Guild Wars 2

Yes, yesterday was clearly a special day. First reset after linking, this was doomed to happen. We need to see if this settles.

Personally, having always been on a lowest tier server, it was nice to see so much activity on the maps. It is really a nice change of pace.

So let’s not overreact and see how the situation evolves.

Hey guys, let’s relax a little bit on qq for queues, it’s the first night of the world links. Let’s give the system a week to see where it goes, it was normal for reset nights and even tournament time to have queues on 4 maps back earlier in the game life.

Will that keep up for saturday and sunday?
What will the queues look like on the weekdays?

There could be a combination of factors here for the increased population tonight other than the link.
Maybe a lot of people are excited and playing on reset when they don’t normally play.
Maybe we got returning players coming in and playing on reset when they don’t usually play.
Maybe players stayed up to 10est to play because it’s reset time when they usually start at 8est and be done by 10est or 11est, so lets see what happens on saturday and sunday.
We don’t know these things as yet.

One thing is for sure, many servers needed players because most times it was 3 empty maps and a queued up ebg map. I know being in queue sucks, that’s kinda why they created eotm, play there while waiting on the queue, but give the system a week to see what happens, we can’t judge it on the first couple hours.

Happy bag hunting.

P.S Thank you Anet for the work you’ve been putting into WvW lately, please keep it up!

Queues were always part of WvW so I don’t know why ppl are so upset about satying few mins in queue and enjoy huge blob fights ;D

Had the most awesome time in wvw today! Its been years since wvw has been this lively! Thank you so much anet! I knew my HOT purchase wasnt wasted! Keep it up!

P/s i really dont mind the queue

TorquedSoul.8097:

X T D.6458:

TorquedSoul.8097:

Reverence.6915:

TorquedSoul.8097:

Reverence.6915:

TorquedSoul.8097:

Reverence.6915:

At this point, I’d rather get 2v1’d again to get action on the maps. BG seems dead because there’s no action, which causes people to log out, cause we’d rather do anything else other than karma training (I tag up for fights, fights end, half my group logs off). Groups from YB and JQ are just karma training empty borderlands thinking they’re hot stuff, complaining about us zerging them down with 10-15 man groups calling them “blobs”, all the while bunkering in keep lords rooms with siege.

Good joke.

If you want BG to play again, bring us fights without siege. Most of us won’t even care if we’re vastly outnumbered.

@Torqued: You seem bitter that BG won’t respond to your requests to push PPT. Guess what buddy, we’re not here to play for you. We’re here to play for us. If you want to play PPT, tag up and do it. Don’t expect someone else, who has no desire to want to play for PPT, to play that way.

Regardless of your perception of my attitude, the fact is that Blackgate is actively driving away PPT players and putting themselves at a disadvantage. Blackgate will never beat Yak’s Bend until they are willing to become like Yak’s Bend.

No amount of server politics will stop the unwashed hoards of Yak’s Bend.

You don’t know how PPT works, regardless of all those number crunching stuff you do (good work on those btw, they’re interesting to look at, despite not having any real relevance in the current WvW climate).

Why don’t you explain to me how PPT works? I’m always open to learning something new. What is my data missing that is so important? Server politics?

PPT isn’t a function (right now) of organisation and skill, but rather, of time and numbers. The more numbers you have on at any given time means that you’ll naturally get more PPT.

If you log in at any time outside of NA prime on BG you’ll notice this. Our small groups are backcapping as fast as they can, but due to lack of numbers, our PPT suffers. We lack numbers because people aren’t willing to put the time into WvW right now due to the lack of incentives to win and the lack of rewards while playing.

But then, I don’t think anyone on BG ever saw you put more hours in-game to help out our weaker time slots.

Maybe if Blackgate didn’t have such a sour attitude towards pugs and pve players they would have MORE people to put in those hours and there would be no grind. But alas, Blackgate is a “skilled fight” server and have chased away all those no skill pvd players.

Your inability to get the coverage speaks volumes about your server culture.

I really don’t understand your posts Torqued, it just seems bitter, and like your mad at BG because we play for fun..and we don’t devout all our time towards something we find meaningless, unrewarding, and not fun…

You are entitled to your opinion, or in this case, confusion. Don’t confuse my engagement in a larger argument as bitterness towards BG. I left BG because I didn’t like the culture the old guard created. As a person that is interested in playing the game that Anet created, sitting on BG and listening to the whining about how Anet ruined everything was getting tiring.

If you are confused, its because you don’t understand that others can enjoy things that you don’t. In this case, I enjoy games when I’m trying to win them. I don’t enjoy listening to stories of the glory days and how we could win if we wanted to. Put up or shut up. I don’t care about how awesome Blackgate was … I want to play the game.

BG’s toxic attitude towards PvD, siege humping “cancerous” game play is evidence that you don’t approve of others that enjoy different things. BG is bitter that Anet has ignored them and not provided them a “skill-based” WvW. which is about as idiotic a request that I could imagine.

Large scale warfare is not about fair fights. Its about coordination, communication, community, resources, alliances, “coverage”, morale, inspiration and RAW NUMBERS. You don’t have to believe me, but I would direct you to a history book. Warfare has always been a numbers game. And as the scope of the conflict grows the possibility of a fair fight dissolves and guerrilla tactics take over.

The servers that make the rational choices within the current game mechanics will push up and those that don’t will fall.

You’re the embodiment of all that is wrong with WvW and your opinion is objectively disgusting.

+1 this match-up thread!

I’m not sure if this should be reported as a bug but there is an issue with the current modeling in the WvW ratings system. I assume that this link is still a valid description of the strength of victory modeling. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/The-math-behind-WvW-ratings/first#post2034699

The problem is that the Sine function model that is currently used to award the actual score in the glicko rating deviates considerably from the actual real distribution of results. I retrieved a history of scores from http://mos.millenium.org/na/matchups and parsed the results and converted the scores into the portions used by the Anet Glicko system. I then converted that distribution into a probability distribution that the rating system uses to assign the “actual” score that is use to correct the ratings. I’ve attached an image of the plots that I did for this explanation.

The black curve is the real distribution of scores. It was normally distributed about 0.5 with a SD of 0.15.

The Green curve is the Sine function curve that is currently used. This curve currently over rewards lower performing servers and under rewards higher performing servers. The worst error occurs at 0.7 and 0.3 on the x axis. In these locations the error is about 0.11. this means that higher performing servers (0.7) performing in this range are getting about a 10% penalty in score and the lower performing (0.3) server is getting a 10% bonus. It doesn’t matter what your server rating is, if you perform in the error range you being rewarded improperly.

The real problem with this is when a server is expected to have a really high score not to lose rating points. The best example of this right now is Dragonbrand (1839.9965). They are currently competing against Stormbluff Isle (1667.1971) and Maguuma (1534.7854).

According the current system, Dragonbrand would have an expected score of 0.71 against Stormbluff Isle. According to the sine function currently used, they would Dragonbrand would need to have a score portion of 0.64. But according to the real data all that should be required to achieve that score is 0.59. That 0.05 difference is significant over the course of the week where the overall proportion shrinks as the scores go up. Against Maguuma the situation is worse. The Sine function requires a portion of 0.73 when only a 0.65 is justified by the historical data. The conclusion is that Dragonbrand (and any top ranked server in a teir) must work harder than necessary not to be pulled back down. And the lower ranked servers will have an easier time pull the top down.

If the servers were pooled and randomly competed this wouldn’t be a problem. It would simply result in a virtual floor and ceiling for the ratings. Downward pressure on the top and upward pressure on the bottom. Everything pushed to the middle. But when you have tiers, this makes Tier mobility difficult. Servers pushing up have to put forth a monumental effort to break in to the next tier and the servers on the bottom of the a Tier get protected by the system even after they stop performing at a level worthy of their tier. To be more blunt, it screws servers like Dragonbrand and Tarnished Coast and benefits servers like Blackgate and Sea of Sorrows who have had long periods of poor performance and still refuse to drop down to the next tier.

In a Strength of Victory system like the one Anet is using, the score awarded should be consistent with the distribution of the historical scoring data. I understand that when a system is initiated and there is no data to reference you must guess. But now there is plenty of data to use for reference.

I’m not sure where the Sine function came from but modeling normally distributed data can be done with a logistic curve much more easily. I believe this is why Elo used it. I have modeled a logistic curve to fit the historical data and it shown in the chart as the red line. The sigmoid midpoint is 0.5, and the k value is 10.91. This k value gives the lowest sum of squares of the difference between the historical data and the logistic model.

You should consider fixing this to reward hard working servers that are trying to push up the ranks and maybe more importantly to properly punish servers that are coasting at the bottom of upper tiers.

Just as an aside, reducing the range of the MMR variability by capping it at 100 has also aggravated the problem because it forces servers like Dragonbrand and Tarnished Coast to compete against lower ranked servers more often which keeps them weighed down.

I’ve also attached a csv of some of the derived data. I’ve included column headers but it is still a bit messy.
Columns
Proportion: a score proportion
Count: The number of times the proportion block (by 0.01) appeared.
Cumulative: Cumulative count.
%cumulative: total Probability distribution of real proportions data.
Sine: the result of the proportion as a function of the Sine function currently used.
Corrected: The result of the proportion as a function of the logistic function.
diff^2: squared diff of %cumulative and Corrected.

EDIT: Changed the x axis on the graph to be more consistent with my comments.

Red Bull doesnt give you wings either.

I hope ANET ignores this with the same intensity as anything to do with gvg/fights that was ever suggested. Sorry something got in the way of your pvdoor guys! Maybe try fighting now?

I’m so Excited™
And I just cant hide it
I just get infracted whenever I try it

Buffy.9246:

Remember when….

Anet cared?

Oh…wait.

Remember when…

threads like this were free of Dev hate and people were reasonable towards them and not acting like brats

oh… wait…

sirflamesword.3896:

I agree with the earlier post in that the “GvG(I don’t think anyone should call it that) guilds” killed themselves off.

Guild vs. Guild shouldn’t be called GvG? And (presumably, since you’re on YB) lacking any first hand knowledge and any semblance of an argument you agree that GvG guilds killed themselves off? Sounds like players from other tiers have a real handle on the situation!

Galandil.9641:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/big-changes-are-coming-to-the-commander-system/

I can’t see anywhere the fact that we have to buy each color separately. Am I reading wrong or apparently they did change from what was announced in the video interview?

Could we get a Red Tag to clear this up?

dancingmonkey.4902:

Don’t be ridiculous. We are literally getting a patch coming in that is full of things asked for. Including differing colored commander tags.

Not one of us made a single suggestion to make this a moneywall rather than a quality of life change that was desperately needed.

Levels? No.

Colors? Yes.

Taking an idea given to the devs by the WvW community and doing this to our idea is a horrid slap in the face of all those who pour heart and soul into WvW.

Now the guilds will be even more reclusive and not community minded.

You aren’t getting how horrid this will be – nothing short of the megaserver will do as much damage to WvW as demoralizing costs that most can’t hope to get reasonably in casual play must now wait months to accomplish ; I am NOT a casual player and I know that some are great at playing the market but most are gatherers and are holding their own buying superior siege.

Anet, you are going to make the next MMO that has three sided warfare (with capture the flag, capture the island and other diversions that help keep the game fresh) look amazingly tantilizing with this bad choice of 300 gold per level for a commander’s tag.

300 gold… those who have money will just buy one.

We already can’t play “like we want” in many ways…

Those who are poor in real life will have to grind and you promised there would be no grinding in this game – you promised.

Blanger.3162:

Sreoom.3690:

Commander’s Color should be based on experience. There should be a leveling system in place for Commanders..maybe based on Points captured, time commanding, kills accrued.

I have absolutely no problem with this, buy the tag it has a base color to show you are a new commander (say white), as you progress through ranks/leveling as a commander other colors are unlocked, it would give players at a glance an idea of the level of a commanders experience, of course it might penalize new commanders in some ways but we have times when no commander is present on the map that a new commander can get his feet wet and gain exp but we’d have to separate it somehow from EotM.

Unlocking by level (WvW level) would have made FAR more sense.

Unlocking isn’t a paywall – and it’s fair to those who have the “Platinum” tag – they EARNED IT.

26 years now in IT…

I was a beta tester for the original Doom

I was a beta tester for 5 months for WoW pre-release

I’ve been a computer geek and professional for a very long time with gaming being my hobby and source of social interaction (military families, orphans and others who have little to no connections in real life will be able to relate…), it’s unkind in the extreme for any company to take a very good idea, one that was needed but not thought of, and make it into their idea of a golden goose.

Gamers are ever looking for a better MMO – and we are all looking Anet.

You are good – very, very good, but you have ignored our pleas over so many issues and even tech support that isn’t tech support who tells us “start over”, “we don’t have access to the database” and “prove you lost xxxx” even though the database is on the server side not the client side.

It’s time for you to stand by your word Anet… you promised we could play like we want to – ergo we gave you a brilliant and simple idea – and you broke our trust – again.

I really hope that I will NOT see any other colour commander tag than BLUE in the entirety of WvW… please all servers instruct your players to use the /join squad functionality that is already build in. Do NOT BUY a coloured tag, instruct all your guilds to NOT BUY them. Buying this tag will only ensure that more features in the game will be accompanied by these kinds of silly things.

Pinkamena Diane Pie.8054:

So can it be that the only things we get from this are coloured tags and golem mastery?!

Except that we won’t be getting colored tags; at least not the ones we requested. What we’re getting instead are gold-gated vanity items which have been co-opted by ArenaNet into a naked cash grab that no true WvW player will bother purchasing (or – as will be the case for many – won’t even be able to afford).

So golem mastery is all we’re getting.

Charging the WvW community for the new commander tag colors is the biggest mistake Anet can make. Not only did it take a year to implement a feature that should have been easy to add, you’re charging the very community that came up with the idea in the first place.

Hardcore WvW players don’t have massives amount of gold, commanders regularly spend gold on upgrades and seige and miss out on quite a lot of PvE content.

I for one have never had more than 300 gold at anytime and I’m still nowhere near buying my precursor. This game needs gold sinks, but not for items that will benefit the longevity of a game.

Charging the community for a utility that’s designed to help with communications and tactics is like charging players with a gold fee to unlock team and map chat.

I ask that you please reconsider charging the community to access the commander colors, because you’re making a huge mistake. The forums are evidence enough on how the community feels.

If you read this post, please take a moment to support this topic with a reply.

The fact that building siege gets you stuck in wvw is a “harder to fix bug” that this flower backpiece bug may be true. But…

• Getting stuck after building has been in for ages
• Getting stuck after building is just one of the million more important bugs still to fix
• I was just pointing out that this backpiece gets near instant attention (within the hour of creation) https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/cultivated-seed-swapped-with-pet-seed/4287291
• I wasn’t being harsh on PvE players, as I too (pvp, wvw AND pve player) also have a backpiece. And was just hugely blown away when reading that thread.
• I even got an infraction and you will not be able to find that post again. As clearly that important thread is read by more moderaters than this forum will ever see.

There is a feature patch incoming, I read about it after this thread was created. So we’ll see if some issues related to wvw and pvp get adressed aswell.

Vol.7601:

Ever consider that there are different degrees of bugs and how they can be fixed?

Ever consider that not fixing a bug at all has nothing to do with the degree of difficulty but rather an unwillingness to commit resources to a particular area of the game?

http://youtu.be/JcPTsIAKAbU?t=23m48s best video ever.

(hint: the legendary ANet guy interfering with a gvg)

ReesesPBC.4603:

Should just submit endless videos of WvW bugs and issues instead. Maybe they’ll get the hint. (probably not)

This or submit that video where GvG was ‘ruining’ the game mode of WvWvW. lol

Should just submit endless videos of WvW bugs and issues instead. Maybe they’ll get the hint. (probably not)

Give us updated commander tags first.

Use Google Translate if you want your own Chinese subtitles for your videos. I can only assume this compilation will be a PR vehicle for our new Asian comrades, because it certainly isn’t going to make our socks roll up and down.

Somebody please do a fly and invisibility hack compilation…