Guild Wars 2

Funky.4861:

I’m surprised no-one has mentioned guardians and ele’s, who have easy access to burning. Anyway, going for a high cond dmg spec will reduce your loot from DE’s as DoT’s are not considered for damage done to mobs when it comes to level of event participation and loot. Your loot from chests will remain unaffected tho.

i think i know why people dont mention guardians at least. Because burn damage has from experience proven to be negligable to me. The difference is between how bleed and burn stacks.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Condition_damage

as you can see in the wiki

Burn stacks in duration. Which means for every tick, youll still be burning for 328 damage. Which is of course like nothing to lvl 80 stuff.

Bleed however stacks in intensity. Meaning they actually well stack. It only ticks for 42.5 per tick. But it could go up to as much as 25 stacks! 25X42.5 = 1000 damage a tick.

3 times the damage that of burn in the same time period

Thus, pretty much why you hardly see guardians make burn builds and go get condition damage,,, ever

I dont need a 10 second 3280 damage burn when my autoattack swing hits for 2000

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Yeah, thing is, I’m not in WvW for one-on-one fights and comparisons. I’m in WvW for purely other reasons than squaring off against someone who was going to smear me. I’m not the one in front trying to lead the charge and go for four kills before I’m brought down. I’m the guy doing combat revives and running supply to the gates to delay them breaking. I’m the guy putting the Arrow Cart plan down for defensive siege, or buying a Ram to sneak in onto a gate. I’m the guy escorting Dolyaks and keeping an eye out for enemies trying to sneak around and hit supply camps.

I’ll also say it again – WvW isn’t really about two exactly matched groups meeting on the field of battle and fighting it out. It’s not about calling a duel between two warriors and may the best set of equipment win.

Well its fine that you want to do support and rez and rams and siege and stuff. But let me tell you this. When i started, i thought the same thing as you. I main a guardian, naturally i rolled the class because i wanted to support my team members. I wanted to build tanky, charge in the frontlines, take hits for teammates. Drop my wall of reflection and shield of avenger. Take out my staff and hammer to choke points. i wanted to stay at the back and drop my heals and let the tough guys charge in and start killing people.

yeah, i never thought i would become damage and kill obssessed when i started.

And basically what made the change in me was people like you.

What i found always in what seems like a 10 man pug. Is that half of my team are lowbies. The other half are undergeared 80s. and 2-3 people left that could actually kill anything.

I want to go support too. But when more than half of my team cant kill someone even if they afked for 10seconds. Someone has to do the dirty work, and “go for four kills before he’s brought down”.

Really, us “gear-chasers” are doing you “support” people a favor in WvW all the time preventing people from kicking your kittens. Appreciate us a bit more.

Yes and you can tell me good strategy and communication stuff wins battles. But without people like me to put all your plans into practice. You would just fail.

Gear matters.

Idk must be a lot i kill everyone who isnt lvl 80 in a couple seconds? dont think i would bother with the math. I talk from experience, 5 seconds tops for anyone under 80 for me. If they let me hit them though, im meelee, people run.

When i first started mmos, i was of the camp that skill and hard work, knowledge of the class etc would always be better than gear which just gives you a minor stat increase. As i played mmos longer, i became more and more disillusioned of the whole skill > gear idea. Frankly, 90% of the time its not just gear and class balance comes into play a lot as well.

My experience in mmos has taught me those little points of stats add up. In another game, i had a +13 bow, and honestly, upgrading it to +15 wouldnt put its damage by 10%. But i did it anyway, and personally for me, the change was rather breathtaking. The whole feel was different. Not that much stats on paper, but it changes things.

And crit damage IS a big deal, people with offensive builds can get near 100% crit rate for a while. Warriors can get close to 90% crit rate no thanks to fury most of the time. Even as a guardian which isnt known for burst, i can have 90% crit rate for 10 seconds.

For people running offensive based builds in WvW. 1 point of crit damage basically equals 1 point of dps.

Im betting on ascended set giving close to +20% crit damage with full set, since i see one ring have 2% more crit damage than exotics.

To me this translates to 20% damage increase for glass cannon burst builds. When you figure in the base damage increase in weapons, and extra power and precision you get. It actually more.

You thought backstabs, hundred blades, and kill shots killing you in 3seconds is bad now? wait till they get full ascended.

the exact number of how much badges it should cost is up to debate, and id happily give 1000 badges too for a ring anyway, 500 sounds more right though

but the point is, i believe it would be better if they had more ways then just doing that dunguen again and again to get the ascended gear

the previous top tier gear, exotics can be achieved in many ways

you could grind dungeuns forever, buy it straight from the TP, craft it, get it from karma, get it with WvW badges

now with ascended gear the only option left is grind dungeuns forever
which doesnt sound like much fun to me

And there is the problem that ascended gear affects WvW balance, but you cant get ascended gear in WvW, which isnt quite fair

Put it this way, what would you think if the best PVE gear in this game can only be got in WvW? You would complain about it too right?

some of us fight on servers that are constantly outnumbered 2 to 1 on a daily basis

people on servers with more balanced numbers dont understand how bad it is for us

just today i had fight 2 hours of WvW where i basically have a group of 10 people to defend our borderlands against what is likely 30 people

it isnt even a matter of skill or focusing on the people rezing anymore, there is no way for us to kill a significant amount of them so that they cant all rez back

in basically every other mmo i had played, when people die, they actually die and have to walk back from their spawn, now when they die, they just have to wait for their zerg to rez them back like nothing happened to them. And thats not even counting they would likely have rallied because their attacker would get focus fired and wind up dead to actually kill anyone

and its not even only about the “down” state, even if i “defeat” anyone, its just a difference of 5 seconds of rezzing versus 10 seconds of rezzing someone

there is no way to thin the enemy group when you are outnumbered with the whole rezzing mechanic around

agrees with OP

downed state in WvW makes it close to impossible to win when you are outnumbered
when you are fighting a force twice your size, theres is no way to thin the enemy zerg. you can kill them one at a time, sure but even if you “defeat” them they can just lie on the floor and wait for 5 people to rez them in 10 seconds

its hard enough to actually kill anyone on the other side when its 10 vs 20
why make it so that those 20 people can easily get a rez when they die too?

I dont play spvp. So i only speak for WvW
Its a very mixed experience playing guardian in WvW

Sometimes you think your the most underpowered class because all you do is hit on the door in siege

At other times you charge into a group of 10 down 2, get back out alive and think your OP

Against a zerg u wonder why you dont have a range weapon and feel your useless

But sometimes you get lucky charging into a zerg of 20
with wall of reflection up of course, (no amount of toughness or vit is gonna let you survive 20 people)
kills someone, gets out alive

and thinks that there is some hope for us after all

oh and of course………

you get to be like the only person on the map who can actually solo a thief

yes ascended gear in WvW please

i have some badges sitting there to rot

lol at people who think gear and lvls dont matter in WvW

well, technically you could go there at lvl 8 and naked too, but lvl 80s are just that much more effective

lvl 80s in exotics could easily solo 2 >80 chars
my personal best was downing 5 >80 chars solo

tell me that gear and lvls dont matter in WvW

this new ascended gear is gonna be a big deal in WvW

It has gotten to the point where i question why i even do WvW anymore, all it does is give me repair bills

Perspective from A Kaineng player on Saturday afternoon

Goes into Kaineng border
Find 30 man devona group hitting garrison west side
charges them solo >>>> dies

Goes out from the east exit this time
Find 20 man devona group hitting cliff
charges a lowbie > kills him >>>> dies

Ragequits in frustration

To actually kill thieves, you actually have to NOT listen to what everybody on these forums are saying.

“That is to play a bunker against a thief in WvW”

You might call me crazy but why do i say this?

Because bunker and survivalbility based builds in WvW exactly leads to what you the OP experience against thieves. Many people hitting thieves for an hour without killing them. Many times have i have to somewhat seem like “clean up the mess” on my guardian because it seems that i am the only person on the whole map which could actually kill a thief.

Now to give reasons why bunker is bad against thieves in WvW

1. This isnt Spvp, thieves are free to disengage you whenever they feel like it, they arent forced to stand in a small circle

2. Bunker builds lack the damage to kill any thief whether they are glass cannon or not because you hit like……well you dont hit for much

3. This leads to thieves basically being invincible against you because you as a bunker, would slowly chip away at the thieves health> which leads to them stealthing away > and reganking you when their cooldowns are back up

To summarize: Bunker in WvW = cant ever kill a thief and opens up the way for thieves to grief you over and over again forever

Now to back up my claim with some personal experience:

I could never finish off a thief when i spec for survivability on my guardian:
what pretty much happens is what you the OP has described,
They dont really kill me, but i dont kill them either, they stealth when they get low and go off to regank me later or just pick on some squishy guy

Now that i spec pure-offensively

I lol burst them and they die in 5 seconds
many times they stealth, i hit my aoes like biding blade, spin and i find a dead thief next to me 5 seconds later

Why you failed to kill a single thief with 5 people is because all those 5 people arent glass cannons themselves, a real glass cannon can easily down a thief in a few seconds

Half of the time as a guardian you put down wall of reflection > afk for 40 seconds > put down wall of reflection > loop in a zerg fight

The other half you take out your mighty greatsword and swing away at verteran guards and scouts at supply camps

You get to auto-attack doors all day long taking all the siege damage because you refuse to use a sceptor

Or you get to rez people on the map because they have all been killed by roaming thieves and everybody wants you to hunt down that thief because you are a guardian and are supposed to just look at thieves and they die nevermind that they run kitten fast and stealth whenever they get below 50% health

And those rare times when you face a group that isnt 5+ people
take them all down, but still thinks that you should reroll

Basically this

i would personally take valor over honor because it increases crit damage,
which to me is a requirement for high damage

there are builds for most classes which can give u enough precision to push your crit up to 80-90% for at least a while under the effects of fury

and when youve got that high crit chance, any extra crit damage is a flat out % based damage increase

speccing 30 points into valor is a flat out close to 30% increase in damage if your crit is high enough, it also increases toughness and opens up your way to either altruistic healing or monk’s focus. Which will increase your survivability, assuming thats what you were going for speccing in honor

i like my human elite racial for my guardian, makes it harder for my enemies to run away

i find my burst to be pretty respectable too with 20/25/25/0/0 build and full zerker everything, i guess we can still build ourselves to be an aoe judge bombing guardian if we want to. 10% to people on fire, 5% greatsword damage and 10% more to people with conditions(fire) = 25% damage increase to people burning. Juke cast purging flames before you cast jude’s intervention for burn and you would find that even 80s go down fairly fast provided they dont spec real tanky

i power up with staff 4 before i charge in and save yourselves before i charge in,

8 seconds of burst mode with 88% crit rate and 3800 attack, 82% crit damage=
very bursty aoe Judge bomb

still yeah i agree that we kinda become reflection wall mules in zerg vs zerg battles,
could really use a better range weapon

gonna retire from WvW for a while

charging into enemy groups downing 1-2 only to see them all rezed back up 10 seconds later gets boring after a while

cant go anywhere without running into 10 devonas

in WvW i pretty much go

Reaper of Grenth(optional) > staff 4 > switch GS > Save yourself > Purging flames >
Judge Intervention > GS 4 > GS 3 > GS 5 > pull > GS 2

of course full zerker everything and traits will be full offensive too

the end result is basically = everything under 80 dies after combo
and squishy 80s die after combo or lose 70-80% of their health
tanky 80s are another story

one trick pony and highly situational, but prob as bursty as a guardian could get
to answer your question, yeah we can burst, not sure if its worth sacrificing your defense for it though

dont recommend ring or warding though since its kinda slow and i heard you can just dodge out of it, and i dont feel bursty enough without my staff 4

Not surprised that people in Kaineng are starting to talk crap to the Devonas
I would probably want to do that too but since it doesnt accomplish anything i refrain from it

Devonas have talked crap to us in my view much more than we have talked crap about u guys

We win, its because of night cap and all we could do is PvDoor
We win and celebrate = we are chest pounding
Dredynte has been chest pounding all week long whether you realize it or not
We’re accused of exploiting using lame tactics daily
And now everyone is saying that all we have are numbers and cant win a fair fight

Basically to sum up what all the Devonas say in here

Devonas win = skill tactics, good strategy that lets u guys take on groups twice your size

Kaineng gets the lead automatically = chest pounding, night cap, mindless zerg beating people 2 to 1, hacking exploits etc, lame strategy in general

Go back to the thread last week, find me 1 person in Kain who complained about Devonas night capping, exploiting or simply outnumbering us

Nope, we never complained when you guys were winning
Instead, you complained about us hacking which was later proven to be wrong too even when we were losing

We’ve gotten all this crap talk from you guys and now you wonder why we are doing it back to you

The only guy in Kain who crap talks on everyone without a reason is probably Mighteous
But he’s funny so i can bear with him

Dont see why there are so many people defending thieves
They are clearly broken in WvW

I say nerf their stealth in WvW specifically or fix the render issues

Seriously fix the render

Mesmer nearly soloed our group of 5 today

@DiogoSilva:

except SoW is a light field and does neither burn or blind

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Light_Field

Well congrats first on DR for taking the lead
You guys somehow got a lot stronger this week compared to last

Last week we at K were fighting FCs all the time but this week our biggest enemy is DR
We would be doing our best to deny you of the win

From random Kaineng person

Oh and where are all the Ferguson people? There were “a lot” of you guys during weekends lol.

Yeah i guess it does suck to have everything taken by the “nightcrew”. Well actually i think many of the nightcrew would be happy to fight when there is more opposition too. But sadly timezones dont really allow that and until arenet comes up with some fix like opening Oceanic timezone servers or do points based on population. I think we’re here to stay.

Guess you guys will have to bear with us for like until…….god knows when?

And also the the guy who said:
“The problem is that during the night it is 100vs10 and during the day it is 40vs40”
Not fair at all

Well do note that if those 100 people were able to actually play during the day
You’d be seeing a 140v50
And then you’d still lose, and then you complain about being outnumbered, instead of nightcapping.

To be fair, maybe there are a bit too many Kaineng posts atm in the forums, a bit of chest pumping here and boasting here and there. But do remember that this is the first time that Kaineng actually could win so many people are just a bit excited and want to celebrate a bit. Im pretty sure the posts will die down a bit next week. Sorry for the incoveniences caused.

Oh and about the population issue. I think population kinda goes like this:

Kain=FC > DR

with Kain havent an advantage becos our pop is more spread out in different times

I dont know about other people, but yeah I at least and im sure a lot of other people do admit that we have more population now.

You poor people at DR dont need to get all sensitive and defensive becos both FC and now Kain is beating you up.
5 minutes till WvW reset, GL to DR and FC your in next matchups…….
You guys were good opponents

=.= yeah and i know i wouldnt be looking forward to mine

whats the big deal with nightcapping anyway? we cap when you are sleeping or something, whats wrong with that?

What to you is in the night in NA is to me my daytime in Asia

You cap as much stuff when im asleep as much as i cap stuff when you are asleep.
But all the people from NA timezone likes to paint us the Oceanic crew as bad guys
all the time

I cap your stuff when your at school/work
And you cap my stuff when im at school/work

You do realize that you people in NA regions nightcap all of us in Asia and Australia
all the time too?

But yes since America is the center of the world, people living in Asia, Europe and Australia are all just 2nd class citizens who should not be allowed to play when you guys are sleeping

Double standards