Guild Wars 2

Is that 15 more than the Axe build? Do you have the 25 stacks up for important fights? Do important fights have a mass of mobs you can cleave to maintain stacks? When fighting a mass of mobs, are you grouped or with other players who are spreading Might?

^

Good point; I was too hasty with my original comment and neglected the huge PvE crit multipliers. Still, it seems completely irrelevant when you basically overlook / ignore the prior post that already included both scenarios. Good job baiting me.

Oglaf.1074:

EasymodeX.4062:

The term “supremacy” is supremely hilarious though, I must admit.

Nontheless it is true. Stand around Lion’s Arch for a few and watch different Warriors come and go and take a count of how many are using Greatswords.

Is that supremacy or popularity?

Um…I’m curious how Axe1 chain is 14% more damage, EzmodeX. Did you math it or did you compare it side by side. If you just math it the 1.75 sec total cast of Axe1 chain is misleading because that’s not the entire animation. The entire chain is actually around 3+ seconds, almost the timespan of a fully channeled hundred blades. Makes them comparable at best.

Took the numbers off the wiki, so they may or may not be accurate. From memory, the times are approximately correct. I used [edit: I deleted my spreadsheet, brb]

.25 + .75 + 1.5 seconds for the Axe1 chain. Note: the wiki doesn’t list the cast time of the second hit. It’s probably .5s, but I used 0.75s to under-estimate the Axe DPS. The Axe chain is 252 + 538 + 858 = 1648 damage. 659 DPS using the “slow” estimate for the Axe chain (it’s probably 732 DPS).

HB is 3.5s. Base damage of 2030. 580 DPS.

Using the generous estimate, 659 > 580 by 14%. More likely 732 > 580 by 26%, but I think some people would cry if I said Axe1 beats HB by 26%.

Anyways, not sure if most people really notice, but the first 8 hits of HB are really weak. As in, “about the same or weaker than GS autoattacks weak”. I guess the side benefit is that the raw # of hits (9 in 3.5 versus 7 AAs in 3.5) gets some random kitten partial synergy with the forceful trait. The vuln stacks on the GS AA help, too. I’m guessing it’s probably better to just use GS1111 over Hundred blades due to the Vuln stacks.

Whilwind Attack is really where GS stops sucking though. That, and the general mobility. Using the 26% number, it will take something like 15 more stacks of Might than the Axe build to maintain DPS. Lulz.

And yet “balance at all levels of play” has basically nothing to do with the topic.

Dev comments about the class in general have nothing to do with the topic.

Funny how people try to take the discussion off-topic to avoid the main issue.

Are you including the 25 perma-Might stacks you get via Forceful Greatsword? That Trait alone is usually what annihilates any opposition to Greatsword supremacy, sadly.

Before or after I include 10% crit damage to Axe, accelerated Adren generation with Axe, perma Might from SOR, FGJ, Might and Fury from teammates … ?

Oh wait, I said raw damage didn’t I?

Greatsword needs about 10 stacks of permanent Might to be in the ballpark of Axe for sustained DPS.

The term “supremacy” is supremely hilarious though, I must admit.

Tarin Twisted.4183:

I mean yeah, everyone plays games to have fun but I would expect most people on your server to consider winning a big part of that. It may not be very realistic, but the goal must be to win right?

Just not sure I am buying the whole if it happens it happens thing. People that play in T1 on one of the top servers in the game investing tons of time, effort and in game currency on something that has no reward other than winning makes the statement hard to believe.

Different people play for different reasons. Some people play just to see enemies do funny things like jump off cliffs.

Out of all the WvW I’ve done, I’ve had the most fun in two specific instances:

1. Using a pull + knockback to pull a player off the back of a tower then knock them off a cliff.

2. Watching a Ranger quickness volley into a Feedback and not stop. The confusion ticks hit 4k, and he dealt 14k to himself from the physical reflection.

Other stuff … less interesting.

Some people play WvW just to be part of a team and play with other people.

Some people play to rack up an invisible kill count. Some people want to make a name for their guild (since making a name for themselves is apparently something ANet wanted to design against).

Players play for different reasons. It’s pretty narrow-minded to assume other players play for the same reason you do, and arrogant to assume that only those who focus on winning T1 can actually get to T1.

This thread is silly.

Most classes can be relevant in both large scale and still survive-ish (but not be top-tier) in 1v1 / small scale.

If you want damage output in large scale as well, that narrows it down to (in no particular order):

1. Ranger
2. Elementalist
3. Mesmer
4. Engineer possibly

Among those, Mesmer has the least AOE but most raw utility. Ranger is the most broad (can range AOE, DPS, CC, and have additional utility). Elementalist is potent in all areas, but typically not within the same spec, and usually not with the same weapon. Engineer is also broad, similar to Rangers, but I don’t know enough about them to comment in detail.

All 4 of those classes can generally survive and get away in “1v1”, although it is rather build dependent for some of them. Rangers are probably the weakest of those 4 in solo / small scale (at least, if the Ranger is built to be competent at large scale).

As the other poster said, your best bet is to roll each class and play them in sPvP to see which one you like the most. Give each a good 10 hours, using random builds and some builds copied off the forums.

Not my name, but I saw a Mesmer run around: “Illusionary Mesmer”. Got a kick out of that.

iSwordsman does significantly more power-based damage than iDuelist.

Sword4 also offers the CC of Pistol while adding a kittenton of damage if you get the block counter off.

It’s basically a stronger offhand, with the limitation of being 80% melee. The Pistol does get miscellaneous bonus points for SI synergy and bugged combo finisher with the Pistol trait, though.

So, in case anyone’s wondering, the Axe1 chain is around 14% stronger raw dps than hundred blades, which is in turn about 2% stronger than GS autoattacks. The 3.5 second (e.g. slow as hell) channel really kills it.

The highest DPS ability is whirlwind attack, due to its insane speed and good damage in melee. Only caveat is that you have to turn back around and re-engage, which tends to stall the dps by a half second. This can be mitigated, however.

Eviscerate isn’t as good as WA, but is significantly better than HB/Axe1/etc.

Generally speaking, don’t neglect that axe also has traits that it can pick up.

For super sustained DPS, GS may be able to get more raw output because there are more traits / useful traits for it. That is, unless the Axe Warr has some group support lulz.

Maugetarr.6823:

Guaranteed crits outside of the ele ability don’t exist either. Roughly speaking (not entirely accurate or encompassing, but decent for bracketing) there is a 1% that a thief with a 60% crit chance will not crit any of those hits while there is a 7.7% chance to land all crits during that. For large sample sizes, the estimate should hold.

Still waiting for the point of that statement.

I can point out that the sky is blue or that it’s chilly outside, but that doesn’t have any relevant impact on the discussion.

I was considering Rampager, but I wanted the Vit from Carrion; something to test for sure. The might stacks from Illu25 would supplement the raw pow/cdmg somewhat.

The issue is that sPvP Rampager has really low condition damage (PvE Rampager has mid-level cdmg, although it has no Vit). Even with extra might, you’re really losing a lot of cdmg with Rampager from Carrion.

I like using the Guardian example because most people complain about bunker Guards.

Maugetarr.6823:

Pretty sure he’s talking about just crit damage here, comparing the 15% increase in damage to the base 50% increase in damage from a crit without any additional crit damage(from traits/gear). For their outputs to be (almost) equal, the thief would have to have a little more than 60% crit chance in combination with the signet to equal the guaranteed damage output of having 5 crits.

Pretty sure this thread has just seen a half dozen posts on the same topic of X poster comparing the value of a guaranteed crit to a non-crit with 15% damage bonus in a context where guaranteed non-crits don’t exist.

At first I rolled my eyes and made a jocular and facetious post to indirectly point out the folly. However, at this point it’s more like a trainwreck as new posters keep chiming in with the same track of irrelevant tangents.

Absorb Kill Shot, shoot 3 Kill Shots?

Pyrial.2917:

urinfamousr.7631:

Pyrial.2917:

You’ll come to learn that every profession is capable of this burst.

from stealth?

So is stealth the problem or is burst the problem?

0.25 damage timestamp / 0.75s full combo with low telegraph from 900 range, e.g. “BURST”, is the problem.

Stealth is the salt.

stof.9341:

EasymodeX.4062:

Backstab damage doesn’t need to be reduced. The damage output on CND needs to be inverted so the damage (and hit detection for the stealth) happens at the beginning of the CND, not the end.

How easy this is to fix.

I’d love to get such a HUGE buff to C&D. I’d be that much easier to land it. And you’d only need to do Mug => C&D => Backstab to do the combo instead of using F1during the C&D cast.

Mug -> CND -> BS would allow the target 0.75 seconds to dodge or escape the combo on premeditated reflex. It would also by necessity include 0.5s of melee-range non-stealth time.

The fact that CND becomes more reliable for non-backstab gimmick builds benefits the class balance as a whole.

This may exacerbate WvW culling problems, but that is an engine problem and the class balance shouldn’t “really” be subject to the engine.

He’s talking about crit chance related to damage. But he’s talking about too much crit chance for what the ability actually does in comparison.

Same mistake many, many players / novice mathcrafters make. It’s all completely irrelevant though because the numbers were already posted.

Precursor = sell. I don’t really care much for most aesthetics. Especially aesthetics that cost 1600 gold worth of time/effort.

I’d sell a precursor in a heartbeat, buy abyss and celestial dye, buy an extra set of exotic gear, then go back to WvW.

I’d take breaks in between to rage at ANet for gear creeping with ascended bullkitten in WvW. Then I’d outline what I would do with the rest of my newfound $ until more ascended gear is released and I quit the game.

Duke Blackrose.4981:

Title says it all – which 3 races would you most want to see become playable?

High Elves
Dark Elves
Eldar

Tuluum.9638:

dreztina.4820:

Can’t help but think most of the people in this thread haven’t seen what happens to a zerg when you get a couple confusion mesmers and a necro together.

There is a good chance most have not. I dont think it is, as yet, a widely employed strategy.

I have used it, as well as have had it used against me though. The first time it was used against me and the group I was with, it was pure, unadulterated destruction.

Thing is about losing though, is it gives a clear objective of areas that need to improve.

The next time we ran into it, just laid down a bali or two depending on group size. Which is another thing you dont see much of (using siege in the open battlefield).

I suspect both will become more prevalent as the game goes on.

I ran Glamour spam when SOR hit T2 and we encountered a ton of turtles when turtling was “all the rage”.

It was pretty funny.

To come back to your last statement, I think you haven’t taken a close enough look at the benefits of interupt bonuses within the Domination tree. Specced correctly, a MantraMesmer can make any class regret casting a skill.

The interrupt bonuses in Dom are mostly horrible. Although, I don’t think I ever re-tested the damage one since I hit 80 / got power exotics.

Lol, nerf Mimic. It would be a funny addition to the pyroperson’s tank retaliation build.

For testing GS DPS, I sure as hell hope you’re using Whirlwind Attack into walls or combo’d with gap closers. WA has something like +50% to +100% the DPS of HB.

That aside, I’d use Axe for dungeon or grinding PvE. GS is good for solo PvE for the mobility, but the mobility isn’t very relevant for grinding fights. Dodging is also less punitive to Axe DPS, as others have noted.

Pyroatheist.9031:

Awww, ac isn’t that bad with a competent team. Also, when you remember that the only other dungeons with pvt gear are SE and HotW, ac starts to look a whole lot more appealing.

I’ve done 1 dungeon run in GW2 one time since open beta, and that was AC story mode. I was PvE’d out for a month.

DX

Edit: I think I just found the entrance to SE in the world last night.

Edit2: Yeah, I’m saving my WvW tokens to outfit an alt with a set of PVT though.

frans.8092:

Eh, no it’s not. A crit can hit for 150-250% damage, which is way more the 115% damage

Too bad autocrits are capped at 100% chance to crit.

Perhaps you should simply review the prior posts rather than making an irrelevant comment.

But other professions telegraph their burst with bright flashy lights, or 4 seconds of prep time.

Nilgoow.1037:

I am a girl IRL (in real life).

Rofl. Are you still rocking lady gaga colors?

Backstab damage doesn’t need to be reduced. The damage output on CND needs to be inverted so the damage (and hit detection for the stealth) happens at the beginning of the CND, not the end.

How easy this is to fix.

LiuliRenai.3928:

Original poster doesn’t have much MMO experience I guess. Warhammer Online bright wizards. There’s a video of three of them wiping out 24 enemy players in seconds. Comparing any balance issues in GW2 to the broken mess that is other MMOs is just silly.

If by 24, you mean 48, yeah.

Edit: The best part is that they were more overpowered before that era.

Moderate damage — enough to break through bunker Guardians with sustain.

Basic build went like this:

- Carrion
- Mental Torment
- Confusion duration 33%
- IP
- Deceptive Evasion
- Adventurer runes
- Energy Sigils (w/e that 50% endurance on swap)
- Staff // Sword/Torch
- Shatter reset

20/20/0/0/30

Build developed as an extension of “pure IP”. The one curiosity of 30 Illusion + IP is that you are always stuck with F1 (power) and F2 (condition). With 20 Dom, your F3 will always enhance power further. With 15 Illu, all your shatters will throw on more confusion. You can’t get away from this, and none of it is based on SI, so no demand for precision.

So I tacked Carrion onto the build to basically enhance both, along with unlimited clone works. I could basically F1-F4 on cooldown, interleaved with Blurred Frenzy and nearly unlimited dodges. Decoy + Torch made for absurd target drops, and 5k+ burning on Prestige is nothing to scoff at … especially when it’s backed by a 6k IP Mind Wrack. The raw condition damage was also delivered via Staff attacks, staff clones, and the poison Chaos Storm — so a lot more delivery vectors than just the confusion.

Guardians are always obnoxious, but they can’t fight through literally a non-stop zerg of clones — even if they have GS and can pop waves of them; I could summon even more, or facetank them with Blurred Frenzy. Boon stripping is particularly key for guardians ofc, and I only swapped in the Torch trait rarely. Forcing the target to use abilities to clear clones was an additional synergy with the confusion.

The weakness of the build (aside from being caught flat-footed by a backstab thief) is that you can actually spend too much time defending (dodge dodge dodge), which lowers damage output.

It’s not really a finished build though, because I think it could be optimized further, but I stopped playing it, so it’s collecting metaphysical dust.

That effect you mention about fine-tuning condition duration also makes me wonder if the normal food I use would be better replaced with condition duration lowering food. I’ll need to run some calculations and see if that is the case.

I would suggest ‘no’ for a general WvW case, due to the prevalence of direct damage.

Unless the combination of that + Melandru suddenly make conditions completely non-threatening. … Which may be the case. Lulz. Haha that would actually be pretty funny. 1s immobilizes would be a stutter.

[Gear]

Right, but he said that he’d have to go farm AC, which is synonymous with flaying myself with a spork. So I figure if I were him, I’d definitely go mess with the build before I’d have the fortitude to step into a PvE dungeon.

@EasymodeX: I’ve used mantras in a pure glass cannon ranged nuker build, and they work fine. The problem isn’t that mantras are completely useless, it is that their usefulness diminishes sharply when put in other situations, where other utilities retain their value.

Dunno, many utilities lose their value in situations where they’re not optimal. I mean does ANYONE use iDefender except your build?

My perception is that the Mantras are by themselves powerful enough to merit their slot, even if they lack flexibility (except MoC lulz). Therefore, they are not underpowered. If a utility is optimal for “too many” builds (whatever that threshold is), then it is overpowered.

Mantra of Pain can be used in any offensive build for elevated spike. Most players want to survive better and will pick Decoy/Blink/Feedback, or go a hybrid route with MI. I’ve used it from time to time in pretty much every power build I’ve ever been spec’d into.

Mantra of Distraction can be used in many offensive builds that include a sharper lockdown mechanism. I ran builds a long time ago that utilized Sword/x + IP burst combos that stacked the daze to combo with the sword3 immobilize. SigDom won’t work in that scenario.

the mantra traits are all over the place in dumb locations

I’d have to disagree with that point. I think they’re reasonably placed overall — if EM or HM were placed as T2 somewhere, you could get some really scary builds going. RM is an inherently different trait and is considered separately.

The stun duration isnt too important, as I have more stunbreakers in this build than you can shake a stick at (also curious if it affects knockdowns/launches type skills). -25% condition duration, on the other hand, is very nice, and deserves some thourough testing in HotM.

Random aside: don’t neglect that many players fine-tune their condition duration to barely meet the last tick of their <insert condition, usually Bleed>, so any -% duration tends to break that and cause their conditions to lose yet another tick -- generally reducing their condition damage output by 30-35%, depending. More importantly reducing the uptime of poison’s debuff to your regen, anyways.

Orrian runes are also interesting. The condition damage helps with confusion bursting, and that on-hit effect has a 10s cooldown, which is quite fine.

I picked that up from another guy who posted his Rabid C/t/p tank-ish condition spec. Didn’t realize how low the ICD on the poison proc was until then. It’s rather nifty, although it’s been so long since I’ve played sPvP that I failed miserably when I tried the other day.

About IP. It is interesting that you view it as a crutch rather than a tool. Lets see if I can correct that view.

I’m well aware of the value of IP — I was one of the first to use it back when everyone and their brother used phantasm army builds.

I suppose if the extra uptime on Cry is that significant (sidenote: I haven’t actually used the build, so these things are probably more clear in actual play), then the cooldown for the 10 points is the main point (along with the utility of IP).

In retrospect, “the other options are rather lackluster” is probably what it comes down to more than anything.

I may have to try the spec out in sPvP sometime to be a tanktroll.

eleven.3170:

That makes sense.
Reason for asking, I was hoping to use my existing Knight armor to try this build.
Looks like I’m farming AC tonight.

You could try it. The toughness is significantly more important than the vit in the build. It’s not like the build would break with Knight’s gear. It’d just be more vulnerable to condition damage or heavy burst.

I had an sPvP hybrid shatter spam build (Carrion) with Torch and Decoy.

It was fun. I even slotted the cooldown reduction on Torch when I didn’t want boon strips (well, this was rare). Fun times.

Not only that, but the slow clone generation with only a single non-Scepter weapon means that mobs will always zerg you. Scepter AA means the mobs will stop to attack the clone all the time.

Makes level 1-6 so much easier.

Rough sketch of 10s:

D/D Thief

2x CND (504) (0.5)
2x BS (806) (0.25)

10x Filler 111 (760 + 168 poison) (0.75)

Total: 10220 in 9s; does not include poison damage

Axe Warr

1x Evisc (731) (?? approx 0.25 – 0.5, I would say 0.5)
4x Filler 111 (1648) (2)

7323 in 8.5

Think the main thing is that the dagger attacks rather quickly. I’m also dubious about the cast time listed for the third step of the Dagger1 chain. I feel like it has a 0.25s wind-down after the hit, for a total of a 0.5s attack, rather than 0.25 listed on the wiki. This would reduce the D/D estimate by 2500.

MOR is usable 3x as often as Null Field for condition removal.

Stiv.1820:

I really don’t see them nerfing mug. Thief burst is the bread and butter for them in tPvP. Without it they are useless.

ANet mistake #1: WvW uses the PvE ruleset/gear.

qqqqqqqqqq

My face hit my desk when I read about their decision in beta.

The elementalist, it doesn’t matter with his combo, he can knock you out of dodge,

I insist: Eles cannot knock a player out of a dodge.

(You abilities in a knock down are all qued for 2-3 seconds, you would need a stun breaker to get out of it.)

Pretty sure almost any instant ability will work, not merely a stun breaker. According to Stiv, any competent player can escape out of Basilisk within 0.25 seconds on reflex, therefore I don’t see why Updraft should be held to a lower standard.

It takes more then 0.25 seconds to get behind someone too,

More like 0.1 seconds by walking through them.

This game doesn’t have collision detection.

The best part is you autoface the target if you release W for a fraction of a moment.

I mean, if you want to say 0.25 seconds to position during the BS actual animation, that’s fine. But 1s? That’s a complete joke. That reminds me of Mesmers saying it takes 2 seconds to cast iWarden.

I would go with 6x Melandru, Dolyak, Earth, or Orrian runes. Probably Melandru. Seems like the weakest point in this build is:

1. Condition spam, particularly sustained poison.
2. General vulnerability before you get warmed up.

CC/condition reduction would help avoid those problematic situations.

Think I would also drop the last 10 in Illu for Blade Training or Chaos for Debilitating Dissipation. Or Dom for the Cripple. Blade Training would allow for obnoxiously frequent BF along with faster leap finisher cycles. On second thought, you still would never get two sets of leaps on your own fields, but it would still help use the fields of others, nevermind the more flexible use of the leap/immobilize separate from the combo finisher.

One thing to consider with a build like this is that the fights are long, sustained, and you end up going through a large quantity of clones. The on-death Clone traits are pretty entertaining particularly when you have little / low demand for shatters. The Chaos one is kind of random and kind of meh, but adds some notable damage. Also adds 100 Tough and 10% boon duration. Crippling Dissipation is rather useful in general, but I’m not entirely sure if you’d want to kite most targets with the focus on Retaliation. Perhaps more an optimization for 1 v manymany.

The on-demand F4 is useful, but it seems like you would always have random illusions left over anyways. In this kind of build I would perceive IP as more of a crutch to overcome rather than a truly added-value tool.

The last consideration is that for winning long, sustained fights, poison is particularly notable to diminish the enemy’s healing. It occurs to me that the Orrian runes, despite not offering Vit/Tough, would have a useful place with this strategy to suppress other “outlast” builds.

Stiv.1820:

You have to be able to eat a C&D+Mug both crits then react before the backstab.

0.25 seconds versus 1+.

Best part is the only thing the Thief’s blown is steal, and you’re below half.

Caligare.7946:

So I finally got my warrior to 80 today, and I’ve already decked him out with gear (below). Whats the basic WvW GS build out there?

20/30/0/0/20

Damage damage damage quickness <25% damage mobility.

Frenzy FGJ BR SOR

Beat the kitten out of something with a quickness stomp then run away. For WvW, basically sword/wh on swap.

Edit:

GS is better than Axe for WvW because of mobility. End of story. Get to fights faster, live longer. Huehue.

It’s hard to chase down a Warrior who rotates Rush/WA/Leap with high swiftness uptime. Nevermind auto-clearing immobilizes.

1. I’m generally annoyed by the fact kittenty PvE gear is required for WvW: e.g. Exotics. It’s annoying as hell to grind mats or grind $ to get gear for WvW. However, I already knew this going in when ANet announced that WvW would use PvE combat (which kittening kitten .

2. Existing Ascended gear already pisses me off because, again, it is usable in WvW and provides a tier of stat increase. Best part is that it requires an even more asinine gated PvE dungeon grind. Why the kitten should I have to do something kitten so I can play the game?

3. I’ll pretty much instantly quit playing GW2 when new Ascended gear is released for the rest of the gear slots. I don’t have tolerance anymore for kitten grinds to meet arbitrary requirements so I can actually play the kitten game.

Double block is pretty fun.

One of the core problems is that MH Sword also offers what’s essentially a superior defensive mechanism via Blurred Frenzy. What niche Scepter has is significantly undermined as a result.

frans.8092:

That is one crit – and requires a grandmaster trait which might have a better use. Same can be said on the sigil. Having one or 5 guaranteed crits is rather different

The Ele capability requires a utility slot which might have a better use. How mind-blowing is that ?!

And the Thief, amazingly enough, has a similar Signet for 15% damage :O. Omgrz! And that’s mathematically stronger than 5 autocrits!

TOO MUCH INFORMATION MELTDOWN.

Wait … all of this was captured a dozen posts ago.

Oh right, I’m slow. Wait, someone’s slow. All I know is that there’s some slowness here.

Edit:

So, like I said before, the only thing that really needs to be changed is to invert CND and/or nerf BS to a 0.5s attack. Nerf to Mug is generally a good idea as well, but more optional. With all 3 I would say also increase the arc of Backstab to include sides as well for more reliable hits.

Zzzzz.

Scepter’s main use atm comes into play when melee is just a really really really bad idea, and you have a condition build.

This combination of conditions is rare.

The biggest issue is that Scepter1 blows. If it weren’t so bad, Scepter would be much more viable. The windup time on Scep3 is also meh. Ohwell.

Edit:

On the other hand, Scepter is amazing before level 7.

VoxParanoia.8976:

So, the Mesmer has really intrigued me for a while now and I think it’s time to roll one.
Any advice/suggestions on a build or weapon choices or anything like that?
I know these posts pop up relatively frequently, sorry for the noob questions >.<

1. Before level 7, used Scepter mainhand.

2. After level 7, use Greatsword + Staff. Edit: If you don’t find those weapons easy to use for rolling PvE, feel free to use other weapons.

3. For your first 5 trait points, stick them into Illusions (last line).

4. For your next 10 trait points, stick them into Domination (first line) and pick up Mental Torment or the 15% illusion damage — whichever you prefer.

5. Understand that clones are fodder, phantasms actually do damage, and both clones and phantasms are “illusions” in general.

6. At level 45, experiment with different specs and weapons until you find a combination you like. You’ll also have to wean yourself off of the PvEase of GS+Staff, although they are fine weapons in their own right.

7. Learn the class in the following sequence:

- Clone/Phantasm uptime and management.
- Clone/Phantasm management while using Shatters.
- Weapon swapping with clones and phantasm management, with Shatters.
- Using all 4 Shatters.
- Using Ethereal (mostly) and Light (some) combo fields while doing all of the above.
- Mantras [optional].

Obsidian.1328:

For instance, managing to pull a lord completely out of a tower(like at the Woodhaven tower on blue map) from outside of it should be obviously wrong to everyone, regardless of whether or not the devs have addressed it. You shouldn’t need someone else to tell you that. Other things, like a thief’s stealth-spike, are not so cut and dry and require debate and discussion.

Pulling a lord out of a tower is legit because you still have to stand in the circle of the tower — that is the primary kittenblock to taking the tower anyways.

I wouldn’t bat an eyelash at a lord pull. The game’s still on and it makes Woodhaven a more unique battle. Annoying on the receiving end, sure, but there are plenty of annoying things in the game.

Thief CND Mug BS combo is imbalanced from an overarching combat design perspective, but I wouldn’t fault any individual player for using it. Repeat stealth + culling is asinine from the engine perspective and again I wouldn’t fault any player for abusing it.

Back when orbs of power existed, repairing the altars with PvE Karma consumables was also the height of cheese, but perfectly legit. Shrug.

Thobek.1730:

SoR doesn’t work well with others? that’s ok it was just a thought to change things up for a week. I’ll talk to you in about a months time and see how you feel then.

SOR dealt with superior BG and SoS coverage in tier 2 for 3 months straight.

Maybe you need to revise your time horizon.