Guild Wars 2

Wenissa.2967:

Entropy.4732:

My server has been engaged in a 3 hour long struggle to capture Durios. Not Hills, not Garrison, Durios. The reason is that the other server stacked it to the gills with arrow carts. You can’t get NEAR the kitten. Even building catapults doesn’t work because of the range on the AC’s. Crazy. The worst part is that a downed wall used to mean victory. Not any more. We broke that wall THREE times and each time our zerg was wiped trying to enter the tower because of all the AC’s raining death down from the walls. Even porting in doesn’t work because you’re still in AC range. Then the enemy zerg lazily wanders over when they’re good and ready and clears all the trebs we built at umber. They yawn and saunter off. Rinse, repeat for 3 freaking hours. And we’re the lower-pop server. See, if Anet wanted to help low-pop severs, they failed miserably. SM does NOT EVER FLIP. One server holds it for the whole week. See, the bigger servers can grab and hold now without fear of any retaliation. If Anet doesnt fix this soon I’m not sure how long I’m gonna stay with this game. VERY frustrating.

So you have their supply line umber. So they have to run supply from outside. You can treb from umber like you said you did. So you can treb their acs away.

Now the fact that they lazily destroyed your trebs but didnt flip umber? Means they didnt have the numbers to oust you. So you rebuild a treb and destroy their acs. It also means that they must have been running supply in from elsewhere, so stop them, once you accomplish that no more rebuilt walls, no more rebuilt acs inside and you waltz on in.

We had a similar battle in my tier. I was defending. We had 2 ac 2 balissta left that the umber trebs couldnt hit and were outnumbered 2 to 1. the trebs had destroyed maybe 4 acs. We sallied a few times to destroy trebs, they rebuilt them. Eventually we ran out of supply, having to run it from SM and so we stopped wall repairs. They attacked and died to our acs and ballies. Then one bright spark on the opposing team, stealthed in and started taking down acs. He got both before we got him, thieves can be like that and then he came back and did it again, took him a few attempts to get my ballista cos I kept point blank spreadshotting him. He was just one player. Had a few of them coordinated all our siege would have been gone on the first attempt. As it was he solod all the siege down with a few repeat attempts, whist the rest stopped us resuppying. Had we had more siege it certainly would have been more difficult for him, but not impposible. Incidentally thieves have been asking for a wvw role, tada there it is.

They took the tower. It took them a fair while longer than before the update, but before the update the tower would have been lost in 3mins flat.

Oh but they did flip umber. And how. The problem with the L2p argument is that what bugs me isn’t adapting to new situations. Eventually we will all adapt to these Holy Arrow Carts of the OP. New tactics are already developing. The problem is the new tactics are boring, frustrating, and just not fun. Who wants to slowly deplete supply lines and build trebs and guard trebs and finally, after hours and hours, take a tower? We want combat and diversity of game play.

Bones.5762:

Yamato Shinobi.4378:

After the AC change, golems are way less viable too. I witnessed a 35+ golem rush on hills and were able to take down NW Outer gate, but only had like 2-3 remaining once inside outer gate, and the remaining 3 just melted due to AC (as did all the others) very quickly.

tbh, thats just sad, even with the AC buff, which i hate, 35 golems should be able to take the first gate in like 30seconds or less, idk how u failed there unless they were opening fire on you before ur golems even got to the gate.

It was SoR who did that. I was manning one of the golems and yes, the gate went down like butter, but seeing 130k HP drop to zero in like 10 seconds is kind of depressing.

I put 30 points into AC and I dont even care if they nerf them and I lose 30 points, just make them reasonable again.

Someone on the forums once argued that because ANet has “professionals” they know what they’re doing.. well that hope that kitten is getting his kitten handed to him by acs. God knows unless darkhaven is zerging, they have 4 ppl in hiding in a tower spaming their acs all day long.

this patch has ruined a lot of things.

Avenge.1478:

Bones.5762:

Yamato Shinobi.4378:

After the AC change, golems are way less viable too. I witnessed a 35+ golem rush on hills and were able to take down NW Outer gate, but only had like 2-3 remaining once inside outer gate, and the remaining 3 just melted due to AC (as did all the others) very quickly.

tbh, thats just sad, even with the AC buff, which i hate, 35 golems should be able to take the first gate in like 30seconds or less, idk how u failed there unless they were opening fire on you before ur golems even got to the gate.

It was SoR who did that. I was manning one of the golems and yes, the gate went down like butter, but seeing 130k HP drop to zero in like 10 seconds is kind of depressing.

I put 30 points into AC and I dont even care if they nerf them and I lose 30 points, just make them reasonable again.

This is the kinda story that really makes me sad about the change. Even if they melted troops, stuff like golems and rams shouldn’t really be taking much damage from ACs. The only way 35 golems should be killed in a push like that is if all of hell is raining down on them.

IMO having AC damage redused against other siedges is only logical choice… Lets see golems – big robot made of steel (or whatever metal that is, i hope its not paper) suffers from simple arrows (ballista bolts mke sense, since they are designed to kill golems) – thats strange. Rams are hard to destroy with arrows too, because its just arrows and flame ram looks sturdy enough to hold itself against arrows.
However, having swirling winds and other counter-treb skills removed (lets face it, noone will ever request ele with focus anymore) made siedges into contets of speed-building trebs and catas.

But on the other hand, it will give birth to some new and smart tactics (but taking Hills will be an EPIC pain in the kitten if lords room is siedged).

How about the fact that ACs defy physics? I get killed by one, through a tower and under a bridge. Didn’t realize arrows can penetrate stone and metal.

The new patch simply broke the game with the arrow carts changes.

Only badge collectors that don´t really like open WvW can enjoy this.

The morning cappers servers just need to build 3 ACs at every door and sit there 1-2 people for hours, untile they got to T3 upgrades. On prime time, all you get is WvACs

Many experienced individuals and guilds are evaluating to slack a bit or just quit the game, so amending this mess should be a top priority to ANet… if they just want to keep the WvW alive, rather than releasing the next Stronghold IV

1. Change the buff to ACs from 80% to 30%.
2. ACs do half damage to other siege equipment.
3. ACs have a slightly smaller range than ballistas.
4. ACs can no longer shoot/damage through doors, walls and roofs. Meaning there needs to be a clear arc from the AC to its destination target.
5. Leave AC mastery as is.

Boom, ACs are balanced.

Omg finally unbanned, wuhuu! Just wanted to add a little quote from Jonathan Sharp a game designer from arenanet:

We want to avoid “whack-a-mole” style balance. HUGH increases and HUGE decreases lead to meta instability, and thusly, we try to make multiple small tweaks rather than putting in massive changes that we have to later correct.

So when are they going to live up to that, and not randomly buff arrowcarts by over 100%? I think the whine is rather week compared, imagine any other mmo or mechanics being more than doubled in effectiveness after 8 months of remaining the same.

Whack-a-mole indeed!

Hickeroar.9734:

Avenge.1478:

Bones.5762:

Yamato Shinobi.4378:

After the AC change, golems are way less viable too. I witnessed a 35+ golem rush on hills and were able to take down NW Outer gate, but only had like 2-3 remaining once inside outer gate, and the remaining 3 just melted due to AC (as did all the others) very quickly.

tbh, thats just sad, even with the AC buff, which i hate, 35 golems should be able to take the first gate in like 30seconds or less, idk how u failed there unless they were opening fire on you before ur golems even got to the gate.

It was SoR who did that. I was manning one of the golems and yes, the gate went down like butter, but seeing 130k HP drop to zero in like 10 seconds is kind of depressing.

I put 30 points into AC and I dont even care if they nerf them and I lose 30 points, just make them reasonable again.

This is the kinda story that really makes me sad about the change. Even if they melted troops, stuff like golems and rams shouldn’t really be taking much damage from ACs. The only way 35 golems should be killed in a push like that is if all of hell is raining down on them.

To be fair, the port up to the gate was botched, however, there were so many darn ACs that couldn’t be easily cleared (both outer/inner) that it wouldn’t have mattered as much. You see the distance and radius on the ACs make it much harder to take them down. You literally have to get lucky to have not much of a force defending with ACs coupled with bad placements and non-ranked ppl on the ACs to have a good chance. Which we finally had today with 9 golems. 6 melted after taking the outer door, had to flash build 3 more once inside and take inner after clearing siege. Luckily the enemy didn’t show up in the numbers they could have and we barely took it with that compliment. If Hills was well defended with proper AC placement and ranked ppl on them, plus a modest compliment of defenders (20 or so), it’s simply dead hard to near impossible to take hills. :P

Yamato Shinobi.4378:

Hickeroar.9734:

Avenge.1478:

Bones.5762:

Yamato Shinobi.4378:

After the AC change, golems are way less viable too. I witnessed a 35+ golem rush on hills and were able to take down NW Outer gate, but only had like 2-3 remaining once inside outer gate, and the remaining 3 just melted due to AC (as did all the others) very quickly.

tbh, thats just sad, even with the AC buff, which i hate, 35 golems should be able to take the first gate in like 30seconds or less, idk how u failed there unless they were opening fire on you before ur golems even got to the gate.

It was SoR who did that. I was manning one of the golems and yes, the gate went down like butter, but seeing 130k HP drop to zero in like 10 seconds is kind of depressing.

I put 30 points into AC and I dont even care if they nerf them and I lose 30 points, just make them reasonable again.

This is the kinda story that really makes me sad about the change. Even if they melted troops, stuff like golems and rams shouldn’t really be taking much damage from ACs. The only way 35 golems should be killed in a push like that is if all of hell is raining down on them.

To be fair, the port up to the gate was botched, however, there were so many darn ACs that couldn’t be easily cleared (both outer/inner) that it wouldn’t have mattered as much. You see the distance and radius on the ACs make it much harder to take them down. You literally have to get lucky to have not much of a force defending with ACs coupled with bad placements and non-ranked ppl on the ACs to have a good chance. Which we finally had today with 9 golems. 6 melted after taking the outer door, had to flash build 3 more once inside and take inner after clearing siege. Luckily the enemy didn’t show up in the numbers they could have and we barely took it with that compliment. If Hills was well defended with proper AC placement and ranked ppl on them, plus a modest compliment of defenders (20 or so), it’s simply dead hard to near impossible to take hills. :P

I’ve been with groups that have defeated 40+ assaulters with about 15 in hills… and that was before this last patch…

Aberrant.6749:

I’ve been with groups that have defeated 40+ assaulters with about 15 in hills… and that was before this last patch…

Indeed, defending never was that hard. It just required a little bit of organization. The biggest problem with defending was just that nobody wanted to do it. I believe there are many reasons for that and most of them have nothing to do with the difficulty.

1. It requires some organization and some initiative. Both things that randoms seem to lack. That is their good right, if they wanted more organization they would be in a guild. Can’t fault anyone for that.

2. It’s a reactive thing to do. Sitting in a keep waiting to get attacked is boring. Going out and attacking something yourself guarantees you a certain amount of action. For all you know you could be in that keep for 3 hours and never get attacked.

3. It’s not rewarding. The defense event is flawed. Even if you can hold them off you might not always get the event (have to kill things or repair) and even getting the event is worthless.

4. Sometimes it was pointless. Because the second you would leave your structure would get flipped. A guildmate once went out of Anzalias to help escort a dolyak and the tower was lost by the time he got back.

5. Sometimes the odds were overwhelming. You could be in a tower by yourself to get attacked by 50 players and a breakout event. There is no point in staying to defend that. And if ever it would be possible to defend against that on your own there is bound to be a very big imbalance somewhere.

To me it sounds like all the people saying defending used to be so hard, hardly ever tried it because of one of the aforementioned reasons. And only one of those things changed a little bit with the patch. It is now a little more rewarding because you can easily farm a lot of bags with those AC’s. It does however add that it now no longer requires skill to defend and it is not challenging anymore, that would be worse than not getting loot or rewards.

TL;DR Defending was never hard.

Aytrix.4059:

1. Change the buff to ACs from 80% to 30%.
2. ACs do half damage to other siege equipment.
3. ACs have a slightly smaller range than ballistas.
4. ACs can no longer shoot/damage through doors, walls and roofs. Meaning there needs to be a clear arc from the AC to its destination target.
5. Leave AC mastery as is.

Boom, ACs are balanced.

All of this.

It is a good news that the devs will rebalance all siege weapons. There is so much imbalance. Why can ACs destroy weapons so easily? Why is it so efficient to glue ACs to walls like nest of swallows? Why are oil pots and cannons so lousy in terms of defending structures?

Some increased damage for ACs is nice. But it should be bound to the mastery and embedded in some major process of overhaul for the siege weapons.

What if they doubled or tripled the supply cost of AC’s?

Kebab.4013:

Omg finally unbanned, wuhuu! Just wanted to add a little quote from Jonathan Sharp a game designer from arenanet:

We want to avoid “whack-a-mole” style balance. HUGH increases and HUGE decreases lead to meta instability, and thusly, we try to make multiple small tweaks rather than putting in massive changes that we have to later correct.

!

As an ele/mesmer player i will put that declaration near

“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.!”

LordByron.8369:

Kebab.4013:

Omg finally unbanned, wuhuu! Just wanted to add a little quote from Jonathan Sharp a game designer from arenanet:

We want to avoid “whack-a-mole” style balance. HUGH increases and HUGE decreases lead to meta instability, and thusly, we try to make multiple small tweaks rather than putting in massive changes that we have to later correct.

!

As an ele/mesmer player i will put that declaration near

“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.!”

I assume that that is a jab at ascended gear. You are right, that was a mistake on their part. However, you are not a lot stronger with ascended gear as opposed to someone who has exotic gear. You can’t really predict the outcome by the difference between those gear tiers. It is still not ok what they did with the ascended gear but it is not that huge a leap from what they said as it is with balancing. The flat 80% buff with the AC mastery ranks just goes against the entire philosophy they have when balancing other stuff.

Caliban.3176:

just goes against the entire philosophy they have when balancing other stuff.

Same with grinding
Same with nerfs
Same with different PvE/WW/PvP balance

LordByron.8369:

Kebab.4013:

Omg finally unbanned, wuhuu! Just wanted to add a little quote from Jonathan Sharp a game designer from arenanet:

We want to avoid “whack-a-mole” style balance. HUGH increases and HUGE decreases lead to meta instability, and thusly, we try to make multiple small tweaks rather than putting in massive changes that we have to later correct.

!

As an ele/mesmer player i will put that declaration near

“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.!”

Well the quote was actually from their view on structured pvp and class balances. So yes you as elementalist/mesmer sure got your mole whacked quite badly last patch. But hey, at least you didn’t take such a hard blow as wvwvw did with the arrowcarts

Aberrant.6749:

Yamato Shinobi.4378:

Hickeroar.9734:

Avenge.1478:

Bones.5762:

Yamato Shinobi.4378:

After the AC change, golems are way less viable too. I witnessed a 35+ golem rush on hills and were able to take down NW Outer gate, but only had like 2-3 remaining once inside outer gate, and the remaining 3 just melted due to AC (as did all the others) very quickly.

tbh, thats just sad, even with the AC buff, which i hate, 35 golems should be able to take the first gate in like 30seconds or less, idk how u failed there unless they were opening fire on you before ur golems even got to the gate.

It was SoR who did that. I was manning one of the golems and yes, the gate went down like butter, but seeing 130k HP drop to zero in like 10 seconds is kind of depressing.

I put 30 points into AC and I dont even care if they nerf them and I lose 30 points, just make them reasonable again.

This is the kinda story that really makes me sad about the change. Even if they melted troops, stuff like golems and rams shouldn’t really be taking much damage from ACs. The only way 35 golems should be killed in a push like that is if all of hell is raining down on them.

To be fair, the port up to the gate was botched, however, there were so many darn ACs that couldn’t be easily cleared (both outer/inner) that it wouldn’t have mattered as much. You see the distance and radius on the ACs make it much harder to take them down. You literally have to get lucky to have not much of a force defending with ACs coupled with bad placements and non-ranked ppl on the ACs to have a good chance. Which we finally had today with 9 golems. 6 melted after taking the outer door, had to flash build 3 more once inside and take inner after clearing siege. Luckily the enemy didn’t show up in the numbers they could have and we barely took it with that compliment. If Hills was well defended with proper AC placement and ranked ppl on them, plus a modest compliment of defenders (20 or so), it’s simply dead hard to near impossible to take hills. :P

I’ve been with groups that have defeated 40+ assaulters with about 15 in hills… and that was before this last patch…

They had 35 golems, not players.

Straegen.2938:

ACs being vastly more dangerous is forcing us to rethink many of our tired and frankly lazy strategies. Now a small team can defend a keep against a larger force which was the point IMO. ACs may have been a shortcut to that goal, but defenders should have a substantial advantage over attackers.

In a couple months without any change, we will have adapted and few will remember the days of weaker ACs.

They just need to fix the ACs doing so much damage to siege, and do something about the open-field fighting problems.

People love ZvZ open field fighting. The enhanced ACs are just a negative-fun factor there. It’s really the fun factor thing that needs to be addressed.

Straegen.2938:

Now a small team can defend a keep against a larger force which was the point IMO.

That was already the case as many guilds have proven already, there was no need to buff arrowcarts for that.

OK, here we are, a week or so into the patch with the changes being live, played with, etc. Let’s forget the forecasts of gloom and doom and take a look at the actual effects of the changes now that we’ve played them. A couple observations:

Arrow carts. Yes, they hit hard enough that you notice and we can no longer giggle at the tickling effects they once had. If you have a structure guarded and sieged up you have a good chance at defending against larger groups. Let’s be honest… this reflect reality. You’re in a defensible position and should be able to hold off larger forces.

30 second delay before “X”. This one I’m still not too fond of, but it’s not as game-breaking as I initially over-reacted about. I have seen camps flip before an “X” showed up, which can be frustrating. I’ve seen tower gates down before or just as people get there to respond. BUT… this simply requires a change in how you defend. As suspected, you’re effectively required to keep scouts in places you wish to defend for your early warning system instead of that being automated. Probably the main issue I have is this… it isn’t fun. ANet can check the logs if they like, but I think I easily spent 12 to 16 hours collectively this weekend in Dawns as the scout, with the occasional jump down to kill a yak or something. It was boring, and I got crap for wxp. But it needed to be done. I was told in chat by someone that scouting wasn’t rewarding which is why it was hard to keep things covered. This effectively punishes the guilds that are more dedicated to “good” WvW and rewards the pugs that only want to frolic though the blood-stained grasses. Maybe something could be done to make scouts more rewarding? I dunno.

30 minute hard despawn siege timer. My opinion, this one blows. No sense going into it, in a different thread Devon had mentioned they were looking at the timers. Hopefully, if possible, I’d like to see the following:

5 – 10 minutes despawn on all rams.
1 hr despawn for non-superior, non-rams.
2 hr despawn for superior, non-rams.

That would make life easier I think.

Anyhow, how about some honest opinions based on actual experience now that we’re a week into the patch and have seen it live through a reset?

I think I see what ANet is trying to accomplish with these changes. Its going to take time for players and strats to adjust. Seems to me the changes are trying to give supply and upgrades more value. 30 second delay certainly makes door and wall upgrades more important. With the despawn siege, this changes the game to where your siege is going to need to built on demand for defense rather than well in advance for the most part. Making the supply in the tower/keep hold and on your person even more precious. This in turn makes supply camps and yaks more precious. Making them more necessary to not just flip but to hold and defend during assaults. This will require more spreading out of forces to hold camps, deny supply to defenders, while pressuring the towers and keeps. Possibly creating more small group vs small group combat around the camps and supply lines.

I still think it needs time to play out, but I can see how these changes could be a step in that direction.

Need to do something for rams otherwise they’ll never be used against gates again. In medieval times we would attach housings to the rams so the 10 men controlling the ram wouldn’t be hit by tar pits and arrows from above.

Why can’t Rams give a buff to the controller and 4 other players to make them take 50% less damage from siege for X seconds on a Y cooldown. Say 5 and 15. This way you’d need 3 rams to provide the buff to 15 people which still isn’t enough for a zerg to stay huddled by the door blasting fields, but would at least give rams a use at a gate.

Atherakhia.4086:

Need to do something for rams otherwise they’ll never be used against gates again. In medieval times we would attach housings to the rams so the 10 men controlling the ram wouldn’t be hit by tar pits and arrows from above.

Why can’t Rams give a buff to the controller and 4 other players to make them take 50% less damage from siege for X seconds on a Y cooldown. Say 5 and 15. This way you’d need 3 rams to provide the buff to 15 people which still isn’t enough for a zerg to stay huddled by the door blasting fields, but would at least give rams a use at a gate instead of out in the middle of no where for fear.

I could be wrong, but I believe an adjustment is being made to ACs such that they do less damage against siege. I think the damage against people is fine to be honest, but a percent reduction against siege would be ok. Not too much… defenders need tools to defend.

Burning oil could use some type of shield… it’s rarely of any value, being burned down long before the first ram falls.

Arrow Cart damage is fine, sucks being on the receiving end but it is as it should be.

Despawn SUCKS! I seriously believe the “servers” can handle more (they can handle 300 live toons in a big kitten zerg battle with crappy lag but they can handle it)

All siege except other AC’s should take a significant reduced damage from ACs. Ram’s could even have a buff that they only receive 10% damage from siege except from that ballista skill that is designed to hit siege. All the other changes are fine. It would also be kind of cool is one person could hide in the ram…

I know this may not be a popular opinion, but i miss Swirling Winds

Someone actually requested that Ele’s equip focues to protect our siege from trebs, until that person was quickly reminded it doesn’t work anymore. There was an audible, collective “sigh” in Teamspeak.

Atherakhia.4086:

Need to do something for rams otherwise they’ll never be used against gates again. In medieval times we would attach housings to the rams so the 10 men controlling the ram wouldn’t be hit by tar pits and arrows from above.

Hm, maybe superior rams, should get an Arrow-Protection (for the user, and maybe 4 others) instead of their superior damage (over normal rams).

Scrambles.2604:

I know this may not be a popular opinion, but i miss Swirling Winds

Someone actually requested that Ele’s equip focues to protect our siege from trebs, until that person was quickly reminded it doesn’t work anymore. There was an audible, collective “sigh” in Teamspeak.

I have to admit… I’m of mixed opinions on that one. Being able to take out assaulting trebs is nice. Having a treb already set up in your tower or keep can make a world of difference, and mortars are a little more important now. I admit, I miss the defense, but there are times you gain defense as well because of the change.

Decent summary, I pretty much agree. It is unfortunate that scouting is unrewarding but I can’t think of anything they can do since anything they do will lead to AFKers standing on tower ramparts.

The siege timer is a toughie as well. I am pretty sure they did that so that people who build siege to ‘siege block’ a map will have to stay around that siege and maybe then ANET can catch em and ban them (or we can report them). But I don’t think it is worth it, 30 minutes is too short a time. Your suggestion is a good one.

I think along with stronger siege that they should make the realm ability that reduces siege damage more accessible/useful. I think upping the damage was a good idea, though suddenly jumping to 80% more was a poor choice, you never want to overdo changes. 40% would have been a big jump. I don’t mind 80%, just pointing out that WvW/PvP changes should always be as gradual as possible. How hard would it be to make it 20-40% then in 6 weeks another 20-40% more?

VOLKON.1290:

Burning oil could use some type of shield… it’s rarely of any value, being burned down long before the first ram falls.

I’m not sure what the solution should be, but I do agree that Burning Oil vats are pretty useless. They only serve to stall the siege by forcing the enemy to stand back and take it out before placing rams.

ammayhem.5962:

VOLKON.1290:

Burning oil could use some type of shield… it’s rarely of any value, being burned down long before the first ram falls.

I’m not sure what the solution should be, but I do agree that Burning Oil vats are pretty useless. They only serve to stall the siege by forcing the enemy to stand back and take it out before placing rams.

Perhaps the oil pool could stay down for a few minutes?

That way the oil could be a way for scouts to delay ram deployment, making them fell as if their presence has mattered more.

Only possible downside is it further counters rams, when they’re already in a bad place.

Arrow Carts: Need to find a happy medium for the damage. Right now, it is, crazy. Split the difference Anet.

Swirling winds: This was a mistake, even if it wasn’t intended to block trebs it turned out to be a powerful tool. You needed 3-5 eles for full coverage, but they had to be coordinated. Also, they ended up getting zerged any after the enemy knew about it. That being said, swirling winds most likely won’t be brought back, but it is a mistake.

Another glitch that has popped up after this patch has to do when jumping off a high object. when you jump off your charcter will do the animation of falling get up and then take the damage from the fall. Sometimes your character resets and completes the jump up to 4 times before allowing it. Idk what it is, just throwing ot out there.

30 second X:: meh

I find it freaking annoying to have to run to carts and balistas all the time to refresh them so that they do not disappear, or have a superior siege weapon lost because someone doesn’t have the missing 10 supplies and the siege weapon 2 minutes run out before it is built.

Lot’s of annoying things in this last patch.

I think the arrow cart damage is fine providing they require line of site and can no longer shoot through objects (doors, roofs, walls, etc). This would solve much of the issue with them vs other siege too, because in order to clear a door, they would have to be in line of site of it …which means they would be able to get cleared by attackers in most cases.

In regards to the siege de-spawn, it is pretty freaking stupid. Make rams despawn after 10 minutes, and leave the rest of the siege alone. I like the 1 hour / 2 hour idea posted .

covenn.7165:

I think the arrow cart damage is fine providing they require line of site and can no longer shoot through objects (doors, roofs, walls, etc). This would solve much of the issue with them vs other siege too, because in order to clear a door, they would have to be in line of site of it …which means they would be able to get cleared by attackers in most cases.

An interesting thought, but there are many places that this would completely render arrow carts useless from a defensive stand point unfortunately. Northwest Hills gate, for example, there would be no place at all you could set up ACs with any effectiveness. So although the idea has its merits I think the negatives would far outweigh them.

Scrambles.2604:

I know this may not be a popular opinion, but i miss Swirling Winds

Someone actually requested that Ele’s equip focues to protect our siege from trebs, until that person was quickly reminded it doesn’t work anymore. There was an audible, collective “sigh” in Teamspeak.

As an ele I like that it got nerfed It means I was finally able to salvage that useless focus of mine and no longer have to waste time baby sitting siege. I am far better suited to killing anyway.

Just add some thing to block them, like mesmer feedbacks but feedbacks can’t reach to AC. You know, like in Zhaitan-killing-main quest – Absolutely Unepic Tyrian Shields-on-move.

covenn.7165:

Scrambles.2604:

I know this may not be a popular opinion, but i miss Swirling Winds

Someone actually requested that Ele’s equip focues to protect our siege from trebs, until that person was quickly reminded it doesn’t work anymore. There was an audible, collective “sigh” in Teamspeak.

As an ele I like that it got nerfed It means I was finally able to salvage that useless focus of mine and no longer have to waste time baby sitting siege. I am far better suited to killing anyway.

“patch notes [fixed]:

Swirling Winds no longer effects unblockable projectiles
Increased Elementalists bag space by (1) slot"

They could add in a few no build zones for the AC that are placed just off the side of a wall so the AC is more glitched to be beside the wall and some what floating in the air. I also think the limitation of how many weapons you can have mainly in tower should be lower so you need to make a chose do you make a tower harder to attk (more AC) or do you make the tower have a use (more trebs). At the same time the person who put the weapon down in the first places should have a chose to destroy it.

Again I see people saying that players needed tools to defend.

Could those people explain how all those guilds use to do it without those tools? There was no real difficulty in doing it.

There was no need for this change and it really did kitten up a lot of things. Overall attendance in WvW has gone down for my server and their opponents, easily seen through all the queues. (Though our dominance might have had something to do with that as well as our use of the Arrowcarts to spawncamp and farm)

Playing other games till this is fixed.

I think also that the AC’s are over powered.
And you can also increase the power of the AC’s more with the abilities.
The abilities upgrade was enough, to make the AC’s a little stronger.
If it was 10-20% more damage then it would be more realstic.
But 80% more damage thats to much.

If they want to change something on the siege, then change the trebs and cata’s.
If you have direct hit on a wall or gate then you get the normal damage, but when you hit it with splash damage then reduce this to 50-75% of the direct hit.

I hope they will change the damage of the AC’s, its to annoying.

I’m quite enjoying the buff to arrowcarts. It’s forced myself and the small groups I play with in WvW to implement new tactics to overcome something that’s actually quite dangerous now. The buff probably is a bit too strong, but I’m liking how things have been changed up suddenly. Maybe the damage increase shouldn’t be applied to siege weapons?

Simonoly.4352:

I’m quite enjoying the buff to arrowcarts. It’s forced myself and the small groups I play with in WvW to implement new tactics to overcome something that’s actually quite dangerous now. The buff probably is a bit too strong, but I’m liking how things have been changed up suddenly. Maybe the damage increase shouldn’t be applied to siege weapons?

I agree w/ this guy. I don’t see what the problem is. This change is making it much harder to PvDoor. It’s forcing teams to try new things. And note, towers, keeps, and castles are still flipping in WvW. It hasn’t broken anything. I’m liking it very much. Devs, please keep it!!

lordkrall.7241:

Josh.3759:

they lose more and more people every new pacth now they made wvw worst another pacth without any incentive for doing wvw dumb.

I would disagree, but since none of us actually have any proof to support our views it is pointless to discuss it.

How can you disagree, I’ve been playing this game since the beginning not mentioning guilds but I know for 5 major WvW guilds up and quit the game, reason being after 5 months of actively playing WvW, what do you possibly achieve, nothing to show for it, you win pride saying your server won that week. Results of winning for that week usually means other servers give up and just band wagon to top servers cause they don’t want to try. As proven in Gw 1 when PVE is done whats left of the game Anet? PvP which why people stay in game and still playing.

Jahiliyya.7095:

Simonoly.4352:

I’m quite enjoying the buff to arrowcarts. It’s forced myself and the small groups I play with in WvW to implement new tactics to overcome something that’s actually quite dangerous now. The buff probably is a bit too strong, but I’m liking how things have been changed up suddenly. Maybe the damage increase shouldn’t be applied to siege weapons?

I agree w/ this guy. I don’t see what the problem is. This change is making it much harder to PvDoor. It’s forcing teams to try new things. And note, towers, keeps, and castles are still flipping in WvW. It hasn’t broken anything. I’m liking it very much. Devs, please keep it!!

I’m liking certain aspects of it and hating others. I’m willing to grudgingly admit that things haven’t been as bad the last couple days as they were at first, and some kind of balance seems to have been achieved.

I would just love to see open field combat ACs nerfed back to their original strength, and siege should be more resistant to ACs.

Defense, especially when undermanned, is far easier. You also have to play differently when going on the offense. Sun Tzu kinda summed it up well: “Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”

Rush in on enemy fortifications which are unmanned, keep the enemy from reaching the portal, attack when the enemy least expects it, or are occupied defending something they care more about, etc.

A good example of this was Mendons yesterday. I had the zerg playing defense for about an hour, pushing FA and DB out of our territory over and over. Out of “seemingly” nowhere, we rushed from durios over to mendons before they had a chance to get any people inside to defend. We blocked several FA from getting inside, fought off a small zerg of FA heading in from speld, and were able to take it just under 4 minutes before the tick. Had two FA made it inside and been on ACs…the whole thing would have been for naught.

In THAT respect, it encourages zerging. A ten man group would probably not have been able to do what we did.