Guild Wars 2

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

if you think about it , in the year and half i’ve played gw2 , long time vetern of gw1.

has anyone ever made a Tactical Strategy to counter a Ranged Fight as a group thinking about that will solved all the problems you think you have.
and i also i think its about time all the full zerk players got some toughness and Vit into the builds they use , i can’t even get a decent WvW player doing to 60% hp using a rapid fire and i run 50% pvt, cav+ zerks 6,0,2,6,0 on my ranger, i can survive Reflects but i’ll only have 40% hp left over if i don’t cancel/ stop attacking.

just adding a reflect wall stood at a distance will stop a Lb’s Assault in its tracks , he will be forced to swap weapons.

If someone doesnt have a reflect effect?

It’s starting to become apparent that a lot of people don’t think this through.

@The person who said “Just any block, reflect, or projectile destroyer will PREVENT AT LEAST 80% OF THE BURST IF THE SKILL IS USED THE SECOND YOU SEE RF”

Its true. Unfortunately, the auto attack can do almost half the DPS as rapid fire, which has no cooldown, and rapid fire has a 10s cooldown, which goes down to 8s with the trait. Most blocks, reflects, or projectile destroyers, on average, has a cooldown way longer than that, and using not one, but both dodges just to deal with it isn’t okay, especially since the auto attack, which again, has no cooldown and can be used anytime, also does very high damage.

Also, as soon as you see the skill being used, 5 arrows have already hit you, and most likely you are fighting someone else.

@The person trying to give a definition of rangers. You have it completely backwards.

Rangers are the type of people who excel in close combat and raiding tactics. Read a dictionary. To range is to basically roam, not fire things from long distances.

@The guy who said “use reflect to force swap weapon”.

Yo, you know he can just wait or fighting something else while that’s up? It’s not very hard.

WEXXES.2378:

It’s starting to become apparent that a lot of people don’t think this through.

@The person who said “Just any block, reflect, or projectile destroyer will PREVENT AT LEAST 80% OF THE BURST IF THE SKILL IS USED THE SECOND YOU SEE RF”

Its true. Unfortunately, the auto attack can do almost half the DPS as rapid fire, which has no cooldown, and rapid fire has a 10s cooldown, which goes down to 8s with the trait. Most blocks, reflects, or projectile destroyers, on average, has a cooldown way longer than that, and using not one, but both dodges just to deal with it isn’t okay, especially since the auto attack, which again, has no cooldown and can be used anytime, also does very high damage.

Also, as soon as you see the skill being used, 5 arrows have already hit you, and most likely you are fighting someone else.

@The person trying to give a definition of rangers. You have it completely backwards.

Rangers are the type of people who excel in close combat and raiding tactics. Read a dictionary. To range is to basically roam, not fire things from long distances.

@The guy who said “use reflect to force swap weapon”.

Yo, you know he can just wait or fighting something else while that’s up? It’s not very hard.

the auto atk dmg w/o cd always was the same, before and after patch…

LordByron.8369:

Prysin.8542:

Did you know that meteor shower with blasting staff trait reaches 1380 range for some reason, and that meteor can deal 5-7k to my glassy warrior. And if i try to close gap i gotta run through a aoe that is huge and lasts long…..
So by that logic, nurf ele, nurf warrior, nurf thief, nurf nurf nurf

read my signature please….you should play more pve.
and not even considering cooldowns.

A pvE player also can’t fight anything with a brain. You see, the pve blobs in wvw don’t really do well when they run into anything with moderate skill.

Anubis.7058:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

if you think about it , in the year and half i’ve played gw2 , long time vetern of gw1.

has anyone ever made a Tactical Strategy to counter a Ranged Fight as a group thinking about that will solved all the problems you think you have.
and i also i think its about time all the full zerk players got some toughness and Vit into the builds they use , i can’t even get a decent WvW player doing to 60% hp using a rapid fire and i run 50% pvt, cav+ zerks 6,0,2,6,0 on my ranger, i can survive Reflects but i’ll only have 40% hp left over if i don’t cancel/ stop attacking.

just adding a reflect wall stood at a distance will stop a Lb’s Assault in its tracks , he will be forced to swap weapons.

If someone doesnt have a reflect effect?

thinking in groups , someone will have a reflect in the area and i realy feel Relfects need to become more Widely used. this game since gw1 and anets philosophy has always been group play people realy need to get out of this 1vs1 thinking and start using Team work, not just oh the guy next to me used a firefield I can get a buff out of that.
a greedy thinking, if the person next to you has a Reflect slotted ,he could use it to protect his teammates rather than his kitten self.

oh such sweet, sweet QQ. Ive been waiting two years to stop being a joke class to others, and now that we have this, the tears are sooooo sweet. So sorry you just cant shrug off a ranger as nothing now.

BTW, I was beating people on glass LB long before this patch, and now I just trash them. Its funny as I sit there and watch people eat the entire channel, knowing full well they have a filled endurance bar. How is that not a LTP issue?

yeah reflect have long cooldowns, but if u manage to reflect a rapid fire only once, im gonna eat at least 50% of my health cuz im full glass cannon too.

Wyrden.4713:

the auto atk dmg w/o cd always was the same, before and after patch…

The DPS on the auto attack has also increased by 10%. Read the Wind makes attacks 10% faster to do. Technically, Rapid Fire has had its cast time reduced, then reduced again by 10%.

Zatoichi.1049:

yeah reflect have long cooldowns, but if u manage to reflect a rapid fire only once, im gonna eat at least 50% of my health cuz im full glass cannon too.

You must be really good, because when I get my attacks reflected I either dodge roll or cancel immediately, taking only 1-2 arrows, then down them after 7 seconds or so, which is basically when rapid fire is off CD again.

I play a ranger too. The issue is not how much damage it dishes out, but how very, very, very easy it is to do it.

The class was never a joke, its just not a lot of people, at least the ones that voice their opinions about it, really knew how to play it well.

[/quote]

Yo, you know he can just wait or fighting something else while that’s up? It’s not very hard.
[/quote]

well then that just sums up the options a Range weapon has vs a melee one, if he changes target don’t give him time to react charge his face while its turned , scew the reflect if his not shooting at you..

WEXXES.2378:

Zatoichi.1049:

yeah reflect have long cooldowns, but if u manage to reflect a rapid fire only once, im gonna eat at least 50% of my health cuz im full glass cannon too.

You must be really good, because when I get my attacks reflected I either dodge roll or cancel immediately, taking only 1-2 arrows, then down them after 7 seconds or so, which is basically when rapid fire is off CD again.

I play a ranger too. The issue is not how much damage it dishes out, but how very, very, very easy it is to do it.

The class was never a joke, its just not a lot of people, at least the ones that voice their opinions about it, really knew how to play it well.

perhaps I should have said “up to 50%” because of how fast rapid fire is, when its being reflected, its pretty kitten difficult to instantly tell if its getting reflected, and because Im full glass, (full ascended zerker everything) even 3-4 arrows of it will do up to 8K to me. I can dodge or cancel but im still gonna eat 3-4, maybe more, before most likely

and yes, the class was absolutely a joke, not in the eyes of the rangers themselves, but in the eyes of many other people/classes. have you ever played gold league WvW?

WEXXES.2378:

Wyrden.4713:

the auto atk dmg w/o cd always was the same, before and after patch…

The DPS on the auto attack has also increased by 10%. Read the Wind makes attacks 10% faster to do. Technically, Rapid Fire has had its cast time reduced, then reduced again by 10%.

Read the wind is a Grandmaster trait though, it wasn’t a direct buff to the longbow itself, but a buff to a very underwhelming trait.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Anubis.7058:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

if you think about it , in the year and half i’ve played gw2 , long time vetern of gw1.

has anyone ever made a Tactical Strategy to counter a Ranged Fight as a group thinking about that will solved all the problems you think you have.
and i also i think its about time all the full zerk players got some toughness and Vit into the builds they use , i can’t even get a decent WvW player doing to 60% hp using a rapid fire and i run 50% pvt, cav+ zerks 6,0,2,6,0 on my ranger, i can survive Reflects but i’ll only have 40% hp left over if i don’t cancel/ stop attacking.

just adding a reflect wall stood at a distance will stop a Lb’s Assault in its tracks , he will be forced to swap weapons.

If someone doesnt have a reflect effect?

thinking in groups , someone will have a reflect in the area and i realy feel Relfects need to become more Widely used. this game since gw1 and anets philosophy has always been group play people realy need to get out of this 1vs1 thinking and start using Team work, not just oh the guy next to me used a firefield I can get a buff out of that.
a greedy thinking, if the person next to you has a Reflect slotted ,he could use it to protect his teammates rather than his kitten self.

But there is this thing called competitive balance…

Rangers got a needed buff to long bow. I like it

What I do not get, is how so many people claim it needs a nerf now, yet offer no reasonable way to compensate the profession.

Wyrden.4713:

WEXXES.2378:

It’s starting to become apparent that a lot of people don’t think this through.

@The person who said “Just any block, reflect, or projectile destroyer will PREVENT AT LEAST 80% OF THE BURST IF THE SKILL IS USED THE SECOND YOU SEE RF”

Its true. Unfortunately, the auto attack can do almost half the DPS as rapid fire, which has no cooldown, and rapid fire has a 10s cooldown, which goes down to 8s with the trait. Most blocks, reflects, or projectile destroyers, on average, has a cooldown way longer than that, and using not one, but both dodges just to deal with it isn’t okay, especially since the auto attack, which again, has no cooldown and can be used anytime, also does very high damage.

Also, as soon as you see the skill being used, 5 arrows have already hit you, and most likely you are fighting someone else.

@The person trying to give a definition of rangers. You have it completely backwards.

Rangers are the type of people who excel in close combat and raiding tactics. Read a dictionary. To range is to basically roam, not fire things from long distances.

@The guy who said “use reflect to force swap weapon”.

Yo, you know he can just wait or fighting something else while that’s up? It’s not very hard.

the auto atk dmg w/o cd always was the same, before and after patch…

3 words : read the wind

Zatoichi.1049:

WEXXES.2378:

Zatoichi.1049:

yeah reflect have long cooldowns, but if u manage to reflect a rapid fire only once, im gonna eat at least 50% of my health cuz im full glass cannon too.

You must be really good, because when I get my attacks reflected I either dodge roll or cancel immediately, taking only 1-2 arrows, then down them after 7 seconds or so, which is basically when rapid fire is off CD again.

I play a ranger too. The issue is not how much damage it dishes out, but how very, very, very easy it is to do it.

The class was never a joke, its just not a lot of people, at least the ones that voice their opinions about it, really knew how to play it well.

perhaps I should have said “up to 50%” because of how fast rapid fire is, when its being reflected, its pretty kitten difficult to instantly tell if its getting reflected, and because Im full glass, (full ascended zerker everything) even 3-4 arrows of it will do up to 8K to me. I can dodge or cancel but im still gonna eat 3-4, maybe more, before most likely

Rangers tell us learn to dodge the RF And now they said : when its being reflected, its pretty kitten difficult to instantly tell if its getting reflected, AND
I can dodge or cancel but im still gonna eat 3-4, maybe more, before most likely

JUST LOL SO HARD
which reflect skill is hard to tell i wonder ?
AND do your rangers know there is another classes playing glass build even with light armor .And they do have to manage their burst unlike your one button RF.

dancingmonkey.4902:

Rangers got a needed buff to long bow. I like it

What I do not get, is how so many people claim it needs a nerf now, yet offer no reasonable way to compensate the profession.

I played power ranger for wvw roaming before patch and i did like it . And I do know whats needed buff to longbow . Definitely not the damage part .RF need a longer CD , also a little nerf to signet of wild is needed .
I like greatsword buff that’s needed , and longbow needs some interesting traits instead of a plain damage buff .No one likes getting killed or kill someone instantly.Making other classes build around to counter one single button is just insane.

And saying something is wrong doesn’t need to offer something better .This is basic logic.

musu.9205:

Wyrden.4713:

WEXXES.2378:

It’s starting to become apparent that a lot of people don’t think this through.

@The person who said “Just any block, reflect, or projectile destroyer will PREVENT AT LEAST 80% OF THE BURST IF THE SKILL IS USED THE SECOND YOU SEE RF”

Its true. Unfortunately, the auto attack can do almost half the DPS as rapid fire, which has no cooldown, and rapid fire has a 10s cooldown, which goes down to 8s with the trait. Most blocks, reflects, or projectile destroyers, on average, has a cooldown way longer than that, and using not one, but both dodges just to deal with it isn’t okay, especially since the auto attack, which again, has no cooldown and can be used anytime, also does very high damage.

Also, as soon as you see the skill being used, 5 arrows have already hit you, and most likely you are fighting someone else.

@The person trying to give a definition of rangers. You have it completely backwards.

Rangers are the type of people who excel in close combat and raiding tactics. Read a dictionary. To range is to basically roam, not fire things from long distances.

@The guy who said “use reflect to force swap weapon”.

Yo, you know he can just wait or fighting something else while that’s up? It’s not very hard.

the auto atk dmg w/o cd always was the same, before and after patch…

3 words : read the wind

the dmg is the same, it just is 10% faster, and 10% is barely noticable

anyway, ranger needed those buffs, and its fine w those atm, stop trying to get rangers nerfed to the ground again

Anubis.7058:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Anubis.7058:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

if you think about it , in the year and half i’ve played gw2 , long time vetern of gw1.

has anyone ever made a Tactical Strategy to counter a Ranged Fight as a group thinking about that will solved all the problems you think you have.
and i also i think its about time all the full zerk players got some toughness and Vit into the builds they use , i can’t even get a decent WvW player doing to 60% hp using a rapid fire and i run 50% pvt, cav+ zerks 6,0,2,6,0 on my ranger, i can survive Reflects but i’ll only have 40% hp left over if i don’t cancel/ stop attacking.

just adding a reflect wall stood at a distance will stop a Lb’s Assault in its tracks , he will be forced to swap weapons.

If someone doesnt have a reflect effect?

thinking in groups , someone will have a reflect in the area and i realy feel Relfects need to become more Widely used. this game since gw1 and anets philosophy has always been group play people realy need to get out of this 1vs1 thinking and start using Team work, not just oh the guy next to me used a firefield I can get a buff out of that.
a greedy thinking, if the person next to you has a Reflect slotted ,he could use it to protect his teammates rather than his kitten self.

But there is this thing called competitive balance…

i don’t think you understand what Competive balance is..rf<Reflect that in its self is competivive balance , No one build do everything.

the situation in which no one business of a group of competing businesses has an unfair advantage over the others , in this case both groups will have a Rf ranger and a Reflect in both groups its up to those group to use the Reflect Smartly. they are balanced/.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

i don’t think you understand what Competive balance is..rf<Reflect that in its self is competivive balance , No one build do everything.

the situation in which no one business of a group of competing businesses has an unfair advantage over the others , in this case both groups will have a Rf ranger and a Reflect in both groups its up to those group to use the Reflect Smartly. they are balanced/.

1v1, tell a necro to reflect
3v3, tell me how a thief should block/stability when dogpiled
5v5, tell a mesmer to do ranged aoe
5v5 each side has each profession once, still tell me how a necro would reflect projectiles

Builds having weaknesses is fine, a profession/class/whatever not being even able to counter another build because it doesnt have the option to get the tools/apppropriate replacements everyone else has is not, that is by definition imbalance (side 1 clearly being worth and able to do more than side 2).

This bug makes it EXTREMELY OVERPOWERED https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Bug-Archer-s-range-2000-instead-of-1500/first#post4374019

Still, I love the ranger changes. I think they are getting even at this time in WvW.

Rym.1469:

Wethospu.6437:

Otaur.9268:

—
@Wethospu: Adrenaline can be regained in under 7 seconds.

The famous 6-6-6-6-6 build with 6 utilities?

And burst recharge can be reduced to only 7.75 seconds, not 7 seconds.

I believe the famous Hambow is enough.

Axe Offhand #5 + Sharpened Axes = full adren

Anubis.7058:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

i don’t think you understand what Competive balance is..rf<Reflect that in its self is competivive balance , No one build do everything.

the situation in which no one business of a group of competing businesses has an unfair advantage over the others , in this case both groups will have a Rf ranger and a Reflect in both groups its up to those group to use the Reflect Smartly. they are balanced/.

1v1, tell a necro to reflect
3v3, tell me how a thief should block/stability when dogpiled
5v5, tell a mesmer to do ranged aoe
5v5 each side has each profession once, still tell me how a necro would reflect projectiles

Builds having weaknesses is fine, a profession/class/whatever not being even able to counter another build because it doesnt have the option to get the tools/apppropriate replacements everyone else has is not, that is by definition imbalance (side 1 clearly being worth and able to do more than side 2).

Stil thinking in 1vs1 Situation , its clear not many people qqing have a Team experiance ,
dogpiled? get your warroir to do somthing.
mesmers Ranged Aoe , Beserker phantam whirl attack its enough to get someone off a dogpile unless the team has kitted themselfs to focus on the downed .
thats just bad luck and should of been prevented in the first place.

Hitman.5829:

This bug makes it EXTREMELY OVERPOWERED https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Bug-Archer-s-range-2000-instead-of-1500/first#post4374019

Thanks for the link. The information provided by its original poster seems legit. I have a level 80 ranger with eagle trait and LB clearly hits much further away than the listed 1500. I had myself estimated it, but never measured, it to be around 1800+, but according to the above seems the actual range is almost 2000 on even ground and up to 2400 from elevated ground.

A mobile single target ranged “100 blades” + 10 stacks in vulnerability = aka rapid fire should not be able to hit from so far, not even from 1200 if traited. I am fine with the damage, just make the real range closer to 900 if traited.

The counter arguments I have seen in these posts are more or less moot:
1. Learn to play or learn to dodge
One dodge doesn’t last the entire duration of rapid fire, thus you will dodge only about half of the missiles at best.
2. Use reflects
Reflecting skills are not available for every profession and are generally on much longer cool down (25-30 s) than rapid fire (8/10 s). Reflects will not fit every build and when everybody is forced to equip something against one build, we clearly have a problem in the game balance. By the way: I have not myself died from such reflect.
3. Close in the ranger and kill him
Wolf pet alone offers cripple, fear and knockdown. The Longbow itself offers stealth and knockback on a low cooldown. Greatsword offers 1100 range leap on a mere 12 (9.6 s traited) cooldown. Signet of stone offers 6 seconds of immunity to damage. In other words many cannot easily outrun the GS/LB ranger with wolf/jungle spider pet or close in before they are shot to death. A death squad of several LB rangers firing the same target makes this trivial.

One should also note that longbow has a very high damage multiplier for a ranged weapon auto attack 0.9x at 1000+ range. Compare this with e.g. engineer rifle, which has 1000 real range (1200 range if traited) and 0.65x multiplier and is generally considered as one of the strongest ranged auto attacks in the game. Both medium armor professions with medium health pool. About the same attack speed. There is a lot of traits to increase the LB damage and even make all it’s attacks pierce. Signet skills can be used to temporarily boost its damage by an significant amount e.g. opening strike (provided either by moment of clarity trait or activating signet of hunt) adds +50% to damage.

PS. I am just 4 damasks short to have all the materials for a complete ascended set for my ranger. Making a full ascended weapons + armor + trinket set + all the runes + sigils is a serious investment. I want ranger to be viable and the GS changes were amazing. Just that the LB + signet changes pushed a very simple to play build into faceroll category.

So i guess the issue now is the Range on the Lb (with traits) can hit at 2000yards.

i dont often get enough time at that range to get more than one shot off, unless the target stands still dumfound letting me get max damage hits.
Rf can’t reach 200 yards
nor can all the other skills a Lb uses.

though Balancing is never perfect its a ongoing progression of changes and big changes to a skill can cause balance issues , but under the rules of balance Anet won’t inbalance anything if it ment it would break the game.

currently it all fits into the Balancing rules one vs one other skill ect im sure they will update thing as they go but Currently only the Full zerks are qqing , i realy don’t think anyone that runs some sort of vit or toughness are having any problems with this One Trick pony of a build.

earlier today inWvW somone said is Full zerk mesmer still viable in WvW that made me laugh.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

So i guess the issue now is the Range on the Lb (with traits) can hit at 2000yards.

i dont often get enough time at that range to get more than one shot off, unless the target stands still dumfound letting me get max damage hits.
Rf can’t reach 200 yards
nor can all the other skills a Lb uses.

though Balancing is never perfect its a ongoing progression of changes and big changes to a skill can cause balance issues , but under the rules of balance Anet won’t inbalance anything if it ment it would break the game.

currently it all fits into the Balancing rules one vs one other skill ect im sure they will update thing as they go but Currently only the Full zerks are qqing , i realy don’t think anyone that runs some sort of vit or toughness are having any problems with this One Trick pony of a build.

earlier today inWvW somone said is Full zerk mesmer still viable in WvW that made me laugh.

Anet also buffed ranger gs ,it’s crazy easy to swap gs and escape then RF again (not to mention maul easily lands spike damage now )also stealth 3s and signet buff .My personal opinion is that ranger longbow didn’t fit ranger traits and skills well before .Its issue wasn’t lack of the damage .Now anet actually made it work well with other weapon sets and traits etc but also with higher damage .
All we need is nerf to RF CD , the rest will be fine .

The initial shots damage should be toned down too.

Lol.

I’m gonna say this now.
Ranger CANNOT build the most damage of all of the classes. Especially against thief despite all of the QQ saying they hit just as hard yada yada. Yes, RF has high scaling but the ranger has no boon access under a DPS build and has substantially lower damage modifiers (less than half) of other classes, notably a good burst thief.

The absolute maximum possible damage output on a ranger’s rapid fire is somewhere along the lines of 13-15k if one assumes max stacks in WvW and a 100% crit rate and food. These wild claims of being hit for 20k RF’s could only be the source of a ranger with 25 stacks of might from other people and the target with 25 stacks of vuln.

Thief backstab – not even the combo – can throttle over 20k depending on the foe.
Proof? Here’s mine, to demonstrate how even after the ferocity nerfs these numbers can be achieved because thieves have so many more damage modifiers whereas the power longbow ranger gets a measly traited 20% at absolute best if flanking and at full endurance. See the screenshot below – and that’s on an 80 heavy with no food or stacks.

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

Oh, and such thieves initiate at 2100 range through instant-speed blinking gap closers, which every other class also has access to, many of which also have a multitude of reflect effects, body blocking, inherently high HP/defense, damage immunity, etc. To say RF is overpowered because a full GC ranger gets some predictable and easy to avoid burst damage is just terribly inaccurate, since you can see it coming and can also LoS it through terrain unlike every other melee attack. Are thieves OP? No. Are longbow rangers? No.

Just like I tell people who QQ about thieves being OP, go and play the class/build for yourself, learn it, and then you’ll find out how to beat it. I get a lot of QQ whispers from other thieves I fight when I CnD off of them while they’re stealthed complaining about hacks or lag or some other BS, but ultimately these builds are predictable and in my experience as playing a thief I’ve learned how to beat them fairly easily; they’re easy to counter, and are the source of complaints by players who just simply refuse to learn to get better at counterplaying.

DeceiverX.8361:

Lol.

I’m gonna say this now.
Ranger CANNOT build the most damage of all of the classes. Especially against thief despite all of the QQ saying they hit just as hard yada yada. Yes, RF has high scaling but the ranger has no boon access under a DPS build and has substantially lower damage modifiers (less than half) of other classes, notably a good burst thief.

The absolute maximum possible damage output on a ranger’s rapid fire is somewhere along the lines of 13-15k if one assumes max stacks in WvW and a 100% crit rate and food. These wild claims of being hit for 20k RF’s could only be the source of a ranger with 25 stacks of might from other people and the target with 25 stacks of vuln.

Thief backstab – not even the combo – can throttle over 20k depending on the foe.
Proof? Here’s mine, to demonstrate how even after the ferocity nerfs these numbers can be achieved because thieves have so many more damage modifiers whereas the power longbow ranger gets a measly traited 20% at absolute best if flanking and at full endurance. See the screenshot below – and that’s on an 80 heavy with no food or stacks.

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

Oh, and such thieves initiate at 2100 range through instant-speed blinking gap closers, which every other class also has access to, many of which also have a multitude of reflect effects, body blocking, inherently high HP/defense, damage immunity, etc. To say RF is overpowered because a full GC ranger gets some predictable and easy to avoid burst damage is just terribly inaccurate, since you can see it coming and can also LoS it through terrain unlike every other melee attack. Are thieves OP? No. Are longbow rangers? No.

Just like I tell people who QQ about thieves being OP, go and play the class/build for yourself, learn it, and then you’ll find out how to beat it. I get a lot of QQ whispers from other thieves I fight when I CnD off of them while they’re stealthed complaining about hacks or lag or some other BS, but ultimately these builds are predictable and in my experience as playing a thief I’ve learned how to beat them fairly easily; they’re easy to counter, and are the source of complaints by players who just simply refuse to learn to get better at counterplaying.

I used RF in heat of the mist on heavy golem and i could do like 10-12k damage with 3-5 stacks of might and ranger rune.
Yeah It’s too hard to learn counterplay just like it’s to hard to roll a ranger and do some test in hotm before claiming something.

I have two of them and have been playing one of them for over two years now.

I see you’ve applied your 20 stacks of vuln from the class mechanics already. I’m waiting where the rest of the needed 50% of your damage is going to come from.

But I guess it’s also too much to expect a real player would dodge 3/4 of the RF or that defenses on tanks are inherently higher in wvw despite the increased damage yields.

Yeah it’s too hard to learn to counterplay so instead just nerf RF since people don’t understand what burst builds are and can’t handle being able to dodge a large portion of the incoming damage by pressing a button and then just walking up and using some gap closing methods in the meantime.

The damage hasn’t changed. Literally, the numbers you did in hotm during your tests are the same they’ve always been. This is not a new concept. The hits are just coming faster.

stof.9341:

Right, sorry, stupid mistake. Still the Longbow has 5% more base damage than the Dagger. As a result, the 3.75 coefficient does 5% more damage which means it’s equivalent to a 3.9375 coefficient skill if it was used by a dagger weapon.

Ok so thief and ranger is on par here. But wait, let’s not forget that RF has a 2.5 sec cast time, thief can burst in less than 1 sec and can land a couple more strikes + another C&D in 2.5 sec. Tell me the total dmg coefficient then.

stof.9341:

And I haven’t added the 5 stacks of vulnerability a Ranger gets as an opening attack , I haven’t counted either the damage the Ranger does with it’s first attack, say, a normal arrow first (0.9 coefficient) that autocrits Let’s not talk about the 10 stacks of vulnerability added by Rapid Fire itself and the 5 more from your own pet opening strike. Or your own pet damage either. And the very high chance that Fire and Air sigil will proc from the 10 attacks you do.

Let’s just exaggerate that ranger stacks 15 vul on the first hit, 0.15 coefficient. Mug is 0.6 coefficient. while it can’t crit it is still 0.2 even if i assume fero multiplier and dmg multiplier adds up to a total of 3. which is a staggering multiplier figure ranger can only imagine. In conclusion, Mug is better than 15 stacks of vul even if all 15 stacks come out on the first hit.

stof.9341:

21s cooldown at most for that combo. And you didn’t mention the small fact that the thief, once his combo is over will be all sad and on melee range of whatever he didn’t manage to kill, like a tanky target. And his friend. And his friend zerg.

So what do we have here?
Thieves pros..
-shorter duration overall same dmg burst
-or same duration overall higher dmg burst
Thieves cons..
-will end up in melee
-longer cooldown

Pretty fair tradeoff i would say.

Pro tip for thieves, do not mindlessly initiate and end up in the middle of your zerg friend

You see? No one is far more superior than the other. At the end of the day, there is no point in comparing apples to oranges. Different class different mechanics different pros different cons.
That is what i am trying to bring across.

DeceiverX.8361:

Lol.

I’m gonna say this now.
Ranger CANNOT build the most damage of all of the classes. Especially against thief despite all of the QQ saying they hit just as hard yada yada. Yes, RF has high scaling but the ranger has no boon access under a DPS build and has substantially lower damage modifiers (less than half) of other classes, notably a good burst thief.

The absolute maximum possible damage output on a ranger’s rapid fire is somewhere along the lines of 13-15k if one assumes max stacks in WvW and a 100% crit rate and food. These wild claims of being hit for 20k RF’s could only be the source of a ranger with 25 stacks of might from other people and the target with 25 stacks of vuln.

Thief backstab – not even the combo – can throttle over 20k depending on the foe.
Proof? Here’s mine, to demonstrate how even after the ferocity nerfs these numbers can be achieved because thieves have so many more damage modifiers whereas the power longbow ranger gets a measly traited 20% at absolute best if flanking and at full endurance. See the screenshot below – and that’s on an 80 heavy with no food or stacks.

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

Oh, and such thieves initiate at 2100 range through instant-speed blinking gap closers, which every other class also has access to, many of which also have a multitude of reflect effects, body blocking, inherently high HP/defense, damage immunity, etc. To say RF is overpowered because a full GC ranger gets some predictable and easy to avoid burst damage is just terribly inaccurate, since you can see it coming and can also LoS it through terrain unlike every other melee attack. Are thieves OP? No. Are longbow rangers? No.

Just like I tell people who QQ about thieves being OP, go and play the class/build for yourself, learn it, and then you’ll find out how to beat it. I get a lot of QQ whispers from other thieves I fight when I CnD off of them while they’re stealthed complaining about hacks or lag or some other BS, but ultimately these builds are predictable and in my experience as playing a thief I’ve learned how to beat them fairly easily; they’re easy to counter, and are the source of complaints by players who just simply refuse to learn to get better at counterplaying.

Thank you for this very unbiased post about thief. You didn’t down play the class and provide wonderful insight about thief. This is lovely to read. The forums need more people like you.

musu.9205:

I used RF in heat of the mist on heavy golem and i could do like 10-12k damage with 3-5 stacks of might and ranger rune.
Yeah It’s too hard to learn counterplay just like it’s to hard to roll a ranger and do some test in hotm before claiming something.

That seems highly improbable.

Just coming out of the Mists with a berserker amulet, runes of the ranger, and fifteen stacks of might and fury I built up with the axe mainhand , warhorn 5, and might on pet swap I only hit for 6.7K from the Rapid Fire alone. Add on another 1-2K from the Air and Fire sigils proccing. This all being on the Heavy Golem as you claim to have performed it on.

Bare in mind it takes a fair while to build up that might by bouncing the axe between three targets, and it fades in a matter of seconds so you have to be VERY fast in the weapon swap and Rapid Fire click.

I was able to repeat the same process and get up to 8.5K with Rampage as One. I only broke 9K by blowing Rampage as One and Signet of the Wild together, but by the time I swapped my pet, popped both, switched weapons, and turned to hit the Heavy Golem my might stacks had already dropped from 18 to 7. That should give you a reference for how hard it is to get a good 10K plus burst out of Rapid Fire.

Even accounting for other factors and differences between our builds you’re getting 3,000 more damage than I am, and your post implies you weren’t blowing an elite and a utility skill to optimize your burst. So what are you doing to get these numbers, exactly?

My build was 6/6/0/0/2.

Ehecatl.9172:

That seems highly improbable.
-snip-

Yeah exactly. More like RF on a light 80 in wvw.

DeceiverX.8361:

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

You cannot include Mug coefficient like that. Mug cannot crit.

stof.9341:

DeceiverX.8361:

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

You cannot include Mug coefficient like that. Mug cannot crit.

look at his screen shot. 2237 mug dmg and 5438 C&D dmg.

if C&D is a 1.5 coefficient skill, that mug has a coefficient of around 0.6… wait a minute, a skill that actually actually cant crit dealt a dmg that has fero factored in!? what? lol.

and he goes on to mug for 5357 next.

DeceiverX.8361:

Lol.

I’m gonna say this now.
Ranger CANNOT build the most damage of all of the classes. Especially against thief despite all of the QQ saying they hit just as hard yada yada. Yes, RF has high scaling but the ranger has no boon access under a DPS build and has substantially lower damage modifiers (less than half) of other classes, notably a good burst thief.

The absolute maximum possible damage output on a ranger’s rapid fire is somewhere along the lines of 13-15k if one assumes max stacks in WvW and a 100% crit rate and food. These wild claims of being hit for 20k RF’s could only be the source of a ranger with 25 stacks of might from other people and the target with 25 stacks of vuln.

Thief backstab – not even the combo – can throttle over 20k depending on the foe.
Proof? Here’s mine, to demonstrate how even after the ferocity nerfs these numbers can be achieved because thieves have so many more damage modifiers whereas the power longbow ranger gets a measly traited 20% at absolute best if flanking and at full endurance. See the screenshot below – and that’s on an 80 heavy with no food or stacks.

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

Oh, and such thieves initiate at 2100 range through instant-speed blinking gap closers, which every other class also has access to, many of which also have a multitude of reflect effects, body blocking, inherently high HP/defense, damage immunity, etc. To say RF is overpowered because a full GC ranger gets some predictable and easy to avoid burst damage is just terribly inaccurate, since you can see it coming and can also LoS it through terrain unlike every other melee attack. Are thieves OP? No. Are longbow rangers? No.

Just like I tell people who QQ about thieves being OP, go and play the class/build for yourself, learn it, and then you’ll find out how to beat it. I get a lot of QQ whispers from other thieves I fight when I CnD off of them while they’re stealthed complaining about hacks or lag or some other BS, but ultimately these builds are predictable and in my experience as playing a thief I’ve learned how to beat them fairly easily; they’re easy to counter, and are the source of complaints by players who just simply refuse to learn to get better at counterplaying.

Respect Son!, this can also be avoided by Blocking,dodging just as the mug goes off unless they traited for daze, stun break.
the pay off 20k in one hit , plus 2-5k in mug and 1.2-2.4ks in normal attacks thats huge in just 2secs and can’t be easly avoided even if the mug hits and back stab fails. Mug + autos and Cnd will still do around 6-10k(10k in the Squishy situations).

actually if you do a FULL stack, FULL bloodlust + BL Bloodlust (3) Zerker ranger, with signets and the right pet, your rapid fire can IN THEORY, if everything hits, crits and procs, deal 21.2k. On a full glass light armor class that is.

That is considering EVERY HIT deals its maximum crit damage (around 1.7k) + air fire proc and 5 stacks of might.

Now, you cannot test this damage in HotM because you cannot get guard stacks, bloodlust and BL bloodlust all at once. But i did do the math (very roughly) and thanks to 3x 10%, 1x 5%, 1x 25% boosters we can reach these numbers.

However the cost for pulling this off is blowing EVERY COOLDOWN KNOWN TO MANKIND. Resulting in the easiest kill known to WvW roamers short of armor-less uplevels.

In short. Rapid fire is amazing, In contrast – Maul (Greatsword #2) can hit for OVER 33k when set up right…. so well, nothing special with RF and ranger having insane spike damage.

EDIT: likelihood of this sort of RF ever landing on you is 10 in 10 squared.

niconori.7235:

Thank you for this very unbiased post about thief. You didn’t down play the class and provide wonderful insight about thief. This is lovely to read. The forums need more people like you.

Thank you. We’re comparing burst builds here. Don’t get me wrong, the damage aspect of the class can be incredible, but it comes at an immense cost. I think a lot of people fail to recognize how the thief is a very polarized profession in that it does only certain things very well dependent on the build’s intended use and sucks at the rest, but what it builds into doing well, it by far excels at.

niconori.7235:

stof.9341:

DeceiverX.8361:

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

You cannot include Mug coefficient like that. Mug cannot crit.

look at his screen shot. 2237 mug dmg and 5438 C&D dmg.

if C&D is a 1.5 coefficient skill, that mug has a coefficient of around 0.6… wait a minute, a skill that actually actually cant crit dealt a dmg that has fero factored in!? what? lol.

and he goes on to mug for 5357 next.

Neither CnD critted, either. Those were non-critical strikes, thus why the mug damage looks high. If mug could crit as it used to the damage as it is in a lot of cases would be something like 10k + 10k + 20k. I just got unlucky on both since ToTC takes my crit rate to over 70% on my thief QQ and the only other backstabs I have done over the 20k mark since ferocity have been in the heat of larger-scale fights where I could just never get a screenshot.

Prysin.8542:

actually if you do a FULL stack, FULL bloodlust + BL Bloodlust (3) Zerker ranger, with signets and the right pet, your rapid fire can IN THEORY, if everything hits, crits and procs, deal 21.2k. On a full glass light armor class that is.

That is considering EVERY HIT deals its maximum crit damage (around 1.7k) + air fire proc and 5 stacks of might.

Now, you cannot test this damage in HotM because you cannot get guard stacks, bloodlust and BL bloodlust all at once. But i did do the math (very roughly) and thanks to 3x 10%, 1x 5%, 1x 25% boosters we can reach these numbers.

However the cost for pulling this off is blowing EVERY COOLDOWN KNOWN TO MANKIND. Resulting in the easiest kill known to WvW roamers short of armor-less uplevels.

In short. Rapid fire is amazing, In contrast – Maul (Greatsword #2) can hit for OVER 33k when set up right…. so well, nothing special with RF and ranger having insane spike damage.

EDIT: likelihood of this sort of RF ever landing on you is 10 in 10 squared.

I wasn’t including sigils since those aren’t a part of RF’s actual damage throughputs and can remain constant across all classes/builds. So alright, you’re near like 17k at absolute peak performance under the assumption the ranger manages 100% crit chance and all those conditionals – and of course, it also depends on the build the ranger has for power scaling, etc.

Better put, a reasonably viable ranger build will be capping around 13-15k :P

DeceiverX.8361:

Lol.

I’m gonna say this now.
Ranger CANNOT build the most damage of all of the classes. Especially against thief despite all of the QQ saying they hit just as hard yada yada. Yes, RF has high scaling but the ranger has no boon access under a DPS build and has substantially lower damage modifiers (less than half) of other classes, notably a good burst thief.

The absolute maximum possible damage output on a ranger’s rapid fire is somewhere along the lines of 13-15k if one assumes max stacks in WvW and a 100% crit rate and food. These wild claims of being hit for 20k RF’s could only be the source of a ranger with 25 stacks of might from other people and the target with 25 stacks of vuln.

Thief backstab – not even the combo – can throttle over 20k depending on the foe.
Proof? Here’s mine, to demonstrate how even after the ferocity nerfs these numbers can be achieved because thieves have so many more damage modifiers whereas the power longbow ranger gets a measly traited 20% at absolute best if flanking and at full endurance. See the screenshot below – and that’s on an 80 heavy with no food or stacks.

And the full CnD combo usually includes mug which yields a total ratio of 1 + 1.5 + 2.4 = 4.9 before considering the effects of might and other readily-accessible boons thieves have access to in order to increase damage. It doesn’t matter that steal has a 30 second cooldown because your target is DEAD. One also needs to consider how burst thieves have access to 16 stacks of might for 10s instantly.

Oh, and such thieves initiate at 2100 range through instant-speed blinking gap closers, which every other class also has access to, many of which also have a multitude of reflect effects, body blocking, inherently high HP/defense, damage immunity, etc. To say RF is overpowered because a full GC ranger gets some predictable and easy to avoid burst damage is just terribly inaccurate, since you can see it coming and can also LoS it through terrain unlike every other melee attack. Are thieves OP? No. Are longbow rangers? No.

Just like I tell people who QQ about thieves being OP, go and play the class/build for yourself, learn it, and then you’ll find out how to beat it. I get a lot of QQ whispers from other thieves I fight when I CnD off of them while they’re stealthed complaining about hacks or lag or some other BS, but ultimately these builds are predictable and in my experience as playing a thief I’ve learned how to beat them fairly easily; they’re easy to counter, and are the source of complaints by players who just simply refuse to learn to get better at counterplaying.

This post explains your crusade against any thief build not D/D.

Thank you for clearing up the source of your l2p issues.

That being said I will have to laugh at the entirety of your argument because it’s VERY misleading and chocked full of untrue statements.

1. That pic of thief burst is only doable on a full signet thief. That means there is no initiating from 2100 distance. Also it’s got 2 HUGE tells as in 2 1 second casts before combo. The next point I like is the fact you are from the Maguuma server if memory serves me right……the last time you fought kain was a LONG time ago before ferocity.

2. RF requires zero set up besides pushing a button vs the sequence required to do a full signet steal CnD bs combo. 2nd you are landing RF 1900-2400 units away faster than the above mentioned combo well under 2 seconds which puts the above mentioned thief dead before finishing casting his basilisk venom.

3. If backstab can hit for 20k you’re kitten sure RF can too since it’s multiplier is higher than the 2.4 backstab one.

Now this is where i can tear into your comparison based solely on range/ttk/ease of execution, or I can flip the script with just how miniscule the risk/reward of RF is. Don’t forget ya got great mobility on that ranger build as well due to GS, but keep up the good fight mate I’ll be laughing

T raw.4658:

This post explains your crusade against any thief build not D/D.

Thank you for clearing up the source of your l2p issues.

That being said I will have to laugh at the entirety of your argument because it’s VERY misleading and chocked full of untrue statements.

1. That pic of thief burst is only doable on a full signet thief. That means there is no initiating from 2100 distance. Also it’s got 2 HUGE tells as in 2 1 second casts before combo. The next point I like is the fact you are from the Maguuma server if memory serves me right……the last time you fought kain was a LONG time ago before ferocity.

2. RF requires zero set up besides pushing a button vs the sequence required to do a full signet steal CnD bs combo. 2nd you are landing RF 1900-2400 units away faster than the above mentioned combo well under 2 seconds which puts the above mentioned thief dead before finishing casting his basilisk venom.

3. If backstab can hit for 20k you’re kitten sure RF can too since it’s multiplier is higher than the 2.4 backstab one.

Now this is where i can tear into your comparison based solely on range/ttk/ease of execution, or I can flip the script with just how miniscule the risk/reward of RF is. Don’t forget ya got great mobility on that ranger build as well due to GS, but keep up the good fight mate I’ll be laughing

1.) So is the high damage from a super-power all-in RF ranger, which will only be applied to one RF every ~ 70 seconds. Wrong. Infil Signet is 1200 Range castable at infinite range (as long as there is a target selected) and will guarantee a 1200 range blink in the direction of the target regardless of how far away he is. Steal has a 900 range baseline. Combine the two, and you have a 2100 range increment at instant speed. No. the screenshot is me from when I was on FC. I’m also now playing on Dragonbrand, and never played on Mag since I prefer not to bandwagon. If you look at the skills in the screenshot, Revealed Training is there and locked. Revealed Training was implemented the same patch as the ferocity implementation. So now you’re wrong again.

2.) RF requires setup in the form of knowing when to cast it. It also will not land 2400 units away. Traited, at max arrow fall-off, the skill will reach 1800. Also, my thief blink teleports to the target faster than my RF arrows with RtW traited even reach the target. Wrong a third time. RF also has a hard counter in the form of reflect and requires positional setup in the form of not being hindered by LoS or body-blocking, unlike a D/D signet stab. A good thief will have already seen the ranger at well beyond 3-5k range and would have pre-casted BV then since it has a 30s duration and rangers do not have access to aegis to need to apply it after getting into combat. So wrong again, number four. Infil Signet and Steal also teleport/break stuns. A good thief has zero excuse to be hit first by the ranger, and even if he is, he has ample time to infil signet/steal through PBS and lay waste to the ranger as well. Wrong a fifth time. Y’know what, I’m gonna stop counting since literally everything you just posted was incorrect. Thief also has a hard-counter to longbow ranger in the form of Dagger Storm since it will directly reflect the damage and prevent KD’s while crippling the ranger and the pet. If a thief cannot execute any of that, or let alone dodge roll and just bypass all of the damage, that thief is bad and needs to L2P. I run a signet thief, and I win these fights. I see zero reason for SA sustain and tankier thieves with better access to stun breaks and evasion have any reason to complain against this matchup. These players are strictly bad players who as I said earlier, refuse to learn how to counterplay.

3.) Wrong again. I’ve taken my thief to over 4.5k power on a 40% damage modifier due to self-stacking boons a opposed to the ranger’s ~3000 at maximum at 20% best-case scenario if flanking and with full endurance. The power difference alone accounts for the lower scaling since it’ll yield an effective 3.6 coefficient before considering the scaling on either. Backstab hits harder on a burst signet thief, sorry.

Except thieves still have better mobility due to shortbow and HS allowing for a faster land speed than swoop due to its excessive cooldown.

So you’ve proven yourself incorrect about every statement you just made.

And lastly, if you’re not playing D/D thief, you’re not playing a real burst-oriented thief. Sorry your damage is lower; maybe next time play with a setup that actually allows for damage to be dealt than sitting in a blind field/perma-stealth or being dependent on spamming evade+ boon strip and wondering why your burst is lower.

This is a prime example of what I stated above about whining players needing to learn how to counterplay and understanding these builds by actually playing them.

sums up the post patch ranger discussion.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXsE5TMN1-M
whats more there is to add?

Dood that signet is not 1200 range

Then look through the rest of the forums where it’s documented LB is reaching 2400

As for you not being on Mag w/e my bad there. The rest of the post is irrelevant as usually.

Get back to me when you’re serious

T raw.4658:

Dood that signet is not 1200 range

Then look through the rest of the forums where it’s documented LB is reaching 2400

As for you not being on Mag w/e my bad there. The rest of the post is irrelevant as usually.

Get back to me when you’re serious

its reaching 2 .1 k around max, 2 k or so if just slightly above cause of terrain, 1800 or so in even / lower terrain

You can think about Rapid Fire in two ways.

First, the decrease in channeling time allows the ranger to deal more damage more quickly.

Second, the decrease in channeling time allows the ranger’s damaged to be dodged more easily and more completely.

Wyrden.4713:

T raw.4658:

Dood that signet is not 1200 range

Then look through the rest of the forums where it’s documented LB is reaching 2400

As for you not being on Mag w/e my bad there. The rest of the post is irrelevant as usually.

Get back to me when you’re serious

its reaching 2 .1 k around max, 2 k or so if just slightly above cause of terrain, 1800 or so in even / lower terrain

Even though people have already tested it and stated 2.4k…..we’ll still say 1.8k-2.1k is still broken since its well over the supposed 1.5k range ^^

T raw.4658:

Even though people have already tested it and stated 2.4k…..we’ll still say 1.8k-2.1k is still broken since its well over the supposed 1.5k range ^^

Once again, it is not broken. Plenty of other projectiles continue to exist and deal damage past their maximum stated range based on elevation. Both the ranger longbow and shortbow do it. Warrior longbow does it. Elementalist staff and scepter both do it on certain auto attacks. Etc.

The skill isn’t bugged or broken in range. People have just been oblivious to the range of projectile skills in this game for two years apparently.

T raw.4658:

All other burst isn’t 1500 or more range away

T raw.4658:

That much damage that fast from that range is game breaking.

thief steal into 10-12K backstab + 5-7K spammable heartseekers says hello.

…

Fun fact:
P/P unload used twice has a higher DPS than RF and the same casting duration.

Deniara Devious.3948:

Hitman.5829:

This bug makes it EXTREMELY OVERPOWERED https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Bug-Archer-s-range-2000-instead-of-1500/first#post4374019

Thanks for the link. The information provided by its original poster seems legit. I have a level 80 ranger with eagle trait and LB clearly hits much further away than the listed 1500. I had myself estimated it, but never measured, it to be around 1800+, but according to the above seems the actual range is almost 2000 on even ground and up to 2400 from elevated ground

No its not legit. He is citing you his own post, and hes been citing his own post all over the place trying to draw attention to it.. Also, take a look at his post history, he basically plays a warrior and goes around calling things other classes can do that his cant, bugs, abuses or exploits. He’s trying to get Lifeforce to decay as fast as adreniline currently does, he claims shadow stepping up stairs is an exploit, and hes reporting on a range “bug” that isnt a bug because of the ranger buff.

Arrows travel slightly passed their range. If you are on flat ground or shooting up, you can shoot about ~1550-1600 with eagle eye, and significantly further if shooting downhill, depending on how much higher up you are than your target. This is intended behavior and has worked this way since launch. No ranger is shooting people from 2000 range on level ground, nor are projectiles traveling further when shooting with a elevation advantage some special property limited to rangers. In his tests, he is constantly shooting from higher ground. his tests are bogus and hes just some forum frumpkin with a pro warrior agenda.