Guild Wars 2

Moshari.8570:

danielrjones.8759:

I’ve read they were leaving several times a day on every site I went to about GW2.

It is clearly Anets fault people didn’t take the time to read about these changes. The least they could have done was go to each persons house and fed the information to them with a spoon.

What is funny to me, all the people who claim to never have time to read the forums are the first groups of people to post on the forums when they screw up.

Please point these postings out to me? I missed them….since I can only find the single post in the "news and anouncements’ from 6 days ago.

Communication was the problem. Like I have said numerous times…this doesn’t really affect me one way or another, had they actually done a decent job of getting the message out there, I would be right there arguing with you instead of against you. I don’t think they did a good enough job of getting the communication out there.

And…bringing the merchants back is just a nice thing to do. It doesn’t affect anyone who used their currency already in any way whatsoever. It simply allows people who didn’t see the obscure communication a chance to use theirs. It is simply a nice thing for a company to do to their customers who played their content.

Once again, this is not granting anything to anyone who didn’t play the content….it is not bringing back the places to get the heirlooms or belongings…it is rewarding the players who played the content…but failed to read a notice.

I think this post sums it up pretty nicely.

Moshari.8570:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Moshari.8570:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Moshari.8570:

Strawman meet JustTrogdor.7892

Look ^^^ I use over used Internet forum terms. LOL ^^^

OR….its a factual term for what you did with your argument: http://www.asa3.org/ASA/education/think/strawman.htm

Rather than answer my question in what way it would hurt you…you used a “straw man argument” drastically ramping up the importance of your position to a ridiculous degree.

Nice link but you are wrong and misusing it. What’s next are you going to accuse me of logical fallacies? Maybe post a meme or something. LOL

The post you quoted wasn’t even answer to a question to start with.

do you want another link? http://www.wisegeek.org/what-is-a-straw-man-argument.htm

That’s cute and doesn’t do anything to solidify your argument. But I imagine this is one of those, “I’ll get the last word kitten it!” arguments. Have fun with that.

The vendors won’t be back. Call it strawman all you want. The post of mine you quoted as “strawman” wasn’t even in response to anything you asked. I cashed in all my event items before the update and kept my blade shards. I win. LOL

JustTrogdor.7892:

Moshari.8570:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Moshari.8570:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Moshari.8570:

Strawman meet JustTrogdor.7892

Look ^^^ I use over used Internet forum terms. LOL ^^^

OR….its a factual term for what you did with your argument: http://www.asa3.org/ASA/education/think/strawman.htm

Rather than answer my question in what way it would hurt you…you used a “straw man argument” drastically ramping up the importance of your position to a ridiculous degree.

Nice link but you are wrong and misusing it. What’s next are you going to accuse me of logical fallacies? Maybe post a meme or something. LOL

The post you quoted wasn’t even answer to a question to start with.

do you want another link? http://www.wisegeek.org/what-is-a-straw-man-argument.htm

That’s cute and doesn’t do anything to solidify your argument. But I imagine this is one of those, “I’ll get the last word kitten it!” arguments. Have fun with that.

The vendors won’t be back. Call it strawman all you want. The post of mine you quoted as “strawman” wasn’t even in response to anything you asked. I cashed in all my event items before the update and kept my blade shards. I win. LOL

OMG! I cashed in my items before the update (sheer puter luck on that, though) AND kept all my shardies… oooh I WIN!!! What do I win? Never mind, I WIN…OMG I WIN…I AM A WINNER!!!!!!!

Faints…..

Cool! I just got this in-game mail saying that my points in WvW had been refunded! I didn’t have to check the forum or anything! I just got informed in a helpful way that something had happened that affects my character. Wasn’t that nice? Whodathunk?

Celtic Lady.3729:

kotgewitter.3657:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Moshari.8570:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Moshari.8570:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Moshari.8570:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Look, you were given a window to spend heirlooms. It was advertised and promoted in the last week. Just because you were or were not thinking about what to spend them on does not matter. You didn’t spend them within that window, sorry you lose out.

“Advertised and promoted” would imply that they put it out there everywhere so that no one would miss it, rather than a single post in the “news and announcements” section of the forum. Had they placed it in the Login section of the game, I would have seen it. Had they done an in-game email, I would have seen it. Had they made an announcement in ALL of the relevant forums (such as this one and the living story one, and the general game one) I would have seen it. And had they done all of that advertising and promotion…I would be right there with you agreeing with you 100% But I feel that if I missed it….and I visit the forums at least once every other day, I read every announcement on the login screen (even about gem-store items), I read every in-game mail and actually talk to vendors and surrounding people…If I missed it…then there were a TON of people that never saw it at all.

I would not call what they did “Advertised and promoted”…..I would call it “Mentioned”. SO you cannot blame people for missing it and simply say “it was out there”

That reminds me of “hitchhikers guide to the galaxy” when they are destroying the earth to make a new transgalactic highway and the humans are saying “WTF??” and the aliens simply say…“Hey, the form was filed with the galactic central office, it was located, on display in subbasement 57 of the galactic central offices. Its not our fault you did not have the means to travel between the stars to go and see it.”

Bookmark the following links in your browser. That way you don’t miss updates:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates

but if I only check those….I would have also gotten rid of all of my blade shards….since they told me to keep those in a different forum.

And what if I don’t read the forums? Like I said, also speaking for several of my guildmates who are stuck with stacks of these as well….one played with me last night and planned on jumping on this morning to use his (just in case) (which truthfully I did also)…but missed out opportunity because this time, they patched early.

I would count this as “player error”. Just because you missed a confirmation from a Dev forum post, doesn’t mean the company should bend over backwards to assist you. Here’s another link you may want to bookmark in your browser:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/devtracker

I actually do read devtracker….however its easy to miss something in there when the devs are posting a LOT (for bugs etc)….because, I missed it there.

To all the people arguing against it…in what way does it hurt you to bring the vendor back for a week? Or to add it to the new “blade shards” vendor that is supposedly coming?

Just curious why some people are arguing so hard that ANET should not bring the vendors back….to be honest, it really doesn’t hurt me much…I probably missed out on like 8 obsidian shards from all the belongings I had….and I have 6 million karma I could spend on that….but I am arguing FOR it for the people that missed out. So I am curious why some people are arguing against it?

It’s not fair for those who do read Dev posts, and subsequently turn in all our trophies in a timely manner.

If every player knew about the time limit, then it could be “not fair” for those who did it in a timly manner.
Or you can call it unfair for the player who farmed those items and cannot use them anymore.
But I think, if the majority of players don´t even know about the time limt, then there shouldn´t be a question abot “Fair or not fair?”. This a problem with the communication between anet and the players. If they have an important change, which directly affects the player, why dont announce it in the patch-notes or send everyone a short letter? My personal favorite is a small pop-up-window ingame, so it doesn´t spam the mailbox.
With that even those players who don´t use the forum or don´t use twitter (or whatever) and are playing GW maybe once every 2/3 weeks will know it.

The fairness non-argument makes no sense and never did. There are better ways to communicate and I assume Anet is learning from their mistakes as they go.

That would make sense, if there was a mistake to begin with.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Cool! I just got this in-game mail saying that my points in WvW had been refunded! I didn’t have to check the forum or anything! I just got informed in a helpful way that something had happened that affects my character. Wasn’t that nice? Whodathunk?

To be fair, this kind of outrage would have been magnified on a scale of thousands because the WvW points affects a larger player base and has more of an investment.

Just saying.

cortin.9174:

I also support giving players ways to keep obtaining blade shards for another week.

Blade Shards are obtainable permanently from Aetherblades and the mystic forge.

kotgewitter.3657:

Moshari.8570:

danielrjones.8759:

I’ve read they were leaving several times a day on every site I went to about GW2.

It is clearly Anets fault people didn’t take the time to read about these changes. The least they could have done was go to each persons house and fed the information to them with a spoon.

What is funny to me, all the people who claim to never have time to read the forums are the first groups of people to post on the forums when they screw up.

Please point these postings out to me? I missed them….since I can only find the single post in the "news and anouncements’ from 6 days ago.

Communication was the problem. Like I have said numerous times…this doesn’t really affect me one way or another, had they actually done a decent job of getting the message out there, I would be right there arguing with you instead of against you. I don’t think they did a good enough job of getting the communication out there.

And…bringing the merchants back is just a nice thing to do. It doesn’t affect anyone who used their currency already in any way whatsoever. It simply allows people who didn’t see the obscure communication a chance to use theirs. It is simply a nice thing for a company to do to their customers who played their content.

Once again, this is not granting anything to anyone who didn’t play the content….it is not bringing back the places to get the heirlooms or belongings…it is rewarding the players who played the content…but failed to read a notice.

I think this post sums it up pretty nicely.

I second that. Bringing them back wouldn’t hurt anyone, except those who are clearly happy that some people didn’t turn in their heirlooms or belongings in time. Making their own items more valuable? Why do people need to take pleasure in other people’s mistakes? Why do they need to be mean? Consider that some players actually have a family, kids, and don’t have time to read the forums all the time. And someone above mentioned the search engine, that could greatly be improved… Finding information on the forums is not always that easy.

There is no living world content for this fortnight, it wouldn’t hurt to have the merchants back a few days. It doesn’t clash with any new content. Anet could do a gesture to these players. Show they care about all the players. Not just the ones who play all day and have spare time to skim the forums. But also those who have a life, a job, a family and made the mistake of choosing playing the game in the little sparetime they have, over spending hours looking for info on the forums every day. Are these players less valuable?

Smooth Penguin.5294:

That would make sense, if there was a mistake to begin with.

There was.

This is the only MMO I can think of where event vendors don’t hang out for a few days after the end of the event. Its sort of stupid. Or an underhanded way to sell more bank slots. Congrats you have a handful left over… or you didn’t log in for the last day of the event and have more then you are willing to toss. Don’t worry buy some more bank space… perhaps we will let you do something with them in a few months. Its cheesy frankly and one of the few things I honestly don’t like about Anets cash collection model.

I played very casually during whole event and almost made enough blade shards for ascended spinal blades ,but also stored few hundreds found belongings alng the way, I thought that i’ll just figure out how to spend them when the event is over. I was sure that the vendors will still be around, haven’t occured to me there can be any other way so i should ceck forums if they’ll be here or not. I can’t see a reason even now why they got removed. It’s against common sense, while the event was up ppl want to spend they time getting things, now they could just sit and think how to spend and what to do with evrything they accumulated.

For the sake of peace and sanity I’d rather see them keeping vendors around for longer. It doesn’t hurt anyone and usually they don’t clash with the new content anyway. Like, for the current update we just deal with the aftermath, L.A. is still in ruins and I don’t see why those vendors wouldn’t be around the refugee camps and collecting lost stuff.

@Moshari.8570 I’m not your momma. Do you own homework. I know I’ve seen it several places. If you do not wish to know more about the game you are playing that is on you. Not me.

danielrjones.8759:

@Moshari.8570 I’m not your momma. Do you own homework. I know I’ve seen it several places. If you do not wish to know more about the game you are playing that is on you. Not me.

Here is a rabbit with a pancake on its head for your trouble. This makes as much sense as your post.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-vG52VM1fYLU/TwrfG0i1hiI/AAAAAAAABhg/AAGIJgH_tVU/s1600/bunny_pancake.jpg

It would harm no one, it would not stress the system or break the game economy to leave a Found Belongings merchant hanging around for those of us who don’t read every Dev update to find out if our loot is suddenly going to be ganked, as opposed to that candy corn piled up in the bank…

Yeah, the Devs have shown me how clever they are and punished me for not reading each and every post they make. I hadn’t played GW2 for several months, and really got into it again as this event started. Got enthusiastic, even. Encouraging friends to have a go at it. Come home from work today, and the vendors are gone. I had to search around to find one brief post from a week ago saying the items would be useless the instant the event ended.

Well, guess what game I’m well and truly soured on now?

To bad it wasnt mentioned in game by say the very vendor that was removed.

maybe a few days or weeks before leaving he (the vendor etc)could announce when you talk to him that he intends to wrap up shop and leave soon so buy now or miss out etc etc…could have made it like a high pressure sales pitch …

also now that it is over and there is time before something else happens could have been the time people could dig in there bags/banks to cash in stuff and craft…

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/escape/Blade-shards-and-found-belongings-really/ I’ve made some arguments here in this thread. Particularly the last two posts.

Let’s sum up the situation:

- ANet did inform the players that the merchants will be removed—on a single forum post. Not website front page announcement, not game loader announcement, not in-game letters, not Living-Story release page, not twitter, not facebook. One single forum post that only forum-goers may notice.
– The Found belongings and heirlooms have already stopped dropping, and the exchanged items are mostly account-bound, therefore not lower the value of said items.
– There are no major consequences for ANet to re-implement the merchants, other than a group of players feel that it is unfair to ignore their enthusiasm and constant attention on every single ANet communication.
– There are already at least 4 threads about this subject matter, signifying that quite a number of players suffer from this communication problem.

Am I missing anything?

Well I got disoconected after the 10 min warning jumping to cash them in and then bang update all vendors gone.

I did know that this was going to happen but they should of been left in place for a while after the event as people are going to be collecting them right untill the end it just seems stupid to remove them with the end of event update.

Was gutted spent all day collecting bits and now they are useless.

In the past, Anet has made the mistake if putting information on places like Facebook and Twitter which is a terrible idea as there are many people who do not use such media. They have an official forum for official information. They should use that.

That being said, at least this time they DID post and they did post it in the RIGHT PLACE. (News and Announcements.)

There is no digging required, and the launcher does link to the forums.

Even if they put the information in the launcher we would have people here complaining because they set it to AutoPlay and never bother to look.

Personally I consider this a willful ignorance of the players. The information was there, it was in the right place, and it was timely. Those who did not get the memo did so on their own accord.

Drat! I didn’t know they were taking the Heirloom Merchants out with this patch. I had hoped I would have another day or two to turn them in. I haven’t had a lot of time to play lately and only just got the 250 needed yesterday before the patch. I literally just logged in an hour ago and found this out.

I’m sorry but just making a forum post about it and that’s it is lazy, when they could have easily sent out an e-mail or in game mail to players. Heck they could have put the time limit notice in the original patch notes so people would know from the start how much time they have.

I don’t know about you but I don’t tend to frequent the forums of games I like to play, if I can help it, simply because they are usually full of hostile and immature people (i.e. forum trolls)

It also seems like something that should have been posted on the “News” page of the actual website.

Oh well, the only thing we can hope for is that the “Trading” lady mentioned in the current release notes might have the potions for trade for blade shards, or that it will be come available another way in the future.

Kumu Honua.2751:

Personally I consider this a willful ignorance of the players. The information was there, it was in the right place, and it was timely. Those who did not get the memo did so on their own accord.

Well now this really sounds like that fragment form Hitchhiker’s guide to the galaxy.
When aliens want to build a space highway through the Earth and they just come with their space bulldozers do destroy our planet, they jus said that “the plans about the demolition were displayed for over 50 years, it’s your fault you never went to see them”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1WomfhjyVM

Zone.1275:

It’s not that it hurts anyone. It’s that it’s dumb to put effort in this because someone wasn’t paying attention. Next time try to be more vigilant.

So we should have to patrol the forums on a regular basis because the devs didn’t put a warning in game? I hate to break it to you, but
1. That’s a horrible way of getting the word out.
2. Some of us have lives and cannot afford to spend an hour every day patrolling forums because the devs decided against putting a warning in-game.

No, the devs already push out buggy unpolished content and the feature patch needs to get here asap. The last thing we need is to waste time trying to get a stupid vendor back that we were told was going away weeks go.

So, they add it back for a day or two, then we will see people that complain about missing those extra days as well and so on.

And in the end we will end up with everything needing to stay in forever, because otherwise “someone might miss it”.

Kumu Honua.2751:

That being said, at least this time they DID post and they did post it in the RIGHT PLACE. (News and Announcements.)

There is no digging required, and the launcher does link to the forums.

Even if they put the information in the launcher we would have people here complaining because they set it to AutoPlay and never bother to look.

I checked the launcher, there is no link that points to the announcement on removal of Found Belongings merchants.

And that is a big problem. A lot of these update patches and information only shows up in the forum, not on website front page or launcher’s bulletin board. I don’t think forum activities is a mandatory requirement for all GW2 players.

Sometimes I find ANet keep making fundamental mistakes that a seasoned game developer should not be making, whether it’s game design or in-game communication, it’s disappointing. Heck, they had GW1 for more than six years.

Moshari.8570:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Moshari.8570:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Moshari.8570:

I visit the forum almost every other day, and I also missed this announcement. I still don’t know where it was??? It definitely wasn’t obvious. So I am sitting on 8 stacks of found belongings with nothing to do with them.

Right here ‘News and Announcements’:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Update-Alliance-Supplies-Found-Items/

yup, that would explain it, rarely if ever read that part unless something is “down”..

That’s your problem and mistake.

Moshari.8570:

Maybe they need to standardize on their communication?

Yeah, like maybe putting things in the forum called, ‘News and Announcements’. Wait they did that.

Find me where they told people to keep their blade shards in “news and announcements” oh wait, they didn’t….which was my point. Maybe you need to read my post before getting snarky.

Nope, your right, they didn’t tell people to keep their blade shards in News and Announcements, that one was a response to a thread on this forum called What to do with Blade Shards. In the same thread they linked the announcement about Heirlooms and Belongings, so both of them did exist on this forum.

On top of that, they’re REALLY easy to find, all you have to do it check the handful of threads with red markings, then scroll down real fast until you find the posts with red markings. It would take maybe five minutes.

Tseikk.9032:

It took me until the patch day to get the money (i’m 15.) and yes. i decided to spend my money on gw2 instead of something else.

But if you got GW2 after the patch, you won’t have any heirlooms, so no harm done.

The reason to remove them is very simple: Item database brevity.
Long-term, there’ll be a patch in a year or so which flat out removes the heirlooms/belongings from everyone’s inventory and banks, freeing up two slots in the long list of items.

And why not? The event is done, the items outdated, bla.

Ofc you’re right, there’s no real harm at all in bringing the vendor back. Only if the knights showed one thing – for those who never did much development :P – it’s that the tiniest simplest change will end up breaking on the other side of the ocean, big time.

So patching that vendor back in… that might bring with it 2 days of full-team bugfixing. For something of extremely tiny value.

That is probably the reason not to do it.

Calys Teneb.7015:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Cool! I just got this in-game mail saying that my points in WvW had been refunded! I didn’t have to check the forum or anything! I just got informed in a helpful way that something had happened that affects my character. Wasn’t that nice? Whodathunk?

To be fair, this kind of outrage would have been magnified on a scale of thousands because the WvW points affects a larger player base and has more of an investment.

Just saying.

In the interest of “fairness” there was no reason to send a mail about WvW points, because it actually doesn’t effect your character in a meaningful way.

Yes you could go out and not have your point set and be at some disadvantage at whatever the thing is your points were set on, but you didn’t lose your points. If you didn’t know about it, because for some reason you don’t bother to read patch notes, you would realize that your seem to be doing less well than expected. You would check to see what bonuses you should be getting from your points and then also notice that your points are unspent. The alternative is that you wouldn’t even notice that there was a difference, then you would earn a point, go to spend it and realize you have all these other points to spend as well. In none of these scenarios did the refund really make a difference short of being something that happened.

The only true statement is that people would have complained about it, and probably ARE complaining about it anyway. They’re not complaining about the note, they’re complaining about the fact that now they have to figure out how their points were spent and respend them, or some other such nonsense.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

That would make sense, if there was a mistake to begin with.

There was.

It just wasn’t ANet’s mistake, and should not be their responsibility to fix.

But they shouldn’t be removed so soon in the first place, because as we can see from the amount of posts and grieviance in this threads ppl just assumed vendor will be still around to cash in leftovers after event stops. It’s not the question about was the anouncement easy to find or not; it’s that a lot of ppl havent considered that they would need to look for/ask if they would be able to sell found belongings right after event. They took it for granted that vendors would still be around for some time. And a lot of players just don’t visit the forums to every game they play, so they would stumble upon the post, just casually log in from time to time and play.
And i doubt that implementing vendors back would cause so much trouble and create many bugs.

Antaris.5281:

Let’s sum up the situation:

- ANet did inform the players that the merchants will be removed—on a single forum post. Not website front page announcement, not game loader announcement, not in-game letters, not Living-Story release page, not twitter, not facebook. One single forum post that only forum-goers may notice.

The website front page and the game loader are the same thing. And are never used for this purpose. Maybe they could be, but I personally would rather not have to wade through all the minor little updates in order to find that actual relevant news items, especially when that’s what the forums are for.

Twitter and Facebook should never be used for this kind of information, but then I don’t think they should be used for any kind of anything. So maybe I’m biased.

I don’t know what the Living-Story release page is supposed to indicate.

That leaves one single forum post in the news and announcements section of the forums, which if no other is used by average people this one should, especially coming on the end of an event, and a mail. Mail doesn’t make sense either, because the mail is used for things that have happened and are happening right then, not for things that will happen some time in the future. That’s why there are the forums. So, that leaves one post in the most obvious place, and is therefore the best choice.

- The Found belongings and heirlooms have already stopped dropping, and the exchanged items are mostly account-bound, therefore not lower the value of said items.

Other than a small handful they’re also basically junk items and not worth the effort to worry about.

- There are no major consequences for ANet to re-implement the merchants, other than a group of players feel that it is unfair to ignore their enthusiasm and constant attention on every single ANet communication.

Other than a small handful of people who failed to acquire some insignificant items of little actual worth. The value of restoring it doesn’t match the actual need for the restoration. I don’t understand your “consequence.” Should I say a small number of players feel that it is unfair that they should put in the smallest amount of effort to keep themselves informed because ANet does actually communicate these things?

- There are already at least 4 threads about this subject matter, signifying that quite a number of players suffer from this communication problem.

Am I missing anything?

And there are at least 5 threads, current and killed about AFK, and as many threads about “loss of equity” on Fractals. ANet handily ignored all of those too, for the same reason. An insignificant population of the game, complaining about an insignificant injury to their play, that no one will even care about, if they remember at all, in a month.

This is like waiting in line at the DMV and having some smug, sneering clerk say I’ve wasted my time.

“Applications signed in blue ink instead of black ink are rejected,” says the smug, sneering clerk.

“WHAT?”

“I announced that over the PA system a week ago. Tuesday, at 0800 hours.”

“I wasn’t here then!”

“Well, it was also on page 6 of the bulletin, posted over there on that wall.”

“There are SIX bulletin boards over there, and they’re all completely covered in all sorts of random stuff.”

“WELL, while you were filling out you application, you could have simply stopped and asked the people around you if we’d decided to stop accepting applications using blue ink.”

“Your saying it’s my responsibility to have just jumped up and asked random people if you were going too suddenly start rejecting any application done in blue ink?”

“Exactly.”

Seriously… for one thing, just vaporizing the heirlooms is bad storytelling. “Oh, the survivors just all decided they don’t want their heirlooms back, pitch ’em into the bay or something…”

The second thing, it’s lousy customer service.

Great job, ANet, you took a great event and soured it by choosing to be the smug, sneering clerk who gets to punish me for not reading page 6 of one bulletin on a whole wall full of random notes.

That’s the way to build and maintain player loyalty. Oh, I’m not deleting my characters and ragequitting, but you’ve changed GW2 from something I really looked forward to coming home and playing to something I’ll probably play when I’m bored with all the other new games coming out.

I honestly thought they’d just be there the first 2 weeks, grinded to get both potions to have something special and it ended up being there for 4 weeks.

OK, so some people missed the announcement, even though there WAS an announcement giving at least 6 days’ notice. That’s fine – we can’t catch everything that goes up on the forums, and we don’t always read the launcher text screen stuff.

BUT, that doesn’t take away from the fact that ANet did give us fair warning.

Now, as to the matter of whether it would harm anyone to bring the merchants back for a couple of days. Of course it wouldn’t. Makes no difference to the people who did turn in their stuff on time, and does make a difference to those who didn’t. But it’s a slippery slope. How many people will miss the extra two days of these merchants, for instance? Quite a few? And then how many of them will complain “but you brought it back for some, but I missed the announcement, bring them back again!” It will get ridiculous. And while they’re at it, we may as well ask them to bring back every limited time item ever and just make them all permanent because that way nobody ever has to miss out on anything ever again.

Yes, I’m exaggerating the end point, but it’s a slippery slope in that direction. And if it’s unfair that people missed out once, then it’s unfair people missed out twice etc. I missed Kasmeer’s staff skin in the gem store and waited and WAITED for it to come back. It did, one sale day in the gem store this month. Guess what? I didn’t play for two days that week and totally missed it. There wasn’t an official announcement, etc. So, I missed it again. Was I annoyed? For sure. But do I blame ANet? Of course not.

They screwed up by eliminating those merchants in the first place, so it’s perfectly fair to blame ANet. They also screwed up by relying on a single lousy post in a forum to inform folks of their rather draconian and utterly pointless intention to eliminate the vendors and heirlooms the very moment the event ended. In pretty much every game I’ve played, such vendors usually stay around for a while to let people collect their rewards.

There was no reason, on the story-side or technical side to simply gank those vendors, other than some body screwed up and didn’t bother to think it through.

It would have cost them nothing to leave the merchants in place for a week or two. It would cost them nothing to acknowledge that they’ve screwed up and to put them back in for a couple weeks.

A small effort to provide customer service, and it would please a great many people who didn’t know.

Just be patient. I’m sure they’ll regurgitate this content again. Battle for Lion’s Arch 2: Ceara’s Searing.

Just a point of advice, never play Neverwinter. It’s an alright game, but they will introduce a random new currency for a weekend, and then immediately remove the vendor for it at the end without question.

This is nothing.

Out of curiosity, if you have a value in excess of the most expensive item available, what is the point of holding onto it. You’re going to spend it on something, so why are you not doing so?

paynesgrey.8932:

They screwed up by eliminating those merchants in the first place, so it’s perfectly fair to blame ANet. They also screwed up by relying on a single lousy post in a forum to inform folks of their rather draconian and utterly pointless intention to eliminate the vendors and heirlooms the very moment the event ended. In pretty much every game I’ve played, such vendors usually stay around for a while to let people collect their rewards.

There was no reason, on the story-side or technical side to simply gank those vendors, other than some body screwed up and didn’t bother to think it through.

This is so right

CrossedHorse.4261:

OK, so some people missed the announcement, even though there WAS an announcement giving at least 6 days’ notice. That’s fine – we can’t catch everything that goes up on the forums, and we don’t always read the launcher text screen stuff.

BUT, that doesn’t take away from the fact that ANet did give us fair warning.

Now, as to the matter of whether it would harm anyone to bring the merchants back for a couple of days. Of course it wouldn’t. Makes no difference to the people who did turn in their stuff on time, and does make a difference to those who didn’t. But it’s a slippery slope. How many people will miss the extra two days of these merchants, for instance? Quite a few? And then how many of them will complain “but you brought it back for some, but I missed the announcement, bring them back again!” It will get ridiculous. And while they’re at it, we may as well ask them to bring back every limited time item ever and just make them all permanent because that way nobody ever has to miss out on anything ever again.

Yes, I’m exaggerating the end point, but it’s a slippery slope in that direction. And if it’s unfair that people missed out once, then it’s unfair people missed out twice etc. I missed Kasmeer’s staff skin in the gem store and waited and WAITED for it to come back. It did, one sale day in the gem store this month. Guess what? I didn’t play for two days that week and totally missed it. There wasn’t an official announcement, etc. So, I missed it again. Was I annoyed? For sure. But do I blame ANet? Of course not.

ANet shouldn’t bring back vendors because ppl are complaining, but because removing them as soon as event ended was a mistake on their side. And by that i dont think it qualifies for slippery slope you described.

Ponku.7925:

CrossedHorse.4261:

OK, so some people missed the announcement, even though there WAS an announcement giving at least 6 days’ notice. That’s fine – we can’t catch everything that goes up on the forums, and we don’t always read the launcher text screen stuff.

BUT, that doesn’t take away from the fact that ANet did give us fair warning.

Now, as to the matter of whether it would harm anyone to bring the merchants back for a couple of days. Of course it wouldn’t. Makes no difference to the people who did turn in their stuff on time, and does make a difference to those who didn’t. But it’s a slippery slope. How many people will miss the extra two days of these merchants, for instance? Quite a few? And then how many of them will complain “but you brought it back for some, but I missed the announcement, bring them back again!” It will get ridiculous. And while they’re at it, we may as well ask them to bring back every limited time item ever and just make them all permanent because that way nobody ever has to miss out on anything ever again.

Yes, I’m exaggerating the end point, but it’s a slippery slope in that direction. And if it’s unfair that people missed out once, then it’s unfair people missed out twice etc. I missed Kasmeer’s staff skin in the gem store and waited and WAITED for it to come back. It did, one sale day in the gem store this month. Guess what? I didn’t play for two days that week and totally missed it. There wasn’t an official announcement, etc. So, I missed it again. Was I annoyed? For sure. But do I blame ANet? Of course not.

ANet shouldn’t bring back vendors because ppl are complaining, but because removing them as soon as event ended was a mistake on their side. And by that i dont think it qualifies for slippery slope you described.

No, it wouldn’t, if they left them there a few days after the event ended. But that isn’t actually what this thread is about. This is about bringing them back once they’ve gone because people missed the announcement. If they did this, yes, it would be the beginning of a slippery slope.

Ponku.7925:

CrossedHorse.4261:

OK, so some people missed the announcement, even though there WAS an announcement giving at least 6 days’ notice. That’s fine – we can’t catch everything that goes up on the forums, and we don’t always read the launcher text screen stuff.

BUT, that doesn’t take away from the fact that ANet did give us fair warning.

Now, as to the matter of whether it would harm anyone to bring the merchants back for a couple of days. Of course it wouldn’t. Makes no difference to the people who did turn in their stuff on time, and does make a difference to those who didn’t. But it’s a slippery slope. How many people will miss the extra two days of these merchants, for instance? Quite a few? And then how many of them will complain “but you brought it back for some, but I missed the announcement, bring them back again!” It will get ridiculous. And while they’re at it, we may as well ask them to bring back every limited time item ever and just make them all permanent because that way nobody ever has to miss out on anything ever again.

Yes, I’m exaggerating the end point, but it’s a slippery slope in that direction. And if it’s unfair that people missed out once, then it’s unfair people missed out twice etc. I missed Kasmeer’s staff skin in the gem store and waited and WAITED for it to come back. It did, one sale day in the gem store this month. Guess what? I didn’t play for two days that week and totally missed it. There wasn’t an official announcement, etc. So, I missed it again. Was I annoyed? For sure. But do I blame ANet? Of course not.

ANet shouldn’t bring back vendors because ppl are complaining, but because removing them as soon as event ended was a mistake on their side. And by that i dont think it qualifies for slippery slope you described.

It does. They’re not doing it the way you think they should be doing it. They’re doing it the way they think they should be doing it. You want them to acquiesce to your way of thinking. They haven’t done it in the past, but if they do then why not all those other times? Why not bring those others backs. It’s exactly the same thing.

CrossedHorse.4261:

Ponku.7925:

CrossedHorse.4261:

OK, so some people missed the announcement, even though there WAS an announcement giving at least 6 days’ notice. That’s fine – we can’t catch everything that goes up on the forums, and we don’t always read the launcher text screen stuff.

BUT, that doesn’t take away from the fact that ANet did give us fair warning.

Now, as to the matter of whether it would harm anyone to bring the merchants back for a couple of days. Of course it wouldn’t. Makes no difference to the people who did turn in their stuff on time, and does make a difference to those who didn’t. But it’s a slippery slope. How many people will miss the extra two days of these merchants, for instance? Quite a few? And then how many of them will complain “but you brought it back for some, but I missed the announcement, bring them back again!” It will get ridiculous. And while they’re at it, we may as well ask them to bring back every limited time item ever and just make them all permanent because that way nobody ever has to miss out on anything ever again.

Yes, I’m exaggerating the end point, but it’s a slippery slope in that direction. And if it’s unfair that people missed out once, then it’s unfair people missed out twice etc. I missed Kasmeer’s staff skin in the gem store and waited and WAITED for it to come back. It did, one sale day in the gem store this month. Guess what? I didn’t play for two days that week and totally missed it. There wasn’t an official announcement, etc. So, I missed it again. Was I annoyed? For sure. But do I blame ANet? Of course not.

ANet shouldn’t bring back vendors because ppl are complaining, but because removing them as soon as event ended was a mistake on their side. And by that i dont think it qualifies for slippery slope you described.

No, it wouldn’t, if they left them there a few days after the event ended. But that isn’t actually what this thread is about. This is about bringing them back once they’ve gone because people missed the announcement. If they did this, yes, it would be the beginning of a slippery slope.

A slippery slope to correcting mistakes and providing good customer service? Might as well never patch or re-balance anything in response to players pointing out that it was screwed up.

paynesgrey.8932:

CrossedHorse.4261:

Ponku.7925:

CrossedHorse.4261:

OK, so some people missed the announcement, even though there WAS an announcement giving at least 6 days’ notice. That’s fine – we can’t catch everything that goes up on the forums, and we don’t always read the launcher text screen stuff.

BUT, that doesn’t take away from the fact that ANet did give us fair warning.

Now, as to the matter of whether it would harm anyone to bring the merchants back for a couple of days. Of course it wouldn’t. Makes no difference to the people who did turn in their stuff on time, and does make a difference to those who didn’t. But it’s a slippery slope. How many people will miss the extra two days of these merchants, for instance? Quite a few? And then how many of them will complain “but you brought it back for some, but I missed the announcement, bring them back again!” It will get ridiculous. And while they’re at it, we may as well ask them to bring back every limited time item ever and just make them all permanent because that way nobody ever has to miss out on anything ever again.

Yes, I’m exaggerating the end point, but it’s a slippery slope in that direction. And if it’s unfair that people missed out once, then it’s unfair people missed out twice etc. I missed Kasmeer’s staff skin in the gem store and waited and WAITED for it to come back. It did, one sale day in the gem store this month. Guess what? I didn’t play for two days that week and totally missed it. There wasn’t an official announcement, etc. So, I missed it again. Was I annoyed? For sure. But do I blame ANet? Of course not.

ANet shouldn’t bring back vendors because ppl are complaining, but because removing them as soon as event ended was a mistake on their side. And by that i dont think it qualifies for slippery slope you described.

No, it wouldn’t, if they left them there a few days after the event ended. But that isn’t actually what this thread is about. This is about bringing them back once they’ve gone because people missed the announcement. If they did this, yes, it would be the beginning of a slippery slope.

A slippery slope to correcting mistakes and providing good customer service? Might as well never patch or re-balance anything in response to players pointing out that it was screwed up.

It is neither a mistake, nor bad customer service to do what they did. It is their design policy. Nothing more. Whether you like it or not is irrelevant. Whether anyone lost anything as a result is irrelevant.

If a store is having a sale for a week and only announced it in one flier, which incidentally is readily available at the stores website which can also be accessed at a kiosk in the store itself, but you didn’t see it and missed it, so you couldn’t get the thing you wanted, would you demand they give you the sale price after the end of the sale? Would you continue to demand it after the cashier explained that it was over? Would you only be satisfied when you’ve bullied a manager into giving you the sale price even though you really don’t deserve it because it’s no longer running?

Do you know why he gives in? It’s not good customer service. It’s store policy to acquiesce to belligerent customers.

paynesgrey.8932:

CrossedHorse.4261:

Ponku.7925:

CrossedHorse.4261:

OK, so some people missed the announcement, even though there WAS an announcement giving at least 6 days’ notice. That’s fine – we can’t catch everything that goes up on the forums, and we don’t always read the launcher text screen stuff.

BUT, that doesn’t take away from the fact that ANet did give us fair warning.

Now, as to the matter of whether it would harm anyone to bring the merchants back for a couple of days. Of course it wouldn’t. Makes no difference to the people who did turn in their stuff on time, and does make a difference to those who didn’t. But it’s a slippery slope. How many people will miss the extra two days of these merchants, for instance? Quite a few? And then how many of them will complain “but you brought it back for some, but I missed the announcement, bring them back again!” It will get ridiculous. And while they’re at it, we may as well ask them to bring back every limited time item ever and just make them all permanent because that way nobody ever has to miss out on anything ever again.

Yes, I’m exaggerating the end point, but it’s a slippery slope in that direction. And if it’s unfair that people missed out once, then it’s unfair people missed out twice etc. I missed Kasmeer’s staff skin in the gem store and waited and WAITED for it to come back. It did, one sale day in the gem store this month. Guess what? I didn’t play for two days that week and totally missed it. There wasn’t an official announcement, etc. So, I missed it again. Was I annoyed? For sure. But do I blame ANet? Of course not.

ANet shouldn’t bring back vendors because ppl are complaining, but because removing them as soon as event ended was a mistake on their side. And by that i dont think it qualifies for slippery slope you described.

No, it wouldn’t, if they left them there a few days after the event ended. But that isn’t actually what this thread is about. This is about bringing them back once they’ve gone because people missed the announcement. If they did this, yes, it would be the beginning of a slippery slope.

A slippery slope to correcting mistakes and providing good customer service? Might as well never patch or re-balance anything in response to players pointing out that it was screwed up.

It’s only a mistake in this case if they also made it a million other times for every other patch update. I think they seem pretty good at admitting a big mistake (like with the removal of the boxes in the Secret Lair). So we’ll see what they think – if they do nothing, clearly they don’t consider it a mistake.

And letting everyone just have access to everything the whole time isn’t necessarily good customer service. Giving in to every little demand from every single customer isn’t necessarily good customer service. What if some of those demands conflict with each other? What if giving in meant you ended up not having resources for some other aspect which meant that the game folded? That’s not good customer services. Bringing back the vendors this once won’t lead to that necessarily, but it WILL start off a landslide of people saying “hey, but I missed X item at X event and you didn’t bring it back” and they’ll have to. Then someone else will start up … so yes, it’s a slippery slope and that’s not good customer service.

What about the people that were playing the content at the moment the patch was applied?

For instance, you were in Lion’s arch, finishing up the knights, had been playing there all morning when suddenly you get the warning “Patch in 10 minutes”.

“Oh crap” you think," I need to go open up all these bags and buy my rewards for playing this content that they provided to me! I’ll just run over to Lornars Pass and do that right now before my 10 minutes is up." You pick the waypoint at the Durman Priory and WHAM…you go to your desktop and start patching…

This is what a friend claimed happened to him…when he got back in the game he still had 500 bags to open and all the champ chests from the knights…but now couldn’t do anything with any of the currency.

This is why after an event ends, and after items stop dropping, you should keep your vendors around to let people to spend their earned currency.

Or, alternatively…they could have stopped the items from dropping for the 6 days after they announced the vendors were leaving, so that people were not still earning the currency for the event.

Either of these two things would have solved the problem. People would have spent their currency until there was no more currency to spend…and done. They wouldn’t have even had to make an announcement really, once the currency dried up people wouldn’t need the vendors anymore so they wouldn’t care that they were gone.

This would have also worked LORE-wise… you stopped finding heirlooms and personal belongings, because there were no more to find. The vendors collected the last of the remains and left.

There is no difference. You knew the patch was coming. You knew there was a chance that you could lose out on your stuff. You should have known that zoning after the announcement causes you to go patch.

As such you should have already spent what you could beforehand and been prepared to lose out on whatever you picked up afterward. Still not ANet’s problem.

Your analogy doesn’t quite fly. This isn’t “missing out a sale” so much as it is something like discontinuing a popular exchange or warranty policy, with the only notice being a single obscure blurb in a corner of the store’s webpage.

As for “It’s not good policy” to satisfy customers, I call bunk. They have an opportunity to recognize and fix a mistake in a way which takes absolutely nothing from the other customers who happened to check that obscure post on an obscure page to find out the was going to be suddenly and unexpectedly ended for no good reason.

Honestly, your argument reminds me of those Sony fans back in the old EQ days who got upset whenever people complained on the forums. “Don’t give in to the complainers! People like corpse runs and level-losses!”

Kal Spiro.9745:

paynesgrey.8932:

CrossedHorse.4261:

Ponku.7925:

CrossedHorse.4261:

OK, so some people missed the announcement, even though there WAS an announcement giving at least 6 days’ notice. That’s fine – we can’t catch everything that goes up on the forums, and we don’t always read the launcher text screen stuff.

BUT, that doesn’t take away from the fact that ANet did give us fair warning.

Now, as to the matter of whether it would harm anyone to bring the merchants back for a couple of days. Of course it wouldn’t. Makes no difference to the people who did turn in their stuff on time, and does make a difference to those who didn’t. But it’s a slippery slope. How many people will miss the extra two days of these merchants, for instance? Quite a few? And then how many of them will complain “but you brought it back for some, but I missed the announcement, bring them back again!” It will get ridiculous. And while they’re at it, we may as well ask them to bring back every limited time item ever and just make them all permanent because that way nobody ever has to miss out on anything ever again.

Yes, I’m exaggerating the end point, but it’s a slippery slope in that direction. And if it’s unfair that people missed out once, then it’s unfair people missed out twice etc. I missed Kasmeer’s staff skin in the gem store and waited and WAITED for it to come back. It did, one sale day in the gem store this month. Guess what? I didn’t play for two days that week and totally missed it. There wasn’t an official announcement, etc. So, I missed it again. Was I annoyed? For sure. But do I blame ANet? Of course not.

ANet shouldn’t bring back vendors because ppl are complaining, but because removing them as soon as event ended was a mistake on their side. And by that i dont think it qualifies for slippery slope you described.

No, it wouldn’t, if they left them there a few days after the event ended. But that isn’t actually what this thread is about. This is about bringing them back once they’ve gone because people missed the announcement. If they did this, yes, it would be the beginning of a slippery slope.

A slippery slope to correcting mistakes and providing good customer service? Might as well never patch or re-balance anything in response to players pointing out that it was screwed up.

It is neither a mistake, nor bad customer service to do what they did. It is their design policy. Nothing more. Whether you like it or not is irrelevant. Whether anyone lost anything as a result is irrelevant.

If a store is having a sale for a week and only announced it in one flier, which incidentally is readily available at the stores website which can also be accessed at a kiosk in the store itself, but you didn’t see it and missed it, so you couldn’t get the thing you wanted, would you demand they give you the sale price after the end of the sale? Would you continue to demand it after the cashier explained that it was over? Would you only be satisfied when you’ve bullied a manager into giving you the sale price even though you really don’t deserve it because it’s no longer running?

Do you know why he gives in? It’s not good customer service. It’s store policy to acquiesce to belligerent customers.

CrossedHorse.4261:

No, it wouldn’t, if they left them there a few days after the event ended. But that isn’t actually what this thread is about. This is about bringing them back once they’ve gone because people missed the announcement. If they did this, yes, it would be the beginning of a slippery slope.

Not exactly, i think this thread is more like: bring them back because removing them was a mistake. (because as we can see a lot of ppl havent considered even asking if vendors stays or not)
Let’s say that ANet would make that whatever server holds Stonemist Castle got a 1000% buff to stats in wvw, making it impossible for anyone to capture it again from them. It would be ANet design policy, so we should leave it at that? I dont think so, players would call it a mistake and want them to change their decision.