Showing Posts For Revilo G.4352:
Fast hands will not be baseline as it is the key trait of discipline but instead the default warrior weapon swap cooldown should be reduced to 7 or 8 secs. The reduction will somewhat reduce the drawback of not traiting into discipline.
Discipline is the trait line tied to weapon swapping and as well as a focus on finishing off your target. A 2-3 second faster swap time from a base of 7-8 seconds best represents this.
The Arms traitline needs to add more incentives for players to use hybrid builds. The abundance of adrenaline gain and traits like, Unsuspecting Foe, Signet Mastery, Dual Wielding, Burst Precision, suggest that Arms is intended to be a full condition or hybrid traitline. My sugguestion here are meant to provide viability to alternative hybrid builds, while not strengthening pure condition as I feel they are in a good spot at the moment.
Grandmaster:
Burst Precision
I agree with you that being in Arms traitline, Burst Precision is not as desirable. I feel that it should also provide a minor benefit depending on how much adrenaline the warrior has when they hit with a burst skill. I don’t have any specific ideas but it could be something that could have value to s/rifle, s/hammer, s/greatsword and etc. We could rename it to something like “Brutal Precision”..
Dual Wielding:
I have a lot of interest in Dual Wielding as I’ve always wanted a sword/x, axe/x build that could work. I also feel that the new Dual Wielding is still lackluster as well. It should provide enough incentives for players to build around that trait while still offer flexibility to use with a variety of setups. This trait is very focused(unlike Furious), it could afford to be a bit more potent.
Besides offhand sword, the other offhands lack in damage, utlities
+15-20% attack speed when wielding an offhand axe, mace, or sword
-15-20% Axe, mace, sword offhand recharge (does not stack)
When swapping to an offhand axe, mace or sword gain 2-3 adrenaline. (Optional)
+5% damage when wielding offhand axe, mace, or sword
Master traits:
In order to compete against Blademaster, the other two traits should be altered to assist in a variety of builds. With my suggestions, Blademaster and Opportunist are the general use traits, while Rending Strikes will be the hybrid specific.
Rending Strikes:
Allows player to maintain condition pressure when using a utility or switching to weapon that causes 4 or more stacks of vulnerability (in one skill). I know this is very similar to Body Blow, but by theme and functionality we could afford to allow it. This directly benefits rifle, mainhand axe, offhand mace, “on my mark” and possibly mainhand mace if they can increase the vulnerability on Sundering Mace.
You have a 33% chance to gain swiftness and cause vulnerability on a critical hit.
Bleed (3 stacks, 7 secs) a foe whenever you inflict 4 or more stacks of vulnerability with one skill. Cooldown: X secs.
Opportunist:
I like the theme of this trait, and without making every trait bloated I feel that some as simple as this can be interesting. This is a more active approach to gaining swiftness compared to random chance.
Gain fury when you immobilize a target. (10 sec cooldown)
Gain 4-6? seconds of swiftness when you cripple a target. (10-15 sec cooldown)
@ronpierce: I was going to post something similar to what you posted but you have expressed it better than I ever would have.
Fast hands is critical for pvp and harder content, but making it baseline would be too strong. With the baselining of fast hands, the appeal of not traiting into discipline will be greater than ever as you can spec more offensively, defensively or a very strong balance. Builds like shoutbow would end up even stronger with the new system in place.
Instead of asking of Fast hands as baseline, we could probably look at changing the baseline weapon recharge of warriors to 8 and have Fast hands reduce it further to the 5 seconds we have now. In addition, adding a new minor mechanic to it to make up for the loss. This compromise will still make discipline desirable while giving back a warrior some of the ferocity that Fast hands represents without traiting discipline. This change “might” even make Rune of the Warrior a bit more appealing..
Sorry for the late response. I like the idea winshmo is suggesting as I believe it is unlikely that the devs will allow ‘cleansing ire’ to trigger without adrenline lost, even though I also want it to trigger either way. It maybe a sizable nerf to consume all adrenaline when their burst is missed but it would give room for improving areas ArenaNet is reluctant to change. The increased risk (nerf) would mean our adrenaline gain and traits would need to improve. New trait ideas and effects would be more viable for them to add, as it will be more easier to introduce new mechanics that tie into adrenaline.
Lastly, I know these strength ideas may not be good or appealing to most player, but there is one idea I would like some feedback on. I feel that adding a trait that allows physical skills to stun break would make the strength traits more usable. It adds a bit of unpredictability for fighting against such warrior.
Physical Training:
Physical utility skills do 100% more damage and recharge 20% faster.
Physical skills break stun.
Strength Traits:
Strength is now one of the weaker warrior trait line as our trait points are better spent on traits that provide warriors with the proper utilities. Merging or replacing the lackluster traits would be the best route to go, but for this thread I will try to improve on them instead. Adding effects that deal with conditions and adrenaline usage in theme of warrior’s “strength” would be ideal.
Death from Above
-Nothing to add. The trait has its uses.
Restorative Strength:
Using a heal skill removes crippled, chilled, immobilize, and weakness.
When a heal skill is used, gain the following based on the bars of adrenaline when activated:
1 bars of Adrenaline: 3 seconds of vigor.
2 bars of Adrenaline: 5 seconds of vigor
3 bars of Adrenaline: 7 seconds of vigor
-This skill could benefit from being linked to a warrior’s adrenaline level.
Great Fortitude:
10% of power is given as a bonus to vitality.
-This trait doesn’t really offer much and could be replaced with something better. Changing the 5% to 7-10% could be of some interest as warriors need every little bit of health they have.
Powerful Banners:
Banners do damage and knockback when summoned.
Recharge banners if adrenaline is full and after a foe dies within 300 range; 95s Cooldown. Does not recharge Battle Standard. Activating the recharged banner removes any active banner (Can’t have more than one of the same type).
-Even as one of the worst warrior traits, I feel that it could still do something if we pushed its theme further. A knockback effect along with it’s damage would give it extra utility outside of regular banner usage. Adding a recharge function to banners may not fix its flaws, but may allow for some usage.
Short Temper:
Gain 2 stacks of might for 5 seconds and 1 strike of adrenaline each time you are blocked.
When an inflicted blind ends from causing an attack to miss, gain blind immunity for 5 seconds. X sec cooldown.
Gain fury for 5 seconds when weakened. X sec cooldown.
-This is one of those conditional trait that does not offer much for warriors needs. If we are to add some more conditional or condition removal/ignoring effects, we can probably see some viability in this depending on the meta.
Dual Wielding:
-Nothing to add. The trait has its uses.
Physical Training:
Physical utility skills do 100% more damage and recharge 20% faster.
Physical skills break stun.
-I find this a very interesting trait, but like others we can’t afford to sacrifice our stability/stun break/condition removal for improved cc. If stun breaks via traits were given to physical skills, the lesser used physical skills could see some usage in some player’s slots.
Distracting Strikes (Renamed to Bully):
Apply confusion when you interrupt a foe. (5 stacks at 8 seconds)
Damage is increased by 5% to foes with 10 or more stacks of confusion.
-Distracting strikes takes up an important major trait slot for improving the strength line. This skill needs to be improved enough that it should be able to supplement builds with the adequate amount of CC but lacking the condition damage. Since warriors are not really good at covering their conditions this can be removed rather easily…
Axe Mastery:
-Nothing to add. The trait has its uses.
Slashing Power:
-Nothing to add. The trait has its uses.
Berserker’s Power
-Nothing to add. The trait has its uses.
Berserker’s Might (Renamed to Berserker’s Rage)
Generate three strikes of adrenaline every three seconds while in combat.
Burst skills grant swiftness for 5 seconds if it hits and breaks stun on activation.
All Burst skills lose all adrenaline on misses.
-These changes should make this skill more interesting, as this introduces a riskier play style. 1 bar burst may be used more often due to the stun break capabilities.
selan: It doesn’t necessarily punish people from running with a large group, and it is not like you can’t go into environmental effects with a zerg. It just requires bit more finesse and coordination to split up then reform after passing through.
Yenn: Lower tier is certainly interesting , but I am pretty content in my current server.
Peetee: I would love to see that. Nevermind.. for some reason i didn’t see the “supervisor buff”…
iiMulch: Maybe my original post wasn’t as clear. Purpose of the environment effects is to spread player around more evenly, to promote the defense/raiding of objectives. It is still large scale WvW but things will be happening everywhere simultaneously. You will still need large groups to accomplish thing even with this system but the need of a mega zerg will not be as necessary.
A thing people need to understand with my idea is that environmental effects are not entirely in your way, the route to all objectives is generally open and clear. Environment effects just happen to be on the sides and outlying areas. It should also be noted that such system would introduce new tactics for large guild groups. What’s stopping guilds from forming a couple of small groups to hunt others (groups that work in unison but keep their distances from each other.).
(edited by Revilo G.4352)
CreativeAnarchy: I can understand your reservation on this idea, I still feel this idea could possibly change things for the better but having been with ArenaNet since Guild Wars, we all know what the results would be. Even with altering the idea without such a bias towards zergs, it could make for some interesting mechanics.
It was wrong of me to dump so many idea out at one time as there is still a few ideas I want to explore/discuss. The outmannded/NPC suggestions and Randomly Generated Security are ideas I am wondering what people think of them. It is not fun playing against servers with large populations and wide time zone coverage on all maps. This would at least give the dominating servers some resistance and larger window for weaker servers to move about.
CreativeAnarchy: I happen to like zergs (despite the theme of my original post) but I mainly want to change how they flow. I just feel they function a little too lite for something so powerful.
The reason I had environmental effects work in such way is that it is hard to implement a good environment system. It is not easy to create a sense of difficult terrain with the way things work in GW2. Your suggestion of physical obstacles is certainly good though, but I feel there isn’t any other options to slow down a zerg. We definitely can’t use collusion-detection in players as that would be disastrous to implement and would cause even more problems.
What I want is to simulate the bulkiness of a zerg, because physically a large mass of individuals should make travel difficult with. I am simply making areas less accessible to them and not giving them something absurd like a global speed debuff for zergs. Environments like a swamp should be difficult to travel in, which is why I had them simulated in such way (a non-intuitive way but it is at least an attempt).
Forgive me, I don’t see how you are forced to do something, as you do not have to chase after groups that utilize these environments. The environments is a somewhat of a risk vs rewards systems anyways. Fleeing and pursuing groups could even up stuck together if they happen to be too close as the environmental system does not discriminate against servers.
Niim: I agree that large complex changes/idea never see the light of day in fan suggestions, I was certainly bored before I started writing about this idea. It was a fun exercise for me since I haven’t written much after finishing school years and years ago.
I honestly feel that some of these ideas would change a lot. Players can play in a small groups with more confidence as they will have a larger window to work with. Underground travel and environment zones allow small groups to escape, annoy, flank, and even reconnect with zergs. With the increased harassment from small parties, zerg numbers will diminish when they are forced cover multiple objectives.
Rewarding small parties is a good ‘must have’ first step, but like you said it will offer “no real balance impact”. If we give them the tools and the rewards, then it would be guaranteed that it will change how they play.
Lordrosicky:Which is why small parties need to be empowered with tools to make it worth it. Players don’t like to be wiped by a zerg, so by giving them the ability to slip pass one will certainly promote people to play in smaller groups.
CreativeAnarchy: Yes, most of these ideas penalize zergs, but there is not enough to reward smaller parties. Zergs no matter what size, has and will continue to play a pivotal role WvW, environmental effects simply acts as stop signs spike strips. The bulk of a larger map with environmental effects will still be open-field. Zergs will evolve to be more modular over time. The end result would make large guild groups much more interesting as they can splinter in to small groups to wreak havoc and form back up when brute force is required.
Note: Not that anyone would be interested, I don’t hate zergs. I play in a tier 2 server and 70% of the time I play in a zerg.
Visual and Aural Improvements:
Improvements in visual and aural aspects of WvW could make the game not only more livelier but to also add functionable gameplay mechanics. In PvE such addition would certainly be desirable but the subtle effects will be wasted as most players will miss it or simply don’t care. In WvW, such crucial clues allow player to react without checking the map or waiting for typed response. * Player tags in zergs are too overwhelming, they should be shortened and appear more muted. They should still be visible enough to gauge numbers in zergs though.
- Players should show up at extreme distances as 2d sprites so vantage points could be useful.
- A zerg should create a lot noise, so it should generate distinct sounds when approaching from a distance. Perhaps some dust can be added as a zerg travels or when in a massive clash, dust can be seen high in the air at a distance.
- Damaged towers/keeps should emit smoke trails into the sky. Small fires should be seen.
- Some effects should be subtle, like bubbles from a small raiding party waiting under a river for an inattentive zerg passing by.
- Enviro-effects would need status notification as well as visual and aural clues as the players will need to see and feel the intensifying effects. IE: when underground players see falling debris/slight screen movement/sounds; when in a swamp players see the dark water shift and change, and characters change to a temporary color when knocked down in the swamp.
- Cave entrances should indicate movement inside when any movement or battle happens near the entrance. Larger events would cause bats to fly out for a period of time. A large trigger zone a few secs into the cave would work. Generic sounds with different levels will be ideal.
- Caves should be hard to see, not dark as in the player having to turn up the gamma, but as in the objects at a distance should be clouded or barely visible( tags will not show up). Spots along the cavern will have an eternally lit light source like torch or plant(If stealth is an issue the light will cause REVEALED to players). (3)
- Sound bounces underground, so varying generic running and battle sounds of different levels will echo from it’s source, with this the lone roamers venture more cautiously in this underground labyrinth.
(1)These environmental effects do not have to function like in real life, they could have special properties since WvW is in the Mists. Also different maps can different set of rules and themes.
(2)These are ideas I feel may not be as critical for the balance of WvW but nonetheless interesting mechanics to have implemented.
(3)Might be a controversial idea as it can be annoying to balance with stealth and thieves…
Thanks for reading and please forgive my terrible writing. Comment/Criticisms?
Secondary WvW Ideas (Standalone Compatible):(3)
Outmanned Improvements
This will tie in with the NPCs we have in game. When one side is OUTMANNED, they will be able to recruit extra npcs to harass the enemy’s camps/towers. The number and extra benefits the NPCs offer will depend on how outmanned the weaker server is compared to the server they are using the NPCs against. When the skewing of balance reaches maximum capacity, special NPC champions with siege engine capabilities can be recruited. If the dominant server does not bother defending, these upscaled and numerous NPCs should be able to take down camps and tower if given time(towers with player interaction). When population starts to return, the NPC numbers will scale back to normal (they run back home) and any special benefits will end.
NPC Improvements
- Outmanned servers recruit NPCs with lesser effort
- Non-outmanned servers require more effort to recruit NPCs against outmanned ones
- If the population is too unbalanced some NPCs will be hostile towards the dominating server for a set amount of time before it re-checks.
- If the two server are both outmanned considerably, and have lost almost all objectives, they can recruit NPCs for a simultaneous breakout event (with the aid of recruited NPC allies).
- Some Npcs will not need you to fight for them, instead you provide supply for their services.
- Example benefits, skritt will raid and steal supply from supply camps and yaks, quaggan could summon weather effects like lighting strikes and ‘Heavy Fog’.
Randomly Generated Security
Ghost capping? Well not so much. The Asuran have created a device which they proclaim to summon “infinite number” of defenders for a tower/keep besieged when everyone is out for lunch. This is a somewhat expensive upgrade for towers/keep that randomly summons 3-5 registered test subjects into the tower/keep when the door is being damaged. The system takes into account how long the perpetrators are at the door and if there 2 or less defender for it to activate. After activating, the device will start it’s XXsec cooldown phase and will require a possibly large amount of supply to startup again. Interested individuals should go see their nearest hill, border or citadel to sign up to be placed into a queue at a yet to be announced price. When chosen, the individuals will be prompted and provided they are not in combat, will take 8 secs to be destroyed and rebuilt at the desired but random location. The authorities have yet to determine the time individuals are registered for and unfortunately if it expires or player changes maps, no refund. Note:The important thing about this is that it does not replace active sentries as they can constantly provide intel on zerg movement and provide first line defense.
Minor Defensive structures [guard post, guard tower].
Completely destroyable/repairable. Can be captured but not counted for points. May upgrade to have a defensive siege like a cannon with a faster build time or have additional guards.
Bridges:
Primarily for best access to certain objectives on the map, alternative routes will be through enviro-affected areas. These serve as the main form of access for zergs and targets for small specialized groups. These structures require quite a bit of manpower and supplies to repair if destroyed. NPCs could be recruited to attack these locations. Outmanned servers could destroy these with greater ease with the aid of NPCs.
Other Environment changes/additions
Water system overview:
The water combat in GW2 feel pointless in WvW, as it is almost no different from fighting on land but with limited abilities. Water should be a means for stealthy travel and access to special routes or even act as a barrier.. It should cloak/camouflage (can’t see tags) players swimming low enough on a river bed, while an observer on the surface should see them if they are close enough. Players underwater will see each normally without any cloaking/camouflage. Underground water routes could provide exclusive access to specific allies like quaggan. Some routes may lead to the underground caverns. Flowing water could be implemented to make destroyable bridges viable (something more elegant than the way it works in SAB). Water also needs to provide more penalties such as group reviving effectiveness halved and mobility debuff.
Underground cavern/tunnel system overview:
- Gave up writing.. point form now
- Underground tunnels accessible from all parts of the map, entrances will be surrounded by enviro-effects. Some small ponds or lakes may have an underground entrance to serve as supply line ambush locations.
- The underground will have a few moderate volume caverns, height will not be too much as primary game play should be on the surface. Lots of interconnecting tunnels of walkways.
- All areas underground should have a purpose, be it for ambush, hiding, or even special npcs
- Some area will have entrances/passages that change due to time, player interaction or NPC’s service
- Perhaps players can sabotage the foundation under a keep to weaken walls? Too tired to elaborate on this one
- The underground caverns will be one of the main choices for NPC recruitment, there will be skritt, dredge, quaggan(underwater passages) and even destroyers (indirectly helping you though). Some NPCs could have rival groups of same or different race.
Overview
As many players feel or have felt, WvW is getting a bit stale. The power of zerging and limited environmental interaction has left many players burnout as there lacks the depth needed for long term enjoyment. With upcoming MMOs like Elder Scrolls Online and Camelot Unchained, Guild Wars 2 will be faced with some stiff competition in the near future and on.
Of the many issues WvW has, I feel the main one that needs addressing at the moment is improving the role of small groups. This directly relates to zergs as empowering smaller parties will help diminish the massive zergs thus improving combat. One way to help smaller groups is by making the environment provide a benefit other than visual graphics. By allowing smaller groups to utilize the environment, we can ensure guerilla tactics becoming viable. While some of ideas here may not be very feasible or even clunky, the key idea is simply let guerilla warfare work in WvW in some way or form.
Examples of environmental effects:(1)
Difficult Terrain [swamps/mud]:
- Lowers mobility, debuff intensifies when in a big group. The stacks increases when in 600 range proximity to another player/enemies. These are non-condition based effects, overrides similar effects from conditions.
- When a player reaches a certain amount of stacks of the debuff, getting knocked down will cause a chain effect to nearby players/enemies (50% chance and 8 sec cooldown)
- Smaller groups generally pass through with little mobility lost.
- Some areas with Difficult Terrain can cause poison or confusion.
- Group revive effectiveness halved
- No deployment of siege weapons within this area.
Unstable Terrain [rocky grounds/cliffs/snowy mountainous areas]:
- May cause disruptive effects and falling boulders and debris.
- Effects intensify as more players move or fight in the area (Rockslides and avalanches)
- Stunned/knockdown players take extra damage from falling objects/slides
- May cause a slight mobility debuff.
- Group revive effectiveness halved
- No deployment of siege weapons within this area.
Underground Terrain [caves/ tunnels]:
- Randomly occurring cave-in (low aoe damage; no special effects)
- Larger groups/battles will trigger larger cave-in (strong and wide aoe damage; wide range of disruptive effects)
- Higher intensity cave-in does extra damage to downed players
- Group revive effectiveness halved
- Massive cave-ins if a zerg was to fight underground
- No deployment of siege weapons within this area.
Tall Grass: (2)
- Cloaks players/npc from far away observers, but reveals within moderate -close distances. -Slight mobility debuff, movement causes swaying in the plants, larger number players causes heavy swaying and wildlife to move out of area.
- Causes REVEALED while in area.
- No deployment of siege weapons within this area.
Heavy Fog:
- Limits visibility at range, visibility improves at medium ranges.
- Naturally occurring, benefit from allied NPC, or even from a new siege utility.
Breakdown of the ideal map
- Map will be 15%-25% larger, if not possible underground area will be increased instead
- 25%-40% of the surface map will be affected by enviro-effects
- 70% of underground will be affected by enviro-effects
- Number of towers and keeps untouched
- Number of supply camps increased, camps will be surrounded by enviro-effects of varying proximity and saturation.
- One of the camps would be a high priority camp with double dolyaks. The winding route will be the longest and most saturated with enviro-effects.
- Shortcuts would be through enviro-effects, Zergs will have to stick with the main roads
- Any siege deployable spot completely surrounded by enviro-effects would be dangerous map design as it would hard to attack a zerg entrenched there, so this will need to be avoided.
Rump Buffalo, Mavis, CrazyAce: I agree somewhat considering their stance on balancing issues after all this time. I am borderline optimistic that they may accept an idea if it happens to fit into whatever strict limitations they have set..
Sil, Samulus: Yeah, I believe all warrior players probably felt that one way or another when we first played it. This is a missed opportunity here ANET.
Rym: Wow, we do have very similar ideas and goals. We both want warriors to have a better set of mechanics, and to desire for warrior to not lose it’s potential as a more interesting class. After I re-read our ideas, I do feel that both our suggestions maybe too powerful, but the main idea/issue is there. Warriors are missing something that will require additional content to truly improve, whereas simply balancing what we have at the moment won’t work. Look at boon-hate suggestions that ANET plans to implement. Adding something “new” to deal with a difficult issue. If there was anything for ANET to take from both our ideas:
Defensive Burst
Idea: A defensive burst (different per weapon) that offers defensive/team utility. Utilities provided are non-boon based, so unremovable. The action however is interruptible.
Justification: A guardian provides team wide utility through divine means, where as a warrior should be able to use their weapons to protect that guardian should he/she be boon ripped and focused.
Expanded Stances
Idea:Stances will have an activatable skill that grants utility with a possible drawback. Such utility can possibly even be an action.
Justification:Stances should offer more flexibility. Adding activatable skills in our current stances would fit us in theme and mechanics. This brings that risk vs reward game play, some of us want expanded in the warrior. We can also go non-boon route to keep things within class restraints.
Just thought up of an idea that meshes well with the topic discussed, Shield stance should provide block to at least 1-2 allies within 40 range. It’s effects isn’t wide reaching, but would provide support on a smaller level.
Defensive Stance Burst (temporary name): An F2 adrenaline burst skill (on all weapons) that provides defensive utility in form of non-boon buffs/debuff and melee range team support (if traited). It functions as a dual type skill (stance/action) where the stance portion grants a temporary buff which ends on duration or on activation part of the skill. The action part provides a utility depending on it’s weapon type.
Defensive Stance (Up to 2 allies and 60 feet range if traited) (Cooldown 12-15 secs?)
=Counts as a stance
=Damage reduction (10%-15%-20%) with short duration (4s-Xs-Xs).
=Stun reduction (15%-25%-35%).
=Stun Break on adrenaline level 3(Yes, a stun break which can be applied to allies).
Note: The Damage reduction does not stack with itself or protection but will add 5% on top. Same occurs for stun reduction with similar effects.
The purpose of this idea is not only to alleviate some of the warrior’s issues but to add more utility in warrior’s own style. This allows warriors to have a more flexible selection of utility skills as their reliance on defense won’t be as strict. When comparing to guardian support, Defensive Stance will be more strict on positioning and timing but provides non-removable buffs. New utility skills/weapons from future expansions can function more creatively without being sidelined as well as the fact that Anet will not need to release skills that band-aids warrior’s flaws.
Activated Skill
These are the activated skills that have situational usage as the player must decide to lose all adrenaline to activate their Defensive Stance and must activate it (which will end stance) before the stances duration ends. These skills should provide additional utility normally not available to the weapon but nonetheless fits it’s theme. Less common or lacking weapons like mace and sword would have more flexible utility for player to improvise on the spot. Only listing one example though..
Rifle
Savior Shot “Get down”
Action: Fires an unblockable zero damage shot that causes daze of ¼ sec. If target is interrupted, the two closest allies within 130 feet of target are granted Defensive Stance buff with duration according to adrenaline level .Only allies near target is affected. Revives the allies for 5% if they are downed at level 3 adrenaline.
Note: Few assumption I will list out while designing this.
*Believes ANet wants to keep warriors a boon lite classes
*Boon hate will play some part in helping but may still be situational
*Warrior getting a few more methods of condition removal as suggested by ANet
*Warrior needs more unique team utility and to be a “sturdy body” without having to spec deep into defense/tactics.