Guild Wars 2

phaneo.4597:

Here’s the link :P

http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/14u07l/death_of_a_dolyak_love_and_tragedy_in_wvw/

Please please please move further discussion here (if you can even still post here? If not just make a new one). This thread was so nice to read prior to the drama that was brought here.

Middzz.1490:

nibbles.2408:

Middzz.1490:

more about your server than any of your protestations .

Yeah you lost my sympathy here.

QQ, pvp in pvp zone, heathen barbarians, loot bags, retaliation, spawn camping, yada yada yada.

We’ve all been through it before, and will continue to re-live it it seems. Lets just move on already okay?

Edit: In fact why doesn’t someone just link the reddit from the first one, and subsequently move all the back and forth to that medium. Instead of clogging up this one with pointless junk.

You miss the point not that it not allowed it is not that you couldnt you can …

The point is you chose too……

…….as said impressed by your sefless bravery heroism true warrior spirit it shines through your actions .

And you miss the point that I actually agree with you. I just don’t think it’s worth crying on the forums about.

Middzz.1490:

more about your server than any of your protestations .

Yeah you lost my sympathy here.

QQ, pvp in pvp zone, heathen barbarians, loot bags, retaliation, spawn camping, yada yada yada.

We’ve all been through it before, and will continue to re-live it it seems. Lets just move on already okay?

Edit: In fact why doesn’t someone just link the reddit from the first one, and subsequently move all the back and forth to that medium. Instead of clogging up this one with pointless junk.

Avatar of Belle.9623:

I thought TC and FA had a love affair! Hickeroar you make it sound like you’re a bit tired of your ‘fiancee.’

Fiancee? No, we’re about to celebrate our Diamond Anniversary at this point.

Reading the forums is always more enjoyable when we are fighting Maguuma.

Rackhir Tanelorn.9123:

nibbles.2408:

Or, barring that, moving to a server like JQ so the balance of what was T2 is not messed up further.

Sadly that isn’t going to happen (and not because of TC).

Because of the Random Match-ups there is a pretty decent chance that at least one “former T1” Server will drop down to face non-T1 Servers.

What I’m pushing for (shameless plug) is for ANet to start handicapping matches.

We’re never going to have “perfectly balanced” tiers/servers/matches but with handicaps we can make them all fairly competitive.

Alright last post on the subject because I want to avoid sounding like a troll/forum warrior whathaveyou.

The point about random matches is right, but even with a T1 server dropping, 3 good T2 servers could put up a decent fight. The same goes for any tier really that moves up or down. As it stands when the stacked servers drop, they dominate precisely because they are stacked—as WvW has been from the beginning. Unlike the past, we are now forced to face this imbalance head on because of the randomness.

So, imo, the randomness doesn’t mean we shouldn’t care about balance because “someone is always going to get dominated,” but we should care more about balance, so that the server who wins doesn’t do so in a fun-killing blowout. Probably a pipe dream, but just something I wish more people would consider as we super stack the top servers.

Although the responsibility of Anet to fix the system (which at this point I dunno many who would disagree that it is broken) is pretty huge, whether it be through handicaps or less randomness or whatever.

MomentofWeakness.1246:

TC told us in the server meeting they don’t recruit NA guilds, the only reason they approached us is because we are an EB-focused Guild and that’s what attracted the TC community to our Guild. Their recruitment thread even states that NA is not something they need.

Fair enough. Like I said I’m not attacking TC or RE in any way. I just know personally, and I’m sure a lot of other people agree, that for balance reasons it would have been nice to see RE move to a server that needed the help more (even if it wasn’t FA). Or, barring that, moving to a server like JQ so the balance of what was T2 is not messed up further.

Kingzook.1620:

I truthfully think arena net had in mind was for the servers to even out but i was proven wrong by that when they increase the cap yet again.

Now im almost positive that they will close 3 servers within the year and merge the population on to the remaining servers.

This. If Anet wants to consolidate servers and save money/space, they are going about it the right way. Unfortunately this means an imbalanced, randomized mess in the meantime.

katanah.8431:

I am not trying to be mean in saying this but if it does upset you so much why dont you recruit for your own server? As you stated you lost guilds, it isnt just RE being on TC that would change that. Just fix the problem you see. You guys do have great guilds out there and plenty of skill on your server.. allow the good part of your server to shine, let other guilds who may be scouting other servers to join see a great community so perhaps you replace the guilds that left.

We have been recruiting, we have a recruitment post up and everything. The problem is there aren’t enough players/guilds to go around. The way it stands the top 4 servers are becoming super stacked, and the answer that is given by you is to stack yet a 5th server to balance it all out? I say that isn’t the right solution.

Before TC acquired its new guilds T2 was relatively balanced. Now I doubt a TC/DB/FA matchup would be anywhere near the same as it once was. I won’t say that TC shouldn’t recruit, but I feel like a more evenly distributed population would be better for the game overall.

Hickeroar.9734:

Yes, that would cause another “T1 server” to roll down in the list for a week, but I think that’s the kind of variance that ANet was hoping for.

Yes, it also stinks for the servers that are getting beat, but that’s going to happen anyway.

As it stands, we end up facing servers that aren’t remotely able to compete with our coverage. I’d rather lose to a T1 server than win the way we are right now.

I normally agree with you Hickeroar so it makes me a little upset to see this coming from you. But hypothetically, if TC had not recruited so heavily, you wouldn’t be stomping servers so badly, so your need to move up to T1 wouldn’t be as great. It just seems like you are sending mixed signals saying that you want harder fights, so you have to recruit for them, which in turn will give you easier fights.

Like I said I’m not trying to say recruiting is bad (I’m not the type of person who can tell others what they should or shouldn’t do), and FA recruits as well, I just wish more people would see the downsides of recruiting/stacking as well.

Jinks.2057:

Pasfiebe.9186:

Alot of FA are taking the week off to be honest so its a bit more even, don’t get too kitteny magooomagins !

Ya why would you log on to get ran over by a T5 server when you can just take a "vacation’ while your off hrs PvD to victory.

Totally agree with you.

Heh you should make up your mind. On one forum you say pvd isn’t worth whining about, then on this forum you whine about it. So which is it exactly?

FA’s fairweathers are also going to come out of the woodwork, so enjoy those tasty bags =D

You’ll have to forgive FA’s “PvD squad,” this is their first week with that designation. Normally they are the “be massively outnumbered by KN/DB squad.” It’s been so long they probably haven’t discovered the best way to dps down those pesky doors yet =P

And to FA: stow the bragging right now. We’ll win this week with numbers and coverage, nothing special to come here boasting about.

Thanks for the nod Hickeroar. And hats off to TC honestly. At the beginning of this week I had hoped that FA would claim its first victory over T2 (mostly wishful thinking of course) but once again you guys have proven that you are the champs of this tier. I checked MOS and I counted 18 weeks total that FA/TC have faced each other, and thankfully the hostilities have settled down to a respectable level.

Dragonbrand, you are awesome opponents. You came out of the gate into T2 with a fury, but unfortunately you have lose some of your luster. Hopefully the server mixups will bring some of it back.

Cheers all and in all likelihood we will be fighting each other some more so stay awesome!

Wow that RE thread is causing so much drama it cannot be contained within one thread!

I got tired of how borked WvW was with the siege glitch so I decided to take a cat nap on TC’s northern doorstep.

Managed to stay there for over 6 mins before a lucky KH guy came by and collected my bag.

Noooooo! After so many weeks of fighting TC, I dunno what I’ll do without them.

Hickeroar.9734:

nibbles.2408:

danelon.5147:

Take FA keeps and Garrison they vulnerable now. Who will defend them, what little coverage and support they have. With guilds leaving left and right FA will pull an SOS maneuver (Tier 1 to tier 4 in about a month).

The 99% of FA who are NOT leaving will defend with our lives (or just take yours), thank you very much =)

You’re talking to a FA spy residing on TC. Just in case you didn’t realize.

An FA spy on TC? Even more reason to kill him imo. Spying is a joke.

danelon.5147:

Take FA keeps and Garrison they vulnerable now. Who will defend them, what little coverage and support they have. With guilds leaving left and right FA will pull an SOS maneuver (Tier 1 to tier 4 in about a month).

The 99% of FA who are NOT leaving will defend with our lives (or just take yours), thank you very much =)

Maybe I’m blind but I’m pretty sure that the “Wagonbrand” stuff is coming in equal measures from both TC and FA members. Dunno why FA is being singled out?

Regardless, must it be repeated that servers are not a collective hive mind? I’m from FA and I could care less about DB transfers. So why can’t that be the opinion that is plastered on the “this is what FA thinks” board instead of only negative ones?

nomdeplums.5780:

Hadan.2841:

FA’s huge RET zerg.

RET has a zerg? Did I miss something or are we multiplying before my very eyes?

I believe he was referring to back in our T3 days before RET split into the new RET and VK.

The Pickle is such a good thief that he look/acts/plays/etc. exactly like a guardian? Haxor =P

I dunno that I would go so far to say we dislike being first (as long as it isn’t a steamroll), but I would agree that for the most part we don’t actively seek it out. We do get a lot of fairweathers when we are “winning,” but the core WvW’ers are out there win or lose.

I could care less about the stats, but all the “FA is losing” posts got me thinking about how hard pressed you’d be to find a server that has a majority of “wins” (JQ maybe?).

Bored in class (teacher not student though =D) so I added it up.

Fort Aspenwood:
1st- 8
2nd- 14
3rd- 11

That’s 8 “wins” and 25 “losses” for those keeping track at home. That MOS site has so much interesting information.

I don’t have time to do it for TC and DB but It would be Interesting to see the comparison… although I think FA has the worst stats probably lol.

Oolune.4357:

It’s that time again, folks!

Happy reset eve!

And in less than 24 hours it’ll be 2-14! Whooo suck it TC!

Kidding of course =) I dunno if a second place over TC even counts, so really we could still be at 0 lol.

But you know what… arrow carts will still be OPsauce in 24 hours.

Keep up the awesome pictures though, I especially like the “rawr I’m a dragon-brand” lizard.

Elano.2014:

Great job defending bay, FA. It took us forever. And those sneaky TC? It was fun.

Sooo much fun. We held for over an hour I think? And I WP’ed at least 3 times after being wiped out defending the lords room, always for one last desperate push. And haha [Awe] from TC being sneaky and hiding up there in the back of Lords. I think we might have been able to push you DB out if they hadn’t of been up there wiping our siege and defensive guys.

Anyways it was great fun, glad to see FA coming back from its break and giving DB a nice welcome to the tier.

Eviator.9746:

nibbles.2408:

I was referring to their introduction post on our website, where they stated their initial reason for leaving DB to transfer to ET.

I’m sure you’re just begging for someone to ask “why did they do it?” Feel important? For anyone who cares, and I’m sure few do, the stated reason is “queue times”. Nothing special.

What Eva said basically. I don’t want to step on any toes here, just provide some general information. Wasn’t trying to be cryptic, just felt it wasn’t my place to state another guild’s intent on the public forum.

Edited for clarity.

Evalana.5480:

nibbles.2408:

Just 15-20 core members under the tag NR. And if the reason for them leaving DB is to be believed then they will fit right in at FA.

They’re not even on DB – they are on ET.

I was referring to their introduction post on our website, where they stated their initial reason for leaving DB to transfer to ET.

Just 15-20 core members under the tag NR. And if the reason for them leaving DB is to be believed then they will fit right in at FA.

I feel like a ratings re-balance would be nice. Not a reset, because the loser of T2 shouldn’t drop to T7, but some of the gaps between the tiers are just ridiculous. TC going to T1 would be a nice change.

Not that we would do much better against BG or SoR, but just a change of scenery would be nice. And the T1/T2 gap is nowhere near the worst.

How does the little thumbs up thing work? Because I want a starred thumb by Shaka’s final picture. Make it happen people! =D

SHAKA ZULU.3128:

<3 you guys. I’d probably rather draw for your thread than ours coming up anyway T^T

We’ll probably need some of your lighthearted pics for the upcoming thread…

But awesome picture =)

GL to you and all of KN in your endeavors.

Oolune.4357:

Happy reset eve!

Darn this thread, my students think I am going crazy with the random bursts of laughter.

Haldunius.7864:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Huygens.4075:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Dhampyr.2104:

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Lol.. Comprehension? I don’t think it is hard to comprehend somebody saying that an ally is now worthless once that ally is no longer strong enough to be of use.

TC and Kaineng were “allies” in regards to how we viewed each other – respect and sportsmanship. Certainly we weren’t allies on the battlefield – my fond thoughts of TC as a server sure didn’t stop me from smoking them, nor did it keep them from planting a spike in my head at times. Not entirely sure why anyone would blow that out of proportion and make it seem like we’re the U.S. and Britain in WWII. On the battlefield, red is dead, as it’s meant to be.

When you start saying that an ally is no longer useful to you it implies something more than a buddy partnership going on. Not that the entire server felt that way about KN. I mean, if you real life friend moves away, do you say “well, theyre useless to me now?” I am sure most people keep in contact as best they can, and not worry about how useful that friend is to them.

You’re reading waaaaaaaay to much into this, dude. We just kill each others virtual avatars for internet points.

Not true. TC is all about the PPTs.

I’ll quote it, “Obv its good to have ally servers, so I’ll play that card all day, but kain isn’t worth much to us anymore”.

Seems full of mutual respect and sportsmanship to me.

Keep in mind that it was one person from TC speaking his mind (I won’t mention who to avoid infractions). While that one person shows a lack of respect and sportsmanship, it isn’t necessarily indicative of the entire server.

Pixelpumpkin.4608:

Please don’t generalise – in all fariness you have to also look at every single TC player who doesn’t diss anybody on the forums OR behind their backs.

They are also the majority.

It’s always the minority that gives a server a bad name unfortunately. Although it seems recently a lot more are getting better at not generalizing like this. I never really understood all the anger and passion from either side honestly, it’s a game, no need to get so worked up and petty over it.

Night Hawk Ix.7360:

azizul.8469:

yay.. T3 next week… i just hope that we have people to play against during SEA/Oceanic… our NA crew will get their fair play ground at last….

Thats ONLY if KN lose this week btw.

A wild Mez appears! =D

Rawr.5930:

nibbles.2408:

I agree wholeheartedly. It seems a match made in heaven on the surface of it all, it’s just the successful work of some trolls that is making it a drag. And only in the forums, speak to any random FA’er or TC’er and I am sure they are both having an equally good time. I know I am.

Exactly!

In fact i had a VERY nice conversation from someone from FA earlier.

Take out the forum personas, and we’d probably get along.

About wvw no less.

An RP carebare and a bloodthirsty killer getting along? According to these forums that doesn’t exist =P

Rawr.5930:

nibbles.2408:

Edit: I meant to quote Theon, but hit the response to his post instead.

I started a thread on the FA forums to discuss this very thing. The conclusion we came to is that FA cares about PPT to the extent that it does not interfere with having fun. Yes there are some who use it as a crutch unfortunately, but most of us want to simply enjoy the good fights, and are quite happy to let TC win T2.

And that’s not to say FA can’t or doesn’t play the points game. We made the push to get to T2, made several weeks of pushing to beat TC, and now we are pushing to stay in the tier. We put on our PPT pants when need be.

Now this isn’t one of those “we could beat you if we tried” posts, TC is a formidable opponent. But your suggestions to improve our meta just aren’t fun in our eyes, because our goals aren’t necessarily the same. Our mentality and culture are in part a product of being dominated in T3 (mostly by TC no less), and it is one we are proud of.

That’s entirely your prerogative, and your server is fully entitled to adopting that attitude.

Likewise, TC has every right to play the ppt meta too no?

I dont know why there’s a need then to QQ endlessly about 2v1, transfers, coverage… etc etc.

IF it’s about the fights, why the QQ about stuff other than fights?

IF some want GvG so much and cant get it in this tier, then is this the right tier?

IF you cant get fights because EVERYONE is running from you (i mean do people seriously believe that, ppt has nothing to do with winning fights obviously…), then is this the tier for you?

So many fallacies it’s bewildering.

I agree wholeheartedly. It seems a match made in heaven on the surface of it all, it’s just the successful work of some trolls that is making it a drag. And only in the forums, speak to any random FA’er or TC’er and I am sure they are both having an equally good time. I know I am.

ykyk.2740:

Lanimal.6541:

Niim.9260:

I wish folks would just accept the fact that servers can have different cultures and thus different views and priorities and different views of success and winning.

Because of a largely opposing views of the game, it is entirely possible for both FA and TC to feel like they are winning at the same time and this thread is the fallout from them trying to prove their winning is more meaningful then the others and gain validation of their version of victory.

The only thing that actually matters to either side is, do you have fun playing the game the way you do? If so, who cares that someone else’s view of success is different then your own?

Fair points but I think the issue is that if FA truly does not care about winning and ppt etc they really should not constantly Q.Q about recruitment / transfers / coverage / 2v1 / PR teams / server zergballs etc.

If all FA wants is open-field fighting; fine talk about it. Talk all you want about GvG and loot bags and continue to post selectively edited footage which I enjoy watching. However, I personally don’t believe that is the case. I believe FA does care about winning and PPT etc but just falls back to this crutch of “oh who cares about the framework of WvWvW” every time they start losing. That I think is where the clash of server cultures happens in my opinion.

To be fair nobody likes to lose and everybody in every form of competition ever comes up with reasons when they do lose. Sometimes it’s valid reflection and often it’s plain excuses, but being able to ignore those reactions is part of sportsmanship and class.

As for the clash of server cultures, I think it makes for great entertainment and rivalry. As long as people don’t start taking things too seriously.

Edit: I meant to quote Theon, but hit the response to his post instead.

I started a thread on the FA forums to discuss this very thing. The conclusion we came to is that FA cares about PPT to the extent that it does not interfere with having fun. Yes there are some who use it as a crutch unfortunately, but most of us want to simply enjoy the good fights, and are quite happy to let TC win T2.

And that’s not to say FA can’t or doesn’t play the points game. We made the push to get to T2, made several weeks of pushing to beat TC, and now we are pushing to stay in the tier. We put on our PPT pants when need be.

Now this isn’t one of those “we could beat you if we tried” posts, TC is a formidable opponent. But your suggestions to improve our meta just aren’t fun in our eyes, because our goals aren’t necessarily the same. Our mentality and culture are in part a product of being dominated in T3 (mostly by TC no less), and it is one we are proud of.

FA has been consistently judged by its forum warriors, a fact that I have often resented because I assumed a label (for being on FA) even though I so rarely agree with our trolls. Now TC has seen a marked increase in their own warriors, so are we to judge their server in a similar fashion?

I for one will not do so. And all I ask is that TC returns the favor. There is sooo much hate for FA because of the viewpoints of our narrow-minded folks that decide to post here, so maybe now TC can understand what it feels like and cut out the hatred and spite. I can guarantee the FA trolls won’t stop, that horse has been beaten enough (trust me i’ve tried). But that doesn’t mean that fire should be fought with fire, burning the thread in the process.

Dear Moderators,

I feel for you, I really do.

-Nibbles

OutspokenAardvark.9781:

I wont deny that getting off-peak hour help has helped our score (and our sleep). But I’m not quite sure why you guys thinks it makes the fights less competitive during the times they’re not even online. That’s all on your end. We have exactly the same team playing when we first got in this tier as we do now. The only difference is you guys just bunker in your keeps behinds seas of arrow carts during NA prime. We’ve gotten better because we run headlong into fights and have grown as a result. When we wipe, we pay the minimal repair fee and get out there again. We don’t run away constantly, cry and stop playing when we’re behind. For a server who constantly says they don’t care about PPT, you sure let it affect you more than any other server I’ve ever seen.

I know [BT] and [VK] are going to come in here and be like GvG, QQ, etc. But there is a reason TC will only GvG with KN and [HOPE]. If you guys want GvG’s, stop whining on the forums and earn some respect by actually fighting us in the field.

Queue rage replies in 3…2…1…

Edit: Okay real response. FA has a fairweather issue, always has and likely always will. I doubt very highly that the fairweathers are the ones you see posting here on the forum, so addressing them like they don’t get out there everyday is only going to incur their resentment (just an observation, so I could be wrong). TC is experiencing the opposite effect, as more of your members show up because of your lead/increased morale.

While the score is close, all three server’s fairweathers show up and make it an even contest, but as soon as the score becomes lopsided so does participation. No judgement, that’s just how it works unfortunately.

At this rate there are still 5 more days left =)

But awesome job FA, keep up the good work.

Draygo.9473:

Also FA needs to keep in mind that Kaineng currently does not want to go to T3 (generally, exceptions abound of course). TC is going to have a huge impact on who gets to stay in t2 and who gets to drop to t3.

Oh I don’t doubt a healthy bit of 2v1 is going to occur (TC hates us and KN doesn’t want to fall), but I want to remind the usual suspects that whining won’t solve anything.

FA will weather this just like it always has, and with all the transfers going on who knows how things will turn out.

MOS always fluctuates wildly during reset weekend. Last weekend it said we were going down to T3 as well, but we ended up passing Kaineng and securing second. The week is still young.

I am a bit surprised at our reset performance. It would seem the time shift hit us pretty hard. Other than that complaining about 2v1 won’t get you anywhere so don’t bother with it.

Rackhir Tanelorn.9123:

nibbles.2408:

Oh one last thing before I go (wow I posted a lot this morning)…

FA is doing a charity pledge drive for the Boston bombings this coming reset week. You can find all the details here:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/FA-Giving-Back-to-the-Community/first#post1859016

But I just wanted to bump it here and encourage everyone from all servers to participate. As much as we get caught up in it, this is still just a game and the world goes on regardless of our petty squabbles here. I for one am thankful that I get to enjoy this game and read these forums with relative comfort, knowing that not everyone is as fortunate. Cheers all =)

This is awesome Nibbles!

Great job on this!

I can’t take credit for this, just passing along the word =)

I am quite broke so I cannot pledge much. But I will pledge $1.00 for every 50 supply used throughout the week. So that’s about $0.02 for every 1 supply used.

MrSilver.5269:

Expunge.4926:

it’s easy to play and have fun when ppt doesn’t give you a guilty conscience

I guess I see things differently… but I also grew up in a generation where they actually kept score in little league.

BTW, is your participation trophy in blue or red?

Everyone plays the game how they want. Respect that decision and move on.

Oh one last thing before I go (wow I posted a lot this morning)…

FA is doing a charity pledge drive for the Boston bombings this coming reset week. You can find all the details here:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/FA-Giving-Back-to-the-Community/first#post1859016

But I just wanted to bump it here and encourage everyone from all servers to participate. As much as we get caught up in it, this is still just a game and the world goes on regardless of our petty squabbles here. I for one am thankful that I get to enjoy this game and read these forums with relative comfort, knowing that not everyone is as fortunate. Cheers all =)

WyldKat.4712:

There IS NO world beyond the eastern coast of America.

What you mean is “There is no world beyond America.” That’s patriotism right there.

You know what this thread hasn’t discussed? The two hour time shift. Which server will benefit or be hurt by it? I suspect TC might get the most benefit, they usually do fairly well during EU time (god knows FA doesn’t have a presence then). Then again it is kind of in a weird limbo now, not EU but not NA either.

Regardless, a lot of NA prime guilds will have trouble getting their full force into WvW it seems, as a lot of them will still be at work/school or at least returning from when reset occurs.

At the very least it will be interesting to see how it plays out for us on FA, reset weekend is typically where we are strongest. I hope the new time doesn’t undermine that.

Wow you guys added three pages from the time I went to sleep until I woke up. Looks like the trolls will have some good eating tonight will all the bites they got today =P