This is still what happens. It’d be nice to have this resolved.
The Net Turret Overcharge Fire Rate bug is still extant despite Net Turret being broken entirely and then resurrected. Just sayin’.
I’m curious as to whether this is even on the radar.
Okay. So. It’s been four months. Do we know whether the fire rates of Turrets besides Net Turret are supposed to be slower than their listed fire rate yet?
Minor, minor quibble: There are five traits that affect Turrets (Metal Plating, Autotool Installation, Rifled Turret Barrels, Deployable Turrets and Accelerant-Packed Turrets). Moving on.
I would love to know what the plan is for turrets. As they stand now, they’re at a bug-count of 26, unless I’m missing some; I might re-establish my reference thread.
Here’s the list, for anyone who’s unfamiliar:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/26-Turret-Bugs-Bug-Listing-Intensifies/first#post2601719
Edit: Just went through and bumped every single Turret Bug thread linked in that post, if the bug is still extant. The front page of Game Bugs is now 64% Turret Bugs. Man, it’s a good thing I listed them in as compressed a way as I could. Might not be Best Bugging Practice, but otherwise the entire front page and then some would be Turret bugs.
It’s been acknowledged by the staff, but it sure doesn’t seem to be doing anything. So far, they’ve fixed…I think three bugs from that list – one was Net Turret’s faulty fire rate (legitimized to 13 seconds), one was Rocket Turret being the wrong version with RTB active (first Turret hotfix, ever, I think), and the last was Net Turret turning off after being overcharged. I hope I’m missing one.
I agree with pretty much every point in this thread, especially the difficulty of balancing something that doesn’t work right to begin with. How can they justify messing with what Turrets do, when they don’t do it properly to begin with?
At this point…I hope they start from the ground up, and just write whole new Turret code that works. It’s obvious they have no idea what they’re doing with the current batch, as every single time they make a change to Turrets, they break something.
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It’s been a little since patch; any more bugs found to be added to the list, or are we still up-to-date?
Also, anybody know anything about whether these are even being worked on? I mean, I know they’re theoretically being worked on, but c’mon, they didn’t develop close to 30 bugs by having people pay attention to them.
A fix is a fix.
If it fails from a balance perspective, then it fails from a balance perspective, but a bug got fixed.
I’ve actually reported those already – along with many others. And with the closest I could come to a comprehensive explanation, too. See?
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/26-Turret-Bugs-Bug-Listing-Intensifies/first#post2601719
I certainly spent enough bloody time testing the kitten things.
The devs have even acknowledged the list itself, though it doesn’t appear to be helping with getting things fixed much.
I used to have a reference post on this board, but apparently, despite the moderation staff’s admittance that they were in the wrong for removing it after I remarked that I was considering uninstalling due to a lack of fixing, they just never felt like putting it back.
Oh, and for the tiny, tiny bit that it’s worth: They did fix the Net Turret’s newest issue, wherein it simply turned off after Overcharging. Even works with RTB.
Deployable version probably doesn’t get that bit of function, but that’s why it’s a separate bug.
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AMR activates regardless of whether your heal skill is actually on cooldown or not, unfortunately.
Meaning: If you wait until almost-death to use it the first time, it won’t come off cooldown when you hit 25% HP a second time. This happens regardless of what healing skill is used, so it’s extra annoying.
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For me, I use AED in the following way, with 20 points in Inventions:
- Get down near 25% HP
- Use AED before 25% mark
- AED comes off cooldown thanks to Automated Medical Response
- AED again when near death
So far, I…actually don’t think it’s terrible. It’s a bit awkward, but it’s a “Go ahead, hit me” heal, of course it is.
The AED does work pretty well in PvE. For PvP…about all I can think of to time it better is to keep an eye out for big-attack animations.
Engineer Master Minor Inventions Trait Automated Medical Response does not activate if: You go below 25% HP with your healing skill on cooldown, heal back up past 25%, and then go back below 25% before the internal cooldown (which, by the way, is not listed in the trait tooltip) has expired.
Replication steps (using AED for convenience):
- Get below 25% HP (as indicated by Low Health Response System’s regeneration application).
- Use AED when near death, healing for 50%+ upon the would-be finishing blow.
- Get below 25% HP again (as indicated by Low Health Response System’s regeneration application) before AMR cooldown expires (90 seconds?).
- Notice that AED isn’t off cooldown.
It has the same effect on every other healing skill available to the Engineer.
I just tested whether AMR would kick in and take the AED off of CD, using the LHRS’ Regen effect to identify when the game recognized when I was below 25% HP and thus when AMR should be triggering.
End result: AMR doesn’t do what it’s supposed to if you reach 25% HP without a healing skill on cooldown, heal back up to above it, and then drop to 25% HP.
I think that qualifies as a bug. I’ll go ahead and report it.
Until they fix that, AED is best used first when at 26-30% HP and under assault, as AMR will take it off cooldown immediately. Then use it again when about to die.
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Healing Turret, Medkit, Elixir H and that stupid gimmicky Antitoxin Spray.
Healing Turret’s overcharge might also be affected, as well as…well, the healing functions of Medkit. As far as I know, it doesn’t work on Toolbelt skills.
The global cooldown used to be…essentially random, with a ceiling of two seconds or so and a floor of about a half-second.
No idea why it was like that. Or why it would take them fifteen months to resolve it. Do they have interns do their QA, or just coding on Turrets and Mortars?
Okay, we’ve got some attempts to fix Turret bugs, such as the Net Turret’s “Well, I’ve shot my load” philosophy on being overcharged. I’ll be testing that.
Testing complete, both with and without Rifled Turret Barrels. It doesn’t succumb to ennui after using its Overcharge. It even functions properly with Rifled Turret Barrels!
Somebody give it a party hat for being one of the only Turrets to not be bugged.
Except that it probably still doesn’t contribute to achievements or trigger rune-procs.
Now, I don’t want to be a cynic…but did they break anything?
Archival: Bug report moved here for future reference if necessary.
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Because they can’t get one set of Turrets to function properly.
How about, instead of turning this into another discussion of Engineer downed skills, we leave the Hobosack thread a Hobosack thread?
For reference, here’s some threads that are actually about what you want to talk about, that you can post in:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer/Engineer-Downed-State
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer/Downed-Skill-2-worst-skill-ingame
I tried to take a look at the skill using the chatcode to get an idea of the effectiveness…but I just can’t get that stuff to work.
One way or another: I’ll probably try it out. They won’t fix Turrets, so I’ll use Gadgets instead (because I am a stubborn man).
It probably is working as intended – it’s just intended to work in a way that’s now outdated. Try putting this in Game Discussion. They probably won’t say anything anyway, but it’ll be more likely to get attention there.
Well, it’s in Game Bugs and it’s not a bug, so they’ll probably ignore it.
How is the heal at 1% going to work?
so we basically get some immunity with this new heal?
Immunity to death. (insert evil laughter of choice here.) Well, theoretically. We’ll probably still get murdered by one condition or another that just doesn’t trigger it somehow.
It says it activates the heal after a short time, so…maybe it encourages risky play with it?
Activate A.E.D. while low on health, if HP hits <1% while A.E.D. active, heal.
Charzooka is mobile, and is only usable by the user. As a Bundle, it might scale with your stats. It has a limited number of uses/casting.
Mortar is not, and can be used by others. As a Turret-Like Object, I don’t even know if it scales with Boon/Condition/Healing stats. Has an unlimited number of uses/casting, and cooldown is precisely the duration of the object itself.
Aside from those, it might be a good idea to take a gander at the skills each offer.
they didnt nerf the turrets, they just defined their roles better
rifle for steady single target
flame for burn
rocket for long range AoE (toolbelt is similar to big ol bomb damage now)
thumper for tanky
net for…nettingpreviously the rocket turret was directly better than the flame turret at both direct damage, bleeding and even had a knockback for utility…
however the problem now is their cooldowns arent equal to one another even with their now specific roles.
and i think they can actually scale now…
They don’t scale to anything that isn’t Condition Damage, Condition Duration, Healing Power or Boon Duration. Somebody broke the tooltips. Again.
I don’t think they’ve ever said anything about it.
Charrzooka. Mortar is buggy crap.
So the thumper pillars are used to thump the leylines or leyline crossings perhaps. That in turn is to disturb the magic energy flow, irritating a/the dragon(s) ?
And that’s how Scarlet Briar will somehow manage to enslave an Elder Dragon.
As Engineer Turrets do not currently scale with the Power stat, I’m reporting this as a bug. When the function is not what the tooltips say it is, then obviously either one or the other is malfunctioning.
This bug affects the following skills:
Rifle, Rocket, Thumper and Flame Turrets
and consists of:
The damage indicated on the tooltips of these turrets scales to the Power stat, while the Turrets don’t actually do so.
Congratulations on #27. I wish the best of luck in not getting the Turret-specific buglist into the thirties.
New bug added: Tooltip discrepancy.
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Turns out this is still broken. I thought it had been fixed, but it hadn’t.
Rocket Turret Overcharge Explosive Rocket deactivates Rifled Turret Barrel’s Range increase.
Reproduction steps:
- Equip Rifled Turret Barrels and Equip Rocket Turret
- Place Rocket Turret outside of untraited maximum range
- Overcharge Rocket Turret on any firing cycle, at any point; success or failure of turret to fire Explosive Rocket is irrelevant, as is number of rockets fired beforehand.
- At conclusion of Overcharge, Rocket Turret will no longer be affected by Rifled Turret Barrel’s Range increase.
Thanks for the report, adding it to my bug list thread; it’s always been in evidence, I just didn’t think to report it.
I’ve confirmed this. Adding it to my turret bug thread for easy reference. Thanks for the report.
Edit: Both of these can be considered confirmed.
RTB having no effect on range indicators is a bit of idiocy I simply haven’t thought to report yet.
List updated with bug reported by Tulki: Rifled Turret Barrels deactivating range increases.
Through testing, I have found that RTB does deactivate when Overcharges of Thumper and Rocket Turret are used, but not Flame or Rifle.
Net Turret turns off after Overcharge anyway, so I didn’t test that one.
Healing Turret doesn’t get RTB benefits at all, didn’t bother testing Overcharge. Not sure if that’s a bug or not, would appreciate any kind of dev input regarding.
All in all…we’ve got four more on the list, including the one that’s actually been in since launch but never really got reported, to my knowledge.
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If it’s intentional for you to be able to transfer dyes between characters on your account, I’d think they’d just make them account-bound instead of character-bound; this ‘method’ doesn’t make any sense.
While playing my Thief, I realized that I had crafted armor dyed with Midnight Ice dye. The problem is…This Thief does not have Midnight Ice dye. My Engineer does.
Near as I can figure, this is what happened (steps provided for reproduction) :
Dyed Seeker armor on Character A
Put Seeker armor in bank
Took Seeker armor out with Character B
Equipped Seeker armor while armor colors were set to default
- I guess the Seeker armor’s manually-set colors overrode the defaults at this point.
Equipped Outlaw armor, noticed brown patches, realized what had happened
And that’s how I accidentally got Midnight Ice armor without having the dye on the character using it.
There’s a balance patch planned for 12/10, yes. It’s also entirely possible that they just managed to break the tooltips, though the fact that the tooltips scale is somewhat difficult to explain, unless they’ve managed to sink to new depths of “How the hell did you break that?” by somehow copying the scaling of another skill.
This was only introduced recently, around the same time as they removed Bleed from Rifle Turret (replaced with Vulnerability) and Burn from Rocket Turret’s regular attacks.
Personally, I’m hoping this is an indication of what they’ve got planned; I’ve been wishing Turrets would scale to Power for quite some time. Without scaling, they fall flat at 80+, while occasionally being absurd very early in.
I never noticed any trouble with the range.
Also, they introduced an issue with Net Turret. With Rifled Turret Barrels active, if you use the Overcharge, the Turret stops firing entirely after launching the Electrified Net.
I think perhaps the most telling thing about this thread is how little anyone defends Scarlet in it. Anything else about this is obviously subjective – but nobody is defending her.
Nobody, not a single person I’ve seen in this thread, is speaking up to say “Hey, I like her.”
If that isn’t a warning sign, I don’t know what is.
Rifle Turret’s overcharge has been broken (no fire rate increase except if overcharged ASAP, then permanent fire rate increase) for quite a while, yes.
Rocket Turret’s overcharge isn’t long enough to cover the entire window between firing cycles. Not sure why it’s never been fixed, but that’s how it is, which might explain something about that issue.
Good find, so the bug is if you overcharge the turret when the shot is on cooldown and the overcharge fades before the next shot is ready, it will cease firing. For now it is probably best if you try not to reproduce that. Sorry for the inconvenience.
Thanks.
Not quite. It’ll also stop firing at all if the Overcharge fires, but both versions of the deactivation issue only occur while Rifled Turret Barrels is active.
The only way to avoid reproducing it, if using Rifled Turret Barrels, is to not use Net Turret’s Overcharge at all.
They don’t really scale with power, the tooltips just look like they do, I think.
Here’s the numbers on the tooltips when I went to test this, with and without PvP Berserker’s Amulet:
Rifle Turret: Without 183, With 367
Rocket Turret: Without 548, With 1,100
Thumper Turret: Without 244, With 733
Regardless of damage suggested by tooltips, their damage was the same in all tests:
Rifle Turret: Light 566, Medium 532, Heavy 476
Rocket Turret: Light 1698, Medium 1598, Heavy 1428
Thumper Turret: Light 754, Medium 710, Heavy 635
In light of this, I really don’t think they’ve implemented power-scaling yet. I’m not sure whether they intend to, even, or if they’ve just broken tooltips again.
The Flame Turret, with Rifled Turret Barrels equipped, only activates Smoke Screen when an enemy is within the default range of the Flame Turret itself.
After the most recent patch, Net Turret simply stops firing entirely after being Overcharged, whether it fires the Overcharge or not (due to another issue, it’s entirely possible that it simply won’t fire it, regardless of ranges involved).
Issue only occurs with Rifled Turret Barrels traited.
Bugs purportedly resolved: General “Rifled Turret Barrels doesn’t work with Overcharges,” really. I’ll be testing these to confirm momentarily, and I will strike them from the list (moving them to this post for archival purposes) if they are well and truly resolved.
Partially Resolved, see below for details:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/RTB-doesn-t-affect-Rif-Net-Fla-Turret-OCs/first#post2957994
Introduced:
Net Turret now deactivates entirely post-Overcharge with Rifled Turret Barrels traited.
If Overcharge fires, no shots are fired afterward.
If Overcharge does not fire (for example, due to the Overcharge window being small enough that it can run out before the next iteration of the firing cycle), no shots are fired after the Overcharge runs out.
This is most definitely not RTB turning off after Overcharge, as I’ve made sure to test it very, very near to the target.
Unresolved:
Flame Turret Overcharge (Smoke Screen) still does not activate at ranges greater than default maximum.
Thought it was fixed, it wasn’t:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Eng-Thump-Turret-Radius-anomaly-w-RTB/first#post2730199
Suppose it’s a good thing I don’t use Net Turret much anyway, but I can’t help but be disappointed that it’s been broken worse.
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Oh, I knew things would take time. They’re not miracle-workers, after all.
Gives rise to the question of “So, what’s taking so long on finding out whether the slower fire rates are due to a bug, or if the tooltip is wrong,” however. Telling us what part of the issue is the issue doesn’t risk breaking everything, but instead, we got one tooltip out of five (Healing Turret doesn’t even list a fire rate) changed, and nothing since. Are we supposed to assume that the slower rate is accurate because they changed a single tooltip?
Some of these bugs seem like they’re actually difficult things to fix…and then there’s things like that, where they don’t even need to change any code beyond what shows up in a tooltip. To me, their inaction gives the impression of apathy.
Reinforcing the impression is that they’ve yet to address an exploitable bug resulting from 5/6 Deployable Turrets replacing Toolbelt skills with Detonate too early, while Healing Turret is completely unaffected by the issue due to only replacing the skill once the Turret hits the ground. By having the other Turrets do the same, they could, seemingly quite easily, prevent a double-detonation exploit.
As for QA spotting bugs with Turrets – almost every time they change something, they break something else. Does QA sleep through their Turret tests? That’s the only explanation I can come up with, beyond them simply not caring, for them to miss Deployable Flame Turret’s lack of cooldown reduction (which stayed that way for weeks). There’s also the more recent issue wherein Rifled Turret Barrels turned the Rocket Turret into a strange half-step between the version with less Direct Damage and Burning, and the version with more Direct Damage and no Burning, making it simply deal less Direct Damage with no Burning (this issue got hotfixed, after an outcry).
Happens from time to time; I don’t worry about it overmuch. They know it exists, they should be working on some of these bugs.
If fixes aren’t incoming, I hope that a restructuring of Turrets in general is.
Of course, I doubt anyone will tell us whether any of these are being worked on (and the proper PR response would be to say so, one way or another). Between the silence and the lack of fixes, however, it’s incredibly easy to come to the conclusion that Anet doesn’t care.
This is particularly aggravating for me, in light of my having bought the game because I wanted to play a Turret-using Engineer, but kitten happens.