Guild Wars 2

This is my take on a phantasm build that produces amazing spike damage, provides some group utility and puts an end to those nasty condition spammers. I never was a big fan of mantras until I begin using this build and realized their full potential.

With the Mesmer’s active defense we can focus on offensive stats and still maintain great survivability.

With the upcoming patch in December this build only looks to get better when Mender’s Purity will cleanse 2 conditions!!!

sPvP Version
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgAQNAR8al4zCpXUTmGb9IypHQnzNdkUoapWJF42FC-T0Ag0CnIqRVjrGTNyas1MIYRwGiDBPCA

WvW Version
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgAQNAR8al4zCpXUTmGb9IypHQnzNdkUoapWJF42FC-jECBYfERzEEwEBDRL5pIaslhFRjVXDT5iIq2krIa1A-w

MoR after the december patch will be very good. It’s actually the best healing skill of the game in term of healing/cooldown so.

I’ll go as far to get maybe 30 in domination for the 3 charges instead of Shattered Conditions, since MoR and MoResolve (oh god I just realised they use the same acronym) will be plenty.

But I can see your build to get used by more mesmers after december patch.

I think it would work well either way really. The trade-off I wasn’t willing to make was losing Phantasmal Strength… It’s close to a must have in my mind since your phantasms are providing the bulk of your dmg output.

[Edit]
Also, when the Dec patch comes. The cond removal of this build may be overkill. In that case, you could replace Mantra of Resolve with Mantra of Distraction and add 2 more dazes to your kitten nal. This will also synergize with the Dazzling trait.

I’ve never taken clone on dodge in a phantasm build. Usually I run gs/sw-sw and take the sword cooldown trait. I could see taking Krispera’s advice after the patch and going possibly 30/15/0/25/0 and getting the extra mantra charges along with Phantasmal Strength. But then I’d have to give up that sword cooldown. Still, I may try this after the patch.

I’ve been running 20/30/0/20/0 for a while now with GS+S/S and find it to be very effective.

You have no talents or utilities which give your Phantasms more HP. Since this is a phantasm-heavy build, you may want to consider such an investment. Without more hp, your phantasms will die with 1 crit, or a couple of hits.

Consider placing only 20 into Inspiration and 10 into either Dueling or Domination. For example, if you put 30 into Dueling instead and pick up Empowering Mantras, you’ll lose 15% Phantasm damage, but gain 5% critical strike chance and 10% critical strike damage, and 8% damage for having 2 Mantras charged. That’s a loss of somewhere south of 5% overall phantasm damage in exchange for ~11% personal damage and bigger spike damage.

If you want to keep Deceptive Evasion, you may want to consider dropping greatsword training in favor of Shattered Concentration. Going into a teamfight, dropping a couple of clones and shattering can strip strong boons like protection, which will give you a huge boost to your phantasm damage.

I’d drop Mantra of Resolve for the Disenchanter. Disenchanter is totally underrated. He drops easily in an AoE fight situation, but aside from that he does substantial condi cleaning and boon stripping.

Edit: Also, I prefer Swordsman over Duelist for this build because of the crazy spike damage he does. If he’s left alone, the Swordsman will hit almost as hard as the Beserker. Plus the Swordsman typically eats thieves alive.

Dasboba.1652:

I’ve never taken clone on dodge in a phantasm build. Usually I run gs/sw-sw and take the sword cooldown trait. I could see taking Krispera’s advice after the patch and going possibly 30/15/0/25/0 and getting the extra mantra charges along with Phantasmal Strength. But then I’d have to give up that sword cooldown. Still, I may try this after the patch.

In your case just swap Deceptive Evasion for Blade Training.

I still like Deceptive Evasion with Shattered Conditions because it gives me a free cleanse and a reason to actually use Cry of Frustration.

Thedenofsin.7340:

I’ve been running 20/30/0/20/0 for a while now with GS+S/S and find it to be very effective.

You have no talents or utilities which give your Phantasms more HP. Since this is a phantasm-heavy build, you may want to consider such an investment. Without more hp, your phantasms will die with 1 crit, or a couple of hits.

Consider placing only 20 into Inspiration and 10 into either Dueling or Domination. For example, if you put 30 into Dueling instead and pick up Empowering Mantras, you’ll lose 15% Phantasm damage, but gain 5% critical strike chance and 10% critical strike damage, and 8% damage for having 2 Mantras charged. That’s a loss of somewhere south of 5% overall phantasm damage in exchange for ~11% personal damage and bigger spike damage.

If you want to keep Deceptive Evasion, you may want to consider dropping greatsword training in favor of Shattered Concentration. Going into a teamfight, dropping a couple of clones and shattering can strip strong boons like protection, which will give you a huge boost to your phantasm damage.

I’d drop Mantra of Resolve for the Disenchanter. Disenchanter is totally underrated. He drops easily in an AoE fight situation, but aside from that he does substantial condi cleaning and boon stripping.

Thanks for the suggestions. All great points. I believe this build is flexible enough you could certainly swap some traits around without losing the main functions of the build.

However, I’m not sold on making the phantasms have more life traits. 20% of nothing is still nothing. I mean, they may last one more hit but that’s not a given.

Hey have a look at this:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/tPvP-Build-The-dual-faced-Lyssa/
This is my version of a 20 20 0 30 0 build and you may enjoy this too

BlackStabbath.9780:

Thanks for the suggestions. All great points. I believe this build is flexible enough you could certainly swap some traits around without losing the main functions of the build.

However, I’m not sold on making the phantasms have more life traits. 20% of nothing is still nothing. I mean, they may last one more hit but that’s not a given.

Fair enough. Perhaps then try running with Defender one of your utility slots. He has around 20k base health and takes 50% damage for your team, Phantasms included. :-)

I usually look at the opposition and make a determination on what to slot. If I see I need more condi removal or boon stripping, I’ll put on Disenchanter. If I see I need more pew-pew reduction, I’ll put on Defender.

I’m liking the build more and more, mainly because I can spike almost as effectively as a shatter mesmer, but with a little less risk. GS4->Decoy->S5->S4->S3->swap->S2+shatter->GS5 can do around 10k damage and leaves your opponent on the ground.

I agree that clone health is so low that 20% increase makes a negligible difference, I wouldn’t bother as there are so many more useful traits. As the previous poster suggested you could perhaps use Phantasm Defender, or if clone health really presents as a problem, use the Signet for +50% illusion health, a lot of people tend to forget about that one.

Not sick of conditions but ill definitely be giving this a try as all I have to do is a gear swap and major trait alterations from the Blackwater build.

nice but….
what about writing some lines on how to play it….
or just a vid would be enough.

LordByron.8369:

nice but….
what about writing some lines on how to play it….
or just a vid would be enough.

Spam Phantasms and run around! :-)

Seriously though, here’s Taugrim’s Phantasm build from back in the day:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NaGcm8jTy4&list=SP69AEEF06799051EB&index=16

Update: Not sure the tooltip is correct but when activating (channeling) Mantra of Resolve it doesn’t seem to remove a condition. This is with Mender’s Purity traited. It does remove a cond when the readied mantra is fired, however…

Not sure if this is by design or a bug. Maybe someone else could confirm?

LordByron.8369:

nice but….
what about writing some lines on how to play it….
or just a vid would be enough.

Play like you would normally play a mesmer, but now you need to micro manage your mantras.

BlackStabbath.9780:

Update: Not sure the tooltip is correct but when activating (channeling) Mantra of Resolve it doesn’t seem to remove a condition. This is with Mender’s Purity traited. It does remove a cond when the readied mantra is fired, however…

Not sure if this is by design or a bug. Maybe someone else could confirm?

Nah it’s made like that. Mender’s Purity works when you heal and it doesn’t work with Restorative Mantras.

I’m kind of having mixed feelings with Restorative Mantras. You have 2 strategy : charge your mantras before the fight or use it in the middle of the fight. Best strategy is to charge MoR before the fight and if you need to charge it again in the middle of the fight, you can take advantage of Restorative Mantras. If you have traited Protected Mantras, it could give you a little protection while charging. Distortion and Stealth can help you (Tip : You can charge mantras while blinking). It is still very risky if you’re fighting someone with interrupts (wars, thief, rangers, mesmers), but it’s a good chunk of heal.

Krispera.5087:

LordByron.8369:

nice but….
what about writing some lines on how to play it….
or just a vid would be enough.

Play like you would normally play a mesmer, but now you need to micro manage your mantras.

BlackStabbath.9780:

Update: Not sure the tooltip is correct but when activating (channeling) Mantra of Resolve it doesn’t seem to remove a condition. This is with Mender’s Purity traited. It does remove a cond when the readied mantra is fired, however…

Not sure if this is by design or a bug. Maybe someone else could confirm?

Nah it’s made like that. Mender’s Purity works when you heal and it doesn’t work with Restorative Mantras.

I’m kind of having mixed feelings with Restorative Mantras. You have 2 strategy : charge your mantras before the fight or use it in the middle of the fight. Best strategy is to charge MoR before the fight and if you need to charge it again in the middle of the fight, you can take advantage of Restorative Mantras. If you have traited Protected Mantras, it could give you a little protection while charging. Distortion and Stealth can help you (Tip : You can charge mantras while blinking). It is still very risky if you’re fighting someone with interrupts (wars, thief, rangers, mesmers), but it’s a good chunk of heal.

You could also just slot Mantra of Pain and have a ~3k aoe heal every 5 secs?

I ran with mantras all the time while leveling. The problem with them in PvP (of any type) is that they take too long to charge, and during that time I can’t do anything else except move. Am I using them incorrectly?

Qaelyn.7612:

I ran with mantras all the time while leveling. The problem with them in PvP (of any type) is that they take too long to charge, and during that time I can’t do anything else except move. Am I using them incorrectly?

You can use any instant skill while channeling the mantra – like activating other mantra charges, shatters, phase retreat, chaos armour, prestige…

Qaelyn.7612:

I ran with mantras all the time while leveling. The problem with them in PvP (of any type) is that they take too long to charge, and during that time I can’t do anything else except move. Am I using them incorrectly?

Embolism did a great job of explaining how to use mantras in pvp in another thread.
Please refer to his post for more info.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Agony-Torment-Pain-PvP-Mantra-Build/first#post1998039

Edit:
If you run a phantasm build similar to mine. You can recharge while your illusions continue to harass your opponents. Decoy, Blink, Mass Invis, etc.

Thanks. That’s interesting as it is close to what I was running before I came to this forum and started build-tinkering — mantra of pain with the heal on it. I just got tired of all the 2 3/4s periods where I couldn’t do much.

How do you feel your build compares to the one by Embolism? They’re quite different. I’m currently running a “convertible” Blackwater/Blackdevil 20/20/30/0/0 build.

Qaelyn.7612:

Thanks. That’s interesting as it is close to what I was running before I came to this forum and started build-tinkering — mantra of pain with the heal on it. I just got tired of all the 2 3/4s periods where I couldn’t do much.

How do you feel your build compares to the one by Embolism? They’re quite different. I’m currently running a “convertible” Blackwater/Blackdevil 20/20/30/0/0 build.

Embolism’s build is tailored more around Mantras whereas mine just happens to use them for the condition removal. My build isn’t anything ingenious, just a phantasm build with some built-in condition removal. I never meant it to be a Mantra build at all…. I’m always tinkering with different things and experimenting. Sometimes things work great together but sometimes not.

I like how flexible 20/20/0/30/0 is. You can easily turn that into a shatter build that completely shuts down conditions and enemy boons (shattered concentration + Null Field).

My only thing is.. shattered concentration in a phantasm build feels.. counterproductive. You could go 10/10/0/25/25, get the phantasm traits (and Mender’s purity), slot iDisenchanter rather than MoResolve, and have powerful phantasms on shorter cooldown and attacking more rapidly (bonus for disenchanter since it already attacks hella fast), and maintain the condition removal.

Xenn.3809:

Qaelyn.7612:

I ran with mantras all the time while leveling. The problem with them in PvP (of any type) is that they take too long to charge, and during that time I can’t do anything else except move. Am I using them incorrectly?

You can use any instant skill while channeling the mantra – like activating other mantra charges, shatters, phase retreat, chaos armour, prestige…

…Spatial Surge…

Stabbath, have you experimented with using an ‘on-heal’ proc Runeset with your Mantra? Lyssa (cough, cough OP) has a great proc and Centaur is really awesome for group mobility.
Mantra Mastery + Centaur is perma-swiftness for your team (and it’s quite underrated in combat too)

I was just tinkering with a mantra build against the NPC profession-bots in the Heart of the Mists using a 0/20/20/30/0 with a soldier’s amulet and runes of vampirism. Primarily focused on the scepter skills (with the scepter cooldown and condition damage boost) and the mantras. Holy cow, talk about a tank. I haven’t played a “real” tanky class like warrior but I felt like I could have taken on 4 of those guys (and I’m not a strong player).

Too bad the runeset is bugged, that would get old fast I’m sure.

Thedenofsin.7340:

Stabbath, have you experimented with using an ‘on-heal’ proc Runeset with your Mantra? Lyssa (cough, cough OP) has a great proc and Centaur is really awesome for group mobility.
Mantra Mastery + Centaur is perma-swiftness for your team (and it’s quite underrated in combat too)

Wow!! Sweet idea. I haven’t tested it but I plan on it.

Here’s one I may try tonight.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgAQNAR8cl4zCpXUTmGb9IxpCQn0DVn6VX6Bu5tsB-T0Ag0CnIKSVkrITRyisFNIYRwGiDBPCA

Krispera.5087:

LordByron.8369:

nice but….
what about writing some lines on how to play it….
or just a vid would be enough.

Play like you would normally play a mesmer, but now you need to micro manage your mantras.

never played phantasm mesmer in WWW (no money for equip, but i already have everything for this build)

D/D Ele since launch i have only an idea on how to play with shatter builds…
Any suggestion?

Thedenofsin.7340:

Stabbath, have you experimented with using an ‘on-heal’ proc Runeset with your Mantra? Lyssa (cough, cough OP) has a great proc and Centaur is really awesome for group mobility.
Mantra Mastery + Centaur is perma-swiftness for your team (and it’s quite underrated in combat too)

Centaur runes is great in theory, in practice however it means that you must pop your heal on every cooldown to maintain speed (it work without mantra mastery as well btw). While it works fine running alone across a warm summer field with fluffy unicorns flying through the air farting rainbows, in a combat situation with Warrior axes flying all over the place and sweaty men in 100kg armour jumping like a bunny on crack over your head, it doesnt really work . You need your heal to be available on demand and use the proper moment to charge the mantra – especially if you traited it to do other things, such as condition removal (oh I need to remove 10s immobilize, nope I used it to get 10s swiftness, good trade!). Missing a beat in small scale against perma-speed classes is almost certain death.

I used them a long, long time before I switched to Traveller runes… Not going back. Usually the team has at least one warrior with a warhorn, which is better perma-speed.

You can use an Eternal Cold Potion + Centaur Runes = Perma-Swiftness without wasting your heal.

Xavi.6591:

You can use an Eternal Cold Potion + Centaur Runes = Perma-Swiftness without wasting your heal.

Does that work mid-combat?

Valarauka.2719:

Xavi.6591:

You can use an Eternal Cold Potion + Centaur Runes = Perma-Swiftness without wasting your heal.

Does that work mid-combat?

I haven’t tested it but I’m sure it does although you would have to open your inventory (or keep the top left inventory slot visible by dragging your inventory off the screen to the bottom-right hand side), click on the potion, press 6 to leave the transformation (same slot as heal) to get swiftness would get bothersome while in combat.

If you’re in a fight and just using your heal to get swiftness in my opinion is probably risky and a waste of a heal unless you are chasing. One of the reasons why Traveler runes are so much better.

Dawdler.8521:

Centaur runes is great in theory, in practice however it means that you must pop your heal on every cooldown to maintain speed (it work without mantra mastery as well btw). While it works fine running alone across a warm summer field with fluffy unicorns flying through the air farting rainbows, in a combat situation with Warrior axes flying all over the place and sweaty men in 100kg armour jumping like a bunny on crack over your head, it doesnt really work . You need your heal to be available on demand and use the proper moment to charge the mantra – especially if you traited it to do other things, such as condition removal (oh I need to remove 10s immobilize, nope I used it to get 10s swiftness, good trade!). Missing a beat in small scale against perma-speed classes is almost certain death.

I used them a long, long time before I switched to Traveller runes… Not going back. Usually the team has at least one warrior with a warhorn, which is better perma-speed.

In the solo queues I have been in, I have found it rare to get someone to drop group swiftness. So I’ve used Centaur Runes and find them to be quite useful in practice. If you are spamming your heal all the time to get swiftness, well, then you’re just stupid.

However, when you take some damage in a fight and pop your heal, suddenly you have swiftness too which really helps your mobility and positioning.

The reason why I mention Mantra Mastery is because it gives you a heal on an 8 second cooldown. This means if you need to run between capture points you can blow both heals and have it fully recharged by the time you reach the next node.

As a Mesmer, one of your roles is to support the team fights while either backcapping or back support. Centaur Runes go a long way to help support that role.

And Traveler Runes are not available in PvP.

Yeah for sPvP, I doubt the Eternal Potion would work anyways,

You need to decide whether you want a shatter or phantasm build. Right now, you have traits for both. My recommendation is to pick phantasm. Ditch Deceptive Evasion, and take 10 more into Domination for the 50% boost to your mantras. Change your Shattered Conditions GM trait into a +20% hp boost to illusions. Ditch pistol; use sword or focus (you have little condition damage).
By doing this, you:
1) Boost phantasms: DPS & survivability
2) Boost condition removal: +2 from MoRes, +1 from MoRec
3) Boost Healing: +50% from MoRec

Thedenofsin.7340:

Dawdler.8521:

Centaur runes is great in theory, in practice however it means that you must pop your heal on every cooldown to maintain speed (it work without mantra mastery as well btw). While it works fine running alone across a warm summer field with fluffy unicorns flying through the air farting rainbows, in a combat situation with Warrior axes flying all over the place and sweaty men in 100kg armour jumping like a bunny on crack over your head, it doesnt really work . You need your heal to be available on demand and use the proper moment to charge the mantra – especially if you traited it to do other things, such as condition removal (oh I need to remove 10s immobilize, nope I used it to get 10s swiftness, good trade!). Missing a beat in small scale against perma-speed classes is almost certain death.

I used them a long, long time before I switched to Traveller runes… Not going back. Usually the team has at least one warrior with a warhorn, which is better perma-speed.

In the solo queues I have been in, I have found it rare to get someone to drop group swiftness. So I’ve used Centaur Runes and find them to be quite useful in practice. If you are spamming your heal all the time to get swiftness, well, then you’re just stupid.

However, when you take some damage in a fight and pop your heal, suddenly you have swiftness too which really helps your mobility and positioning.

The reason why I mention Mantra Mastery is because it gives you a heal on an 8 second cooldown. This means if you need to run between capture points you can blow both heals and have it fully recharged by the time you reach the next node.

As a Mesmer, one of your roles is to support the team fights while either backcapping or back support. Centaur Runes go a long way to help support that role.

And Traveler Runes are not available in PvP.

Actually, just charging the Mantra will give you the heal effect, and proc the centaur runes swiftness. You don’t need to actually use the heal.
In this way, you don’t really ever need to “waste” the heal for swiftness.

Requiem.8769:

Actually, just charging the Mantra will give you the heal effect, and proc the centaur runes swiftness. You don’t need to actually use the heal.
In this way, you don’t really ever need to “waste” the heal for swiftness.

Yes, this is how I use it. I charge it at the start of the fight. After finishing at a capture point, I’ll discharge all the remaining casts and leave for the next point. By the time I get there, I’ve recharged it fully.

Plus Lyssa Runes of OPness are awesome with this mantra. Countless times I Lyssa has given me protection, regen or Aegis after casting a heal and it’s amazeballs.

Requiem.8769:

Actually, just charging the Mantra will give you the heal effect, and proc the centaur runes swiftness. You don’t need to actually use the heal.
In this way, you don’t really ever need to “waste” the heal for swiftness.

Errr… You need to use the two-three heals to be able to charge. If you dont use the heals, you get 10 seconds of swiftness period. Not very good when its 15 minute PvP/3 hour WvW.

Also I was talking from a WvW perspective, obviously not PvP. In PvP, you barely need any speed at all, the maps are too small and the entire point is to engage the enemy and win, not run away.

I’m using centaur runes in WvW for ages already, and I don’t see any problem with using my heal for swiftness.

I’m using the mirror-heal in WvW, which is on a 15 seconds cooldown. Since I’ve got eyeballs in my head, I don’t “waste” my heal if enemies are obviously gonna attack me in the next few seconds. Having that in mind, my heal-cooldown will maybe be at 7 seconds in a worst case scenario because I had used it for swiftness. Now if I’m at full HP and can’t survive for 7 seconds, then I would probably have died even if my heal would have been ready.

Now with the mantra-heal… well, I think I would indeed hesitate to use it for swiftness, simply because you need to actively recharge it if you want to heal yourself. And that’s one of the reasons why I never liked this heal… not only does it have a cooldown (well just 10 seconds, but still…), you also need to recharge it to be able to heal again. Feels too clunky for my taste. If I’d go for mender’s purity, I would probably still use the mirror-heal, just because it’s way more reliable.

I use mirror heal as well with centaur runes. It’s great. I actually would be more careful and calculating with heals but i find that I don’t even need to. I would go swiftness just before a fight no prob. I SPAM the heal like crazy. It’s like a massive regen. At 15 seconds like… with so much mesmer utility like blurred frenzies, aegis, stealth, so on, those 15 seconds are practically invulnerable anyway. I take some damage, I heal. LOL. I’m almost constantly at full health, all the time, no matter what i’m fighting, unless I’m taking on 3+ enemies or a lot of condi, but if u focus on condi removal it won’t be a problem either

Dawdler.8521:

Requiem.8769:

Actually, just charging the Mantra will give you the heal effect, and proc the centaur runes swiftness. You don’t need to actually use the heal.
In this way, you don’t really ever need to “waste” the heal for swiftness.

Errr… You need to use the two-three heals to be able to charge. If you dont use the heals, you get 10 seconds of swiftness period. Not very good when its 15 minute PvP/3 hour WvW.

Also I was talking from a WvW perspective, obviously not PvP. In PvP, you barely need any speed at all, the maps are too small and the entire point is to engage the enemy and win, not run away.

No, that is simply not true. All you need to do is charge the mantra, not activate it. If you don’t like the heal from mantras, you can charge the mantra, proc the swiftness, and then switch to whatever heal you prefer. Repeating this every 10s will give you permanent swiftness, without using a single heal skill.
It also appears we have a different perspective on what swiftness is for. I like to use if for running toward the enemy, you apparently prefer it for running away. In my experience, it is exceedingly useful in PvP and WvW both. The role is different; the value is similar.
For PvP, swiftness lets you start the ticking at points sooner; decap enemy far points, and reach your own points and prevent decaps in time.
For WvW, swiftness lets you chase fleeing enemies, and make sure more of your skills land while fewer of theirs do.