Guild Wars 2

Thaddeus.4891:

Jerus.4350:

Fernling.1729:

To me, PvE is the only good thing this game offers. SPvP and WvW are some of the most boring things I’ve done in an mmo. I would primarily call myself a PvP player too in other games.

I fall into the exact same category.

WHAT Jerus you disappoint me. You don’t like the PvP, you break my heart.

I want to so badly, SO badly, but I just can’t get into it. I’ll give it a whirl for like an hour each week just hoping that I’m missing something about it and someday it’ll click and I’ll enjoy it (it worked in one of my old games), but every time I just go in, play for a bit, and I don’t know, I just feel like the gameplay is sloppy.

Too many variables, too harsh of counters, but not only that it’s not counters within play (RPS style) but within builds. Now, highend play, I think things change as people will conform a bit more to certain elements as with a competent and organized team you can shore up any weakness in a single individual’s build. If the one player builds for something and leaves out condi cleanse, no worries your buddy has your back. So it’s surely different when you’re working as a full team as counters aren’t as harsh, but in queue’d play… naw.

If you’re solo queueing and you’re playing a build without condi cleanse or stunbreaks and you come up against someone focusing on that… you’re dead. And, that’s where I find it really troubling. This is the ONLY game I’ve ever played where I find myself in a situation where the best option is to run away… RUN AWAY, let that sink in for a second. Fast action packed combat and you’re running away! WTF!

My last MMO had what I still feel is the best MMO PVP ever, it was DCUO, where I’d say GW2 takes the normal MMO concept and smashes it together with a more adventure RPG type game (think Ocarina of time for example) DCUO was the same but with a fighting game, so think Tekken/MK/Virtual Fighter (;)) type play. In that game I NEVER ran from a fight, as if I played well even if they were my strongest counter class if I played lights out perfect I could beat them or at least last long enough for backup to arrive, and yes this is talking at the high end as well, best players vs best players. I watch these PVP tournaments and I just don’t see that same possibility of excellence and perfection. I see sloppiness. That’s not to insult those players, they’re far better at it than I am, but I simply get no feeling of motivation to get better when… that… is what I’d be achieving. It’s simply not a game I want to play, again, looks and feels sloppy.

Sorry to rant, but PVP is really troubling me right now in that I feel like that’s the playstyle that they’re trying to shift PVE to. Colin with his comments about highend PVP being the only area where you use your full set of skill… it got me worried. I don’t want to see my clean PVE change into that sloppy PVP style. I do very much want more challenging PVE but I want it to be a step forward in the same direction as what we have, not a dodgeroll back into something completely new.

deSade.9437:

/looks for spojski’s comment

Uhhhh…

to paraphrase, he used to play with the guy and talk with the guy, giving him a chance, then suddenly realized he had a dagger in his back and turned around to see that Romanian kitten with his maniacal grin.

What gets me is he takes Brazil out of context and uses him to prove the point he’s trying to make. Just feels pretty rude when Brazil was the guy who sat down and had a pretty decent conversation with him, but he didn’t stop there, he then accuses dlonie of being an elitist… dlonie… elitist… they don’t belong in the same sentence much less the same page. Ehh, maybe he just did a good job of striking a chord. He seems far more interested in drumming up controversy and siphoning anyone who doesn’t like the meta into his youtube channel.

Nia.3964:

Jerus.4350:

Feel Free to hit me up, can’t say I’ll be availalbe (friends keeping me busy lately) but down if not

EU?

NA I really wish I grabbed an account for EU when it was $10 Maybe start a f2p one! /shrug

Well I feel stupid for ever trying to give the guy a chance. spoj, all I can say is you’re right.

Attacking dlonie for being an elitist… LOL, I joined his guild, it was a lot of fun, last full group I played in it was taking 4 new players ranging from lvl 37 to 1 lvl 80 through CM carrying them the whole way, having lots of laughs and tons of fun as I did my best to teach them encounters and how to play the game. This is the guild that he’s one of the big names and vital members, this is the guild that tries to help people, and you call him an elitist? Wow.

I actually defended you the other day in a thread, man was I mistaken. I saw your video talking with Brazil, you came off as pretty intelligent, and very reasonable. You brought up a lot of good points, and you do in this video as well. But, now you just come off as a kitten. Guy sits down and talks reasonably with you, giving you the benefit of the doubt as the community has more or less turned their back on you, and then you take his play out of context in an attempt to prove your own point? kitten move buddy.

That icebow video you showed, yeah, pretty sure all of DnT or at least a few of the key members have spoken out against it’s dominance, and that’s not even the linecasting which (you’re about 5-6 months late on this btw) was deemed an exploit by the speedrunning community and banned from records pretty quickly after it began to see a rise in use.

If you want to make a point, make the point, don’t attack people and try to demonize alternative communities. But I think making the point isn’t your goal here, your goal is to create controversy, to suck in all the anti-meta people to your youtube channel. I can respect that, I wouldn’t say it’s the most polite thing to do, but hey, being a prick can be quite beneficial. So good on ya for throwing your manners aside to strum up some views on youtube.

As for necro, pretty sure Brazil’s been playing it quite a bit, being at least somewhat vocal about it’s uses. I’ve been playing quite a bit of it myself, bringing it into fractal 50s and having fun. I think the last 4 of them have ended on Mai trin, where I kited and stripped stacks, dodging her spin and absorbing the shot with DS. I don’t think I died in a single one of those while my entire party cycled through the known (and ignored) exploit of Kiel rezzing to come back and join me in the fight. Can’t say I don’t see the power when I can easily fight Mai Trin and it would be a solo if it weren’t for that exploit letting others jump back in. But instead of trying to berate members of the community, I prefer to highlight the faults in the game hoping that they fix them, I prefer to be polite to my fellow players and do my best to teach the less educated members of our community on how events work. Almost never commenting on builds unless people ask, just plodding along trying to spread information about encounters as I go.

I’ll end in one thing I can agree with you on. Necromancer is a HIGHLY underrated profession, it’s a profession that’s pretty easy to play with the right build (DS) allowing a plethora of mistakes while pumping out consistent damage, while not optimal the fact that it’s mainly pressing 1 it allows you to hit near optimal for necro quite easily, and even if other professions (especially engi) are higher they take more precision and the likelihood of them maximizing and hitting anywhere near their potential is pretty low and in that stance Necro can easily come very close. That all said, Necromancer very much lacks on the tools and skills that are complementary to PVE in this game right now, they lack active defenses (evade/block) and bring very little party support (vuln/some healing/some blinds/rezzing utility), and what they do just isn’t the key parts that make up the “support” role in this game (projectile defense being the biggest one). So overall while Necro is very much underrated, it’s still lacking, but it’s fun, and no one should feel bad playing it, it can hold it’s weight outside the speed run playstyle by which I mean going for a record, not just trying to finish a dungeon in a timely manner (it can do that just fine).

TLDR: If you want to make a point, don’t drum up a ton of controversy while doing so, your point will be lost in the wake.

Nia.3964:

Did Arah Fullrun PuG tonight. Or atleast, I tryed to. 1hr 30 Minutes for 4+2, then I left after we managed to kill belka after a few horrible skip fails.
Best part was the thief laying a blackpowder field right inside like 10 spawned grubs from the previous fails. After p2 I leave, wishing them good luck…what happened then can be seen in the screenshots.

PS: I advertised as “no OS Lupi”, and I’m the guardian that “failed” the OS.
PPS: Anyone interested in fast late night Arah runs?

Feel Free to hit me up, can’t say I’ll be availalbe (friends keeping me busy lately) but down if not

Fernling.1729:

To me, PvE is the only good thing this game offers. SPvP and WvW are some of the most boring things I’ve done in an mmo. I would primarily call myself a PvP player too in other games.

I fall into the exact same category.

deSade.9437:

LF portal spots in cm plox too lazy to google (but I doubt I’ll step foot in a dungeon that isn’t arah again…)

Wait? there are dungeons other than Arah?

And, Quark it’s totally worth it, that or a good movie or something you can watch while they try to make the Ooze → Tar P1 skip.

Palador.2170:

I See No Tomorrow.7302:

The only counter I can think of is the more damage you deal, the more damage your opponent deals in all forms. Thus higher DPS builds wouldn’t really be wanted since you’d just be killing everyone faster.

How about a boss with stats based on the raiders’ stats?

Either directly (more power for the raiders means more power for the boss) or inverted (more power for the raiders means more toughness for the boss). It’s kind of a cheap trick, though…

I expect to see at least one boss where if its health drops too fast, it changes tactics to wipe out glass cannon builds.

Very lame trick indeed for the stat changing.

The other thing though, YES, I want it, I want it bad. It’s a pretty common strategy to punish the DPS stacking tactics in raiding games I’ve played. You have % based triggers, but unlike the lupi and grawl phasing no skipping through them, if you unleash a burn that drops it 10% and at every 5% he spawns a wave of adds, well now you get 2 waves.

Makes high DPS risky, but that’s the point, high risk, high reward, reward being faster kill.

Samhayn.2385:

Really the zerker meta is in place because the faster stuff dies the less you need to deal with it’s mechanics, most of them big one shot deals.

So active defense and burn it down is the name of the game since toughness doesn’t absorb enough damage to stop a one shot.

It would really need to be more but smaller hits and other mechanic changes to make other gear sets viable.

As for the soft trinity the reason it never really works is because you can bring support and control and still not give up much dps on most of the classes.

All anyone can do is hope that the raid devs see what happened in current pve and change mechanics to counter it.

Exactly, which is why I get the feeling that gameplay as a whole is going to be drastically changed, no more focus on active defenses, but instead mitigation and absorption. I guess some people may enjoy it, I can’t say I will.

BINGO

Quickfoot Katana.8642:

It seems that Whiteside F2P server launch is happening 29 september. Any filthy elitists out here who are going to try it out?

I’ll probably give it a whirl again. I just lacked (maybe still do?) the motivation to start another MMO when I tried before. Just so much to learn and master in an MMO that it’s a pretty daunting task, plus learning the new UI and all that. I will say Whiteside made me appreciate a lot of things about GW2, though of course with that came that sinking feeling thinking about how much potential this game has but left untapped. Here’s hoping my guesses about raids are wrong.

shion.2084:

I’ve found that I don’t need to be quite meta to be very effective in dungeons, especially these days. It sort of all seems a cake walk compared to pre patch.

I will guarantee that meta likely involves alchemy though I run firearms and explosives with it and a power build. I debate between marksman and pinpoint dist (because with a high precision the pinpoint is enough to give even my power build good supporting condi damage). And in duneons I think there’s a case for the increase effectiveness when close skill compared to armour exploit trait…. though I debate. I run EG, BK, rifle and might potion (fury is nice). Can stack 23 might or so on group before engagemnets, can remove condi’s, things basically melt like swiss cheese.

Firearms + Explosives are the key to any damage focused build whether power or condi. The last is generally tools because it has some neat stuff, but Alchemy can be nice for HGH with EG and some things that could act as a safety net.

A FYI though, you can stack 25 might by juggling your utilities and blasting fire fields before a fight, no need for HGH or elixirs, though they can be easier to accomplish this.

eisberg.2379:

Astralporing.1957:

Larynx.2453:

The only reason zerker is meta is because ArenaNet is inclusive and not enforcing any requirements.

If they will be enforcing any requirements, it will be towards zerker, not away from it. They have said many times already that they don’t consider zerker meta a problem, quite the opposite, they think it’s a gear for more skilled players (you know, the “greater risk, greater reward” case). And you know what kind of players the raids are made for? Hint: not the unskilled ones.

Going with Zerker is actually easy mode for dungeons and everything else related to PvE in this game, going in with something else other than Zerker actually takes skill and team work to accomplish because nothing dies really fast before it can cause to much damage, which means people need to use their skills to help each other out either through controlling or supporting.

With the raids, they are designing them so you actually need a group of people with a mix of control, support, and damage builds. They didn’t do that with previous PvE content in Guild Wars 2.

When you talk many dungeons yes. When things are blowing up yes. But, that’s just simply untrue when you are doing longer fights. I have a feeling that convincing you will never happen, but I can tell you right now when I do fractal trios 3X zerker can be quite frustrating as with zerker some bosses kill you by looking at you. The setup that makes it nice smooth and easy is when i run with a clerics guard, they’re able to heal up any bit of stray damage I take (that doesn’t kill me on the spot that is). It’s certainly a more relaxed and enjoyable experience for me.

Blanket statements are quite silly, but hey it’s the forums and that’s what people do right?

AlliedKhajiit.2794:

Just seems like it’d be a nice QoL change for mesmers. It’d do the same deal with leaving a clone at your last position if you have a target, and work as a shorter range version of Infiltrator’s arrow on thief.

It’s pretty annoying having to quickly use about face two times to cover some distance on the class, and when doing it fast enough, as about face isn’t instant, it can quite easily mess up the direction you were walking in, making you have to reorient the camera.

Thoughts?

As you’re running, target an enemy you’re passing, once you pass it, phase retreat and it’ll propel you forward. Do it while out of range and there is no clone to put you in combat.

EcoRI.9273:

Let’s be real if a necro was “very effective” in a raid, I can’t see it being hard. It seems like as long as you know the mechanics you will do fine.
Also I probably wouldn’t want any thieves/ele if there are mechanics in the raid where you can get 1shotted easily.

Look at PVP, and how they tank up and take persistant damage right to the face while waiting for strong CC/spikes to dodge. That’s what we’re getting. Hope everyone has fun!

Iris Ng.9845:

Wethospu.6437:

Today I wanted to do the first part of CMP1 solo on Thief. Naturally after that I made a casual lfg to finish the path.

Near instantly my party gets filled with level ~50 characters, all with < 1k AP. I waited at the the barn when they bravely entered the mansion.

After 4 minutes they were still inside.

After 8 minutes they were all dead.

All leave except one who then gets enough courage to speak up. I showed him the way and then created LFG again. But that’s another horror story for some other time.

Show Spoiler

hide spoiler

Think about someone getting revealed every skip and then you have to stealthresurrect everyone few times.

I learn from my experience that mesmer is naturally a better carry class in CM p1 than thief. You dont have to stealth your group and make sure they will not reveal themselves. Just tell them to waypoint and take your portal…

So much this, Thief for when I’m teaching people how to do it, Mes for when I’m just looking to get them through it.

Nokaru.7831:

spoj.9672:

Whether buffs share to all 10 or not i guarantee it will be 2+ chronomancers.

I don’t really play Mesmer that much. Why do you think that these will be that desirable?

Perma slow, quite a bit fo swiftness, plus all normal mesmer tricks.

Miku Lawrence.6329:

http://gw2efficiency.com/c/Miku%20Lawrence

Wish people were using this more.

kitten elitist, You just awnt to discriminate against people for using builds they find fun. You’re trash, and you’re the reason dungeons aren’t fun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No new fractals incoming atm, they said that

I agree with your definition of challenging, very very very much do. However, I think gimmicks are not necessarily a bad thing, and Mai trin is a wonderful fight. The cannon phase can be a bit wonky but overall it’s one of my favorite fights in the game. I think they did a great job. It makes you use all of your tools and focuses a lot on positioning. It’s a great example of how Gimmicks can be good and still provide challenges.

I think Colin and his crew get off on keeping information away from their fans. I can just picture him holding a piece of paper with the answer above a group of us as we try and jump to get it whilte he pulls it back higher and puts on that kitten eating grin. I can respect and get behind that kind of evil though. Good on ya ANet,

So, Lone Star, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb

LOL I like that, last hope is their incompetance?

Really though I think they’re good developers, I’ve enjoyed the game so far. But, I can’t help but feel they’re steering it strait in the opposite direction from what I love about it.

Maybe I’m just a weird person but this is like the 4th game to do this to me if my thinking is right here. Game plays one way, many people love how it works and play it for years, others complain daily and don’t really play, and of course some quit. Years into the game they cave in to the complaints after most of those people are gone anyways, or those that remain continue to sit in the common areas and never really intended to play the game just socialize anyways. Ehh whatever.

Isn’t that the typical cadence of things? Trash is called trash not just because it goes down easy or that you get bad loot typically, it’s because it’s simply filler. They’re just trying to space out the events (event being boss or some neat gimmicky puzzle type thing, maybe both).

EcoRI.9273:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3jdjtv/designing_challenging_content/cuoh8b6

“When bosses don’t die in 5 seconds, survivability and sustainability actually becomes a thing.”

Oh look dungeon requires no skills says a dev.(At least thats how I interpret that statement.)

I was far more interested in the other comment. I take it they have play tested the raid already. If necro is in a good place (likely they didn’t really look at damage that much) then I can only assume that a focus on avoiding damage and the current style of PVE is not something we’re going to see in raids. Not a big surprise seeing their feverish love for their PVP and their belief that it’s somehow a superior gameplay style.

Chances are these raids won’t be very much fun to me it keeps sounding like.

Wouldn’t need that. Just give each trash/event/boss a check box, when it’s finished you get a check in it, if you start the instance the next time it simply doesn’t spawn or start that event and instead begins on the next one.

We had that setup in Everquest actually, though it was a bit different it did allow us to knock out a few bosses each night instead of having to clear it in one shot.

I really hope there is some way to pause and come back where you left off. Or at the very least that they’re going to completely rework the instance system such that when it bugs or DC’s you, you’re not required to start all over. And of course, like your suggestion so you can do it in chunks throughout the week.

Putting my money on at least a few potential gamewide firsts being blocked by crashes or bugs

SlyDevil.3952:

Jerus.4350:

They did reference toughness gear and using it to take hits. Will they be strengthening the agro advantage of toughness gear? because as is, while it has some strength it’s far from consistent. I take it we’ll be doing a lot of range damage to stay away from the melee hits that you need defensive gear for?

Ehh, I should stop thinking about it, just wait to see it, my hype and positive outlook is gone.

Maybe we can body block projectiles easier >:)

Bodyblocking rushing teragriffs?

They did reference toughness gear and using it to take hits. Will they be strengthening the agro advantage of toughness gear? because as is, while it has some strength it’s far from consistent. I take it we’ll be doing a lot of range damage to stay away from the melee hits that you need defensive gear for?

Ehh, I should stop thinking about it, just wait to see it, my hype and positive outlook is gone.

Rising Dusk.2408:

They seriously need a shroud trait for defense in SR.

Shroud Carapace
You take no damage from attacks and conditions for 2 seconds when you enter shroud.

So much needed. It’s just insane how far the gap is in active defenses.

TheRandomGuy.7246:

Jerus.4350:

So, 2X on my 30 fractal last night, 3rd fractal, Thaumanova, everyone crashes after activating the side events… fun stuff. ANet didn’t want me to do a 30 last night.

Lol that crash is still not fixed?

Nope, twice last night… twice! 3rd fractal each time.

dlonie.6547:

I got a lot of good from that new article:

- multiphase bosses
- enrage timers
- raid-specific masteries

some bad:

- they do mention that toughness gear may be ideal for some situations (though perhaps not absolutely required, I hope).
- Unique rewards only once per week. I hope they still give some gold reward or similar for repeating it within a week…

Not sure I’d put masteries in the good category. “Hey you’re not going to have to jump through any hoops to do these raids! just propel your body through this circular pipe… what? it’s not the same thing!”

“Tactics like combo field manipulation, proper damage maximization, and damage mitigation for your profession will be vital to your success.”

Hype successfully neutralized. Have fun with your raids.

deSade.9437:

ONE. Ok? I can compromise up to ONE additional gearset for my chars – my heavy one for guard and rev and maybe I may feel like cashing out a light healing/cele set, and ONLY if it’s optional for increased safety/efficiency. That’s it. Deal?
(omg if they bring back tanking I swear to god imma hunt down all the godkitten phiw excuse of people in this thread and end them)

Nope, done deal, “damage mitigation” will be important… mitigation…

Would love if they started using some of the LS in general to create fractals. WTB Glint’s Lair fractal!

As someone who never got to do Marionette, I’d love to see it as well. I just started the game and was getting killed by the failures as I was doing my personal story but that’s it I think I hit 80 about the time that thing closed down

ANet simply doesn’t care. We see a video from Chris Cleary where he strips, suicides, then proceeds to delete the character and ban the account for a WvW greifer. Yet we see known dungeon griefers continue to play after they’ve recieved dozens and dozens of reports.

No hate for Mr Cleary(he’s a really cool guy), I understand the issue with it being a very complicated situation. There are so many possibilities. But, when someone posts an LFG then gets kicked from their own party at the end of a dungeon. When someone is kicked at the end of a fractal without any discussion then it’s posted in LFG to sell. These are unacceptable and clear cases of abuse.

It’s sad and pathetic, but this “nicest community” that ANet likes to claim (god I laughed so hard when they quoted that in the F2P presentation) is anything but. But not only is it full of griefing kittens, it also doesn’t do a kitten thing to help protect it’s players. You’re on your own. Don’t even kid yourself that it’ll ever get better, don’t kid yourself that a report will work. Nothing will happen and the people who do it are simply smarter than us nicer people who think that’s wrong. They have it right, screw other people just steal and get what you want, nothing is going to happen.

I really feel that the content should be hard enough that we all actually want to go get some defensive gear for it initially. But I totally agree that glass should be an option, just one far out there beyond the reach of most players. Think non reflectable lupi level of active defense combined with extra mechanics, some of which will have you taking damage so you have to gather and blast a water field, all while having to have persistent reflects for additional attacks that would drain you if you attempted to use your other defenses. Something along those lines.

Rising Dusk.2408:

Truthfully I’m okay with this as long as they’re active in building new raids and Fractal content.

Ditto.

At this point I really only enjoy Arah, while Fractals I enjoy most (kitten snowblind).

So, 2X on my 30 fractal last night, 3rd fractal, Thaumanova, everyone crashes after activating the side events… fun stuff. ANet didn’t want me to do a 30 last night.

Totally agree Vox, and what I was trying to get at earlier. I highly doubt it will tune at the absolute maximum, but I hope it will advance PVE past whatit is at.

Samhayn.2385:

Jerus.4350:

There is PVP coming in HoT, Stronghold, though something tells me if someone wants to play a MOBA they’ll be looking elsewhere.

Their love of PVP certainly has me concerned. Yes you see a variation of gear usages in PVP, but the entire play style is not something I enjoy at all. Colin’s comments about PVP while discussing raids worries me. PVP plays a whole lot different than most PVE. I want a harder version of the PVE we have not a completely different style that I won’t find fun.

I thunk his comment has more to do with things like cleansing, boon coruption, and all the other things that are used way more in pvp then in current pve. Can’t hurt to make more skills and abilities needed in pve

If it is, sweet, we’ve all wanted it and it surely needs it. I just can’t say it enough that I want the PVE game taken to the next level(high focus on active defense), not turned into the PVP feel(much more soaking up damage while you wait for the big attacks to avoid).

Quite sure they said no, IIRC those at 50 currently even will get a title? not sure on that may be a rumor.

Taku.6352:

Most important part about revenants is that they can afk Mai Trin cannon phase.

!?!?! I must know!

Aye makes sense No Trigger, like you said different games use things from other games, advance them and tweak them to fit. That shield thing doesn’t sound all that different from some old EQ mechanics with doom triggers and bane items, something like the two combined with an environmental mechanic added in.

So much agree Gabe, so much.

That’s my fear is that we’ll just be forced to take a lot of more passive things, that’s not the game I fell in love with. I want to build a set of defensive gear because I find myself unable to keep up actively, be it because I screwed up in my dodge/block rotation or because projectil defense had a gap in it. I do want some healing both to help counter that but also to deal with certain mechanics that require quick responses (think old tom but harder/more punishing). I want effects like Simin that require some team response. I want adds that come rushing in to destroy something where we have to respond quickly and keep them away while we whittle them down, not blow them up, maintaining blinds on them and interrupting the “unblindable” deadly channel effects while avoiding the fields from the boss/adds/room. I want rotating fields (when you look at rev’s new projectile block skill on hammer it looks like they can do the things like you see in noTrigger’s video of that rotating field on that boss). I want to have to keep on the move, no free casting outside certain times (when you break the breakbar?).

I want the difficulty to be about actively responding to each situation, not slapping on tanky gear because it’s required to survive. I want this game’s PVE to be taken to the next level, not transformed into their beloved PVP.

There is PVP coming in HoT, Stronghold, though something tells me if someone wants to play a MOBA they’ll be looking elsewhere.

Their love of PVP certainly has me concerned. Yes you see a variation of gear usages in PVP, but the entire play style is not something I enjoy at all. Colin’s comments about PVP while discussing raids worries me. PVP plays a whole lot different than most PVE. I want a harder version of the PVE we have not a completely different style that I won’t find fun.

EcoRI.9273:

Personally speed shouldn’t be something people optimize for until they have figured out how to farm the raid. Thief imo is too squishy and can be a liability. Personally i would go warrior and GS rush for anything that requires mobility.

I hope mobility speed is important, from engaging an enemy further away from the defended point, or activating/disabling some mechanism. Certainly an aspect I think should be valued.

EcoRI.9273:

I can see thieves being left in the dust if there are no major trash mob skipping encounters.
I can see eles being left in the dust if boss mechanics have very hard to avoid aoes. If you look at the bosses in silverwaste, or even those 2 plant dragon bosses in living story, most of the aoes are not easier to dodge just because you are ranging it. If that is the case, eles with its low HP and low armor getting 1shotted will probably not be desired for a while until people really get the raids down to a science.

I’d imagine they’d be the runners, going to activate whatever asap. Their mobility is still very nice which could prove to be quite beneficial.

NoTrigger.8396:

the challenge in raiding comes from learning complex stuff fast and finding answers and patterns + the teamplay. its possible to make bosses so hard that no one will ever kill them without challenging the individual player.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qIVkFINBSQ

for example this fight doesnt require much individual skill. but in the second phase the coordination and teamplay required is so insane, that no one except enigma killed this boss in this form. and every other guild and even the devs said its impossible to kill it.

you have to kill all orbs before you run out of shields, players will get rooted, if the roots overlap the players will die. if like 2 players die you wont have enough dps. the only way to protect the players with the roots is using a shield. each player has 1 shield which can be used once, the flame wave one shots everything, unless you use a shield.

Cool stuff, you got me there, I did downplay the value of organization a bit too much, guess my brain is stuck on GW2 where it’s kind of “learn your job and execute it” without that need to communicate on who’s going to handle it as the situation changes. Reading/seeing that reminds me of some old raids. Closest we have in this game is Simin’s paralysis but of course that can be nullified with a well timed stability, no need for communication (though it helps).

So I assume you use your shield to defend whoever gets stuck in a bad spot, trying to save yours by hitting that gap aye?

Yes to the Assassin stuff. I believe Ele optimal is like either your staff or 2 armor pieces assassin, just as an example.

Also, Bloodlust is not a 25% gain to DPS, you’re right in saying base DPS but your gear and what not will give you more power, so it has the potential if you don’t use any power in gear. If you do you’re looking at something like 2100 iirc off the top of my head, meaning ~11% gain, and then if you factor in might you’re looking at another 625 so 2750 and food maybe another 100 so you’re at 8.7%. It doesn’t deminish it’s actual damage returns, but as a percentage it does drop down.

Then there are things like Reflects which ignore your power but do take your crit chance and modifier into account, which is why many mesmers run around with Assassin gear and/or Accuracy sigils to really ramp up that returned damage.

Some more factors to things than just the base level.