Guild Wars 2

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud, minions

Mesmers:
illusions

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements

Thief:
stealth/mobility

Rangers:
pets

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt

gaurdians:
boons/blocking

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

you do not ask for that to be changed for your own selfish desires.

Considering your post history, this sure is hypocritical. You have post demanding changes to sigils, runes and warriors. In the past 7 days you posted on two other professions threads, discussing negative changes to those professions. You have an extensive history demanding WvW and PvP changes, as well as crying for changes to the warrior. It seems your okay demanding positive changes that benefit you personally, but when someone asked for an adjustment when something is clearly out of balance in a manner that does not favor you, all of the sudden it’s

“when you play a game, you follow the rules.
you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.
rules are meant to be followed, not twisted to your own whim.”

If you care to refute this, I would happily offer multiple links in which you are demanding changing on a whim as you put it.

My point is, if you have a reason imbalances shouldn’t change, please offer it. If you have a logical reason why warriors should not follow the balancing philosophies they posted on the profession, when you were okay with all of the other professions nerfs based on these philosophies, I would love to hear it. Otherwise please stop trolling by posting every few minute regurgitating the same comments.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

when you play a game, you follow the rules.
you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.
rules are meant to be followed, not twisted to your own whim.

in other words:

warriors have best landspeed.
you play the game according to that.
you do not ask for that to be changed for your own selfish desires.

So what you’re saying is, all those buffs the devs put on warriors over all these months post launch (based heavily on the requests and complaints of warrior players) were wrong and should be reverted. Hmmm….

Ross Biddle.2367:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

when you play a game, you follow the rules.
you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.
rules are meant to be followed, not twisted to your own whim.

in other words:

warriors have best landspeed.
you play the game according to that.
you do not ask for that to be changed for your own selfish desires.

So what you’re saying is, all those buffs the devs put on warriors over all these months post launch (based heavily on the requests and complaints of warrior players) were wrong and should be reverted. Hmmm….

it is all right since the rules maker decided to amend the rules.

players should follow the rules set by the rules maker.

of course, some unsatisfied players may request the rules maker to amend the rules.
but the other satisfied players have the right to object the unsatisfied players request to amend the rules.

yes?

coglin.1867:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

you do not ask for that to be changed for your own selfish desires.

Considering your post history, this sure is hypocritical. You have post demanding changes to sigils, runes and warriors. In the past 7 days you posted on two other professions threads, discussing negative changes to those professions. You have an extensive history demanding WvW and PvP changes, as well as crying for changes to the warrior. It seems your okay demanding positive changes that benefit you personally, but when someone asked for an adjustment when something is clearly out of balance in a manner that does not favor you, all of the sudden it’s

“when you play a game, you follow the rules.
you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.
rules are meant to be followed, not twisted to your own whim.”

If you care to refute this, I would happily offer multiple links in which you are demanding changing on a whim as you put it.

My point is, if you have a reason imbalances shouldn’t change, please offer it. If you have a logical reason why warriors should not follow the balancing philosophies they posted on the profession, when you were okay with all of the other professions nerfs based on these philosophies, I would love to hear it. Otherwise please stop trolling by posting every few minute regurgitating the same comments.

does not matter, because warriors are balanced. it is not my fault when other people could not see this.

“You have post demanding changes to sigils, runes and warriors. "
really? i have a bad memory, would you kindly please remind me when i made such demands? thank you.

“have an extensive history demanding WvW and PvP changes”
do you have any evidence to back up this claim?

“crying for changes to the warrior”
evidence, please?

thank you.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

coglin.1867:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

you do not ask for that to be changed for your own selfish desires.

Considering your post history, this sure is hypocritical. You have post demanding changes to sigils, runes and warriors. In the past 7 days you posted on two other professions threads, discussing negative changes to those professions. You have an extensive history demanding WvW and PvP changes, as well as crying for changes to the warrior. It seems your okay demanding positive changes that benefit you personally, but when someone asked for an adjustment when something is clearly out of balance in a manner that does not favor you, all of the sudden it’s

“when you play a game, you follow the rules.
you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.
rules are meant to be followed, not twisted to your own whim.”

If you care to refute this, I would happily offer multiple links in which you are demanding changing on a whim as you put it.

My point is, if you have a reason imbalances shouldn’t change, please offer it. If you have a logical reason why warriors should not follow the balancing philosophies they posted on the profession, when you were okay with all of the other professions nerfs based on these philosophies, I would love to hear it. Otherwise please stop trolling by posting every few minute regurgitating the same comments.

does not matter, because warriors are balanced. it is not my fault when other people could not see this.

“You have post demanding changes to sigils, runes and warriors. "
really? i have a bad memory, would you kindly please remind me when i made such demands? thank you.

“have an extensive history demanding WvW and PvP changes”
do you have any evidence to back up this claim?

“crying for changes to the warrior”
evidence, please?

thank you.

Does everyone that has argued against you need to post links to several of your forum posts that are completely biased and bigoted while only based off playing casual sPvP hot join only 20 solo ques and no team ques?

I remember when the devs used to have SOTG discussions with high end players from both EU and NA. These players provided constructive criticism on proposed changes even if the change buffed their own class.

You do no such thing.
I have played several tPvP games across all classes and right now I can honestly say that a warrior can do the job to fit every role with in tPvP better than those classes which were originally supposed to supposedly fit certain roles.

This game doesn’t have the holy trinity like other games. However it still has roles.
At the most basic level the roles are:
-You have your home point capper
-Mid point bunker
-Roamer
-Far Point assaulter

No class can successfully fill all these roles except one. Warrior.

Mesmer used to be able to fill the role of home point capper… Then the condi meta hit and pushed mesmers out.

Eles used to be able to be the far point assulters… RTL and cantrip nerf stopped that (and yet warriors are still griping that they need their movement to get around)

Thieves were once the gods of roaming as they should be…. Not anymore… A single hambow warrior will keep the thief from doing anything… Yet the thief requires two or three burst combos to kill a warrior wearing the same amulet…

Guardians used to be great home point and mid bunkers. But a warrior can fulfill the role so much better because guess what… a bunker warrior can OUTHEAL a bunker guardian…. With much less effort.

Should every class be able to fill more than one role with in the tournament environment? Yes.

Should one class fill all roles with little to no effort… Not one bit.

jportell.2197:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

coglin.1867:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

you do not ask for that to be changed for your own selfish desires.

Considering your post history, this sure is hypocritical. You have post demanding changes to sigils, runes and warriors. In the past 7 days you posted on two other professions threads, discussing negative changes to those professions. You have an extensive history demanding WvW and PvP changes, as well as crying for changes to the warrior. It seems your okay demanding positive changes that benefit you personally, but when someone asked for an adjustment when something is clearly out of balance in a manner that does not favor you, all of the sudden it’s

“when you play a game, you follow the rules.
you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.
rules are meant to be followed, not twisted to your own whim.”

If you care to refute this, I would happily offer multiple links in which you are demanding changing on a whim as you put it.

My point is, if you have a reason imbalances shouldn’t change, please offer it. If you have a logical reason why warriors should not follow the balancing philosophies they posted on the profession, when you were okay with all of the other professions nerfs based on these philosophies, I would love to hear it. Otherwise please stop trolling by posting every few minute regurgitating the same comments.

does not matter, because warriors are balanced. it is not my fault when other people could not see this.

“You have post demanding changes to sigils, runes and warriors. "
really? i have a bad memory, would you kindly please remind me when i made such demands? thank you.

“have an extensive history demanding WvW and PvP changes”
do you have any evidence to back up this claim?

“crying for changes to the warrior”
evidence, please?

thank you.

Does everyone that has argued against you need to post links to several of your forum posts that are completely biased and bigoted while only based off playing casual sPvP hot join only 20 solo ques and no team ques?

I remember when the devs used to have SOTG discussions with high end players from both EU and NA. These players provided constructive criticism on proposed changes even if the change buffed their own class.

You do no such thing.
I have played several tPvP games across all classes and right now I can honestly say that a warrior can do the job to fit every role with in tPvP better than those classes which were originally supposed to supposedly fit certain roles.

This game doesn’t have the holy trinity like other games. However it still has roles.
At the most basic level the roles are:
-You have your home point capper
-Mid point bunker
-Roamer
-Far Point assaulter

No class can successfully fill all these roles except one. Warrior.

Mesmer used to be able to fill the role of home point capper… Then the condi meta hit and pushed mesmers out.

Eles used to be able to be the far point assulters… RTL and cantrip nerf stopped that (and yet warriors are still griping that they need their movement to get around)

Thieves were once the gods of roaming as they should be…. Not anymore… A single hambow warrior will keep the thief from doing anything… Yet the thief requires two or three burst combos to kill a warrior wearing the same amulet…

Guardians used to be great home point and mid bunkers. But a warrior can fulfill the role so much better because guess what… a bunker warrior can OUTHEAL a bunker guardian…. With much less effort.

Should every class be able to fill more than one role with in the tournament environment? Yes.

Should one class fill all roles with little to no effort… Not one bit.

yes, a warrior can do all of these
- home point capper
- Mid point bunker
- Roamer
- Far Point assaulter
in one single build.
(btw i really dunno since i dun team arena, and hardly solo arena)
(my play style in hotjoin is just dun die so many times, have some fun)

but how do they compare against specialized builds?

for example, a warrior may be:

level 3 home point capper
level 3 Mid point bunker
level 3 Roamer
level 3 Far Point assaulter

versus a
guardian
level 5 Mid point bunker

well, i am just throwing some numbers, since i am not experienced in all those specialized solo / team arena roles.

so, for balance, it should be:

warrior:
level 2 home point capper
level 2 Mid point bunker
level 2 Roamer
level 2 Far Point assaulter

versus a
guardian
level 8 Mid point bunker

is it supposed to be something like that?
what do we have now?

are you telling me, in team arena, it is like this?

warrior:
level 5 home point capper
level 5 Mid point bunker
level 5 Roamer
level 5 Far Point assaulter

versus

guardian:
level 5 Mid point bunker

To answer your question, yes. Here you are blaming others for the devs deciding the healing signet regen needs an 8% reduction, and complaining about it left and right.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/8-signet-reduction

Here you are complaining about the devs reduction of 8% to healing signet regen
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/Healing-Signet-is-not-to-powerful/first#post3494883

Here you are calling for PvP changes
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/4v4-Fractured-Arena-remake-gw1-RA

here you created a thread to do nothing but complain about “fear me” and instead of following your own rule of do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules, you are demanding changes to the devs plan.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Fear-Me-80s-Recharge-time-NOT-reasonable/first

Here you are demanding yet more changes.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Mystic-Coffer-as-Tpvp-Soloq-Reward

Here your asking to change fear to be changed from a condition to strictly a control effect because it would be easier for you to break fear with your build
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Why-is-fear-a-condition

here your asking for a buff to healing signet
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Deimos-s-thought-on-OP-healing-signet/page/3#post3406540

The list goes on and on I am sure. I only felt like investing 5 minutes on this. Finding this in 5 minutes says a lot.

None of which are congruent with your philosophy of

“when you play a game, you follow the rules.
you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.
rules are meant to be followed, not twisted to your own whim.”

Either we can add, adjust to, and expand the game when changes are needed or we do not. You cannot have it both ways.

Deimos, you’re derailing this thread. Kindly stop posting or I’ll be forced to bring the devs in to remove you.

Thanks, have a nice day.

I say we up the cooldown of leap by 25%, add a 100% increase in cooldown if the warrior doesn’t hit a target with leap & reduce the leap distance by 20%
All in one patch

Sound familiar?

I Am Dansker.7105:

I say we up the cooldown of leap by 25%, add a 100% increase in cooldown if the warrior doesn’t hit a target with leap & reduce the leap distance by 20%
All in one patch

Sound familiar?

Nope not one bit. Anet would never nerf anything that bad. Wait…

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.

That’s the entire point of this forum. Which means the only real question is: why are YOU here?

Qaelyn.7612:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

you do not ask to change the rules because you do not like the rules.

That’s the entire point of this forum. Which means the only real question is: why are YOU here?

He’s off this thread, no more off-topic posts concerning him.

I do think all dedicated gap-closers should get the RTL treatment, and that there is something fishy about warriors being the most versatile class. I thought that was supposed to be elementalists?

A pocketknife is arguably more versatile than a chainsaw. But cutting off a tree branch takes a long time with one of those tiny serrated blades :/

jportell.2197:

Does everyone that has argued against you need to post links to several of your forum posts that are completely biased and bigoted while only based off playing casual sPvP hot join only 20 solo ques and no team ques?

I remember when the devs used to have SOTG discussions with high end players from both EU and NA. These players provided constructive criticism on proposed changes even if the change buffed their own class.

You do no such thing.
I have played several tPvP games across all classes and right now I can honestly say that a warrior can do the job to fit every role with in tPvP better than those classes which were originally supposed to supposedly fit certain roles.

This game doesn’t have the holy trinity like other games. However it still has roles.
At the most basic level the roles are:
-You have your home point capper
-Mid point bunker
-Roamer
-Far Point assaulter

No class can successfully fill all these roles except one. Warrior.

Mesmer used to be able to fill the role of home point capper… Then the condi meta hit and pushed mesmers out.

Eles used to be able to be the far point assulters… RTL and cantrip nerf stopped that (and yet warriors are still griping that they need their movement to get around)

Thieves were once the gods of roaming as they should be…. Not anymore… A single hambow warrior will keep the thief from doing anything… Yet the thief requires two or three burst combos to kill a warrior wearing the same amulet…

Guardians used to be great home point and mid bunkers. But a warrior can fulfill the role so much better because guess what… a bunker warrior can OUTHEAL a bunker guardian…. With much less effort.

Should every class be able to fill more than one role with in the tournament environment? Yes.

Should one class fill all roles with little to no effort… Not one bit.

How much exactly your “several tPvP games” was? Because this post is pure brilliant.

Rednik.3809:

jportell.2197:

Does everyone that has argued against you need to post links to several of your forum posts that are completely biased and bigoted while only based off playing casual sPvP hot join only 20 solo ques and no team ques?

I remember when the devs used to have SOTG discussions with high end players from both EU and NA. These players provided constructive criticism on proposed changes even if the change buffed their own class.

You do no such thing.
I have played several tPvP games across all classes and right now I can honestly say that a warrior can do the job to fit every role with in tPvP better than those classes which were originally supposed to supposedly fit certain roles.

This game doesn’t have the holy trinity like other games. However it still has roles.
At the most basic level the roles are:
-You have your home point capper
-Mid point bunker
-Roamer
-Far Point assaulter

No class can successfully fill all these roles except one. Warrior.

Mesmer used to be able to fill the role of home point capper… Then the condi meta hit and pushed mesmers out.

Eles used to be able to be the far point assulters… RTL and cantrip nerf stopped that (and yet warriors are still griping that they need their movement to get around)

Thieves were once the gods of roaming as they should be…. Not anymore… A single hambow warrior will keep the thief from doing anything… Yet the thief requires two or three burst combos to kill a warrior wearing the same amulet…

Guardians used to be great home point and mid bunkers. But a warrior can fulfill the role so much better because guess what… a bunker warrior can OUTHEAL a bunker guardian…. With much less effort.

Should every class be able to fill more than one role with in the tournament environment? Yes.

Should one class fill all roles with little to no effort… Not one bit.

How much exactly your “several tPvP games” was? Because this post is pure brilliant.

1600 team que games from january of last year, and about 500 soloque games since the introduction. I play soloque across several classes because I am going for the champ titles in all 8 classes. Currently I have champ illusionist, genius, and paragon titles.
And lets just say the amount of work that I have to put in on my elementalist and thief (as well as the other classes when I still feel like playing them) compared to the amount of work that i have to put in to be successful on my warrior is atrocious.

There is a huge gap in the amount skill (effort/work/keyboard concerto whatever) required to play any other class effectively to fulfill its role against a warrior compared to the amount of skill that a warrior has to put in to succeed against any other class to fulfill the same role.

A good way to measure balance in a game can be looking at the games leaderboards and pick apart the representation of the classes. Ideally there should be no gross over/underrepresentation of any one class. If there is that is a sign of imbalance one way or the other. That doesn’t mean that all classes should be represented equally. However right now I think there are 2 eles in the top 100 of the leader board and a handful of mesmers……. That is a gross underrepresentation.

Also ANET could take a look at the metrics of team tournament teams and see which classes are grossly over represented or underrepresented in the meta across all game modes… I think in that case they will see that warriors are very prominent in every game mode. This is a sign of unfavorable imbalance.

You know what jportell, this is very similar to what I have stated in other post in this thread. Only my experiences were all in WvW. I have leveled every profession to 80 some time abo and 50-60 levels on each profession was in WvW. My experience in WvW is where I have my complaints on things such as a profession such as the warrior using gap closers for general mobility or escaping. In my opinion, this issue is obviously not restricted to a single profession.

So this was supposed to be a [Warrior][WvW] thread, right?

Well, unless they split those skills between PVE and WVW you need to QFT because I don’t need my warrior’s movement speed nerfed in PVE.

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud/minions/

Mesmers:
illusions

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements

Thief:
stealth/mobility

Rangers:
pets

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt

gaurdians:
boons/blocking

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Necros
Death Shroud, minions/HP/damage/wells/AoE conditions/

Mesmers:
illusions/damage/stealth/ports/passive efects/passive attacks/ranged stuns/boons

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements/damage/passive efects/attacks/boons

Thief:
stealth/mobility (combat speed?)/damage/evades/landspeed/

Rangers:
pets/spirits/evades/passive efects/AoE conditions

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt/damage/passive efects/passive combat/boons

gaurdians:
boons/blocking/armour/combat mobility/passive efects

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility? (combat speed?)

silentnight warrior.2714:

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud/minions/

Mesmers:
illusions

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements

Thief:
stealth/mobility

Rangers:
pets

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt

gaurdians:
boons/blocking

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Necros
Death Shroud, minions/HP/damage/wells/AoE conditions/

Mesmers:
illusions/damage/stealth/ports/passive efects/passive attacks/ranged stuns/boons

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements/ damage/passive efects/attacks/boons

Thief:
stealth/mobility (combat speed?)/damage/evades/landspeed/

Rangers:
pets/spirits/evades/passive efects/AoE conditions

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt/damage/passive efects/passive combat/boons

gaurdians:
boons/blocking/armour/combat mobility/passive efects

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility? (combat speed?)

Seriously lol’d. How exactly do attunements help eles? I would say that currently they are more of a hindrance since eles have worse abilities because of attunements and need to use more of them to obtain equal results.

What are the elements supposed to be anyway? Are they different from attunements? Maybe they are a class mechanic that I’m not aware of?

Also, the list is pretty bad because it doesn’t take into account anything but the amount of “stuff” each class has. You seriously can’t argue that all of these effects you listed are equal to each other.

Ganathar.4956:

silentnight warrior.2714:

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud/minions/

Mesmers:
illusions

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements

Thief:
stealth/mobility

Rangers:
pets

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt

gaurdians:
boons/blocking

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Necros
Death Shroud, minions/HP/damage/wells/AoE conditions/

Mesmers:
illusions/damage/stealth/ports/passive efects/passive attacks/ranged stuns/boons

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements/ damage/passive efects/attacks/boons

Thief:
stealth/mobility (combat speed?)/damage/evades/landspeed/

Rangers:
pets/spirits/evades/passive efects/AoE conditions

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt/damage/passive efects/passive combat/boons

gaurdians:
boons/blocking/armour/combat mobility/passive efects

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility? (combat speed?)

Seriously lol’d. How exactly do attunements help eles? I would say that currently they are more of a hindrance since eles have worse abilities because of attunements and need to use more of them to obtain equal results.

What are the elements supposed to be anyway? Are they different from attunements? Maybe they are a class mechanic that I’m not aware of?

Also, the list is pretty bad because it doesn’t take into account anything but the amount of “stuff” each class has. You seriously can’t argue that all of these effects you listed are equal to each other.

lol… You should ask zapv.8051 about that because he is the one that wrote that. I only complete what he wrote because he was “forgeting” lots of things.

I belive he meant as elements as those “elements” you summon = AI.

And switching attunements helps eles. (boons/cleanses)

silentnight warrior.2714:

Ganathar.4956:

silentnight warrior.2714:

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud/minions/

Mesmers:
illusions

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements

Thief:
stealth/mobility

Rangers:
pets

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt

gaurdians:
boons/blocking

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Necros
Death Shroud, minions/HP/damage/wells/AoE conditions/

Mesmers:
illusions/damage/stealth/ports/passive efects/passive attacks/ranged stuns/boons

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements/ damage/passive efects/attacks/boons

Thief:
stealth/mobility (combat speed?)/damage/evades/landspeed/

Rangers:
pets/spirits/evades/passive efects/AoE conditions

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt/damage/passive efects/passive combat/boons

gaurdians:
boons/blocking/armour/combat mobility/passive efects

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility? (combat speed?)

Seriously lol’d. How exactly do attunements help eles? I would say that currently they are more of a hindrance since eles have worse abilities because of attunements and need to use more of them to obtain equal results.

What are the elements supposed to be anyway? Are they different from attunements? Maybe they are a class mechanic that I’m not aware of?

Also, the list is pretty bad because it doesn’t take into account anything but the amount of “stuff” each class has. You seriously can’t argue that all of these effects you listed are equal to each other.

lol… You should ask zapv.8051 about that because he is the one that wrote that. I only complete what he wrote because he was “forgeting” lots of things.

I belive he meant as elements as those “elements” you summon = AI.

And switching attunements helps eles. (boons/cleanses)

Yeah, you only get those if you trait for them and the boons that you said would fall under the “boons” category that you listed, let’s not try to make the lists bigger than they need to be :P

Ganathar.4956:

silentnight warrior.2714:

Ganathar.4956:

silentnight warrior.2714:

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud/minions/

Mesmers:
illusions

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements

Thief:
stealth/mobility

Rangers:
pets

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt

gaurdians:
boons/blocking

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Necros
Death Shroud, minions/HP/damage/wells/AoE conditions/

Mesmers:
illusions/damage/stealth/ports/passive efects/passive attacks/ranged stuns/boons

Elementalist:
The elements/ attunements/ damage/passive efects/attacks/boons

Thief:
stealth/mobility (combat speed?)/damage/evades/landspeed/

Rangers:
pets/spirits/evades/passive efects/AoE conditions

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt/damage/passive efects/passive combat/boons

gaurdians:
boons/blocking/armour/combat mobility/passive efects

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility? (combat speed?)

Seriously lol’d. How exactly do attunements help eles? I would say that currently they are more of a hindrance since eles have worse abilities because of attunements and need to use more of them to obtain equal results.

What are the elements supposed to be anyway? Are they different from attunements? Maybe they are a class mechanic that I’m not aware of?

Also, the list is pretty bad because it doesn’t take into account anything but the amount of “stuff” each class has. You seriously can’t argue that all of these effects you listed are equal to each other.

lol… You should ask zapv.8051 about that because he is the one that wrote that. I only complete what he wrote because he was “forgeting” lots of things.

I belive he meant as elements as those “elements” you summon = AI.

And switching attunements helps eles. (boons/cleanses)

Yeah, you only get those if you trait for them and the boons that you said would fall under the “boons” category that you listed, let’s not try to make the lists bigger than they need to be :P

:)

You are right, but i Forget the heals… lol

coglin.1867:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

they can flee, because their profession mechanics allow them to do so. did you forget that they are melee profession and require movement skills to get close to attack?

And this makes my point. You appear to have difficulty understanding very key components of making an experienced and intelligent argument. You do not even know what your own mains professional mechanic is. It is your adrenaline and F1 key. Fleeing is in no way part of their professional mechanic.

As well, you make a lot of false claims. They are not a melee profession. Warriors are a heavy armor profession with both melee and ranged weapons. You can have purely ranged or purely melee weapons, but it would really help your argument if you developed a little more understanding of the profession you are making blind arguments in favor of.
Do I need to quote the balancing philosophies for you again?

fellyn.5083:

Since we’re talking about things the devs said, lets go back to the original description they gave warriors on their official page shall we..?

“Warriors are masters of weaponry who rely on speed, strength, toughness, and heavy armor to survive in battle. Adrenaline fuels their offensive power—the longer warriors stay in a fight, the more dangerous they become.”

Interesting how they can contradict themselves is it not? Then again, they’ve nerfed all our burst skills so the second part is kind of a lie, which is another contradiction. So the precedent has been set, what they say one day is completely irrelevant to the next. Hence their design philosophies that you are using to justify your need for more nerfs are a joke.

And you keep assuming things and being wrong. You should really work on that.

/Sigh…….shakes head.
that quote might have some weight to it if you had even the slightest concept of who wrote it. I know who wrote that. It was not a dev. Might I make a friendly suggestion? It may be wise to actually know something about points you are attempting to make . At least I am actually quoting devs, offering you a source link, and making sure their names are visible. What your doing is copy/pasting what the promotional and advertising department put on a promotion website. But to claim a dev said something when they did not, works strongly against your point.

Fair point that a dev might not have said it directly. But it’s still officially an endorsed description by arena-net so in the end it doesn’t matter who said it. At one point in time some one sat down and decided “this is how a warrior is supposed to be” and slapped a-nets label on it.

So your point on who said what and when is moot.

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud, minions, health, conditions, aoe damage, passive effects

Mesmers:
illusions, conditions, stealth, passive effects

Elementalist:
The elements, attunements, aoe damage, passive effects

Thief:
stealth, mobility, damage, passive effects

Rangers:
pets, kiting, damage, passive effects

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt, conditions, damage, passive effects

gaurdians:
boons, blocking, damage, armor, passive effects

warriors:
land speed, health, armor, damage, passive effects, mobility, adrenaline

that’s fair

Except for health is shared with necro, armor is shared with guardian, and thief can do quite a bit more damage. And shouldn’t land speed be rolled into mobility? Because that’s what it is?

So where a mesmer gets it’s clones to make up for not having a lot of hp or armor it gets something better as far as defenses go. Where an engineer might lack a bit of mobility they gain quite a bit of defense from conditions like blind.

The point is that for every “bonus” a warrior has other classes have a compensation for it. Some better, some worse. But that’s beside the point.

So yeah, I fixed the list for you! That’s fair. Wouldn’t want you to appear biased in your comparison or anything.

And finally, at the end of the day making class vs class comparisons is flawed because that’s not how a-net balances this game. And this the argument most people seem to be making. “Well warrior has a better <insert ability here> than <class> so warrior needs a nerf”. Nope, sorry. Wrong.

Warrior does a lot of things okay. It by no means does everything the best. Jack of all trades, master of none, etc.

fellyn.5083:

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud, minions, health

Mesmers:
illusions, conditions, stealth

Elementalist:
The elements, attunements, aoe damage

Thief:
stealth, mobility, damage

Rangers:
pets, kiting, damage

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt, conditions, damage

gaurdians:
boons, blocking, damage, armor

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Except for health is shared with necro, armor is shared with guardian, and thief can do quite a bit more damage. And shouldn’t land speed be rolled into mobility? Because that’s what it is?

So where a mesmer gets it’s clones to make up for not having a lot of hp or armor it gets something better as far as defenses go. Where an engineer might lack a bit of mobility they are gain quite a bit of defense from conditions like blind.

The point is that for every “bonus” a warrior has other classes have a compensation for it. Some better, some worse. But that’s beside the point.

So yeah, I fixed the list for you! That’s fair. Wouldn’t want you to appear biased in your comparison or anything.

shouldn’t adrenaline be on your list for warriors? Or do class specific mechanics cancel each other out? So deathshroud,illusions,ele attunement,kits,etc need to be removed.

Samhayn.2385:

fellyn.5083:

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud, minions, health

Mesmers:
illusions, conditions, stealth

Elementalist:
The elements, attunements, aoe damage

Thief:
stealth, mobility, damage

Rangers:
pets, kiting, damage

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt, conditions, damage

gaurdians:
boons, blocking, damage, armor

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Except for health is shared with necro, armor is shared with guardian, and thief can do quite a bit more damage. And shouldn’t land speed be rolled into mobility? Because that’s what it is?

So where a mesmer gets it’s clones to make up for not having a lot of hp or armor it gets something better as far as defenses go. Where an engineer might lack a bit of mobility they are gain quite a bit of defense from conditions like blind.

The point is that for every “bonus” a warrior has other classes have a compensation for it. Some better, some worse. But that’s beside the point.

So yeah, I fixed the list for you! That’s fair. Wouldn’t want you to appear biased in your comparison or anything.

shouldn’t adrenaline be on your list for warriors? Or do class specific mechanics cancel each other out? So deathshroud,illusions,ele attunement,kits,etc need to be removed.

I added it…and I’m questioning what “passive effects” are on that list. I think every class has “passive effects”. Some good, some bad. So that’s not even warrior thing, whatever it’s supposed to mean.

Arius.7031:

Artaz.3819:

Arius.7031:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

this is working as intended.
warriors are meant to be fast.
what is the problem?

do you remember that warriors have no direct access to:
- stealth
- illusions
- death shroud
- pets
- minions
- protection, aegis

warriors are balanced and not overpowered, it has been more than a year since launch, please accept that already.

Most other classes don’t have access to:

-Very strong heals
-Highest armor class
-Highest HP pool
-Immunity to condis/damage via stances (including shield stance)
-Utilities that can heal for 2k+ that also have strong utility aside from that

Etc… You forget that wars have access to defensive things that other classes do not. Before you “oh he’s just whining blah blah blah”, I have a level 80 warrior that I roam in WvW with quite a bit.

To be fair, could you list out everything that all other classes have for defense? We need a full list for comparability if you are going through with this argument. /tangent

No lol, that would take forever. Besides, I’m just answering the all too common response “but wars don’t have access to x!”. It’s a copout, every class has access to a bunch of defensive things, every single one. Warrior is no exception. Not only is it no exception, there is a very good reason why it’s considered one of the best defensive classes in the game… because it has very strong defensive capabilities compared to other classes.

So you are admitting that your original tangent comparison on a ‘mobility’ thread was way off base, got it.

Do the work if you haven’t already done so and you’ll see how flawed that original statement was unless of course this is a trollz will be trollz in which case, good job.

Fungalfoot.7213:

I’ve played a lot of MMOs and never before have I seen one with as much blatant class bias as Guild Wars 2. Why on earth does the most heavily armored class in the game also offer superior mobility? It’s time to get serious about class roles and stop bullkittenting your community with balance patches that do nothing but unbalance the game further.

Don’t have time now to explain now what ‘heavy’ armor does but trust me when I say it is mechanically minimal at best (think of it as bonus toughness and virtually -0- scalability to pretty much any non-glass set up). Now heavy armor looks (cosmetic) is a whole different topic and you can take it up with the GW2 art team.

I disagree, I wouldn’t exactly say that the game is less balanced than the start of it. I would say that the vision has been lost because what seemed like minor changes (i.e. introduction of ascended gear in phases) have far greater multiples of balancing issues than were calculated/tested because the first introduction (trinkets) changed next to nothing, the next phase (weapons) introduced more problems, and now with ascended armor, well, suddenly we need to revamp critical damage stat…

The new stat is one attempt at fixing what is only one flawed piece of the power creep. ANet has completely forgotten that conditions are based around two stats with just as much power creep but easier to abuse because it is only two stats and not based around three.

READ: If you aren’t using a condition build for min-max right now, you will be come March/April.

I agree with Artaz. I really think the current balance issues are a result of:

• Ascended weapons and armour having 5% higher base damage/armour and this having a far greater effect on everything than predicted (the raw stat gain is minimal).
• Too much early sPvP-complaints based balancing which swung the pendulum too far one way. This combined with the Ascended change to make the current balance extremely unstable.

I think the devs are a bit… “Well, what do we do now”. They obviously cannot backpedal on Ascended. I mean look what the Prowess-nerf is causing a whinefest in regards to the rarely used Celestial gear.
But in the end, they’d need to do something to make balance more controllable before they sit down for individual classes.

fellyn.5083:

Samhayn.2385:

fellyn.5083:

zapv.8051:

To use a Deimos Argument:
Necros class theme:
Death Shroud, minions, health

Mesmers:
illusions, conditions, stealth

Elementalist:
The elements, attunements, aoe damage

Thief:
stealth, mobility, damage

Rangers:
pets, kiting, damage

engineers:
tool kits/ tool belt, conditions, damage

gaurdians:
boons, blocking, damage, armor

warriors:
land speed/health/armor/damage/passive effects/mobility

that’s fair

Except for health is shared with necro, armor is shared with guardian, and thief can do quite a bit more damage. And shouldn’t land speed be rolled into mobility? Because that’s what it is?

So where a mesmer gets it’s clones to make up for not having a lot of hp or armor it gets something better as far as defenses go. Where an engineer might lack a bit of mobility they are gain quite a bit of defense from conditions like blind.

The point is that for every “bonus” a warrior has other classes have a compensation for it. Some better, some worse. But that’s beside the point.

So yeah, I fixed the list for you! That’s fair. Wouldn’t want you to appear biased in your comparison or anything.

shouldn’t adrenaline be on your list for warriors? Or do class specific mechanics cancel each other out? So deathshroud,illusions,ele attunement,kits,etc need to be removed.

I added it…and I’m questioning what “passive effects” are on that list. I think every class has “passive effects”. Some good, some bad. So that’s not even warrior thing, whatever it’s supposed to mean.

passive effects would be to me, self casting shake it off, self casting damage immunity, high passive healing from signet, passive healing from adrenal health (or whatever its called). These would be passive since you don’t actively have to use them.

yes other classes have these but they either suck, don’t trigger or are getting nerfed.

so the ULTIMATE PVP BWALOONCE would be slowing everything down to a crawl and lets just run 5 signets we have enough options in our weapons already, too many if u ask me. i think warrios shouldn’t be allowed in WordvWord UGH because these rhymes are obsurd! i was just an orphan chillin on the curb real late, on the organ while i verbilate, the warrior hates misplaced a place of power should be seperate, my kitten, we on together in the battles bad or better like these rhymes they rain like weather UGH

Summary: Warrior has the best land speed and too much mobility.

Arguments “if he flees, you won” are moot for WvWvW. You don’t get any loot bags if the enemy managed to flee. Sending him/her back to the spawn area is the only counter, especially when you want to counter the enemy sniping your dolyaks or flipping your supply camps.

Warrior land speed comes mainly from these sources:
- permanent swiftness (warhorn + quick breathing trait +20% boon duration, signet of rage also gives swiftness)
- sword #2, 600 leap, 8 s cooldown
- greatsword #3, 450 whirl, 10 s cooldown
- greatsword #5, 1200, 20 s cooldown

Forceful greatsword, which is already a very powerful trait, granting might on critical hit with spear and greatsword, also reduces the cooldown by 20%. This means we have a 1200 range mobility skill on 16 second cooldown. And that is a problem.

Elementalist’s ride the lightning has 40 s cooldown if it is misses target. Thus is cannot used that well repeatedly for fleeing (unless you manage to his some rabbit in the forest ). Engineer’s rocket boots has 900 range, 20 s cooldown.

I know rush has pathing issues to hit a target, but as a mobility skill with mere 16 s (trained cooldown), that is way too good to remain as it is and to make matters more imbalanced warrior has 2 mobility skills on greatsword, mobile strikes trait (removes immobilize on movement skill), and fast weapon swapping with fast hands, allowing quick swaps between GS and S.

I have spent couple of hundreds hour more time playing on my warrior than on my thief. My warrior is better equipped than my thief, so I don’t think I am partial here. But I really think the mobility crown should belong to the medium armor professions, not to warrior. Warrior needs mobility to close in to targets, but to be like Usain Bolt.

Rush should have range should be changed to 900 and CD increased to 25 s. Sword #2 and GS #3 should also be looked upon.

Traited warhorn is very powerful in zergs, converting conditions to boons. And warhorn #4, charge, also removes immobilize, cripple and chill and grants switness up to 9 allies. I think that is too much. In solo roaming this is okay, but in zerg setting this is way too much happening for a skill with so low cooldown.

@Deniara – I disagree with you – a S+WH+ GS build brings just mobility with not much else.
Also I see a lot of people asking for rush to be nerfed – yet NONE of them have even mentioned that rush should be FIXED also.
It almost never lands, and it is very easy to avoid it. Running TOWARDS The rushing warrior will make rush fail to hit.

Deniara Devious.3948:

Summary: Warrior has the best land speed and too much mobility.

Arguments “if he flees, you won” are moot for WvWvW. You don’t get any loot bags if the enemy managed to flee. Sending him/her back to the spawn area is the only counter, especially when you want to counter the enemy sniping your dolyaks or flipping your supply camps.

Warrior land speed comes mainly from these sources:
- permanent swiftness (warhorn + quick breathing trait +20% boon duration, signet of rage also gives swiftness)
- sword #2, 600 leap, 8 s cooldown
- greatsword #3, 450 whirl, 10 s cooldown
- greatsword #5, 1200, 20 s cooldown

Forceful greatsword, which is already a very powerful trait, granting might on critical hit with spear and greatsword, also reduces the cooldown by 20%. This means we have a 1200 range mobility skill on 16 second cooldown. And that is a problem.

Elementalist’s ride the lightning has 40 s cooldown if it is misses target. Thus is cannot used that well repeatedly for fleeing (unless you manage to his some rabbit in the forest ). Engineer’s rocket boots has 900 range, 20 s cooldown.

I know rush has pathing issues to hit a target, but as a mobility skill with mere 16 s (trained cooldown), that is way too good to remain as it is and to make matters more imbalanced warrior has 2 mobility skills on greatsword, mobile strikes trait (removes immobilize on movement skill), and fast weapon swapping with fast hands, allowing quick swaps between GS and S.

I have spent couple of hundreds hour more time playing on my warrior than on my thief. My warrior is better equipped than my thief, so I don’t think I am partial here. But I really think the mobility crown should belong to the medium armor professions, not to warrior. Warrior needs mobility to close in to targets, but to be like Usain Bolt.

Rush should have range should be changed to 900 and CD increased to 25 s. Sword #2 and GS #3 should also be looked upon.

Traited warhorn is very powerful in zergs, converting conditions to boons. And warhorn #4, charge, also removes immobilize, cripple and chill and grants switness up to 9 allies. I think that is too much. In solo roaming this is okay, but in zerg setting this is way too much happening for a skill with so low cooldown.

You are talking about roaming or zergs? Because in zergs no one uses GS (except pugs, but pugs are nothing but bags anyway) and traited warhorn is only secondary source of condi cleanse, main cleansing are coming from shout guardians and warriors.
And I will tell this again – if someone manages to die from GS – it’s best for him to go to spvp and learn at least basics.

Rednik.3809:

You are talking about roaming or zergs? Because in zergs no one uses GS (except pugs, but pugs are nothing but bags anyway) and traited warhorn is only secondary source of condi cleanse, main cleansing are coming from shout guardians and warriors.
And I will tell this again – if someone manages to die from GS – it’s best for him to go to spvp and learn at least basics.

I am talking about both roaming and zerging. I know very well that hammer + sword/warhorn is the basic warrior weapon set for zerging.

The WvWvW meta has been stale for way too long time. Warriors, guardians, elementalists and necros are the backbone of any organized guild zerg. Have been and still are. Few mesmers needed for veiling and portals. Medium armor professions got the short end of the stick, besides thieves, who are still abundant in roaming, besides mesmers and warriors. I would argue that warriors and guardians are by far the most common professions in WvWvW and you can see a lot of them in pvp and pve as well. Please don’t tell me that warriors are popular in every game. I think think if you look at the characters created in Guild Wars 2, the professions are probably quite evenly distributed. So popular professions like warrior maybe attribute to 16-18% (max 20) and least popular professions like mesmer and engineer probably attribute to around 10%-12% of total characters. BUT if you look at characters which are actively played at level 80, I am quite sure warriors are >20%.

Game design wise I think the king of mobility should be thief. Medium armor, low health pool, lack of long distance weapons. Currently thief is the fastest profession underwater, but Arenanet has pretty much deleted underwater combat from this game, so it doesn’t matter. Yet, thief already has amazing access to stealth and tons of shadow stepping, so adding more mobility range for thief wouldn’t be good for general game balance. The only logical solution is to nerf warrior mobility.

By the way now when immobilize is stacking, somebody can die to greatsword and it is not about skill (immobilize gets covered by other conditions, so condition cleansing rarely works either). Immobilize shouldn’t stack or last very long time, but we already have threads about it.

thefantasticg.3984:

So this was supposed to be a [Warrior][WvW] thread, right?

Well, unless they split those skills between PVE and WVW you need to QFT because I don’t need my warrior’s movement speed nerfed in PVE.

Well, it happened to elementalists…..I think warrior mobility is too good in all parts of the game….pve included. If rtl had to get reduced range and double cooldown in pve it’s only fair that warrior follows the same philosophy…

“The only logical solution is to nerf warrior mobility.”
I don’t see the logic here exactly.
Not the warrior, but another class would be the fastest, overpowered class. Do you consider it a solution?
Seems like you don’t want any balance, you just want to nerf warriors because you hate them, or one of them.

keoma.5210:

“The only logical solution is to nerf warrior mobility.”
I don’t see the logic here exactly.
Not the warrior, but another class would be the fastest, overpowered class. Do you consider it a solution?
Seems like you don’t want any balance, you just want to nerf warriors because you hate them, or one of them.

The point is – warrior have too much of everything. It is a joke that a HEAVY armor class is able to escape SO easily and so freely without punishment. If Ride The Lightening deserved to be so heavily nerfed, the same should happen to Rush.

keoma.5210:

“The only logical solution is to nerf warrior mobility.”
I don’t see the logic here exactly.
Not the warrior, but another class would be the fastest, overpowered class. Do you consider it a solution?
Seems like you don’t want any balance, you just want to nerf warriors because you hate them, or one of them.

I do not hate warriors. I have spent many hundred hours playing one and lots of money gearing my warrior as well.

Maybe you didn’t notice, but Arenanet has been buffing warriors since Autumn 2012 all the way till summer 2013. Almost every single balance update was like Xmas to warrior. Healing signet’s passive effect was almost doubled. Condition removal and mitigation was significantly ramped up: cleansing ire, dogged march, berserker stance. This was all done because warrior was weak in tpvp. I do not think even the developers considered warrior ever to be a weak in pve or WvWvW. I still remember how warriors were in Autumn 2012 in WvWvW. If you think they were weak in WvWvW, you must have been playing them wrong.

Well warrior finally got to become strong in spvp and tpvp. And now warriors are very common there. But the buffing went too far. Warrior was never weak in mobility, but when warrior still lacked condition removal and sustainability, it wasn’t yet much of a problem. Now warrior has one of the best condition removals and mitigations, non-interruptible sustain, great melee damage, tons of control, area support, tied best profession for zerging with guardian, great for roaming, great in pvp, great in pve.

I honestly like warriors more than thieves (the implementation of stealth is still wrong in this game), but if you read Arenanet’s design manifesto for the professions, warrior should be the sturdy melee class and thief should be the mobile hit & run.

Every profession should have some strong and weak areas. If one profession is the best or second best in almost all the areas, why to ever play the other professions?

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

keoma.5210:

“The only logical solution is to nerf warrior mobility.”
I don’t see the logic here exactly.
Not the warrior, but another class would be the fastest, overpowered class. Do you consider it a solution?
Seems like you don’t want any balance, you just want to nerf warriors because you hate them, or one of them.

The point is – warrior have too much of everything. It is a joke that a HEAVY armor class is able to escape SO easily and so freely without punishment. If Ride The Lightening deserved to be so heavily nerfed, the same should happen to Rush.

Heavy armor doesn’t do as much as you seem to think it does. Especially in a condition heavy meta like we have now.

Still seems like people aren’t going to be happy until warriors are a free kills again in wvw and pvp and all their damage reduced to nothing in pve. And as slow as a turtle as well.

Because that’s fair.

fellyn.5083:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

keoma.5210:

“The only logical solution is to nerf warrior mobility.”
I don’t see the logic here exactly.
Not the warrior, but another class would be the fastest, overpowered class. Do you consider it a solution?
Seems like you don’t want any balance, you just want to nerf warriors because you hate them, or one of them.

The point is – warrior have too much of everything. It is a joke that a HEAVY armor class is able to escape SO easily and so freely without punishment. If Ride The Lightening deserved to be so heavily nerfed, the same should happen to Rush.

Heavy armor doesn’t do as much as you seem to think it does. Especially in a condition heavy meta like we have now.

Still seems like people aren’t going to be happy until warriors are a free kills again in wvw and pvp and all their damage reduced to nothing in pve. And as slow as a turtle as well.

Because that’s fair.

You mean like Eles?

Let’s take a survey. If you think, the warrior is OP, bump this thread:
- thread was closed -

If you think the warrior is balanced, bump this thread.
- thread was closed -

Since balance is not only about number but also a subjective assessment, it would be nice to know what the majority thinks.

Deniara Devious.3948:

Maybe you didn’t notice, but Arenanet has been buffing warriors since Autumn 2012 all the way till summer 2013. Almost every single balance update was like Xmas to warrior. Healing signet’s passive effect was almost doubled. Condition removal and mitigation was significantly ramped up: cleansing ire, dogged march, berserker stance.

fellyn.5083:

Heavy armor doesn’t do as much as you seem to think it does. Especially in a condition heavy meta like we have now.

Still seems like people aren’t going to be happy until warriors are a free kills again in wvw and pvp and all their damage reduced to nothing in pve. And as slow as a turtle as well.

Because that’s fair.

You might want to read the post before yours fellyn. It’s not just the heavy armor, but a combination of overbuffs.

Aberrant.6749:

Deniara Devious.3948:

Maybe you didn’t notice, but Arenanet has been buffing warriors since Autumn 2012 all the way till summer 2013. Almost every single balance update was like Xmas to warrior. Healing signet’s passive effect was almost doubled. Condition removal and mitigation was significantly ramped up: cleansing ire, dogged march, berserker stance.

fellyn.5083:

Heavy armor doesn’t do as much as you seem to think it does. Especially in a condition heavy meta like we have now.

Still seems like people aren’t going to be happy until warriors are a free kills again in wvw and pvp and all their damage reduced to nothing in pve. And as slow as a turtle as well.

Because that’s fair.

You might want to read the post before yours fellyn. It’s not just the heavy armor, but a combination of overbuffs.

Warriors got a lot of buffs because they were literally 1 trick ponies in pve only. In wvw or any form of pvp they were all but considered free kills. The warrior representation was next to nil.

So, yes, I’m aware of the history. Still the whole “warrior has heavy armor so it shouldn’t be fast” argument is very tired. Since when has GW2 ever followed the typical mmo tropes?

fellyn.5083:

Warriors got a lot of buffs because they were literally 1 trick ponies in pve only. In wvw or any form of pvp they were all but considered free kills. The warrior representation was next to nil.

So, yes, I’m aware of the history. Still the whole “warrior has heavy armor so it shouldn’t be fast” argument is very tired. Since when has GW2 ever followed the typical mmo tropes?

Warriors were the backbone of WvWvW zerg meta from Autumn 2012. Telling anything else is either just a blatant lie or shows ignorance of this game mode. Warriors were never weak in pve or WvWvW and buffing them for this game mode has been overdone.

I haven’t used the heavy armor argument at all. I know that protection > armor in most cases. The base health pool size and mobility however matters.

I am not asking to have warrior’s nerfed to the ground since I am playing one, but there are few issues which need addressing:

1. mobility (GS #5 needs its CD increased and range brought down to 900, warhorn CDs and effects should be looked upon with quick breathing trait)
2. longbow #5 needs to be toned down (compare it with any other immobilize weapon skill e..g guardian hammer #3 and engi rifle #2 and you see it is overpowered and at the same time longbow #1 could do roughly 10% more damage)
3. Healing signet needs to have its passive effect reduced and its active effect buffed up (in general signets should more active use for all professions)

Deniara Devious.3948:

fellyn.5083:

Warriors got a lot of buffs because they were literally 1 trick ponies in pve only. In wvw or any form of pvp they were all but considered free kills. The warrior representation was next to nil.

So, yes, I’m aware of the history. Still the whole “warrior has heavy armor so it shouldn’t be fast” argument is very tired. Since when has GW2 ever followed the typical mmo tropes?

Warriors were the backbone of WvWvW zerg meta from Autumn 2012. Telling anything else is either just a blatant lie or shows ignorance of this game mode. Warriors were never weak in pve or WvWvW and buffing them for this game mode has been overdone.

I haven’t used the heavy armor argument at all. I know that protection > armor in most cases. The base health pool size and mobility however matters.

I am not asking to have warrior’s nerfed to the ground since I am playing one, but there are few issues which need addressing:

1. mobility (GS #5 needs its CD increased and range brought down to 900, warhorn CDs and effects should be looked upon with quick breathing trait)
2. longbow #5 needs to be toned down (compare it with any other immobilize weapon skill e..g guardian hammer #3 and engi rifle #2 and you see it is overpowered and at the same time longbow #1 could do roughly 10% more damage)
3. Healing signet needs to have its passive effect reduced and its active effect buffed up (in general signets should more active use for all professions)

“I haven’t used the heavy armor argument at all”

That’s probably why I wasn’t quoting you to begin with don’t you think?

As for the rest..

1) Okay. Fine. But make it so it doesn’t outright miss your target 98% of the time for no particular reason.
2) I disagree that #5 needs more nerfs.
3) If they make the passive even worse than the proposed 8% nerf to encourage the use of it’s active unless the active is amazing no one is going to use it. People will just switch to healing surge.

keoma.5210:

“The only logical solution is to nerf warrior mobility.”
I don’t see the logic here exactly.
Not the warrior, but another class would be the fastest, overpowered class. Do you consider it a solution?
Seems like you don’t want any balance, you just want to nerf warriors because you hate them, or one of them.

As weird as it sounds, the best way to handle this on a design level is to nerf everyone.
You want players to differentiate in elements which feel important, without them actually being important. Give the illusion of choice and uniqueness, without giving it. WoW did this right at first in TBC, and later screwed it up from Cataclysm forward, because they overdid it and now you never have the illusion that you’re different from everybody else.

It helps to nerf everyone for this, a lot. The lower the global power level, the less the same percent imbalance causes in absolute balance worries. The more room you have to put in small differentiations.

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

Let’s take a survey. If you think, the warrior is OP, bump this thread:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Is-the-warrior-OP-Yes/

If you think the warrior is balanced, bump this thread.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Is-the-warrior-OP-No/

Since balance is not only about number but also a subjective assessment, it would be nice to know what the majority thinks.

Why don’t you just post a link to an actual poll instead of asking everyone to “bump” a thread, as that is against the forum rules.

fellyn.5083:

The warrior representation was next to nil.

Wow, you have a knack for posting misinformation. Warriors have been all over WvW since day one. As well, Anet posted a chart showing the most played professions in general and warrior easily topped the list.

fellyn.5083:

Deniara Devious.3948:

fellyn.5083:

Warriors got a lot of buffs because they were literally 1 trick ponies in pve only. In wvw or any form of pvp they were all but considered free kills. The warrior representation was next to nil.

So, yes, I’m aware of the history. Still the whole “warrior has heavy armor so it shouldn’t be fast” argument is very tired. Since when has GW2 ever followed the typical mmo tropes?

Warriors were the backbone of WvWvW zerg meta from Autumn 2012. Telling anything else is either just a blatant lie or shows ignorance of this game mode. Warriors were never weak in pve or WvWvW and buffing them for this game mode has been overdone.

I haven’t used the heavy armor argument at all. I know that protection > armor in most cases. The base health pool size and mobility however matters.

I am not asking to have warrior’s nerfed to the ground since I am playing one, but there are few issues which need addressing:

1. mobility (GS #5 needs its CD increased and range brought down to 900, warhorn CDs and effects should be looked upon with quick breathing trait)
2. longbow #5 needs to be toned down (compare it with any other immobilize weapon skill e..g guardian hammer #3 and engi rifle #2 and you see it is overpowered and at the same time longbow #1 could do roughly 10% more damage)
3. Healing signet needs to have its passive effect reduced and its active effect buffed up (in general signets should more active use for all professions)

“I haven’t used the heavy armor argument at all”

That’s probably why I wasn’t quoting you to begin with don’t you think?

As for the rest..

1) Okay. Fine. But make it so it doesn’t outright miss your target 98% of the time for no particular reason.

So Warriors have the right to complain while Eles with offhand dagger (RTL) don’t?