Guild Wars 2

Just like you, I’m having loads of fun with it. I’ve also noticed block being quite an issue for thief to fight against . Maybe that’s something that could be added to debiltiating arc. I think it would make sense to have an animation where you’d rather push yourself away from the target with your whole body anyway rather then what the animation looks like right now…. so it would make sense to break his block I guess (legs on his chest/arms kind of thing)

But this could become overpowered perhaps ? At any rate it would be only in the case of daredevil staff so it’s not really an overall solution I guess.

And… since all those classes have been given a lot of blocks, I don’t see why we wouldn’t have something against it.

Just like stealth and reveal.

I’m using Staff Daredevil in PvP (with soldier amulet and the daredevil rune) and I enjoy it very much.

The 2 3 4 slot skills feel like they would need some improvement however and the elite skill would be better if it started right away with the second stage as I find myself prevented from using it effectively far too often by either the downed state abilities themselves or other players.

By the looks of it however.. people will complain a lot about vault which is pretty much one of the main things that makes it viable, at least for me. If that skill will get nerfed… and the others don’t change for the better… I fear it won’t be viable anymore.

Impact.2780:

I would see the following:

Make baseline:
- Preparedness (+1)
- Bountiful Theft

Preparedness is debatable… but I’m positive Bountiful Theft is not a good balancing idea to have as baseline at any rate.

Impact.2780:

Nerf:
- Vault: Reduce damage by 15-20%

Buff:
- Dust Strike creates a smoke field
- Reveal lasts 3 seconds
- Black Powder costs 5 initiative
- Cloak and Dagger costs 5 initiative
- Withdraw: apply the promised and apparently forgotten healing increase

I think Vault is perfect for what it’s worth, nerfing it will greatly damage the intent of the staff daredevil playstile in my opinion.

I don’t support dust strike creating any smoke field. Staff is not about active stealth use at all. You might want to use it through weapon swapping if you want to insist on a different playstile imo.

My only suggestion for dust strike would be at most a slight increase in range, only slightly. It has it’s uses if you know well your opponents… by no means it’s a spammable skill tho.

You can spec the dodge out and in again in the trait line and it works again. But it is indeed a bug and looking forward to it getting fixed.

I find staff daredevil very enjoyable so far. It has access to a few of the things I’ve been looking for when I’ve first picked up the class. The possibility to have a bit of stunlock and it still keeps a good deal of mobility coupled with incredibly good dodging.

For those of you that feel underwhelmed by it I suggest you try to do what the daredevil rune silently says, forget about zerker meta for a minute. You will be pleasantly surprised !

Most importantly… I feel like I have a very good chance against any profession without dying in one second….while also leaving a lot of space for personal improvement !

Petoox.6570:

I didn’t even get recipe from completeing my Daredevil, luckily, check out Laurel Vendor, they sell you your Daredevil recipes for 1 Laurel + 8 silver and 64 copper.

Many thanks for the information ^^

I got dragonhunter too… and I really wanted to test out the daredevil one. It was kind of a build enabler for me. I hope they fix it soon :c

glaphen.5230:

Revengeance.8956:

Might I ask…. How does the daredevil 6th rune effect work ? Is the “attack” considered to be a full chain on a skill or just one of the hits that will cause damage?

For instance… If one’s using fist flurry after a dodge roll….will all hits critically strike or just the first one in the chain ?

One hit per dodge.

Oh kitten …it might have had some seriously good applications with more defensive/endurance oriented builds without the need to pick up actual crit chance. I wonder if it would work anyway….with vault at least.

Might I ask…. How does the daredevil 6th rune effect work ? Is the “attack” considered to be a full chain on a skill or just one of the hits that will cause damage?

For instance… If one’s using fist flurry after a dodge roll….will all hits critically strike or just the first one in the chain ?

Chazz.6709:

You mean to “controll” the event or being the enemy for the other ones ?

Being the enemy for the other ones, yes. From start to finish.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

its an interesting thought. I suspect the problem would be people who take that boss forms just to troll the event. (Just standing there and not fighting or getting out of reach and staying out of reach is 2 I can think of offhand).

Hmm… you are indeed right. I believe there could be things done to prevent that tho. Like I’ve mentioned… having other players to aid this boss would not only make it more interesting for the fight but it would also make it possible to report the player in the position of the boss if he refuses to play accordingly. And of course…. the loot at the end of whoever wins will be the “usual” incentive to win.

I also think there should be some sort of ranking system… or maybe how WvW has commanders… that could prevent players from going boss mode to do unwanted things.

Of course, players also shouldn’t be able to join versus specific groups of players they know since they might use it as an unfair farming tool and so on, thus the implementation of a random joiner tool would be necessary for this type of event, I think.

As for staying out of reach, the boss itself could have a “hidden dome” around himself just like the add players so that he won’t be able to do wildly unintended things.

BBMouse.6510:

Not bad. It’s actually a type of pvp mode (1vX). You could put a boss arena inside pvp arena. 1 player plays the boss while other X players against it. X can be as big as 100. Might be some interesting experience for the one playing the boss and the zerg would be fighting an intel boss. Imagine you play kittenter and the zerg not would be complaining about auto attack its right hand anymore. It would be wiping the zerg instead XD.

Towards a mode where a player would be a bigger boss and have that kind of devastating ability. I think it should be a slow reacting type of ability that can be evaded… in that case however I think the add players should be geared with lots of ways to control the enemy so that they do get hit by them if not paying enough attention.

Would definitely love to have something like that !

I’ve been randomly thinking today at what would make my experience of this game (or any in general) more enjoyable given the fact that most MMO’s have…. a lot of things in common that may cause extreme boredom at times.

One of them was this…

What if we could get a type of game mode in the future where one player becomes a boss for the duration of the event (a legendary hero, an awesome mordrem teragriff, or who knows what else !) , maybe have a few other players alongside as adds that will be behind some energy domes to prevent them from participating before the boss reaches a certain ammount of hp, maybe even be brought back in the domes (similarly to how mordrem vines get you outside the walls) if needed and so on.

If you are in favor of something like that or have similar ideas that could build on this, It would be nice to hear them !

Doggie.3184:

BrunoBRS.5178:

i love the bifrost, but it just doesn’t fit the thief theme (unless you’re going for a bifrost/dreamer double rainbow combo). as for nevermore… it’s a really cool staff, just not for melee. i mean, it’s a freaking twig.

so… i’d say bifrost, if only because it looks like something you could beat people up with, rather than something that would at most scratch their eyes and mildly annoy cattle.

But it has high Elemental, Impact, Slash and Puncture damage all in one weapon with all those sturdy branches and shinies. Getting slapped around with it would be painful.

Plus you can sneak up on people and shove a giant stick up their…

Silly man, you can’t trigger berserker mod with it… it’s useless !

BlackBunny.3681:

Neither…. I dont think either of them fit as a melee wep. No idea why they released another caster staff when they just implemented 2 melee staff users.

Share your feeling there.

I’ve been wondering, how come there’s the option to change the color on your armor sets (which is great) and nothing like that for weapons ?

I understand some of them might be too complex for that, but many of them aren’t and there are a lot like that which have ok, good or even great models but I feel like I don’t want to use their skin due to color preference and incompatibility with my armor color choice or my personal preference.

Anyone else feeling the same ?

I thought about this as well… but apparently most people are ok with how it is. Well I guess that’s because most people don’t really try to main the ranged ones…. which is understandable right now.

These were my thoughts a while ago https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Steal-Ability-suggestions-problems/first#post5586770

My concern as well, being the main ability of this profession… you’d think it should work well with all weapons right ? I was thinking more we could have different skill choices on a same cooldown for this ability. This way it wouldn’t hurt any other weapon, at most give it another choice that might or might not be the best giving the fact they share cooldowns and you might need the gap closer instead in the next 5 seconds or so haha.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Steal-Ability-suggestions-problems/first#post5586770

Unless maybe if all stealth abilities would be more geared towards utility rather then raw damage which I’d personally prefer much more. That’s an interesting idea to be honest.

messiah.1908:

Revengeance.8956:

messiah.1908:

simple solution is to make #2 of the pistol a leap p/p will use it with #5 to stealth if needed to reposition or disengage

Like somebody else has mentioned through these threads…. this won’t work well for p/p because most of it’s damage comes from Unload unlike the other build’s much more potent auto-attacks.

stealth give you the ability to reposition fast and sneak attack which does mini unload and doesnt cost initiative
without stealth we are easy target

What you are saying is true, but I don’t think the idea of P/P is to be like D/P where you rely heavily on stealth, in fact the new changes they brought to daredevil traits and the ones currently in testing are showing clearly just that intention.

And with the new buff to damage on Unload I think there should be a better utility use/need for the stealth skill for P/P (how sword has for example a daze). Just another mini-unload doesn’t seem all that great for this set to be honest.

messiah.1908:

simple solution is to make #2 of the pistol a leap p/p will use it with #5 to stealth if needed to reposition or disengage

Like somebody else has mentioned through these threads…. this won’t work well for p/p because most of it’s damage comes from Unload unlike the other build’s much more potent auto-attacks.

I bought it and I drank a full glass. T-T

Arctarius.2649:

What happened to high risk high reward?? Thief has become high risk no reward over the last year.. It’s very annoying and I feel sorry for any of your new players that roll thief, they have no idea but they have just entered the jungle for real by doing so.

Hey there, I happen to be in the situation you have just described here. Not long ago I decided to try this game out as it became free to play. It’s progression system, which I’ve never seen anywhere else to be as efficient and feel so painless but still remaining a grind with more reward to those that go through it to some extent has certainly caught me in. Bought the next expansion and rolled as a Thief after reading it’s general description being “They’re deadly in one-on-one combat using their agility”.

Naturally, I was expecting to be much less efficient in group combat then any other profession, I was prepared for that and it felt like a tradeoff like in any other game perhaps. What I found instead tho was that I was extremely inefficient at both no matter what skill level X player/profession I was faced with so far.

I know a lot of you guys have much more experience with this profession and have played it for quite a while, nevertheless I think my opinion has a different type of value, “the fresh newcomer that has not seen the past and evolution of this proffesion that won’t suggest things to be brought back” kind of value (like this “Ricochet” I kept hearing about for example which did seem like something that didn’t need to be on this profession to start with since it’s against it’s 1v1 nature to be honest except maybe for the increased range part of it if it did have something like that)

Personally, I think a lot of the inconveniences with this profession also come from the fact that a lot of Traits focus on improving the Steal ability too much instead of focusing on the general profession.

Imagine all the traits that improve this ability taken out, can you see the free space there ?

Honestly I think either Steal needs to gain a different functionality for this profession instead of just being another gap closer (from my point of view thief already has enough of that and pretty much every other profession I’ve seen has much better class abilities.) OR … just remove whatever traits are associated with it and increase the general efficiency of this profession.

Just my opinion.

Since this profession hasn’t met my expectations in the slightest, if daredevil also won’t meet them, I’ll be forced to reroll.

rennlc.7346:

Making steal less important would make thief easier to play, but it’s also one of the most rewarding abilities to use when players improve their timing and start recognizing the tells for when they should use or prepare to use steal. For example, if you’re +1ing a d/d ele your team is pressuring and he hasn’t dodged in the 3-5 seconds that have passed while you’re getting in range to strike, he’s probably going to use a dodge soon and you should wait for it.

Even with ranged weapons, it’s incredibly helpful. With p/p, thieves currently need steal to CC and get on top of players who counter their bursty range damage by LoSing. They also can save it to interrupt someone attempting to rez someone they’ve just downed with unload spam. With short bow, a player can time steal with the slight delay of the cluster bomb animation to port to a player and quickly hit them with a detonated clusterbomb. (Thieves who regularly duel other thieves use this latter maneuver a lot because it’s an almost instantaneous way of delivering a significant blow against squishy classes.)

That’s true… it still has some use even for a ranged character, mentioned one myself. But…. that wasn’t the problem.

The problem is It doesn’t have enough use as it stands for it to be a profession ability and to be as versatile as the profession itself and as the benefits you gain through passive traits for it.

For example… Endurance Thief trait in Daredevil.

As it stands right now… aside from granting the usage of the staff, this will be the trait line that will enable a much more viable usage of range weapons in PvP scenarios as far as I can tell. With that specific trait being a minor….. how does that come into play?

Will one be able to use this skill for that specific purpose it received through that minor trait ? Don’t think so, no. But sure… as a melee… it looks fine since you can always use a bit more endurance alongside with it’s main usage of closing in for example.

What I’m trying to say is that I can’t possibly think of this skill as being only a gap closer when it’s forced upon me with other really good effects as well that really have nothing to do in particular with closing the gap between me and another player. (except Sleight of Hand perhaps ~ but that is much more of a choice rather then a forced minor trait)

It however can be considered a forced pick by some even in a Major Trait line when there are no other as good options in that line.

And again…. In some cases the stolen skill you gain through steal is only usable or of any use in melee range only

Example:
-> Guardian- Mace Head Crack -170 range 3 second Daze -- Great usage on a melee character, you can use it whenever you need it… but for a range pick can be used only immediately after closing the gap with the main ability… and as soon as it gets removed…. you are in far greater danger.

-> Elementalist – Ice Shard Stab -170 range 10 second chill and some damage -- Again not bad for a melee …. and again.. not so great for a range focused character.

All that being said I still think that Steal Needs to be more versatile. Either the way I’ve mentioned it in my first post on 2) or some other way.

I have to start off by saying this is my opinion only, if you don’t agree with it… that’s fine.

The first problem I see with this main ability of the profession is that there are far too many augmentations to this specific skill (some of which can’t be avoided).

What does this cause in turn?

A great disadvantage if it fails to land OR if you can’t use it as frequently (or can’t use it at all) as it’s augmentations demand.

While it can still work for most melee builds in it’s current state…. for ranged options such as pistol/pistol or shortbow is at most a finisher gap-closer for the new Impact Strike elite skill.

What I personally think that can be done could go two ways…

1) Consider this profession’s ability a “lesser ability” , compared to any other profession’s ability (which by default… at least in my eyes… already seems to some extent as a lesser ability) ….. and…. instead of having so many forced augments to it…. replace those augments in each respective trait lines with more important benefits for each respective specialization, in such a way that it makes up for having the main ability being less important then it’s counterpart in other professions.

This way it can still have a purpose for any build yet it isn’t forced on the player that he should use it at all times because it does so many things. Things that he might’ve never even wanted to pick up for that specific ability in the first place. Things such as minor traits on which I have no choice but to take.

2) Change Steal in such a way that it is a viable option no matter the choice of weapon.

How it should be changed, you might ask. There are probably a lot of ways to change it, and I’d love to see more opinions on what everyone else thinks what could be this change. For now I’ll offer my simplest of opinions based on my personal gaming experience from other games and such.

The simplest, least impactfull, most versatile change to steal that I can think of would be to not change Steal at all. Let’s face it…. it’s pretty difficult to change an ability that defines the profession’s name itself.

Instead … there should be added a second ability that shares cooldown with the original Steal…. Let’s call it “Steal 2” for now. How this ability should work is debatable….. but somewhere between these two might be a decent idea:

-> throw a hook at your foe and steal from them.
-> evade backwards as you steal from your foe.

Personally I think a combination of both 1) and 2) are required. But if you really want to keep that big of a focus on the Thief being a Thief…. 2) should suffice if done properly. (being unblockable for example)

Swiftwynd.1685:

DresdenAllblack.1249:

Bah, 1 second block better get a bump or that skill will grow dust from lack of use.

You do know its a block and a knockdown and damage skill and a stunbreak on a loooooow recharge right? Its one of our strongest utility skills.

It is indeed a strong skill but then again it can knockdown only targets in your melee range, so unless you’re planning to go full in with it in a 1200 ranged character’s face it’s only a 1 sec block and stunbreak. That’s what it is that I don’t really like about this build tbh, while phys utility skills do have great synergy with endurance gain and have pretty nice effects…. they’re still melee range which goes against the idea of being exactly a mid-range build.

While I do think this build will be pretty good against a melee… in a very counter/reactive way, I don’t see it as good looking against ranged professions. Just my opinion… might very well be wrong (I hope so) … but I don’t think it has enough utility to get close enough without dying while trying to do so. And given the nature of Bandit’s Defense and Fist Flurry, you’d probably want to be in melee range rather then mid-range against a ranged profession.

I can’t really imagine the Condi P/P part with only auto’s and bleed that doesn’t even synergise with almost anything else from the traits as far as I can tell (if it were a poison however it would’ve been a different case) but…. P/P Daredevil certainly looks like it will be a thing and I’m excited for it.

I was wondering however… how does everyone feel about Steal for daredevil…. being still…. the thief Steal…. a close-in skill for a mid-ranged character that will reward you with melee range skills in certain situations doesn’t sound really useful to me. I don’t know…. it feels a bit … dodgy (get it? I’m terrible sorry)

Since this new elite spec is the only thing that makes ranged play viable for thiefs…. I believe it should also come with a counterpart for Steal. However since it also comes with the option of playing staff…. it’s a difficult call as in what it should be exactly.

How do you feel about it ?

I know that Thief as a Ranged combatant doesn’t seem to be the focus of almost anyone talking on the forums about Thief ….however I think the Daredevil specialization looks like a great trait line towards Pistol/Pistol and Shortbow builds. Most people might ignore that when they say the dash dodge isn’t as useful… and it definitely isn’t as useful for melee combatants…. it looks great for a ranged type imo.

However…. I think what’s truly missing is some sort of change to the special class trait like every other class gets. I think there should be some sort of change to Steal. This would be the best opportunity to have a different option for steal (which also doesn’t even fit the “daredevil” anymore imo) that would make sense for those kind of builds as well but also needs to remain somehow reliable for the new staff weapon. If anyone has a suggestion for that it would be great to hear !

Again… I think it’s a big big chance to fix older problems from the past with this new elite spec. I also believe a small change to it wouldn’t suffice…. if it functions mostly as it is right now… even if say the ability itself will do a dodge or evade backwards from a target instead of closing in…. or something similar, the stealing factor of it would still generate a skill that will have the need to be used in melee range (in most cases) …. which again makes it highly unreliable.

A rework of some of the skills on the range side wouldn’t be a bad idea either. (like the auto-attack on the pistol for example… it should at the very least have poison rounds instead of bleeding targets so it works better with other traits available) but this last part is a bit off-topic for this particular thread.