Guild Wars 2

Omg you too salty ..we ll see in 2 days

A ele in mid with high mobility, high AoE ability, high support/healing ability and high condition damage ability can be a very big problem for your enemies.

Ok, when they overcharge is hard to don’t see them, but if you see, the Empowering of the guardian have 2.5 sec of casting and they can do it.
The water overcharge will be very useful in spvp, expecially with the current meta, and you take 2.75 sec to execute it. If you have a guardian in team or chose a good moment to active the overcharge, it will do a good work. AoE condi clean, heal and a big waterfield to blast. In 4 seconds you will clean all the conditions and heal your allies by 50% by overcharge, shout heal and blasts. Not a bad thing, right?

And the warhorn will provide Moving Fields that provide AoE damage and boons! Come on guys, that is a bery big thing! Expecially in a situation where a single supporter can make the difference.

We don’t know what meta will come up when HoT will be released and we don’t know 5 of the class specializzations.

Actually I think that it will be very good to add something lesser selfigh and more AoE to the common D/D build to be more good in team fights

Avead.5760:

Omg you too salty ..we ll see in 2 days

Not all bro! I’m just so excited for all this new stuff exactly like all our other stuff!

You don’t even know if any traits are going to affect this yet… And… Armor of earth.

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pve, in pvp the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

I feel the need to point out a direct contradiction in your argument. You say that the entire elite spec will be shut down by the mantra of distraction, but do you know what mantras are?

They’re skills that require a 2.75 second channel time by which to activate, before you can use the skill for its strong effects. If your argument is to be completely valid, then mantras must also be unviable too. Oh wait, they’re actually the crux of the most commonly seen mesmer build in high level tournaments right now.

Most mesmers precast them before going into battle. Unless theres a no out of combat rule to the overcharge mechanic, you could likely begin the channel as you go into a fight. Even if you use them in the fight, mantra mesmers are able to consistently channel their mantras without getting focus fired and chain CCed to death, even though they have no stability at all on a mantra build. Its because of two things, positioning, and protected mantras being baseline that allow them to charge in combat, in high level tournaments with no problem. When you channel a mantra you get +600 toughness during the channel. When tempest channels their overcharge, apparently traits can get enhanced damage mitigation from traited protection (again all the details are unclear). If a mantra mesmer, in marauder or zerker amulet can get a mantra channel off in combat with no problem, then I don’t see any reason why a celestial elementalist would fail to get off if they have good positioning, as they can take so many more hits.

Anyway yeah, so if mesmers have no problem charging mantras in combat, I don’t see how elementalists would have a major problem, especially when the earth one has defiance. Sure it will get interrupted sometimes, but clearly not every time they go for it if they know what they’re doing. Its high risk, high reward, something that elementalists have never had to worry about before given how low risk, high reward their cele builds in pvp have always been.

Why’s everyone getting shouts? You’re stealing my thunder here, ANet!

Sincerely,

Main Warrior alt Guardian.

Kodiak.3281:

Avead.5760:

Omg you too salty ..we ll see in 2 days

Not all bro! I’m just so excited for all this new stuff exactly like all our other stuff!

Nah its ok i understand.When you have everything its pretty hard to get excited no matter what you get. Then again i hear that some thief/mesmer alike stealth and evasion on top of sustain from 2 other lines can make even kings shed some tears of joy

I already see a nice synergy in order to bypass (partially) the long attunement cooldowns after using overload.

Anyone has other ideas on how to use the tempest features, like using shouts and trooper rune to get rid of water spec in pvp ?

The big idea is to be creative and to deviate from the known build archetypes.

^^ hes right you know, Ele has everything, so there wasn’t really anything purely and totally new that an elite spec could offer, and its cool that its offering a way to be viable without being a skill rotation bot machine.

Personally i’ll probably be trying out an Earth, Water, Tempest spec, maybe do Earth, Fire, Tempest, maybe air over fire… I really like the earth line, and the tempest seems awesome so those two i’ll be trying to get to work together pretty badly…

TheFamster.7806:

PlatinumMember.5274:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Drayos.8759:

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pvp, the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

how do u even know that is the case without any insight of the specc? Lol. Ur Just making stuff up now and throwing at the fact he does not have a Sword, lmfao you have no idea what will and will not counter it til the preview goes live.

Reaper will be SLow as hell and shut down by merely being ranged and capable of kiting, people will still be using it in pvp and it prolly still work in a way, Just because ONE proffession counters it, doesnt make it useless Everything NEEDS to have a counter.

It’s in the description that every overcharge of attunement will take anywhere between 2.75 to 5 seconds. So anyone with atleast a bit of a brain and CC can have a go at the Tempest going Overcharge.

Apparently a trait with an 8.66 mininum CD, which provides 2 second worth of stability, will protect you while you channel 2.75 to 5 seconds skills.

Afterall, positioning and brains will save you. Sometimes I wonder if people assume everybody is stupid.

I’m pretty sure you don’t play pvp or if you do not at decent level. Basically in a pvp match with people who actually are competent any major channeling skill will be interrupted in no time. Not everyone plays at the lowest skill ceiling.

Carefully reread what I wrote. I even tried to make it as obvious as possible without giving away the punchline.

This new mechanic sounds like some antimechanic. Ele’s core mechanic is usually about swapping attunements as fast as possible, because of long skill cooldowns and benefits from that swapping.
But this ’’overloading’’ looks like it’s working against that. Forcing you to stay in 1 att longer and not swapping so quickly. That 20 sec cd sounds really scary.
Also if you will be overloading in pvp, you will just be a snack for mesmers if you don’t get on some stability (yeah, again cantrips). Because Tempest should be close to mid range, we should expect heavy interrupts from other classes as well.
Shouts sounds pretty interesting, exept the elite one, I hope it will offer more than what they wrote. We don’t need another terrible elite skill.
Because we are getting OH and that visibly avoiding of scepter comments by Karl, I have high hopes that they will finally do something and bring the scepter from that position in which it currently is.

nearlight.3064:

^^ hes right you know, Ele has everything, so there wasn’t really anything purely and totally new that an elite spec could offer, and its cool that its offering a way to be viable without being a skill rotation bot machine.

Except so far everything shown still shows that being a skill rotation bot machine is superior.

Kodiak.3281:

Avead.5760:

Omg you too salty ..we ll see in 2 days

Not all bro! I’m just so excited for all this new stuff exactly like all our other stuff!

I am also excited about these changes. Anybody that isn’t excited is kitten fool. Arena net knows exactly what elementalist needed. The power of more team work is always great in my book.

nearlight.3064:

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pve, in pvp the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

Most mesmers precast them before going into battle. Unless theres a no out of combat rule to the overcharge mechanic, you could likely begin the channel as you go into a fight. Even if you use them in the fight, mantra mesmers are able to consistently channel their mantras without getting focus fired and chain CCed to death, even though they have no stability at all on a mantra build. Its because of two things, positioning, and protected mantras being baseline that allow them to charge in combat, in high level tournaments with no problem. When you channel a mantra you get +600 toughness during the channel. When tempest channels their overcharge, apparently traits can get enhanced damage mitigation from traited protection (again all the details are unclear). If a mantra mesmer, in marauder or zerker amulet can get a mantra channel off in combat with no problem, then I don’t see any reason why a celestial elementalist would fail to get off if they have good positioning, as they can take so many more hits.

Anyway yeah, so if mesmers have no problem charging mantras in combat, I don’t see how elementalists would have a major problem, especially when the earth one has defiance. Sure it will get interrupted sometimes, but clearly not every time they go for it if they know what they’re doing. Its high risk, high reward, something that elementalists have never had to worry about before given how low risk, high reward their cele builds in pvp have always been.

Sorry but what? Mesmer lost its high risk Back in the patch, i’d love to se ethe risk in 30second invis’s with free boon Regenerations?… I’d love to see the high risk in the current condi builds which pretty much play themselves even with enough survivability… i’d love to see the risk in Just blowing everyones HP Out the waters in 3 hits no matter what armour types they are.

U even destroy ur own hard counter without any problems, let alone dealing with anything else, Risk factor was Killed in mesmer, even half the people who use ur Proffession admit that much, thats the whole reason Mesmers are QQIng hardcore currently due to the reductino in the Skill Floor for the proffession with all these new Shiny Safety nets installed into everything you do.

Elementalists have 0 burst, meaning THey have to actually Fight for more then 3 Seconds to actually win a fight, and Bunkering with a Non-bunker build which the build is almost is harder then 3 hitting everybody lol.

lordhelmos.7623:

The flashy animations are going to be a giant kill me sign for stunlock slayers like war thief and mes.

When I see a solar nimbus on my screen that looks Captain Planet taking a radiation bath in the center of an exploding nuclear reactor, I know who is going to eat my bulls rush > 100 blades

and when you notice they’re reducing your damage by 55% Reducing ur Condi damage by 100% Gaining Stability and If in Earth Will be immune to any crits u manage to pull out, you’ll notice very quickly they wont die lol, we’re already tanky, with those Sorts of Damage reductions u aint got a hope in hell doing anything but causing urself to get focus’d by the entire elementalists team.

Anyone with a brain will use Elementalists as Bait with this new stuff coming out, and ur quickly going to be desolved by Insta-gibbing Thiefs and Mesmers.

‘Feel the Burn’ – The tempest sears their voice into the ground and causes growing flames to emit from that location.
‘Aftershock!’ – Creates a powerful earthen force around the tempest, crippling those effected. After a short delay, an aftershock immobilizes enemies
‘Eye of the storm’ – The tempest will call the storm down on nearby allies and himself, breaking stun on anyone affected while granting superspeed.
‘Freeze’ – Causes the air around enemies to cool and harden, damaging and chilling them for a period of time.

So with all the new capabilities they are able to pull off with the engine that they have been bragging about they are only able to conjure up utilities as lazily designed as this? They just seem like cliche, ’damage in area and add generic effect ’ abilities that we see all the time in our weapon skills. I feel like they really put their feet up doing these ones.

And I thought Warhorn was a let down…

nearlight.3064:

^^ hes right you know, Ele has everything, so there wasn’t really anything purely and totally new that an elite spec could offer, and its cool that its offering a way to be viable without being a skill rotation bot machine.

He’s not right. Ele lacks a strong burst build that isn’t completely outclassed by thief and mesmer. (I can count on one hand the number of times fresh air has been run in a tournament, and in every instance the fresh air ele was a complete liability to the team).

Then again, it’s too early to say whether tempest will be good or not. Maybe the tempest traits will allow for a new burst build. Too early to tell.

I think you’re already on the right track. You could potentially go scepter/warhorn with marauder and combine it with fresh air for massive damage and constant overloading of the attunement. Could also combine with the soldier runes like you said to cleanse condis outside of water and then take water attunement for more sustain, earth for more defense, or fire for more pure damage and high blind spam capabilities.

Here’s a layout of what I was thinking: (Note the empty stuff will be filled in with tempest things)
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFAQFAbAFOIIAYRAoAUElL5FoGC-T5AFABiXGoo9HA4BAAA

PlatinumMember.5274:

I am also excited about these changes. Anybody that isn’t excited is kitten fool. Arena net knows exactly what elementalist needed. The power of more team work is always great in my book.

Yeap Anet has their ears to the ground man. They got the vibe of what’s really core of Elementalist game play. I mean it’s a long time known fact ANet has it’s finger on the pulse of the Elementalist community. It’s not surprising at all they delivered some really solid and exciting changes. I mean when I think Elementalist right now, I think selfish player. Limited to no team support. Limited field generation for others to combo with. No utilities that can be shared with other people. Don’t even get me started on the small amount of boon sharing. Before Tempest we didn’t even have shouts to share boons!

I can’t wait till Friday to see all the exciting new stuff with Tempest that really finally gives us the ability to support our team.

Durzlla.6295:

Personally i’ll probably be trying out an Earth, Water, Tempest spec, maybe do Earth, Fire, Tempest, maybe air over fire… I really like the earth line, and the tempest seems awesome so those two i’ll be trying to get to work together pretty badly…

This is what I would like to do as well, always loved the earth spec and the idea of an earth mage.

Unfortunately the Tempest looks like it is going to suffer from the same problems as all content concerning the earth element has since launch, 99% focus on tanking even though it is supposed to be a tanking and CONDITION tree.

I cannot freaking believe that something that requires you to SIT IN EARTH ATTUNEMENT FOR AN EXTENSIVE PERIOD is STILL not going to apply a single bleed!

… What I used to hate about caster in other MMOs was the fact that I had to wait X amount of time to cast or activate a skill…. In GW2 I loved the fact that Elementalists where quite mobile and a minimal amount of skill had cast times.

If for what I see I will have to stay put, being vulnerable to many interrupts, (no matter how big the payoff) I don’t think I will use the Tempest at all. Witch means that I will keep using my regular elementalist or change my main to another class.

But I will wait to see the Tempest in action when HoT comes out, and only then I will make my decision.

Copestetic.5174:

Why’s everyone getting shouts? You’re stealing my thunder here, ANet!

Sincerely,

Main Warrior alt Guardian.

Time to level a necro and an ele then :P , I would also suggest ranger, but no one deserves to deal with shouts with cast time …

ResJudicator.7916:

nearlight.3064:

^^ hes right you know, Ele has everything, so there wasn’t really anything purely and totally new that an elite spec could offer, and its cool that its offering a way to be viable without being a skill rotation bot machine.

He’s not right. Ele lacks a strong burst build that isn’t completely outclassed by thief and mesmer. (I can count on one hand the number of times fresh air has been run in a tournament, and in every instance the fresh air ele was a complete liability to the team).

Then again, it’s too early to say whether tempest will be good or not. Maybe the tempest traits will allow for a new burst build. Too early to tell.

Zoose carried his team in that game. Anyway the point is that a burst spec exists and is possible. Even if its not ideal, its still possible. Meanwhile for other classes they couldn’t even try because they tools (like no necro cleave) weren’t there for them. The tools for every type of build were always there for elementalist, even if its far outclassed, you can’t argue that its not there.

Kodiak.3281:

PlatinumMember.5274:

I am also excited about these changes. Anybody that isn’t excited is kitten fool. Arena net knows exactly what elementalist needed. The power of more team work is always great in my book.

Yeap Anet has their ears to the ground man. They got the vibe of what’s really core of Elementalist game play. I mean it’s a long time known fact ANet has it’s finger on the pulse of the Elementalist community. It’s not surprising at all they delivered some really solid and exciting changes. I mean when I think Elementalist right now, I think selfish player. Limited to no team support. Limited field generation for others to combo with. No utilities that can be shared with other people. Don’t even get me started on the small amount of boon sharing. Before Tempest we didn’t even have shouts to share boons!

I can’t wait till Friday to see all the exciting new stuff with Tempest that really finally gives us the ability to support our team.

All I can say is: #believeinkarl. I think he has earned it.

Azel.4786:

And pardon me for not being excited about having to sit in an attunment for X amount of time, then having to channel that attunement for 2,5s-5s hoping no one will interrupt me with the insane amount of interrupts in game, and then, if it works or if it doesn’t, being locked out from that attunement for 15s-20s.

Sure will love when I need to heal and am locked out of water or when I need to do damage and will be locked out of fire / air, sounds super!

I think you just described a play style that’s different from the current norm. Isn’t that what ANET “promised” ?

I am looking forward to testing this out, despite the obvious drawbacks. Slightly off topic below, but relevant considering I feel Eles have been left out by the devs for a long time.

Just tested the Monk class in Skyforge and it’s like they made Elementalist with melee staff, really nice and at least x2 the fun (Ele is my favorite class in GW2). There one attunement (stance) is for AOE, one is for more CC like stuff and mobility, one is for single target… Ele attunements are way more of a color change in comparison to the way different weapons handle (fire – air vs staff – d/d).

Kodiak.3281:

PlatinumMember.5274:

I am also excited about these changes. Anybody that isn’t excited is kitten fool. Arena net knows exactly what elementalist needed. The power of more team work is always great in my book.

Yeap Anet has their ears to the ground man. They got the vibe of what’s really core of Elementalist game play. I mean it’s a long time known fact ANet has it’s finger on the pulse of the Elementalist community. It’s not surprising at all they delivered some really solid and exciting changes. I mean when I think Elementalist right now, I think selfish player. Limited to no team support. Limited field generation for others to combo with. No utilities that can be shared with other people. Don’t even get me started on the small amount of boon sharing. Before Tempest we didn’t even have shouts to share boons!

I can’t wait till Friday to see all the exciting new stuff with Tempest that really finally gives us the ability to support our team.

I’m not sure if you’re serious? As a ranger player with an elementalist alt, the difference in utility, support and mobility is day and night. Elementalist, compared to other professions, is top tier in most departments. Perfect? No. The current build sets for Staff and DD however are so strong and flexible, that “complaints” really do fall short compared to other professions in much more need (notably Necromancer/Ranger/Revenant).

PlatinumMember.5274:

Kodiak.3281:

PlatinumMember.5274:

I am also excited about these changes. Anybody that isn’t excited is kitten fool. Arena net knows exactly what elementalist needed. The power of more team work is always great in my book.

Yeap Anet has their ears to the ground man. They got the vibe of what’s really core of Elementalist game play. I mean it’s a long time known fact ANet has it’s finger on the pulse of the Elementalist community. It’s not surprising at all they delivered some really solid and exciting changes. I mean when I think Elementalist right now, I think selfish player. Limited to no team support. Limited field generation for others to combo with. No utilities that can be shared with other people. Don’t even get me started on the small amount of boon sharing. Before Tempest we didn’t even have shouts to share boons!

I can’t wait till Friday to see all the exciting new stuff with Tempest that really finally gives us the ability to support our team.

All I can say is: #believeinkarl. I think he has earned it.

True… He has… I will not cry anymore, until I test the Tempest with my own keyboard and mouse in HoT.

PlatinumMember.5274:

All I can say is: #believeinkarl. I think he has earned it.

I’m with you man! Karl’s reputation with the Elementalist community is 100% earned!

nearlight.3064:

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pve, in pvp the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

I feel the need to point out a direct contradiction in your argument. You say that the entire elite spec will be shut down by the mantra of distraction, but do you know what mantras are?

They’re skills that require a 2.75 second channel time by which to activate, before you can use the skill for its strong effects. If your argument is to be completely valid, then mantras must also be unviable too. Oh wait, they’re actually the crux of the most commonly seen mesmer build in high level tournaments right now.

Most mesmers precast them before going into battle. Unless theres a no out of combat rule to the overcharge mechanic, you could likely begin the channel as you go into a fight. Even if you use them in the fight, mantra mesmers are able to consistently channel their mantras without getting focus fired and chain CCed to death, even though they have no stability at all on a mantra build. Its because of two things, positioning, and protected mantras being baseline that allow them to charge in combat, in high level tournaments with no problem. When you channel a mantra you get +600 toughness during the channel. When tempest channels their overcharge, apparently traits can get enhanced damage mitigation from traited protection (again all the details are unclear). If a mantra mesmer, in marauder or zerker amulet can get a mantra channel off in combat with no problem, then I don’t see any reason why a celestial elementalist would fail to get off if they have good positioning, as they can take so many more hits.

Anyway yeah, so if mesmers have no problem charging mantras in combat, I don’t see how elementalists would have a major problem, especially when the earth one has defiance. Sure it will get interrupted sometimes, but clearly not every time they go for it if they know what they’re doing. Its high risk, high reward, something that elementalists have never had to worry about before given how low risk, high reward their cele builds in pvp have always been.

On my Mesmer I can recharge my mantra in stealth. Good luck doing that on an ele. Thing is you left stealth out of your argument, which is a huge factor. Second, mesmers can distortion or blink to high ground or 1200m to fight reset and re mantra.

Look ele has no problem disengaging with rtl and flash. But if a Mesmer and tempest disengage who gains the advantage? As a Mesmer I can re-enter the fight in sealth then mantra stun > gs burst you from 100 to 0.

How effective is the tempest going to be vs a lethal enemy that can kill you from max range. Will your overcharges hit him from that range? How about thief and its ability to withdraw/shadow step out of your overcharge or stun steal to you to interrupt it?

What if you push aggression with your overcharge? The most basic Mesmer can:

1 Moa
2 diversion, which is an interrupt with huge field aoe
3 One of his 2 charged MoDs
4 gs illusionary wave
5 blink out of range
6 blurred frenzy through the final burst
7 decoy and the prestige stealth escape

My question is when is it ever going to be strategically advantageous for you to put one of you attunements at risk for an overcharge that is going to be laughably easy to counter or punishing to you for using. Half of those counters will stop your channel dead.

I stand by synopsis that if you use this you will be food. You might as well dive into a sea of sharks covered in chum. Your survival rate will be about the same

And to top it off, Mesmer Mantras go on cooldown the second you channel them where as the Overload when you channel it will go on full cooldown, completed or not and will lock you you out of attunement.

I’d rather that. Plus stealth.

I’m pretty confident there will be a trait somewhere to deal with interrupts or else the viability of Singularity will definetly suffer in pvp. You can’t have ‘good timing or positioning’ against insta-cast interrupt skills, specially on professions with teleports and stealth.

Kodiak.3281:

PlatinumMember.5274:

All I can say is: #believeinkarl. I think he has earned it.

I’m with you man! Karl’s reputation with the Elementalist community is 100% earned!

Ya know I mentioned this on Reddit and was downvoted to oblivion. IDK why they just didn’t #believeinkarl with me.

PlatinumMember.5274:

oZii.2864:

http://www.tentonhammer.com/news/guild-wars-2/guild-wars-2-tempest-revealed

An exception to this is Earth attunement, in which you’re given a break-bar that will eat a few control-skills before you’re interrupted.

Eye of the Storm! – The tempest will call the storm down on nearby allies and himself, breaking stun on anyone affected while granting superspeed.

At least draw a reference on how the devs work instead of oh mantra of distraction

We also don’t know all the traits they could easily make a trait that grants 1 stack of stability for 3-5 seconds when you use a shout and make it a grandmaster.

We already have a trait that gives us stab every 8 sec if we want to attune to earth that often. Necro can get stab every 8-10 seconds.

It is entirely possible the tempest trait line will have something similar. You know how a mesmer gets no stab but can trait a gm trait and get it every 15 sec.

This is really a weak assumption

Jekkt.6045:

shoutwar ran banner for so long… key is positioning, use your brain and avoid getting interrupted. or use rock solid.

That stability requires you to take earth. So you are going to switch to earth get a 2 second stability so you can use a 2.75 to 5 second channeling, bloody brilliant. I cannot believe I failed to see the brilliance of that combination. I guess the class mechanic has been fixed, go home.

I feel like both of you two are not thinking at all.

yeah you really fail to see the brilliance.

lordhelmos.7623:

Just as an FYI for people spewing Rock solid, I’m sure the description of the tempest said you needed to stay in an attunement for a period before being able to overcharge. If this is the case rock solid would be about as useful as a water pistol in an swat team raid

ele was always able to precast a skill and then switch attunement. i don’t think this will be different for tempest.

Wow. I expected almost nothing and I’m still disappointed. Those shouts don’t even TRY to compete with cantrips, so they will see absolutely no use in pvp and wvw. There’s no way the heal shout will be better than healing signet, and the elite seems extremely underwhelming. So all new skills already suck

Then the overloading. While a neat mechanic and fluffy, 2.5-5(!) seconds channel time means you will NEVER get it off in pvp. Never. And there’s a trait that gives protection while overloading? LOL? We’ need like 10 stacks of stability to finish that channel. Mantra of Distraction says hi.

Also, if you get interrupted while overloading EVERYTHING gets put on cooldown? LOL again? On top of the channeled attunment going on a 20 second cooldown? Are they serious?

The very few previewed warhorn skills sound kinda nice, but I don’t think it’s gonna replace focus for defense or dagger for all around (especially movement) awesomeness.

AND you need to have the elite spec traited to even use the warhorn meaning there’s probably not gonna be a single tempest spec in pvp…

Wow. I expected almost nothing and I’m still disappointed. Those shouts don’t even TRY to compete with cantrips, so they will see absolutely no use in pvp and wvw. There’s no way the heal shout will be better than healing signet, and the elite seems extremely underwhelming. So all new skills already suck
Then the overloading. While a neat mechanic and fluffy, 2.5-5(!) seconds channel time means you will NEVER get it off in pvp. Never. And there’s a trait that gives protection while overloading? LOL? We’ need like 10 stacks of stability to finish that channel. Mantra of Distraction says hi.
Also, if you get interrupted while overloading EVERYTHING gets put on cooldown? LOL again? On top of the channeled attunment going on a 20 second cooldown? Are they serious?
The very few previewed warhorn skills sound kinda nice, but I don’t think it’s gonna replace focus for defense or dagger for all around (especially movement) awesomeness.
AND you need to have the elite spec traited to even use the warhorn meaning there’s probably not gonna be a single tempest spec in pvp…

Iason Evan.3806:

Disappointed that they went with an off-hand when Ele’s offhand options were arguably the best overall already. Point blank: Ele could have used another two-handed option.

I am not saying that the warhorn isn’t great. It could be amazing. That’s not my point. My point is that they are bolstering that which needed no bolstering. If they really wanted a frontliner like they say, give us an option for mainhand outside of Lightning Whip.

They kind of had to do an offhand if they want to balance skills introduced.

Most classes get 3 or 5 new weapon skills, with warhorn eles get 8. With GS or Rifle (although rifle would be RAD) they’d get 20 new weapon skills.

What if they added 5 stacks of stability to the overcharge but only apply after 3 sec of charge? so someone that reacts quickly can interrupt but if left unattended for 3 sec stability kicks in for the remainder of the charge allowing the overcharge to complete. Is the only way i could see overcharge going off without interrupt.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

Wow. I expected almost nothing and I’m still disappointed. Those shouts don’t even TRY to compete with cantrips, so they will see absolutely no use in pvp and wvw. There’s no way the heal shout will be better than healing signet, and the elite seems extremely underwhelming. So all new skills already suck
Then the overloading. While a neat mechanic and fluffy, 2.5-5(!) seconds channel time means you will NEVER get it off in pvp. Never. And there’s a trait that gives protection while overloading? LOL? We’ need like 10 stacks of stability to finish that channel. Mantra of Distraction says hi.
Also, if you get interrupted while overloading EVERYTHING gets put on cooldown? LOL again? On top of the channeled attunment going on a 20 second cooldown? Are they serious?
The very few previewed warhorn skills sound kinda nice, but I don’t think it’s gonna replace focus for defense or dagger for all around (especially movement) awesomeness.
AND you need to have the elite spec traited to even use the warhorn meaning there’s probably not gonna be a single tempest spec in pvp…

believe what you want but tempest will be op in pvp, it’s basically a d/d ele + a shoutbow.

depending on shout traits you will already take them for soldier runes to drop water or arcane. the support on this build will be insane and if the cc is as good as karl said then tempest will cause havoc in teamfights.

afaik the overcharge that pulses protection is the earth one, the same one that gives you a break bar so interrupts won’t be a problem. interrupts in general have always put the skill on cooldown.. so that’s nothing now and the elite shout is insanely strong when you combine it with other elites.

120s rampage combined with this is 90s cooldown. if you use your overcharge it will only be on a 15s cooldown or less depending on the arcana minor.

i won’t say that i’m happy with what we got because it just builds on what we already have instead of giving the class what it actually needed but i cannot deny that all of it has the potential to be very strong.

The overcharge mechanic is interesting, so are the shouts.

But why would you overcharge fire if it doesn’t do as much damage as a meteor shower? I hope it does tons of damage.

If Warhorn is close-range it wont get use in WvW zerg fights much, ele is too squishy in the current meta. The skills should be aoe cast in my opinion.

The utilities are almost all offensive based, meaning they will only really work in PvE beside Eye of the Storm which is a stun break and could replace Mist form or Armor of Earth.

Armor of earth still remains our only stability.

We don’t get any of the new boons or condis.

Kinda disappointed by the new elite, GW1 had one that instantly recharged your last skill. Getting your meteor recharge down to 15 seconds doesn’t mean anything if when you swap back after overcharge you have to wait 20 seconds to get back in fire. How is it going to work with Elemental Surge condi application? Well at least it does something, contrary to all our current useless elites and there is no doubt none of the current elites will ever get used again.

Traits and special graphic effects looks amazing. As usual the GW2 art team are at their best.

The way I see it work in PvP is that if you 1v1 someone you can finish the fight with an overcharge. I don’t think it’s something you will want to use at the beginning of a fight.

lordhelmos.7623:

nearlight.3064:

lordhelmos.7623:

While it will be god mode in pve, in pvp the entire elite spec is shut down by mantra of distraction.

I feel the need to point out a direct contradiction in your argument. You say that the entire elite spec will be shut down by the mantra of distraction, but do you know what mantras are?

They’re skills that require a 2.75 second channel time by which to activate, before you can use the skill for its strong effects. If your argument is to be completely valid, then mantras must also be unviable too. Oh wait, they’re actually the crux of the most commonly seen mesmer build in high level tournaments right now.

Most mesmers precast them before going into battle. Unless theres a no out of combat rule to the overcharge mechanic, you could likely begin the channel as you go into a fight. Even if you use them in the fight, mantra mesmers are able to consistently channel their mantras without getting focus fired and chain CCed to death, even though they have no stability at all on a mantra build. Its because of two things, positioning, and protected mantras being baseline that allow them to charge in combat, in high level tournaments with no problem. When you channel a mantra you get +600 toughness during the channel. When tempest channels their overcharge, apparently traits can get enhanced damage mitigation from traited protection (again all the details are unclear). If a mantra mesmer, in marauder or zerker amulet can get a mantra channel off in combat with no problem, then I don’t see any reason why a celestial elementalist would fail to get off if they have good positioning, as they can take so many more hits.

Anyway yeah, so if mesmers have no problem charging mantras in combat, I don’t see how elementalists would have a major problem, especially when the earth one has defiance. Sure it will get interrupted sometimes, but clearly not every time they go for it if they know what they’re doing. Its high risk, high reward, something that elementalists have never had to worry about before given how low risk, high reward their cele builds in pvp have always been.

On my Mesmer I can recharge my mantra in stealth. Good luck doing that on an ele. Thing is you left stealth out of your argument, which is a huge factor. Second, mesmers can distortion or blink to high ground or 1200m to fight reset and re mantra.

Look ele has no problem disengaging with rtl and flash. But if a Mesmer and tempest disengage who gains the advantage? As a Mesmer I can re-enter the fight in sealth then mantra stun > gs burst you from 100 to 0.

How effective is the tempest going to be vs a lethal enemy that can kill you from max range. Will your overcharges hit him from that range? How about thief and its ability to withdraw/shadow step out of your overcharge or stun steal to you to interrupt it?

What if you push aggression with your overcharge? The most basic Mesmer can:

1 Moa
2 diversion, which is an interrupt with huge field aoe
3 One of his 2 charged MoDs
4 gs illusionary wave
5 blink out of range
6 blurred frenzy through the final burst
7 decoy and the prestige stealth escape

My question is when is it ever going to be strategically advantageous for you to put one of you attunements at risk for an overcharge that is going to be laughably easy to counter or punish you for using. Half of those counters will stop your channel dead.

I stand by synopsis that if you use this you will be food. You might as well dive into a sea of sharks covered in chum. Your survival rate will be about the same

The current meta mantra mesmer build used in tourneys doesn’t even have any stealth at all (staff/GS, no decoy, no torch even), so your argument is still invalid when Mime and Happy Kid (in the last ESL) were able to charge mantras in combat using a zerker ammy just relying on posititioning from the staff, with 0 stealth. And obviously you won’t want to overcharge in a 1v1, its clearly meant to be a gamechanging teamfight ability. The only downside in my mind is that you’ll need a bunker guard or something to hold point for 3-5 seconds while you channel, which isn’t a huge downside.

You’re trying to turn this into an argument of tempest vs. mesmer 1v1. Thats not what I care about or was talking about at all if you read my post. I’m just saying if mesmers can charge mantras in TEAMFIGHT combat with good positioning, then elementalists can do. That was my point.

Vesuvius.9874:

Azel.4786:

And pardon me for not being excited about having to sit in an attunment for X amount of time, then having to channel that attunement for 2,5s-5s hoping no one will interrupt me with the insane amount of interrupts in game, and then, if it works or if it doesn’t, being locked out from that attunement for 15s-20s.

Sure will love when I need to heal and am locked out of water or when I need to do damage and will be locked out of fire / air, sounds super!

I think you just described a play style that’s different from the current norm. Isn’t that what ANET “promised” ?

Exactly. Elementalists, with the very few exceptions of channeled skills, are a class that requires constant movement, especially with melee range weapons. The overcharge play style puts huge cooldowns on 25% of an elementalists skills and roots them in place for long periods of time as well. This is almost like the Revenant’s energy management component and a completely different playstyle then we currently have.

Edit – Had a random kitten in my post that was funny but made sentence nonsensical.

Alright, let’s take this one item at a time. Obviously this is not what you would have liked to see, but there are some points that really need to be pointed out:

Azel.4786:

Great that you grasp the concept…. Elementalist had a ton of group support already, ever heard of Staff support builds??

Mostly Agree: Staff support is indeed a way to play the staff ele, but it’s currently their only viable support option. It’s long-range viable and predominantly focused on producing fields of various sorts. Warhorn is for melee-range abilities, and coupled with shouts these will provide up-close group support including AoE condi clear if using Rune of the Soldier.

Azel.4786:

But sure, if “new play style” for you is simply having a different animation but playing group support mechanically very similar to before, guess that must be different interpretations then because when they said new play style I assumed it meant “new mechanic way to play”, like, you know, all the other elite specializations had. -and just a side note on this, it remains to be seen but elementalists are also not getting any of the new boons or conditions, but let’s get a confirmation of this on Friday – which again was something they “promised” they would give to the classes with the specializations / new elites.

Disagree: It’s not a similar support style at all though. A melee-ranged shout support build is not a long-range field support build.

About the new mechanic, yes, they do get a new mechanic. The attunement overcharging is the new mechanic.
- Mesmers got an F5 that allows time reversal, but F1-4 are identical
- Necromancers got a new set of shroud skills but their F1 ability type is identical
- Guardians got some updates to the active effects of their virtues but the passives are identical

They aren’t trying to reinvent the wheel here, and it would be dishonest to say that any other class revealed thus far has had anything more drastically different than the Elementalists.

Azel.4786:

And pardon me for not being excited about having to sit in an attunment for X amount of time, then having to channel that attunement for 2,5s-5s hoping no one will interrupt me with the insane amount of interrupts in game, and then, if it works or if it doesn’t, being locked out from that attunement for 15s-20s.

Agree: Maybe it won’t suit your play style to camp in an attunement until it overcharges; that’s perfectly okay. Maybe there will be a trait that grants you 5 stacks of stability while channeling the attunement overcharge or something; who knows? If they don’t add something though, then I would have to agree with you and the channels may go overlooked as “not worth it”.

Azel.4786:

Sure will love when I need to heal and am locked out of water or when I need to do damage and will be locked out of fire / air, sounds super!

Neither Agree Nor Disagree: You will still have your #6 heal, but even now you do have a CD on attunement swapping. The only one that can get away with no attunement swapping CD is X → Air if you’re running Fresh Air. 15 seconds isn’t going to be a game-breaker, but if it is, then you would have to strategize and not put an attunement on CD if you think you’ll need it soon.

Azel.4786:

And aimlessly changing attunements? Dude you have to carefully swap them so you are never locked into one with all skills on cooldown and so that your swap is actually beneficial at the time (pop protection, heal, interrupts, do damage, etc.). Being in one attunement with a long cooldown on skills is terrible and often gets you killed!

Mostly agree: This can be an issue and, as I stated above, they would need to implement something to counter this. The overcharge abilities would have to be strong enough and “worth it” enough to justify sitting in the attunement. Of course, you could still swap attunements relatively normally, as long as you don’t overcharge them.

Azel.4786:

Oh and on the word promise…. yeah I always thought it meant: “A declaration assuring that one will or will not do something;”, so pardon me for thinking that when ANET said they will give us new play styles that was a promise… please enlighten me on the meaning of the word.

Disagree: They made a promise and it doesn’t seem they have gone against it so far. This spec is providing a different play style; maybe just not a play style you would have liked. That does not mean it isn’t a different play style.

Arcane will impact overload recharge, so most probably we will be forced to go Water/Arcane/Tempest.

oZii.2864:

http://www.tentonhammer.com/news/guild-wars-2/guild-wars-2-tempest-revealed

An exception to this is Earth attunement, in which you’re given a break-bar that will eat a few control-skills before you’re interrupted.

Eye of the Storm! – The tempest will call the storm down on nearby allies and himself, breaking stun on anyone affected while granting superspeed.

At least draw a reference on how the devs work instead of oh mantra of distraction

We also don’t know all the traits they could easily make a trait that grants 1 stack of stability for 3-5 seconds when you use a shout and make it a grandmaster.

We already have a trait that gives us stab every 8 sec if we want to attune to earth that often. Necro can get stab every 8-10 seconds.

It is entirely possible the tempest trait line will have something similar. You know how a mesmer gets no stab but can trait a gm trait and get it every 15 sec.

This is really a weak assumption

Stab on shouts would certainly work well with all these offensive shouts.

Lol 40% aoe Protect on each overcharge, plus aoe support shouts.

Not to mention that Elementalist is already the best class in the game (watch WP 1vs30 video).

Any reason to play Guardian or any other class? Isn’t it going too far with this class?

<3

Hahaha well Guardians will be arguably better at pew pewing than rangers, so its full circle I suppose!

Eles are the best and most versatile profession the game. There is nothing that they are deficient in that an elite spec could bring, such as melee cleave to necromancers who had none before.

The elite spec is bringing a new playstyle that breaks the usually flow of being a rotation attunement dancing on cooldown bot, which is refreshing, and I sincerely hope they make these overcharges worth it to justify this new playstyle.

Conncept.7638:

Durzlla.6295:

Personally i’ll probably be trying out an Earth, Water, Tempest spec, maybe do Earth, Fire, Tempest, maybe air over fire… I really like the earth line, and the tempest seems awesome so those two i’ll be trying to get to work together pretty badly…

This is what I would like to do as well, always loved the earth spec and the idea of an earth mage.

Unfortunately the Tempest looks like it is going to suffer from the same problems as all content concerning the earth element has since launch, 99% focus on tanking even though it is supposed to be a tanking and CONDITION tree.

I cannot freaking believe that something that requires you to SIT IN EARTH ATTUNEMENT FOR AN EXTENSIVE PERIOD is STILL not going to apply a single bleed!

I’m just hoping that they forgot to mention it bleeds because that’d be the smart thing for it to do…. hoping…

I’d actually be more happy than anything if they went through all the earth skills, reduced the physical damage they all dealt by like 50% but added bleeding to compensate for the damage loss. Then it’d finally fit the theme of the tanky condi attunement instead of just the tanky attunement.