Guild Wars 2

Dware.4259:

WvW is a HUGE zergfest that normally involves pounding on empty keep doors.

Who cares what gear your wearing? I roll WvW on my level 20ish alts..

Lets not pretend GW2 has some fantastic Group RvR action going on where gear actually matters.

Its zerg vs zerg 99.99999999999999999% of the time.

If you’re with the zerg 100% of the time then you’re not actually contributing much, sorry to break it to you.

The fact that you even say something like that means you have basically no understand of how WvW works.

Khemizt.5104:

Anyways I’m seeing a lot of tears so I’m heading out, stop complaining about treadmills it will do NO good, they are coming deal with it, and maybe send a thank you to anet for ensuring the longevity of your game.

“Here’s a bunch of facts I made up. Okay, bye guys!”

Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.

fellyn.5083:

Tiborb.1453:

No, I hate the new ascended items. I hate new Legendary with more stats too.

Which do not in fact exist at this point. You likely don’t even have a legendary anyways.

I don’t get how people can hate something when they don’t even know how it’s going to work.

Ah yes, because something suddenly being better than everything else is good because….?

Khemizt.5104:

Nachyochez.9758:

Khemizt.5104:

Bearhugger.4326:

Khemizt.5104:

There is no other way to make a MMO other than using the treadmill. Theres no progression without a treadmill… How do you guys not see that, how can sitting in the same gear since you turned level 80, and downing bosses that don’t vary in toughness be fun!?

Not really. Over 7 years, Guild Wars 1 had zero power creep.

And thats why the game was only popular for a few months, they are trying to stop that from happening to this game.

GW1 was insanely popular for several YEARS. Heck, people STILL log in to play it to this day which means the servers are still running… so there’s money coming from somewhere.

The term insanely popular would not describe the game in the NA market, it had a huge following and dwindled away a few months after launch. You were left with koreans and the few die hards.

Going to need a source on this one as well.

Hrafn.7638:

Its a good idea, so stop crying please. Instead of farming Orr for hours, seeing two people online out of 200 in my guild and reading complaints (same people who are now complaing, e.g. crying) about GW2 having no endgame at all, Anet is finally doing something about it.
And no in case you havent noticed: It isnt GW 1 and also nobody cares about you quitting.

Or they could create exciting and engaging content. That thing they managed to do pretty well during the 1-80 process.

Khemizt.5104:

nofo.8469:

Khemizt.5104:

Bearhugger.4326:

Khemizt.5104:

There is no other way to make a MMO other than using the treadmill. Theres no progression without a treadmill… How do you guys not see that, how can sitting in the same gear since you turned level 80, and downing bosses that don’t vary in toughness be fun!?

Not really. Over 7 years, Guild Wars 1 had zero power creep.

And thats why the game was only popular for a few months, they are trying to stop that from happening to this game.

Your posts make my head hurt.

I know it’s been a hard concept to grasp for this community so let me explain, without the use of treadmills your game will continue to die at it’s current pace, Anets marketing team see’s this change and is doing something to fix it and a team of people, much smarter than you, decided this was the best way of making the game more appealing to other players, and to keep it’s current player base relatively stable.

Do you have numbers to back up the supposed death of the game? Or are you just wildly speculating?

Mike O’Brien posted:
Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.

Extorza.3976:

Alice.8694:

Sparda.9750:

“i loved clock tower” ( seriously )

Clocktower was awesome.

Agreed, only entitled s­h­i­t­t­e­r­s think it was bad because they’re too awful at video games to do it, and feel like they deserve the achievement.

You must be fun at parties.

Rangers are still in the game?

Khemizt.5104:

nofo.8469:

Khemizt.5104:

Snow.5269:

Having played numerous MMO’s I eventually identified the one characteristic which drove me away from all of them. The gear treadmill. A gear treadmill is a linear design concept where every time new content is released, new gear is added with higher stats, effectively making all previous acquired gear obsolete (As well as your previous time & effort).

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

---

“This is just the beginning. In November, we’re only adding the first level of Infusions and Ascended Rings and Back slots, so that leaves us a lot of room to build upon these levels of Item progression in future content.

As we release more new end game content in the future, you’ll see more Infusions and Ascended item types being added to the game. Eventually, you’ll be able to kit yourself out with a full set of Ascended gear and high end Infusions to help give you the edge in end game content."

---

Perhaps I am misinterpreting your meaning but what I am reading as a customer is:

“We are going to continue to add better gear with addition of every content update rendering your previous gear void & oh yeah, your friends who haven’t logged on in a few months they will no longer be able to do content with you because they are not ascended.”

Now if I am not mistaken in GW2’s mission statement/manifesto was it not stated that GW2 would “NOT” be a gear treadmill based MMO?

There is no other way to make a MMO other than using the treadmill. Theres no progression without a treadmill… How do you guys not see that, how can sitting in the same gear since you turned level 80, and downing bosses that don’t vary in toughness be fun!?

This has to be a troll post.

Nobody is this ignorant surely.

Have you played any MMO’s before WoW butchered the market?

Every decent MMO uses the treadmill system weather you know it or not, please name one that doesen’t.

Define “decent”. WoW is decent by player standards, but I personally hate it. Guild Wars 2 has the right formula for me, now they’re mucking it up so they can become another gear grind game.

Khemizt.5104:

Gathslan.1870:

Khemizt.5104:

Snow.5269:

Having played numerous MMO’s I eventually identified the one characteristic which drove me away from all of them. The gear treadmill. A gear treadmill is a linear design concept where every time new content is released, new gear is added with higher stats, effectively making all previous acquired gear obsolete (As well as your previous time & effort).

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

---

“This is just the beginning. In November, we’re only adding the first level of Infusions and Ascended Rings and Back slots, so that leaves us a lot of room to build upon these levels of Item progression in future content.

As we release more new end game content in the future, you’ll see more Infusions and Ascended item types being added to the game. Eventually, you’ll be able to kit yourself out with a full set of Ascended gear and high end Infusions to help give you the edge in end game content."

---

Perhaps I am misinterpreting your meaning but what I am reading as a customer is:

“We are going to continue to add better gear with addition of every content update rendering your previous gear void & oh yeah, your friends who haven’t logged on in a few months they will no longer be able to do content with you because they are not ascended.”

Now if I am not mistaken in GW2’s mission statement/manifesto was it not stated that GW2 would “NOT” be a gear treadmill based MMO?

There is no other way to make a MMO other than using the treadmill. Theres no progression without a treadmill… How do you guys not see that, how can sitting in the same gear since you turned level 80, and downing bosses that don’t vary in toughness be fun!?

WVW and , bosses CAN be tougher, and they can be fun, you just need to counter them with skill instead of stats

Sure, then whats the point of killing that boss if he drops the same gear you are wearing!? That’s the problem with the game and what they are fixing, leaving the game without a treadmill would leave in the boring static state that it’s in now.

Cosmetics.

Khemizt.5104:

Snow.5269:

Having played numerous MMO’s I eventually identified the one characteristic which drove me away from all of them. The gear treadmill. A gear treadmill is a linear design concept where every time new content is released, new gear is added with higher stats, effectively making all previous acquired gear obsolete (As well as your previous time & effort).

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

---

“This is just the beginning. In November, we’re only adding the first level of Infusions and Ascended Rings and Back slots, so that leaves us a lot of room to build upon these levels of Item progression in future content.

As we release more new end game content in the future, you’ll see more Infusions and Ascended item types being added to the game. Eventually, you’ll be able to kit yourself out with a full set of Ascended gear and high end Infusions to help give you the edge in end game content."

---

Perhaps I am misinterpreting your meaning but what I am reading as a customer is:

“We are going to continue to add better gear with addition of every content update rendering your previous gear void & oh yeah, your friends who haven’t logged on in a few months they will no longer be able to do content with you because they are not ascended.”

Now if I am not mistaken in GW2’s mission statement/manifesto was it not stated that GW2 would “NOT” be a gear treadmill based MMO?

There is no other way to make a MMO other than using the treadmill. Theres no progression without a treadmill… How do you guys not see that, how can sitting in the same gear since you turned level 80, and downing bosses that don’t vary in toughness be fun!?

WvW?

Cyrus.8261:

Besides, I’m sure that the next endgame dungeon will have… “Corruption” or something, that makes your Ascended gear full of Infusion completely useless, so you can start over again slotting “Purity” upgrades. (and at the same time, not having Infusion will not set you back in this new dungeon).

This would be even worse.

Vasham.2408:

Hyperbole (hy-pur-bo-lee) is the use of exaggeration as a rhetorical device or figure of speech. It may be used to evoke strong feelings or to create a strong impression.

Translation: OPs post in a nutshell.

STRAW MAN

1
: a weak or imaginary opposition (as an argument or adversary) set up only to be easily confuted

I can do it too.

fellyn.5083:

Bunch of drama queens. People complained because legendary weapons weren’t better than exotics. People complained that there wasn’t legendary armor and that full exotics were too easy to get.

Anet is giving everyone exactly what we’ve been asking for for the last 3 months. More end game. Something to do.

Besides that we don’t even know exactly how it’s going to work yet. I for one am excited for the up coming changes.

The ones complaining about no gear grind and legendaries having the same stats as exotics are the vocal minority.

Mada.5319:

Fallen Angel.5092:

This all depends on what you’re interpreting “deeper into the dungeon” as. For all you or I know it could be your 100th run through before Agony is too much to not have Infusion to defend again. This goes for any other dungeons they have planned using this Agony effect. Only Anet is in the know for how long you will be able to withstand Agony before you need infusion. So my point is not invalid based on my interpretation of the information they have posted, nor is his in a sense. My point was there is already player gear gating in place and of course the new dungeon will be no exception. However, to believe one entire run of the 9 wings of the new dungeon, which are randomized mind you, will be unbeatable without this new gear that NO ONE CURRENTLY HAS is pretty foolish.

“Well guys, we’re going to have to reset and hope we get the 4/5/6 wing set instead of the 1/2/3 wing set because 1/2/3 is too much Agony damage.” This scenario is what I will never see happening for at least one entire clear through Fractals of the Mists. After that, so long as item rewards aren’t better (quantity != better), the extra difficulties are artificial progression for kitten flexing. Nothing more. If Anet applies this to every dungeon they create later on, there is nothing wrong. It’s when they make your T14 WoW raid gear required for Normal Stratholme a problem.

The increasing difficulty comes in the form or more monsters, higher monster hp and bigger damage from monsters. This coupled with the agony condition is what they meant when they say it gets increasingly difficult. I suggest you re-read all the information that is present. There is more info than the blog post suggests.

So make the monster hit for an extra 5 damage instead of making Agony do 5 damage.

JJGlyph.9746:

The new patch puts Ascended gear between exotics and legendaries. Ascended gear has higher stats than exotics, which means legendaries will likely be getting a boost.

Oh cool, so they’re going back on their ideas for legendaries as well.

impoc.1795:

elsbeth.3567:

impoc.1795:

it doesn’t matter what other games you have played, this is not those games

give the new content a try and see how it works

its ok to express your concerns or fears, but to outright say you have been betrayed, or scammed, or that you are quitting because of this, is simply idiotic

PLAY the content, THEN give feedback

right now everyone is taking speculation as fact, without even giving the ideas and content a chance

FROM THE GOLDEN RULES OF GUILD WARS 2:

Take risks
“Let’s try it.” You hope to hear that phrase at the end of a meeting, especially if that meeting was contentious, or if the idea discussed is new and radical.
Imagine a playground full of kids playing. At its best, playing is making mistakes in a safe environment and learning from those mistakes in a way that encourages growth. Trying out new ideas or making drastic changes is the way we as designers get to play with the game. It’s where we slip and fall, scrape our knees, and otherwise monkey around on the jungle gym. While we don’t try out every idea, we use our collective experience to get a sense for what has promise—what we should follow down the rabbit hole. We look at where our ideas break, how they break, and why they break. "

Industry history doesn’t matter? Why? Because you just declare that by fiat?

ArenaNet’s own descriptions and promises don’t matter? You yourself are quoting some of them. Should we ignore those, too? How is responding to the company’s own words “speculation”?

Your argument is like saying that just because I once got bitten by a growling yellow dog, I should not be worried about being bitten by a growling brown dog. Experience matters. Your line of argument is naive, illogical and beside the point, since many people of course will be trying it.

I wasn’t saying you shouldn’t have reservations or concern, I stated quite the opposite, I’m saying look at what we know, look at how Anet has developed THEIR game, TRY IT and THEN give feedback

most people are outright rejecting the ideas because of fear and ignorance

My lack of ignorance is what makes me scared when Anet starts introducing items with better stats.

Shifu.4321:

they could have avoided this if they just made ascended gear have the same stats as exotics but with the infusion socket.

They could have avoided it entirely by introducing a gradually tougher dungeon that doesn’t require a stat to do.

Look at all this fallout. It’s a mess.

Alice.8694:

Talloc.6835:

Alice.8694:

Talloc.6835:

Alice.8694:

Alexander Dragonfang.1759:

Alice.8694:

If you can point out, which part of this announcement explicitly points out that arenanet are turning GW2 into a gear threadmill, power creep snowball. Then your argument might actually hold weight. But you cannot, because it’s simply not there.

Maybe you missed it but…

https://d2vn94glaxzkz3.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Ascended-EN.png

There you have it, power creep, small, weak, almost unoticable, but power creep after all.

But not a snowball, that is simply a higher plateau. The argument you are making is that somehow these ascended items are going to break the level limit and get progressively stronger.
Nothing mentioned here actually supports that.

Do you know what the snowball argument actually is? Please don’t give me a link, I’d like it in your words.

The snowball argument somewhat ironically is another name for the slippery slope fallacy…
But since you are more implying how it relates to this situation:
The sheer act of increasing the item power will somehow cause a momentum that forces Arenanet to add additional levels of power in order to continue the intended effect of adding the first.

It’s basically an assumption that because they added A therefore they must then add B, C, D, E, F and G to sustain the effect intended by adding A.

Which implies a deliberate ignorance to the current system in place and how what they’ve specifically said would effect it.

And what is your reasoning that they won’t add more progression now that their foot is in the door? I’ve got about five dead MMOs backing up my worries.

I can honestly say I wish I shared your optimism, but this announcement has given me a familiar feeling.

Your dead mmos are meaningless because there are too many variables involved in game development for you to use them as examples. Everything from design philosophy to the guy who makes the coffee in the morning could have some potential factor on how each of them didn’t perform. And more than likely, most of them didn’t die because of adding an additional tier of item rarity. Though you’re welcome to list them so I can speculate on why they died, for a laugh.

Your issue with the game, currently isn’t present. Had they already added a previous tier of item rarity and suddenly their adding another a few months in. I would understand and completely agree with your concerns. But this is the first time they’ve done this. While yes, this is shakey ground from here on. How they proceed from here is very much what decides if they use ascended as the new plateau or if they sucumb to a gear treadmill power creep.
But you cannot claim the latter, simply because they’ve added a new plateau for the first time. You can worry about it however… But there is a difference between worrying and outright claiming their implementing gear treadmill power creep without any evidence to support it.

My advice to you is:
A. Calm down.
B. Make your concerns for the future known.
C. Don’t make sensationalist rage posts claiming the worst is already happening without evidence.
D. Drink some Tea, Coffee or beverage of choice.

I could come up with some eloquent, flowing paragraph to cleverly hide a “kitten you” remark, as you seem to have done. However, I’m just going to say, as I’ve said in more detail in previous posts, that gear grinds are stupid, stat upgrades are stupid, and I think the game was fine without them.

They created this shakey ground, as you put it, of their own choosing and it’s my choice to speak out against it and hope they’re simply testing the waters to decide what direction the game is going.

phooka.4295:

Talloc.6835:

Go back to WoW if you want your +5 rings.

No need to.

Now that GW2 is all about the gear treadmill, too, he can stay with GW2 if he wants his +5 ring.

Although it’s actually +4%. And 4% in three months makes 17% in a year. That’s more than the difference between rare and exotic.

Actually, it’s 42%, assuming every slot is filled.

Sippolo.1948:

You got it wrong guys, nobody will give a kitten if you try to boycot the event, the majority of people will still play it and will be playing for the next weeks/months on these new patches.
You’re actually complaining about having more variety in the game and having natural gear progression that every single mmorpg meets eventually.
Anything you do this way is completely useless, just swallow it or quit the game.

These ç_ç clubs are a lot of fun anyway, you think you have the power to radically change whatever choice the designers make XD

Guild Wars 1 didn’t have gear progression outside of cosmetics.

Can we stop with this stupid website linking? It’s taking away from what has actually been a civil debate.

Alice.8694:

Talloc.6835:

Alice.8694:

Alexander Dragonfang.1759:

Alice.8694:

If you can point out, which part of this announcement explicitly points out that arenanet are turning GW2 into a gear threadmill, power creep snowball. Then your argument might actually hold weight. But you cannot, because it’s simply not there.

Maybe you missed it but…

https://d2vn94glaxzkz3.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Ascended-EN.png

There you have it, power creep, small, weak, almost unoticable, but power creep after all.

But not a snowball, that is simply a higher plateau. The argument you are making is that somehow these ascended items are going to break the level limit and get progressively stronger.
Nothing mentioned here actually supports that.

Do you know what the snowball argument actually is? Please don’t give me a link, I’d like it in your words.

The snowball argument somewhat ironically is another name for the slippery slope fallacy…
But since you are more implying how it relates to this situation:
The sheer act of increasing the item power will somehow cause a momentum that forces Arenanet to add additional levels of power in order to continue the intended effect of adding the first.

It’s basically an assumption that because they added A therefore they must then add B, C, D, E, F and G to sustain the effect intended by adding A.

Which implies a deliberate ignorance to the current system in place and how what they’ve specifically said would effect it.

And what is your reasoning that they won’t add more progression now that their foot is in the door? I’ve got about five dead MMOs backing up my worries.

I can honestly say I wish I shared your optimism, but this announcement has given me a familiar feeling.

Jrunyon.3012:

Alexander Dragonfang.1759:

Jrunyon.3012:

YEAAAAH! LETS DISCOURAGE ALL NEW IDEAS! NO NEW CONTENT SHOULD BE ADDED EVER!

WoW player detected.

Adding numbers and stats is not adding content.
We have nothing against the new dungeon itself (maybe something about the new agony condition) nor against new maps, new puzzles, new enemies, new bosses, new game mechanics, new cool looking armor sets, etc. Cause thats content and everyone loves new and more things to do.

Adding more stats to a diferent coloured piece of equipment is not content.

Ive never played WoW in my life actually, besides a few hours on a private server.

So do you really think that a couple of added points to precision and vitality is really that big of a deal? From what im reading, the armor sets arent even going to be useful outside of the dungeons because the infusions are made to progress further in the dungeon. I dont see a problem here, maybe you can enlighten me about the problems you see in the patch without assuming my gaming background.

The problem is because you played on a private server. As it is, WoW gradually added a few stats for every new dungeon you were doing. Eventually you kept getting piled on with more and more stats, causing a very linear and grindy method of progression. It’s especially unfun while doing it on multiple characters.

It’s sort of the TL;DR version of why I don’t like it, but I’ve got like 3 discussions going on at once.

Oreoz.2573:

Talloc.6835:

Oreoz.2573:

Talloc.6835:

Oreoz.2573:

Talloc.6835:

Oreoz.2573:

lets be real here folks.

the majority of you that said you aren’t gonna play anymore………………….are gonna play. cmon now. You will. It’s a free game.

Actually, Guild Wars 2 was sort of going to be my last MMO. The way they set it up kind of spoiled me, especially after a few years of playing WoW.

Then they toss what made it fun out of the window. It’s left a bad taste in my mouth. I’m trying really hard to get them to see why it’s a bad idea. They made a game perfect for a niche market, and now they’re messing it all up.

well they just added more content and more gear and when you consider the static leveling curve it wasn’t gonna take you any longer to get it than it would’ve to get exotics but you don’t like to play mmos anymore so buh bye

sorry for being a kitten but I’m trying to get people to realize how stupid it is to complain about all this.

Ah well, I guess if you’re going to be an kitten I can be one too.

Go back to WoW if you want your +5 rings.

FACEPALM

I’m not even…just….ugh.

You went there?

Really?

“Go play WoW” = “I have no further argument.”

golfclap

It’s a niche game. I have plenty more to say about it, but most people in support of the change are simply regurgitating that “It’s not a slippery slope!” and “It makes me better because…???” and I’ve gotten tired of it.

Don’t feel bad.

Players who put far too much pressure on themselves and others to be the best or have the best are the ones who are creating the problem.

If you eliminate the pressure, you just have the game.

And last I checked we all agree that it’s fun to play the game.

I’d like for it to remain fun to play without trying to incentivize me with higher stats. It creates a barrier for entry that can hurt the longevity of a game, dissuades people from an oversaturated as well as already dominated market, and hurts someone who has real life obligations and is unable to grind just so they can compete.

It’s a dark road, it’s one that’s been traveled before, and I don’t want to see it happen to this game.

On that note: I honestly wouldn’t mind one new set of extra gear if it’s so desperately needed. What I’m worried is that it creates artificial content while the actual game bit are lost under miles and miles of +1 upgrades. I’d play a JRPG if I like watching numbers rise.

I think it’s actually kind of sad how WoW has turned this genre in to something that means the game is pointless if you aren’t always getting upgrades. There’s other ways to get invested in a character besides playing them for a long time. I didn’t like Dart from Legend of Dragoon when I was a kid because I got some fancy sword after killing a boss.

Oreoz.2573:

Talloc.6835:

Oreoz.2573:

Talloc.6835:

Oreoz.2573:

lets be real here folks.

the majority of you that said you aren’t gonna play anymore………………….are gonna play. cmon now. You will. It’s a free game.

Actually, Guild Wars 2 was sort of going to be my last MMO. The way they set it up kind of spoiled me, especially after a few years of playing WoW.

Then they toss what made it fun out of the window. It’s left a bad taste in my mouth. I’m trying really hard to get them to see why it’s a bad idea. They made a game perfect for a niche market, and now they’re messing it all up.

well they just added more content and more gear and when you consider the static leveling curve it wasn’t gonna take you any longer to get it than it would’ve to get exotics but you don’t like to play mmos anymore so buh bye

sorry for being a kitten but I’m trying to get people to realize how stupid it is to complain about all this.

Ah well, I guess if you’re going to be an kitten I can be one too.

Go back to WoW if you want your +5 rings.

FACEPALM

I’m not even…just….ugh.

You went there?

Really?

“Go play WoW” = “I have no further argument.”

golfclap

It’s a niche game. I have plenty more to say about it, but most people in support of the change are simply regurgitating that “It’s not a slippery slope!” and “It makes me better because…???” and I’ve gotten tired of it.

Alice.8694:

Alexander Dragonfang.1759:

Alice.8694:

If you can point out, which part of this announcement explicitly points out that arenanet are turning GW2 into a gear threadmill, power creep snowball. Then your argument might actually hold weight. But you cannot, because it’s simply not there.

Maybe you missed it but…

https://d2vn94glaxzkz3.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Ascended-EN.png

There you have it, power creep, small, weak, almost unoticable, but power creep after all.

But not a snowball, that is simply a higher plateau. The argument you are making is that somehow these ascended items are going to break the level limit and get progressively stronger.
Nothing mentioned here actually supports that.

Do you know what the snowball argument actually is? Please don’t give me a link, I’d like it in your words.

piitb.7635:

It generally works fine in all games.

In most MMOs you need a certain stat threshold for progression purposes.

Agony is no different than requiring your main tank in WoW have a certain amount of health, block, dodge, armor, etc…

And agony is built into the dungeon itself, meaning to get good at the dungeon, you need to run that dungeon. Unlike other games where you’re grinding gear for the next tier of content.

Read up on why LotRO is dead and why WoW doesn’t bother with resistance checks anymore.

and I don’t know why you guys keep saying that to be good at something you need the best gear. That’s half the problem right there.

Oreoz.2573:

Talloc.6835:

Oreoz.2573:

lets be real here folks.

the majority of you that said you aren’t gonna play anymore………………….are gonna play. cmon now. You will. It’s a free game.

Actually, Guild Wars 2 was sort of going to be my last MMO. The way they set it up kind of spoiled me, especially after a few years of playing WoW.

Then they toss what made it fun out of the window. It’s left a bad taste in my mouth. I’m trying really hard to get them to see why it’s a bad idea. They made a game perfect for a niche market, and now they’re messing it all up.

well they just added more content and more gear and when you consider the static leveling curve it wasn’t gonna take you any longer to get it than it would’ve to get exotics but you don’t like to play mmos anymore so buh bye

sorry for being a kitten but I’m trying to get people to realize how stupid it is to complain about all this.

Ah well, I guess if you’re going to be an kitten I can be one too.

Go back to WoW if you want your +5 rings.

Oreoz.2573:

lets be real here folks.

the majority of you that said you aren’t gonna play anymore………………….are gonna play. cmon now. You will. It’s a free game.

Actually, Guild Wars 2 was sort of going to be my last MMO. The way they set it up kind of spoiled me, especially after a few years of playing WoW.

Then they toss what made it fun out of the window. It’s left a bad taste in my mouth. I’m trying really hard to get them to see why it’s a bad idea. They made a game perfect for a niche market, and now they’re messing it all up.

Even if this is a one time thing and Anet totally swears they’re not going to add any more stats (We promise guys, this is it okay?) it still means that two years from now, after a few new classes are added you’ll be running that same dungeon because it gives better loot than you can get anywhere.

So we’re either setting a precedent for tiers of loot, or Anet has made the best dungeon in any MMO and is kitten proud of it.

Alice.8694:

Alexander Dragonfang.1759:

You know about the snowball effect?

When you throw a snowball downhill it will become bigger and bigger, till it destroys itself against a tree or a fence beging reduced to nothing.

This update, no, this change, this new ascended mechanic is just like a little push to the snowball, and if Anet already do one little push, nothing will stop them to do another one, till the ball begin move downhill…

You know anything about sea navigation? 1 milimeter doesn`t see as much on a map, but if the navigator misses by 1 milimeter the whole ship will, at 24 hours, missing their route by 120-130 kilometers… This is why most of us is here crying, Anet is about to miss by 1 milimeter.

http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope

You are assuming that because they added additional gear, then they will continue to add additional gear. This is an assumption on your part, likely based around your fears.

The Ascended gear simply seems to be a higher power plateau. Which renders your analogy meaningless.
To put it in terms of snowballs… Arenanet pushed the snowball down a hill and it reached an infinite flat plateau shortly after.

Ah, the same response you gave me from earlier. Care to explain why they’re adding one set of armor with a new mechanic on it and it’s only happening this one time?

Or I guess you could just link your slippery slope argument website again.

Oreoz.2573:

Webba.3071:

Oreoz.2573:

A FLAT LEVELING CURVE AND NO REAL GEAR REQUIREMENT (OUTSIDE OF THIS DUNGEON) MEANS THAT THIS IS NOT A GEAR TREADMILL AND YOU SIMPLY HAVE MORE SHINIES TO COLLECT.

Again I struggle to see the issue here.

Because if this is not the first of many increases in gear power than increasing stats on this release is pointless. They could have made the new stuff have the same stats as exotic. This release fine, its the umpteen other releases doing that same thing that will almost certainly follow it that are going to be the problem.

The angst is not about what this release contains, its about what it means for the future of the game.

Ok fine, lets say they do it.

More stuff to do. More shinies to be had.

Where’s the problem?

A +5 is not a shiny.

It does, however, give me a very good example to go on.

Hellkaiser.6025:

The difference in stats is like… 2 base stats, several % of the garbage MF stat and like, 3 stats on the additionals which are non customisable as they’re inbuilt

the ability to customise them is lost to the addition of the infusions to combat agony
How on earth is this a game breaker for Wv3?

there’s more advantage of having ONE extra non exotic geared true 80 than there is in having several ascended geared players. Because you clearly CANNOT be talking about SPVP because gear progression there is purely cosmetic, and are in fact talking about the hybrid PVP/PVE that is Wv3 mode.

It won’t make a difference dude, please realize this and not spam the forums

Until a server heavy on WvW decides to farm all the dungeons nonstop until everyone has that 8% boost.

And assuming there’s gear for every slot, we get up to the 42% area of bonus stats. Imagine a thief slamming you with a 40k BS.

Vasham.2408:

Talloc.6835:

Vasham.2408:

That would require the GW2 community to be a couple of things: calm, rational, and open to new ideas.

Sadly they are none of these things.

You mean that idea that’s plague the MMO community for years, giving rise to things like GearScore?

Naw, I’ll pass.

Thanks for providing a perfect example of what I was talking about. Immediately comparing what’s happening to other MMOs rather than waiting and seeing how it turns out. The usual kind of kneejerk reactions I’ve grown accustomed to on these forums.

Yeah, no. I’ve played about five MMOs at launch and each time the developers screamed at me “No really, we promise you’ll love it!”

Now they’re all collecting dust on my shelf because I thought they would teach me a lesson.

Shifu.4321:

Banewrath.5107:

I`ve only read the first few pages of comments but I am really finding it funny that so many people are raging over new gear added. You don`t have to get the new gear you know. You are still going to be able to play the game the same as it was before with your current gear. But the option is there if you want to try and upgrade to the ascended sets. Did you need exotics to be able to run the lvl 80 zones or run dungeons?

Most people don’t just want to do content, they want to do content with the BEST possible gear. However marginal stats the new gear gives, most people will want it because its the best gear. That means they will basically have to force themselves to do something they may hate just to get that gear, which is basically contrary to what the game wants you to do.

Honestly, how many people are fine with rare being their endgame equipment? Not many I’d guess. Most people would get exotics first WHILE doing the rest of the content.

I believe a 43 page thread only a few hours old does a good job of showing what the community wants.

piitb.7635:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

That 5 extra power and precision sure is game changing…..

Now add that to an entire armor set, then do about 4 or 5 more releases, because there’s no point in doing such a unique change only once.

Read the entire article.

I don’t want to replace my gear.

piitb.7635:

Talloc.6835:

piitb.7635:

It’s 2 rings and a back piece.

And the rings are unique so you can’t wear 2 of the same type of ascended rings.

Talk about a knee jerk reaction over basically nothing that is going to affect the game other than dungeon runs.

Read the entire post. It’s not just rings and a back piece.

Rings and a back piece are all that’s coming out with Lost Shores.

Here is the actual quote:

" In November, we’re only adding the first level of Infusions and Ascended Rings and Back slots, so that leaves us a lot of room to build upon these levels of Item progression in future content."

You guys are acting like its the end of the world when things like chest pieces probably won’t be available for a year.

Doesn’t matter if it’s a year from now or tomorrow in my eyes.

Vasham.2408:

That would require the GW2 community to be a couple of things: calm, rational, and open to new ideas.

Sadly they are none of these things.

You mean that idea that’s plague the MMO community for years, giving rise to things like GearScore?

Naw, I’ll pass.

Shoros.3172:

Arnath.2319:

If Ascended items were added at the launch of Guild Wars 2 no one would be complaining, NO ONE, they would just see this as another thing to work towards just like a legendary.

This game is dying very fast and Arenanet has responded with Ascended items that will slowly be released over many months, this will keep people playing, this will bring in new players, this will keep the game alive!

Well, ANet promised that Exotic gear will stay “the best” gear. That you only shift around your stats, not your “overall” power. They have now officially broken their promise.

And you are wrong: this won’t keep the game alive, this will kill it.

I’m sure not sticking around. I just dropped 60 bucks on this game along with another 10 on the Kytran armor in the cash shop under the assumption that I’d only be transmuting that set once.

piitb.7635:

It’s 2 rings and a back piece.

And the rings are unique so you can’t wear 2 of the same type of ascended rings.

Talk about a knee jerk reaction over basically nothing that is going to affect the game other than dungeon runs.

Read the entire post. It’s not just rings and a back piece.

Ashes.6418:

Let’s avoid Slippery Slope fallacies. They add one new tier of armour, that does not automatically mean that they are going to add even more in the future.

I feel rather disappointed by the addition of these new armours, but I don’t feel betrayed. My interest in GW2 has been dwindling, this might just be the straw that breaks the camels back. Even if they’re only minor upgrades, not sure if I can be bothered trying to get them.

Why would they bother adding a new mechanic and type of gear for a one shot thing?

Oreoz.2573:

Zefiris.8297:

The ceiling has been raised a bit in terms of gear.

That’s the issue. A huge part of the audience specifically went for GW2 because the ceiling wasn’t going to be raised.

See, if it’s raised once, it will be raised again. We know this, because the blog post specifically mentions that the other slots will follow. That isn’t what we want, and why we are dropping the game over this.

Not a big deal, really. You can handle seeing some mature gamers go, since you have people like Jabronee.9465 to make up for it. Just hope people like him offset the revenue lost due to people like myself dropping.

http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope

It’s not a logical fallacy when it’s already mentioned to happen.

well see that’s the thing i don’t get.

Why are people getting so mad? It’s just more content. More fun things to do. I would understand if sets of gear were required to complete content but aside from this dungeon that’s not the case at all.

Sure people are worried that now they’re gonna have to get ascended gear to be able to compete in WvW (depending on how things go) but if you ask me if people are complaining that they have to play the game to get better at it (i.e. obtaining new and powerful gear) then I have to wonder why they’re playing at all.

How is obtaining gear with more stats getting better at a game?

That’s just turning a 1 in to a 2.

LF2M Fractal, link all Ascension gear or NO INVITE

azurrei.5691:

Let’s not forget that GW1 WAS A DIFFERENT GAME. It was a single player instanced RPG that allowed you to play with friends or a group of A.I. NPC’s at your side. Oh, you could trade and talk with players, too. It was NOT an MMO with an open world. ArenaNet is attempting to adapt their core gameplay to attract a wider audience – give them some credit for trying to do it in the least evasive way possible – we still don’t know all the details so there is no need to to argue until we experience it for ourselves.

You must have played Guild Wars 1 in the later years.

Alice.8694:

Talloc.6835:

Until they raise the ceiling again. I mean, why not? They’ve already gone back on what they said they would do.

I am not against new content
I am not against new gear
I am not against the cash shop
Hell, I’m not even against paying a subscription.

What I’m against is one slight little change that can completely run away and next thing you know, you’re grinding progressions of gear and start to wonder why you don’t just play WoW.

http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope

You’re kitten straight I’m making a slippery slope argument.

Oreoz.2573:

I don’t understand all the outcry over this ascended gear.

Like, at all.

What did we have before it?

Exotics/Legendaries

Were they on par with each other statwise?

Yes.

What are we getting now?

Ascended gear/new legendaries

Will they be on par with each other as well as existing legendaries?

Yes.

Is ascended gear simply new “exotics” and provides the playerbase with even more content to strive for and benefit from?

Yes. It does.

Is it a treadmill?

No. Aside from one special, completely optional circumstance, no amount of gear or combination of gear is required to experience content in this game aside from the obvious need to be at an appropriate level.

Why are we whining here folks?

The ceiling has been raised a bit in terms of gear. That’s it. Ascended gear could have just has easily been in the game prior to this patch so what’s the issue?

Seriously, someone explain to me why this is a problem.

Until they raise the ceiling again. I mean, why not? They’ve already gone back on what they said they would do.

I am not against new content
I am not against new gear
I am not against the cash shop
Hell, I’m not even against paying a subscription.

What I’m against is one slight little change that can completely run away and next thing you know, you’re grinding progressions of gear and start to wonder why you don’t just play WoW.