Showing Posts For annabelle.5876:
Random encounters are definitely a core part of rpgs and mmos, but an often quoted remedy to the random mob placement in HOT is to avoid those encounters entirely using character skills and HOT mobility masteries. My point is that if those mobs are truly to be avoided throughout the maps, that points to a weakness in game design in my opinion. If those mobs are to be fought by players as one move through the maps, not all players are having a positive experience in that process. The stealth detection mastery for example, makes movement and combat significantly easier against stealthed enemies on the early maps, but it is at a higher tier of mastery than basic mobility essentials like updrafts and mushrooms. A player new to the HOT maps, may get turned off with the inability to counter those enemies, and forgo returning.
While you certainly have the option to do so, you don’t fight every single mob in every single map in core Tyria, do you? If by some chance you are one of the rare people (rare by my observation) who does that, well, you can do that in HoT too if you like. Or you can run past the ones you don’t want to engage. It’s a choice, same as any other map. There aren’t any invincible mobs you’ll encounter while running around in the HoT maps (which I assume would be the case if they were truly designed to only be avoided).
As for dealing with some of the more annoying mobs such as the ones that stealth before you have the stealth detection mastery, it really boils down to learning enemy tells and using your active defenses (blocks, cc, blinds, movement skills, etc.). If you have still have difficulty surviving using your weapon/utility skills/dodges, you always have the option to up your passive defenses (traits, gear) so that you can take a few more hits until you are more accustomed to dealing with HoT mobs. It’s not like they can’t be countered until you have the mastery unlocked.
Dodges are not the only active defense. Blinds, interrupts, CC’s, stealth, blocks, reflects, and evades also negate damage. Soft defenses like cripple, chill, slow, weaken, regen, and protect also help negate damage. One’s dodges should not be the only thing keeping them alive. It is a combination of several tools.
This, so much. If you still can’t manage to survive/ beat them using a combination of movement and defensive skills, there’s always the option to beef up your passive defense via your trait selection and gear choices.
WvW travel is exceedingly straightforward in comparison to HoT. The learning time for getting around in HoT zones is greater than the WvW zones by a large factor. Even the Desert Borderlands, which a lot of people disliked, were straightforward once one explored them a tiny bit. One time was enough for me to know where everything was, and EB/Alpine Borderlands are practically second nature after one run through.
I see your point, thanks. So basically it’s just a matter of preferring a simpler, more linear map, right? I’m not sure I agree that the HoT maps being less straightforward is necessarily a design flaw as has been suggested by the OP, though. Just because something might take longer than one run through to learn doesn’t make it inherently bad, in my opinion. Player preferences will vary, and that’s perfectly okay. I personally found the complex aspects (non-linear movement, layered map levels, etc.) of the, for instance, Verdant Brink map to add more depth and variety than the maps in the core game, which I appreciated. I can even appreciate the design of Tangled Depths, though I admittedly get confused and lost there quite often. Granted, there is a slightly higher learning curve involved in navigating the new zones, and not everyone will like that, I’ll agree with you there.
@Blood Red Arachnid – I absolutely agree. I am probably what would be considered an “okay” player. I try to pull my own weight, I’m certainly not overly good and far from great, in part due to the lack of time I have to devote to it, but I can say from experience that changing my mindset in order to adapt to the increased challenges in HoT has been both beneficial (my situational awareness has improved greatly, lol) and satisfying.
@Danicus – I get what you are saying regarding my analogy, even though I must politely disagree with some of it. I think that EoTN was the only expansion for the first game, and in that regard is entirely analogous to HoT in conception. Nightfall and Factions were stand alone games that didn’t require you to own anything else, unlike EoTN (and unlike HoT). I would also disagree that there was a skill progression (e.g., less difficulty —→ greater difficulty) in EoTN’s general pve content. It was a collection of zones for max level characters, and the difficulty was more or less the same throughout EoTN (excluding, of course, some mobs being more dangerous than others and of which the same can be said of the mobs in HoT as well), and mobs generally hit much harder than those in the core campaigns. Again, same concept. The harder challenges in EoTN that you mentioned (dungeons, HM) were optional challenges aimed at players looking for increased difficulty, and in this respect (in my opinion) could be roughly compared to the option to raid in HoT.
What I’m having trouble understanding is why you feel that a new mechanic (gliding, mushrooms, etc) is a barrier to gameplay? Is it because you have to progress the ability? Tbh, I feel like gliding has opened up an entirely different way to experience the HoT zones (and while I do not have unlimited gliding unlocked yet, I am making steady progress on getting it!) and is a fantastic addition. I guess what’s causing my disconnect here is that you say you mainly hate traveling to get to the fight in HoT, but at the same time you also say that you enjoy WvW, which has no gliding, few waypoints, requires fighting or sneaking past things that want to kill you, and requires traveling to get to pretty much any fight. I’m just not following what you’re getting at I suppose.
Minion master reaper was the easiest for me, followed pretty closely by druid, and tempest was the hardest (to be fair I admit I’m not very good on elementalist in general).
An interesting point about casuals and not finding the game enjoyable. I would like to reiterate why I suggest why HOT may not be enjoyable for the casual player. Player skill progression is usually tied to built in in-game learning experiences. In my opinion, well-designed in-game learning experiences follow somewhat of a time-linear scaled set of challenges. A casual player (in my opinion), follows this sequence without excessive frustration. The ideal is a sort of Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi flow state where consciousness of time playing disappears. I do not believe HOT scales in this way. Yes it is possible, with time effort and motivation to overcome these challenges, but is that what the designers truly intended? I want to thank the posters on this thread for such positive and sincere dialogue.
I mean no disrespect, but I’m going to go out on a limb here and ask if the 950 WvW rank you have was earned primarily in EoTM? The reason I ask is that, after having read a multitude of threads on this same topic, it seems to me that the majority of the people who are currently vocal about hating the difficulty of HoT pve content (post-April patch, and barring things like high ping or physical disabilities) don’t have a good grasp of the profession they’re playing the content with, likely due to spending much of their time zerging or being carried in the core game. Tbh, leveling alts via zerging in EoTM was my own problem and it was likely the reason that I found the HoT content overwhelming at first. But I stuck with it and adapted, and now I find that I really enjoy the jungle and have acquired a much better understanding of the various professions.
Vayne makes a very important (and accurate, imo) point. The game has been gradually getting more difficult in the level 80 pve maps. Since you have the “Closer to the Stars” title, you are obviously a veteran of the first game, so I’d like to toss out some food for thought. They used this exact model in GW1 when they released Eye of the North. Unlike GW:Factions and GW:Nightfall, which were stand alone campaigns with their own starter areas and gradual difficulty progression, GW:EoTN was an expansion that was designed entirely for max level characters. There was no gradual difficulty progression. Certain skills were gated behind reputation with the various factions (norn, asura, etc), which was basically like the current mastery system. It was presumed that by the time you were able to play EoTN you were max level and had learned how to play your chosen class. There was no more hand holding in EoTN- you went to the shiverpeaks and it was sink or swim. HoT is (with the exception of map mechanics and the lack of the option to take along a party of heroes to hold you up) basically like that. In a big picture perspective, core Tyria is the training ground, the gradual difficulty progression, and HoT is the proving ground. Of course, I have no idea how you felt about the EoTN expansion – you may well have disliked that one too, for much the same reasons as you stated above regarding HoT. I’m just making the assumption that you didn’t, since you stuck with it at least long enough to complete the Hall of Monuments up to Closer to the Stars. And if you didn’t hate the similar model in the previous game, perhaps the reason you dislike HoT is actually something different than what you have articulated here?
I’m curious how much time you have spent playing the HoT maps? Perhaps you just don’t enjoy the jungle, and that’s ok. The multi layered maps take some getting used to. It grew on me after the April changes, but I think that all content doesn’t have to appeal to everyone. I do think the difficulty increase over core maps was needed, though. I myself have never set foot in raids or “real” WvW because I’m in a small guild and those things haven’t been a priority for me in my limited playtime (real life makes me the very definition of casual, lol), but I can see the value in that content for people who enjoy it, and wouldn’t want to see it nerfed because it wasn’t exactly what I thought it should be.