Guild Wars 2

Dos.7052:

Now let me ask you:

" why there is too many rangers using longbow"

I’ll speak for myself, but if i wanted to use a sword or axe i’d have gone warrior.

Once again, doesn’t RF need an elite and one or two signets to do the damage people are complaining about?

And forgive me the ignorance, but apart from bolas what else is in his bar to be able to hit 100b?

edit: oh, you mean he used all his CDs at once for the 100b. Isn’t it exactly that what people are doing with RF, thus all the complaining in the forum (RaO, SotW and maybe SotH, not sure about this last one)?

All that being done in one skill and the class still sucks compared to yours.

nicknamenick.2437:

there is only 1 big difference:

100b needs a HUGE CC skill to land all the hits.. with most CC skills you will NEVER hit the final big hit.. only when you use a different weapon set…
But now you build is all about landing 1 skill.. good luck.

Doesn’t RF also require an elite skill and one (or two) signets to do the damage you’re complaining about? Also, doesn’t it need a heavy trait investment?

Juba.8406:

when is the last time you saw a warrior using a GS in tPvP ?

I’ve never done much tpvp, but in wvw, many warriors i’ve seen used GS.

And just out of curiosity, how does the ranger GS compare to warrior GS?

Then if warriors are still way above rangers, why are we discussing warrior buffs, just because it’s what rangers just got?

That will increase the gap again, that’s the oposite of balance. This 100b buff is not even a QoL thing.

I haven’t been able to play after the patch hit, so i honestly don’t know, but does all this cat fight mean that rangers are now in a better place than warriors in pve and wvw?

I made a ranger to be able to play a ranged archer type character for the first time in a MMO.

Right, but my pet dies from massive aoe and cleave damage, not damage targeted at the pet (we are talking about zerg vs zerg here, not roaming).

Simply solved by the aspect feature, let me stow the pet for the same % it is supposed to do.
Upside: you don’t have to micro manage the pet (and honestly, in these conditions it’s impossible to do so);
downside: you lose the pet’s utility.

Was there something mentioned about pet changes to prevent them from getting killed in a few seconds in the middle of a zerg vs zerg battle?

Or even better, that aspect feature so we can stow pets?

Prysin.8542:

Most of you will and probably do hate my guts, good for you, keep hating, i’ll still be right. Doesn’t matter if i tell you to L2P in a nice way or right to your face, if it is an L2P issue, it is an L2P issue. No ore no less.

I don’t understand how you call Xsorus rude and arrogant and then you pull something priceless as this. Even if you are right, and you are aggressive and entitled like this, how are people not supposed to hate you (if they indeed do)?

Is there any post in the bugs forum about it? I can’t find one.

Prysin.8542:

may i suggest you for once may be wrong? Or maybe your infinite wisdom can finally shed light on something my ranger cannot provide that is not positive.

The post that preceded the Ranger CDI, where people voted Ranger as the worst class in this game, by a large margin, kind of indicates you are the wrong one.

Prysin.8542:

Aioros.4862:

On another note, i have a question for people who still play ranger, do most ranger aoes still only hit 3 targets or has it been fixed?

Only Muddy Terrain and entangle was limited to 3 (some speculate traps too, but that was never confirmed to be limited to 3 since they are pulsing fields). These two utilities was bumped up to 5 many months ago.

Cleave attacks hits 3 targets, just like anyone else’s cleave attacks.

Bounce attacks hit 3 targets, just like anyone else’s bounce attacks

Piercing attacks hit everyone in a line (unconfirmed 5 targets max)

AOE hits 5 targets

Pulsing fields 5/pulse

Shouts/howls – 5

Spirit buffs – 5

Healing spring – 5/pulse

healing aura from elite spirit – unconfirmed, i have counted 7 in PvE during recent LS.

Thank you.

Jitters.9401:

Aioros.4862:

There is no speccing for blob as a ranger, that is the point.
That ranger has 1 or 2 good builds for spvp and roaming we already knew, you didn’t strike gold.
Too bad WvW is not about roaming.

Made me laugh.

You did read I play a thief right? How many builds do you think a thief has to choose from? A backstab thief plays the same build roaming/havoking/blobbing. A condition thief does the same.

The only difference I use if I am in a blob, is I will use caltrops and dagger storm for keep defense. You shadow refuge inside the keep. roll out the doors, drop caltrops on the rams or a group behind the rams (depending how they are attacking), then start to dagger storm so they do not realize their are caltrops are bleeding them. They stay in the circle trying to kill the solo thief, and their health levels plummet. Lots of fun to do right before your back up squad attacks.

Laugh all you want. In all your ramble about how your class sucks in a blob too, you did nothing but agree with me. That doesn’t make ranger’s case any better and this thread was about rangers, was it not?

On another note, i have a question for people who still play ranger, do most ranger aoes still only hit 3 targets or has it been fixed?

There is no speccing for blob as a ranger, that is the point.
That ranger has 1 or 2 good builds for spvp and roaming we already knew, you didn’t strike gold.
Too bad WvW is not about roaming.

Allie Murdock.8152:

What I’ve been seeing a lot of is that you guys don’t necessarily dislike pets. What you dislike is how they act and how they are controlled. It seems to me that these are feelings that have been built up over time, and have culminated into “pets have to go” because you guys haven’t seen the improvements that should be made to pets to make them desirable. I certainly don’t blame you for getting to this point, but I do want to know the core of the problem before we start talking about rebalancing an entire class.

We wouldn’t dislike pets if they were reliable.
We also lost hope of you ever fixing them. You tried and failed multiple times and you yourselves said fixing pets would be lots of work and as such it would not be possible.

Allie Murdock.8152:

Think of it this way: You’re building a house and a 2×4 breaks while you’re trying to screw it in to something. Do you scrap the house and completely rebuild it because that one piece broke, or do you grab a new 2×4 and use that instead? Which do you think would be more efficient?

Let me share a piece of Monty Python script i think is relevant here.

“King of Swamp Castle: When I first came here, this was all swamp. Everyone said I was daft to build a castle on a swamp, but I built in all the same, just to show them. It sank into the swamp. So I built a second one. That sank into the swamp. So I built a third. That burned down, fell over, then sank into the swamp. But the fourth one stayed up. And that’s what you’re going to get, Lad, the strongest castle in all of England.”

If i remember correctly the fourth castle eventualy sinks into the swamp.

Where i’m getting at is, you’ve been bringing in new 2×4′s to rebuild the castle … i mean, patching pets for one and a half years, but the profession sinks into the swamp every time.

On a plus for the stow option, people who want to use the pets in pve will be able to use stow as a pet dodge, as the pet will disappear right before some one hit skill lands, and be able to be unstowed right after.

gawker.8340:

Allie, i’m so happy. Even if half the things you listed make it into the next balance patch, I will accept it. I really like the damage reduction on pet and active signet effects apply on ranger by default. These two changes alone would be EPIC WIN.

Gawker, Allie was making a summary of the proposals people wrote here, not a promise to implement them.

The problem with that is it’ll will make rangers better than other classes.
Rangers shouldn’t be better, we should be even.

Hey don’t tell me that, i rolled a ranger to use bows (as i prefer to play a ranged class), but that’s not the how the game works, and the with the “rangers are skirmishers” thingy in the 1st post, it sounds to me that’s how it’s intended.

Now we are skirmishers, not archers. I think it’s a “Go melee or get out” thingy.

They want us to be skirmishers, and in old times skirmishers would wield spears.
So, I don’t see what’s the problem getting the legendary spear.

Sandpit.3467:

They absolutely don’t want you to stow your pet so I can’t see them rewarding you with a buff for doing the one thing they don’t want. They might consider a heavy debuff for doing it though.

If they can’t fix pets (they said so) and they won’t allow us to play without pets, what 3rd option is there, have a CDI for rangers a year from now?

Belzebu.3912:

Aioros.4862:

If you want high skill cap, you can go and play the class now, there are people out there who can make the class work. It’s just not for us common folk.

High skilled players can make ranger work, a ranger played by a high skilled player is as effective as an average warrior, guardian and so on.

[off tipic]your niki is from the anime Saint Seiya?

EDIT: Pets wont be fixed, so suggest that is pointless, we need to figure out ways to not be punished for that problem, ways of our class mechanic not be totally disabled when the pet is dead and so on.

Yes, that’s where the name came from.

And you got my point exactly before and after the edit.

If you want high skill cap, you can go and play the class now, there are people out there who can make the class work. It’s just not for us common folk.

There is also a big problem with pets, if ANet says they can’t fix them and we can’t play without them we end up right where we are.

I think people want the option to play without pets because ANet failed miserably on every attempt to fix them, and many PvE features they released have core problem with pets (even if it’s just exploding the pet up in 1 blow). It seems that playing without pets is the last resort for this class ever be on par with the others.

Prysin.8542:

bri.2359:

This way Whiteside can say, they ‘tried’ but the mean and nasty ranger community derailed things because we did not ‘understand’ Anet’s ranger ‘philosophy’.

Doesnt help that they so far have refused to share their philosophy to any reasonable extent. But yes, i agree. This thread was doomed to fail, not because of how it was set up, but the resources given to it. Allie has no way to keep up with 250-300 posts pr day. Not to mention the other devs lurking around. Doesn’t help that the devs by and large is living in the US, so all of us non-US players have little chance of discussing things with them directly while their even here.

At least you can post in the same forum as the Devs. Other MMOs (coughwowcough) have separate forums and devs only respond to the North American forums.

I’m sure Allie is doing the best job she can.

I enjoy using bows, killing at range and efficient direct damage builds.

Talk about picking the wrong class!

A detail? I can probably use one hand to count ranger weapons skills that are not a dps loss compared to auto attack.

Psientist.6437:

With all due respect to Arghore or anyone else describing a permastow plus aspect buff, what they write is irrelevant. Arenanet will not support a profession with two distinct, mutually exclusive and equally complex profession mechanics.

If i remember correctly they already said they can’t fix pets because it’d affect npc AI.
If they don’t give us the choice to play without the broken mechanic we end up where we are now, having a first CDI because we REALLY need help.

petespri.6548:

I want an archer, not a pet master. Why do so many games make you think that Rangers need a pet? I want a leather-armor-arrow-slinger… and I don’t want to micro manage a zoo.

Bad news for you and I, then. We are now skirmishers, not archers, so better put your bows aside and ready your melee weapons.

Isn’t rapid fire a dps loss compared to auto attack?

+1 for Holland.9351’s post.

But I don’t know about Aoe, it feels absolutelly mandatory for WvW, at least.

Durzlla.6295:

Aioros.4862:

jcbroe.4329:

I haven’t ever seen anything that was nerfed unnecessarily, and for the most part, this a perception that is shared by people who play every other single class.

Pet damage for non beastmaster builds?
Shortbow range?
Shortbow “animation fix” mega nerf?

Key word is bolded, when SB had same range as longbow there was literally 0 reason to use the longbow, pet damage was nerfed because you could go bunker with literally 0 drawback, and SB animation fix was to make the weapon not ungodly OP, after that “mega nerf” it continued to be, and still is, one of our best weapons.

I said non beastmaster builds, the only bunker build at the time. power builds are not bunker builds and suffered the same % damage reduction to pet damage.

I don’t remember anything in bows ever being ungodly OP, and Shortbow damage is pitiful. They could also make the longbow more appealing by making it not suck, instead of making both weapons suck.

jcbroe.4329:

I haven’t ever seen anything that was nerfed unnecessarily, and for the most part, this a perception that is shared by people who play every other single class.

Pet damage for non beastmaster builds?
Shortbow range?
Shortbow “animation fix” mega nerf?

Durzlla.6295:

…

I didn’t mean ranged burst, in the middle of a bunch of people (friendly and foe) even if you see (and you probably won’t, in the middle of the mess) someone popping cooldowns, how do you know it’s you they’ll be targetting and not someone else next to you? And this is if you’re not mass stunned or feared.

That “you can use cooldowns to negate a burst combo” works in small scale pvp, but in large scale burst is king. And AoE too. We have neither.

Talking about AoE, don’t ranger aoe skills hit less targets than other classes? Like others hit 5 targets at once while our skills only hit 3?

That works well while roaming, but in a zerg single target sustained damage is nearly useless.
And no one can time any cooldown vs burst cooldowns when you don’t know where the damage is coming from.

Durzlla.6295:

They took the “unparalleled archers” thing out of there because people kept grasping at straws for why their bow should deal more damage than a warriors great sword, and why no one should be able to beat us in 1v1 ranged duels ever. Rangers aren’t purely ranged, and it’s about time they kill that stupid though process. Either way the way this, and almost every other balanced game, works is Melee does more damage than ranged, but ranged is safer and has 100% (or nearly 100%) uptime.

I don’t think i ever saw anyone saying that bows should out damage a warriors GS. Warrior/ranger bows on the other hand, yes, ranger’s bows should be better than warrior or rogue bows/rifles.

Yeah, it’s too soon to have answers, but this kind of shows how high ranger hopes are on the results of this CDI. XD

The stated Ranger Design Philosophy scares me to death.

Ranger Design Philosophy: Please keep this in mind when posting feedback.
The Ranger is a resilient profession that excels at skirmishing by drawing from nature to support themselves as well as their allies. Alongside their pet, they have some of the best single target and sustained damage that will whittle their opponents down.

I noticed they worded it very carefully to avoid mentioning bows and ranged.

Also, they seem to still be trying to find quick fixes to ranger problems, and not too fond of making core changes.

I have a bad feeling we won’t come out of this any better than before.

Allie Murdock.8152:

Ranger Design Philosophy: Please keep this in mind when posting feedback.
The Ranger is a resilient profession that excels at skirmishing by drawing from nature to support themselves as well as their allies. Alongside their pet, they have some of the best single target and sustained damage that will whittle their opponents down.

So, a new profession concept to replace the old one from the main page. I think everyone got the hint of careful wording to exclude the “unparalleled archers” line. Can we take this as devs finally admitting we are not supposed to succeed as a ranged profession?

On a more humorous note, if we cannot stow the pet permanently, can we have an option to stow the ranger? :P

Bran.7425:

Wonder what keeps delaying them?

They weren’t expecting to have to start with rangers and panicked? :P

You assume everyone will have a chance to make ascended gear, but the massive grind behind it will make a gap between those that can only log in occasionally (for reasons outside the game) and to have fun, from those who make GW2 their job.

If ascended was pve only, i wouldn’t care, but they screwed up majorly by allowing it in WvW.

I don’t want BiS, i want a leveled field in WvW, i can’t understand why they thought it was a good idea to have a leveled gearing system in SPvP but not in WvW.

It’s way worse, in my opinion.

I’ve never had more than 30G at once, i have 10G right now. If you play for 1-2 hours a day, and still have the money to buy your way through ascended, you must be flipping the TP, because i used to play every day for more than that and never managed anywhere near that much gold.

Nikaido.3457:

It is if you intend to actually stay in exotics forever.

I actually do. I’ve considered what i had to do to go for ascended, and reached the conclusion i would never get there, and above all, i already have a job, don’t need a second. Plus, i wouldn’t get paid for this one.

You seem to forget players in rares, exotic and ascended are pitted against each other.
No one is using rares in WvW unless they are recent lvl 80s or upleveled, or they like pain.

Nikaido.3457:

Aioros.4862:

Nikaido.3457:

Aioros.4862:

Are you worse or equal at pve or pvp if you’re doing more damage/surviving longer from a stat increase?

In the typical progression mmo, when you get inflated stats on your gear, mobs also follows the inflation. So if you can tank more, the mobs will also do more damage. Did you actually get stronger ? no, you grind so that you can go back to the same power level you had before the new tier of gear. It’s just a constant hamster wheel.

The same being true for pvp in another way, since the players who do care will all grind the new gear, so if you can tank more, the dps opponent in front of you can also damage more, in the end, no one gained anything from it beside wasting their time on a mindless grind.

Vertical progression is stupid and mindless.

Just look at ascended gear. Weapons do 5% more damage. But armor gives 5% damage reduction. So you grind for more damage, but then said damage gets negated by the armor grind. Two people fighting each other in ascended isn’t any different from a pure gameplay point of view as two people fighting each other in exotics.

All it does is make you do content you wouldn’t have wanted to, like grindfarm orr temples all day, so that you can keep your spot on the power curve, rather than be left behind. You’re grinding for the right to do the same thing you would have done if the grind didn’t exist, since the game doesn’t actually change, it’s only a general inflation of numbers.

Oh, i’m with you then, except on one part.

“Did you actually get stronger ?”.
Yes you did, dungeons do not scale, so you just got stronger by dealing more damage and taking less.

This is because GW2 is the only mmo in the world that introduced vertical progression without introducing actual content to follow.
You get new tiers of gear in WoW so that you complete new raids.
GW2 still has the same old instances from years ago with nothing new on the horizon.

But actually, when it comes to PVE speedruns the next balance patch is going to negate the benefits from ascended gear. 10% damage nerf for berserker builds is basically an ascended nerf. Anyone who cared about speedrunning already has ascended gear, and that nerf is going to bring them to the level of damage they used to do on exotics.

Ascended gear is an answer to the wrong question. It didn’t bring anything of worth to this game beside a mindless grind.

We grind for ascended berserker in PVE so that we can have the same power level we.. had on exotics? what a joke.

Won’t people in exotic berserker suffer the same penalty percentage? If so, ascended is still a damage upgrade.

Nikaido.3457:

Aioros.4862:

Are you worse or equal at pve or pvp if you’re doing more damage/surviving longer from a stat increase?

In the typical progression mmo, when you get inflated stats on your gear, mobs also follows the inflation. So if you can tank more, the mobs will also do more damage. Did you actually get stronger ? no, you grind so that you can go back to the same power level you had before the new tier of gear. It’s just a constant hamster wheel.

The same being true for pvp in another way, since the players who do care will all grind the new gear, so if you can tank more, the dps opponent in front of you can also damage more, in the end, no one gained anything from it beside wasting their time on a mindless grind.

Vertical progression is stupid and mindless.

Just look at ascended gear. Weapons do 5% more damage. But armor gives 5% damage reduction. So you grind for more damage, but then said damage gets negated by the armor grind. Two people fighting each other in ascended isn’t any different from a pure gameplay point of view as two people fighting each other in exotics.

All it does is make you do content you wouldn’t have wanted to, like grindfarm orr temples all day, so that you can keep your spot on the power curve, rather than be left behind. You’re grinding for the right to do the same thing you would have done if the grind didn’t exist, since the game doesn’t actually change, it’s only a general inflation of numbers.

Oh, i’m with you then, except on one part.

“Did you actually get stronger ?”.
Yes you did, dungeons do not scale, so you just got stronger by dealing more damage and taking less.
Then the worst offender, WvW, you deal more damage, take less and you’ll be against many many people who will be in full exotic gear because the grind is so ridiculous to some it’s just not possible to get there (my case), or because they got tired of their mains and want to go on alts, or because they want to try new builds.

Are you worse or equal at pve or pvp if you’re doing more damage/surviving longer from a stat increase?

silvermember.8941:

There is a reason why MMORPG =/= RPG. If you hate grind don’t play an MMORPG.

What part of Guildwars 2 being announced pre launch as an MMORPG without grinds are you failing to grasp?

Now it has the mother of all grinds i’ve ever seen, and it’s mandatory if you want to be sure pvp will be skill based as much possible.