Showing Posts For mezo.9568:
Please remove the AOE cap, it definitely empowers the mindless zerg.
Yes I call it tactics to AOE choke points.
I also call it tactics to have your ORGANIZED zerg put up stability and double dodge right through it all and plow into the tower/whatever.
I agree, I think the AoE capped should be raised higher, and I would say pulling someone where you want them (choke point) is tactics. I was more appealing to the thought that “our 3 eles drop a group of 30 before they can scramble” like with stability or dodge roll is NOT tactics. If they can kill them that fast that is in now way tactics, that’s firepower. That’s blatantly dropping a nuke on North Korea saying “You cant do crap about it, good luck.”
They are saying (I believe) that those 3 should be able to wipe out 30 before they can use tactics to counter an ambush. I would say that if they are smart enough to roll out and stability up, those 3 should get their butts whooped, which is likely what is happening to them now.
You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.
You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.
Seconded. Lack of game knowledge shouldn’t be catered to after a point. This game allows for content land to extend forever with success!
“You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.” – Me
Then your lack of comprehending what sarsbear wrote is a falsity. 3 staff eles aoeing on top of 30 guys should drop said 30 guys if clumped and remain clumped. That is fact if the Aoe cap was removed. You telling us that Aoe cap won’t help is incorrect.
That is not precisely why the AoE cap was put in place, see my earlier responses.
I would like to confirm from you though that you think it is fair for 3 Eles to drop meteor shower on a group of 25, and should wipe them out without actually putting thought in to the fight beyond “put them in the choke and drop one spell”. That would be “tactics” to you?
Anyone else is welcome to answer this question as well cuz I think it is relevant…. I agree it should be able to happen, and I believe those 30 should learn to GET THE F OUT OF THE WAY
Again I am with you guys on this. If they don’t move, they should die. Removing the cap or raising it will help. However the zerg wont just stand there, they WILL dodge roll or use cool downs. Raising the cap isn’t going to work the way you think it is going to. But again I think it should be raised!
You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.
Sorry, I guess I should have expanded on my thoughts. The average WvW player in my mind is that ranger that auto attacks while backstepping, and continues to do so while he is being focused. It is sad that I consider those that know how to dodge out of AoE to be among the more knowledgeable of the mindless zerg population… but I guarantee you if there was no AoE cap that our 5 man, and yours as well I am sure, would never lose to that skilless zerg. As it is right now, our initial hit will drop a good amount of them, but they have 3 people resing each downed zergling, and eventually we have to string them out or are forced off due to the sheer amount of damage that 30 auto attacks can do.
If they have that many to your numbers you shouldn’t be fighting that, you need to split that up a lot more before you engage themI guess this is getting a bit off topic from what I initially thought for this thread. I am just excited to see that the devs are trying to implement more skilled combat into WvW, and it is obviously something that some people don’t want (Not you Mezo, but our friend Raf here).
Response in bold above and :
Hmm. I think it’s neat that you can drop people quickly, but they aren’t necessarily out of the fight. Their allies can either choose to assist them and give up on you temporarily (giving you time to escape the situation WITH PRIDE) or if they chase after you, you can fight them and get your fight. Obviously if the group is large enough to do both, this is the scenario where you’re fighting with your fists instead of your head. You need to break that group up a lot more.
You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.
You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.
Seconded. Lack of game knowledge shouldn’t be catered to after a point. This game allows for content land to extend forever with success!
“You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.” – Me
Then your lack of comprehending what sarsbear wrote is a falsity. 3 staff eles aoeing on top of 30 guys should drop said 30 guys if clumped and remain clumped. That is fact if the Aoe cap was removed. You telling us that Aoe cap won’t help is incorrect.
That is not precisely why the AoE cap was put in place, see my earlier responses.
I would like to confirm from you though that you think it is fair for 3 Eles to drop meteor shower on a group of 25, and should wipe them out without actually putting thought in to the fight beyond “put them in the choke and drop one spell”. That would be “tactics” to you?
I’m not bum hurt in the least. But couple of Paxa guys in this thread act like they think that thier interpretation of the game is the only one that matters. I disagree with them. And I’ll tell them what I think.
I do like to zerg, except when I’m small grouping with the guild. But I don’t try make make it seem like my views speak for the entire server.
I’ve seen these forum tactics before. People just need to speak up so ANet doesn’t get the idea that your views are the views of everyone involved in WvW. We all have opinions on this game. But none are less valid than anyone else’s.
And creating a long forum thread doesn’t validate those views over anyone else’s either.
I tried to explain it to you in extremely simple words, but it still seems to go over your head as you say that we think our way to play the game is the only one that matters. Until you offer some cognitive ability to hold a conversation and show some sort of reading comprehension, I’ll just let you continue on posting your slander towards us and refrain from responding to you from here on out.
Not to be harsh, but I would hardly blame him for not understanding what you two are saying. I did’t call you out maliciously because I figured there is probably a legitimate excuse (ESL, emotional, young) for you two not writing clearly. I found this reply funny. Again, sorry that I AM now calling you out on it. I’ll gladly keep to the discussion of wvw as opposed to digressing to the petty though!
You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.
You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.
Seconded. Lack of game knowledge shouldn’t be catered to after a point. This game allows for content land to extend forever with success!
“You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.” – Me
Mezo how many people does ur “5 man” hit back peddling facing you coming right at them? Get maybe an ability or two off? Seems like the majority of zergers play with this style that we hit….
Are you asking:
“How many stay and fight (while back peddling away from us) before they actually come at you?” or, are you asking, “How many people we hit with our skills as we back peddle away from a zerg coming at us?”
I do agree with a larger AoE cap. although I don’t think you understand that they are gonna carry the same firepower of mass AoE that you do when they have uncapped AoE. They are still gonna send five people after every one of you, and still have people to spare. I just think it will help small groups slow down a zerg, but it for sure isn’t going to stop them.
We have been dealing with 5 people to our 1 for months now. thats not new, what would be new, is my 5 being able to hit your 25……deal with that and then lets talk. Because we are already dealing many times with the 5 to 1 ratio of incoming damage. We are saying even up the playing field with DMG OUTPUT and you are scared and dont like the idea.
I do not understand what you are saying here. I would like to respond though.
He’s saying that changing the AoE cap has no effect on the zerg. A group of 25 has already been enjoying hitting all 5 players in a group for months, while the group of 5 has been only allowed to do dmg to 20% of them because of game mechanics.
If the cap was changed to 10 the zerg would still hit all 5 of the group, but the group of 5 can now hit 40%. In reality with all the pets and minions and clones, this probably means the group of 5 can now do dmg to actual players.
You’ll see far fewer players running right through your cripple/stun/whatever field immune to its effects just because he’s surrounded by friendlies. Your small group of 5 can use more baiting/terrain/whatever tactics because their abilities will now work against the larger force. Should 5 beat 60? No, never really, but they shouldn’t have their abilities made useless just because there are more than 5 enemies.
Thank you, he re-wrote it so I could understand and I replied. There is no reason to believe that uncapping the AoE will do anything in open world. They will dodge roll out or use cool downs, they spread out and you’re dead anyways.
If you don’t think it will help then it should be no big deal if they do it. I could be wrong cause I started playing WVW late cause I used to spvp. But didn’t the 5 cap come in later cause small organized groups where killing zergs? I could be wrong I thought I read that somewhere.
I just want to remind you guys that I agree with you for removing the AoE cap. The five man cap came in because the fights did not last long enough to player’s and ArenaNet’s goals. You would have 50 on 50, they would drop all of their AoE, and the fight would be over in a matter of seconds, as opposed to the more long and drawn out encounters we have now, NOT because small mans were wiping out big groups. I agree with that, it would suck to roam a map as a zerg with 5 Eles for a few minutes to finally find another force, then only get 4 seconds of fighting because they had 10 Eles.
Well maybe then the AOE cap just needs to be raised to 10 or 15. It makes sense why they did it then, tho you can get back into the fight in under 15 sec the way the maps are made hehe. I think raising the AOE cap to hit players is raised to 10 would be a great start.
Hear hear!
You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.
You seem to be describing players that know what they are doing. Skilless players, which there are plenty of in WvW, will not be playing smartly, and deserved to be punished for it. Right now, they are not punished what-so-ever for their lack of game knowledge.
You consider dodge rolling or using cool downs to get out of mass AoE skill? If they do this they “know what they are doing” and if they do not they are “skill less”. If that’s all that makes the difference from a skilled player to a not skilled I think you and are talking very different levels of tactics. I apologize for wasting your time.
I do agree with a larger AoE cap. although I don’t think you understand that they are gonna carry the same firepower of mass AoE that you do when they have uncapped AoE. They are still gonna send five people after every one of you, and still have people to spare. I just think it will help small groups slow down a zerg, but it for sure isn’t going to stop them.
We have been dealing with 5 people to our 1 for months now. thats not new, what would be new, is my 5 being able to hit your 25……deal with that and then lets talk. Because we are already dealing many times with the 5 to 1 ratio of incoming damage. We are saying even up the playing field with DMG OUTPUT and you are scared and dont like the idea.
I do not understand what you are saying here. I would like to respond though.
He’s saying that changing the AoE cap has no effect on the zerg. A group of 25 has already been enjoying hitting all 5 players in a group for months, while the group of 5 has been only allowed to do dmg to 20% of them because of game mechanics.
If the cap was changed to 10 the zerg would still hit all 5 of the group, but the group of 5 can now hit 40%. In reality with all the pets and minions and clones, this probably means the group of 5 can now do dmg to actual players.
You’ll see far fewer players running right through your cripple/stun/whatever field immune to its effects just because he’s surrounded by friendlies. Your small group of 5 can use more baiting/terrain/whatever tactics because their abilities will now work against the larger force. Should 5 beat 60? No, never really, but they shouldn’t have their abilities made useless just because there are more than 5 enemies.
Thank you, he re-wrote it so I could understand and I replied. There is no reason to believe that uncapping the AoE will do anything in open world. They will dodge roll out or use cool downs, they spread out and you’re dead anyways.
If you don’t think it will help then it should be no big deal if they do it. I could be wrong cause I started playing WVW late cause I used to spvp. But didn’t the 5 cap come in later cause small organized groups where killing zergs? I could be wrong I thought I read that somewhere.
I just want to remind you guys that I agree with you for removing the AoE cap. The five man cap came in because the fights did not last long enough to player’s and ArenaNet’s goals. You would have 50 on 50, they would drop all of their AoE, and the fight would be over in a matter of seconds, as opposed to the more long and drawn out encounters we have now, NOT because small mans were wiping out big groups. I agree with that, it would suck to roam a map as a zerg with 5 Eles for a few minutes to finally find another force, then only get 4 seconds of fighting because they had 10 Eles.
That’s WvW, you want to change points?
Again it suck but points = nothing in this game at this time all it does is = population.
What do you get for being 1st on t1 or being 1st on t8 nothing its the same. So whats the difference, population.
I believe 1st place right now is Sanctum of Rall. Their population is large, but I believe the last census stated they were still smaller population than #2 & #3. I would assume they DO get something out of it (although not material from ArenaNet) from being number one. That’s why they fight. Population does play a very big role in WvW. I don’t dis-agree with you there. But it certainly isn’t the end all be all of WvW, and if you aren’t playing for points anyways, then you have an even bigger advantage in the fact that you can take your time in breaking those zergs up. It’s like surgery without a timer!
I do agree with a larger AoE cap. although I don’t think you understand that they are gonna carry the same firepower of mass AoE that you do when they have uncapped AoE. They are still gonna send five people after every one of you, and still have people to spare. I just think it will help small groups slow down a zerg, but it for sure isn’t going to stop them.
We have been dealing with 5 people to our 1 for months now. thats not new, what would be new, is my 5 being able to hit your 25……deal with that and then lets talk. Because we are already dealing many times with the 5 to 1 ratio of incoming damage. We are saying even up the playing field with DMG OUTPUT and you are scared and dont like the idea.
I do not understand what you are saying here. I would like to respond though.
He’s saying that changing the AoE cap has no effect on the zerg. A group of 25 has already been enjoying hitting all 5 players in a group for months, while the group of 5 has been only allowed to do dmg to 20% of them because of game mechanics.
If the cap was changed to 10 the zerg would still hit all 5 of the group, but the group of 5 can now hit 40%. In reality with all the pets and minions and clones, this probably means the group of 5 can now do dmg to actual players.
You’ll see far fewer players running right through your cripple/stun/whatever field immune to its effects just because he’s surrounded by friendlies. Your small group of 5 can use more baiting/terrain/whatever tactics because their abilities will now work against the larger force. Should 5 beat 60? No, never really, but they shouldn’t have their abilities made useless just because there are more than 5 enemies.
Thank you, he re-wrote it so I could understand and I replied. There is no reason to believe that uncapping the AoE will do anything in open world. They will dodge roll out or use cool downs, they spread out and you’re dead anyways.
Mezo and raf, clearly you guys are of the zerging camp and DO NOT wish to leave content land or ever be challenged…Thats fine. There are some that do and we hope Anet realizes this or will be faced with the few competitive people leaving their game for good.
I have mentioned already that my group never runs with more than 5. I hope this doesn’t constitute a “zerg” in your opinion. I am trying to help you achieve what you are looking for because it IS fun, but it requires that you use your head (something you clamor about, and why zergs suck) before you can be competitive. I am sorry you don’t see that.
I’m not sorry, but you play for meta and we play for kills.
You JUST SAID that you want to fight for “around the hills, and in an open world” THAT IS META. If you just want kills, then you know where you should go.
If you (a five man group) successfully defended, why isn’t your second five man heading to the next tower? They can do the same thing. After enough “NOPE” from you, they have no choice but to split it up!
I guess we have just had different experiences in WvW then. Mindless zergs, in my experience, will always run with more people rather than split up. Or they just get frustrated and leave WvW, which none of us want, for obvious reasons as we don’t want WvW to die.
It takes a while before they get their heads on and start splitting up to fight you on smaller levels, it doesn’t happen right away, but when it does, you will get EXACTLY what you’re looking for. In the meantime, you get to remind your group that you are conditioning them and turning them into your little pawns with a fraction of their firepower.
As far as the second part, if they are going to leave WvW because you forced them to split up, how is forcing them to play AS five man tactics going to change their decision to leave. They are going to leave if you force them to fight AS five mans anyways.
When you arent roaming in a zerg, and you rely on less people to win, your skill naturally increases every fight. This doesnt happen as you are allowed to win in fights just by adding numbers to the pile. If we are allowed to hit more than 5 guys, it will hopefully allow for growth beyond the classic zergball mentality and leave some people with the option of get better or quit, not stay in content land and remain the same forever.
… We are fighting for the same thing. You are asking ArenaNet to hand you something that already exists but you cant figure it out. I understand what you are saying here, I love it. Uncapping AoE will work like this:
You (5 guys)
Them (50 guys)
You 5 spike a choke hold and drop your uncapped AoE. It will NOT kill them, they dodge roll out or use cool downs. They spread like bugs. Now you have 10:1 on you. You think that you can take on 10 guys yourself, with them all spread out? It only helps you in Towers and Keeps where they (temporarily) cannot get to you. Siege already does this.
Mezo and raf, clearly you guys are of the zerging camp and DO NOT wish to leave content land or ever be challenged…Thats fine. There are some that do and we hope Anet realizes this or will be faced with the few competitive people leaving their game for good.
I have mentioned already that my group never runs with more than 5. I hope this doesn’t constitute a “zerg” in your opinion. I am trying to help you achieve what you are looking for because it IS fun, but it requires that you use your head (something you clamor about, and why zergs suck) before you can be competitive. I am sorry you don’t see that.
I like a lot of the ideas from you guys, but I fear that you guys aren’t playing WvW as tactfully as you can. Try it out, it really does work.
one thing about our group and a couple other smaller man guilds we know is the points system, capturing towers/camps/keeps/ whatever hasnt been fun after the 100th time taking something.
That’s WvW, you want to change points?We find enjoyment in fighting peoples best efforts on the field…using the open world platform to roam, best position our group for a fight, while giving ourselves the best advantages to win. Like the guy said, “there is a sense of whats over the hill” in wvw that IS NOT in spvp. We enjoy the random chance, the no time limit, the no kill limit.
I LOVE this, this is what we fight for as well. I perfectly understand you here. Unfortunately, there is a bit more tactic that just fighting these groups, you have to help the overall map as well. This should ADD to your tactics and experience, not deter your experience.What is broken is the fact that Anet has established ZERG ONLY mentality.
From your point of view, but you gotta fight with your head before you can fight with your fists!The aoe cap removal would lessen this mentality and establish a bit more balance.
I agree! But you’re still outnumbered 5:1 even if you can hit all 5 of them, all 5 of them can hit you harder.The wvw scene should not just be 5 mans owning 20+ mans. It should be a balance of both. and right now, it is “Bring more numbers because this 5 man over here is good….or just run inside until those 5 guys get bored of our 20 on arrow carts….” pretty boring.
Many previous responses are telling you how to break up those groups and force them to fight on your level, think like a terrorist!
Responses in bold
I do agree with a larger AoE cap. although I don’t think you understand that they are gonna carry the same firepower of mass AoE that you do when they have uncapped AoE. They are still gonna send five people after every one of you, and still have people to spare. I just think it will help small groups slow down a zerg, but it for sure isn’t going to stop them.
Ya they will have mass AOE and thats cool but ppl will have to think when they play instead of being in a ball.
They are gonna spread like bugs, and will still have 5:1 on you, they wil still wipe you open field
When they(zerg) spread out leaves the small group to start taking out the ppl 1 by 1(and they cant focus rezz cause there not in a ball) and this is where the skill comes in from the zerg side or the small man side.
They are going to spread out just far enough to kill you 5:1Also allows a small man group to defend a tower aginst 30 if they all ball up outside of the gate, or allows them to hold off the wall thats down by AOEing the choke point.
They already allow you to do this. With Siege. That’s what defensive siege is forWhich in turn will help small pop servers as well. Look its not 100% fix but it will help. And I don’t think they should do unlimited aoe cap to start with make 10 or 15 and go from there.
I agree
Responses in bold
If you (a five man group) successfully defended, why isn’t your second five man heading to the next tower? They can do the same thing. After enough “NOPE” from you, they have no choice but to split it up!
I guess we have just had different experiences in WvW then. Mindless zergs, in my experience, will always run with more people rather than split up. Or they just get frustrated and leave WvW, which none of us want, for obvious reasons as we don’t want WvW to die.
It takes a while before they get their heads on and start splitting up to fight you on smaller levels, it doesn’t happen right away, but when it does, you will get EXACTLY what you’re looking for. In the meantime, you get to remind your group that you are conditioning them and turning them into your little pawns with a fraction of their firepower.
As far as the second part, if they are going to leave WvW because you forced them to split up, how is forcing them to play AS five man tactics going to change their decision to leave. They are going to leave if you force them to fight AS five mans anyways.
I do agree with a larger AoE cap. although I don’t think you understand that they are gonna carry the same firepower of mass AoE that you do when they have uncapped AoE. They are still gonna send five people after every one of you, and still have people to spare. I just think it will help small groups slow down a zerg, but it for sure isn’t going to stop them.
We have been dealing with 5 people to our 1 for months now. thats not new, what would be new, is my 5 being able to hit your 25……deal with that and then lets talk. Because we are already dealing many times with the 5 to 1 ratio of incoming damage. We are saying even up the playing field with DMG OUTPUT and you are scared and dont like the idea.
I do not understand what you are saying here. I would like to respond though.
I like a lot of the ideas from you guys, but I fear that you guys aren’t playing WvW as tactfully as you can. Try it out, it really does work.
When you take that camp, you have 100 supplies. Drop a few supply traps, then you have 5 minutes to go knocking on a tower or keep. They come back to take the camp, they get no supplies, even if they get the camp. They wipe out your scratch group hitting their keep tower, but cant repair without using tower/keep supply. Persistance! It works beautifully, I do it all the time! We have been able to SLOWLY turn a map in our favour, it just takes time, patience and persistence. I promise!
I understand what you are saying. What happens after your successful defense? They zerg somewhere else… not split up into smaller groups to recap the camps.
If you (a five man group) successfully defended, why isn’t your second five man heading to the next tower? They can do the same thing. After enough “NOPE” from you, they have no choice but to split it up!
I do agree with a larger AoE cap. although I don’t think you understand that they are gonna carry the same firepower of mass AoE that you do when they have uncapped AoE. They are still gonna send five people after every one of you, and still have people to spare. I just think it will help small groups slow down a zerg, but it for sure isn’t going to stop them.
Me
Wrong, our argument is to have more than 2-3 light/medium weights in the ring….maybe having 10-15 rather than 3 heavyweights and 2 lights. No dude, we dont want ez mode as small mans. Small mans implys just that, HARDER THAN ANY OTHER FORM to compete with heavyweight zergs. The argument is make it more realistic to be able to COMPETE…..not win all the time. Reread this thread, couple guys said well skilled/organized guilds/zergs should be able to beat small mans, but by using skill and coordination WHILE FIGHTING….not the games mechanics of aoe cap and downed state as well as small maps.
You want to compete. As a lightweight. Against a heavyweight. And have the possibility of winning. You are still thinking with your fists. Fight with your brain. If you keep them drained, they have no choice but to break up and attempt to be at all possible locations. You just used your brain to turn your heavyweight into lightweights, on your level. Then you can have the fights you want.
If i wanted to play RISK id be playing the board game. I am here to play against other players……so what you are suggesting isnt fun for our entire guild and guilds like us. We want to actually FIGHT and compete with skills and abilities….
Then Schedule a GvG or Go in to TPvP or SPvP. That’s exactly what you’re describing. Why should those of us that want to play WvW, with tactics be forced to line it up like rock em sock em robots or do 10vs10 death matches? There are other places for that!
You want to compete. As a lightweight. Against a heavyweight. And have the possibility of winning. You are still thinking with your fists. Fight with your brain. If you keep them drained, they have no choice but to break up and attempt to be at all possible locations. You just used your brain to turn your heavyweight into lightweights, on your level. Then you can have the fights you want.
This is not true in the current state of WvW unfortunately. There have been multiple situations where my server has taken just about every camp on an enemy bl (HoD has a decent amount of small groups running around on a nightly basis). A zerg comes in, and do they split up to reclaim all the camps? No, they flip one or two camps, each taking a matter of seconds, and go attack the nearest tower/keep. They own all of the towers/keeps – doesn’t matter. They’ll still run around as a zerg to flip the camps. There is no reason or incentive for them to split off, they are just as effective staying together and have a less chance of dying due to numbers. Mind you, we are talking about the mindless zerg here, not the organized zergs.
When you take that camp, you have 100 supplies. Drop a few supply traps, then you have 5 minutes to go knocking on a tower or keep. They come back to take the camp, they get no supplies, even if they get the camp. They wipe out your scratch group hitting their keep tower, but cant repair without using tower/keep supply. Persistance! It works beautifully, I do it all the time! We have been able to SLOWLY turn a map in our favour, it just takes time, patience and persistence. I promise!
stuff
Some small man want to fight ppl not with siege, but with the skills on there bar. Yes I think a small group that knows what they are doing should be able to wipe a zerg. But if the zerg has half a brain they should kill them or make them run.
Also ppl that think PPT means anything is just silly cause it means nothing. PPT has nothing to do with skill 95% of the time, PPT is population. If the AOE cap was removed or brought to a decent number then I think servers with less pop have a better fighting chance if they have there kitten together.
Still funny how ppl still fight and think PPT means something.
You joined World vs World, to have small fights? And don’t care about your worlds progress? Seems like you should be in SPvP.
And a small group should not be able to take out a large group head on. There is a reason that when the U.S. goes to war, it’s enemies hide, run small groups, and use guerrilla tactics. Only a novice would take their rebel group of 500 against an army of several million. You force them to fight on your level, read my previous reply and fight with your brain, stop trying to go head on.
Me
Wrong, our argument is to have more than 2-3 light/medium weights in the ring….maybe having 10-15 rather than 3 heavyweights and 2 lights. No dude, we dont want ez mode as small mans. Small mans implys just that, HARDER THAN ANY OTHER FORM to compete with heavyweight zergs. The argument is make it more realistic to be able to COMPETE…..not win all the time. Reread this thread, couple guys said well skilled/organized guilds/zergs should be able to beat small mans, but by using skill and coordination WHILE FIGHTING….not the games mechanics of aoe cap and downed state as well as small maps.
You want to compete. As a lightweight. Against a heavyweight. And have the possibility of winning. You are still thinking with your fists. Fight with your brain. If you keep them drained, they have no choice but to break up and attempt to be at all possible locations. You just used your brain to turn your heavyweight into lightweights, on your level. Then you can have the fights you want.
A lot of small groups seem to be wanting to be able to go head to head with a large zerg and wipe it. These are the same mindless tactics you are accusing the big zerg of using that you want applied to your small man group. Stand at a choke and AoE, really, that’s tactics?
My small group flourishes at denying the map to zergs, with the API changes and the supply traps, siege buffs, and invincible camp supervisors, y’all are obviously not getting the hint. My group (which refuses to go above 5 members, we form a second group at that point) runs to camps as the timer expires, drops a supply trap near the mindless entrance, on top of the supplies, and still has enough supplies to throw up 2 arrow carts to defend a tower or keep. We watch map chat for zerg movements and after about an hour of us being on the map, we have enough siege built on our structures to defend keeps and towers. Someone mentioned before “A zerg with no supplies is a useless zerg”, AMEN. They can run around open field fighting all day long, and not be able to make an advancement in PPT if your two small mans play well. You build catapults or flame rams, slowly drain the supply of their tier three towers, run when you see the zerg coming, and keep at it, they cant repair if they are out of supplies, meaning they are gonna help you in draining their own towers and keeps more for you.
You guys are TERRORISTS, NOT WAR HEROS, NOT SPARTANS. Persistence is the key. I don’t know what you guys expect ArenaNet to do in order to make your small five man group of Sun-Tzus and Sima-Yis be able to take out a 60 man group head on, but you are very obviously over inflated.
They build trebs to start advancing? You take your five man and you build an arrow cart and destroy that crap, their zerg isn’t going to sit on their trebuchet, and if they are, you bring your two five mans together temporarily and counter trebuchet that trebuchet.
You watch map chat for zerg movements, they make a move to your tower or keep? You better hope you know how to place arrow carts and can hit the gate with the four arrow carts you built while one spotter is watching for catapults, trebuchet, or counter carts.
There are almost no instances where a dedicated group of five cant wreak havoc on a group of 40-60. You guys are making the request to ArenaNet to have a lightweight beat the crap out of a heavyweight, as opposed to winning the fight with your head, your still trying to use your fists.
(edited by mezo.9568)
BG “Where guilds transfer to die”.
(Steve Irwin:) Shh… quiet.. we don’t want to startle it. This here folks is what’s commonly referred to as a Troll. They get clingy if you feed them. I’m gonna try and touch it…
So the quote is accurate on both counts. Transfer to BG to die (Steve Irwin). Troll SoR is Troll.
!http://imgur.com/6VpWF!
The conversation went on to ‘If Anet didnt want it, they wouldn’t have it in the game’ and several people including myself explaining that they knew that it was not intended in the game, but yet they did it anyways.
TLDR One of our Blackgate guys was caught wall jumping, and fussed up, and had his butt lit on fire from team mates, I doubt this is the first time he has done it or the last. I apologize TC.