just gonna throw this out there but your maths is way off.
10% increase in dmg is a 9.1% decrease
20% dmg is a 16.66% decrease
Just going to assume lets say a 50% CD? add that to a 50% base, that means crits do 100% dmg, so lets assume you go from 100 to 90 CD, its a 5% decrease in dmg (1.9/2)
anyways formula goes like
1x 1.052 × 1.1 x = 1.15789
.8/1.15789=.69 or 31% decrease
God, i made so many mistakes, someone should make sure my maths isnt off D;
(edited by MyCondolences.8172)
Use both? Mace and sword OH both have their strengths in different places.
Yeah i will. Was planning on crafting on of them ascended, but decided i’ll be better off crafting ascended gsword and axe insead of axe+offhand.
I just how you don’t join my party with that useless off hand. You would do far more for the party dps just auto attacking with axe than a cast of that could ever make up. In the end all off hands suck in comparison to the axe auto attack.
Not true, using tremor as soon as its off cooldown would offer an over all 1% dps.
Values of skills are taken from gw2skills.net for uniformity
7x(1170+2340+2340+2508)1397×2=61300
58506 +2794=61,300
So compared to auto atk with no Tremor.
7x(11702340+2340+2508)+1170+1170=60,846
58506+2340=60,846
So Tremor was a 1% dps increase compared to auto atk chain.
But a 1% increase in dps is hardly worth choosing an offhand. The damage difference is so little between the offhands, that i believe you should chose one based off what utilities they bring to the party/situation and as i said, mace has the most to offer in that case.
Alternatively you could use shield or warhorn but that would cause you to lose the 5% dps increase from dual wielding.
Decided to chose mace, just bc its more party friendly. It both increases party dps and survivability where as sword doesnt help party.
Test: Start with Tremor and let auto atk cycle til cooldown. I got exactly 7 cycles of AA chain.
Values of skills are taken from gw2skills.net for uniformity
7x(1170+2340+2340+2508)+1397x2=61300
58506 +2794=61,300
Next using burst as a timer, i tried my best to guess the time it took to cast tremor so i could compare it to the number of atks from the autochain. The first atk after tremor was roughly at the end of the 7sec mark. Comparing it to auto atk, that was roughly the first chop of double chop(or 2 hits).
So compared to auto atk with no Tremor.
7x(1170+2340+2340+2508)+1170+1170=
58506+2340=60,846
So Tremor was a 1% dps increase compared to auto atk chain.
Now with Impale+rip
4x(1170+2340+2340+2508)+872+3343
4×8358 33,432 =37,647
Did the same thing as b4, but timed impale+rip and compared to auto atk.
4x(1170+2340+2340+2508)1170×4
33,4324680=38112
1.3% loss in DPS. This does not include the DPS from torment.
I was doing some maths b4, and now i’m more unsure then ever.
Tremor is extremely high dps. I’m not sure of the actual animation time for the skill but going off activation time alone, its double the dps of 100b.
And using tremor, followed by auto atk with axe on 3 targets is almost the same DPS as Whirling Axe hitting all 5 targets.
Sword is only a single target atk and again going off activation time alone, Tremor blows it out of the water, although taking into account the cooldowns and how often you can use it, Impale will do more dmg over an extended period of time. Then again impale has 3/4sec longer activation time per a rotation taking up time from auto atk, meaning that it could infact be less damage over time then Tremor.
Again, this is only considering the stated activation time, not the actual time it takes for the animation to complete.
I do agree, axe/axe is such an awesome look, and i’m so keen on using dual axe but it will be at the cost of over all dps and utility.
One major point against mace, is the long cooldown on tremor. That and the fact it has CC would make me hesitant to use it for DPS purposes and rather save it for those oh kitten moments. On the other hand impale offers no utility, is a good opener and has a short enough cooldown that i dont mind spamming it. It also has block on a seperate skill for those oh kitten moments.
Just tested Tremor. It hits up to 6 times so a maximum of 3 hits per a wave.`
Also given the short activation time, tremor appears to be the highest DPS warrior skill.
(edited by MyCondolences.8172)
I’ve decided on going sword.
I cant see any reason to use mace unless tremor can hit 5 targets.
From looking at it in terms of DPS.
Swords seems to be best single target DPS
Axe seems to be best for groups of mobs. hits 5 targets
Mace seems to fall somewhere in between, less damage then sword more dps then Axe but only hits 3 targets.
edit: thats assuming tremor only hits 3 targets inwhich i have no idea. something i need to test.
I have found that for the most part, mace is better in PvE due to higher AOE damage and the 4 stacks of vuln which are pretty strong in PvE. The only time i use sword offhand is if i need the block (99% of the time this is lupi) or im not using GS since i have ele’s giving me might and in that case i use Axe/mace+axe/sword.
How many targets can tremor hit? Is it 3 per a wave?
If you run a condition build sword is best. If you run a power build sword is best. If you need AoE in dungeons axe is best. If you pvp against bads or need cc mace is best though shield would do what you need better.
So you reckon sword is better dps then mace for pve?
I’m using the 30/25/0/0/15 meta with axe and gsword. PVE style, not worried about PvP.
What are your thoughts of sword for offhand. i realise most ppl run mace so i’m going to assume there’s quite a few arguments for that.
Noticed that the rip portion of sword 4 does roughly the same dmg as mace 5 except its single target instead of aoe.
Impale also does somewhat decent dmg and adds 15 seconds of 5 stacks of torment.
Its hard to compare con dmg to physical bc of crits and modifiers so i have no idea how torment would compare with raw dmg.
Sword number 5 offers a 2 second block which could be good in tight situations. Although it does counter i found that if you stayed out of melee range that it blocked an indefinite amount of times which could be a life safer, compared to KD which is ineffective on bosses.
Also i cant really see myself using mace #4, longer activation time then axe #2 and i rarely find myself using axe#2 as is. Most of the time bosses are already at max stats or close enough.
Anyways would really like some opinions and advice, I’m close to making my ascended weapons and wonder what i should make.
I never said anything about nerfing a build and I always have condition removals. when a condition is removed it is reapplied almost instantly there for making condition removal nearly useless all together. What I proposed was when you remove a condition you are immune to conditions being reapplied for say about four seconds maybe less. Tell me why that would be a bad idea.
Well then, can condition classes get immunity? I mean you get hit once and then you get hit again.. /unfair!!!!
I’m just gonna throw this in the air….. but no.
If your having trouble tweak your build. No reason viable builds should be destroyed because your build isnt optimal in every situation.
And coming from a thief, we have it hard enough without taking any more nerfs.
edit: and from what i’ve read, so do engis.
I’m specing for as much dps as possible.
Sword seems to me atleast to be the only offhand that will increase dps.
Mace is CC
Axe is dps but very situational. Its only a dps increase if I’m mobbed. (ignoring fury, which is why i like it for open world)
Shield is defensive
Horn is supportive
Figure with sword, i can use #4 and 5 and just let them run their course. 15seconds of 5bleeds/5torments just ticking away while i dps. Ofcourse I’d have to figure out if the animation time would make them less dps though.
went with gsword and the 30/25/0/0/15 meta. So far loving it. 100b does alot of dmg and i dont have to deal with the crappy auto atk from gswords. Also love the extra might stacks.
Was thinking of changing to Axe/Sword aswell. Was playing around with sword as offhand and looks like it could be useful in dungeons although so far i dont like it in open world.
In what context will you be using this? Dungeons or WvW? Taking for granted you’re not using this for PvP.
Sorry PvE. dungeons, fotm, events, etc
Why are you asking us if opinions don’t matter to you?
DOWN BOY, thats a bad troll.
I’m going to be running an axe/axe build. Dont really care for your opinions on axe as offhand, doesnt bother me at all that its sub optimal, i like the way dual axe looks.
Anyways onto my question..
Tossing up between gsword and longbow for my secondary weapon. Ofc i plan to carry both but i cant always equip both at the same time and I’m planning to chose my build on which of the two i chose.
Gsword offers 100b and good mobility but no ranged, longbow on the other hand doesnt really offer much cept for ranged dps for those sticky situations so i can regen health or dps while dodging aoes.
Anyways planning on using
30/10/0/0/30 for longbow
30/25/0/0/15 for gsword
so yes i can swap them depending on situation but its not so easy to retrait.
Cof p1 + events is probably the easiest way to go for ascended weapons.
And from what i understand most weapons are viable.
Gsword offers great mobility, decent dps and one of the highest dmg skills ingame
Axe offers best dps but lacks mobility
Sword is great for conditions
Mace/Hammer are designed for more supportive/defencive rolls; lots of CC
And both ranged weapons are good depending on situation although like most ranged sets lack dps when compared to melee.
As for offhands they seem to all have their uses cept for axe which only offers fury(easily obtained elsewhere) and a weakish dps aoe(atleast compared to AA)
Whirling axe is pure crap.. nough said.
3.5second animation time. I’m not a 100% sure on this, but it seems that axe 1 auto chain lies between the 3-4second range. So roughly the same.
so lets compare.
1160+2320+2320+2488 vs 5205
8288 vs 5205
so over 50% more dmg from the axe chain.but u havent try…. that is why it won’t work!!!!!!!
I have tried. I’ve lvled my warrior to 80 with axe/axe and plan on continuing to use axe/axe. I know its an effect dps loss compared to other builds but i just love the way axe/axe looks.
Whirling axe is pure crap.. nough said.
3.5second animation time. I’m not a 100% sure on this, but it seems that axe 1 auto chain lies between the 3-4second range. So roughly the same.
so lets compare.
1160+2320+2320+2488 vs 5205
8288 vs 5205
so over 50% more dmg from the axe chain.
all i’m going to say is that whirling axe dps is less then that of axe’s autochain.
The only reasons i can think of using axe #5(whirling axe) is for
1. quick adrenaline
2. more then 3 mobs
3. whirl finisher
thats it….
You could have all the buffs in the game and you would still do more damage by just auto attacking.
sad truth. I really want axe to work as offhand, mostly because i love how dual axes look.
But the way it currently is, its the most boring thing, Basically with axe/axe pressing any key 2-5 is a loss in dps so you just sit there auto atking.
ty for your response. I was aware of that but i read in a thread that the actual effects of hightened focus was only 9% compared to the 15% in description.
Read that this skill was bugged when i googled it. Is that the still the case?
Does it provide a 15% crit increase?
Any advice will help. Trying to decide if its worth incorporating in my build or not.
I’m new to warrior and by no means an expert, but couldnt sharpened axes increase dmg output? With 100% crit your talking about gaining adrenaline 3x faster then without meaning that you remain at max adrenaline more often and get more use of burst skills.
btw i dont even know if Eviscerate is even commonly used.
Also were the additional bleeds calculated in the dmg of the builds that involve arms?
I calculated each build with 25 Might stacks, not sure where you got the idea I did it with 0 Might.
6 boons is absurd, you don’t average 6 boons in an organized group for any extended period of time. 3 Boons is the average, and its what we use for Empowered.
I didn’t say anything about the cool down reduction or axe rotation so thats a non-sequitor. You asked for the math and I gave it to you.
Doesnt that contradict yourself? Your doing the rest of the calculations with the assumption of 25 might stacks, yet for empowered 22 of them magically disappear?
I’m baffled.
edit: you also dont explain of crit plays into your calculations.
edit2: by boons, does it mean boon type? as in 1% dmg for boon type, not amount of boons?
(edited by MyCondolences.8172)
There are no damage modifiers in discipline. Damage modifiers > crit damage. Also best dps for pure axe is actually 30/25/0/10/5 because you dont need fast hands if you’re not going to use 100b + ww in the rotation.
What about the extra dmg from empowered? Wouldnt that be an extra 25-30% dmg compared to the 10% from atk of opp?
Just out of curiousity can someone explain or link me to a more detailed explanation as to why 30/25/0/0/15 is best dps build for axe. The perks in 30/0/0/10/30 look like it would offer more dps in a group setting(assuming high might stacks).
what type of build do you want?
Just saying something good for PvE doesnt really help much. Most builds would be capable of map completion, some easier then others, some faster then others.
I used 25/30/0/5/10 for map completion myself although i ran into trouble in Orr.
If I was you i’d first go on sites like http://www.gw2armorgallery.com and decide on a look you want to aim for. You might find that the piece you want already comes with berserker stats and you can work on obtaining that. Save yourself wasting your time getting something just to replace it.
Then for anything left over either buy them with gold, or farm dungeons, CoF is an easy one to do with plenty of parties.
I wouldnt use karma for armor, its needed for legendary and ascended weapon and alot harder to come by then gold. Unless ofc you want it for looks.
lol, funny seeing you over here Peow. Rolled a warrior too. They are soo easy to play.
I’ve managed to solo champs under geared with power/prec stats without using heal.
Tanked multiple mobs 2-3, even 4 lvls higher then me.
Can run through zones without losing any health.
Havent been in pvp yet, but its easy mode in PvE
love the picture, just so lovely.
How does this differ from the current implementation? You state that on a subsequent steal, the F2 skill would get overridden with the new stolen skill, therefore making the change be nothing more than a visualization of the skill cooldown and another required button to use the stolen skill? I agree that a cooldown timer would be nice while holding a skill bundle, but I don’t see any real use to separate the abilities like this. Even an argument that you don’t have to spend a ~second using the stolen skill seems weird as we have sufficient time to waste it away while being forced into stealth.
I think its a great suggestion, or even just being able to right click the f1 icon to remove the stolen ability. More often then not i use steal for shadow step or as an emergency heal and have no interest in the stolen ability but it has to be used before i can reuse steal again.
We are talking about 1sec here, we’re playing a class where every second counts.
edit:
Another idea could be to add a store function via f2, allowing you to store the item and use steal for its traited purposes while being able to hold onto stolen abilities to use when you want, not when you want your steal ability again. Coupled with right click to remove stolen item. be a huge buff to steal.
eg. When you steal, item appears in f1 slot, you can press f2 to store the item so you can reuse steal, sequential uses of steal would steal nothing until f2 was used, allowing you to use it for more combat oriented purposes. Right clicking either icon would remove the stolen item. You could even add f3 and f4 to store up to 3 items.
(edited by MyCondolences.8172)
war
- - it’s not channeling like some classes have and this is amazing, cause you can instantly change target
- - whats bad in long range knockback?
- - Vengeance, beautiful skill, saved my life thousand times, even untraited (if no hope to completely res at least you have possibility to run as far as you can and die in safer place, where easier to ressurect)
I still stick by my first opinion, thieves have a nice set of down skills.
- hits does decent dmg and cripples targets. It also hits 3 targets increasing your chance of rallying.
- Considering your #1 cripples, i’m sure you get much more time to recover from teleporting away compared to a single target knock down.
- is pretty much useless now, it used to awesome cause it broke aggro giving you a chance to escape, or atleast buying you some time for shadow escape to recharge so you could further the distance from mob til this skill would work. But now its just trash, buys you a second or 2 of time inwhich you cant really do much.
I dont think you’d stack all that many mights with hidden assassin. I’d say maybe 6 at max. Odds are you’ll have 0 boon duration. Revealed lasts 3-4seconds. So that would be 2stacks every 3secs(15sec duration) which means you’ll be able to build up a max of 10 in combat, this is assuming perfect timing, and hitting straight away in stealth.
I know if done right, with dodge food, inertia and feline grace i was getting around 6-7stacks.
So really depends on how you want to play. If you plan on stealthing alot go Shadow Arts, else go Acrobatics.
Warrior and Guard have best. Necro is not bad (since you heal with #1) but thief.. they’re bad.
I think warrior skills are horrible.
- and 2 are both single target and do low dmg.
Vengeance unless traited is basically suicide/last attempt.
Guards arent bad.
But what kind of skills are you expecting whilst down? The objective is to rally rather by healing your health or killing an enemy.
This makes warrior bottom tier. Low damage and no class specific heals.
Guardians do well and i think thieves do as well.
Thief number 1 does decent dmg, and depending on the situation i’ve killed trash mobs with full hp. And the teleport allows you to further your distance from danger giving you more opportunities to either heal or kill.
Personally i think thief have some of the best downed skills.
Number 1 does pretty decent damage
Shadow escape is great, you can teleport away from the enemy or out of aoes.
Smoke bomb is disappointed but i feel that way about stealth in general.
also
“if you go back and look the fastest cof p1 speed runs typically only had 2 wars in them”, kitten 2 of them must have really dropped the dps of that party… If they’re so bad, wouldn’t more thieves in the party be better? 4 thieves, 1 mesmer, sure they lose the banner buffs, but at least they dont have dps that’s possibly the lowest. (And yet, for some reason, in practice, I clearly remember the LFG site having multiple groups looking for only zerker warriors, weird when they’re near the bottom of the dps chart…)
The party would have failed with 4 thiefs and a mesmer. If you didnt notice the thiefs jobs werent so much dps as it was their ability to use cluster bomb on fire field to give whole party 25 might stacks before bosses.
thieves need a snatch skill. now that could be fun xD
And thats the problem with Thieves.
They are built around the fact that they can stealth and stealth in itself is a more or less crap skill. Doesnt negate any dmg, short duration, longish cooldown(matter of opinion).Warriors on the other hand dont need stealth, they can just facetank the sort of dmg that would annihilate a thief.
I can negate a ton of damage while I a stealthed. Can heal and cleanse conditions too.
Bad argument there. 30points while stealthed for a similar amount of healing as a 15 point warrior trait thats always on.
And with shadow embrace i’d agree that thieves would have more condition removal, but warriors have stability.
If I recall wasnt it stated by Anet that all classes would have no defined roles and that all classes would be more or less versatile in how they are played?
And thats the problem with Thieves.
They are built around the fact that they can stealth and stealth in itself is a more or less crap skill. Doesnt negate any dmg, short duration, longish cooldown(matter of opinion).
Warriors on the other hand dont need stealth, they can just facetank the sort of dmg that would annihilate a thief.
warrior doesn’t have perma stealth
btw your post is 0/10
And come dec 10 neither will thief.
I am an avid thief enthusiast. It is the best class in the game IMO due to its enjoyable factors, despite its strength. Even then, I don’t see them being weak. Ask my guild, I do phenomenal damage and that is one of the reasons they want me in dungeon groups. I crit 9k on dagger 2 if they are below 25, 8k below 50, and I hit 1k no criteria per dagger 1 hit.i have no troubles playing, using a mix of seeker and power vitality toughness gear with full seeker trinkets. Try it sometime, maybe you will see thieves don’t die quite so much if you play well enough. Don’t reroll warrior just because it is easy, play the game for enjoyment, because every class can kill one another. I harbinger you will be killed by thieves one after another because they are GOOD, better than you are on a warrior.
Well i decided to hit up pvp and test out some warrior builds. The damage was crazy. I’ve always loved dual axes, probably my all time favourite look so i was playing around with that. Got my whirlwind dmg to hit upwards of 10k, this is in pvp gears mind you, with no buffs, no food, and no bloodlust stacks.
I usually try to avoid the popular classes in games but warriors looking fun. I’ll just have to find a unique build and play it to my style. When thieves get some love i’ll come back to play it again. ATM they are nothing like what i’d expect the class to be.
I think what we should all take from this video is this…
Even a bad Warrior is Good.
Anyone else notice how he could walk into the middle of a zerg and just shurg off the dmg.
]in case you didnt notice we were talking about pve with full pve buffs that arent achievable in a zerg environment or are at least incredibly rare in a zerg environment
I was talking about a PvE Zerg eg. champ. Highest dmg i’ve seen pistol whip hit was probably for around 18k.
I suppose your using 25 Power stacks, Sigils of slaying, potions and food/oils to achieve this kind of dmg?
im just going to go ahead and assume your running full soldiers by those numbers, and thief sword AA with average amount of might/vuln is around 8/8/13k, probably closer to 10/10/16k
Please tell me where your getting those numbers from. My Pistol Whip let alone AA on my thief rarely hits 16k in zergs. Am i missing some sort of super buff that doubles my dmg? This is in full serkers btw.
(edited by MyCondolences.8172)
word has cleave and it outdamages warriors axe/x, and if you even know the basics of speed runs you’d know warriors are closer to the bottom of the dps chart than they are to the top
Pretty sure warrior dps, atleast greatsword dps is better then Thief. So what are you implying about thieves dps?
-you are trying to take warrior traits and put them on a different class 0/10
I didnt say that, i just said i wished we had traits like these, nowhere did i comment on how it would balance in the game or say we should have them.
- 100b is a channeled abillity that stops your movement and requires your enemy to be rooted, go and use this in WvW, tell me how you fared.
How is that different to Pistol Whip?? You cant move during its animation, although it is quicker but the over all dmg seemed less.
- warrior is gettting nerfed on december 10 both hammer and longbow, pls promise you arent going to lvl up til 80 than come to warrior forum and re-roll guardian because they are “op”
I didnt even look into either of those builds. This was a gsword build and they only received more buffs
- no they do not have perma-fury
Arcing Slice? 10second cooldown with 15second fury time, i only played Warrior for a short period of time but i didnt have much problem with keeping adrenaline up.
Alternatively you can add 20 points into Opportunist and 10 points in tactics for Leg Specialist for 10second fury. Most warrior weapons have cripple effects.