Guild Wars 2

garethh.3518:

Pride N Greed.8106:

this game has been in development since 2007 and had plenty of time to lay a more solid foundation is what bothers me.

Then you titled your thread terribly.

No my title is fine, I just wanted to point out those contradictions. People keep veering the thread off course.

JonathanSharp.7094:

FluffyDoe.7539:

I have a question here; How come Mr.Sharp was so eased on saying “we need to do a better job communicating with the players”, but he has yet to agree with the fact that having ranking/matchmaking at launch would have made the ‘state of the game’ much better than where it’s at now?

I spoke of this on Friday, but let me reiterate.

We could have had rankings, but without tournaments or a way to get teams playing against each other in an organized fashion, they would have ranked…..nothing. Just the pub play matches. That’s why we wanted to set down a framework first, then add in the custom arenas (for practicing/developing organized matches) and rankings. Having rankings without tourneys or a matchmaking system literally wouldn’t do anything…you would just have rankings based on random pub matches where teams would be anything from 1-8 players. Seems bad to me. That’s why we made that decision.

Does that make sense?

J

Not to sound mean Jonathan Sharp because i don’t know what situation you have at arena net.We also don’t know when you were hired or when pvp started in development. ANET started developing this game since 2007 i remember when it was announced. You guys had 5 years to create a much better foundation than what we have now. We got 4 maps based on conquest. Really 5 years to do that. Poor excuse on anets part. You guys also had amazing pvp in gw1 but none of it was implemented(HA,AB,RA,GvG,) none of it why?

You guys from the beginning intended this game to try to be a esport. Why did you not add rankings/ladders tournaments at launch. The mists is practically dead.

Picking on games simply because you don’t like them is not going to help the subject matter. What is at stake here is how poorly developed spvp/tpvp was launched. Having amazing gw1 pvp and none of it was implemented. Also, this game has been in development since 2007 and had plenty of time to lay a more solid foundation is what bothers me.

I think if anet would of just held off on pvp and just added ladders/rankings.PvP would be doing 100x better than it currently is doing.

Noctred you did your homework for all those mmo’s i can add a few more but there is no point. We all know all the mmos that have come out in the last couple of years did not do so well. That is why a lot of people have high hopes for this game. They delivered on the pve end we got the short end of the stick on the pvp side:(

NevirSayDie.6235:

There’s a difference between not implementing a change until they are sure it will help, and releasing the game without having exact knowledge of how every skill combination will work out. Basically, there was no way for them to predict every balance issue that would emerge ahead of time, so it was better to release the game in a controlled game mode and plan to make changes after release, because beta weekends simply can’t give enough raw data to release a 100% finished PvP game.

On the other hand, now that they have the data, they are right to wait a bit instead of hotfixing every little balance change. The only thing worse that flavor of the month is flavor of the week. I’d rather see one good patch per month, than three good patches and one bad patch per month. It’s not a matter of not putting enough effort in before release, it’s just that some things can’t be foreseen ahead of time.

Also, D3 will be in textbooks of the future on how not to make/manage video games.

Yes, I agree with you to some extent.Only one major flaw i see is not implementing Rankings/Ladders since launch. That would of given them much more better data than what the game has to offer as he stated in the interview. Much better to balance imo when you have ranking/ladder systems like lol/dota/ etc….Again ill go back to what i said. I rather wait till all of this was implemented. We would all be enjoying pvp and anet would have a easier time trying to balance. First impression is very important. Look at how dead the mists are.

garethh.3518:

Pride N Greed.8106:

Not implying that forum "go’ers have all the ideas. There are some people who put out some great ideas on many different posts i read with devs on here agreeing to them. But, what you fail to realize is that the community is what drives the game any game for that matter. Jonathan even stated that they read the forums. They hear us on what we have to say. According to him, they are tailoring pvp on what we like.One way to communicate with them is on the forums.

Saying the one dev who commonly is known, and just said to be the ‘forum perusing guy’ is the only one who can save a game, is a pretty blatant implication to that idea…

Anyways…
Yes some people have good ideas, but it is a rare rare day that they are something the devs have not thought of and beats out their ideas.
Let me repeat… extremely rare day.

And good luck with that dream… the day that devs tailor a game based on what people on the forums say they want is the day an MMO becomes a nightmare…

You obviously have not seen the interview..

garethh.3518:

Pride N Greed.8106:

…I think he is the only who can save pvp. He is our link to anet on what needs to get done on the pvp end….

hahahahahahahhahah…

Wouf, let get my breath for a second…
You’re implying random forum go’ers have all the idea needed to save PvP…

hahhahahahahahahah

Man you’re a kick in the pants.
The people at Anet understand what is going on just as well as you do, no wait, far better than you do. What they can and end up doing is the product of the methods a of a business, (timelines, funds, profits, manpower, exc.) and they have dozens of people who do little else but work on ways to improve the game….
Any idea expressed here, odds say, has been thought of there.. the constraints are just man power and opinions of effectiveness…
The only thing that will come out of public forums are general opinions on already implemented or soon to be implemented content and I would rarely ever want it to be any more than that…

Not implying that forum "go’ers have all the ideas. There are some people who put out some great ideas on many different posts i read with devs on here agreeing to them. But, what you fail to realize is that the community is what drives the game any game for that matter. Jonathan even stated that they read the forums. They hear us on what we have to say. According to him, they are tailoring pvp on what we like.One way to communicate with them is on the forums.

Jelle.2807:

It’s not so much about him contradicting himself as the company having conflicting policies.

Maybe they claim they don’t want to release something until it’s ready, and maybe someone higher up said release anyway. Maybe the whole when it’s ready is a PR stunt. Maybe they’re all sadists and enjoy lying to people who knows.

Bottom line is you can’t account one person for the decisions a whole company makes, the guy was just trying to explain the decisions made, contradictory as they are.

Sure it would be nice if a company as an entity stuck to their word, but we live in a kitteny world where corporate lies are the norm so better be skeptic about claims like these at all times.

I am definitely not trying to put all the blame on Jonathan Sharp. I think he is the only who can save pvp. He is our link to anet on what needs to get done on the pvp end. Bottom line is, he got the ok from arena net to do the interview. When you work for a big company like them and are doing a interview. You represent them and are sharing the views of the company and were you want it to go. He is the lead pvp designer so we know he must have a lot of say on what goes on.

When you have a complaint about something you go straight to management right?

I would like to point something out in the interview with Jonathan sharp about the state of pvp. Jonathan pretty much said pvp is not were they wanted it to be, but he states that they wont release something until its ready.(Like ladders,Arenas etc…)That seems to be anet favorite phrase this days. Than he states that the reason why pvp is in its current state is because pve was done and the game was released on the account knowing pvp was not fully finished. They thought that they could build upon pvp as time went by.

To me what Jonathan said is just one big contradiction in my eyes. Why even release pvp if its not done? You guys even state you wont release until its ready. Why not just wait like how d3 is doing it? Why did you guys not put enough effort into pvp like how you guys did pve? You bring up gw1 pvp in the interview but don’t acknowledge that it was a good foundation already that you guys could of used. I’m sorry if it seems like a rant. I just have to many questions as to why pvp is so bad currently. You guys could have done a lot better job. I had huge hopes for pvp. You guys should have just stuck to your guns and waited UNTIL ITS READY! I would of been more than happy to wait knowing pvp would be rock solid than what we currently have. I think the community would agree.

Here is a link to the interview
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hByqoWsnz-I

Embershard.7294:

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Seether.7285:

Liewec.2896:

KarlaGrey.5903:

No need to feel so enraged over a very logical marketing and company strategy decision.

Is it a logical business strategy to split the game into distinctly PvE and PvP and then ignore every word uttered by the PvP community until they all move on to other games?
it seems more like amputating a diseased limb and leaving it to rot…

It is less of a “logical business plan” and more of a self-fulfilling prophecy when you handle things in the way they have. They could have easily monetized the PvP base by having custom servers available at release for duels/scrims etc. Instead they had NOTHING useful or wanted by the PvP community in the gem store and their first attempt at monetizing their PvP base was the introduction of Paid Tournaments which I think has surpassed George Bush in the “miserable failure” google search results.

GW2 is a case study of how to destroy the goodwill of a community and demonstrates that despite having a good foundation of a game you can’t treat your community like kitten and let exploits/broken abilities run rampant for weeks without negative repercussions.

To be frank, whoever decided to go with a tournament system rather than matchmaking should be fired, whoever decided to implement paid tournaments before custom servers should be fired. Whoever decided to sit on necessary changes to fix broken items/abilities rather than hotfix them deserves to be fired. I know it is extremely unlikely that any of the necessary personnel changes will be made and it is just as unlikely that GW2 will become any sort of major PvP game with its current trajectory.

Some people will say things like “just give them more time..” etc, but there are many gamers here who have seen this sort of thing before. The writing is on the wall and the PvP aspect of this game is on life-support and the prognosis does not bode well for GW2’s future.

I agree with you 100% well written post. Like i stated before this game was in development since 2007 and all we got was 4 maps based around conquest and zerg pvp(WvWvW). The work that went in for pve guys shows us that they have the potential to do great things. Also having had a good backround on gw1 pvp and why some of it was it not implemented in this game, still bothers me. If anything they have a better understanding than most mmos when it comes to pvp…

tOss.9024:

Please, let guild mates know whats going on here so we can get even more participants. Also, don’t forgot to post duel times here, and winners so that I can post them!

Edit: Get some video if you want to be included in the community dueling videos.

ill bite!

What we need is a list of people who can commit. I think the easiest way is to use one your reserved posts and fill it with players names and what time they are available that way we can calculate what time is best to set the tourney up.

ALSO VERY IMPORTANT! POST YOUR TIME ZONE!NAME!Your Schedule!
From here we can determine the number of people! Than we can all meet and decide on the time/brackets/prizes!

I will start:
1.Pride N Greed- Available Night time 8-12 PST

Pray.9751:

Clearly Arenanet wanted to cater to PvE players all along and we were the idiots foolish enough to not take the “this is a pvp centered mmo” as exactly what it is: a marketing strategy to generate a tadbit more income from a community so malnutritioned that it would reach for even the most obviously fake straw in history.

The sad part is Gw1 was a well established PvP game. Most of the people considered the game more pvp oriented. Yes and we know that it took them time to implement it. Why do they need to start from scratch again in this game?

Braxxus.2904:

Jakkson.4076:

The NA gaming loves their carebear PvE MMos too much…

A vastly large reason for that probably having something to do with the PvP community at large and how full of spiteful angsty rager kids it is that spends all day thinking of new creative ways to insult people that like different things from themselves and idolize kittenholes and trolls to the point of deitific absurdity.

*Also pvpers have never, and will never match the revenue that casual pve side players will shell out. I do both, as I do in all games because otherwise I’d only be playing a minscule part of a game, and have dropped some cash on the gem store fairly often to get fine transmute stones and boosters along with outright buying gold because I don’t have the time to farm it (wvw siege weaponry and crap is expensive).

How much cash does your diehard tpvper drop in the store? Yeah, if anything we should be happy they even have the workforce they do have working on PvP since it’s not the money maker. For that reason rather than deride the PvE community you should be kissing their feet and thanking them for funding your pvp game for you.

Why would we kiss their feet? When we know games that are e sport bring in huge revenue and have a huge fan base. This is what a net strives to become. Famous players help the games out by people who watch them. They end up buying the games they play. It works both ways.

Jakkson.4076:

I’m sure they have stats on the actual number of accounts that are regularily active in the PvP content…or the revenue it brings in vs. the PvE side…should PvP prove to be as profitable they will put all the efforts in to make it worthwhile for the player base…I don’t believe it will ever be the case though. The NA gaming loves their carebear PvE MMos too much…

I would of agreed with you if we had ladders/ranking system different pvp modes from the beginning. The problem is they never established a solid foundation. People already left so it doesn’t look good from a stand point. At the moment it falls back on Arena Net shoulder’s. They simply did not put in enough man power effort to get it done imo.

I believe there is plenty of money to be made of the pvp community. Look at lol and sc2 and the dota2 tournaments and find out how much money they make. Most famous professional gamers are pvp’ers go figure.

It’s very obvious that anet has the man power, if they can add events every month and content. It would be nice if they dedicated 1 month to just implement what Jonathan Sharp and his team are currently working on. If they can just establish a better footing on pvp. Maybe we can get those people who have left and newcomers along the way to come and play.

I would like to point out a quote from our PvP game Designer Jonathan Sharp, who I believe is our only link from keeping pvp alive in this game. Stating that they are in the process of adding new pvp content.

NOW! My point is that the reason nothing is getting done in the pvp end of this game is simply that their is not of workforce to help Mr. Jonathan Sharp and his dev team. I feel like we the pvp’ers are not getting the same treatment the pve side gets. We are treated as 2nd class were the pve’rs get new content every month and events!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Ask-not-what-your-developer-can-do-for-you/first#post809642

Pride N Greed.8106:

JonathanSharp.7094:

Wow, what an amazing thread. Thanks for starting it tOss!

It’s a great idea and one that represents a very different point of view. You guys can do a lot to push the current game, and I applaud you for making an effort.

But at the same time, some of this still falls on myself and other devs. We will continue to listen to your posts about balance. We will continue to push features forward that help you to enjoy the game (like custom arenas, matched tourneys, QP rankings, leaderboards, a way to spectate the game, etc).

I know it sucks that everything isn’t done right away, but just know that we’re still working on the features we’ve mentioned before.

Until you get custom arenas, you can definitely use the current PvP browser to set up 5on5 matches and settle disputes via 1on1 duels. We don’t want to tell you how to enjoy the game, and we commend you for using the current systems as you wait for future features to come online.

Although this sounds great to hear Jonathan and thank you for making a valiant effort. I think i can speak for a lot of people on here who are frustrated and or left. I think we the pvp community are getting treated as 2nd rate citizens. The amount of effort that goes into putting those pve events and even adding new content.In a short amount of time, Just shows us that they have the work force to churn pvp content out faster than its current pace. It also shows us that Anet as a whole could have done a better job at providing us with a much better pvp experience than what we currently have. I can guarantee you this is why the mists is a ghost town. It would be nice to get more people working on your team because you know what needs to get done. You just don’t have the work force.

tOss.9024:

This game has been pushed to it’s limit as far as the aspect of pvp. Everyone knows in order to be successful you are forced to run bunker classes and your everyday cookie cutter classes/builds to succeed. People played it and got bored and moved on.

I think comparing this game to vanilla wow was not accurate way to describe how pvp can be better in this game by doing what you stated.
1. This game is not faction based (Horde vs Alliance)
2. You are not forced to pvp in contested areas only in wvw.
3. WvW is a zerg fest and in no way balanced.
4. Spvp is conquest based so you cannot 1v1(unless you get into empty server and hope no one joins it.)

The pvp community is almost non existent go to the mists and go look at how many people are in there.

I think the community hasn’t even made a real effort to push this game to it’s limit. The comparison was merely to exemplify the course of action that they took, I don’t see how it fails in that regard.
1. Factions are irrelevant in getting active communication throughout a playerbase.
2. Being “forced” to pvp is also irrelevant to the point. Forced PvP =/= player organized PvP.
3. What does the WvWvW balance have to do with this post?
4. I included the fact we may need “fillers.” However, in the case of larger 1v1 brackets these “fillers” would simply be participants waiting there turn. Or, in larger 2v2 or more matches “fillers” could double as cameras.

1. Actually Factions are revelant because it created the disputes which caused all the world pvp goodness.
2. Being forced to pvp was what helped fuel the battles and create rivalry.
3. I used wvw as a way to compare wow pvp in its vanilla state were most of the pvp was world pvp not instanced zones(like wvwvw).
4. I agree with you on this anyone who pvp’s loves to duel it helps you test builds and also in the process makes you better better player. You also benefit from learning more from your class.

The effort has been made buddy the problem is we don’t have to many options we either spvp(conquest) or wvwvw. We dont have much room to work with. In vanilla and i hate bringing it up. You still had bg’s(Ctf,conquest,av)World pvp(Tauren Mill, Fighting over world bosses etc..),Duels,and Gurubashi arena i am sure you remember!

JonathanSharp.7094:

Wow, what an amazing thread. Thanks for starting it tOss!

It’s a great idea and one that represents a very different point of view. You guys can do a lot to push the current game, and I applaud you for making an effort.

But at the same time, some of this still falls on myself and other devs. We will continue to listen to your posts about balance. We will continue to push features forward that help you to enjoy the game (like custom arenas, matched tourneys, QP rankings, leaderboards, a way to spectate the game, etc).

I know it sucks that everything isn’t done right away, but just know that we’re still working on the features we’ve mentioned before.

Until you get custom arenas, you can definitely use the current PvP browser to set up 5on5 matches and settle disputes via 1on1 duels. We don’t want to tell you how to enjoy the game, and we commend you for using the current systems as you wait for future features to come online.

Although this sounds great to hear Jonathan and thank you for making a valiant effort. I think i can speak for a lot of people on here who are frustrated and or left. I think we the pvp community are getting treated as 2nd rate citizens. The amount of effort that goes into putting those pve events and even adding new content.In a short amount of time, Just shows us that they have the work force to churn pvp content out faster than its current pace. It also shows us that Anet as a whole could of done a better job at providing us with a much better pvp experience than what we currently have. I can guarantee you this is why the mists is a ghost town. It would be nice to get more people working on your team because you know what needs to get done. You just don’t have the work force.

All of this suggestions have been made in one form or another. Since beta actually! To answer the OP. Just look at how many people are currently in the mists vs 1 month ago. That should give you a good indication of people if they like conquest or not!

PvP community in this game are 2nd Class Citizens, after the pve people. Just ask Arena net how many people they have working on the pvp department and how many are on the pve. :P

Suzu.4193:

Soooo Paids Never PoP now.

Free tournies take 10-20 mins to pop now depending on the time period….

Imagine playing LoL/Dota/Halo4/CoD and the wait time was 10-20 min or god forbid an hour, every one would quit…..oh wait they did.

over 2 million people bought this game, yet there are at most 50/325 spvp servers active, and the tourny system being as dead it is, then there’s a WHOPPING 500-1000 players playing pvp!

their tourny system a ghost town, spvp is thought of as an annoying and mindless zergfest AND the heart of the mists are NOT connected leaving most ALL of the servers Heart of the mists deadzones……

If WvWvW is considered PvE why are the heart of the mists tethered to the single server if Spvp has NO impact on WvWvW?

I thought this was marketed as a pvp oriented game…..yet why is all the new content only PvE???

List goes on, ranking system, new game modes, ect, ect,

Deathspiral crashing into the grave pretty fast for a newly launched [so called Esport PvP] game…..

Anets intention’s are unclear as what they want to do as far as pvp goes and were it fits into a esport. It has frustrated a lot of players who came in here thinking it was a solid pvp game only to find out its unfinished. For that reason players have quit and are waiting to see what they do.

tOss.9024:

I am making this thread to open up some discussion about what I believe to be an issue in regards to the long term success of Guild Wars 2. I find that the community(even other communities now) is increasingly relying on the developer to implement structure or activities with which to compete, or to hold their attention. I believe that this is the wrong way to look at a game that we, the community, enjoy and want to succeed in the long run. Note however, this is not to say that the developer should never implement new things, or improve upon things they have, but for the community to be less reliant, overall, on what Anet does.

To draw a comparison, let’s look at WoW’s early PvP community. (considered by some the best time for PvP in the game)The community was, before the implementation of battlegrounds and areas, largely self supporting. Forums were a place to arrange large battles, settle disputes between guilds, or between people. Tournaments were arranged, 1v1 and even larger groups of people in particular zones would arrange to fight. There were games played on the forums, like tagging certain players to find and kill. The point being, that the community took the initiative.

Now, I understand that Anet has thrown the Esport goal out there. But, I think it’s up to us to push this game forward so that it can achieve it’s full potential. In my opinion, I believe that a game’s community is the main drive behind any online games success. This community can make this game great even if they never put in arenas, or dedicated servers.(which they already stated they would, and will also help the community) Also, things that the community do can help Anet decide what to implement, and when.

Finally, I’ll list some things we can do, as a community, to keep the life pumping until Anet adds more features; even things we can do afterwards.

-Create our own match-ups and duels. Their are empty servers that can be utilized as vehicles for small skirmishes or duels, like 1v1 up to 4v4. (Fighters joining, then extras to prevent disruptive players)

-Recording match ups made.

-Tie WvWvW conflicts into sPvP. Known commanders dueling, or things of that nature.

-Guilds can host events for small-scale GvG activities.

I hope to see some more ideas here in this thread as well.

This game has been pushed to it’s limit as far as the aspect of pvp. Everyone knows in order to be successful you are forced to run bunker classes and your everyday cookie cutter classes/builds to succeed. People played it and got bored and moved on.

I think comparing this game to vanilla wow was not accurate way to describe how pvp can be better in this game by doing what you stated.
1. This game is not faction based (Horde vs Alliance)
2. You are not forced to pvp in contested areas only in wvw.
3. WvW is a zerg fest and in no way balanced.
4. Spvp is conquest based so you cannot 1v1(unless you get into empty server and hope no one joins it.)

The pvp community is almost non existent go to the mists and go look at how many people are in there.

aydenunited.5729:

Pride N Greed.8106:

aydenunited.5729:

Pride N Greed.8106:

We can complain all we want they just cant do anything about it. They don’t have the man power to fix all the huge issues. They had since 2007 to make pvp kick kitten All we got is 4 maps designed on conquest. On top of that a lot of imbalance issues with classes. JUST BORING AS HELL….

But the worst offender is that they promised this game to be esport and its not even close or will ever be. Once again pvp takes the back seat and we get screwed thanks anet.

The article I read said their ultimate ambition was to become an e-sport, not promising instant e-sport status less than three months after release.

If you truly go by the history of most MMO style games and e-sports, they are on a pretty good timeline, especially considering how good the balance is for something that has so many different aspects from typical MMO style PvP play. PvP interest will always ebb and flow. Gamers are fickle, and no longer have to be patient because there is always another game out there they can go to.

Then there are loyal players… those take time to build, especially considering how different this is from GW1, the GW1 playerbase isn’t an automatic crossover.

They had 5 years… since 07 plenty of time to come up with a much better concept than what we currently have. Answer to your first statement.

History of Mmo’s does not matter when their population is low and no one is interested in playing.(AoC,Rift,Aion,Swtor(massive failure),warhammer) list goes on and on. They had plenty of games to learn from and improve upon.

Anyone who plays mmo’s can tell you first impression is the most important in order to insure the survivability of the game. This game was advertised as a e sport competative pvp game and all we got was 4 maps and broken classes which took them 5 years to create. Need to stop cutting slack to all this companies which is why we have been getting crap mmo’s for so long.

There was no such advertising as an e-sport, just a couple of articles that are being taken out of context.

“Guild Wars 2! Instant E-Sport!”… never happened. And any sentence that says “history” and “does not matter” is doomed to be eternally ignorant.

Not just articles, Dev interviews. Never said it was going to be a instant e sport. They designed it" to try be". Ignorant is far from it its called hard data and to many years of playing mmo’s. Im sure you have gone through a couple of mmo’s yourself….Point being HoTm used to full of players now i hardly see 6-10 people in their. Everyone on the forums also see the problems. GL on your gw2 adventures while you wait for pvp to be fixed!

aydenunited.5729:

Pride N Greed.8106:

We can complain all we want they just cant do anything about it. They don’t have the man power to fix all the huge issues. They had since 2007 to make pvp kick kitten All we got is 4 maps designed on conquest. On top of that a lot of imbalance issues with classes. JUST BORING AS HELL….

But the worst offender is that they promised this game to be esport and its not even close or will ever be. Once again pvp takes the back seat and we get screwed thanks anet.

The article I read said their ultimate ambition was to become an e-sport, not promising instant e-sport status less than three months after release.

If you truly go by the history of most MMO style games and e-sports, they are on a pretty good timeline, especially considering how good the balance is for something that has so many different aspects from typical MMO style PvP play. PvP interest will always ebb and flow. Gamers are fickle, and no longer have to be patient because there is always another game out there they can go to.

Then there are loyal players… those take time to build, especially considering how different this is from GW1, the GW1 playerbase isn’t an automatic crossover.

They had 5 years… since 07 plenty of time to come up with a much better concept than what we currently have. Answer to your first statement.

History of Mmo’s does not matter when their population is low and no one is interested in playing.(AoC,Rift,Aion,Swtor(massive failure),warhammer) list goes on and on. They had plenty of games to learn from and improve upon.

Anyone who plays mmo’s can tell you first impression is the most important in order to insure the survivability of the game. This game was advertised as a e sport competative pvp game and all we got was 4 maps and broken classes which took them 5 years to create. Need to stop cutting slack to all this companies which is why we have been getting crap mmo’s for so long.

We can complain all we want they just cant do anything about it. They don’t have the man power to fix all the huge issues. They had since 2007 to make pvp kick kitten All we got is 4 maps designed on conquest. On top of that a lot of imbalance issues with classes. JUST BORING AS HELL….

But the worst offender is that they promised this game to be esport and its not even close or will ever be. Once again pvp takes the back seat and we get screwed thanks anet.

Timeslice.9027:

I keep seeing people ask for other gametypes such as arena, and every time they do some people reply with the ArenaNet talking point about restricting sPVP to one gametype so that it is easier to balance.

That’s fine.

The thing is, conquest is really, really boring. I say this as someone who couldn’t wait for GW2 to launch after having PVPed non-stop during each beta weekend. Fast forward 2 months and I don’t even log in any more, and when I did I was doing PVE (leveled to 69).

We all know that there is no ladder in sPVP, no spectator system, no dueling, and no private servers. This is pretty sad from a game that apparently wanted to be an esport, but the thing is, I’m not sure implementing these things will add much interest to sPVP — because conquest is just utterly dull.

I really think it’s a bad idea to focus on one gametype when the chosen gametype is not very interesting. Give us arena, give us CTF, give us payload. Make the game FUN, and worry about balance later. Because games are supposed to be FUN, and right now what you have is a game that is balanced, but not very fun to play.

Was going to agree with you, But than you said that the game is balanced which is not and everyone knows it!

I believe the main problem with spvp at the moment. Is that anet just simply did not put enough time and effort into finding the right formula to make it a esport. I was so hyped up a year or two ago when they stressed how good this game pvp(spvp) was going to be and i really believed them because a lot of people had high hopes for them. They should of never said anything about and people wouldn’t get their hopes up. For a game that’s been in development since 2007. You would think they had plenty of time to think of something better than what we have now…… Which is boring and broken spvp conquest.

My guild pretty much gave up, we all had high hopes when we came in and once we started pvp you can see all the problems right away. Now were clinging on that nov 16 patch deciding to either scrap this game and just move on.

I think adding TDM/Team Arenas game mode will alleviate a lot of the problems with tpvp and spvp. Since tpvp/spvp designed on conquest everyone know’s what classes you need to be viable. It’s simple logic that guardians/thiefs/mesmers cater better to conquest and to put it simple it just is not fun.

No matter how much balancing anet does it will not fix pvp if they dont add other game modes. Adding TDM/team arenas is just who kills who and its much easier to balance around than a capture the point. Much more classes and builds will be viable imo.

This game will not become a esport the way tpvp is designed. As it stands as of now conquest was a poor choice on anets parts to do class balancing around. Its simple logic that some classes are better designed for it.

You know the bottom line is and many people have stated. No matter how much tweaking anet thinks they need to do to balance and or nerf. Tpvp will always cater to those classes who are designed better for that type of game mode. Unless they want to redesign classes and focus on making King of the hill there main focus. They need to simply add more game modes to be able to play other classes imo.

This is amazing good job man. Now we have data on paper. I’m sure the devs would love to take a look at this.

Here is my post from the other thread

I have been reading the pvp forums for a while and i have not come across substantial constructive material that adress major issues with pvp in this game. I am sure most of you who are doing spvp or tpvp in this game competitively realized some serious problems over the time you have been playing it. The way pvp is in its current state, is no were near a esport(which is what anet has been shooting for but i see no improvement). I don’t want to go into wvw in this thread since its in the Spvp forums, So i will address in my view the problems that i feel is really holding this game back from being competitive and fun. Also suggestions on how to improve.

PROBLEM!
Spvp only has one form(or mode)however you want to put it. Which is king of the hill based over three capture points. First question, Was this a smart idea to balance pvp around with? I think this was a poor choice in a mmo considering the fact that spvp and Tpvp is overrun by guardians/thief’s/mesmers. Why you might ask? Tpvp makes very good use of those classes abilities and utilities. No matter how much balancing arena net do to try and make things better, by nerfing or buffin etc.. IT WONT fix the problem plain and simple. Unless arena net either a redesign the whole class(es),which i doubt they will do.

Guardians with the right build can hold of a entire team until teammates arrive for help.They have enough utility to sustain and make fights last longer(Downed State can elongate battles by their ability). They can also dish out very good damage at the same time.
Mesmer’s are a pain in the butt to fight just due to the fact they are hard to stick on with the sheer number of clones they can create. On top of that if specced correctly you can do some massive melee damage or stack conditions on your opponents.If you yourself take condition damage no problem you have an ability to put back on your target. To me mesmer’s are the most OP at the moment for Tpvp
Thief’s by far have the most upfront burst damage and makes them very unpredictable. It can be hard to counter if they get there skills to all critt. You might die before you get chance to even swing at them.They are very good for getting that pesky player trying to capture a point(s). They also attain very good tactical utility skills to either evade(stealth) or Teleport around the map(shortbow). No matter what expect to be always opened up by a thief.

Spvp/Tpvp just make this classes shine its catered to they way they are designed.

SOLUTION

I don’t really care if this game becomes a esport or not . If anything gets fixed, A easy solution would to obviously add Random/Team Arenas like guild wars 1. It’s team death match style for those of you who didn’t play the first one. Which did a excellent job at utilizing many different types of builds and team composition. Its much easier to balance a mmo around team deathmatch than objective based in my eyes. Every class has the ability to kill and heal. Now its just a matter building around your teammates. Were as King of the hill will always point to guardians/thiefs/mesmers/because it optimizes them. You might think that we might arrive to the same problems that are currently going on. But if you think about it, more classes will be viable with many different builds.

PROBLEM

Another major issue and i know its been brought up. DOWNED STATE needs to go. Some classes have better abilities when they are down(Guardians/Warriors/Mesmers).
You cannot expect to play competitively knowing when you down someone there is a good chance he will get back up and come back and kill you and stay up. Chances increases when you fight around your teammates for surviving.

CONCLUSION
This game has a lot of potential to shine in pvp. Problem is people are not going to sit around and wait forever for a fix and so far it anet has been flooded with work. I dont see a fix anytime soon. Whether or not this game becomes a esport, or if arena net pursues it. They need to sit down and really think about how they plan to accomplish because as it stands. Objective based is not going to accomplish this.

SORRY FOR THE WALL OF TEXT.

I have a post of my own suggesting a different Game mode into fully utilize all classes and not cookie cutters that do better in King of the hill style! Check it out!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Current-State-On-SPVP-Tpvp-Improvement-suggestions/first#post613957

Might just post mine on here since this one is addressing some of the main issues i have with spvp/tpvp.

We Need a Ranking system as well. What do you guys think?

Boloth.6879:

While these might be valid issues fixing them won’t really change anything in PvP.

The main issue with PvP has more to do with faulty system design and would require more time and effort to fix than I think the devs are willing to put out.

To understand good competitive system design you have to look outside GW2 and the MMO genre and study competitive gaming as a whole.

I recommend going to YouTube and watching a few episodes from the Day9 Daily and UltraChen TV and listen to how the host(s) commentate, analyze, and break down games.

Then check out some videos of matches from EVO and take note of the kinds of decisions players make during the games and who wins and why.

Once you’ve done that you will understand the real problem with PvP.

Oh i have watched before! They are certainly Fun!! Problem is we cannot compare it to anything but another mmo. As far as my understanding, I don’t think a mmo has made it to a esport. ArenaNet has set a pretty good foundation as far as limiting the amount of skills you can bring. Problem is they did a very poor choice to making the game modes objective based(King of the hill). It has created Cookie cutter classes. With very little chances for other classes to be effective. Again its hard to balance a mmo as it is. That’s why i believe balancing around team deathmatch will be much easier and much more fun for us at the same time!

RESERVED JUST IN CASE*

I have been reading the pvp forums for a while and i have not come across substantial constructive material that adress major issues with pvp in this game. I am sure most of you who are doing spvp or tpvp in this game competitively realized some serious problems over the time you have been playing it. The way pvp is in its current state, is no were near a esport(which is what anet has been shooting for but i see no improvement). I don’t want to go into wvw in this thread since its in the Spvp forums, So i will address in my view the problems that i feel is really holding this game back from being competitive and fun. Also suggestions on how to improve.

PROBLEM!
Spvp only has one form(or mode)however you want to put it. Which is king of the hill based over three capture points. First question, Was this a smart idea to balance pvp around with? I think this was a poor choice in a mmo considering the fact that spvp and Tpvp is overrun by guardians/thief’s/mesmers. Why you might ask? Tpvp makes very good use of those classes abilities and utilities. No matter how much balancing arena net do to try and make things better, by nerfing or buffin etc.. IT WONT fix the problem plain and simple. Unless arena net either a redesign the whole class(es),which i doubt they will do.

• Guardians with the right build can hold of a entire team until teammates arrive for help.They have enough utility to sustain and make fights last longer(Downed State can elongate battles by their ability). They can also dish out very good damage at the same time.
• Mesmer’s are a pain in the butt to fight just due to the fact they are hard to stick on with the sheer number of clones they can create. On top of that if specced correctly you can do some massive melee damage or stack conditions on your opponents.If you yourself take condition damage no problem you have an ability to put back on your target. To me mesmer’s are the most OP at the moment for Tpvp
• Thief’s by far have the most upfront burst damage and makes them very unpredictable. It can be hard to counter if they get there skills to all critt. You might die before you get chance to even swing at them.They are very good for getting that pesky player trying to capture a point(s). They also attain very good tactical utility skills to either evade(stealth) or Teleport around the map(shortbow). No matter what expect to be always opened up by a thief.

Spvp/Tpvp just make this classes shine its catered to they way they are designed.

SOLUTION

• I don’t really care if this game becomes a esport or not . If anything gets fixed, A easy solution would to obviously add Random/Team Arenas like guild wars 1. It’s team death match style for those of you who didn’t play the first one. Which did a excellent job at utilizing many different types of builds and team composition. Its much easier to balance a mmo around team deathmatch than objective based in my eyes. Every class has the ability to kill and heal. Now its just a matter building around your teammates. Were as King of the hill will always point to guardians/thiefs/mesmers/because it optimizes them. You might think that we might arrive to the same problems that are currently going on. But if you think about it, more classes will be viable with many different builds.

PROBLEM

• Another major issue and i know its been brought up. DOWNED STATE needs to go. Some classes have better abilities when they are down(Guardians/Warriors/Mesmers).
  You cannot expect to play competitively knowing when you down someone there is a good chance he will get back up and come back and kill you and stay up. Chances increases when you fight around your teammates for surviving.

CONCLUSION
This game has a lot of potential to shine in pvp. Problem is people are not going to sit around and wait forever for a fix and so far it anet has been flooded with work. I dont see a fix anytime soon. Whether or not this game becomes a esport, or if arena net pursues it. They need to sit down and really think about how they plan to accomplish because as it stands. Objective based is not going to accomplish this.

SORRY FOR THE WALL OF TEXT.

I encourage all of you pvpers out there to put your own input. I will update this post more with time. I was planning to make a WvW post but i’m sure the devs already know whats wrong with it.

Yea bugged on Fort Aspenwood….

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Forsaken-Halls-Halloween-Special-Bugged

Anyone else experienced this situation yet? Today got to the last part of the forsaken Halls. You have to kill the Veteran Flesh Grazer. Well we tried killing and he would not die we got him to 2% and he got bugged or something because no matter what we did he became immune to damage….. He also has this buff over him(determined) says he wont take damage. Is this a bug or we doing something wrong?

We also tried resetting him we got him to reset his hp pool but not that buff…..

I am frustrated with the lack of communication we are getting from this its getting unbearable. What happened to the arena net of old? Keep your complains on here don’t stop posting and voicing your concerns. We have been robbed and something needs to give.

Jason can you please clarify who to adress the ticket to? In game, or on the website and to whom please. Thanks!

It does sound like arena net does not have a item generator tool from what all the responses all you guys are getting. It seems they want to refund but they don’t know how. Some of the responses came off like your out of luck and other’s seemed to imply that somehow they are going to repay us the question is when….

Yes we knew that the Draconic Berserker box contained Berserker Gladiator gear instead that’s why all this people blew in game gold and real money. Really Anet? At least own up to your mistakes and fix it!

How do you guys not have a gear generator tool for situations like this. You would think from all the past mmos in years almost all of them have the “tool” to fix this problem and yet you guys forgot to add one? LOL, You guys should be on top of you game.

I’m sorry to hear what happened coldcut. I used to have very high respects of Arena net back in gw1. My opinion on them has changed since than. The way they are handling themselves with the situation is pretty shameful.

Like i said before they fixed half the problem, Now the box rewards the correct items. They should of said something to the players who opened the box and got screwed over on how they plan on repaying the people who opened the box. I only lost 11g in game which i farmed myself but those of you guys who spent real money sorry to hear. You guys should definitely fight it till we get this resolved because this cannot go under the table and pretend like nothing happened!

If it means resorting to taking legal action for those of you who spent real money, Than by all means do it.

Fact of the matter is you guys paid for an item which was descrided as higher quality and you ended up getting a hyundai. Gives you a reason to fight it!

They should at least refund the gold….

Everyone who has been affected By this and opened the box, and whether you bought it or crafted and have beserker gladiator set(Rare) set sitting in your bags. PLEASE Speak up Now! Some of you spent Your hard earned money via in game gold or your dollars. We need a resolution and this is unfair.

They fixed half the problem and left everyone who has opened the box in LIMBO. Anyone else who comes across this post and would like to support us, thank
QUOTE THIS THREAD with your response PLEASE

Momo.9230:

According to: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Update-Notes-September-15th-2012/first#post244270

• Box of Berserker’s Draconian Armor and Box of Rampager’s Draconian Armor now reward the proper items.

So… Any update as to what about all of us who did NOT receive the proper items before?

How do they plan on refunding the players who already Crafted or Bought box and opened it….. and got the gladiator set instead….

Still nothing? How about anet you at least refund out money on crafting/buying until you fix the problem that would be nice! That way i can PORT out of lions arch