Guild Wars 2

Some thief utility skill’s cool downs need to be reduced. When GW2 first came out, yes there CD were appropriate but it’s 2016 and some of these skills are outdated. For example, Blinding Powder has a 40s CD for a 3s stealth. That CD is way too long for what the skills gives you, in 2016. Here are some skills that NEED CD reductions to give Thief more build diversity.

Roll for Initiative – 60s to 50s
Blinding Powder – 40s to 32s
Smokescreen – 30s to 24s
Haste – 60s to 35s
All Venoms – 40s to 24s

Everything yes except for haste which is fine where it is. 60s cooldown for 6s quickness and a stun break is extremely reasonable.

Thieves Guild on 3-minute cooldown?

Two AI Thieves that get swatted like flies?
That’s some kind of guild, eh? :-P

Well this at least certainly wouldnt break anything and make the core utility more competitive to the elite ones.
I’d still rather increase cooldowns across the board, but Im starting to feel like the powercreep is a concious decision and wont be revisioned, so might aswell.

Turk.5460:

Everything yes except for haste which is fine where it is. 60s cooldown for 6s quickness and a stun break is extremely reasonable.

Nah, no thief uses haste because simply put there are better option to fill that utility slot with than a 60s stun real with 6s of quickness. By reducing the CD to 35-40s, you at least give the players some incentive to using choosing skill. Most of the thief utility skills are useless simply because of their cool downs and by slightly reducing some of them, you give the thief SOOOOO MUCH build diversity. I mean when was the last time you saw a thief run venoms? Never. Or smokescreen? Never. You never have that thought of “dang should I give up this skill for this skill?” because so many of the thief skills are useless with their current CD.

Roll for Initiative – yes.
Blinding Powder – No. (already one of the best skills available)
Smokescreen – Not really. Works well for dungeons and never has really been restricted by cd. Not really good anywhere else, even with a lower cd.
Haste – Not really. It would be good for dungeons when you don’t have a mesmer with a shorter cd, but that’s about it. Still wouldn’t be worth using in PvP due to other better options and raids it would be redundant with a mesmer.
Venoms – No. There are problems with venoms from a PvP perspective, but in PvE, they are strong enough to make us one of the highest condi dps while also bringing the best break bar utility. Condi traits are kinda all over the place though.

Shovel Face.4512:

I mean when was the last time you saw a thief run venoms? Never. Or smokescreen? Never.

You never saw a Thief running with Smokescreen because they are always invisible, hehe! It’s one of my go-to utilities for a perma-Stealth build! ;-D

Shovel Face.4512:

Turk.5460:

Everything yes except for haste which is fine where it is. 60s cooldown for 6s quickness and a stun break is extremely reasonable.

Nah, no thief uses haste because simply put there are better option to fill that utility slot with than a 60s stun real with 6s of quickness. By reducing the CD to 35-40s, you at least give the players some incentive to using choosing skill. Most of the thief utility skills are useless simply because of their cool downs and by slightly reducing some of them, you give the thief SOOOOO MUCH build diversity. I mean when was the last time you saw a thief run venoms? Never. Or smokescreen? Never. You never have that thought of “dang should I give up this skill for this skill?” because so many of the thief skills are useless with their current CD.

Venoms are actually good now and that’s something I never thought I’d say. A condi thief is a mediocre, but viable build in PvP, but in PvE, it’s a very strong raid spec that does well in fights that either need condi damage or fast break bars such as VG and Gorse. The single target DPS is also on par with a perfect rotation condi engi.

As for Smokescreen, it’s been a solid skill to bring for dungeons for a long time. It’s good for projectile defense and also allows for extended group stealth (smokescreen + short bow blast, then refuge later before stealth ends).

Haste should be 3-4 seconds of quickness on a 30-40 second cooldown.

Do not forget the healing that leeching provides on venoms either. On a 24 second cooldown I can spec to get it to less than 20 seconds.

If wearing something like shamans/apothecary I can rely on that lower cooldown to maintain more stacks while at the same time garnering all of that extra healing. It not hard to trait up for 500+ heal per venom strike meaning Spider venom would add 3k heal on its own every 20 seconds. This shared with as VA would be uber powerful.

The underlying problem with venoms is not potential damage as much as it is with them filling up the utility bar and precluding much needed stunbreaks or Condi cleanse.

babazhook.6805:

The underlying problem with venoms is not potential damage as much as it is with them filling up the utility bar and precluding much needed stunbreaks or Condi cleanse.

^ So much this. If stuns/condis could be handled to some reasonable extent with a full venom buil, I’m sure we’d start to see venom share have a chance at meta. Until then, outside of basilisk and a single venom on a yolo dodge/DB spam condi build are all we’ll see in PvP. A cool down change alone would have no impact in PvP.

I always thought venoms where useless so i never tried them… until i did, and now, i cannot leave my venomshare build in pvp. If you know how to use them they are more than viable. And no, venoms don’t need cooldown reduction, their damage would be absurd

Nope and nope. Venoms are not good in any build period. If all your doing is playing hot joins and unranked, you no business talking. The reason venoms are bad is b/c there are simply better skills you can use. I know a bunch of condi thieves that are actually good with a 62% win rate who doesn’t use venoms. Why on earth would you slot any venom skill in place of Shadow step, signet of agility, impairing daggers, bandits defense, shadow refuge. And even to an extent, Roll for initiative, blinding powder and infiltrators signet.

Shovel Face.4512:

Nope and nope. Venoms are not good in any build period. If all your doing is playing hot joins and unranked, you no business talking. The reason venoms are bad is b/c there are simply better skills you can use. I know a bunch of condi thieves that are actually good with a 62% win rate who doesn’t use venoms. Why on earth would you slot any venom skill in place of Shadow step, signet of agility, impairing daggers, bandits defense, shadow refuge. And even to an extent, Roll for initiative, blinding powder and infiltrators signet.

You can do just fine with shadow step along with impairing daggers and spider venom. This is a pretty common build and it’s carried people to legendary last season.

I wouldn’t put it over the meta D/P, but it’s certainly viable and can easily 1 v 1 most builds.

Shovel Face.4512:

All Venoms – 40s to 24s

As long as Venom Aura exists, that will never happen. This is one of the major issues of Thief, there are so many pigeon holing going on that if you want to use venom effectively, for example, you are forced to take VA because of the ridiculous CD.

Kageseigi.2150:

Thieves Guild on 3-minute cooldown?

Two AI Thieves that get swatted like flies?
That’s some kind of guild, eh? :-P

cooldown reduction won’t fix that skill.

Reduce venom cooldown or make the venoms worth the long cooldown, but then limit venomous aura to 3 targets

NinjaEd.3946:

Kageseigi.2150:

Thieves Guild on 3-minute cooldown?

Two AI Thieves that get swatted like flies?
That’s some kind of guild, eh? :-P

cooldown reduction won’t fix that skill.

Haha, indeed! I’m not sure what to suggest other than make it duration-based. So every time one Thief gets downed, another comes in to take its place… even if the duration has to be reduced from 30 seconds.

Shovel Face.4512:

Roll for Initiative – 60s to 50s -yes
Blinding Powder – 40s to 32s – NO
Smokescreen – 30s to 24s – sigh
Haste – 60s to 35s – sigh
All Venoms – 40s to 24s – NO

Overall i’m against of reducing cooldowns couse it promotes skill spamming istead of intelligent situational ability use. My reasons by/against your suggestions:

1. i would actually lower the cd of roll to ~30 sec and lower the initiative refill to 2. Bandit’s defense would be still better, but in this state it maybe would see some light.
2. blinding powder is totally fine…. stealth got the least counterplay in this game… this skill is even a blast finisher, use it wisely.
3. Smokescreen CD reduction can end up in a disgusting amount of stealth camping that i hate with a passion. d/p wont sacrafice powder/bandit’s for this, on the other hand d/d could stealth camp well with this. Dont misunderstand me i am begging for more thief build diversity, but pls find another way than giving stealth camping ability to more builds….
4. uhh.. maybe? i wont really enjoy getting quickness cleaved paired with every basi venom though.
5. just please don’t…. basi venom is already major aids on builds like d/p who can stealth cast it. This ability got massive power creep’d in the last months, this change would mean that you could use it on every steal…. grow brain.. this suggestion is stupid. Plus if the aids share thief besoms meta with this i gonna cut myself….

MadVisions.4529:

Plus if the aids share thief besoms meta with this i gonna cut myself….

You dont like venoms? ^^