Guild Wars 2

Ayrilana.1396:

That’s not what I’m saying. What you’re calling loyal is similar to someone who supports a sports team only when it’s performing well.

Well then we simply have differing opinions about what constitutes customer loyalty. (Shrugs)

Ayrilana.1396:

If a player is so hesitant to purchase an expansion with so much info made available to them, and would prefer to wait until they see reviews first, would you really consider them loyal?

If, in the end, the player actually ends up purchasing the product (and thereby financially supporting the company), then…yes?

Anyone who makes a repeat purchase from a company is showing customer loyalty.

Ayrilana.1396:

Because they’re not loyal. If even after all of the information that is going to be released has been released the day before the expansion, if they are still on the fence about buying the expansion then their loyalty is questionable.

You are actually suggesting that the only way to be considered “loyal” is to hand over your money before the product is even released?

That’s stretching the definition of customer loyalty quite thin.

Chobits.2430:

Players that purchased the game before that time get a Free character slot, value ~$10.
New players do not get a free character slot, but everyone gets something.

But ONLY if you pre-purchase the expansion before it releases. If you would rather wait until release so that you know exactly what you’re buying, you will need to spend an additional ten dollars for a character slot if you are already maxed out and wish to play the new profession.

Apparently, fifty dollars isn’t enough money for ANet to provide you with an expansion that is fully accessible without extra charges.

Consider it a “penalty fee” for not being loyal enough to hand them your money before release.

Lothian.1268:

Also, what happened to the Anet announcement about a year ago that there would never be a paid xpac for GW2? It was less then 3 months later that HoT was announced as a paid xpac. You can’t honestly say that no one knew it was being produced. You guys are coming off even more shady then Blizzard right about now.

I don’t suppose you have a link to that statement, do you? Because I’m fairly certain that ANet has never made a statement saying they would never make a paid xpac for GW2. I remember them making statements to the effect that they were choosing to go with Living Story as a method for delivering content rather than doing it through expansions, but even then they never said “never”.

Not that I’m expending a ton of energy defending them, mind you. I am nearly completely out of patience with ANet as a company. I hate the arrogance with which they refuse to communicate with us. I hate the cowardice displayed when they refuse to even admit to making mistakes (let alone apologizing for them). And now I’m hating the greed I’m seeing in the decision to release a fifty dollar expansion and expect people to either pre-purchase it or pay a penalty fee for a character slot if you choose to wait until release.

So yeah, I’m horribly disappointed in ANet right now. But I still don’t think they said what you think they said.

Chicho Gosho.6507:

You do not have any information about the standard HoT package. You are just speculating and twisting the facts to your liking. Only HoT pre-purchasers are getting character slot is correct because we do not have any information about anything else.

“unnecessarily manipulative sales tactic” – this is wrong.

Look, there are really only two possibilities here:

1. They are withholding a character slot from anyone who does not pre-purchase the basic version of HoT. (which is, in my opinion, an unnecessarily manipulative sales tactic)

OR

2. They are intentionally advertising HoT in a manner that misleads people into thinking they have to pre-purchase HoT to get a character slot with the basic version. (which would be downright dishonest as well as manipulative)

And for the record, I am twisting no “facts” to my liking. My statement of what I find to be an unnecessarily manipulative sales tactic is an opinion, not an objective, provable fact, and I never claimed otherwise.

sirsquishy.8531:

[SNIP]…The price is what it is, we are all now getting the free character slot for the Rev. No reason to be unhappy about that.

No, we are not “all now getting the free character slot for the Rev”. That’s my whole point. Only the people who pre-purchase are getting the character slot.

I don’t mind pre-purchase incentives for people who want to give money to a company in return for a promise of future product delivery. Things like weapon skins, or a new costume, or even exclusive armor skins…all fine. But a character slot is necessary to gain full use of the product they are already charging fifty dollars for. There is no ethical reason at all for them to expect people to pay even more money to access the new profession or have to delete a character.

It’s an unnecessarily manipulative sales tactic and is most definitely a reason for some of us to be unhappy. I get that you’re happy with being forced to pre-purchase in order to get a character slot for the new profession, and that’s fine. More power to you.

IndigoSundown.5419:

and the FAQ …

“If you registered your core Guild Wars 2 game before January 23, 2015 and register a pre-purchase serial code for Heart of Thorns any time before the expansion is released, you’ll receive a free character slot! Once you apply a pre-purchase serial code, you’ll be eligible for the slot regardless of where you bought the core game.”

… there is nothing in either phrasing that prevents them from offering the same deal after HoT launch.

Let’s assume, for the sake of discussion, that they do that. Would everyone really be okay with that???

I mean, the idea that they would drum up pre-purchase sales by intentionally misleading people into believing that they will not receive a character slot unless they pre-purchase is, in my opinion, completely unethical.

I’ll be blunt. This character slot should not be considered “free”. People are paying a pretty hefty price tag for even the most basic version of HoT. My feeling is that if you are paying fifty dollars for just an expansion pack, that should certainly cover the cost of a character slot without needing to feel as though the Gods of Good Fortune have seen it upon themselves to graciously bestow you with an amazing gift that you should have to feel grateful for.

I didn’t want a character slot for “free”. I wanted to pay them fifty dollars— at release— for an expansion pack that included the ability to access the new profession without having to pay them an additional sum of money or delete an existing character.

I can’t help but feel as if ANet has gotten away with making so many people actually feel grateful for being granted bare-minimum functionaly of a fifty dollar product.

Abdulmaelik.8964:

Patience guys. Anet will adjust the price for the vets. Just dont pre order this overpriced and unfair expansion. Some vets will waste their money on the pre ordered expansion but on release day there will be an expansion only price, cheaper than this nonsense, because Anet now wants to milk the pre order gw2 fanatics. The intelligent gw2 players are too many for Anet to throw away.

You might be right, but I think I’m now to the point where it doesn’t matter any more. They had a chance to make things right when the first wave of pitchforks and torches arose, and they chose to simply leverage it as an opportunity to pressure people to pre-purchase.

I think my loyalty to this company has suffered from what can best be described as the “death by a thousand cuts” syndrome. It feels to me that I can nearly always rely on them to either:

A) Ignore an issue entirely
B) Communicate, but only in the vaguest possible way while admitting no mistakes; OR
C) Choose a course of action that offers the least possible benefit to players in order to drive up gem store sales.

To the eyes/ears at ANet:

I played GW1 for years (including Prophecies, Factions, Nightfall, and Eye of the North). I enthusiastically pre-purchased Guild Wars 2 (because I wanted to, not because I was being manipulated by the threat of losing out on basic game features like character slots), and I have made gem store purchases. And I would have spent many, many more dollars if I had been treated as a valued customer.

But now I’m tired. I’m tired of only getting communication and/or action when the community is in an uproar. We shouldn’t have to rely on such aggressive tactics to receive even the most basic customer service. I honestly resent that you seem to expect us to fight for your scraps. It’s exhausting, and I’m over it.

So you know what, guys? Keep that precious ten dollar character slot, the sale of which is obviously so important to the very survival of your company. And I’ll just keep the fifty dollars that I had planned to spend on HoT, as well as any money I would have spent on gem store purchases and any future expansions. I don’t really see how that works out better for you, mathematically speaking, but I’m sure you know best.

And it took this long to get an honest, concrete reply because…er, why, exactly?

Tyber Valens.5148:

Except it isn’t the same thing. Anet is saying we need to pre-purchase to get the extra character slot. If we don’t purchase HoT, we don’t get the slot. That isn’t the same as getting the extra slots when purchasing Factions and Nightfall. We got them regardless of pre-ordering.

The whole thing just stinks.

Exactly. I was perfectly willing to throw my fifty dollars at them upon release, but the fact that they want to put strings and conditions on something that is supposed to be an expression of appreciation for veterans is insulting.

I guess I’m only worthy of appreciation if I give them my money in advance. That kind of “appreciation” could not be any less sincere. Classy.

Gibson.4036:

To be fair, the extra character slot wasn’t added as an “extra”, it was added in response to a large uprising by players who felt it should be a given part of paying for an expansion.

And to answer a question above: Yes, if they added a new profession as a stand alone DLC, I would expect it to include a character slot in the cost. It’d be weird to double charge by paying to unlock the profession on my account, then require me to either delete a character I’ve already built up or pay again for the profession by purchasing a new slot.

(Bold emphasis mine)

I agree with you. And yet, that is exactly what ANet is doing come release day.

Mortifer.2946:

Not anymore, read news. Every veteran will get +1 character slot, on the top of the one slot that is already offered for deluxe and ultimate versions.

Not every veteran. Only the ones who pre-purchase the game. No thanks.

On another note, I really love how so many people in this thread (not directed at you, Mortifer) keep going on about how “entitled” we are for thinking the expansion should simply come with the flipping character slot without strings attached. If anyone in this situation is acting entitled, it is most certainly ANet, who seems to think they are entitled to my money before they even announce a release date, let alone provide the product they want me to pay them for.

Honestly, they have done their level best to try to pressure people to buy a character slot. They originally had no intention of including one at all in the basic version of HoT, and were only dragged kicking and screaming to the point we find ourselves at now, where they grudgingly agree to provide one IF, and ONLY IF, we give them our money before they provide the product.

I get that they are a business. I get that they need money to keep that business running. But they could have— in fact, should have — chosen to earn that money by providing us with the opportunity to purchase things from the gem store that we would enjoy. Instead they have chosen to release a product with less than we will need in the hope that we will pay them even more money to get full use of this product. This just creates a feeling of resentment on my part. It feels like a greedy rip-off.

Yes, they need cash, but it’s not like Collin is out in the company parking lot collecting empty pop cans for the deposit money so they can pay their electric bill. They aren’t desperate, even though this move kind of makes it look like they are.

Sogradde.8016:

Arachnophobia is the discrimination of spiders then?

Sigh. Words have meanings. You can look up those meanings in a dictionary. Again, from Merriam-Webster:

“arachnophobia
: pathological fear or loathing of spiders”

Anyway, back on topic, I think Sya is a great addition to the cast of NPC’s. It’s just a small bit of diversity added to the game, and I (and many others) appreciate it.

Sogradde.8016:

I have a hard time understanding where people get the “homophobia” and “transphobia” from because nobody is scared by gay people.

From one page back:

Merriam-Webster defines “homophobia” as:

" irrational fear of, aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or homosexuals"

Please note the “aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or homosexuals” part. Can we please stop pretending that the word homphobia doesn’t apply simply because one isn’t “afraid” of gay people?

“Homophobia” is a compound word. That’s when you put two words together so that the combined word takes on a new meaning of it’s own. In this case, “phobia” is not meant to only mean “fear”.

So yes, if someone has an aversion to the entire group of people who identify as gay, or discriminates against the entire group of people who identify as gay, it does mean that person is homophobic, whether or not they experience fear as a component of their homophobia.

Harper.4173:

So not caring is no longer neutral basically. I cannot separate myself from this issue and am forced to take a side.

If the question is “do you oppose it” and I answer no people will automatically assume I support it. I want the situation where I don’t do either. What do you call that?

I see your point, but I have to wonder why you would worry so much about what other people assume your answer to mean if you truly, actually do not care. It’s not as if you owe anyone access to your deepest thoughts and beliefs.

In that kind of a situation, where someone finds themselves being grilled about their political beliefs, it is entirely acceptable to simply diffuse the situation by smiling and saying something to the effect of “Oh no, I never talk politics in social situations.” If someone persists in grilling you after that, they’re being incredibly rude and deserve what they get.

I guess this is one of those things where you can’t really have it both ways. You can keep your views private (since they aren’t anyone else’s business no matter what they happen to be), or you can air them in public and deal with how other people may react. There simply is no option to be able to say what you want and not have others form an opinion about whatever it is that you just said.

Ithilwen.1529:

No neutrality isn’t a good position at the moment, when in many places my life would be under threat simply for who I am.

I totally get what you’re saying here, and I want to clarify that I don’t mean neutrality as in people should feel completely neutral about the subject of discrimination and personal safety.

But if society was truly neutral about the subject of transgender people, you wouldn’t have to be afraid to walk down any street, because no one would care that you are transgender.

That’s the kind of neutrality I mean. The kind where we are all free to just be who we are and it’s no big deal. Sorry if my contribution to the neutrality issue came off differently.

Harper.4173:

I fear that’s not how things will be.

If in a room of people I’m asked if I support gay people ( rights, equality, anything really) and I were to answer no – how exactly will people label me?

Will I be “that guy who doesn’t care about things” or will I be instantly demonized?

I’m pretty sure we both know the answer to that one.
We can’t have this neutrality since people are somewhat demanding you support their side.

Let’s explore that for a moment.

If your answer to the question you posed was that you don’t actively take action to support gay people, simply because you have other interests and passions in your life that occupy your time, I don’t think you would be demonized. Nor should you be.

I mean, I don’t do work on behalf of cancer fundraising, but that doesn’t mean I oppose people raising money for cancer reasearch, right?

But what if the question you were asked in a room full of people was “Do you oppose gay people” (rights, equality, etc.). That is an entirely different question; and I’m afraid that if someone were to give the answer that yes, they actively oppose equal rights for gay people, then the reaction would most likely be unfavorable.

Because someone not wanting others to have the same rights they have is pretty callous and selfish. (In my opinion, at least) And, it is worth noting, it’s also not at all a truly neutral position.

Harper.4173:

What if people just don’t care?
What if someone doesn’t consider you special. What if the plight of an individual (however justified and difficult it might be) is simply irrelevant to another.

I feel there’s no “neutral” state – you’re either allied or opposed.

That’s actually, in my opinion, the most optimal state. True neutrality. Someone who is truly neutral couldn’t be homophobic, since they lack any reason to fear, be averse to, or discriminate against gay people.

Neutrality is where I hope the world is heading.

CorrynnStarr.7942:

With the recent media hype over the LGBT community and how it needs special treatment…

And by “special”, you mean “equal”, right?

Harper.4173:

So how exactly does one discriminate against something by disliking it?

You don’t. Not liking something isn’t discrimination. Nor does the definition from Merriam-Webster imply that it is.

Harper.4173:

Also aversion is a strong word – what if you dislike something but not as strongly. There are all sorts of things wrong with that definition.

If one is only slightly averse to gay people, then I suppose they are only slightly homophobic. There is a spectrum. Not everyone who is merely mildly uncomfortable with the notion of homosexuality is a frothing hate-monger.

Harper.4173:

Also I feel that you might want to cut the “entire” part out of your statement. By that logic you can dislike and discriminate 99% of said category and still be outside your definition if you’re nice to 1% of it.

By “entire” I simply meant that if you object to gay people as a group of people simply because they are gay, rather than simply disliking a single gay person, who you may dislike simply because they happen to be a jerk. Sorry if I was unclear.

Sarevok.2638:

Then why is the character’s choice “brave”? Why not “Oh nice” or “Hope it works for you” or “So how about Lion’s Arch?”

Let’s say that after a near-death experience you re-evaluate your life and decide to quit your job and move halfway around the world to start a new life. That would be a pretty brave thing to do, would it not?

Any radical life change can be considered “brave”. That fact that the dialogue choice mentions that her decision is brave does not have to automatically be attributed to mean “brave because the citizens of Tryia will now judge and discriminate against you, because, politics and stuff.”

If you choose to interpret it that way, that’s on you. But don’t blame others for bringing in “real life” story elements that aren’t actually there.

Harper.4173:

If I dislike something -regardless of what it is or isn’t – that doesn’t automatically means I’m scared of it and I want it to not exist.

Merriam-Webster defines “homophobia” as:

" irrational fear of, aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or homosexuals"

Please note the “aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or homosexuals” part. Can we please stop pretending that the word homphobia doesn’t apply simply because one isn’t “afraid” of gay people?

“Homophobia” is a compound word. That’s when you put two words together so that the combined word takes on a new meaning of it’s own. In this case, “phobia” is not meant to only mean “fear”.

So yes, if someone has an aversion to the entire group of people who identify as gay, or discriminates against the entire group of people who identify as gay, it does mean that person is homophobic, whether or not they experience fear as a component of their homophobia.

Sarevok.2638:

Ok, I’m getting pretty ticked by this.

And why should this be brought into this VIDEO GAME, why? It’s a form of ESCAPISM, enjoyment, FUN. Those themes are not fun, they are horrendous harsh realities and are being brought into the game by the very people complaining about them because they think this minor NPC sends a message.

Yeah, this argument needs to stop. The existence of a transgender NPC in-game is not a “horrendous harsh reality”.

For some people who may be struggling with transgender issues in real life, seeing a happy, healthy, and productive transgender person in-game is a form of “ESCAPISM, enjoyment, and FUN” for them.

None of the characters in-game are complaining about her, there is no storyline about transgender issues. NONE of what you are claiming to be bothered by is actually IN THE GAME.

Baconplease.1657:

If my prerogative is game balance and that is weird, then what does that make this thread? I’m done now. The hive mind here is like talking to a wall. Goodbye.

Wow, three posts in the span of 20 minutes. This thread can’t be that unimportant if it’s got you riled up this much.

The Hive Mind bids you farewell.

Baconplease.1657:

This is not important.

But hey, thanks for taking the time to bump the thread anyway! Twice. Much appreciated!

Khristophoros.7194:

I think what he meant was “leave behind current IRL issues that people talk about incessantly”

I doubt it. War and politics are two major things that are current IRL issues that people talk about all the time that are present in the world of GW2 and people don’t seem to have a problem with that.

But a gay, lesbian, or trans character shows up and suddenly people are like “OMG, real life, oh noes!”

Let’s be honest. This excuse of “I have no problem with X-group of people, I just don’t want to see them in-game because Real Life” is a pretty weak excuse, and no one is buying it.

Rukhas.2597:

Minbariguy, you have something of importance to say?

Yes. And I have already said it.

Sarevok.2638:

That is NOT it and is a very dangerous viewpoint to take.

Care to elaborate? In what way is my viewpoint dangerous?

Edit to add: Look at the posts directly above and below me (by Rukhas and Sogradde respectively, in case these posts are deleted later). I rest my case.

Dashingsteel.3410:

Only one side of the debate was asked to be respectful.

Maybe that’s because the motivation of one side of the debate is to defend the rights of people to live their lives free of harassment or judgement, while the motivation of the other side of the debate is simply to defend the rights of people to harass and judge them? The two sides are not ethically equivalent.

Just a thought.

Kury.8210:

Anyhow, thanks again for the conversation. I’m not sure if we ended up in agreement, but you seem like a good person.

Ditto. And maybe we didn’t exactly agree on all points, but it’s much more important that we were able to respect each other. Cheers!

Kury.8210:

I guess the real reason I felt I had to type up this response is due to two factors in my own relationship. First, it feels like it implies what we had shared for over a year was never real. Second, I very much valued the experiences I had. I had reached the conclusion that despite how it ended, I would not have done it differently. I understand this is partially what I want to believe, thus is not evidence for or against, but if the relationship was simply a result of pressure from society and not a choice… That’s harsh. That’s really harsh.

Sorry, I definitely did not mean to imply that your entire relationship was based on societal pressures. You’re right, that would be an incredibly harsh thing to say, and it’s not what I meant.

For various (unfortunate) reasons, sometimes lgbt people get into heterosexual relationships. The fact that they are lgbt doesn’t mean that they don’t love the person that they’re with, only that they are not physically attracted to them. Further complicating the matter is that there is an entire spectrum of attraction, the middle of which would be considered bisexual.

I think because bisexual people are capable of being attracted to either gender, many people confuse it with people they presumed were 100% heterosexual suddenly choosing to be gay.

In any case, for what it’s worth, although I disagree with you strongly about the “choice” aspect of this discussion, I totally respect the way you reacted to the situation you found yourself in. You handled it a lot better than most would have, in my opinion.

Edit to add:

I have muddled my own argument a bit by using the moniker “lgbt”, since the “b” specifically refers to bisexual people. This of course makes no sense when I go on to say that lgBt people are not physically attracted to their partners in a heterosexual relationship. Obviously I meant to refer to gay and lesbian people. Sorry!

Bloodstealer.5978:

… I guess the question that comes to mind for me is.. if that can and does happen in RL why then would we all want that to creep into something we’re likely sitting at home playing away from reality as well, I don’t think I would look forward to logging in so much for sure.

I’m not sure I understand this comment. What exactly are you referring to when you ask whether we want “that” to creep into our game? It’s not like the NPC’s of Lion’s Arch are going to come running up to you shouting racist or homophobic expletives.

If you’re talking about other players in map chat, well, people say offensive things all the time. You block, report, and move on.

Kury.8210:

I know a big debate is over whether it’s a choice or not, and maybe for some there isn’t a choice. But for some it is and opinions can be swayed.

No. Just, absolutely, no. I am sincerely sorry for what you went through, but sexual orientation is not a choice.

In a better world, your girlfriend would never have felt pressured to “fit in” by getting involved with someone of a gender she was not oriented to be with. And you would have been spared that pain. But spreading the misconception that one’s orientation is a choice implies that anyone who is heterosexual can simply choose to be attracted to someone of the same gender.

Can you do that? Can you simply flip a mental switch, look at a picture of another guy, and find him attractive? If you can’t (and believe me, you can’t), then surely you can realize that no one else can do it, either.

I’m not picking on you. I think it’s a real shame what you went through. Anyone would have been hurt by that.

I think the inclusion of a transgender character is fantastic. And it’s important to note that players are not being exposed to “real world” controversy in-game, since no one in Tryia makes an issue about it. I could understand people being uncomfortable if there was an entire storyline where NPC’s were picketing and protesting for transgender rights in Lion’s Arch, but this just isn’t the case.

I posted the following in a discussion on another site, but it applies here as well:

It just seems like people who complain about “real world” “angenda”-type stuff in their games are contradicting themselves.

On the one hand, they claim they don’t want to see unpleasant political stuff in their games, but then when you try to immerse them in a game world where transgender people (or gay or lesbian or whatever other appropriate minority) exist WITHOUT the nasty unpleasantness…

Well, they don’t want to see THAT either. Funny, that.

And let’s give a nod to Bobby and Rubi too, who both seem to communicate as much as they are permitted to.

TJgalon.5012:

It cost money to keep this game running. It played on servers, that cost money. you pay a one time fee, and still playing. Sometimes some player donate to them and earn gems, other do not, and now a new expansion is out, which took, who knows how long to makle, employee, and all that, and they set a price. Fair enough, 50$ is a lot, but dont buy it then if you feel the price is unfair. You can still contune to plkay everything else you have normally.

Yes, but if they need money so badly, then presumably they would like the fifty dollars that I am willing to pay them for HoT at the time of release, yes? And all they have to do to get my fifty dollars is make sure a character slot is included at the time of release.

That’s it. Just one simple character slot and I’m happy. That’s all it would take.

Doesn’t seem to me like they really want my money too badly, then.

Edit to add:
I do understand that they want to give people incentives to pre-purchase, and I don’t have a problem with giving people who pre-purchase some extras. The problem for me occurs when what is being given as an exclusive “extra” is something that I regard as a basic requirement for purchase.

For me, a character slot is a required feature in any expansion that features a new profession. I will not purchase it without one, especially at the fifty dollar price point.

I mean, go ahead and heap mini-pets, weapon skins, costumes, toys and whatnots on all who pre-purchase. I don’t mind them getting all that stuff that I won’t. But to deny launch purchasers a character slot?

Just really bad form.

scerevisiae.1972:

Revyn.8961:

No pre-purchase, no free character slot.

i’m sure they wouldn’t be so stupid to restrict it to pre-purchase-only, else this will all start again, only even more virulently.

Well, they have restricted it to pre-purchase only, and most people seem pretty happy with it. I really don’t think this is going to blow up again.

Revyn.8961:

Lol! Exactly. But right about that time, the announcement for Guild Wars 3: Cantha will come out …

Well, sure, the announcement, but it’ll be another 7 years after that for GW3 to actually release. :-P

[EDIT to add: ]

…but don’t worry, you can pre-purchase GW3 next month.

I kid! I kid!

Khristophoros.7194:

What I’m upset about is they’re only including the character slot for preorders so I feel bullied into it even though I much prefer not to preorder. I don’t like the concept of preordering. I want to decide after the product comes out if it’s worth the price.

Yeah, I figure if there’s not a character slot in the basic version of HoT when it is released (and it sounds like there won’t be, unless something changes) then I’ll probably just end up waiting a good 9 to 12 months until the price drops. There are other games to play in the interim.

By that time, even if I have to pay ten bucks for a character slot it will most likely still be a lot cheaper than fifty dollars. I can wait.

I honestly don’t mind them packaging all previously existing content and expansions with any new expansions that come out.

I have found myself passing on games simply because the barrier to entry was too high when I realized how many expansions I would have to purchase to be current. I think this will help foster a healthy population as the game ages.

Elia.7193:

So if we don’t pre purchase , we don’t get the character slot?

Correct.

Random.4691:

All valid, and I’m hoping by the last day of Pre-Purchase I have more info that entices me. Small victories are better than no victories, live to fight another day, this isn’t the hill you want to die on, all that stuff.

Yep. :-) I absolutely agree that the situation has been greatly improved, and it seems like most people are pleased with the bonus to a pre-purchase. It may not be the result I wanted, but it works for a lot of people, so I’ll just be glad for them. lol

Fernling.1729:

No pitchfork here. I just don’t think Anet should be put on a pedestal for fixing something that should never have been a problem in the first place.

I really do appreciate that they are willing to make changes based on customer feedback, I just don’t like the extent the playerbase has to take it to actually make it happen.
People were warning/begging/asking Anet months and months ago about adding a character slot to the expansion. If they really wanted to listen they probably should have done it then. Not when they see bad press and go into damage control. At this point they’re only doing it because it’s in their best interest.

^^^This.^^^

As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, it really does feel like they are doing the absolute bare minimum they could possibly get away with doing to address player concerns.

I don’t know. It just feels like ANet never does anything nice without some kind of “catch”.

Like Living Story season one, for example:
Yay, more story, and free content! (Catch: You can only play it when we want you to and if you miss it, too bad, it’s gone)

Or Living Story season two:
Yay! I can play it at my own pace! (Catch: But only if you’re level 80. Oh, and if you don’t log in during an event, too bad, you’ll have to pay gems for it later)

And now this.
Yay! They’re going to give us the character slot we told them we wanted. (Catch: But only if we give them our money before we actually know what we’re buying)

I realize the word I’m about to use here is an exaggeration, but I can’t help feeling frequently manipulated. It seems like simply giving them my money isn’t enough anymore, they also seem to expect me to jump through their hoops, and to do so on their timeline, not my own. It just…doesn’t feel good.

I’ll purchase (or not) HoT when I am ready, not when ANet tells me to. And since a simple character slot is a pretty basic feature for an expansion pack that features a new profession, it would be nice if ANet just gave the slot with the basic version, no matter when it is purchased.

But yeah, I know. There’s always a catch.

Spleen.7836:

I still feel it was a bad move to try to sell the expac without a new slot from the beginning, but i’m thankful you are correcting that.
I’m still not sure that the xpac worth its price, but there is nothing wrong about that, nothing force us to pre-purchase it.

Except that it doesn’t really sound like they are correcting that, unless you pre-purchase. If you want to wait until it’s finished and released so that you know exactly what you’re getting, they’re not going to give you a character slot.

I appreciate the response from ANet, and I definitely feel as though it was a positive move, but I don’t think it’s really going to benefit me in any way. I doubt I’ll be willing to purchase HoT until it’s released, and I most definitely will not spend fifty dollars on an expansion pack that doesn’t come with a character slot.

Sigh. Still looks like a no-buy for me at this point. But I’m glad others are pleased.

Okay, so, to be clear…if we wait until after release to purchase HoT, we don’t get a character slot? The character slot is only a pre-order bonus?

Ohoni.6057:

Wow, the shear volume of “I’m a Mr. Bigshot wbho spends millions of dfollars on GW2, but this $10 price differenc eof opinions is the LAST straw and I’m never playing again until they give me the price I want, which I’m sure they’ll do before I cave because I’m suchb a big-shot customer” posts is just depressing. Every time I start to think that humanity is getting a little bit better. . .

Then perhaps it is time that you backed away from this discussion?

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Basandra’s kind of response really boggles me. No where, any where, have I said I’m being forced to do anything nor do I feel I’m missing out. Nor am I having a ‘mental breakdown’ nor I am following ‘the rest of the fools on the forum.’ Nice job insulting an entire community by the way.

Yeah, I love how Basandra posts things like

I pity society and the direction it’s going in.

AND

Frankly I dont know why I bother with these threads, other than to prove to myself every once in a while why I have little faith or empathy for society.

and still feels level-headed enough to accuse others of having a mental breakdown. That there’s some irony.

Leo G.4501:

Again, this practice isn’t illegal nor is it really mean-spirited. It happens and is usually a tactic to get more people to use the service.

It also isn’t illegal or mean-spirited to ask for a better value (I know you didn’t say that it was, but hear me out for a sec, lol).

A few years back I realized that I wasn’t really comfortable with what I was paying my cellphone carrier, so I found a better deal elsewhere. When I called the company to cancel my cellphone service, they were suddenly very interested in saving me money to keep me as a customer. Miraculously, they were able to switch me to a “loyal customer” plan that was not only cheaper, but gave me more minutes.

Obviously, they would not have lifted a finger to give me a better value had I not contacted them.

Another example. My mother called her cable television company to express how unhappy she was with her rates going up. To persuade her to remain a customer, they lowered her monthly bill for a period of 6 months. Again, this only happened because she took it upon herself to ask for a renegotiated rate.

Yes, there are lots of companies (like your gym) that have various promotions that award certain advantages to one group or another at various times. But many of these companies (the smart ones, at least) also understand the need to be flexible and responsive to what their customers are willing to pay for their service.

ANet, as a company, can also choose to be responsive to customer concerns regarding the value of the service they are selling. But they aren’t going to do this out of the goodness of their hearts. We have to let them know how we feel.

And that’s what the community is doing, all over the internet.

Edit to add:

Ricky.4706:

“I’ve learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” – Maya Angelou

I’ve heard this quote before, and it is so, so true. ANet should engrave this on a plaque and hang it on their office wall.

Greyhound.2058:

I’m glad the silence from Anet is deafening. It should be. I preordered and prepaid for the ultimate edition, and I’m very happy with all the perks that come with that.

I don’t want those perks that I paid so much extra for to start being doled out for free to people who’ve bought the cheapest ‘basic’ package. You want the perks? Pay for them then. If you don’t think it’s worth it, don’t buy it.

But if ANet does rework the expansion packages and they happen to add something extra to the package you’ve already prepurchased, I’m sure you won’t want that either, right? In fact, I’m sure you’ll just delete it, whatever it is, since you only want what you paid for.

Right?