Guild Wars 2

@sorrow: That’s the problem, Mesmers aren’t even getting a proper acknowledgement of issues. Therefore, I do see the need for this topic for more exposure about these bugs. Two issues i’m particular about:

1.) Bouncing Priority Issue.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Major-bug-with-Bouncing-skills-mechanic/page/2#post2133175

Not a single red acknowledgement, and it even affects bouncing skills not just from Mesmers. Introduced without any documentation in the recent patch.

2.) Izerker issue.
We needed a direct question asking face-to-face to get an acknowledgement of the issue? Even then its shoddy at “i’ll look into it”. Before the recent SOTG, this is was the last reply made to Mesmers concerning the issue, 1month ago.

JonPeters.5630:

As far as we know something did go wrong. We can’t reliably get it to display all of he damage floaters, but we have tried to test if the damage is lower or it just doesn’t hit and we have never seen that error I our debug setup which shows attack areas. I may try and make a bad pic tomorrow to show what I mean.

This is not a confirmation of the bug by Anet, according to this, damage is not affected and only displayed numbers are malfunctioning. And they give us the lame reason of damage floater issue? It takes 1minute to specifically observe the HP bar to know its not the case. There is no further communication afterwards, left hanging for the “bad picture”.

No offense meant to any other classes, we are not going, “fix us first instead of other classes”, we are looking for the most basic, from Anet: “Yes we know this bug exists and will queue it up for fixing”.

I’ll see (looks at toes)…i’ll see when I get back to my office.

Not directed at anyone, just wanted to add some pictorial evidence to the izerker’s issue. This happens roughly 30% of the time on a stationary golem in HotM.

Whats with the Mesmer hate around here? No one is asking for a buff, no one is asking for a nerf to other classes. We are simply compiling issues we want a reply to because posting in our class forums have proven ineffective. And people proceed to post in tones similar to “how dare you even start a state of the Mesmer topic”?

What this feels like to me: A rich guy gets robbed and goes queue up to file a police report. A poorer guy already in queue turns around and shouts in the rich guy’s face, “how dare you even file a police report. I’m poorer and deserve the whole space of the queue to myself!”. Even though the poorer guy is already ahead in queue and decision of priority is ultimately decided by the policeman.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Blurred Frenzy and Mind Wrack are currently incredibly, almost brokenly strong, and you think they’re UP? Are you serious?

The focus is on bugs and how they are introduced every patch undocumented and hidden in various game mechanics, not Mesmers being UP.

How would you feel if you got arrested without a reason or trial? How would you feel if your X skill got dps lowered by 30-50% with no documentation, reasoning or explanation? And its not even a direct number lowering, its through lame reasons like, bouncing priority, AoE hitboxes and uneven terrain (not enough to lose line of sight).

The issue with bouncing skills:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Major-bug-with-Bouncing-skills-mechanic/page/2#post2133175

There is no push for Mesmer buffs, but rather, a push for the way Mesmer bugs are treated to change.

As mentioned in the recent SOTG, Izerker issue. Lasted over 3months and consistent top topic in Mesmer forums replied with the excuse of ignorance? It even has a red post in it for crying out loud. And now the bouncing issue? The current way for Mesmer bugs to even get a response is a direct live question in SOTG? If Izerker was never brought up in SOTG it would never get fixed despite a red recognition?

Furthermore, these bugs are not a trait or minor bug, its a newly introduced bug on weapon skills that significantly lowered the effectiveness of said skills and was undocumented and received no reasonably proper reply or response.

If it means anything, I felt Mesmers were the most bug-free at launch of the game, day zero. Every passing patch I search the forums and wiki for undocumented changes, login to my Mesmer and test my weapons skills to see if they even work properly. And if something is wrong, I can only pray and beg for indications of a clutch fix months later.

Sometimes I wonder if there are inside devs who secretly hate the Mesmer class but are unable to present justified nerfs to the community in broad daylight and thus resort to undocumented mechanic shenanigans to harm the Mesmers. It’ll be like, the skill TECHINCALLY does this, but goodluck getting it to work as described.

jportell.2197:

I cannot describe how frustrated I was when jSharp was like “Oh it is?” I’ll look at it when I get back to my office….

Haha, same thing. Consistent top topic in Mesmer forums for months, one thread even has a red post in it lasting a month old. And you’re saying you don’t know about it? Its either a problem of incompetent communication in your team or a blatant lie to save your “face” by pleading ignorance instead of “oh, we knew about it for 3months and still haven’t gotten/bothered to fix it.”

@nyaonyao: Gonna change title now, since various posters have indicated its not specific targetable allies’s issue but rather bouncing as a whole.

Keep up the good work guys! 3 more months, some red posts and enough popularity to be asked in a SOTG before we get a “we’ll look into it”.

And the award for longest, unfixed and ignored bug goes to the Mesmers! Over 300replies, 21k views and lasting 1month (actual bug over 3months). Comes with a “hit-n-run” red post by yours truly, JP.

Come on, say something Anet, anything. Try floater issue.

Wish we still had a red who even cares about Mesmers. I felt the unbroken and bug-free at launch.

I appreciate everyone who would comment on this issue and help increase our “voice” on this to Anet. Thanks for your time and effort in helping. I believe that given enough public attention, a response will come. (Whether or not a fix actually comes then remains to be seen)

If it doesn’t, then at least more players will know of these behaviors by Anet. Unintended changes due to poor coding by programmers and checking then subsequently left unfixed. Ignoring bugs due to complexity or difficultly and diverting attention through excuses of “new content” and fixing bugs people don’t even care about (underwater).

The feeling of getting nerfed/screwed by undocumented changes and then /ignored by Anet is horrible. Mesmers have experienced this through Izerker bug which has consistently been an on-going topic and just outright ignored by Anet.

Even though currently GS/Staff-Mesmers suffer the most due to this, several other classes (Eg: Guardian/Necro/Engi) are affected by this. I urge everyone to help bring this to the attention of Anet for a response and fix. If this is allowed to pass by similar to Izerker issue, it will set a precedent whereby /ignoring major issues is acceptable by Anet.

This patch may not affect your main class, but allow it to pass and the next patch it may be YOUR turn. Do we really want Anet to start getting comfortable ignoring major issues such as those that destroy over 30-50% of a skill’s dps?

Not a single response to this issue? Seriously?

It’s like, you’re talking to this guy. Then all of a sudden he ignores you and starts another conversation without saying anything.

“ok i’ll try this bad picture tomorrow…”
→Various other posts in other topics and issue.
→Left the conversation hanging and split.
→Its almost like proposing to someone, giving he/she time to consider and never getting a reply. Don’t even have the basic respect/courtesy to reply.

Personally, the pull either pulls enemies to the ledges, or off the ledges. If coordinated with multiple Mesmers, yes you can force people off walls even when not at ledges.

Rezzet.3614:

…Exclusive to one class who else has an AoE pull that yanks players from behind walls?

(By behind I assume on the walls but not on the ledges. So far I have never seen players being pulled from behind walls -> on walls -> on ledges -> off ledges onto the ground)

This is a defining trait for Mesmers in WvW. Other classes have their own defining features in WvW. By your point, no one class should have exclusive features?

Exclusive Features (I can think of off-the-bat):

-Thief: Awesome roaming/scouting in WvW almost uncatchable with mix of teleports, swiftness and stealth.

-Guardians: AoE active area passage denial. (used in advanced tatics where several guardians do a coordinated area blockage.) Reliable projectile reflection at target areas. Ability to reliably spread stability buff to allies.

-Necros: Heavy area denial and control through marks. Multiple necros placing marks are able to effectively zone out areas. Landmine logic of “persistent” denial until triggered.

-Elementalists: Heavy ranged direct damage in a AoE. While necros usually apply chill and various debuffs by AoEing walls, eles drop the direct aoe damage.

So, what about all these exclusive features by other classes? Should they all be equalized for fairness or removed? Sure Mesmers can somewhat AoE walls but its not gonna be as powerfull as necro or ele AoE. Similarly, other classes can pull people off walls, and they rightfully are not as powerful as Mesmers pulls.

Moreover, its not as if the pull is unreasonably unfair. The coordinated effort can be nullified through various methods, often by players on their own. Stability and aegis both prevent being yanked off. 2 dodges rolls and <insert appropriate escape utility> also offer a high chance of making it back into safety.

The money wouldn’t go to them in the first place if money was not allocated to fix all those bugs. Its sad enough that I would really pay for said DLC at the moment to fix 80% of all major bugs deemed important by players.

Maybe they could market their expansion for gw2 like this. Accumulate various bugs with each patch and then market expansion with “bug fix patch”.

Izerker too hard to fix? Lets screw with GS#2 bouncing and take weeks to fix it. Maybe people will be grateful and possibly forget about izerker. False sense of legitimacy through deflection attention.

“Willing to pay 2000gems in gemstore for DLC patch fixing GS#2 and #4!”

Guys, quick, is NCsoft/Anet looking at this?

I’m spending more time on the forums with each passing patch, and the majority of it is due to QQing about bugs. Maybe several months from now, the forums will be full of bug reports instead of game/class discussions.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Clones-turrets-are-now-Bounce-able-targets/first#post2113695

Willing to pay for a gemstore DLC fixing all major bugs of ACTUAL concern by players instead of these time-dragging excuses of “fixes” on low-concern bugs while causing tons of major bugs in other places.

Best parts? Majority of the game-breaking bugs that are undocumented is discovered 10mins into the patch by players. Just goes to show the quality involved in patch code checking.

Better add more gemstore items. Hey A-net, try adding a DLC with fixes for 80% of all traits and bugs of classes. I will buy it, even at 2000gems, the price of the deluxe upgrade.

I’m ashamed they have the face to call this a bug fixing patch. A majority of the fixes were low-priority issues. Underwater sinking really? I believe no one really cares about it, and just laughs it off as a joke. This spent time and effort should’ve been spent fixing more pressing matters and making sure the patches are not full of unintended changes. (clones/turrets being bounce-able targets)

Let A-net fix izerker and the current bouncing on clones first before trying to suggest any other changes. Every single change comes with various other unintended game-breaking bugs enough to lower dps of skills by 30-50%.

At this point, I’m even scared of being buffed by A-net. A mobile-spinning iwarden? Who knows what other undocumented and unintended joke will occur.

So, having an entire off-hand weapon whose only real threat is a instant pull at 20s cd is enough to warrant a nerf?

Then iwarden better be buffed. But then again, A-net will probably break 10 other things while implementing this.

Now, look at focus phantasm. And realize the only reason anyone uses focus outside of pve context is for into the void. (And as a swap weapon for swiftness.)

There is currently no priority list observable. It seems to just target nearest bounce-able target. There should be a priority of bouncing such as Enemy→friendly player→friendly npc.

Edited title to include turrets. Contributed by Nkuvu.

eldenbri.1059:

So it seems like this change is pretty much pure benefit if you stay at range with the greatsword and never get more than one clone out.

Except that this is purely from a solo-play perspective. In pvp, I doubt you will successfully keep further than 600range consistently. And, in both pvp and pve, other players are not getting buffs.

Extra thing to note, apparently engi turrets are “bounce-able” targets too. And its screwing their elixir bounces lol.

Nkuvu.2570:

It’s not just mesmers.

My engineer has been using the elixir gun and turrets. The second skill, Elixir F, is bouncing between enemies and turrets… giving the turrets swiftness, I guess.

Something went horribly wrong in the coding process. At first I thought it was just clones, but apparently it works on turrets too….

The Staff bounce on a clone giving fury COULD be good in a limited situation in a 1v1. BUT, honestly, in any other setting, it fails. It could’ve been a buff to a PLAYER (that ally guard/rogue/ele/warrior slapping the enemy) that would utilize it much better than a clone.

This not only affects Mesmers, its affects other classes as well, so please fix it faster than izerker. Going to sleep and hopefully its gone when I wake up like a bad dream.

Haha, inb4 phantasmal swordsman start using illusionary leap AI. I’m starting to think how patch notes are becoming april fool’s notes. lol

Oh my god. No, do not ask for a range indicator. Clones were asked to target ranger pets, and in this patch clones become “bounce-able targets” royally screwing GS#2.

Ask for a range indicator and…something horrible and unintended will happen. Like…“vertical range” is now considered.

I knew it. Ask for clones to hit ranger pets? See what happens.

KratosAngel.7289:

Since updates are mainly based around figures guys, you know what you have to do if you want to see the bugs fixed : drop GS, don’t use it anymore. If they notice a sudden big drop in the use of GS from mesmers, maybe they’ll think about fixing it.

…The funny thing is…our only respectable direct damage dps weapons are Sword and GS…it isn’t even funny, there IS NO other weapon for zerker builds. Time for Zerker Mesmers to go MH sword for both weapon sets.

I will agree all patch notes by A-net are a running joke now. Comes with various unintended, unannounced, unrelated changes to various stuff. Which players DISCOVER for the developers in under 10mins upon patch.

Read up on May 28th patch thread in Mesmer forum. We have a solid covering on clones being bounce-able targets lol.

AndrewSX.3794:

Wow, that bouncing thing is just…bah.

-Hey, Anet, please fix IE for affecting clones/phants please!
-Ok! (nothing really done)
patch happens
-Anet: Huh? Wut? Something happened? How? I dunno >.>
trows the bug report in “hopeless” section alongside iZerker dmg

Fixed. Btw, go check up necro’s supposedly staff mastery and greater marks trait fixes. Had a good laugh. Oh, A-net you beast. “Fixes”.

Tested to affect bouncing skills by all classes with bounce to allies. Clones are wasting buffs and bounces.

Tested with a Necro friend whereby I placed 2 clones next to a golem. The bouncing reaper sickles are going enemy1→clone1→clone2→clone1 etc. and giving them regen.

Iruwen.3164:

Noince.7364:

I made a thread in bugs report. Hopefully, since this affects all classes’ bouncing skills, it will be fixed much quicker than izerker.

Is this confirmed, do other classes have the same issues?
I just tested it during normal gameplay and almost never got might since a clone or phantasm is usually closer to the target.

Tested with a necro friend. The bouncing sickle is wasting bounces by going enemy1→clone1→clone2→clone1→clone2. etc.

I think this issue is unintended and occurred because of a change of codes in a totally un-related issue. Doesn’t reflect goodly on A-net’s coding team, where a change to one thing breaks another. (Phantasm summoning sickness remember?)

Problem is, when will it be fixed. Will it be become similar to izerker, an abandoned child?

Zumi.6384:

skcamow.3527:

If IE is traited, iMage bounces twice. Target gets 3 confusion stacks and 2 closest allies receive retaliation.

This gives me hope to finally justify using the torch in a WvW build! Thanks for the confirmed info, I’ll be testing my new build tonight and probably posting it right after if I deem it worthy =)

Don’t. As it is now, all bouncing skills which can bounce to allies are worthless. Clones are going to leech and waste your bluffing bounces.

I made a thread in bugs report. Hopefully, since this affects all classes’ bouncing skills, it will be fixed much quicker than izerker.

Linguistically Inept.6583:

if i recall correctly dont players have priority over clones and summons when it comes to buffs/heals?

Sadly, there doesn’t seem to be any priority at all. I’m testing it now, and its nearest bounce-able target. Only time I got it to bounce onto me is when i’m nearer than clones.

I’ll rather get the buff bounced to players 100% of the time, instead of having clones perma hogging all the buffing bounces.

Remember, this is not just affecting mesmers. It affects all classes with bouncing skills that buff. Example: necro’s bouncing sickle.

Clones after the May28th patch are now considered bounce-able targets for skills which bounce. This is basically a nerf to all bouncing skills, instead of bouncing to a enemy target for damage, skills can bounce to buff clones (which is useless).

Special shout-out to Mesmer GS. First izerker has been un-fixed and ignored for months. Now GS#2 bounces onto clones like no tomorrow giving them 3might instead of bouncing onto the enemy and dealing damage? I have no idea how this change even occurred, but it seems with every patch, some random issue will screw up Mesmer GS. Please, stahp.

EDIT: Why is there no bouncing priority?

No, the poster got it wrong. Clones are NOW considered bounce-able targets.

Hey guys, guess what? GS#2 now bounces on clones. Just officially de-list GS as Mesmer weapon. You just screwed GS#2 damage, 3might on clones GG.