Guild Wars 2

I don’t see how the hell people are still QQing over Engineers here, I mean I main a mesmer and I’ve managed to literally 1v Engineer+turrets all day.
Make Clones>Throw Feed Back Bubble> Turrets hit themselves not me, I throw a either chaos storm and bounce conditions back and forth and chaos armor and I just out boon their dmg.

As for the rest of you guys, there are OTHER classes that can aid. There is NO shame fighting someone with help. (team games)

Asuras (us!) Would be the only one with actual cars and jets. Screw that give me a another Mr. Sparkles and I’ll be happy

Mount A Charr into battle, I’m just saying.

Omg How the hell is everything still catch hell against them? You just find a mesmer(me) Throw a feedback bubble on the turrents and just throw conditions in there. The turrets along with anything inside that bubble will die in less then 3 seconds. Top of that ANYTHING with range won’t hurt you in.

I’m seeing more complaining about turrets now then I do with stealth on the thieves..

echo.2053:

Bojoo.7819:

That would be fine if every thief weapon would have its own initiative pool.
Right now, it would brokenly broken thieves. Lets say you interrupt 5/6 initiative skill and thief loses 10/12 initiative because power block. You do what then as a thief? Die because someone used 1 skill?

If you interrupt not thief class skill it goes on double cd, he can use other skill who are not on cd, he can wep swap and still try to do something.

As a thief you would be left with nothing. Cant use most of skills because no initiative. Weapon swap and then what, AA? It’s stupid and it wouldn’t work.

Also, guess what? Initiative is not a cooldown. It’s a pool.

Also someone mention Chill, because someone always mentions Chill. It effects thieves speed, steel and utility/elite. It’s also, let me quote wiki “Movement speed decreased by 66%; skill cooldown increased by 66%; stacks duration.”

Initiative is not a cooldown. It’s a pool.

Stop comparing class mechanics.

aww poor teef spilling massive amounts of salt all because the potiental to be killed or crippled by one skill – we mesmers wouldn’t know about that though, we’ve only been having to randomly predict when an 8k attack was going to happen resulting in death or on the very verge of death since game launch — no biggie though.

The orignal release of pb was fine except for the stomp interrupt. The reason for including rez is that there outside skills like war banner and exilir R but there isn’t an instant kill skill.

The main issue for pb’s decline was the removal of the effects on AA. Anet’s flawless logic was " we find it perfectly fine for classes to be able to chain stunlock and fear on relativly short cd skills is perfectly balanced, however having AA on cd while being fully mobile is completely broken – nerf!! " even though the majority of teef damage comes from skill 1, even though when sprit rangers were a thing the damage came from the bleeds caused by skill 1…..

There was 1 thing that were slightly on track about at the end – pvp balance isn’t suppose to be class vs class but rather the strength and weakness of specific builds vs other builds. Case and point- you make the passive claim that if pb were to remove intitive then itd make mesmers godly against teefs – yet you conviently leave out the fact that mesmer vs teef match ups are pretty much decided within the teefs 1st opening attack based about the mesmers luck and/or quick reaction. During that first attack, how much of an issue is inititive? its not, so shouldn’t a teef be punished for allowing a fight to persist espically with that advantage?

^That pretty much sums everything up. I wouldn’t complain as much if I was at least allowed to create clones without having to target something.

Yasha.5963:

Yeah, when in stealth you should leave footprints because even though invisible we can still hear and should be able to see the footprints right?

Also if blinded a player should move extremely slowly, or maybe the screen should go black because – well try closing your eyes and see how fast you can move about.

And what about burning? Surely the player should lose control of movement and run around in circles in pain trying to put out flames.

Probably these things should only happen if player is in stealth, because you know, L2P.

You know everytime I hear someone use the word L2P It makes me go to the PvP on my mesmer and simply kill the hell out of people without even attempting to use my shatters -.-;

Not work if you under a condition like Bleeding? OR at least it won’t make you as stealthy as a certain distance because you are leaving a trail of blood.

Welp, everyone roll with the idea. …GO

They are just to change the skill like they have been doing every other month with Mesmer. Hell I’m at the point we should all who play mesmer just get a free 80 Scroll to use to a new character.

So far everytime, and I mean EVERYTIME I get gear and items set up for a new build on my mesmer they Train the whole tree and skills with zero lube. I restart from the ground up and right when I make it good again they repeat the process.

Every class has an issue but Mesmers have been slapped around too many times.

I’m not even worried about it anymore, Mesmers may not have a TRUE place in Pvp anymore but people have to remember we are what make PvE go around.

When people don’t want to do a jump puzzle who do they ask for help? The Mesmsers ^^
I’m just happy I proved something last night, I fought two different thieves in pvp last night and the conditions were I wouldn’t use any clones if they didn’t use any stealth. (I didn’t use any stealth as well)

…2 out of 2 wins >.>

I’m just tired of people saying use AOES, that counters.

You can’t dodge what you can’t see. Unless other classes can unlock Jedi Skills I don’t see that happening.

By the time a Thief appears from stealth odds are it’s almost beside you if not already behind you. As a Mesmer play about time I already hit my skills I’ve taken a shank and a good clean fraction of my hp is gone. You can’t instana shatter your clones you have to actually make them first with a minor delay.

If they want to fix mesmer, allow the clones to literally mirror the player’s actions towards a target. Think Zed from League of Legends.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

GoogleBrandon.5073:

Yep, the meta is centered around Thieves…

That is why most optimal builds are like AoE happy machines that makes spectating for a new player seems as if they are watching Rainbow-Simulator 2…

… Or was the meta buid around, you know, conquest? Might sound silly, I know, but there might be a possibility no?

Well, AoE is the best counter to stealth…

Obviously Conquest is still the ultimate goal, but there are quite a few builds that perform well in Conquest if an enemy thief is absent. None of these builds are meta. To say the Thief hasn’t shaped the meta is not accurate. Most professions have shaped the current meta (still unsure about Ranger, though).

Yes AOE WOULD work if we weren’t in open areas. “Oh look a read danger zone, Imma just flip over it or walk around it.”

Ravenmoon.5318:

Shomaruki.7395:

You want to fix thieves then force them to have longer cd if they are trying to stealth while taking damage.

Or at least if they are taking damage while in stealth they lose some mobility.

Hell I can stealth just as many times as a thieve with my mesmer but no hell in way I can shatter as quickly as one of them are able to backstab me.

Really the only thing that makes me rage over them out of ANYTHING, is my feedback bubble does no counter their dagger spin. It won’t reflect the damage back on them.

O_O Are you saying there are thieves that use dagger storm in spvp?
Plus yeah, ANet’s reflection system kittens itself when a condition like this is met, having to reflect an already reflected projectile.

You do know that dagger storm reflects projectiles right?

Well I’ve tested it with a friend in WvW with a buddy of mine just to see and FeedBack Bubble for Mesmers is like anyone with range attacks nightmares.

I usually combine that with a dagger storm thieve on my side along with my radiation skill and got poison+compound bolts flying from thieve. (but that’s another story)

My only issue is, if it’s suppose to reflect all range attacks from inside the bubble why it wouldn’t work on dagger storm. I figured they would cancel each other out.

You want to fix thieves then force them to have longer cd if they are trying to stealth while taking damage.

Or at least if they are taking damage while in stealth they lose some mobility.

Hell I can stealth just as many times as a thieve with my mesmer but no hell in way I can shatter as quickly as one of them are able to backstab me.

Really the only thing that makes me rage over them out of ANYTHING, is my feedback bubble does no counter their dagger spin. It won’t reflect the damage back on them.

You know what I do when I see people charge in like that on my mesmer, I throw my focus down pull everyone dead center, throw a feedback bubble and tell my thieves spin marry go rounds inside of it….compound bolts OP

I can’t even find where to go to que up for it ^^;

I’m not at home but the idea came to me today and had to know if it counted or was possible.

If my secondary weapons are the same as my primary ones and I switch to them, would that COUNT towards a different Cooldown? OR would I have to wait in general for my weapon skills in general.

(Find a better way to word it.)
I got a pistol as my offhand mesmer
switch weapons and still have another pistol offhand as mesmer. Would the same skills be on cd?

Fay.2357:

ViciousVyne.2935:

Mesmer is fine, a l2p issue.

Mesmer isn’t fine…but I’m finding it hard to disagree with the rest of your post for this specific thread.

Mesmer is no where near fine, and I swear people with the L2P response can never bring up any real input. I’m pretty sure the people that even use that are the people who only play one class period =-=

Mesmer has been my favorite class out of all the classes. I’ve shared all off the wonders of jump puzzle cheating with portals and the tears of defeat to make anyone angry when they finish off one of my clones instead of me.

Personally, I could care less if I don’t win every fight, everyone loses from time to time. However after playing other classes for a while I couldn’t help but to turn back to my mesmer for a brief moment then remember why I dislike playing.

IF I could ONE thing with the Mesmer is would just to be allowed to use my clones at will without having to have a target on someone. Just going to give a simple example

Lets throw a thieve in the picture, mind you when one of them goes in stealth what’s the first thing that comes in mind? He/She about to come throw a dagger in my back or line something up for a painful attack. Mind you I almost have the same amount of stealth skills as them with the only exception is mine are double edge swords. I’m basically using them at the cost of some offensive play. (still shatter for days though).

If ANYTHING I rather be allowed to still have someone’s hp bar traced even when under stealth conditions so I could at least summon my clones and illusions around me. Sure they wouldn’t be allowed to attack until someone appears but I feel as though a Mesmer should have the right to go. “Oh I can’t see you but even still you have to figure out which one of me is the real one or I’m going to mess you up.”

It’s not too much of a rant against the thieve class, I have a lvl 76 one and I have to tell you. Out of all the classes that I played, I feel no…“effort” in it. (No offense to the class players.)

^No No remember they said they deserved that high hitting burst dmg because they were super squishie. But then you had to fire back at if that’s the case the Defenders should be able to tank all they get thrown ate.(But it’s been proven time and time again that even then most toughest defender can get ate alive.)

Ravenmoon.5318:

^ So you are basically crying because you can’t play around the stealthed characters. Instead of flipping your kitten after a backstab, you have 3 seconds in which the thief CANNOT reactivate stealth. If you can’t count to 3 seconds, you can watch for the regular attack, after the 3rd blow they can stealth again. It’s almost a 3 second chain and by the time they cast Cloak and Dagger the revealed buff is gone. But that’s only for D/D thieves.

If you play against D/P thief they have a much harder access to stealth mostly in the form of shadow field leap combo. SD thieves have it cheaper but they have to be really close to the mesmer for that cloak & dagger.

And the pistol thieves … well … they are a joke ……

I mean I’m willing to bet enough gems right now you wouldn’t last a week playing against your class as me. As I said once one of you cloak I throw mine on as well. But difference is I don’t have a high burst attack jumping out of stealth. (unless I’m running torch build.))

I’ve played Mesmer since the five day early access, been a personal favorite class ever since and let me tell you. I’ve remember being one of the classes that annoyed the living hell out of every other class.

When I fought against Warriors all I had to do was time my dodges and play clone wars the video game.

Fighting Rangers I would just cripple them and feed back bubble for days. (Their pets only real thing that annoyed me)

Other Mesmers…we agree on just staying away from each other..(Unwritten rule in WvW)

Defenders It’s pretty much a boss battle of whose cds reset.

Thieves on the other hand I’ve had to use every different combination of skills and tried multiple fighting methods against them but 8 out of 10 of them it’s nothing I can throw that keeps them off.

Out of ANY class in this game Thieves are the only kind that I’ll literally become the angry german kid from youtube.
1) There’s not a skill in a the world I can prevent them from stealthing over and over. I can’t use Disenchanters of them because I have to actually have a target to use it on.

2)When they do go stealth I already assume they working their way behind me for the stab. Even if I time it right, I’m playing Jedi Instincts to time a dodge, That’s even WHEN I’m trying to throw down chaos armor or chaos storm to soft the blow.

3) My double edge sword is I can almost stealth as many times as a thieve in one of my builds but I trade off ALMOST all of my offensiveness for using that many escape.

In WvW or PvP I’ve ran into more Thieves targetting me more then any other class out there :/.

Maobirds… Maobirds everywhere.

I kinda stole the idea what a thief does when they wanna finish someone cloaked.

Right before I finish someone with my mesmer, I pop a decoy that makes a clone and I’m stealthed and I just walk up to them finish them while invis.

Trait that gives 3% damage reduction pure lil mini us we have out on the field. 3%*

Someone finally thanked us mesmers ;~;…..We are loved after all.

Find it amazing the main who dislike the changes were to one hit wonders. Always telling people learn to dodge and L2P.

Seems the table has been flipped XD

If Batman played this game, he would be an engineer.

Stin.9781:

If you carry Assasins signet Signet of shadows and third slot is stunbreaker so you can spam hearseeker, then you will not have invisiblity. you do understand that

Let me help you

Translation: You actually have to TRY in PvP now if you a thief player.

I’ve been waiting for this day a long time. I’m sure by now all the 1 trick pony people are raging like crazy. Cause now they actually have to TRY when they fight now. The new 5 hits instead of 1 hits actually balances out the damage. On top of that it also removes the “None skilled” Thief players out of the picture. I"m sure the legit people are going to find this a + more then a -.

wtf o.o I can’t say DBZ?

I’ll allow this to happen if you let my clones jump on the back of my enemies and self destruct like in Dragon kitten.

Daecollo.9578:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Guide-7-Ways-to-to-kill-a-Thief-Warning-Long/first#post498726

This guide should help you against thieves.

That’s twice you posted that in my topic. Stop.

I never said we never couldn’t kill the guy in the end, I was just stating the fact the guy was no where to be seen.

I just wanted to know if it was an exploit or render issue.
Wasn’t an OP topic, wasn’t an nerf topic, wasn’t a topic about how to kill, wasn’t a topic on “Well my elemental does more damage” It was just about someone that wasn’t able to be seen able to down people without being seen.

Personally I don’t care about anyone playing a thief cause push come to kill, All I do is create a barrage of clones and Press F4 and the next couple of spams do no damage to me and gets part of it reflected back on them.

And that’s why I sat myself between a net turret and my rifle while the aoes. I mean we killed him a few times, we camped just at the first tower outside their spawn.

I wasn’t mad about it, it actually was funny. Like playing who could down him the first or was going to be the first to actually die to him. Like i said, turrets track people in invis they just don’t fire at them. All I said to do was see which direction my turret was facing and I just randomly start firing in that direction.

9/10 the people who trying L2P are the people usually using/playing what people dislike. However when finally get balanced out and the table gets flipped everyone switches positions and you will have your moment to go L2P.

Seren.6850:

thats what I was told, so how was this guy stealthed & invun for an entire 30 second battle. Does anyone have a link to the build you guys think he was using.

I have wvw a lot, and am on a tier3 server I’ve fought hundreds of thieves only seen this happen today. It wasn’t culling or rendering I’m quite experienced with that.

I’ve taken like 20 screen shots I’m trying to sort through the ones where you can see us take the damage, Problem is the SS don’t show anything but us firing at the wind trying to hit the guy that isn’t there.

Hermes.7014:

What is this perma stealth nonsense? After attacking from the Stealth condition there is an additional condition called “Revelaed” which lasts a couple of seconds that doesn’t allow you to go immediately again into Stealth.
If people are permanently stealthed then it’s a rendering issue or an hacker/exploiter.

^And this is what we were trying to GET at. This isn’t a NERF or QQ thread. And kitten from few post up top ago wasn’t helping. What I was saying along with few others who were with me at the moment was, we was fighting a thief. Who literally was just sliding through everyone invisible hitting them.

How many people honest in all there history in guild wars 2 could say they are able to fight 1v8 and walk out of it solo?. Not that he managed to kill out of us we managed to revive people before he could land any killing blows but the point I and few others were trying to make was he is perma stealthing then what really is the point of back stabs and any other skill a thief can use if all he has to do is remain in stealth and poke you all day.

ZLE.8293:

Dear @Shomaruki and Dear @Masternewbz…
You are BOTH mesmers.Don’t you ever again point a fingers to other class.EVER
Thank you.I go to work now.

While you at work if you get a lunch break find me a post where a mesmer can down people in 2-3 seconds before going back to stealth.

ZLE.8293:

The time of the Perma-Stealth has come? Already?
I would suggest if you are smart to whine first for Backstab and then for Stealth.
This way you will get both nerfed….

Yes actually play a class that requires “effort” other then three keys then we will accept your input there buddy.

Exactly, the downing wasn’t the problem. the Perma stealthing was.

He was downing ppl left and right >_> But he couldn’t finish anyone, cause we aoed our teammates who were downed.

I’ll post my screenshots after I log out but this is what’s going on. (Yes I have proof)

I don’t want to post the screenshot simply cause even though I can’t show the users name cause he is from WvW but his guild name shows.

He pretty much perma stealth, and downing people. Now before anyone says anything, we used traps and aoes and everything there is to do to stop the guy but you can’t target him. I even switched to my engineer and ran back to the area he camping. My turret tracks him in stealth but we can’t target the guy as he was killing people. He couldn’t (Finish) cause I’m sure he would of been beat down however we still there if you wanna look.

We pushed him and his buddy back to front of

Dragonbrand Spawn.

I got witnesses and everyone who is viewing if they got the screenshots to, they more then happy to show.

I’m JUST saying…Thiefs already got that rep where not many people like them, (Heck I got one and I dun even like it simply cause it’s easy tier..) But it’s people like this that’s really throwing them down some more. (brb with the screens later.gonna try and record it. Still in game)

How to counter a thief….. Play PvE.

The end result would be?

No one really ask what would happen if two spamming Ninjas. (I know they are called Thief..for the record) were to fight each other, both using the same build. Would it just be a stealth stand off on one another?

Kaizer.7135:

Warriors have INVULNERABILITY buffs, Mesmers have clones, Warriors can GET UP from downed state and can still survive..

You calling us OP?

If you actually can’t tell a real mesmer from the clones…You sir deserve to die.
Warriors can get up after a down states but there is a cd before they can even use it. (ALL I had to do to counter a warrior getting back up was kite for a few seconds then they just fall right back on the ground. I got a similar skill on my mesmer that works on my party.)

Like I said, give me clones that can dodge and move around like I do. I wouldn’t have a single worry in this game, except maybe other mesmers.

EnochDagor.6185:

Kaizer.7135:

Warriors have INVULNERABILITY buffs, Mesmers have clones, Warriors can GET UP from downed state and can still survive..

You calling us OP?

I can see a warrior. I can joust and outplay or be outplayed a warrior

That one little bit right there is what’s the difference between any other glass cannons. This is the rule to ANY MMO, I don’t care who are you in this game.

I have countered warriors and even died to them. THE only reason is simply because I can SEE them. The ONLY way a warrior has killed me is if I’ve been careless and didn’t pay attention to all his attacks.

There is no build that protects you from stealth. My stealth protects from getting targeted. I got no damage+ or def + being in it. Hell the only skill I got that actually does damage on range is my great sword on mesmer and even still that really isn’t much more damage.

I wouldn’t even worry about a thief. If Anet made my clones move around like I PLAYED. *Clones were able to run around in circles or actually dodge on their own too and use weapons that I’m actually holding. I would say GG because not a single person would be able to touch me or any other good mesmer.

TRUE I can stealth almost as much as a thief, but I can’t burst no one down like they do. The ONLY shatter I use when fighting a thief is my F4. Simply because I can’t take damage during those 2-3 seconds. That gives me just enough for a window to move away or attack back. (After he/she has been able to get free 2-3 hits off me)

Hell I just used GS, Stor and Pistol. All I do from there is just spam clones and illusions and make sure to have it to where my clones and illusions cripple when they get destroyed.

Just to also kitten them off I usually daze them none stop.

But yea using that with decoy at the start of a fight is funny cause they love to charge dead into the fake me.

Backstab already does additional damage base on how much life someone is missing. So why not just make it where it can’t crit a target.

I just thought about that. So far I haven’t seen a single person actually think that part though. Thief can KEEP everything about it just make it to where Backstab

A skill designed to already do additional damage base on missing life on a target, Not be able to critical.

Minx.7521:

you don’t have to be a sitting duck. you can be a moving duck! run in circles or somethin backstab’s hard because 1) meelee 2) have to stab in back :P

Well duh…I am moving around. There was literally ONE skill I could depend on fighting a thief but I literally a window of killing a thief if it didn’t I had to go back on the offensive…Turning them into a Bird. Half the time if I turn them into the bird and don’t kill them, they flee. (Worse mistake anyone can do is chase after them…) So I let that person flee and I carefully watch them run away before I leave.

Kiirin.3418:

If you’re trying to defend Assassin Signet + BS, then you’re obviously trolling. If you’re one of those thieves who know the restealth bug in spvp then you’re obviously trolling.

No one should be able to, not even a glass cannon, should be able to hit you for 10,000+ damage with backstab on a person with 3,000 armor. I play a necro and I don’t have access to all the good cc breakers or even a fear that lasts longer than 1 second. Thieves atm are the BEST at what they do. They’re not the best 1v1ers but they will kill anyone they choose with AS+BS when roaming.

We just for fun ran the pure glasscannon AS+BS and started 100-0 every possible profession within 2-4 seconds. We will be posting videos about this. So people can see how real this is.

I don’t want thieves to be overnerfed, but no class should be able to global a full on tank. For necromancers my cc breakers are on an incredibly long cd, so i don’t have them up a good amount of the time.

And this brings up any topic about a thief. I’m playing mesmer I’m about to 1v1 a Guardian it’s just a battle of endurance. As long as he/she keeps killing my clones And illusions I’m going to continue to keep my distance and slowly bring him down.

Warrior, same thing with exception I use my block skills and pop a clone after I block.

Rangers? Feedback bubble when they start rapid firing at me and make them kill themselves.

Elementailist….. Throw a cripple illusion, confusion stack and just have my pistol illusion kill them off. (Actually bring them down the fastest for some reason)

Necro’s (Hardly see them but I’m sure they drop the same.)

Engineers- Same issue has Rangers I just feedback and take them out

Thiefs- . . . The moment I see them stealth (I’m playing zomg zomg better dodge now and how he is already attacking me.) Using pulse wave to make sure he isn’t near me again. Oh wait. kitten he restealth I can’t target him so now I’m using my stealth simply because I CAN’T target him. If I can’t target him, none of my defensive skills are enabled for use. Once my stealth is down I’m a sitting suck.