Flipping is just arbitrage. It’s a guaranteed profit because of the gap in the bid-ask spread. There’s no such thing as “long term flipping” because it’s not a “flip” it’s a “hold.” If you hold something hoping the price will rise, that’s investing/speculation/betting, and can be spread across a variety of time horizons.
You make money by buying low and selling high. It takes effort to research prices and think about the probable outcome of events, which is why until recently I’ve mostly stayed away from it.
I suspect they may implement it like they did in China, with some form of pvp-style reward track. Or make it tied into the achievements system.
I think the practical question is, are they really going to ban you for instrument scripting? They may keep the policy broad to ensure they have discretion, but I suspect they are going to distinguish:
(a) someone who is at the computer, actively playing the game, responsive to the environment, and not using a macro to gain an unfair advantage (examples: scripted music, buying karma drinks for thirst quencher / opening 10,000 dragon coffers)
from
(b) someone auto farming/looting an event, using macros to manage multiple characters at the same time, or botting the TP.
Many people talking about their biggest losses are suffering some serious myopia. Its like someone who died 3 times fighting tequatl talking about how he lost money(back when there was repair fees), ignoring the fact he won the fight.
Point the op is making, is yes you lose on investments some times, but overall its pretty easy to come out ahead OVERALL. Talking about the time you lost 10 g on sprockets and ignoring the other times you made 100g is foolish.
For those who say, the TP is a net loss, sure maybe for the world, but we know its a net loss for the world, the question is, is it a loss for you as a TP player? Its like someone saying the stock market was a loss because they have to pay broker fees.
Heres the truth, TP is pvp, you take your money from other players, mostly less educated (on tp) or people who dont care. You essentially siphon money from all the players who arent playing the same game as you. Redistributing wealth into your pockets.
I mean its fine, but stop lying to yourself, saying you COULD lose money on the TP if you are foolish, you could lose money waypointing over the map, or leaving dungeon runs due to anger, or failing tequatl/wurm.
Lets be real and honest. The risk on the TP is minimal overall when you have even an inkling what you are doing, for an actual TP player. The risk is extremely great for a non TP player, but they dont know/dont care that they have just lost value, in fact they will often argue with you until you are blue in the face, when you talk about things like opportunity costs, transforming items, waiting, variance, etc.
TLDR, actual TP players lose little to no money, but gain money the overall. Whether the TP is a net loss in value for the economy is totally and completely irrelevant to whether its a net loss for players. TP players essentially suck money out of players who dont know/care to gain wealth.
Is this bad or not? thats up for debate, but dont try to hide with half truths, obfuscations, and double talks.
You’re talking about trading. He’s talking about speculative investments gone sour. There’s a difference. Unless you are running a pure arbitrage strategy or are able to purchase an item at vendor cost (and don’t have opportunity costs in terms of storage/liquidity), then any investment carries unmitigable risks, which scale with the amount of the investment. Look at Vol and his dodge food bet.
also, there are plenty of other infrequently seen (and cheaper) greatswords if all you care about is uniqueness. Go buy a beladonna of dreams, make a foefire’s essence or volcanus, etc…
I would appreciate a primer on how to incorporate TP API into spreadsheets.
Since the fall of LA, I’ve mined my home sprocket every day and now have ~35 blade shards. You need close to 1k for the ascended backpiece, right? For people who aren’t already loaded up, that’s scarce.
Don’t open them.
If you need short term money or if you have the time/energy, sell and use the proceeds to flip identified dyes.
If you don’t need short term money and don’t need the liquidity for other investments, just stuff em in the bank and keep an eye on the price over the next 5-6 months.
I bought a few stacks when they hit rock bottom as a long term hedge because I’m lazy and hate flipping items on the tp. I think prices will eventually rise enough over 6 mos to make a decent return with minimal effort on my part. And there’s always the possibility that demand for dyes could spike if a new, hot recepie is introduced, such as with ascended cooking.
This is just an extreme example of r > g.
demand > supply. JS just showed us that the demand is genuine. Start forging dungeon exos?
I think this is more of the case where players lack the organizational tools necessary, especially when having to deal with a constant inflows and outflows of random strangers thanks to megaserver.
The terrible loot doesn’t help either. If they want to limit zerg farming but not totally stiff players, I thought the LA events rewards were (a) fair and (b) moderately incentivizing, as the obbys and chance for special skins were good hooks. I wish they would go back that way. 6 champ bags, some tokens and some gauntlet tickets are really bleh.
Who wants to take bets on anet doing a mid-event revamp of boss blitz, ala the assault knights?
I suspect the ori market is liquid enough that the handful of people who read markco’s blog aren’t going to make that big of a dent.
On the merits, neither the introduction of ascended weapons nor armor saw the ori market dry up. I doubt JC would be different. More likely to be less so given the alternative sources of jewelry.
Better yet, place portals by each of the zones and only allow 10 people to enter each portal. It worked for marionette.
I wonder if it really is a good time to offload. I think there’s fair odds that after this giant mat sink they’ll introduce 500 JC and a permanent leather fix akin to silk. Further bolstering my suspicion is the extreme nerf to farming via champ trains and the QP events that occurred in this patch. There’s also the prospect of “rebuilding” lion’s arch…
20-30c is no doubt a safe take-profit level on an 8c purchase, but if the price doesn’t crash back before the next update that could be a huge upside lost.
(edited by Mckeone.9804)
In a world of megaservers where you can’t control people flooding into maps, it is substantially harder to coordinate groups. Marionette worked because the mechanics forced the zerg to split up. This is just an epic train wreck
Thumbs down on QP. Takes too long, giant hp sacks aren’t fun, loot is practically non-existent. Farming cheevos and never coming back.
I’ve had Verizon for the entire release of GW2 and never had this issue until today. Hopped on a Comcast VPN and it worked great. What is going on Anet?
They haven’t paid their ransom yet to Verizon I bet. Yes, we don’t need network neutrality at all…
Any other verizon customers having constant problems with packet loss between verizon and level3? I think GW2 may be a victim of Verizon’s attempt to defraud me of the services I paid for by holding my internet hostage until netflix pays up more…
In my experience, 29’s really seem to be the way to go.
Sorry, bub, we only apply mark-to-market accounting in this forum.
I would love to see official statistics on how many people are at 300% luck. I suspect the number is very, very small. Small enough you couldn’t fill a movie theater with the account holders.
Could not disagree more with the OP, except for the camera issue.
It was a demanding fight, but it wasn’t arbitrary. You could memorize all of the attack patterns and orbs were immune to ranged for a reason (to make players think about positioning).
A+ fight, look forward to doing it again.
The current trading post is the beta placeholder that never got updated. As I understand it, a new TP has been an on-and-off project for a while, ie, dont expect it anytime soon.
People would just complain that it’s a reskin of the nightmare greatsword.
Keep that 100g for MF attempts, but only when you feel like trying your luck. As I’ve said before, try maybe once or twice a week, and keep building on that 100g as your precursor attempt coffer, so you can buy either materials towards making rares or exo’s, or just buying rares or exo’s from the TP.
I already finished my legendary, I’m looking for a quick profit.
Learn to flip items on the TP. 100g isn’t even close enough for the statistics to work in your favor, assuming it ever could.
Opening up more build options would requires traits that don’t require you to camp one element to get the benefits.
make it an account bound, 10k cheevo reward. problem solved
Yes. When balancing: (a) protecting the profits of speculators, (b) having to deal with whining from buyers regret when something becomes cheaper, and © improving the availability of inordinately scarce runes and sigils, I’ll take ©.
The thing to keep in mind about Aetherpath is that it is
primarily a control dungeon. None of the bosses have huge HP sacks and attacks that you can just mindlessly stack through.
Which is probably why most dungeoners, who like to mindlessly blast through dungeons and collect money, have a strong distaste for it.
But I love it and run it often with guildies. We’ve got it down to under 30minutes. And I’ve gotten a Xanthium, which was nice consolation prize for not getting precursor drop in 3k hours.
Let’s review:
The Ooze Font – has nothing to do with agro management, as someone a few posts above me just said. All you have to do reflect / knockback the eles while the kiter runs the ooze through. The point is to let control specs shine.
Slick/Sparki – the fight is all about positioning and having a minimum amount of attention to detail. Players have to pay attention to who has the ooze buff and whomever gets it has to kite it through the oil slicks or the toxic fumes will kill everyone fast.
Hologenerators – Again, all about mob positioning and control. If you have an aoe pull or knockback, you can simply group up the holos and set off a chain reaction.
Foreman Spur – this is probably the worst fight in the dungeon, because it’s basically a tank and spank except for the whirl phase.
Security room – straight forward puzzle, meh.
Oakheart – All about mob positioning. He dies super fast you can even get him before a single invul phase. The only trick is learning how to slow walk the oakheart while pulling the holo. Yet for some groups this is like running headfirst into a brick wall.
However GW2 was originally marketed as “buy once, play forever” just like GW1. Defend the cash shop all you want, but it’s not good for the longevity of the game.
How much is the monthly sub cost again? I don’t think I’ve had to pay anything since my box fee.
It’s fair to debate the merits of things like gem to gold conversions, etc…, but it’s not fair to imply that anet is being deceitful with the playerbase.
It’s not teasing. It’s called foreshadowing.
The box price was never suppose to fund the game like GW1. The Gem Store was always the plan on how to pay the bills quarter to quarter. The box price paid for the 5 years of development because the $10 million a year for the last couple of years of development from GW1 wouldn’t pay for a 250-300 player dev team.
In your mind maybe, but it was marketed as I have described it.
I would love to see the source of your information.
Note – personal preferences don’t count as facts.
He’s got an uncle that works at anet, you see…
Since everyone keeps saying that the OP knew the risks. Can someone please let me know where ANet has posted the odds?
Inherent in any scratch ticket is the fact that your odds of winning are clearly published.
It’s 1/25. I believe it says so square on the tooltip that pops up with the item description text.
Player knows that buying gem store dyes is gambling.
Player gambles and loses.
Player is upset, argues that the result is unfair, and demands market intervention.These posters are either conniving (they’re not really upset, but just trying to find a way to mitigate gambling losses) or perfect examples of why economics based on the myth of a “rational person” is complete bunk.
No, they are players who wanted to get a dye related to the living story and who were forced to use an unreliable method of acquiring them. The gamble part should be in that you get a “random dye from the new set”, not “maybe a dye from the new set”.
When I used to open up unidentified dyes, I would have felt cheated if, instead of a dye, I got a copper ingot. If that was the only way to get dyes, then it would be unfair to attack people who complained by saying they knew the odds.
Knowing the odds doesn’t make it fair when the only game in town is crooked.
You can always buy it off the trading post = Your point is entirely invalid. It’s not crooked when you know the odds, decide to gamble, lose, and get mad about it.
edit: It would only be crooked if anet was lying about the odds of getting a fancy dye. No one is accusing them of that.
Player knows that buying gem store dyes is gambling.
Player gambles and loses.
Player is upset, argues that the result is unfair, and demands market intervention.
These posters are either conniving (they’re not really upset, but just trying to find a way to mitigate gambling losses) or perfect examples of why economics based on the myth of a “rational person” is complete bunk.
Hronk is white (as are all healing power primary weapons). Wupwup is lavender / light purple-ish.
Fractal rewards still grossly broken. Please, anet, it would be nice to know if you were even looking at it
Look, I for one am grateful to all the gamblers and whales. It means I can buy dyes for cheap with my in-game gold after a couple weeks as sellers rapidly undercut each other.
Dungeons, I’d guess. Now that crit scales, you can blaze through the lower level dungeons. AC1-3, CM3, SE1/3, and COF1 can be done in what, under 2 hours with an experienced group, and will net you ~10g in coin + champ bags + other drops.
I did a more detailed post here (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/bltc/A-failing-economy-after-update/page/2#post3942766), but Wanze is pretty much right.
The patch is a big hit to people who farmed bosses, but is largely neutral in terms of currency generation. The macroeconomic effect will depend on whether the market liquidity and volume created by farmers/world boss train riders will be offset by mass casual players. In turn, that will depend on how individuals respond to a new set of incentives – if fewer rewards, but with higher value rewards that are distributed randomly, will cause people to become more risk averse, both in how they generate and spend money.
TLDR – The effect of the update increased demand, kept money supply current, but decreased supply. Although the net effect in the macro sense may be neutral because increased value may offset decreased item generation, the arbitrary nature of the reward systems may cause people to stop engaging in economic activity and withdraw from the market. This could drive deflation or general economic paralysis by encouraging people to hoard for a legendary/gems/premium item, and buy nothing else.
Full version:
In thinking about the update, a few macro fundamentals are important to keep in mind. The first is the rate at which currency (gold) is introduced into the economy. The second is the rate at which currency leaves the economy. The third is what currency is actually used for in the game – items, and how they are introduced into the game.
The introduction of the megaserver will have a minor, negative impact on currency generation. The megaserver nerfed world boss farming (RIP world boss train), which provided rewards primarily through the guaranteed rares and useful mats (or rares converted to ecto), which were sold on the TP for pre-existing currency. The only impact on currency generation would come from the few silver that came from event completion and from vendoring trash/blues/greens: fewer events and items → less coin generated.
The champ bag nerf had a more direct effect on currency generation. Although this will have a stronger impact on the people who endlessly trained in FGS/QD, I think it will have more limited on the economy as a whole, and will be balanced out by the increased dungeon and PVP rewards, as well as the armor cost removal.
Similarly, the recent patch didn’t do much to impact the rate at which currency leaves the system. I suspect armor costs were largely nickel and dimining people anyways, which is why they got axed.
Where I suspect the patch will have the biggest impact is on item #3, the supply of valuable items. Increased demand due to wardrobe system + decreased supply of rares (thus indirectly nerfing (a) precursor availability through forging/reduced drop rate from world bosses and (b)ecto supply from salvage) and mats used for making special skins will result in higher prices, at least in some areas.
So, if people can generate about the same amount of currency as before, but items are more scarce, this is really a distributional issue. I think for many people, myself included, wealth was generated by selling drops on the TP. But remember, there is a player on each side of any TP transaction. So the benefit will primarily accrue (a) in an arbitrary fashion, to random people who luck out with a good drop, or (b) people who make good investment decisions with time-limited skins.
The economic consequences will thus turn on how people react to greater item scarcity. Price levels tend to be sticky, and only change over time. Moreso in this game, where sellers are stuck with a sunk cost in the item listing fee. But if people perceive that it will be harder to obtain the item that they want, it may reduce overall economic participation, which in turn could lead to broad deflation.
For instance, I used to run the WBT to obtain rares, which I would then sell and save the proceeds to purchase precursors. Now I don’t think its worthwhile to farm bosses because the opportunity cost, in terms of fun/time, is too great vis-a-vis how long it would take me to buy a precursor at the new, higher price level. So, now I’m no longer generating as much currency as I used to, and incidentially, the psychological effect has made me much more miserly with how I spend money in general (the wealth effect). Another example – before the patch, I would drop 50g on a dye or gems because I thought I could make it up with a reasonable effort. Now, not so much.
The same could be true for champ farming if reducing coin drops killed the incentive for more risk averse players, even though the net effect may be broadly unchanged. Paradoxically, it would drive income inequality by making the rich even richer.
As such, if too many people feel that currency has become too dear and thus stop engaging in market transactions, deflation could take hold across the economy. To be certain, the price of some status items like legendaries and the incidentals like t6 mats may remain high, but the price I am willing to pay for all other goods has fallen. In effect, you will see a two-tier economy – skyrocketing premium items, while collateral markets falter.
Of course, the role of gold <—> gems conversion could have an effect on all of this. If desireable items are on the gem store and people are not willing to buy gems with dollars, this could exacerbate the deflationary spiral. Conversely, if people are willing to convert dollars into gems and then into gold, then it will abate deflationary pressure. I’m sure anet would love the latter.
What really kills me is that I used to enjoy running world bosses while waiting on my regular 5man fotm team to log on. Now it’s so hit or miss and requires so much standing around that the past two nights I’ve just logged out before everyone managed to get online.
The ICC is for trib mode. I suspect even the most casual players can finance a trip through infantile or normal mode mode without it.
I suspect that they are putting SAB on a longer development schedule after the flower debacle and other bugs that really soured people when W2 was released.
Every time anet says that they are improving rewards, it often means the exact opposite. See the March fractal update that significantly nerfed ascended boxes and fractal weapon drop rates.
I found the new system to be very frustrating, and I suspect by the number of people I found milling around not knowing what to do, I may not be alone?
My suggestion is that world boss metas need to be updated with uniform, clear instructions and include timers.
For example, I tried to do Frozen Maw but, I guess it failed because we took too long to escort brogan — even though there wasn’t a timer for completing it? At least the Modnir Ulgoth meta tells you everything you need to know. But GJW still has the old pre-event meta in, even though (buried in the patch notes) the old pre-events are redundant.
I tried to catch a few events last night and none of them worked (Great Jungle Wurm events didn’t start, Shadow Behemoth portals bugged, etc…), so I just gave up. As someone with a full time job and family, I also really dislike the fixed schedule.
I’m sure the bugs will get worked out and people will eventually get into a routine with the new starter events, but I’m afraid it will feel laborious now.
RIP world boss train.
I don’t know if the trading post is still under development, but is there any chance of getting some more advanced trading tools built into the TP and the Gem Exchange?
Right now the TP has basic limit order capacity, and it would be nice to see that added to the Gem Exchange. It’s kind of a pain to keep track of prices and place gem orders with the current market only order system. I’d love to be able to set a buy/sell order threshold for gems and get back to playing the game.
For both systems, I also think it would be great if there was an “advanced” drop-down tab that would allow people to set some conditions, automatic adjustments, and durations for trade execution. In particular, an order cancels order function would be amazing – an OCO would let you bid for two items, but if one is purchased, the other is withdrawn. So if you placed buy orders for dawn and dusk, when the first order is filled the second order is withdrawn.
Oh, and of course, bulk placement… even if we’re stuck with 250 quanity orders, at least let us place multiple order blocks!
We would love to have skill points to be account bound! When can we get them?
Worst idea ever!!!!
So your idea is your level 50 or 60 goes and unlocks all the skill points, and your new level 5…. gets 50 skill points day one?
Let’s just serve the whole game On a silver platter. The Six forbid the game have a challenge if you can avoid it, Like giving your level 5 every skillpoint they will ever need day one?
Bad, bad, bad idea.
I have 1000 scrolls of knowledge in my bank. There’s nothing stopping this already. I can already give level 2 alts all the skill points that will ever be needed.