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There may be a few swept up in unfortunate circumstances, but here’s my point. First off, these players got out on that team in the first place because the game saw them at a similar MMR. It’s not like they were placed with people that were significantly lower than their MMR (which can happen in Unranked, when they try to balance the MMRs across team). Secondly, because the old Unranked system tried to balance teams, people get under this assumption that because their win ratio is 50-55% elsewhere that they are at least average players or better. Many players have convinced themselves that they are better than they truly are, and that’s another unfortunate side effect of this new system. Some people are getting a dose of reality but they are the same people who blame the system rather than themselves.
Point is, I think people are over-attributing their losses to the “system”, and are under-attributing their losses to their lack of skill.
And I’m not sure why people get floored by the suggestion, but que up with a couple buddies to get yourself out of the rut you’re in. You have the power to fix the rut of you think you’re just being wronged, que with better players which should help your MMR.
Couldn’t say this better.
Also, this is Sunday 4 pm HotM. I don’t see that many amber icons. Apparently majority is NOT sitting in 100 games loss streaks.
This comes off as a bit clueless… getting out of Amber if you play enough is inevitable even with 100 game losing streaks, as you can’t lose pips. Getting to Emerald is tiresome but doable for most players. If you’re lucky to win a match once in awhile and have the patience to deal with broken matchmaking.
What you’re not understanding is besides that the reason you’re not seeing many Amber players is because many players are quitting. Would you keep playing a broken system after 100 loses in a row???
Everyone thinks, he is (at least) decent, because the previous system allowed everyone to win a good amount of games. But how can you know, if you have never faced much better players before?
Because in a league you will get to a point where’s you can go no further. The current set up means you stomp, or get stomped. There is no way to improve when you have close to no chance of winning.
Most people don’t want a free ride, the just want a chance of winning every match to a point.
In most leagues yes this would be true… In GW2’s current set up… the more matches you win the more matches you will win because it will set you up with easier matches. Whereas if you lose A match… good luck moving up a tier again.
Usually happens to me after I’ve stomped someone. Right at the moment their body disappears I’ll get hit with a quick burst of conditions.
Just build a trap guardian… simply just have to walk out… push 7890 and autoattack once a minute.
That was actually a pretty good game… both teams scored over 100. Short answer is, it’s not a fair game. Apparently the matchmaker rewards what it determines are “good” players with easier matches.
I don’t know how WvW rewards are going to compare to Raid rewards… as a thief I haven’t been allowed to Raid.
Cerby, we obviously don’t see eye to eye lol. I think it’s pretty bogus that a glass cannon elementalist can solo fight an entire 5 man team and come out completely untouched by pressing 2 buttons. Things need fixed.
I don’t see the terrain of the new map as an issue. I like that there are new nooks and crannies I can use to my advantage in a fight. I’ve mentioned before the Fire Keep needs an overhaul, as it’s the only keep with only 1 way in. Also, the Oasis should be consumed by Cthulu and never seen again.
I think the biggest issue with WvW is class balance. The big zergs used to have front, mid, and back lines based on classes…and ALL classes brought something to the table. Now it’s just a front and back line and half the classes are actively discouraged because they bring nothing that can help (namely aoe fields). It does suck to be fighting on narrow terrain and have an army comprised soley of necromancers, dragonhunters, and rangers decimate a much larger, more diverse group simply because they have access to unblockable fear and knockback. That said, it’s a class balance issue, and well… it’s not only WvW that’s suffering from that.
While I’d like to hope Anet can fix all the damage HoT has done, I do admit I’m one of those players who used to mainly do WvW…switched to PvP for awhile since WvW became a ghost land, and now am looking for another game to replace GW2. I stopped playing PvE because it was so buggy I couldn’t complete the story. Which is sad because up until I discovered Mordropurgatory I was interested in the story.
Anyway, in the short term, I hope they bring back the alpine map to A borderland, if for no other reason than as a show of goodwill to their rather upset player base. I think that’d at least tide people over until they release this “overhaul” they are working on. Otherwise, I’m fairly certain that their player base will begin a mass exodus to other games.
Pretty much.
The power creep of HoT messed up all the gamemodes.
A lot of PvE content (dungeons in particular) has been completely trivialized by the absurd new heights of damage. While I don’t know the particulars of the maximum attainable DPS, I wouldn’t be surprised if it currently approaches twice what was possible when dungeons were designed.
The PvP meta is garbage with way too much (way too strong) AoE cleave and far too much damage efficiency, causing the skill ceiling for every meta build to be excruciatingly low.
But neither of those modes was hit anywhere near as hard as WvW. I’d even go so far as to suggest that the impact HoT had on WvW fights has driven more people away from the game than the horrendous new map. Due to the shear number of players involved, the balance between group-wide sustain and damage in WvW is quite delicate, and this was quite obviously not considered for a second during development of the expansion (or the specialization update in June, while we’re at it).A lot (and I do mean a lot) of formerly dedicated WvW players who are still playing the game are only doing so because they haven’t found a replacement yet. Many have high hopes for BDO. Personally, I do not think it will fill the hole left by what GW2 WvW once was (from what I hear it doesn’t have anywhere near the same teamwork requirements). However, eventually a new solid RvR game will come out and this game will suffer immensely.
Amen
Meta is all about high defense and high offense now that you can get both without compromise in many classes. Thief isn’t one of those classes. With a full toughness vitality build a thief is still a one shot down, sometimes two shots. Originally thief was the high risk high reward class. Now you’d be better off playing Rev because it’s basically a thief mashed up with a guardian.
Zuko nailed it. People like me are already quitting PvP outright because of the exact reasons he/she outlined.
Also doesn’t work on top of the walls of the Necromancer Tower in the Desert Borderlands… sucks when you’re trying to escape a zerg of 30 people and the neither shadowstep or shortbow 5 will transport you across a straight line….
The score from the opening post on this thread is how every single match is. It doesn’t matter how much you play. You will be on one side or the other of that. This whole “the better people will move up much faster” line Anet is pushing is patently false. Queue times in Emerald Hell are already worse than they were last season. At least last season you could reasonably expect both teams to be able to score over 100.
The more you play, the better your mmr becomes and the better matches you get…
False.
If you’re not playing Necro, Ranger, Revenant, or Guardian this season then you’re not playing PvP…hence why I’m not playing PvP anymore.
Hacks Bend, Jade Quarry, and a couple other servers have been taking advantage of this for forever. WvW is won based on population around the clock. If you can’t keep a map populated, it’s gonna flip. The solution is to try to recruit people from different time zones.
I actually like both the old maps, with the exception of the Oasis event. Once you get used to the layout of the new maps the objectives are spaced out about the same. The shrines could use some work… like if you take a shrine your team should get that buff, not the hold all 3 plus the keep. Also, the fire keep could use a rework as it is the only keep with literally 1 way in or out. Oasis could be completely nuked. Hell, flood it and put an underwater keep if you must.
So after 3 days of trying to get 1 tier in emerald repeatedly getting to 4 pips only to get rolled for the next 20 matches I’ve decided I’m done. Until Anet pulls it together no more PvP for me. They need another balance patch and to figure out their matchmaker system (you know… like testing it beforehand).
Since this season has started I’ve had one match…ONE match that was a close game. EVERY SINGLE OTHER MATCH was either roll or get rolled. 650-10, 500-43… rarely do both teams break 100. I’ve been on both sides of it. It’s not fun for anyone.
It’s not that thief is weak… the other classes are just overpowered
By the time things pan out, the season will be three quarters over. The league system is busted. It’d work better if they actually balanced the classes correctly before starting a new season.
This is pretty much how every match goes these days
This is my screen every time I manage to get to 4 pips. There’s gotta be a game out there with a full staff of developers that are better at balance.
tips: never go to the middle of the fight always pick well your target if in danger being focuse just stealth and shadow step away.
1v1 you can beat necro, warrior, mesmer ele, ranger, stay away from dh and scrapers same skill lvl you will 50-50 fights
As a general rule stay way from Guardians, Engineers, Rangers, Revenants, Elementalists, and Necromancers. You can fight other thiefs, or mesmers.
They could always make your rank based on your personal play and not whether or not your team won the match. That way no one would be carried, and no one would be sunk by a crap team.
I am having the same exact prob seas 2 – living in the same bottom feeder hell. Started the season, w. my friend (solo qed tho, didn’t pair up cuz we play diff times). I actually had a slightly higher mmr than he does – dragon rank, made it to ruby – about 50% ratio or a little higher. Ive been pvping in gw for 12 yrs, and gw2 since beta. Do it every day. Play meta dh, meta rev, meta reaper.
last seas I was 2 pips from diamond, but didn’t make it cuz of all the afker’s and match throwers – u know – throw a skill every one min, or stand outside the cap zone. Everyone told me, hang in there – it’ll be better seas. 2
Started in same place as my friend. Got paired w/ ppl who thought they should throw games some more (they didn’t think to read patch notes) – I told them mmr had been fixed and they told me to kitten off. Kept playing, won a few, then lost 4 in a row due to various situations (teams on ts, rerolls, bad compositions, 1 dc, etc. Kept hanging in there, but lost 3 more – bad team composition in 2, and 1 w/ 2 complete noobs who kept fighting ppl in mid of map and doing nothing else but dying. Got paired lower and lower.
I am now in a 72, yes 72! game loss streak. I am in some Twilight Zone hell where the players r noobs, newbies, clueless, afk, dcing, or just stupid re: strategy. I don’t feel Im ever getting out of this. Ive been stuck in tier 1 of emerald for 2 days solid. Meanwhile, my friend, whom I TAUGHT how to play pvp, is sailing thru sapphire, caught on a lucky streak of supportive players. And no, HE IS NOT A BETTER PLAYER, and no, I do not suck (I can hear the self righteous noobs right now who are in sapphire or above, whose butts I know I have slammed in gw2 pvp MANY A TIME before, thinking just that).
I feel like many. I have been playing gw for 12 yrs, all of it primarily pvp. I am a seasoned veteran player. I am not enjoying the game for the first time ever, and am actually being told, all I need to do is either practice in pve (the troll response) or buddy up w/ a team to “carry me” (I exclusively solo q and don’t like team pvp, tho I can do it), take a break of several weeks until the “good players” get their legendaries and stop playing (and I get to continue getting matched up w/ garbage teams), or quit. The latter sounds most appealing, tho I love gw and don’t want to. I am soldiering on at the moment, but it is very demoralizing. Especially all the talk about all the “skilled players” having reached their appropriate placements and all of us “less skilled players” sinking to our bottom feeder placement. So sad. So demoralizing. It would actually be less demoralizing if I did suck, cuz I am ever the realist, and don’t mind at all being sucky at stuff, or new to stuff. I would practice then and beat it. But this seems like it has NO FIX!
I’m running into the same issue…. the only solution I see is uninstalling as anet seems set to not fix it.
The entire game is a waste. For the next 2 months expect to see nothing but necro’s, guards, revs, and engi’s. Anything else is told to commit suicide in rl.
Given how god awful pvp is lately, where it’s either roll or get rolled I’ve begun offering my teammates to take the dishonor hit and leave the match if we’re losing terribly so that they don’t lose their pips. I find it personally disheartening to lose match after match after match, especially when you’re almost to tier but then get a bad roll. I’m talking games of where the score is 600-10. I’ve been on both sides of it and it’s fun for nobody.
Only positive thread on this entire page, seriously people, the game can’t possibly be THAT bad :P.
Since HoT’s release the game has taken a turn straight off a cliff.
Season 2 is much like Season 1, you’re right. I haven’t had a balanced match yet. It’s either a complete and total blowout or an utter steamroll. Getting slaughtered isn’t fun, neither is winning several in a row when it’s just sad.
Nerf Rev, Guardian traps (still), and Necro’s god mode and things would be better. Also the engi’s skill where they become invulnerable at 10% health for like 10 seconds should be shortened.
The matchmaker is still broken and will remain broken until such time as anet balances team composition, and balances the classes (last balance patch was a slight improvement, but we’re at almost a year of a completely busted system). You can always tell which classes are in vogue, when you run into teams of 5 of the same class over, and over, and over again. Also, people are getting around the team thing by just putting 4 people in a group so they can get on teamspeak and beat on pugs. Seriously tilts the advantage. If you’re in a party, you should be matched with other people in parties. If you’re the same guild, you should be treated like a party. Simple.
Particularly in the borderlands in wvw, the sb shortbow doesn’t work on inclined terrain like the lead up to the northwest camp, or staircases, etc…
Don’t know why I mention this as I’m a hair’s breath from uninstalling…but if there are still dev’s for the game maybe they could fix that one thing.
I’ve given up. Even with this last balance patch my thief with toughness build is a 1 shot… I can manage 2 shots if I do toughness and vitality. I HATE HoT. I keep changing my build up to see if there’s anyway I can survive better… but no luck at that. Any AOE field and I’m toast.
Thieves are now top-tier DPS in raids. Once you have the boons and stuff you need, bring it alongside the Tempests etc and you’ll be fine.
Either Dagger or Staff will work just by spamming autos if you’re lazy (easy 19k DPS), but you can go higher by using actual skills (Backstab or Vault).
How are you getting 19k on a staff auto attack?
Acrobatics is completely worthless on a thief. The entire trait line. They seemed to focus on it this patch…but it just fundamentally doesn’t work on a thief.
CS has no sustain….but for thief honestly… even our toughest builds are not “sustainable”. Actually leading up to this patch I was under the impression that thief was getting a major rework considering how poorly it’s been received in HoT. For WvW… congrats on doing better, keep in mind though that WvW is basically empty right now.
So after screwing around a bit tonight I’ve actually found that I have better luck without trickery traits. Against my intuition I put together a DA, CS, DARE staff build, and have been able to survive a bit better. The acrobatics line is a cute idea, but in practice just doesn’t work….. sorry Anet, you tried. I’m finding ele and mesmer have been brought closer to thieves balance wise, engi’s are the clear meta, and revenant is a solid second place currently, with ranger/necro tied for third. Hopefully there are a few more tweaks coming from this winter patch thing that will fix the bugs and bring things more inline. I don’t want to be some “OP god”, that said I would like to have some good, fair fights.
kinda hard to experiment during Raids….don’t you think?…
Then how do you suppose builds make it to meta?
Personally, I’d want to test a build in the environment it was designed for.
That’s great and all, except most parties will boot a thief on sight for raids.
Same old same old… I was trying to main staff, pointless. Changed up my build a lot, ended up with a sword/pistol combo with acrobatics and deadly strikes… but most my acrobatic traits are not triggering, nor is daredevil rune.
I can only attest for personal experience. Was using staff.
For me, instant reflexes isn’t working… at all. Upper hand isn’t working… at all. Signet of Malice is broken, it heals while I attack but if I activate it, it takes two seconds to take effect, and if I move, get hit, or anything it misfires. I’ve had 1 critical strike hit for 11,618 tonight, that was with vault. The rest crit at 2000… using daredevil rune so when I dodge it should crit next hit… only happens maybe 1/10 of the time.
Was super excited for this balance update. Heard that thief/daredevil was supposed to get a big buff since it got looked over with HoT’s release. Went to PvE… killing things took much longer, even though according to the notes I’m supposed to be doing more damage. Headed over to PvP…that was a joke. Still getting instant melted by engi’s that can pound on ya without losing stealth. It seems the only real improvement was basilisks venom.
Has anyone had any luck changing up their build since this bogus balance update?
Ele’s and druid’s are literally immortal at this point. It takes 3-4 people to drop a day one of these now… put 2 or 3 on a team… game over. Engi’s pretty close too.
Oh and the tower designs are awful… cannons where necros can fear you off the edge into the zerg, or eles can melt you before you fire a shot off. just bad. we have to spend more on siege inside keeps because the siege that comes with the upgrades is absolutely useless… still trying to figure out what the mortars can actually hit…
Describe a typical hour for you in the Alpine Borderlands in the past. For example, What size of group were you running in? What kind of tasks did you run? What activities did you do?
I’d either roam solo when thief build was more viable and solo camps and open walls in towers, or command and run with 5-25 people. Capture the third nearest our spawn first then take the other objectives. Depending on which servers we got paired up with we’d do some fights, but oftentimes we’d try to avoid the other server since they’d outnumber us 5-1.
Compare your experience described above with a typical hour spent in Eternal Battlegrounds, if you went there at all. Does your style of play change between the 2 maps? Same style, capture our third, then try for smc, then take the other objectives, or roam and disrupt supply.
Compare your experiences described above with an hour spent in the new borderlands.
Spend most my time crossing the map. 1 person will defend a tower against 20, at least long enough for the huge zergs to roll us over. Spend the next 15 minutes walking traversing the map. Go to oasis event…get rolled over by giant zerg. Lose all the towers we managed to capture the last several hours.
Describe the nature of combat in the borderlands in the past. How have the new borderlands impacted this paradigm for you? What style or build changes might it cause? For example, knocking people off cliffs or into lava might play a more important role.
Borderlands combat before was straightforward, drop your aoes, focus your downs, if near walls use them to get out of combat if you need to regroup. New borderlands haven’t changed this… can’t really use the cliff thing because the blow jets don’t drop people far, besides you have to have all 3 shrines PLUS the keep in order for anthing to be active. Pushing people into lava sounds fun… but I have literally zero push skills. Oh, and they are likely immune to the lava. or they can run into rocks…which, is just mildy annoying. Honestly have just tried avoiding the gimmicks. before we assault a keep, take out at least one of the shrines because that nukes their main advantage.
In your experience, compare the time it takes take a structure or objective here, then it did in the past.
It takes a lifetime longer now than it used to. Supply is lightyears away. Especially for the smaller servers, by the time we get enough supply to build a catapult, it’s evaporated.
How is the loot and wxp for you compared to in the past? Will it be able to sustain whatever you are doing? Did it take a hit, or was it improved? If you are planning to unlock an elite specialization, do you think you were helped or hurt in these regards?
WvW has always been the LAST place you look for loot. It just doesn’t drop. It never has been able to sustain whatever we are doing. it takes 2 or 3 catapults or rams to get most doors or walls down fast enough that you don’t get ran over ( more if it’s tier 3). That’s expensive, and it’s not like good siege ever drops. It’s just as bad as ever in that regard. I’ve unlocked my elite specialization in PvE… I wouldn’t even attempt it in WvW as that would take years.
Do you think you could pursue any other in-game goals just by playing WvW? No, WvW has very few mats, really poor loot drops, and no real reward system. Edge of the Mists is good for leveling a character, but that’s it really as far as other in game goals.
How will the map change impact the long sessions (multiple hours) you spend in WvW? The maps just increase commute time… alot.
In 100 words or less, describe how the new BLs could be improved.
Make them easier to get around, less buggy (graphic rendering). Less zergtastic, Make it so that if you have the shrine you get the bonus, whether or not you own the keep. Get rid of oasis entirely. put air in the fire zone, lava in the earth zone etc.
In 100 words or less, describe how the borderlands work to a new WvW player.
Currently…they don’t.
In 100 words or less, describe how the borderlands work to a veteran WvW player that is new to the maps.
They’re a mess currently.
Which map am I most likely to find you currently, if you’re on Gw2? You won’t anymore. My server has basically died on WvW since the new maps came out, so I’ve been playing pvp, which is it’s own mess.
I’d give money to go back to GW2 pre-heart of thorns. Can we make this an option?
No dragonhunters, tempests, daredevils, etc.. in pvp until things are more balanced. No Mordromoth fight until purgatory isn’t a thing anymore. No WvW where you have no idea if a wall is there or not or if it’s upgraded or not. Please?
The “hotfix” literally fixed almost nothing.
Unless you’ve got the rest of the team carrying you, thief currently is pretty awful. It’s my main and I do ok with it. But in pvp pretty much all I can do is avoid fights and decap stuff now. Most classes simply one hit aoe down me now. You dodge, but not far enough, or you dodge but hit an invisible wall and get hit anway. Plus you get to feel all the rage of your friends for being dumb enough to play thief.