Guild Wars 2

Salamander.2504:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Eater of Peeps.9062:

As a meta dh, I routinely kill 3 or 4 by myself. So what? If none of ur team is capping, or they die instantly or w./e, guess what, u can still lose. Same when I play reaper or rev.

That’s why I say, MY MMR is not based on MY PERSONAL SKILL. It is based on my TEAM’s COMBINED SKILLS.

QTF. No matter how well you do, it’s a team game, if your team has enough bad in it you will lose.

I know we are all human, and mistakes happen, or we just get overwhelmed. But when people say people just need to “get good” or “L2P” or even “comeback in a few weeks” they are not helpful suggestions. I’m slowly climbing through emerald, but the whole thing is being made slower by the win 2 lose 3 merry go round I’m on for 10-15 matches before I get the 3 in a row so I can move up 1T.

Why is win 2 lose 3, followed by a winstreak a problem? It sounds like your win-rate is in the realm of 50%.

Because I have to play for around 7-8 hours to move up 1T. Once I’m out of emerald, I don’t even want to think about how long it’s going to take to climb a T in the next division. I’ve not had a won streak of more than five since I got out of Amber.

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see an entire team that just got stomped in a match, come to this forum to complain about anet matching them with bad players. Every single one of them believing the other 4 are bad, but that they themselves weren’t the cause of the defeat.

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see an entire team that just got stomped in a match, come to this forum to complain about anet matching them with bad players. Every single one of them believing the other 4 are bad, but that they themselves weren’t the cause of the defeat.

This post is a shinning example of what’s wrong. People are not complaining about losing, not really. What they are complaining about is how they are losing. That some of the teams they face they have no chance of beating. Same when most win matches. It’s such a one sided victory it’s not funny. What most are asking for are fun challenging matches, not roflstomps.

BrotherBelial.3094:

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see an entire team that just got stomped in a match, come to this forum to complain about anet matching them with bad players. Every single one of them believing the other 4 are bad, but that they themselves weren’t the cause of the defeat.

This post is a shinning example of what’s wrong. People are not complaining about losing, not really. What they are complaining about is how they are losing. That some of the teams they face they have no chance of beating. Same when most win matches. It’s such a one sided victory it’s not funny. What most are asking for are fun challenging matches, not roflstomps.

Then you don’t want a league.

Kuya.6495:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see an entire team that just got stomped in a match, come to this forum to complain about anet matching them with bad players. Every single one of them believing the other 4 are bad, but that they themselves weren’t the cause of the defeat.

This post is a shinning example of what’s wrong. People are not complaining about losing, not really. What they are complaining about is how they are losing. That some of the teams they face they have no chance of beating. Same when most win matches. It’s such a one sided victory it’s not funny. What most are asking for are fun challenging matches, not roflstomps.

Then you don’t want a league.

Then you have no idea how a league is supposed to work.

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see an entire team that just got stomped in a match, come to this forum to complain about anet matching them with bad players. Every single one of them believing the other 4 are bad, but that they themselves weren’t the cause of the defeat.

Your family, friends and colleagues are definitely irked that you make sweeping, unfounded accusations against people just for the hell of it. They tend to groan when you walk in the room and you think you hear someone mutter the work f___ but can’t be sure. You also have too much potassium in your diet and a slight body odor you think you can mask with deodorant and no one has mentioned anything.. well yet. Fingers crossed!!

BrotherBelial.3094:

Kuya.6495:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see an entire team that just got stomped in a match, come to this forum to complain about anet matching them with bad players. Every single one of them believing the other 4 are bad, but that they themselves weren’t the cause of the defeat.

This post is a shinning example of what’s wrong. People are not complaining about losing, not really. What they are complaining about is how they are losing. That some of the teams they face they have no chance of beating. Same when most win matches. It’s such a one sided victory it’s not funny. What most are asking for are fun challenging matches, not roflstomps.

Then you don’t want a league.

Then you have no idea how a league is supposed to work.

Well, i guess we could call the kind of league you want league-lite, or league for pve players. Everyone’s a winner in your league!

jessiestiles.9437:

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see an entire team that just got stomped in a match, come to this forum to complain about anet matching them with bad players. Every single one of them believing the other 4 are bad, but that they themselves weren’t the cause of the defeat.

Your family, friends and colleagues are definitely irked that you make sweeping, unfounded accusations against people just for the hell of it. They tend to groan when you walk in the room and you think you hear someone mutter the work f___ but can’t be sure. You also have too much potassium in your diet and a slight body odor you think you can mask with deodorant and no one has mentioned anything.. well yet. Fingers crossed!!

You are probably the funniest poster in this forum. You need to post more often.

TheFamster.7806:

No because then at the end the average skill ceiling in this game will go down just as it did with pve. Do you think high end players like carrying people? This has been the case before HoT where high end players had to carry low skilled players resulting in frustration and toxicity. Also new players will think that they won the match instead of being carried.

What happens right now is “high end” players carrying each other. how can you tell you are not the one being carried.

Why thank you. Yeh.. I really only come here when I’ve got something to complain about. lol sorry about that. Ok something positive. The professions seem to have a lot more balance than last season. Everyone has roughly the same damage to sustain ratio.. baring the condis who have a little bit more of both. I love celestial but turns out it was a good thing it’s gone. Well done Anet

Kuya.6495:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Kuya.6495:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

It wouldn’t surprise me to see an entire team that just got stomped in a match, come to this forum to complain about anet matching them with bad players. Every single one of them believing the other 4 are bad, but that they themselves weren’t the cause of the defeat.

This post is a shinning example of what’s wrong. People are not complaining about losing, not really. What they are complaining about is how they are losing. That some of the teams they face they have no chance of beating. Same when most win matches. It’s such a one sided victory it’s not funny. What most are asking for are fun challenging matches, not roflstomps.

Then you don’t want a league.

Then you have no idea how a league is supposed to work.

Well, i guess we could call the kind of league you want league-lite, or league for pve players. Everyone’s a winner in your league!

I see your an “I can explain it to you, but I can’t understand it to you” kind of guy.

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

A lot of people are saying they are being matched together with terrible teams and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. Because this is exactly what happened.
If you don’t understand the concept of positive feedback, here is a wikipage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_feedback

Or maybe you refuse to believe a perfectly rational explanation of the situation in flavor inflated self worth and prefer to believe you actually earned your win streak because you are a god of war.

Malediktus.9250:

Too bad the season only last 2 months. So if it takes 2 weeks for the system to work thats 25% of the season wasted with bad games which make a lot of people give up on pvp.

This is the point. Yes its Ranked and people should expect seeding out competition but they will play it and get frustrated.
The downspiral mechnaic is cruel. Till now i can hold me up. But i constantly fear that i loose some in a row, then go on a loosing streak and after 20 i am hoplessly lost even when i propably can stand ground in diamond when on com. The only way back would be teaming.

Torafugu.1087:

Kuya.6495:

A lot of people complaining about S2 are saying they are being matched together with terrible teammates and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. The funny thing is, the rest of their team is probably also blaming them for being terrible.

A lot of people are saying they are being matched together with terrible teams and that this is the cause of their lose streaks. Because this is exactly what happened.
If you don’t understand the concept of positive feedback, here is a wikipage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_feedback

Or maybe you refuse to believe a perfectly rational explanation of the situation in flavor inflated self worth and prefer to believe you actually earned your win streak because you are a god of war.

It’s what’s happening in some games but not all. I’ve been on a few team where you’ve played with and against the same people, and those matches where close. then I’ll be on a team with a few names I’ve remembered from those games, and the next thing you know, roflstomped by a far superior team. this is what’s killing the fun for me.

BrotherBelial.3094:

Salamander.2504:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Eater of Peeps.9062:

As a meta dh, I routinely kill 3 or 4 by myself. So what? If none of ur team is capping, or they die instantly or w./e, guess what, u can still lose. Same when I play reaper or rev.

That’s why I say, MY MMR is not based on MY PERSONAL SKILL. It is based on my TEAM’s COMBINED SKILLS.

QTF. No matter how well you do, it’s a team game, if your team has enough bad in it you will lose.

I know we are all human, and mistakes happen, or we just get overwhelmed. But when people say people just need to “get good” or “L2P” or even “comeback in a few weeks” they are not helpful suggestions. I’m slowly climbing through emerald, but the whole thing is being made slower by the win 2 lose 3 merry go round I’m on for 10-15 matches before I get the 3 in a row so I can move up 1T.

Why is win 2 lose 3, followed by a winstreak a problem? It sounds like your win-rate is in the realm of 50%.

Because I have to play for around 7-8 hours to move up 1T. Once I’m out of emerald, I don’t even want to think about how long it’s going to take to climb a T in the next division. I’ve not had a won streak of more than five since I got out of Amber.

I don’t see an issue with this. If you’re having a slow go moving up tiers now, you’re probably very close to your appropriate league position. The league is not a reward track for you to progress through linearly. No one is entitled to move up the leagues.

Fivedawgs.4267:

Eater of Peeps.9062:

Well, I will address and hopefully correct some of your more eggregious misstatements and misassumptions.

Personally I presume I did not have a low mmr at start of seas 2. I was in ruby, 100% solo, 2 pips from diamond. I didn’t make it cuz the last 2 days, tried to “breeze thru wins” using old losing strategies from seas 1, and it hurt my ability to get diamond and prolly my mmr too. But whatever. With a high number of games under my belt, and a 53% win ratio, I don’t think my mmr was reflective of a lower tier player. I breezed thru amber and 1st tier emerald in less than an hr day one.

Then all of sudden, my skill seems to have vanished. I started losing. The first games lost were due to the afkers etc who still thought losing games was still a good way to win this season ( I would never engage in such tactics, I always try to win). I had some dc’ers. I had some who threw games for their friends. We got stomped by rerolling/op/gimmicky teams on ts. Fine. I guess spvp is now a team sport exclusively.

In addition, once I started losing, mmr started matching me w/ poorer players (day 1-2 of seas 2). I play alot. I couldn’t save all the matches. Sometimes you just get matched w/ ppl who r not a good fit (rerolls wont help or not available) or who don’t know how to play spvp.

I am not, as arrogantly implied by many, upset about facing better players. In fact, that’s what I like about spvp – the competition. That way I can get better if I need to.

You mention that you don’t like to carry people who “don’t know what a node is.” What do you think I am encountering. How come it is perfectly okay for me to encounter people needing to be carried endlessly, but not you. I don’t understand. I paid the same amount for this game as you.

I don’t see any psychological mumbo jumbo, unless of course, anyone with emotions, opinions, and a brain is having psychological mumbo jumbo.

And please, try to refrain from telling people like me that our frustration is silly and insulting. I don’t really appreciate it. Please don’t demean my experience. I take offense at your efforts to deminimize my frustration, and others, especially since in my case, I have been playing pvp on GW for 14 years.

I am not paired with ppl in my skill level. I did not sink to this level because of my personal skill.

Think about it. My mmr is not calculated solely (or even necessarily primarily) by my personal skill level. It is calculated by the sum total of all the games I have played, and thus includes, and perhaps is primarily the result of, the personal skill levels as well the desire/ability to play exhibited by all my teammates.

This isn’t about right or wrong. There have been some horrible miscalculations and design flaws that are horribly skewed, and not panning out according to the “purist” model as designed, and consequently, the system is punishing longstanding, loyal members of the gw family, as well as punishing most casual pvp players, which unfortunately anymore, is most of the gw2 population base.

Remember, as I face more and more losses it will be impossible for me to claw my way up and in the interim, I am forced to play beneath my own personal skill level (contrary to what you may think), and it is quite frustrating and demoralizing. My last 4 matches even had players who admitted they deliberately dc’ed or akitten. They were reported, chat recorded, but so what – I still lost my pips and my downward spiral continues. What was it that I was supposed to do. I am at the bottom playing with people who don’t know how to play. There is no support. I can kill 1 v 4, but so what. If my teammates are doing nothing and 1 is afk, and the rest quit because of this, or they don’t care (cus its just one game after all), how is this my fault or reflective of my skill?

Also, as to your suggestion that players at the bottom can always go play unranked, cuz that’s where we presumably belong, is rather presumptuous. Without ever seeing any of us play, how would you know where our skill level is really at? Besides, in unranked, players go in there to fight one another one-on-one mid map or to test builds. How would that help me or anyone else, even presuming we need help and need to get better (and btw I don’t personally need help – since playing spvp since beta has taught me how to play by now). How is this suggestion a solution. You’re actually telling me to go do something else. Why don’t we all just go to pve too, and never pvp?

I am entitled to refuse to play w/ friends. That is my prerogative. If anet wanted all ranked pvp to be team based, w/friends, then anet should should make it mandatory that all people form a team in order to play ranked pvp, and should also eliminate the hotjoin button. Also, btw, my friends don’t want to risk lowering their cumulative mmr, by carrying a kitten player cuz the match-ups offer them no team support and players are often clueless about strategy or builds and sometimes, even with 2 good players, you still can’t save the team to rise up out of the lowest tiers.

Your own statement says it all: You “don’t feel the need to carry someone who barely knows what a node is.” Yah, its not fun. I am not enjoying it either.

I also don’t want to be “carried.” I have never been carried in pvp. I play 100% solo, and always have and always will. Its a preference. I don’t want to feel forced to do what “top players” think I should do to fix my dilemma, or to improve my fun level or skill level.

Also, my cumulative mmr is now shot forever. I will never be able to claw my way out of the bottom, probably not this season, and possibly never. Its not fun. Its the antithesis of fun. If you want to come carry me, please do so.

However, I will continue to empathize and support the same frustrations other players are experiencing as well and are quitting the game over. I don’t want GW to die. I want anet to try to fix it.

Don’t presume I play ranked pvp for the backpiece either. I don’t care about the backpiece at all. I don’t even want it. I play pvp specifically because I like strong competition. Now I must endure frustration endlessly and believe me, its not fun.

Contrary to what you say and imply, at least at it applies in my case, no matter how many times you say it or imply it, I am not a bad player. My mmr is the cumulative result of the skill levels and motivations of the teammates I get paired with, along with my personal skill and other external factors like lag, dcs, etc. I can get punished very badly if my teammates are bad. I am living proof of that.

And why is it, finally, that you emphasize your suggestions with italics, and bolding, but that is not considered drawing attention to your posts over and above what others have posted by using capital letters or other punctuation to emphasize theirs? You seem to have a nice understanding of forum rules, hence your suggestion to me as to how to post my replies. Please elucidate for me what you know of the rules that makes bolding and italics ok, but other punctuation, font types, capital letters, or other formatting means of typing emphasis are not ok. I would appreciate an education in this regard instead. Thanks for your anticipated help in this regard.

Please do not think I have not considered your viewpoint. I just think until you walk a mile in my shoes for one day in pvp, under the present system, that you are showing an amazing lack of understanding of the issues.

Also, please remember I am new to the forums. I have never felt the need to come onto the forums for anything in 14 yrs of playing gw.

+1 … nicely put

If you spent the time taken writing these posts playing the game, you wouldn’t be struggling at emerald.

Jus sayin

Salamander.2504:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Salamander.2504:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Eater of Peeps.9062:

As a meta dh, I routinely kill 3 or 4 by myself. So what? If none of ur team is capping, or they die instantly or w./e, guess what, u can still lose. Same when I play reaper or rev.

That’s why I say, MY MMR is not based on MY PERSONAL SKILL. It is based on my TEAM’s COMBINED SKILLS.

QTF. No matter how well you do, it’s a team game, if your team has enough bad in it you will lose.

I know we are all human, and mistakes happen, or we just get overwhelmed. But when people say people just need to “get good” or “L2P” or even “comeback in a few weeks” they are not helpful suggestions. I’m slowly climbing through emerald, but the whole thing is being made slower by the win 2 lose 3 merry go round I’m on for 10-15 matches before I get the 3 in a row so I can move up 1T.

Why is win 2 lose 3, followed by a winstreak a problem? It sounds like your win-rate is in the realm of 50%.

Because I have to play for around 7-8 hours to move up 1T. Once I’m out of emerald, I don’t even want to think about how long it’s going to take to climb a T in the next division. I’ve not had a won streak of more than five since I got out of Amber.

I don’t see an issue with this. If you’re having a slow go moving up tiers now, you’re probably very close to your appropriate league position. The league is not a reward track for you to progress through linearly. No one is entitled to move up the leagues.

you know the funny thing, after I posted that, I won 5 games in a row and move up to the last T in emerald. guess I’m not where I should be after all.

Lol. You obviously have not yet hit your losing streak. You don’t understand the coding mechanics.

If, by any chance, you hit a losing streak, either because you are not as good as you think you are, or you have met your top limit match, or your teammates dc due to lag/power failure/work gotta go, etc., or they are afk (like if you get a stomp after first cap and score is 50 v 10 and they think you cant recover so they go afk), or your teammates are new and don’t play much so they are not actually as good as you are but they have a higher mmr cuz they never play and they actually don’t have any idea how to play or win, or they think if they score the most points in the game or kill the most people that is the point so they don’t suck, even though you lost, or you lost and its only one game right? Well you get the idea. It could also be that you get stomped by a pro team, tho mostly they have moved on and that only happened to the unfortunate few who jumped on the bandwagon early on and played alot.

Here’s my advice: Just don’t let your mmr win/loss drop below 50% – that’s when the bad stuff happens. That’s usually a 10 game losing streak. It might be because you’ve hit your skill limit. But it might not be (as in examples above).

Remember, your personal mmr is not calculated only using your own skill level, it is also reflective of every single teammate you played with in every game. If you lost because of a bad player on your team, or some unfortunate occurrence like lag or dc, well then, you lose, and that adjusts your personal mmr down. Have you met your true skill level match? Maybe. Maybe not.

However, once you get about a 10 game losing streak, for whatever reasons, and your mmr or win/loss ratio drops below the magic 50% range, the game is coded so that you will only win 33% of the time, and your opponents are coded to win (those on a winning streak) 66% of the time. So pray it doesn’t happen to you.

People are getting stuck at different levels. Well, is that reflective of their skill level? Maybe. Maybe not. But once stuck, that’s it. You’re basically there forever.

So good luck. Ride your win wave as long as you can. But watch out, cuz its coming at you.

Eater of Peeps.9062:

Lol. You obviously have not yet hit your losing streak. You don’t understand the coding mechanics.

If, by any chance, you hit a losing streak, either because you are not as good as you think you are, or you have met your top limit match, or your teammates dc due to lag/power failure/work gotta go, etc., or they are afk (like if you get a stomp after first cap and score is 50 v 10 and they think you cant recover so they go afk), or your teammates are new and don’t play much so they are not actually as good as you are but they have a higher mmr cuz they never play and they actually don’t have any idea how to play or win, or they think if they score the most points in the game or kill the most people that is the point so they don’t suck, even though you lost, or you lost and its only one game right? Well you get the idea. It could also be that you get stomped by a pro team, tho mostly they have moved on and that only happened to the unfortunate few who jumped on the bandwagon early on and played alot.

Here’s my advice: Just don’t let your mmr win/loss drop below 50% – that’s when the bad stuff happens. That’s usually a 10 game losing streak. It might be because you’ve hit your skill limit. But it might not be (as in examples above).

Remember, your personal mmr is not calculated only using your own skill level, it is also reflective of every single teammate you played with in every game. If you lost because of a bad player on your team, or some unfortunate occurrence like lag or dc, well then, you lose, and that adjusts your personal mmr down. Have you met your true skill level match? Maybe. Maybe not.

However, once you get about a 10 game losing streak, for whatever reasons, and your mmr or win/loss ratio drops below the magic 50% range, the game is coded so that you will only win 33% of the time, and your opponents are coded to win (those on a winning streak) 66% of the time. So pray it doesn’t happen to you.

People are getting stuck at different levels. Well, is that reflective of their skill level? Maybe. Maybe not. But once stuck, that’s it. You’re basically there forever.

So good luck. Ride your win wave as long as you can. But watch out, cuz its coming at you.

I hit a 15 game losing streak, but not had one as big as that since. Most has been 4. But normally I end up on a win 2 lose 3 merry go round for a day or so before I get unstuck and win 5-6 games in a row, then repeat the merry go round.

Well, at least Ive stopped crying in real life. Its been hard to accept that I wont be playing GW anymore. I am now accepting that I cannot escape tier one of emerald. I am doomed to be there forever, because I played a lot early on and due to unfortunate circumstances (like getting trounced in my solo que by organized/ts/rerolling/meta pro league) and other unfortunate teammate garbage I am now stuck at the bottom with no way up or out.

I have asked people, and begged people to carry me. I have looked for teams willing to pair up. No one is willing to risk a downward adjustment in mmr for any reason.

So, seeking a team is out. Since the game is coded for me to win only 33% of the time, and my mmr is now so low that I am in the game with people brand new to pvping, my experiencing pvping is beyond frustrating.

Be clear. I primarily love to play pvp only for the strong competition. I do not like coaching noobs, teaching strategy, just like the rest of you riding your 66% winning streaks (yes the game is coded for you to win 66% of the time) – you don’t want to carry people. Yet I have to do that with the bottom players all day long. I don’t care about a backpiece – I don’t want it.

Many people think I belong where I am. I disagree. But more importantly, there is no way up or out if you cant get a team. People are getting stuck in different divisions (lucky then to be stuck in sapphire or ruby cuz at least there the players are somewhat decent). I did group up with a sapphire team who begged me to stay with them after 2 losses, because they admitted I was better than all of them who were in sapphire division.

I am tired now. The game has been ruined for me. I am not going to slog away at the bottom forever, with no hope of it ever changing, cuz I win two, and immediately lose 3 cuz of pairings caused by coding mechanics combined with absolutely clueless players.

So, you can all say what you want. Think whatever you want.

I just want to say I will be giving my stuff away – I have tons of materials, gold etc. I want to be nice to the players who play gw. I have always loved this game. I am a nice person and am an honest, good player with integrity and skill.

I will be giving my stuff away, probably this weekend. After 14 years, Im sorry to go, but I wont play at a frustrating bottom level forever where I cant get out of it and no one will help.

If there is anyone out there, before this weekend, who would like to offer help to carry me, I would greatly appreciate it, as I don’t really want to quit. I love GW. I loved pvping. I am sure anet didn’t really want this disaster (and all of you with your winning streaks who think how great it is – whatever).

I will freely admit it for all of you skeptics and smug people as well. I suck I admit it. I truly mean it. I suck. I am terrible. You will be risking a ding to your mmr if you help me.

Please help me. I am begging. That’s what people on these forums tell you to do. I am doing. I am terrible. Really awful. I have been practicing pvping for 14 years on GW so Im probably not going to improve. But at least if someone carries me to sapphire, if I suck, I would know it, cuz I would continue to play, and I would drop down in mmr, and I would be no threat to anyone next season.

I am looking for any kind souls who have a good team, willing to help craptastic me move up artificially. If not, please hang out this weekend in the lobby. Free stuff for everyone. And then you can all have the joy of not listening to me anymore.

The reason i don’t trust any of this complaining is because of my experience when i lose. For example, yesterday i lost in a team with a warrior that complained he got grouped with bad players again (IE: the rest of us), this same warrior was rushing far and was complaining he was holding 3 people there and we couldn’t cap other points… for the 5 seconds that he lasted. He then decided to rush lord at 250 points. When i pointed out how ironic it is that he’s claiming he’s being matched with scrubs but he himself doesn’t seem to be very good, he claimed he had the highest score in the team(hence he’s the leetest) and challenged me to a duel for 50gold to demonstrate how good he is.

Today, i had a match with a necro that was also saying the rest of his team was kitten and couldn’t focus a target. This same necro was a minion mancer who kept going far by himself and promptly killed within 5 seconds.

So you see, i really don’t trust this complaining that people keep getting matched with bad players, because there’s a good chance they are pretty bad themselves if not worse.

Eater of Peeps.9062:

Well, at least Ive stopped crying in real life. Its been hard to accept that I wont be playing GW anymore. I am now accepting that I cannot escape tier one of emerald. I am doomed to be there forever, because I played a lot early on and due to unfortunate circumstances (like getting trounced in my solo que by organized/ts/rerolling/meta pro league) and other unfortunate teammate garbage I am now stuck at the bottom with no way up or out.

I have asked people, and begged people to carry me. I have looked for teams willing to pair up. No one is willing to risk a downward adjustment in mmr for any reason.

So, seeking a team is out. Since the game is coded for me to win only 33% of the time, and my mmr is now so low that I am in the game with people brand new to pvping, my experiencing pvping is beyond frustrating.

Be clear. I primarily love to play pvp only for the strong competition. I do not like coaching noobs, teaching strategy, just like the rest of you riding your 66% winning streaks (yes the game is coded for you to win 66% of the time) – you don’t want to carry people. Yet I have to do that with the bottom players all day long. I don’t care about a backpiece – I don’t want it.

Many people think I belong where I am. I disagree. But more importantly, there is no way up or out if you cant get a team. People are getting stuck in different divisions (lucky then to be stuck in sapphire or ruby cuz at least there the players are somewhat decent). I did group up with a sapphire team who begged me to stay with them after 2 losses, because they admitted I was better than all of them who were in sapphire division.

I am tired now. The game has been ruined for me. I am not going to slog away at the bottom forever, with no hope of it ever changing, cuz I win two, and immediately lose 3 cuz of pairings caused by coding mechanics combined with absolutely clueless players.

So, you can all say what you want. Think whatever you want.

I just want to say I will be giving my stuff away – I have tons of materials, gold etc. I want to be nice to the players who play gw. I have always loved this game. I am a nice person and am an honest, good player with integrity and skill.

I will be giving my stuff away, probably this weekend. After 14 years, Im sorry to go, but I wont play at a frustrating bottom level forever where I cant get out of it and no one will help.

If there is anyone out there, before this weekend, who would like to offer help to carry me, I would greatly appreciate it, as I don’t really want to quit. I love GW. I loved pvping. I am sure anet didn’t really want this disaster (and all of you with your winning streaks who think how great it is – whatever).

I will freely admit it for all of you skeptics and smug people as well. I suck I admit it. I truly mean it. I suck. I am terrible. You will be risking a ding to your mmr if you help me.

Please help me. I am begging. That’s what people on these forums tell you to do. I am doing. I am terrible. Really awful. I have been practicing pvping for 14 years on GW so Im probably not going to improve. But at least if someone carries me to sapphire, if I suck, I would know it, cuz I would continue to play, and I would drop down in mmr, and I would be no threat to anyone next season.

I am looking for any kind souls who have a good team, willing to help craptastic me move up artificially. If not, please hang out this weekend in the lobby. Free stuff for everyone. And then you can all have the joy of not listening to me anymore.

Hey, hang in there man! It’s not as bad as it seems, trust me. No game is worth that amount of distress. Take a break for a few days and clear your head. Alternatively, go play a few unranked games to get your confidence back.

Kuya, You disbelieve every complaint of being matched with unskilled players, while you are describing a match you were in of being matched with unskilled players. This is non-sensical. Oh wait.. no..nvm.. I had something kinda funny and bit mean to add but I think I’m on probation because.. you know the story.

EaterofPeeps,

Go to hotjoin and do a lot of skirmishes. At the moment there seems to be a lot of “Ranked Refugees” in hotjoin actually playing objectives. Try different classes and builds there. Be your own judge of how you do; don’t let the matchmaking decide for you who you are.

Best wishes for you. Just relax and believe in yourself.

Eater of Peeps, I feel for you, it can be very demoralizing to lose many matches in a row and have a low win percentage.

If you don’t mind my asking, what class/build are you playing? Perhaps there is more you can do to help you team by making better choices about what role you play to carry your team.

Not specific to Eater of Peeps, many people on the forums complain that “while I was capping home, the other guys on my team rushed mid and wiped”, well, then why were you capping home? If you want to carry you need to play a build that does well in team fights and can help your team win the team fight. Winning the team fight typically means winning the match. So if you want to carry bad team mates and escape ELO hell and a low division, you need to play a strong team fighter and help your team. I play a sustain oriented reaper build with good survivability and good damage, and I anchor team fights, it’s one reason why I’m in Ruby now.

I guess what I’m trying to say is, look beyond mechanical skill and rotations. While those are important, that’s not all that’s important.

Eater of Peeps.9062:

Well, at least Ive stopped crying in real life. Its been hard to accept that I wont be playing GW anymore. I am now accepting that I cannot escape tier one of emerald. I am doomed to be there forever, because I played a lot early on and due to unfortunate circumstances (like getting trounced in my solo que by organized/ts/rerolling/meta pro league) and other unfortunate teammate garbage I am now stuck at the bottom with no way up or out.

I have asked people, and begged people to carry me. I have looked for teams willing to pair up. No one is willing to risk a downward adjustment in mmr for any reason.

So, seeking a team is out. Since the game is coded for me to win only 33% of the time, and my mmr is now so low that I am in the game with people brand new to pvping, my experiencing pvping is beyond frustrating.

Be clear. I primarily love to play pvp only for the strong competition. I do not like coaching noobs, teaching strategy, just like the rest of you riding your 66% winning streaks (yes the game is coded for you to win 66% of the time) – you don’t want to carry people. Yet I have to do that with the bottom players all day long. I don’t care about a backpiece – I don’t want it.

Many people think I belong where I am. I disagree. But more importantly, there is no way up or out if you cant get a team. People are getting stuck in different divisions (lucky then to be stuck in sapphire or ruby cuz at least there the players are somewhat decent). I did group up with a sapphire team who begged me to stay with them after 2 losses, because they admitted I was better than all of them who were in sapphire division.

I am tired now. The game has been ruined for me. I am not going to slog away at the bottom forever, with no hope of it ever changing, cuz I win two, and immediately lose 3 cuz of pairings caused by coding mechanics combined with absolutely clueless players.

So, you can all say what you want. Think whatever you want.

I just want to say I will be giving my stuff away – I have tons of materials, gold etc. I want to be nice to the players who play gw. I have always loved this game. I am a nice person and am an honest, good player with integrity and skill.

I will be giving my stuff away, probably this weekend. After 14 years, Im sorry to go, but I wont play at a frustrating bottom level forever where I cant get out of it and no one will help.

If there is anyone out there, before this weekend, who would like to offer help to carry me, I would greatly appreciate it, as I don’t really want to quit. I love GW. I loved pvping. I am sure anet didn’t really want this disaster (and all of you with your winning streaks who think how great it is – whatever).

I will freely admit it for all of you skeptics and smug people as well. I suck I admit it. I truly mean it. I suck. I am terrible. You will be risking a ding to your mmr if you help me.

Please help me. I am begging. That’s what people on these forums tell you to do. I am doing. I am terrible. Really awful. I have been practicing pvping for 14 years on GW so Im probably not going to improve. But at least if someone carries me to sapphire, if I suck, I would know it, cuz I would continue to play, and I would drop down in mmr, and I would be no threat to anyone next season.

I am looking for any kind souls who have a good team, willing to help craptastic me move up artificially. If not, please hang out this weekend in the lobby. Free stuff for everyone. And then you can all have the joy of not listening to me anymore.

My friend, don’t beat your self up like this. Just take solace in the fact that people have been creating new accounts and rising rapidly through the ranks while their main account crashes and burns.

Here’s the thing, there are DENIERS about this system. The DENIERS are benefitting with artificial wins, so OF COURSE they’ll say “get better”. It goes against their interests to say otherwise! They pretend the system is legit, when it’s obviously not!

jessiestiles.9437:

Kuya, You disbelieve every complaint of being matched with unskilled players, while you are describing a match you were in of being matched with unskilled players. This is non-sensical. Oh wait.. no..nvm.. I had something kinda funny and bit mean to add but I think I’m on probation because.. you know the story.

I could believe my skill level being close to his, for whatever reason. Just that the only ones who seem to always blame their teammates are often just as bad if not worse.

So every time someone talks about their lose streaks, i wonder if they even think about what they could have done better.

Kuya.6495:

jessiestiles.9437:

Kuya, You disbelieve every complaint of being matched with unskilled players, while you are describing a match you were in of being matched with unskilled players. This is non-sensical. Oh wait.. no..nvm.. I had something kinda funny and bit mean to add but I think I’m on probation because.. you know the story.

I could believe my skill level being close to his, for whatever reason. Just that the only ones who seem to always blame their teammates are often just as bad if not worse.

So every time someone talks about their lose streaks, i wonder if they even think about what they could have done better.

See, I don’t buy any of this schpiel because at release time, DAY 1, there was a feeding frenzy by premades on newcomers in amber taking advantage of the matchmaking system. Basically, first come first serve. Build up your mmr and you’re set! If you’re late, too bad. You were fated to struggle with other intermediate players in perpetuity.

THIS is what’s happening now. EMERALD is the new RUBY. Ruby HAS no queues. If there is, it’s little.

BASICALLY, its the SAME RESULT as season 1.

Kuya.6495:

The reason i don’t trust any of this complaining is because of my experience when i lose. For example, yesterday i lost in a team with a warrior that complained he got grouped with bad players again (IE: the rest of us), this same warrior was rushing far and was complaining he was holding 3 people there and we couldn’t cap other points… for the 5 seconds that he lasted. He then decided to rush lord at 250 points. When i pointed out how ironic it is that he’s claiming he’s being matched with scrubs but he himself doesn’t seem to be very good, he claimed he had the highest score in the team(hence he’s the leetest) and challenged me to a duel for 50gold to demonstrate how good he is.

Today, i had a match with a necro that was also saying the rest of his team was kitten and couldn’t focus a target. This same necro was a minion mancer who kept going far by himself and promptly killed within 5 seconds.

So you see, i really don’t trust this complaining that people keep getting matched with bad players, because there’s a good chance they are pretty bad themselves if not worse.

While I agree with what you are saying, yes there are people out there like that, there are also people who are just bad and dragging others down.

But then this is part and parcel of team bases MP PvP games. You never know how “good” your team will be, and how good or bad the team you face will be. Add into that class stacking and you can be on to a loss if you are on a team with a bad comp I.e. A DH, ranger and 3 warrior’s vs 2 necros, 2 eles and a rev.

I just want to point out, that in ranked play the reason matches become so one sided at times is because of mistakes.

a 250-500 game is actually pretty close.
It could be your team made 1 major mistake that resulted in a 2 cap for the enemy that you could not recover.
Maybe you did not regroup as a unit, but trickle fed a node.
Maybe someone went for a decap instead of +1 a fight and the even sided team lost the fight.

These things in a match may not seem like the reason a game is loss, but it actually is. There are several decisions that decide your final score as a team.

Very even games 490-500 for example are usually both sides making the same amount of mistakes/ same amount of good plays.

Only time I would consider a match a crushing loss is 150 or less points. Meaning your team did not maintain a 1 cap most of the match.

Eater of Peeps.9062:

I have asked people, and begged people to carry me. I have looked for teams willing to pair up. No one is willing to risk a downward adjustment in mmr for any reason.

So, seeking a team is out. Since the game is coded for me to win only 33% of the time, and my mmr is now so low that I am in the game with people brand new to pvping, my experiencing pvping is beyond frustrating.

So I actually have a very similar perspective of Zuko, and happen to be a member of one of the teams in the top 10 NA currently, on my main account. I have taken advantage of sales on HoT, and have two extra accounts, of which are already ranked up once or twice, but aren’t high sapphire like my main. On my alt accounts I have found that my w/l ratio has stayed very similar (nearly undefeated), even queuing with clearly non-meta classes, such as kill-shot warrior and etc. Not to brag about personal skill, but my perception is that with a little bit of communication and queuing with some decent players, anyone can get out of terrible losing streaks.

In fact, I am considering starting a guild where we specifically recruit both losing streak players, and other decent pvpers who are willing to help. Let me know what you think! Feel free to pm, mail, or whisper me if anyone is interested.

masterfoo.6320:

Eater of Peeps.9062:

I have asked people, and begged people to carry me. I have looked for teams willing to pair up. No one is willing to risk a downward adjustment in mmr for any reason.

So, seeking a team is out. Since the game is coded for me to win only 33% of the time, and my mmr is now so low that I am in the game with people brand new to pvping, my experiencing pvping is beyond frustrating.

So I actually have a very similar perspective of Zuko, and happen to be a member of one of the teams in the top 10 NA currently, on my main account. I have taken advantage of sales on HoT, and have two extra accounts, of which are already ranked up once or twice, but aren’t high sapphire like my main. On my alt accounts I have found that my w/l ratio has stayed very similar (nearly undefeated), even queuing with clearly non-meta classes, such as kill-shot warrior and etc. Not to brag about personal skill, but my perception is that with a little bit of communication and queuing with some decent players, anyone can get out of terrible losing streaks.

In fact, I am considering starting a guild where we specifically recruit both losing streak players, and other decent pvpers who are willing to help. Let me know what you think! Feel free to pm, mail, or whisper me if anyone is interested.

masterfoo.6320:

Eater of Peeps.9062:

I have asked people, and begged people to carry me. I have looked for teams willing to pair up. No one is willing to risk a downward adjustment in mmr for any reason.

So, seeking a team is out. Since the game is coded for me to win only 33% of the time, and my mmr is now so low that I am in the game with people brand new to pvping, my experiencing pvping is beyond frustrating.

So I actually have a very similar perspective of Zuko, and happen to be a member of one of the teams in the top 10 NA currently, on my main account. I have taken advantage of sales on HoT, and have two extra accounts, of which are already ranked up once or twice, but aren’t high sapphire like my main. On my alt accounts I have found that my w/l ratio has stayed very similar (nearly undefeated), even queuing with clearly non-meta classes, such as kill-shot warrior and etc. Not to brag about personal skill, but my perception is that with a little bit of communication and queuing with some decent players, anyone can get out of terrible losing streaks.

In fact, I am considering starting a guild where we specifically recruit both losing streak players, and other decent pvpers who are willing to help. Let me know what you think! Feel free to pm, mail, or whisper me if anyone is interested.

that’s awesome of u man

Kuya.6495:

I could believe my skill level being close to his, for whatever reason. Just that the only ones who seem to always blame their teammates are often just as bad if not worse.

So every time someone talks about their lose streaks, i wonder if they even think about what they could have done better.

Oh well.. this where we need a little faith in our intuition in deciding who is believable/trustworthy or not in any aspect of our lives. And a little bit of logic helps too in being a good judge of character. For eg. It is a falacy of logic to propose C is true based on A and B.

A. Unskilled players exist.
B. Unskilled players are likely to experience losing streaks.
C. A person on a losing streak is an unskilled player.

Another example where C is an invalid conclusion:

A. People who mapchat trash-talk sometimes have an inflated perception of their own skill. (or could be skilled with rage issues or had a bad day at the office)
B. Some people who complain in forum may mapchat trash-talk.
C. People who complain in forum are an unskilled player.

Also false:

D. People who have an inflated perception of their own skill also mapchat trash-talk.

And while possibly true we have nothing to base this assumption on:

E. Some people who complain in forum do mapchat trash-talk.

For a skilled player a losing streak wouldn’t be the end of the world and (if it doesn’t break) there are things they can do to change the situation. It’s unfortunate and incredibly frustrating that they drew the short straw in algorithmic lottery. I’d say from reading people experiences it happened a lot more than people think.

And the greatest tragedy was the system going way too far on punishing unskilled players.

So why you shouldn’t be so incredulous towards people making this claim:-

It’s humanly impossible, without stepping outside the rules of conduct, for a player to simultaneously hold 2 capture points. Therefore a player with skill holds x capture point and their teammates are incapable of doing the same for y or z capture points; given the opposing team does have adequate skill to hold y and z; or y or z plus a greater number of kills or secondary objectives: the person will lose regardless of their having a high skill level. This senario can happen quite easily and repeatedly in the current system. You must have experienced this yourself.

People who have shown they have played a number of games in the many thousands; and that they have been able to maintain a win rate of 55-60% in both ranked and unranked; and that they are or were infact in a losing streak; and have given a personal assertion that they are not an unskilled player; and have also described this exact situation above: in this circumstance we can with a certain amount of confidence accept they are not an unskilled player. (This does not suggest that people who haven’t got these same statistics are unskilled, it is just to show it is a believable situation)

The term unskilled may be a little subjective and cause some confusion. Eg. A Diamond level player may consider anyone who is less than Diamond as unskilled. As a general guideline we will define it as a skilled person has a firm understanding of game mechanics and tactics within the mid level range and up: ie. equal to Saphire -> Legendary. Unskilled being everyone else.

It is also a fact that people within the gaming community just love to behave in a highly derogatory manner towards whoever they consider “noobs”. So regardless of having been shown their behavior is needlessly disrespectful and in this case completely illogical they will continue to do so no matter what.

Finally, despite how good a judge of character that using logic and our intuition can make us, we can never definitively know if someone is being truthful or not without proof. We can strongly suspect but often regarding an individual it is best to keep that to yourself. We are not infallible. Innocent people have been put to death for looking highly suspicious. We know it is possible that some people are being truthful about their predicament so in legal terms or a sporting competition this would be what we call benefit of the doubt. You can apply this to your everyday life also. Now what you were doing instead is not trusting anyone and giving all people the disadvantage of the doubt. This is extreme and for me was a little suprising. I realise your point of view now and that many of us probaby have trust issues for various reasons and it’s really not always necessary.

I would definitely be interested in this. I have been contacted a lot, both by mean trolls (I know, I suck) and kind souls and also by people who understand the system is defective and punishing to solo que players.

I took the advice of many and made a free alt char on a HoT account. I immediately went into spvp. In one day, I am in sapphire, caught on the winning side tide. How is this possible? I can I be a sapphire player on one account in one day on an alt char playing the same exact build as I did on day one. What’s the difference? How is this possible? Did my skill really improve dramatically in 6 days (despite the fact that I purportedly suck on my other character after nearly 3 years of pvping on it). The only difference I see is the playing field.

I would point out to every naysayer out there, the system is flawed and abusively punishing – not against skilled/non-skilled players but against losing players.

I would like to remind everyone you can lose for any reason, sometimes your fault, but sometimes totally beyond your control (lag, dc, etc) and sometimes the fault of your teammates who might be close to you in rank when first joined for whatever reason (such as they don’t play much or they advanced in seas 1 for unscrupulous reasons or whatever), but whom are unskilled or simply pvp inexperienced as to strategy, hidey holes (to avoid fire), rez skills, etc. etc. Sometimes these people think being the high scorer makes them skilled at pvp, and you can never convince them otherwise.

Believe me, as it should be patently obvious to everyone by now, I scrutinize my own play pretty harshly. If I have screwed up, I am the first to admit it and attempt to correct it. I play because I like strong competition. It is the best part of the game.

However, I would like to remind people of a few facts:

1) I play a lot. Yes a lot. I mean really a lot.

2) On day 1 I played a lot. On day 1 there were numerous factors present that day, all day, that are not so prevalent in spvp currently (and for that matter, since the day after until currently). For example – there were many people playing that day who still thought it was a good idea to lose a bunch of games since they thought, since they hadn’t bothered to read patch notes or forums, that it was still a good idea for them to not play as much as would normally be expected in a true competition, like as in afk or faux type play which was somewhat prevalent in seas 1.

Another example – many people solo qued that first day, including myself, and we were often matched in teams consisting of all other solo players or some duos, many of whom, while presumably good or average players, may not have been playing meta builds or may have been weaker classes (mes, war, etc) and all of whom were definitely not on ts. Unfortunately these random solo teams were inexplicably pitted against 4 man pre-made teams from the pro-leagues with set/gimmicky op builds, ts, rerolls and stomp tactics. Many of these games ended in 500 to 20 losses etc.

Because I played a lot that day, I encountered it a lot that day. What is to be done in that situation? What should I have done differently against a premade team on ts w/ coordinated builds? Especially when most of us were surprised that was being allowed. Were these pro players better? I honestly cannot say – presumably because we got trounced I would assume so. But honestly, how would I know for sure? It was hardly fair. We were hardly on a level playing field. No, not because of skill (though I presume they are all better), but because we were not coordinated. We were not on ts. We did not have set builds with set strategic coordinated pounce tactics. So consequently, as much as I would like to listen to the elite pvpers, it was off of my back that they breezed thru the first day of pvp and rose in ranks quickly.

By contrast, in addition to being matched w/ potentially less skilled players, the fact that many of us got trounced that day by pros, which was intended because seas 2 was designed to push the pros to the top quickly and reduce their wait times for matches and to quickly get a little bigger pool of potential players for them in diamond or up, it was done at my expense, and the expense of others like me. My mmr was driven into the ground, and rapidly. Was it my fault? Am I a bad player? I don’t even know anymore. I thought I was good. Now I am at the bottom because my mmr was tanked at the end of day one.

3) Once your mmr slips below a magic number (presumably 49% win/loss which is probably a losing streak of about 20 games give or take) the coding mechanisms kick in. The fallacy here is that the software coding actually takes into account certain variables to determine your individual skill. But that is not the case. The only thing it takes into account is win/lose. You’re either a winner or a loser. If a loser, and loser enough (for whatever reason) you will get stuck. If a winner, you will win, until finally you plateau, and you begin to lose, and then you are a loser, and then you get stuck. The sad fact is, many people who were eager to play the first day, who played a lot, were subjected to play that is not present in the matchups today. The pros are already out of there. And they are out of there because of me. Their wins are represented by my losses. Why didn’t someone warn me not to press the hotjoin/solo q button? Why didn’t someone warn me that if I did that, the one game I love, and the one activity I loved the best in the game, would be ruined for me forever.

4) Once you have lost enough games, you will keep getting matched with poorer and poorer players. Since I did a tremendous amount of playing that first day, I kept encountering numerous variables that had nothing to do with my skill. Try as I might, and play as hard as I might, I couldn’t convince people to not go afk, I couldn’t control lag, I couldn’t beg pro leagues to not stomp us. Is it my fault? Everyone keeps telling me it is. I get it, I suck. In any event, I made it to emerald, but couldn’t make it past that. Now, because the deck is stacked against me, since the coding intends for me to lose 66% of the time, and since I am paired with poor or new players, I am forced to play in a continuous loop of losses with a couple of spikes of wins.

5) One person, no matter how skilled, cannot carry a whole team. One person, no matter how skilled, cannot coordinate with random people to effectuate strategy, especially if against legendaries on ts.

6) Your mmr is not calculated based on your skill. It is only based on your wins/losses of your entire team. Does it mean if you lost that you lost because of you? Possibly. Does it always mean that? Possibly. However, equally possible is the fact that it might have been due to player #3 one game, player #4 the next game, pro elite opposition next game, afker next game, lag or dc next game, your fault next game, close game/good game next game which you lose, player #2’s fault next game, etc. You get the point. Its your win/loss ratio that is being evaluated and only that. It is not your personal skill, kitten many people have suggested and insist (presumably because they are still riding the win wave).

7) Teams in sapphire or ruby do not want to “carry” me to a win to raise my mmr. They do not want to jeopardize their mmr or have a loss. Perhaps there is a kind pro team of 4 willing to do this for me, especially since they blitzed thru day 1 lower tiers off of my back (and the backs of my teammates). Most of my teammates have quit. I am still hanging in, tho I am feeling very demoralized and sad that I have lost a game and activity I love, and if these elite players are so confident and happy with their skills and play, I would really appreciate it if they would step up to the plate and offer to help me out. What could it hurt them? They have already gotten where they want to be because of people like me. Where is their conscience? Where is their benevolence?

So that is why I think my experience may have been different from many others. I know that quite a few hardcore players that were playing that first day quit the game in disgust. I watched some guy in Lions Arch giving all of his stuff away. I will probably go out the same way, though people are telling me to hang in, to play on my alt, and to wait it out until seas 3, when hopefully I wont continue to be penalized for what has happened. As it now stands, I will never claw my way out of emerald 1st day. I played it for 6 days straight for 10 hrs or more a day, and without help, it cannot be done. Am I that poor a player? My alt would suggest otherwise. My experiences thus far with playing with others would suggest not (many I have played with or against have been quite supportive of my skill and have told me I am a good player, and I have not solicited their input).

So decide for yourself whatever you want to think, just as I am grappling with my decision whether to quit gw after 14 yrs or not. In the meantime, I welcome any top tier players to help me out. You just might find out, I am really not that bad. Or perhaps I will find I am. Either way, I don’t see it as a risk to anyone, just a small investiture of some time and some kindness.

If you quit can I have an item from your stuff?

The thread above shows how wrong this system has been – very detailed and comprehensive

Eater of Peeps.9062:

I would definitely be interested in this. I have been contacted a lot, both by mean trolls (I know, I suck) and kind souls and also by people who understand the system is defective and punishing to solo que players.

I took the advice of many and made a free alt char on a HoT account. I immediately went into spvp. In one day, I am in sapphire, caught on the winning side tide. How is this possible? I can I be a sapphire player on one account in one day on an alt char playing the same exact build as I did on day one. What’s the difference? How is this possible? Did my skill really improve dramatically in 6 days (despite the fact that I purportedly suck on my other character after nearly 3 years of pvping on it). The only difference I see is the playing field.

I would point out to every naysayer out there, the system is flawed and abusively punishing – not against skilled/non-skilled players but against losing players.

I would like to remind everyone you can lose for any reason, sometimes your fault, but sometimes totally beyond your control (lag, dc, etc) and sometimes the fault of your teammates who might be close to you in rank when first joined for whatever reason (such as they don’t play much or they advanced in seas 1 for unscrupulous reasons or whatever), but whom are unskilled or simply pvp inexperienced as to strategy, hidey holes (to avoid fire), rez skills, etc. etc. Sometimes these people think being the high scorer makes them skilled at pvp, and you can never convince them otherwise.

Believe me, as it should be patently obvious to everyone by now, I scrutinize my own play pretty harshly. If I have screwed up, I am the first to admit it and attempt to correct it. I play because I like strong competition. It is the best part of the game.

However, I would like to remind people of a few facts:

1) I play a lot. Yes a lot. I mean really a lot.

2) On day 1 I played a lot. On day 1 there were numerous factors present that day, all day, that are not so prevalent in spvp currently (and for that matter, since the day after until currently). For example – there were many people playing that day who still thought it was a good idea to lose a bunch of games since they thought, since they hadn’t bothered to read patch notes or forums, that it was still a good idea for them to not play as much as would normally be expected in a true competition, like as in afk or faux type play which was somewhat prevalent in seas 1.

Another example – many people solo qued that first day, including myself, and we were often matched in teams consisting of all other solo players or some duos, many of whom, while presumably good or average players, may not have been playing meta builds or may have been weaker classes (mes, war, etc) and all of whom were definitely not on ts. Unfortunately these random solo teams were inexplicably pitted against 4 man pre-made teams from the pro-leagues with set/gimmicky op builds, ts, rerolls and stomp tactics. Many of these games ended in 500 to 20 losses etc.

Because I played a lot that day, I encountered it a lot that day. What is to be done in that situation? What should I have done differently against a premade team on ts w/ coordinated builds? Especially when most of us were surprised that was being allowed. Were these pro players better? I honestly cannot say – presumably because we got trounced I would assume so. But honestly, how would I know for sure? It was hardly fair. We were hardly on a level playing field. No, not because of skill (though I presume they are all better), but because we were not coordinated. We were not on ts. We did not have set builds with set strategic coordinated pounce tactics. So consequently, as much as I would like to listen to the elite pvpers, it was off of my back that they breezed thru the first day of pvp and rose in ranks quickly.

By contrast, in addition to being matched w/ potentially less skilled players, the fact that many of us got trounced that day by pros, which was intended because seas 2 was designed to push the pros to the top quickly and reduce their wait times for matches and to quickly get a little bigger pool of potential players for them in diamond or up, it was done at my expense, and the expense of others like me. My mmr was driven into the ground, and rapidly. Was it my fault? Am I a bad player? I don’t even know anymore. I thought I was good. Now I am at the bottom because my mmr was tanked at the end of day one.

3) Once your mmr slips below a magic number (presumably 49% win/loss which is probably a losing streak of about 20 games give or take) the coding mechanisms kick in. The fallacy here is that the software coding actually takes into account certain variables to determine your individual skill. But that is not the case. The only thing it takes into account is win/lose. You’re either a winner or a loser. If a loser, and loser enough (for whatever reason) you will get stuck. If a winner, you will win, until finally you plateau, and you begin to lose, and then you are a loser, and then you get stuck. The sad fact is, many people who were eager to play the first day, who played a lot, were subjected to play that is not present in the matchups today. The pros are already out of there. And they are out of there because of me. Their wins are represented by my losses. Why didn’t someone warn me not to press the hotjoin/solo q button? Why didn’t someone warn me that if I did that, the one game I love, and the one activity I loved the best in the game, would be ruined for me forever.

4) Once you have lost enough games, you will keep getting matched with poorer and poorer players. Since I did a tremendous amount of playing that first day, I kept encountering numerous variables that had nothing to do with my skill. Try as I might, and play as hard as I might, I couldn’t convince people to not go afk, I couldn’t control lag, I couldn’t beg pro leagues to not stomp us. Is it my fault? Everyone keeps telling me it is. I get it, I suck. In any event, I made it to emerald, but couldn’t make it past that. Now, because the deck is stacked against me, since the coding intends for me to lose 66% of the time, and since I am paired with poor or new players, I am forced to play in a continuous loop of losses with a couple of spikes of wins.

5) One person, no matter how skilled, cannot carry a whole team. One person, no matter how skilled, cannot coordinate with random people to effectuate strategy, especially if against legendaries on ts.

6) Your mmr is not calculated based on your skill. It is only based on your wins/losses of your entire team. Does it mean if you lost that you lost because of you? Possibly. Does it always mean that? Possibly. However, equally possible is the fact that it might have been due to player #3 one game, player #4 the next game, pro elite opposition next game, afker next game, lag or dc next game, your fault next game, close game/good game next game which you lose, player #2’s fault next game, etc. You get the point. Its your win/loss ratio that is being evaluated and only that. It is not your personal skill, kitten many people have suggested and insist (presumably because they are still riding the win wave).

7) Teams in sapphire or ruby do not want to “carry” me to a win to raise my mmr. They do not want to jeopardize their mmr or have a loss. Perhaps there is a kind pro team of 4 willing to do this for me, especially since they blitzed thru day 1 lower tiers off of my back (and the backs of my teammates). Most of my teammates have quit. I am still hanging in, tho I am feeling very demoralized and sad that I have lost a game and activity I love, and if these elite players are so confident and happy with their skills and play, I would really appreciate it if they would step up to the plate and offer to help me out. What could it hurt them? They have already gotten where they want to be because of people like me. Where is their conscience? Where is their benevolence?

So that is why I think my experience may have been different from many others. I know that quite a few hardcore players that were playing that first day quit the game in disgust. I watched some guy in Lions Arch giving all of his stuff away. I will probably go out the same way, though people are telling me to hang in, to play on my alt, and to wait it out until seas 3, when hopefully I wont continue to be penalized for what has happened. As it now stands, I will never claw my way out of emerald 1st day. I played it for 6 days straight for 10 hrs or more a day, and without help, it cannot be done. Am I that poor a player? My alt would suggest otherwise. My experiences thus far with playing with others would suggest not (many I have played with or against have been quite supportive of my skill and have told me I am a good player, and I have not solicited their input).

So decide for yourself whatever you want to think, just as I am grappling with my decision whether to quit gw after 14 yrs or not. In the meantime, I welcome any top tier players to help me out. You just might find out, I am really not that bad. Or perhaps I will find I am. Either way, I don’t see it as a risk to anyone, just a small investiture of some time and some kindness.

A very good post. I think you could have hit the nail.on the head with the problems with this system.

Kuya.6495:

So you see, i really don’t trust this complaining that people keep getting matched with bad players, because there’s a good chance they are pretty bad themselves if not worse.

Well, if the system is working right, as you say, and you are teamed with people like that, then obviously you are as bad as they are, or worse. Right?

Perhaps then that warrior was right and, no matter how unskilled/inexperienced, he was still the best player in your team. Right?

Or perhaps, maybe, there is something wrong with the matchmaking system…

Astralporing.1957:

Kuya.6495:

So you see, i really don’t trust this complaining that people keep getting matched with bad players, because there’s a good chance they are pretty bad themselves if not worse.

Well, if the system is working right, as you say, and you are teamed with people like that, then obviously you are as bad as they are, or worse. Right?

Perhaps then that warrior was right and, no matter how unskilled/inexperienced, he was still the best player in your team. Right?

Or perhaps, maybe, there is something wrong with the matchmaking system…

Logic win

Since the season is so short they should just implement placement matches and have it go from there. Last season for me was actually good towards the end because it did weed out a lot of players and I was already Legend x6, so most of my matches were quality matches.

I was talking on stream today about how discouraging it would be for a new player and also as to how easy it is to obtain Legendary even for fairly above average players, so why not just speed your process up by having placement matches instead of having good players grind and force lesser players to lose constantly vs that.

jessiestiles.9437:

Eater of Peeps.9062:

I would definitely be interested in this. I have been contacted a lot, both by mean trolls (I know, I suck) and kind souls and also by people who understand the system is defective and punishing to solo que players.

I took the advice of many and made a free alt char on a HoT account. I immediately went into spvp. In one day, I am in sapphire, caught on the winning side tide. How is this possible? I can I be a sapphire player on one account in one day on an alt char playing the same exact build as I did on day one. What’s the difference? How is this possible? Did my skill really improve dramatically in 6 days (despite the fact that I purportedly suck on my other character after nearly 3 years of pvping on it). The only difference I see is the playing field.

I don’t know how the MMR works exactly but new players start at mid point MMR. So if you did great on a new account and terribly on your regular account then the system has put your MMR below that of an average or new person for god knows what reason and it’s steadily gotten worse. It’s a major flaw especially for people who aren’t interested in joining a team.

Lots of people have been having success by making new account. This surely explain why someone who took a 6 month break is having no trouble climbing up at all since his MMR was averaged by the system. While those who played last season got punished, that is if you have an MMR below 50%. Interesting indeed.

Zoose.1640:

Since the season is so short they should just implement placement matches and have it go from there. Last season for me was actually good towards the end because it did weed out a lot of players and I was already Legend x6, so most of my matches were quality matches.

I was talking on stream today about how discouraging it would be for a new player and also as to how easy it is to obtain Legendary even for fairly above average players, so why not just speed your process up by having placement matches instead of having good players grind and force lesser players to lose constantly vs that.

This^^^ .. but some people are so sticker up on their side that they fail to see the bigger picture. Thanks for your input ZOOSE.

Now we have 3 pro player on this thread alone giving their take on the system.

Same here, I would never ever call anyone who made it to diamond last season a bad player. And @easter I understand how you feel, being on both side of the coins but I am advice to you is to not give up. Team up with a good team mate just to get out of where you are stuck. Solo q ing , in low tier, this season has been HORRIBLE unless you are one of those lucky few.

Theres a simple way to resolve this issue yourself, guys.

As soon as you loose one game → log out and dont log back in for a few hours.

Dont log out as long as you are winning games.

Voila. Legendary league explained in two sentences.

Fivedawgs.4267:

Same here, I would never ever call anyone who made it to diamond last season a bad player. And @easter I understand how you feel, being on both side of the coins but I am advice to you is to not give up. Team up with a good team mate just to get out of where you are stuck. Solo q ing , in low tier, this season has been HORRIBLE unless you are one of those lucky few.

you cannot do that since you are basically pulling him down with the spiral you are running into already.

StinkyLord.7950:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Same here, I would never ever call anyone who made it to diamond last season a bad player. And @easter I understand how you feel, being on both side of the coins but I am advice to you is to not give up. Team up with a good team mate just to get out of where you are stuck. Solo q ing , in low tier, this season has been HORRIBLE unless you are one of those lucky few.

you cannot do that since you are basically pulling him down with the spiral you are running into already.

Well

I spend 10 hrs a day trying to grind out of the emerald tier the pro leagues all sank me to that first day.

Nice the pros are getting victories and enjoying their pvp experience and exchange warm wishes and gloat, and discuss how the system has been good to the esports players.

However, the pros all got their organized victories off the backs of players like me.

It would have been nice if someone would have warned me that 1st day that a slew of organized and coordinated pro teams on ts w/set stacked builds, were going to stomp and trounce their way thru innocent players like me who, as usual, pushed the solo q hot join button that first day. I played all day and didn’t know/realize that mmr was formulated so that losses would beget more losses and I should stop playing when I hit a losing streak. As a solo quer, I got teamed with other random teammates with whom it was literally impossible to coordinate/communicate.

Hardly a level playing field.

While I can appreciate the pros all had an agenda, and their goals/feats and esports concerns were significantly more important than my hardcore casual player interests, I am stuck at emerald, where the pros all drove me down to that first day, and I am now stuck forever because of the mmr coding (unless I get organized help from 2 or more pre-made “teammates”). I am now playing 10 hrs a day against ambers who do not know how to pvp at all. All I do now in pvp is try to teach people strategy, all day long, in the hopes I can get a random team that will win one. Not gonna happen. And the toxic responses from the high scorers of the lost matches (you know, players who do most damage but never cap, etc) is nothing less than soul draining. So usually, I just stop talking altogether and give up and ride the magic loss wave endlessly around in a loop.

My play experience has been ruined. Hope the backpiece is worth it. Just sayin – you might want to think about what you all are doing, and at what cost to others.

Why did not a single elite player warn solo players that first day to not push that solo hotjoin button that first day as the pro leagues blew thru the system on their way to their playing field, as the consequences of doing so has ruined my entire ranked spvp gameplay forever.

Want to come watch me teach newbs how to play pvp on twitch all day? Didn’t think so.

Eater of Peeps.9062:

I spend 10 hrs a day trying to grind out of the emerald tier the pro leagues all sank me to that first day.

Nice the pros are getting victories and enjoying their pvp experience and exchange warm wishes and gloat, and discuss how the system has been good to the esports players.

However, the pros all got their organized victories off the backs of players like me.

It would have been nice if someone would have warned me that 1st day that a slew of organized and coordinated pro teams on ts w/set stacked builds, were going to stomp and trounce their way thru innocent players like me who, as usual, pushed the solo q hot join button that first day. I played all day and didn’t know/realize that mmr was formulated so that losses would beget more losses and I should stop playing when I hit a losing streak. As a solo quer, I got teamed with other random teammates with whom it was literally impossible to coordinate/communicate.

Hardly a level playing field.

While I can appreciate the pros all had an agenda, and their goals/feats and esports concerns were significantly more important than my hardcore casual player interests, I am stuck at emerald, where the pros all drove me down to that first day, and I am now stuck forever because of the mmr coding (unless I get organized help from 2 or more pre-made “teammates”). I am now playing 10 hrs a day against ambers who do not know how to pvp at all. All I do now in pvp is try to teach people strategy, all day long, in the hopes I can get a random team that will win one. Not gonna happen. And the toxic responses from the high scorers of the lost matches (you know, players who do most damage but never cap, etc) is nothing less than soul draining. So usually, I just stop talking altogether and give up and ride the magic loss wave endlessly around in a loop.

My play experience has been ruined. Hope the backpiece is worth it. Just sayin – you might want to think about what you all are doing, and at what cost to others.

Why did not a single elite player warn solo players that first day to not push that solo hotjoin button that first day as the pro leagues blew thru the system on their way to their playing field, as the consequences of doing so has ruined my entire ranked spvp gameplay forever.

Want to come watch me teach newbs how to play pvp on twitch all day? Didn’t think so.

I hear you dude! As a casual player, I can designate like 2-3 hrs a day for the game , which is significantly high, and I am in the same loop as well, making me hating the game, not sure if there is a Anet solution to this or if they care at all, but this should be a different topic !

2-3 h a day is huge ….. That´s not casual anymore.

Zuko.7132:

Hi all. I’m Zuko. I play tempest for Best Team North Africa, which is currently invited to participate in the Challenger Cup to qualify for Pro-League.

So the goal of this new matchmaking is to make the league system more skill-based. So if you have high mmr (the game thinks ur good) you will progress faster and easier. If you have low mmr (game thinks ur bad) you might have incredible difficulty getting out of amber. How it works is you get matched with players on ur team of similar mmr. The opposing team has team mates of a similar mmr on it. However, your teams average mmr and the enemy teams mmr can be vastly different. If you are one of the players in the top 1% then you have a 99% chance to face an enemy team with lower skill than you. Likewise if you are in the bottom 50% you have a 50% chance to fight people much better than you.

The idea is that the good players will progress to higher divisions quicker and leave only the bad to average players in the lower divisions. Then the average players will advance leaving only the bad players. So as the season goes on your matches should start becoming more balanced, and divisions will actually represent skill instead of time spent playing like last season.

Here’s the issue with that. While I love the fact that I am progressing quickly as a reward for being one of the more highly skilled players, this type of matchmaking can be quite discouraging to a majority of the playerbase. If the game doesn’t already rate you as good, you will be more likely to lose and the game will think more and more that you suck. Anet’s answer to this is as time progresses matches will become better. I fear however that this new matchmaking will cause many of the new, average, and bad players to just give up before matchmaking becomes balance again. Call it quits and go home. And let’s face it, that’s bad for the game. I would ask anet if having the few really good players progress faster is worth angering and harming the gaming experience of the vast majority of the player population. Also for the unlucky people who actually are bad whether it be from being unable to commit enough time or just lacking skill, there matches will never get better as they are always going to be below average and so will always have more of a chance to face teams better than them, and will always be on a losing streak and thus quit the game.

Feel free to share your thoughts.

Same system in Hearthstone. Just do what people do there and wait a week or two on a fresh ladder if you want your grind to be easier. Implement a system that boosts starting rank based on ending rank in previous season. You still need a full reset like this to establish the rankings needed to implement that.

Outside of that, what do you advocate as an alternative system? Not a lot of better options.