Guild Wars 2

Oozo.7856:

Smitten.3076:

I sometimes run my Power necro for group PvP. =D

What’s the command for deguilding someone? YOU MUST PLAY CONDITIONS!!

I also run a S/D Ele and a support thief, and sometimes a healing Guardian. -.-

I sometimes run my Power necro for group PvP. =D

Sol.4310:

Dynnen.6405:

Sol.4310:

Dynnen.6405:

dreztina.4820:

Oozo.7856:

Get over yourself, d/d e.

Nobody in AD claims to be the best at anything. Unlike some others in this teir.

BTW, the NoQQ elem who beat you used to be someone we fought against when they were on Kaineng. Their group was better than OG. A guild group we fought against from NSP called PAXA. Yup, better than OG. Envy from FC, better than OG.

Keep on building that self-perpetuated myth that Maguuma has the most skilled players in GW2 though. The rest of us will sit and laugh at you and recognize that all servers have skilled players on them.

Considering I’m not geared for 1v1 and never use my elite 1v1 either, even you guys in AD should be able to get a kill now on me now and then.

I’m still waiting to see those better guilds, though. I’ve never seen OG turn down a fight, even if they weren’t sure they’d win, unlike certain other guilds.

If you’re talking about AD, the only time we fall back is to string out the groups we are fighting to a more advantageous position for us. Not our fault you keep running at us like trained zerglings. Maybe if you thought more tactically and less “ZOMG IM SO GUUD AND GANGSTA” then you might do better in wvw.

Ranger vs AD = Ranger win’s.

Screenshots from 5 different angles + fraps or it didn’t happen
– bunzie

AD, you guys come across as try hard’s, all you ever talk about is OG but you keep refusing to duel/team fight, so run your mouths on the forums post your videos with your guardian saying “I’m Rooted I’m Rooted” (You really need to learn how root works, just dodge out of it), and there is good chance you won’t be facing Mag for long time enjoy Tier 6, while we enjoy an more active tier.

Ranger Out…..

Actually I think you’re wrong here. We do get strung into responding to OG people a lot, should probably try not to get baited into that I suppose though. We actually have taken the stance of mostly ignoring OG , they have some decent players but really they aren’t a factor with how we play our WvW game. I actually think the whole thing was perpetrated by a few posters within OG who seemed to chafe at Oozo’s videos. To each their own though, I’d probably enjoy OG if the trash talk on the forums( from a few) wasn’t my first introduction into their skill. We really aren’t trying hard either, we WvW then put out videos of fun fights. Well Oozo does .. it never really was anything more than that. Until some people decided to make more of it. We’ll keep doing our thing, you keep doing yours.

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

I suggested ways around the change while opening up more avenues for WvW players to run their groups. That’s not being scared …. that’s being level headed and making suggestions for how to improve something as opposed to gutting it. Keep it coming though …

No, you’re coming across as a D/D Elementalist who is afraid of the changes, and screaming; “DON’T CHANGE US BRO”. That’s why you’re arguing with me because I’m ok with the changes, and I too have offered logical, and well thought out solutions to the problem.

But my solutions don’t support your; “no change to my class” solution so you’ll argue with me until one of us gives up.

So this is me giving up on discussing anything with you since you believe everything you’re doing is much better than what others you kill are doing, therefore you’re daBest, and everyone should realize this, and not balance the game. You’re no different than any other player in any other game who is trying to defend something that needs changed to balance the game.

When we destroy a Zerg in our AE group, none of us believe it is because of our skill, and we echo often in vent saying; “wow, that was kind of silly”, but that only shows a difference in maturity levels to be honest. We’ve lately been leveling a group of Rangers for a better challenge, and when we heard about this AE change, all five of us were happy to hear about it.

There, I’ve said my peace, and will discuss things with more reasonable people, who don’t feel they’re the best, and they only win because they’re the best.

I don’t play my Ele , I made a D/D Ele and then retired it because it was to cheese. What are you talking about?

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Kuthos.9623:

Was getting tired of WvW but if they nerf AoE it will put a coffin in the game for me.

As someone else said

Single target should be > AoE

however

AoE should not have a 5 cap limit. There shouldn’t be a limit on aoe at all. If you can’t move out of aoes that’s your own fault. If your group of 30 gets run over by 5 people using AoE then too bad. Should have payed more attention / played better. Hand-holding zergs will only make the game worse.

Seems like this game is going to end up like all the others. Giving in to making the game easier so more “casuals” can have their fun, when it ends up just ruining the game and dumbing it down even more.

I agree with you to a point. There does need to be a cap on number of players hit, but it needs to be something like 15-20 players hit by AEs.

If they do more than that, we’ll be back to having Bright Wizards, who when protected could kill massive zergs by themselves. It was utterly stupid how effective Bright Wizards were, and I played one, who was guarded 100% of the time by a Knight. <grins evily>

You can already use one Guardian to deny access to a ramp, backed by 4 AE classes, as long as two are Elementalists, and destroy massive zergs because those trying to attack “up the ramp” have limited sight, and will see their attacks obstructed, while those above the ramps, can rain down death.

Stability is the answer for any Guardian denial. You really can’t blame AoE for horrible zerg tactics.

Because Stability is never on cooldown, and they knew when going up the ramp to save it, amirite?

I mean seriously, you’re only hurting your argument.

I save stability for ramp/lord pushes. All Guardians should, Mesmer’s should save portals/Mass invis, I could go on here. Area denial in this game is only as strong as the players its used against.

What good is your stability if my Necromancer, or my Mesmer strips it from you? Are you a newer player to this game?

I hit my second ability with Stability on it? Or the next person in my group hits it, or perhaps we portal in, or invis. Or ANY OTHER ABILITY USED TO PREVENT AREA DENIAL.

Are YOU new to the game?

First the Mesmer has to get through to portal, you know this right? And if you pop a second Stability, which most classes don’t have easy access to, we toy with you, as you do nothing but die, or run back to your Zerg because you’re dying.

What other abilities to deny area prevention? Most teleportation abilities are bugged when you try to teleport UP, so they are not reliable.

I don’t think you understand how a Guardian prevents you from coming up the ramp, or you wouldn’t mention invis up, or have a Mesmer run up, and drop a portal. Here, this web page might help you out some.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Main_Page

Are you serious?
Every ramp in this game is large enough to walk around a Sanct/LoW/RoW. We do it every time we assault a tower/keep. In Hills keeps we pop stealth/stability and the mesmer saunters in for a portal drop. I MAIN a Guardian, the area denial is only as strong as the people you are using it against.

People not using their heads in zergs doesn’t mean AoE is to strong.

lol… What server are you on? We would kill you countless times, even if you had the Zerg to back you up.

Devona’s Rest, there’s no reason for you to get bent out of shape. You’re incorrect and clearly pandering to the lowest common WvW player. Some of us actually run competitive groups and don’t lose our heads in WvW. Threatening to come kill me only demonstrates the futility of your arguement, heck I was even trying to be nice with you a bit ago while letting you explain some things.

/shrug — I should probably stop being nice to people.

If you’re as good as you believe you are, this change wouldn’t scare you, but instead give you hope that things will be made more challenging, rather than keep it in the easy mode it currently is in.

Don’t be afraid of the change, instead embrace it, and the challenges it brings.

I suggested ways around the change while opening up more avenues for WvW players to run their groups. That’s not being scared …. that’s being level headed and making suggestions for how to improve something as opposed to gutting it. Keep it coming though …

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Kuthos.9623:

Was getting tired of WvW but if they nerf AoE it will put a coffin in the game for me.

As someone else said

Single target should be > AoE

however

AoE should not have a 5 cap limit. There shouldn’t be a limit on aoe at all. If you can’t move out of aoes that’s your own fault. If your group of 30 gets run over by 5 people using AoE then too bad. Should have payed more attention / played better. Hand-holding zergs will only make the game worse.

Seems like this game is going to end up like all the others. Giving in to making the game easier so more “casuals” can have their fun, when it ends up just ruining the game and dumbing it down even more.

I agree with you to a point. There does need to be a cap on number of players hit, but it needs to be something like 15-20 players hit by AEs.

If they do more than that, we’ll be back to having Bright Wizards, who when protected could kill massive zergs by themselves. It was utterly stupid how effective Bright Wizards were, and I played one, who was guarded 100% of the time by a Knight. <grins evily>

You can already use one Guardian to deny access to a ramp, backed by 4 AE classes, as long as two are Elementalists, and destroy massive zergs because those trying to attack “up the ramp” have limited sight, and will see their attacks obstructed, while those above the ramps, can rain down death.

Stability is the answer for any Guardian denial. You really can’t blame AoE for horrible zerg tactics.

Because Stability is never on cooldown, and they knew when going up the ramp to save it, amirite?

I mean seriously, you’re only hurting your argument.

I save stability for ramp/lord pushes. All Guardians should, Mesmer’s should save portals/Mass invis, I could go on here. Area denial in this game is only as strong as the players its used against.

What good is your stability if my Necromancer, or my Mesmer strips it from you? Are you a newer player to this game?

I hit my second ability with Stability on it? Or the next person in my group hits it, or perhaps we portal in, or invis. Or ANY OTHER ABILITY USED TO PREVENT AREA DENIAL.

Are YOU new to the game?

First the Mesmer has to get through to portal, you know this right? And if you pop a second Stability, which most classes don’t have easy access to, we toy with you, as you do nothing but die, or run back to your Zerg because you’re dying.

What other abilities to deny area prevention? Most teleportation abilities are bugged when you try to teleport UP, so they are not reliable.

I don’t think you understand how a Guardian prevents you from coming up the ramp, or you wouldn’t mention invis up, or have a Mesmer run up, and drop a portal. Here, this web page might help you out some.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Main_Page

Are you serious?
Every ramp in this game is large enough to walk around a Sanct/LoW/RoW. We do it every time we assault a tower/keep. In Hills keeps we pop stealth/stability and the mesmer saunters in for a portal drop. I MAIN a Guardian, the area denial is only as strong as the people you are using it against.

People not using their heads in zergs doesn’t mean AoE is to strong.

lol… What server are you on? We would kill you countless times, even if you had the Zerg to back you up.

Devona’s Rest, there’s no reason for you to get bent out of shape. You’re incorrect and clearly pandering to the lowest common WvW player. Some of us actually run competitive groups and don’t lose our heads in WvW. Threatening to come kill me only demonstrates the futility of your arguement, heck I was even trying to be nice with you a bit ago while letting you explain some things.

/shrug — I should probably stop being nice to people.

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Kuthos.9623:

Was getting tired of WvW but if they nerf AoE it will put a coffin in the game for me.

As someone else said

Single target should be > AoE

however

AoE should not have a 5 cap limit. There shouldn’t be a limit on aoe at all. If you can’t move out of aoes that’s your own fault. If your group of 30 gets run over by 5 people using AoE then too bad. Should have payed more attention / played better. Hand-holding zergs will only make the game worse.

Seems like this game is going to end up like all the others. Giving in to making the game easier so more “casuals” can have their fun, when it ends up just ruining the game and dumbing it down even more.

I agree with you to a point. There does need to be a cap on number of players hit, but it needs to be something like 15-20 players hit by AEs.

If they do more than that, we’ll be back to having Bright Wizards, who when protected could kill massive zergs by themselves. It was utterly stupid how effective Bright Wizards were, and I played one, who was guarded 100% of the time by a Knight. <grins evily>

You can already use one Guardian to deny access to a ramp, backed by 4 AE classes, as long as two are Elementalists, and destroy massive zergs because those trying to attack “up the ramp” have limited sight, and will see their attacks obstructed, while those above the ramps, can rain down death.

Stability is the answer for any Guardian denial. You really can’t blame AoE for horrible zerg tactics.

Because Stability is never on cooldown, and they knew when going up the ramp to save it, amirite?

I mean seriously, you’re only hurting your argument.

I save stability for ramp/lord pushes. All Guardians should, Mesmer’s should save portals/Mass invis, I could go on here. Area denial in this game is only as strong as the players its used against.

What good is your stability if my Necromancer, or my Mesmer strips it from you? Are you a newer player to this game?

I hit my second ability with Stability on it? Or the next person in my group hits it, or perhaps we portal in, or invis. Or ANY OTHER ABILITY USED TO PREVENT AREA DENIAL.

Are YOU new to the game?

First the Mesmer has to get through to portal, you know this right? And if you pop a second Stability, which most classes don’t have easy access to, we toy with you, as you do nothing but die, or run back to your Zerg because you’re dying.

What other abilities to deny area prevention? Most teleportation abilities are bugged when you try to teleport UP, so they are not reliable.

I don’t think you understand how a Guardian prevents you from coming up the ramp, or you wouldn’t mention invis up, or have a Mesmer run up, and drop a portal. Here, this web page might help you out some.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Main_Page

Are you serious?
Every ramp in this game is large enough to walk around a Sanct/LoW/RoW. We do it every time we assault a tower/keep. In Hills keeps we pop stealth/stability and the mesmer saunters in for a portal drop. I MAIN a Guardian, the area denial is only as strong as the people you are using it against.

People not using their heads in zergs doesn’t mean AoE is to strong.

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Kuthos.9623:

Was getting tired of WvW but if they nerf AoE it will put a coffin in the game for me.

As someone else said

Single target should be > AoE

however

AoE should not have a 5 cap limit. There shouldn’t be a limit on aoe at all. If you can’t move out of aoes that’s your own fault. If your group of 30 gets run over by 5 people using AoE then too bad. Should have payed more attention / played better. Hand-holding zergs will only make the game worse.

Seems like this game is going to end up like all the others. Giving in to making the game easier so more “casuals” can have their fun, when it ends up just ruining the game and dumbing it down even more.

I agree with you to a point. There does need to be a cap on number of players hit, but it needs to be something like 15-20 players hit by AEs.

If they do more than that, we’ll be back to having Bright Wizards, who when protected could kill massive zergs by themselves. It was utterly stupid how effective Bright Wizards were, and I played one, who was guarded 100% of the time by a Knight. <grins evily>

You can already use one Guardian to deny access to a ramp, backed by 4 AE classes, as long as two are Elementalists, and destroy massive zergs because those trying to attack “up the ramp” have limited sight, and will see their attacks obstructed, while those above the ramps, can rain down death.

Stability is the answer for any Guardian denial. You really can’t blame AoE for horrible zerg tactics.

Because Stability is never on cooldown, and they knew when going up the ramp to save it, amirite?

I mean seriously, you’re only hurting your argument.

I save stability for ramp/lord pushes. All Guardians should, Mesmer’s should save portals/Mass invis, I could go on here. Area denial in this game is only as strong as the players its used against.

What good is your stability if my Necromancer, or my Mesmer strips it from you? Are you a newer player to this game?

I hit my second ability with Stability on it? Or the next person in my group hits it, or perhaps we portal in, or invis. Or ANY OTHER ABILITY USED TO PREVENT AREA DENIAL.

Are YOU new to the game?

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

Kuthos.9623:

Was getting tired of WvW but if they nerf AoE it will put a coffin in the game for me.

As someone else said

Single target should be > AoE

however

AoE should not have a 5 cap limit. There shouldn’t be a limit on aoe at all. If you can’t move out of aoes that’s your own fault. If your group of 30 gets run over by 5 people using AoE then too bad. Should have payed more attention / played better. Hand-holding zergs will only make the game worse.

Seems like this game is going to end up like all the others. Giving in to making the game easier so more “casuals” can have their fun, when it ends up just ruining the game and dumbing it down even more.

I agree with you to a point. There does need to be a cap on number of players hit, but it needs to be something like 15-20 players hit by AEs.

If they do more than that, we’ll be back to having Bright Wizards, who when protected could kill massive zergs by themselves. It was utterly stupid how effective Bright Wizards were, and I played one, who was guarded 100% of the time by a Knight. <grins evily>

You can already use one Guardian to deny access to a ramp, backed by 4 AE classes, as long as two are Elementalists, and destroy massive zergs because those trying to attack “up the ramp” have limited sight, and will see their attacks obstructed, while those above the ramps, can rain down death.

Stability is the answer for any Guardian denial. You really can’t blame AoE for horrible zerg tactics.

Because Stability is never on cooldown, and they knew when going up the ramp to save it, amirite?

I mean seriously, you’re only hurting your argument.

I save stability for ramp/lord pushes. All Guardians should, Mesmer’s should save portals/Mass invis, I could go on here. Area denial in this game is only as strong as the players its used against.

Exarthious.5792:

Kuthos.9623:

Was getting tired of WvW but if they nerf AoE it will put a coffin in the game for me.

As someone else said

Single target should be > AoE

however

AoE should not have a 5 cap limit. There shouldn’t be a limit on aoe at all. If you can’t move out of aoes that’s your own fault. If your group of 30 gets run over by 5 people using AoE then too bad. Should have payed more attention / played better. Hand-holding zergs will only make the game worse.

Seems like this game is going to end up like all the others. Giving in to making the game easier so more “casuals” can have their fun, when it ends up just ruining the game and dumbing it down even more.

I agree with you to a point. There does need to be a cap on number of players hit, but it needs to be something like 15-20 players hit by AEs.

If they do more than that, we’ll be back to having Bright Wizards, who when protected could kill massive zergs by themselves. It was utterly stupid how effective Bright Wizards were, and I played one, who was guarded 100% of the time by a Knight. <grins evily>

You can already use one Guardian to deny access to a ramp, backed by 4 AE classes, as long as two are Elementalists, and destroy massive zergs because those trying to attack “up the ramp” have limited sight, and will see their attacks obstructed, while those above the ramps, can rain down death.

Stability is the answer for any Guardian denial. You really can’t blame AoE for horrible zerg tactics.

Sacrx.6721:

Smitten.3076:

Sacrx.6721:

Everyone is missing the point of this thread or even topic. Anet is only gonna nerf AOE now because of SPVP which has nothing to do with WvW. Yet now we will suffer because the WvW guys are standing behind Esports in any balance changes. Take mesmer portal.

Why would they nerf AoE based on SPvP?

All the balance changes in the game come from SPVP. Chapman just said on the livestream the AOE nerf was basically because 2 guys went down in Spvp to 1 and the 1 guy used AOE instead of stomping. Or finding more people in spvp teams doing aoe when people go down rather than stomping.

Wait, what? Really or is this an exaggeration?

Sacrx.6721:

Everyone is missing the point of this thread or even topic. Anet is only gonna nerf AOE now because of SPVP which has nothing to do with WvW. Yet now we will suffer because the WvW guys are standing behind Esports in any balance changes. Take mesmer portal.

Why would they nerf AoE based on SPvP?

I use a mechanical keyboard, my wife must know by my furious key pounding how hard I just destroyed someone.

… or how mad I am I just died.

Currently I don’t see any show stopping AoE damage besides Mesmer bombs.I’m just not seeing the reasoning behind nerfing AoE in general. Perhaps it’s a way to nerf D/D Ele’s without coming right out and saying " Hey , yeah you , bend over ". Like I said there seems to be a better way to “balance” all this out without gutting AoE groups while opening the door for something lovingly refereed to as the melee assist train of Daoc.

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

ajm.2931:

Exarthious.5792:

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

But like all MMOs, the majority who play the classes who’re getting changed will fight tooth, and nail against the change, without offering up better alternatives, that are more reasonable.

My AoE’s do mediocore damage to max 5 targets, my single target abilities do sucky damage 1. The fix isn’t to give my AoEs sucky damage, but to give my single target abilities good damage.

The problem though is defense is so useless in this game, they just can’t up the damage to single target abilities, without really messing stuff up. So in my honest opinion, as someone who plays AE classes, among them the Elementalist, the AE Confusion Mesmer, and the Shortbow Thief, they need to lesson the damage our AEs do, and increase the number of targets hit.

I know I used the number 15, but the more I think about it, the more I believe the number of targets hit (depending on how much damage they remove) should be 20.

Smitten.3076:

If they want to take the focus off AE damage in WvW and allow for melee trains/single target then they need to correct single target damage. Nerfing AoE’s in general isn’t the correct path to this “balance”. Some builds do need their AoE toned down, but again the path to “balance” for a melee train is to make that train worth while. Which would be a buff overall to survivable train builds and more pronounced a buff to CC in general.

This is an overreaction. They would have to cut AE damage by 75% to make it useless, and allow for these make believe melee trains you speak of, and I’m pretty sure that isn’t going to happen.

I’m not sure exactly what your arguing, so I’m just going to wait patiently for you to explain.

I’m arguing the change is needed, and people should not overreact to the change.

I don’t think AoE in general needs to be nerfed, so on that side I’ll have to disagree. Better management on Defense, Single target damage, and CC would have the same effect while opening up more avenues for WvW players to enjoy. I.E Melee Trains.

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Could you explain what you mean by “defense is so useless in this game” , please?

3200 Armor isn’t much better than 2500 Armor. As a Thief, I tested this with a Guardian buddy of mine who changed servers to test it. With 2500 Armor, I killed him in 2.5 seconds, with 3200 Armor, I killed him in less than 3 seconds multiple times, so he went 100% into toughness, with toughness food, and such, putting his Armor to (if I remember correctly) to 3400, maybe 3500 Armor, and I killed him in just over 3 seconds.

Here is the kicker. I havn’t taken the time to upgrade my level 78 Exotic Beserker gear either.

The diminishing returns on Toughness, as it relates to Armor is drastic, not like the massive benefits we get from Power, and Precision, not to mention the extremely large pool of itemization you get from having a high critical hits, from food, and sigils.

I don’t disagree, I was curious which route you were going to take the statement though. DR’s , buggy mechanics or over indulgence in damaging stats.

Exarthious.5792:

ajm.2931:

Exarthious.5792:

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

But like all MMOs, the majority who play the classes who’re getting changed will fight tooth, and nail against the change, without offering up better alternatives, that are more reasonable.

My AoE’s do mediocore damage to max 5 targets, my single target abilities do sucky damage 1. The fix isn’t to give my AoEs sucky damage, but to give my single target abilities good damage.

The problem though is defense is so useless in this game, they just can’t up the damage to single target abilities, without really messing stuff up. So in my honest opinion, as someone who plays AE classes, among them the Elementalist, the AE Confusion Mesmer, and the Shortbow Thief, they need to lesson the damage our AEs do, and increase the number of targets hit.

I know I used the number 15, but the more I think about it, the more I believe the number of targets hit (depending on how much damage they remove) should be 20.

Smitten.3076:

If they want to take the focus off AE damage in WvW and allow for melee trains/single target then they need to correct single target damage. Nerfing AoE’s in general isn’t the correct path to this “balance”. Some builds do need their AoE toned down, but again the path to “balance” for a melee train is to make that train worth while. Which would be a buff overall to survivable train builds and more pronounced a buff to CC in general.

This is an overreaction. They would have to cut AE damage by 75% to make it useless, and allow for these make believe melee trains you speak of, and I’m pretty sure that isn’t going to happen.

I’m not sure exactly what your arguing, so I’m just going to wait patiently for you to explain.

Could you explain what you mean by “defense is so useless in this game” , please?

If they want to take the focus off AE damage in WvW and allow for melee trains/single target then they need to correct single target damage. Nerfing AoE’s in general isn’t the correct path to this “balance”. Some builds do need their AoE toned down, but again the path to “balance” for a melee train is to make that train worth while. Which would be a buff overall to survivable train builds and more pronounced a buff to CC in general.

I use S/D and Staff in WvW , far from UP.
I would be on board for increasing Guardian and Ele hp, as long as the counters came at the same time. I’m personally playing my Guardian again, while we do have some strong bunker builds the reasons HP were nerfed have since been corrected. It seems only natural the HP changes should be reversed. I’ve never been sure why Warriors have maintained their absurd HP pools.

Duke.4795:

Smitten.3076:

Condition damage specs are different from Burst damage specs for a reason, even in PvE. It’s very easy to build survivable with Condition damage, not so much with burst. That’s the trade off.

I definitely don’t disagree with your point here. The Rabid armor prefix makes condition dmg + survivability easy to gear for. I don’t think anyone will argue with you on this point. However, the argument I make is more in terms of the inherent system, in addition to specific builds. Sure, you can get decent dmg with decent survivability as a Rabid-equipped condition dmg dealer, but I can do the exact same or more as a Knight-equipped Warrior or a knight-equipped guardian, since I don’t run into the inherent problem of individual burns not stacking or bleed capping, etc. Basically, if you run a condition ranger in a party with another condition ranger, only one of your burns will be counting.

Yep and if that’s the point of the thread, then I’m right there with you. They need to figure out a way to allow multiples based on stackers in PvE only.

Duke.4795:

Erasculio.2914:

Duke.4795:

Condition dmg specs need to do some very creative things (like Nemesis’ Hybrid Necro) to even come close to the dmg output of direct dmg specs.

The failure in your argument is that you are talking about DPS as if all sources of damage were meant to have the same rate of damage per second. Just as a thief has higher burst damage than a guardian, which doesn’t mean the guardian can’t do more damage than the thief, just because condition damage doesn’t have higher DPS than using all 5 skills in a row doesn’t mean that condition damage isn’t a viable source of damage.

But that’s the thing, you would think that over a long fight, the dmg of bleeds/burns/poison would exceed that of direct dmg. However, I believe I make my point quite clear, that condition dmg does NOT win over a long period. Even if an Axe warrior does nothing but spam 1, he, alone will do more dmg than 25 stacks of bleed over any period of time. From my experience, DoT abilities (from WoW, Dota, etc.), usually have a higher overall dmg, but compensated by being spread over time compared to direct damaging abilities. In GW2, the DoTs don’t have higher overall dmg, yet are still spread over time, in addition to being capped.

Let’s say in the future, ANet does indeed fix the dmg of DoT to be on par w/direct dmg. The capping of the conditions will still prevent DoT from being effective. Allow me to give you an example. I bring 2 warriors + 1 bleed/burn ranger each with a respective DPS of 3k. That dmg will be superior than bringing 1 warrior, 1 bleed/burn engi, and 1 burn/bleed ranger since the bleeds are capped at 25 and the burns do NOT stack, meaning either the ranger’s or the engi’s burn is doing nothing.

What I’m arguing is that direct dmg does more burst and more sustained damage than condition dmg.

On paper you are correct, in a dungeon you are wrong. Every time that Glass cannon takes a smack in the face, they lose heal/utilities/dodges and damage on the target. If they take a few, they go down. You don’t have to worry about that as a Condition damage build, baring that most CD builds also offer decent group support over the glass cannon builds.

If the argument is about bringing multiple CD builds into one group, then yes you’d have a point. Otherwise no , you shouldn’t be comparing the two.

Condition damage specs are different from Burst damage specs for a reason, even in PvE. It’s very easy to build survivable with Condition damage, not so much with burst. That’s the trade off.

Server wide mumble would help DR, I’ve been told we have one but I’ve never once seen people spamming it in t/m for puggies to get organized. Our commanders all getting along would help too. There’s certainly more wrong in DR than our WvW population. As much as I detest the zergs in this tier, ( Yes I’ve been in higher tier servers and understand this zerg is nothing to those) I wouldn’t mind banging my head on the wall if it would benefit the server in : Tactics and Communication.

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

We’ll use every advantage we can to win an engagement, while trying to keep our groups small.

So /shrug …. game on.

You run with 20+ people in an attempt to keep your group small?

Actually .. edited it because you’re really not worth it.
All OG is, is forum bravado and a few dueling specs, nothing special. We get better fights from Mag from other guilds there, we’ll continue to enjoy fights with those folks.

Video should be out of the zerg busting in a few nights once Oozo has time to mess with them. Was a fun zerg stomp, we probably had 12-14 with us consisting of 1 BSty, about 5-6 Larp/Noqq.

so 14+1 = 15
+ 6 = 21
yep 20+ which is what i said earlier >.>

No you misread, the Larp/Noqq and Bsty count is added with our total.Hence the phrase “consisting of”. So still 14ish, i’ve been informed the third group might have been full but I can think of who was in it though.

I will be sure to count when you release the video, I am 95% confident there was at least 15.

I’ll give you 15, that’s pretty small compared to a zerg of 30+.

/shrug It was a fun fight, let it go at that. Video will come when Oozo has footage and time, I bet he’s compiling footage tonight since he’s not on.

So which one ended up wiping you?

4 OG, 5 TLP or The Maguuma Pugs

All of the above together? I don’t want to get into it with you Champ, the video will do the talking. Take your loss and move on.

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

We’ll use every advantage we can to win an engagement, while trying to keep our groups small.

So /shrug …. game on.

You run with 20+ people in an attempt to keep your group small?

Actually .. edited it because you’re really not worth it.
All OG is, is forum bravado and a few dueling specs, nothing special. We get better fights from Mag from other guilds there, we’ll continue to enjoy fights with those folks.

Video should be out of the zerg busting in a few nights once Oozo has time to mess with them. Was a fun zerg stomp, we probably had 12-14 with us consisting of 1 BSty, about 5-6 Larp/Noqq.

so 14+1 = 15
+ 6 = 21
yep 20+ which is what i said earlier >.>

No you misread, the Larp/Noqq and Bsty count is added with our total.Hence the phrase “consisting of”. So still 14ish, i’ve been informed the third group might have been full but I can think of who was in it though.

I will be sure to count when you release the video, I am 95% confident there was at least 15.

I’ll give you 15, that’s pretty small compared to a zerg of 30+.

/shrug It was a fun fight, let it go at that. Video will come when Oozo has footage and time, I bet he’s compiling footage tonight since he’s not on.

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

We’ll use every advantage we can to win an engagement, while trying to keep our groups small.

So /shrug …. game on.

You run with 20+ people in an attempt to keep your group small?

Actually .. edited it because you’re really not worth it.
All OG is, is forum bravado and a few dueling specs, nothing special. We get better fights from Mag from other guilds there, we’ll continue to enjoy fights with those folks.

Video should be out of the zerg busting in a few nights once Oozo has time to mess with them. Was a fun zerg stomp, we probably had 12-14 with us consisting of 1 BSty, about 5-6 Larp/Noqq.

so 14+1 = 15
+ 6 = 21
yep 20+ which is what i said earlier >.>

No you misread, the Larp/Noqq and Bsty count is added with our total.Hence the phrase “consisting of”. So still 14ish, i’ve been informed the third group might have been full but I can think of who was in it though.

Sol.4310:

Smitten.3076:

Sol.4310:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

We’ll use every advantage we can to win an engagement, while trying to keep our groups small.

So /shrug …. game on.

You run with 20+ people in an attempt to keep your group small?

Actually .. edited it because your really not worth it.
All OG is, is forum bravado and a few dueling specs, nothing special. We get better fights from Mag from other guilds there, we’ll continue to enjoy fights with those folks.

Video should be out of the zerg busting in a few nights once Oozo has time to mess with them. Was a fun zerg stomp, we probably had 12-14 with us consisting of 1 BSty, few Larp/Noqq.

90% Ele’s thiefs and mesmers I bet….. Oh and the odd Guardian.

Is that in reference to our group?

Just in case, we had :
1 Guardian, 4 Theifs(One was SB) , 5 Ele’s (3 Staff, 1 D/D, 1 S/D) , Necromancers 1, Engineer 1, Mesmer 1, Warrior 1. I might be missing a class , but that’s more or less what we ran tonight, well earlier tonight.

Nice lineup, where is the poor ranger ahahahah. We always left out.

I actually am going to make a Ranger, I get a kick out of playing the supposed UP professions and builds. That’s why my necro has been seeing so much play time. I’m also the S/D Ele there. Granted I’m not calling the professions weak myself but its interesting making something work when people say it can’t.

Sol.4310:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

We’ll use every advantage we can to win an engagement, while trying to keep our groups small.

So /shrug …. game on.

You run with 20+ people in an attempt to keep your group small?

Actually .. edited it because your really not worth it.
All OG is, is forum bravado and a few dueling specs, nothing special. We get better fights from Mag from other guilds there, we’ll continue to enjoy fights with those folks.

Video should be out of the zerg busting in a few nights once Oozo has time to mess with them. Was a fun zerg stomp, we probably had 12-14 with us consisting of 1 BSty, few Larp/Noqq.

90% Ele’s thiefs and mesmers I bet….. Oh and the odd Guardian.

Is that in reference to our group?

Just in case, we had :
1 Guardian, 4 Theifs(One was SB) , 5 Ele’s (3 Staff, 1 D/D, 1 S/D) , Necromancers 1, Engineer 1, Mesmer 1, Warrior 1. I might be missing a class , but that’s more or less what we ran tonight, well earlier tonight.

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

We’ll use every advantage we can to win an engagement, while trying to keep our groups small.

So /shrug …. game on.

You run with 20+ people in an attempt to keep your group small?

Actually .. edited it because you’re really not worth it.
All OG is, is forum bravado and a few dueling specs, nothing special. We get better fights from Mag from other guilds there, we’ll continue to enjoy fights with those folks.

Video should be out of the zerg busting in a few nights once Oozo has time to mess with them. Was a fun zerg stomp, we probably had 12-14 with us consisting of 1 BSty, few Larp/Noqq.

Aether McLoud.1975:

Smitten.3076:

With the exception of perhaps a TPV – Sword/GS Warrior, every other profession must make sacrifices for their mobility. Utilities, weapon swaps, sub-par weapons, trait selections which all add up to a reduction in either : Healing, CC , Cleansing, Boons, Damage, or group utility.
The D/D build doesn’t … it literally has everything neatly packed into one build.

Two things to do really : Nerf the build or buff every other profession to be able to do everything in one build as well. I’m game for the later , I’d love to see how that turned out.

Sounds like eles who sacrifice the ability to do ranged damage for mobility…

Also quit the useless whining, they already said countless times that ele is in a good spot (needs some damage buffs here and there) and they want them to be kings of mobility + versatility with the highest skillcap out of all classes.

Also just recently a lot of classes got passive 25% movement speed with a sigil.

I’d love to sacrifice ranged damage on any other profession I play to have the kit the D/D ele has. Seriously … give it to me.

They actually didn’t say anything of that nature. They said that D/D ele’s sustain damage needs some help. The rest of the discussion was pretty obvious that the Developers knew the build needed some tweaks with this line :
“[…] Some defensive Ele specs are too good. […]while some spike builds are pretty rough.[…]”

Seems pretty easy to read a tweak coming, with the only buff being to sustain.
It doesn’t really matter at this point, this is all water under the bridge. Anet’s message acknowledges the problems, even the lack of sustain. Hopefully they make the right tweaks because I don’t want anything nerfed into uselessness.

I enjoy fighting WaR, fun times. I certainly enjoyed dueling one of their Warriors on my Necromancer until the duel was interrupted. Look like it was going to take awhile to finish that fight. ( Duel was last rotation)

I also enjoy fighting PvP and SM , PvP likes to engage like we do it seems. Superior numbers, probably going to die … heck with it, let’s do this. SM’s got a strong guild and after last nights defense of some key objects I was highly impressed by their coordination in getting their members to and from defenses.

The only time I see OG , after the first time we smashed their group, is running solo so can’t really comment on em. I do know AD isn’t a dueling guild, we’d be playing Tpvp if we were. We’ll use every advantage we can to win an engagement, while trying to keep our groups small. So I’m not really one to buy any of the " you’re not on our level" bravado. Everyone dies and everyone loses, it comes naturally when you don’t shy from many engagements. It’s a general rule I think just about every roaming group knows. Die and learn from it, try something new the next time around. I learned long ago in Daoc, that being graceful in defeat and humble in victory opens more doors than elitism. No one remembers the loud mouths when reminiscing on old enemies from a prior game, but I’d bet everyone remembers the friendly rivalries between worthy groups.

So /shrug …. game on.

Hackuuna.4085:

Oozo.7856:

Bunzy.8674:

Maguuma is winning due to superior tactics, it has nothing to do with population.

No, it is actually numbers this week. Switch to DR and get chased by literally 50+ Maguuma around the map for a couple of hours in MBL and you might have a different viewpoint. Either that or you are just trolling again. :P

Here is what happened last night from our perspective in Maguuma borderland as I was one of the group chasing you guys down: we wanted to commit a large number of people to defend our borderland until we could get a lot of the upgrades in like waypoints and fortifications. Devona had 1 upleveled person in the entire borderland for the first hour after reset and only Borlis sent anything at all.

You guys showed up while we were working on pushing Borlis off the map and triggered a breakout or two. You threatened the supply camps that we were upgrading to get supplies to the keeps to make upgrades go faster, so we had people watching and calling out for where you were going. After you died a couple of times (and yes, we heavily outnumbered you) you understandably left the area.

Once upgrades finished we had about 5 people holding that borderland down while everyone went off to different maps. As someone who appreciates good PvP and somewhat fair fights, my advice to you guys is to not even bother going into a place like Maguuma borderland at reset without there already being huge pressure from all directions — you will just end up frustrated. Now that the key upgrades are done you should have a better experience in there.

Yeppers – We learned that the hard way last night, we are determined to atleast bust something up last night. Reseting a few supply camps was about as far as we got, the SE one was camped by SM and I think that’s the only one we didn’t flip. We might have gotten it once, don’t remember. We also thought we could split the zerg, divide them then sweep threw a couple times. kitten if we only split a few off and the rest of the zerg stayed tight. Well done with the leadership there, we were raging before we left. =)

Nilgoow.1037:

Thanks for keeping us abreast of your personal opinion of other posters.

You are very welcome.

I also think the SM Thief/Commander with the Leg Shortbow is my favorite (enemy) Thief. Kudos to him/her.

I’m learning more and more whom to ignore in these threads, some people are trolls others apparently are deliberately being obtuse.

GuardianOMS.8067:

He was trolling but so are you if you’re saying we ever had 50+ on Mag BL at any time other than reset last night. Why do people exaggerate so kitten much?

That’s exactly what he is saying, why do people get so defensive so much?

With the exception of perhaps a TPV – Sword/GS Warrior, every other profession must make sacrifices for their mobility. Utilities, weapon swaps, sub-par weapons, trait selections which all add up to a reduction in either : Healing, CC , Cleansing, Boons, Damage, or group utility.
The D/D build doesn’t … it literally has everything neatly packed into one build.

Two things to do really : Nerf the build or buff every other profession to be able to do everything in one build as well. I’m game for the later , I’d love to see how that turned out.

TheGuy.3568:

Sigh the balancing we have seen in WvW has been based around the team and not individual builds. So far portal and healing to the group are all that have been hit. In competitive pvp eles have been hit with 50% reductions on some of our strongest healing skills much like mesmers with confusion.

The other glaring issue is the overall lack of player knowledge. If ranger goes pure melee sword/greatsword it has more mobility than we do. Warrior just going GS is enough but if the go pure melee then yes still more mobility than us. Guardians going sword/gs would be less mobile in each set but combined would equal us.

The fact is our purely melee set is balanced against other purely melee sets. the sad part if if you nerf it would be a result of whining not balance.

Please for your own good look at the movement skill list for Sword and Greatsword

Guardian
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Flashing_Blade
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Leap_of_Faith

Warrior
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Savage_Leap
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Whirlwind_Attack
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rush

Ranger
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Swoop
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hornet_Sting
to (flip the camera 180 degrees to get full movement)
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Monarch%27s_Leap

Are you really posing that Guardians and Rangers have more mobility than D/D Ele’s?

Guardian with Sword/GS: ( Sword is a weak weapon for Guardians currently btw)
600 range on each ability, Flashing blade requires a target.
600 range on LoF, no target.
2 Abilities and a weapon swap to accomplish 1 RtL.

Rangers :
Hornet Sting — 130 Range and requires a target. // Monarch’s Leap 600 Range.
Swoop – 1,100 Range

You really want to compare the mobility ?

Edited * ML doesn’t require a target, corrected.

Arheundel.6451:

And the point is…WvWvW is not PvP!
You can take it as an insult as you like, the fact remain that no balance suggestion can be made based on such a format,

You’re so absurd its almost comical. WvW is PvP , and plenty of balance suggestions and changes have been done with WvW balance in mind directly.

Glass cannon video vs Up-levels and other glass cannons.

Nothing to see here.

I’d suggest everyone just ignore the derailing from Arheundel, as this is primarily a WvW issue and thread his opinion is meaningless.

Bunzy.8674:

Smitten.3076:

Bunzy.8674:

Oozo.7856:

Montage of some of this week’s footage. This one is more of an entertainment style movie. Some group versus group, some 3vN, some humor.

We had a one-man advantage in the group vs. group fights, so keep that in mind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sR2jER9aIV4

@3:21 it says TLP/OG
I failed to see any OG members……

@3:50 , the Ele that ran was an OG.

Better luck next time perhaps

Eh ? D/D Ele … always escape, never die. Hue Hue Hue. She/He died plenty that day in videos not worth recording or posting so it’s not really an issue.

Solori.6025:

For the sake of perspective, why do you think balancing descisions should also be made with WvW in consideration, especially when so many variables cannot be controlled?

Simplistically?

Consider the healing nerf had never hit Ele’s , now consider that build being use in conjunction with an organized guild in WvW. As you have already stated, there are carry overs between the spvp and wvw balance passes, ideally all balance changes would and should affect each environment differently. ( PvE, WvW, and Spvp ) Specs that work wonderfully in spvp are inadequate in WvW, where survivability reigns supreme. Many survivable builds have been nerfed due to spvp, those builds were necessary components of small man groups in wvw. For example Bunker Guardians pre-nerf were an amazing, albeit boring, group utility build for WvW. Thje illogic of balancing with WvW in mind ( from you ) seems to stem from it being difficult due to many variables. Difficult doesn’t equate to stupid, I think WvW balance is even more important than Spvp given the variables. In spvp you know the odds, the builds are typically standard fare, it’s a caged enviroment , winning and losing is based on control/point mechanisms, respawns are fixed.

Truly the only unique variables to WvW are size, siege equipment , and culling. Level , Gear, Skill , Space, and Travel variables aren’t a factor necessary for balance.
Level isn’t a balance concern, the system auto 80’s.
Gear equally isn’t an issue, there isn’t a noticeable gear treadmill in this game.
Space doesn’t factor into profession balance as nothing surpasses a 33% swiftness or 1200 range with the exception of Siege engines.
( Grey area )Travel speed isn’t a concern either, abilities cap at 1200 range and swiftness at 33%. Perma swiftness builds have been around since beta, that won’t change so travel speed clearly isn’t an issue. This is the only grey area because clearly it has been a point in balance changes, but given travel speed is capped I don’t consider it “balance concern” within organized WvW.

For the remaining variables :
Seige Engines shouldn’t and don’t factor into Profession balance in WvW, they are separate entirely as only projectile reflections/blocks benefit them. ( With the exception of Golems)

So when it all boils down, there really aren’t as many variables in WvW that matter besides the size of the fights.

It would seem that ideally balance should first start with WvW given its difficulty , and the carry over be applied to spvp instead of the reverse. Fix the difficult first , then see where the cards fall on the easier path .. not vice versa.

Keep in mind I run small group roaming / zerg busting ; so my WvW views are perhaps drastically different from those that ride the Zerg. I play competitively, every engagement worth note is against enemy forces 2-4x my groups amount.

Bunzy.8674:

Oozo.7856:

Montage of some of this week’s footage. This one is more of an entertainment style movie. Some group versus group, some 3vN, some humor.

We had a one-man advantage in the group vs. group fights, so keep that in mind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sR2jER9aIV4

@3:21 it says TLP/OG
I failed to see any OG members……

@3:50 , the Ele that ran was an OG.

Solori.6025:

..He’s actually been talking more about Tpvp..
While i dissagree that WvW is a higher form of pvp. I also dont agree that it isnt real pvp ( since it involves killing players)
Tpvp is a higher form of pvp because it brings the people who seek to change the meta together, in a controlled environment. ( meaning you dont have half a map to run and you arent fighting people with large stat differences, and/ or food buffs)
It brings coordination and team play to a higher level that Zerging people in a 12v12.

While WvW has its own problems.
Calling for a balance change in a place that isnt controlled, like tpvp and spvp, is illogical and pretty stupid..

One thing that should have been done..
Spvp and WvW should share the same balancing.
Things that are OP in Spvp, are going to be OP in WvW, but work just where they need to in PvE.
While the area for this is small, the small changes that they make for spvp should carry over to WvW.
And the devs should continue balancing around Tpvp.

And alot you QQ’ers still havent seen a S/D..
Thats what the pro’s play.

Yep and I’ve been talking about WvW , we can drag this thread down into the mud and exchange blows on why I think tpvp/spvp is boring and doesn’t demonstrate half the skill of WvW but that’s besides the point. I couldn’t disagree more that calling for a balance change in WvW is illogical.

At this point I’m just going to have to start putting people on ignore that think tpvp/spvp is the end all balance test. I really never have understood why anyone thinks a controlled 5v5 environment is more a demonstration of skill than open world pvp. To each there own though, you keep enjoying your spvp and I’ll keep enjoying my WvW.

Arheundel.6451:

Huh?..still with this WvWvW non-sense…bro I rarely play PvE, being used to paid tournaments I assume our views on balance are… quite different to say the least, have you got any idea of what does it mean to play against opponents of equal or superior skill level?
The truth is..you’re the one with head deep buried in the sand, here I am again discussing balance with people who have never even touched real PvP, dude…I played against thieves who can burst you down in 1/2s ..bunker or non bunker, played against necros who don’t know the meaning of leaving an enemy with a single boon up, played against mesmers who will daze at 100% every attempt of healing ( not like the daze nab spammers from zerg vs zerg), played against skilled non GS warrior newbsm, warriors using mace/hammer build or some other crap….there are dozen after dozen of skilled players out there, you’d know it if you’d play paid against QP 100+ opponents ( higher than me)

I can let you scrimm against pro from other professions if you wish so, who will make you cry for mommy after 5s, you can really forget your “Lol god mode WvWvW bunker build” against them.

What about it?Wanna bet that you won’t show up anymore on these forums after this test?..You really think to be in god mode when playing ele? I’d be glad to prove you wrong…

Have you got any idea of what it means to play against 2x 3x and 4x your numbers as a small man team in WvW? You assume that WvW isn’t competitive, you assume that balance issues in WvW don’t matter just as much as those in spvp. How about I repeat myself one last time, you apparently are to daft to get it the first three times, I could give a rip about Spvp. I don’t play it, it’s boring .. I consider spvp to be the weaker form of pvp in this game. That’s not the point of this thread though, so how about you cut the Spvp bravado and save it for someone who actually thinks it means anything.

It would also help if you stopped assuming so much when you reply to me, no where did I call ele’s god mode. No where did I ask for rampant nerfs. Their mobility needs to be tweaked, which can be accomplished with an increase RTL and trait tweaks. The trait tweaks are needed for the Elementalist as it is anyway. It amazes me you compare playing the Ele well to “playing mozart with your keyboard” the build is easy to play for anyone worth his salt.

“Having said that, Dagger/dagger Ele needs help. Some defensive Ele specs are too good. Some of their sustained damage is too low, while some spike builds are pretty rough. Keeping an eye on it means we’re not going to nerf/buff it without thinking very carefully about it”

THIS is the quote that makes you think they aren’t going to nerf D/D Ele? That quote practically states Anet is AWARE that the D/D ele needs to be tweaked. The only thing they said was sustained damage needs some help, which logically means a hit to burst, certainly with the comment on burst. Good to see Anet has already acknowledged the problem and instead of knee jerking is going to balance the class.

Hi Champ, I wondered when you would hop onto my message in yet another wonderfully condescending message. Link the source. Never the nerf’s I am hoping for? You mean you don’t think they will touch the builds mobility, or tweak traits? I’ve played the build, it’s currently to strong, you can bury your head in the sand all you like. I don’t play broken builds , certainly not ones that require as little skill in WvW as the D/D Ele build. It’s not crying, its stating the obvious … perhaps you should play against the build before staunchly defending it.

Or…

Some of us know how to counter them, have played the build and still agree it’s going to get nerfed. Claiming the standard D/D Ele has no damage output is a lie, simply because a build doesn’t spam large numbers doesn’t mean it doesn’t have damage output.

I can’t speak for spvp, as I don’t enjoy it thus don’t play it.

When the changes come for D/D ele I do hope they take a look at other builds, some cast time reductions on Scepter surely. Trait lines need some work as well, given most professions seem to need the same trait tweaking. I’m not sure exactly how the changes will hit the build, I don’t think they can touch cantrip’s at this point and to many nerfs penalize the S/D users. Perhaps just a RTL cooldown increase with some trait changes will correct the current issue.

I honestly hope Mag moves up next week, not that I don’t enjoy the players or guilds its just the amount that is hard to swallow. I enjoyed BP more-so in that regard this matchup. I felt even BP had more in WvW than DR, but it was manageable and forced smart play. I think we will probably lose once more if we stay here, against BP, we just need to take our collective lumps in order to fine tune our WvW map play.

A little recruitment wouldn’t hurt either, maybe.