Guild Wars 2

So what are the best dungeon builds for each class. The ones that I know to be good (From my experience) are for guardian and mesmer only. I haven’t seriously done dungeons on other classes but I have all 8 4 of which are 80. So any input would be nice. Here is the build I use on my mesmer in dungeons.

10/30/0/30/0 Sword Focus/Sword Pistol (Mesmers need a good MH ranged weapon)
Dom: III (empowered illusions)
Dueling: IV, II, IX (Phantasmal Fury, Blade training, Duelists Discipline)
Inspiration: V (or IV), VIII, X (Menders purity (or persisting images), Wardens feedback, restorative mantras.
Gear is all Zerker, Runes are scholar.

Guardian: 0/25/0/20/25
Radiance: VI, X (Blinding exposure, Powerful blades)
Honor: II(or III), VII (Superior aria/writ of exaltation, and writ of persisitance)
Virtues: VI, IX (or X) Master of consecrations, And absolute resolution or indomitable courage.
Weapons Hammer, Sword/focus all zerker gear Runes of the eagle.

The goal of both builds is to capitalize on damage modifiers. I am curious what other builds are good for these classes as I am sure there are variations, and what builds are good for other classes. Please leave a link to a build and I will add it to the list.

Mesmer Build: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgAQRAsd8al4zioHSTqGa9IxpHRf5OnUBVX6Bu5duB-jwxAY/BRTQCERI0JvioxWcLiGruGT5SEVDA-e

Guardian: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fUAQNAS8dlUgyC33xMEf4ESODRCBtZAQHEmCMyjA-jwxAYfBZKSgICwJvioxW4KiGruGT5SEVLFwoCjA-e

If you have builds for other classes please post them below if you have suggestions to make to change or modify the above builds feel free to lemme know. Once again I am looking for optimal dungeon builds per class meaning the builds in each class that will help a party complete a dungeon fastest.

Neither of those builds are the best builds for their respective classes.

I believe this may be the highest sustained damage build for engineer (different trait could be switched for different situations).
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQJAqelIqiY3zSZF17IyYGk2EC+Ag95hc1WQIA-jwxAY/ASQAJRAJvioxWcLiGruGT5SEVDA-e

DEKeyzToChaos.7381:

Neither of those builds are the best builds for their respective classes.

If you have a suggestion to improve them or an alternative build please do tell. Just popping off and saying “neither of those builds are good” offer up an alternative. The guardian build provides good boons has lots of blinds spammable virtue of justice in all fights but boss fights and good group Condi clear. The mesmer build has high phantasm damage the focus pull group Condi clear and group healing without sacrificing damage. If you have alternative builds that offer good support and help clear dungeons faster please do tell.

jportell.2197:

DEKeyzToChaos.7381:

Neither of those builds are the best builds for their respective classes.

If you have a suggestion to improve them or an alternative build please do tell. Just popping off and saying “neither of those builds are good” offer up an alternative. The guardian build provides good boons has lots of blinds spammable virtue of justice in all fights but boss fights and good group Condi clear. The mesmer build has high phantasm damage the focus pull group Condi clear and group healing without sacrificing damage. If you have alternative builds that offer good support and help clear dungeons faster please do tell.

Maybe if you weren’t such a kitten, ignoring all helpful criticism and lashing out at people that tried to help you in your selfish builds thread, then maybe people would be more willing to help you.

for thief:
30/30/0/0/10 — fights shorter than 9 seconds
25/30/0/0/15 — fights shorter than 19 seconds
25/30/10/0/5 — fights longer than 19.1 seconds (edit: only if you can consistently backstab every 4 seconds indefinitely, if not then 25/30/0/0/15 is better)

Personally I never understood why people keep running 30 in inspiration, I find no good traits in the grandmaster slot that are usable in an actual fight. Personally I run 15/30/0/25/0 or 10/30/0/20/10(arah build), 30/30/0/0/10 for non reflect situations though.
As for major traits, Duelist’s dicipline is a complete waste in my eyes, the duelist is an allright phantasm, but it isnt on par with the damage the swordsman provides, or the reflection the warden does. I would personally go for empowering mantras(XI) with mantras charged of course, or Blurred Inscription(VIII) combined with a signet of midnight for harder situations. Lastly, persisting images really doesnt have a big effect on phantasm survivability in non open world PvE, it increases health by around 1600 on phantasms, and honestly, that’s not going to make them take another hit, and definitely not more than 1. taking II, glamour mastery would usually be a better choice, in my experience.

Those are my thoughts on the mesmer build atleast

DivineSlayer.5039:

jportell.2197:

DEKeyzToChaos.7381:

Neither of those builds are the best builds for their respective classes.

If you have a suggestion to improve them or an alternative build please do tell. Just popping off and saying “neither of those builds are good” offer up an alternative. The guardian build provides good boons has lots of blinds spammable virtue of justice in all fights but boss fights and good group Condi clear. The mesmer build has high phantasm damage the focus pull group Condi clear and group healing without sacrificing damage. If you have alternative builds that offer good support and help clear dungeons faster please do tell.

Maybe if you weren’t such a kitten, ignoring all helpful criticism and lashing out at people that tried to help you in your selfish builds thread, then maybe people would be more willing to help you.

You would do well to notice when I made that thread I ran 0/0/30/20/20. And now I’m not. So maybe I didn’t ignore those people. And maybe ur just a little kitten. Just trying to compile builds that are dungeon specific.

10/25/0/5/25 have to be existent in any pve guardian builds, aswell as 0/30/0/20/10 for any mesmer build in parties.

The guardian build you listed is more suitable for high end fractals, however I probably wouldn’t run powerful blades if I was going to sit on hammer the majority of the time. This is not something I would bring to any other dungeon as that much protection is not required and a more dps oriented build works better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Guide-DPS-Guardian-for-PVE/first

I’d trim down to longer consecrations, 3 condi rems on resolve activation (swap to indomitable courage for lupi fights, grants stability on virtue of courage use) and the typical points in radiance for blind/burning/vauln spam. Rest invested into Dps. You may also like to place 5 points in honor if you want some high vigor up time.

Core build- 10/25/0/0/25. Gear and variations listed in the link.

swiftpaw.6397:

The guardian build you listed is more suitable for high end fractals, however I probably wouldn’t run powerful blades if I was going to sit on hammer the majority of the time. This is not something I would bring to any other dungeon as that much protection is not required and a more dps oriented build works better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Guide-DPS-Guardian-for-PVE/first

I’d trim down to longer consecrations, 3 condi rems on resolve activation (swap to indomitable courage for lupi fights, grants stability on virtue of courage use) and the typical points in radiance for blind/burning/vauln spam. Rest invested into Dps. You may also like to place 5 points in honor if you want some high vigor up time.

Core build- 10/25/0/0/25. Gear and variations listed in the link.

Well hammer is something that has never left my weapon set since I started guard. I tried to like greatsword in pve I really really really did. It just seems so lacking compared to hammer. The 5second blast finisher is what sold me on it. That is almost as spammable as a thieves.

And I constantly swap between sword and hammer hence the powerful blades I don’t just sit on hammer and AA. I usually open fights with a might stack combo with my group (hammer/focus/VOJ) and between my blasts and theirs I have really found no need for the staff anymore. Then going into honor at least 10 has always been a no brainer for me because the symbol size increase can be huge help, the decrease recharge on shouts is also rather nice because it can mean less time on the group is on their face for fights that spam CC. If I were to ever take 10 points out of anywhere to put into zeal it would only be 10 points out of honor (the symbol duration increase can be annoying in some parties.)

If it is a fight that absolutely requires me to range I will swap to something else in place of powerful blades.

Edit: I looked at the hammer build 15/15/0/20/20 may be right up my alley for an alternative build….. O.o The versatility of a guardian can be surprising. Had a fractal group with a warrior that said “3 guardians…. So … No DPS?”…

Note that since Mesmer phants do not benefit from scholar runes, going for ruby is a very cheap, effective alternative. Also sword is usually a little better than pistol. Spec’ing for that allows empowering mantras for more damage as well.

I like the suggestion for 15 in domination. I don’t want to give up 25 in inspiration, because extra 15% phant damage is quite nice.

Anicetus.1253:

10/25/0/5/25 have to be existent in any pve guardian builds, aswell as 0/30/0/20/10 for any mesmer build in parties.

The guardian build I can understand. However on the mesmer build…. You have no illusion damage modifiers except for maybe phantasmal fury. The very bread and butter of a mesmer DPS build for dungeons is at least 10 in domination and at least 25 in inspiration as those are the main source of damage in dungeons.

jportell.2197:

swiftpaw.6397:

The guardian build you listed is more suitable for high end fractals, however I probably wouldn’t run powerful blades if I was going to sit on hammer the majority of the time. This is not something I would bring to any other dungeon as that much protection is not required and a more dps oriented build works better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Guide-DPS-Guardian-for-PVE/first

I’d trim down to longer consecrations, 3 condi rems on resolve activation (swap to indomitable courage for lupi fights, grants stability on virtue of courage use) and the typical points in radiance for blind/burning/vauln spam. Rest invested into Dps. You may also like to place 5 points in honor if you want some high vigor up time.

Core build- 10/25/0/0/25. Gear and variations listed in the link.

Well hammer is something that has never left my weapon set since I started guard. I tried to like greatsword in pve I really really really did. It just seems so lacking compared to hammer. The 5second blast finisher is what sold me on it. That is almost as spammable as a thieves.

And I constantly swap between sword and hammer hence the powerful blades I don’t just sit on hammer and AA. I usually open fights with a might stack combo with my group (hammer/focus/VOJ) and between my blasts and theirs I have really found no need for the staff anymore. Then going into honor at least 10 has always been a no brainer for me because the symbol size increase can be huge help, the decrease recharge on shouts is also rather nice because it can mean less time on the group is on their face for fights that spam CC. If I were to ever take 10 points out of anywhere to put into zeal it would only be 10 points out of honor (the symbol duration increase can be annoying in some parties.)

If it is a fight that absolutely requires me to range I will swap to something else in place of powerful blades.

Edit: I looked at the hammer build 15/15/0/20/20 may be right up my alley for an alternative build….. O.o The versatility of a guardian can be surprising. Had a fractal group with a warrior that said “3 guardians…. So … No DPS?”…

Well this is a best dungeon build thread, if you like running that build because you enjoy it then by all means, but it’s far from the best overall dungeon build for guardian. Hammer is a great weapon, but for most run of the mill dungeons it wont be needed.

Your group should be able to achieve 25 stacks might easily without it. If your group has good dps, you do not need shout cooldowns either, most things should be dead in seconds. Boons are achieved through virtues ultimately, which frees up your utility bar for stronger stuff like purging flames, wall of reflect and hallowed ground which are coincidentally consecrations and fire fields which will = continued might stacks for your team in battle as they blast them. Increased symbol size is another thing that is nice to have but ultimately not needed once again, as your party is going to be stacking for most fights anyway. When we are looking for the best builds, we have to strip away what we think is nice, to leave what is needed.

Guards can provide some decent dps, not to mention they have plenty of avenues to providing vulnerability and blind spams.

swiftpaw.6397:

jportell.2197:

swiftpaw.6397:

The guardian build you listed is more suitable for high end fractals, however I probably wouldn’t run powerful blades if I was going to sit on hammer the majority of the time. This is not something I would bring to any other dungeon as that much protection is not required and a more dps oriented build works better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Guide-DPS-Guardian-for-PVE/first

I’d trim down to longer consecrations, 3 condi rems on resolve activation (swap to indomitable courage for lupi fights, grants stability on virtue of courage use) and the typical points in radiance for blind/burning/vauln spam. Rest invested into Dps. You may also like to place 5 points in honor if you want some high vigor up time.

Core build- 10/25/0/0/25. Gear and variations listed in the link.

Well hammer is something that has never left my weapon set since I started guard. I tried to like greatsword in pve I really really really did. It just seems so lacking compared to hammer. The 5second blast finisher is what sold me on it. That is almost as spammable as a thieves.

And I constantly swap between sword and hammer hence the powerful blades I don’t just sit on hammer and AA. I usually open fights with a might stack combo with my group (hammer/focus/VOJ) and between my blasts and theirs I have really found no need for the staff anymore. Then going into honor at least 10 has always been a no brainer for me because the symbol size increase can be huge help, the decrease recharge on shouts is also rather nice because it can mean less time on the group is on their face for fights that spam CC. If I were to ever take 10 points out of anywhere to put into zeal it would only be 10 points out of honor (the symbol duration increase can be annoying in some parties.)

If it is a fight that absolutely requires me to range I will swap to something else in place of powerful blades.

Edit: I looked at the hammer build 15/15/0/20/20 may be right up my alley for an alternative build….. O.o The versatility of a guardian can be surprising. Had a fractal group with a warrior that said “3 guardians…. So … No DPS?”…

Well this is a best dungeon build thread, if you like running that build because you enjoy it then by all means, but it’s far from the best overall dungeon build for guardian. Hammer is a great weapon, but for most run of the mill dungeons it wont be needed.

Your group should be able to achieve 25 stacks might easily without it. If your group has good dps, you do not need shout cooldowns either, most things should be dead in seconds. Boons are achieved through virtues ultimately, which frees up your utility bar for stronger stuff like purging flames, wall of reflect and hallowed ground which are coincidentally consecrations and fire fields which will = continued might stacks for your team in battle as they blast them. Increased symbol size is another thing that is nice to have but ultimately not needed once again, as your party is going to be stacking for most fights anyway. When we are looking for the best builds, we have to strip away what we think is nice, to leave what is needed.

Guards can provide some decent dps, not to mention they have plenty of avenues to providing vulnerability and blind spams.

Well now that that has been hashed out what are builds for other classes. LIke warrior/ele/thief/engineer/ranger/necro.

Zerker. Don’t even need to see the classes name for in this game if you want a viable build go zerker or you are a noob. As sad as it sound.

Pip.2094:

Zerker. Don’t even need to see the classes name for in this game if you want a viable build go zerker or you are a noob. As sad as it sound.

I think he meant traits

DivineSlayer.5039:

Pip.2094:

Zerker. Don’t even need to see the classes name for in this game if you want a viable build go zerker or you are a noob. As sad as it sound.

I think he meant traits

Pretty much… I would rather have a zerker warrior that is running banners and shouts over a zerker warrior running nothing but 5 signets…

jportell.2197:

Gear is all Zerker, Runes are scholar.

The 10% extra damage does not effect your phantasms. I wouldn’t say ruby orbs are definitely better (as I’m not sure either way), but for the money they are.

Also, I don’t agree with your trait set up. Replace persisting images with glamour mastery and get rid of restorative mantras

Ethics.4519:

jportell.2197:

Gear is all Zerker, Runes are scholar.

The 10% extra damage does not effect your phantasms. I wouldn’t say ruby orbs are definitely better (as I’m not sure either way), but for the money they are.

Also, I don’t agree with your trait set up. Replace persisting images with glamour mastery and get rid of restorative mantras

Yeah the inspiration traits are swapped consistently in dungeons depending on the fight. Glamour mastery sees it way in there quite a bit. Restorative mantras is way stronger than you give credit for look at pyro’s “Overpowered Phantasm Dungeon build” That is a backbone to a dungeon mesmer. Spamming mantra of pain while your phantasms do the attack rotation is a good way to keep a group alive in fights that slowly tick away at you.

For Warrior, I’m fairly certain the Meta is 30/25/0/0/15, using Axe+Mace or Sword/GS. Utility skills are always “For great justice!”, a banner of sorts (Discipline -> Strength -> “On my Mark!” shout -> Tactics/defense?) and usually a flexible utility slot depending on situation (Balanced stance when Stability’s needed, Signet of Fury when things just have to die, Signet of Stamina in Condi-heavy fights etc). However, there’s also the 30/0/0/10/30 build with the same weapons and utilities. Think the personal DPS is lower, however I find myself preferring it because of the flexibility that 10 into Tactics offer, such as more frequent fgj/On my mark shouts or Perma-banners. 25s downtime on Banners when most Zerk encounter are over in 9 seconds or so is almost three whole encounters without a banner boost (Le gasp!) /sarcasm. It’s also more Pug-friendly, and the extra 100 Vit helps if you’re still learning the Zerking.

For Rangers, the most useful build I’ve found is 25/25/10/10/0 (30/25/5/10/0 is also useful, but I find tossing up Quickness/Breaking stun more often helps more than 50 extra points in Power), with Sword+Warhorn/Sword+Axe (Keep something for Ranged and GS for Skipping ,Swoop/Counterattack are great tools for that.) and Red Moa/Jungle Stalker pets (Fury/Might respectively). Sometimes it’s better to bring a Ranged pet though, as sometimes you don’t want pets rushing into melee range. Healing skill is Always Healing Spring, cause it’s a friggin’ water field. Utility skills are Frost Spirit, Quickening Zephyr and either “Sic ’em!” or “Search and Rescue!”. Pets don’t last long against some Bosses’ AoE’s, might as well make their damage count when they can do it or have them do other things to be useful.

30 (V IX XI), 25 (V X), 0, 0, 15(VI) indeed provides the highest dmg output for wars, whether running dungs or solo. 10 in Tactics used to make sense before Empower Allies was moved up a traitline, however now I simply believe its not worth it. In most dungs you will be able to place banners each encounter despite the overlong CD, also its not worth sacrificing the traits in Arms as they are more crucial for sustained dps. Utilites are simple, FGJ is usually locked in stone, for the rest two slots I tend to run banners (Disc > rest) though if you have another war in the group you can coordinate with him. In the case of trash runs or PuG encounters such as AC P1/2 endboss and Lupi, condi removal and stability will prove best. In the general case, if you need survivability on a free slot take Endure Pain. Additionally with this build SoR > BS except in bossfights like Lupi where most groups usually down alot. Weapon sets like aforementioned are GS and Axe with situational Mace/Sword offhand.

Clumsy.6257:

for thief:
30/30/0/0/10 — fights shorter than 9 seconds
25/30/0/0/15 — fights shorter than 19 seconds
25/30/10/0/5 — fights longer than 19.1 seconds (edit: only if you can consistently backstab every 4 seconds indefinitely, if not then 25/30/0/0/15 is better)

30/30/0/0/10 with sword/dagger is far better you just have to 1-1-3, 1-1-3 instead of just auto-attacking. The total DPS is like 1% lower but you don’t have to worry about stealth cd or being behind the target, also you can cleave while bringing your highest damage. By all means you can take s/d and d/d though.

For warrior –
GS + axe/mace sigil of night in gs and axe, sigil of battle in mace.
Full zerk gear, scholor runes slotted.
Traits are 30str, V, IX, XI
25 arms, V, X
15 discipline, whatever you want i guess. sig mastery would probably be best though.

Full axe build, AXE/Mace +warhorn/or sword warhorn most of the time though.
Sigil of night in axe force in off hands, energy in sword is ok too.
Full zerk, with scholar.
traits are 30 str, V, X, XI
25 arms, I, X
10 tactics, VI
5 discipline
Idea in this trait set up is to maximize the deeps, Nike vouches that the last 5 in discipline is better than anywhere else.
You don’t need fast hands in this build because the off-hand skills don’t recharge that quickly.

Enjoy.

Dempsey.8760:

Clumsy.6257:

for thief:
30/30/0/0/10 — fights shorter than 9 seconds
25/30/0/0/15 — fights shorter than 19 seconds
25/30/10/0/5 — fights longer than 19.1 seconds (edit: only if you can consistently backstab every 4 seconds indefinitely, if not then 25/30/0/0/15 is better)

30/30/0/0/10 with sword/dagger is far better you just have to 1-1-3, 1-1-3 instead of just auto-attacking. The total DPS is like 1% lower but you don’t have to worry about stealth cd or being behind the target, also you can cleave while bringing your highest damage. By all means you can take s/d and d/d though.

For warrior –
GS + axe/mace sigil of night in gs and axe, sigil of battle in mace.
Full zerk gear, scholor runes slotted.
Traits are 30str, V, IX, XI
25 arms, V, X
15 discipline, whatever you want i guess. sig mastery would probably be best though.

Full axe build, AXE/Mace +warhorn/or sword warhorn most of the time though.
Sigil of night in axe force in off hands, energy in sword is ok too.
Full zerk, with scholar.
traits are 30 str, V, X, XI
25 arms, I, X
10 tactics, VI
5 discipline
Idea in this trait set up is to maximize the deeps, Nike vouches that the last 5 in discipline is better than anywhere else.
You don’t need fast hands in this build because the off-hand skills don’t recharge that quickly.

Enjoy.

s/x is always inferior to d/d on single targets and for most parts when cleave is useful s/p is superior because of blinds, but then we get into the whole smokescreen vs assassins signet to swap s/p to s/d and its overly complicated so im going to say both are comparable

jportell.2197:

Anicetus.1253:

10/25/0/5/25 have to be existent in any pve guardian builds, aswell as 0/30/0/20/10 for any mesmer build in parties.

The guardian build I can understand. However on the mesmer build…. You have no illusion damage modifiers except for maybe phantasmal fury. The very bread and butter of a mesmer DPS build for dungeons is at least 10 in domination and at least 25 in inspiration as those are the main source of damage in dungeons.

Yeah, usually putting the last 10 points into domination. But 4% damage per mantra and 3% damage per illusion are much stronger than 15% phantasm damage.

As for other professions:
Warrior: 30/25/0/0/15.
Necro: 30/25/0/0/15 or 30/15/0/0/25 (solo). After 10th december both: 20/25/0/0/25.
Engineer: 30/10/0/0/30.
Ele: No set build, most have: 25/0/10/10/0, though.
Thief: 25/30/0/0/15 or 30/30/10/0/0.
Ranger: 20/25/0/25/0? In a solo setting probably 30/25/0/15/0?

For ranger, I’d say it’s more like 30/25/0/15/0, gaining opening strike (always crit + 10 stack of vuln) each time you kill a foe is priceless for trash mobs fight.

Step 1: Identify damage modificators (+5% etc.)
Step 2: Identify game-changing op traits (such as vigor on crit, longer consecration uptime, condition removal on virtue, reflect on focus skills, to some extent longer firefields and forceful greatsword etc.)
Step 3: Stockpile as many damage modificators as you can get with least op traits neglected. Keep the statbuffs of the traitlines in mind.

Works for every class.

Example for Mesmer:
1: 4% per mantra, 3% per illusion; to a lesser extent both 15% more phantasm traits
2: Reflect on focus skills, vigor on crit, faster glamours; 20% faster sword recharge, (clone on dodge); 20% faster recharging phantasms, faster recharging phantasm attacks.

Now if you expect a lot of projectiles, youll get the focus reflects because its the most op traitpoints you can spend under projectile circumstances. Else it takes a lot of points with no effect. Mesmer is one of the classes that have a tad more build variety within the meta than say, warrior.

Remorseless isnt great though if it does only what it says.

Anicetus.1253:

Necro: 30/25/0/0/15 or 30/15/0/0/25 (solo). After 10th december both: 20/25/0/0/25.

30/15/0/0/25 Will still be best solo after the patch. I made some incorrect assumptions when I compared them solo the first time.

Ruby orbs really aren’t good on Mesmers at all.

For engineers, I think it’s the following setup:

Traits:
Explosives 30 (IV, VII and XI)
Firearms 20 (III and VII if you’re using Pistol, IX if you’re using Rifle)
Inventions 0
Alchemy 10 (I)
Tools 10 (VI)

Healing/Utility:
Healing Turret
Grenade Kit
Bomb Kit
Elixir Gun/Elixir B (For when you need Stability)

Most of your time will be spent using Kits. If you’re running Pistol/Shield, you’ll mostly swift to this for the Blind, Projectile reflect and Block. If you’re using Rifle, it’s for the 3rd and 5th attacks, the latter hitting like a truck in melee range. 2nd and 4th are good for control. Pistol/Shield lets you use 2 Sigils though, which may be the deciding factor for some players.

jportell.2197:

Yeah the inspiration traits are swapped consistently in dungeons depending on the fight. Glamour mastery sees it way in there quite a bit. Restorative mantras is way stronger than you give credit for look at pyro’s “Overpowered Phantasm Dungeon build” That is a backbone to a dungeon mesmer. Spamming mantra of pain while your phantasms do the attack rotation is a good way to keep a group alive in fights that slowly tick away at you.

This is true if the players you play with are bad and need healing. In which case I’d rather just not play with them than heal them.

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

Ruby orbs really aren’t good on Mesmers at all.

Can you go into more detail about why they aren’t good? or a link with more information?

I know that scholar runes won’t work for phantasms (well the 10% anyway), so I figured orbs was the next best choice.

Ethics.4519:

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

Ruby orbs really aren’t good on Mesmers at all.

Can you go into more detail about why they aren’t good? or a link with more information?

I know that scholar runes won’t work for phantasms (well the 10% anyway), so I figured orbs was the next best choice.

Right: I was under the impression that even though scholar might be marginally better, it is much more marginal than for all other classes, and so might not be worth the cost of the scholar runes. Every respected guide I’ve read has indicated as such, anyway, but I would be curious about why you think otherwise! Thanks.

TheSwede.9512:

For engineers, I think it’s the following setup:

Traits:
Explosives 30 (IV, VII and XI)
Firearms 20 (III and VII if you’re using Pistol, IX if you’re using Rifle)
Inventions 0
Alchemy 10 (I)
Tools 10 (VI)

Healing/Utility:
Healing Turret
Grenade Kit
Bomb Kit
Elixir Gun/Elixir B (For when you need Stability)

Most of your time will be spent using Kits. If you’re running Pistol/Shield, you’ll mostly swift to this for the Blind, Projectile reflect and Block. If you’re using Rifle, it’s for the 3rd and 5th attacks, the latter hitting like a truck in melee range. 2nd and 4th are good for control. Pistol/Shield lets you use 2 Sigils though, which may be the deciding factor for some players.

I disagree, elixir gun and elixir b are good but they don’t replace the 3 blast finishers you get for using thumper turret (meaning 6 extra stacks of group might compared to elixir gun and 9 extra compared to elixir b) also I see no reason to go 20 points into firearms unless you are talking about post update and modified ammunition changes.

Engineer: 30/10/0/0/30. TheSwede.9512
30/15/0/0/25 is the best build for engineer as target the weak in firearms is better than anything you can get in the 30 point trait for tool (unless you are having a hard time keeping up full endurance for your extra 10% damage boost from enduring damage)

maxinion.8396:

Ethics.4519:

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

Ruby orbs really aren’t good on Mesmers at all.

Can you go into more detail about why they aren’t good? or a link with more information?

I know that scholar runes won’t work for phantasms (well the 10% anyway), so I figured orbs was the next best choice.

Right: I was under the impression that even though scholar might be marginally better, it is much more marginal than for all other classes, and so might not be worth the cost of the scholar runes. Every respected guide I’ve read has indicated as such, anyway, but I would be curious about why you think otherwise! Thanks.

Ruby orbs are only 2% better than scholar runes without the 10% bonus. Thats a barely noticeable difference. You may aswell take scholar runes so your direct damage is better and your reflects are better.

spoj.9672:

Ruby orbs are only 2% better than scholar runes without the 10% bonus. Thats a barely noticeable difference. You may aswell take scholar runes so your direct damage is better and your reflects are better.

That seems barely worth it, as my direct damage is equivalent of a cleric axebear ranger with his bear dead.

As for the reflects part, that’s interesting. I’m sure bosses like Lupi, CoF p1, Archdiviner, etc would be worth it, but I’d almost rather have the 2% for my clones 24/7 rather than the 10% in certain instances for my reflects.

I don’t know, I’d have to do math, and math is hard.

Pretty sure that you would need 3 phants constantly up for the 2 to be similar.

Ethics.4519:

spoj.9672:

Ruby orbs are only 2% better than scholar runes without the 10% bonus. Thats a barely noticeable difference. You may aswell take scholar runes so your direct damage is better and your reflects are better.

That seems barely worth it, as my direct damage is equivalent of a cleric axebear ranger with his bear dead.

As for the reflects part, that’s interesting. I’m sure bosses like Lupi, CoF p1, Archdiviner, etc would be worth it, but I’d almost rather have the 2% for my clones 24/7 rather than the 10% in certain instances for my reflects.

I don’t know, I’d have to do math, and math is hard.

Honestly, if you’re hitting mobs with your sword, your damage should not be all that bad, with a proper mantra build with 2/3 mantras charged, an autoattack chain should hit about 2-2-4=8k damage, and you can likely use about 2 aa chains within the time that a swordsman hits for another 6 to 8k, if you have 3 swordsmen up(hypothetical sistuation, naturally), you should get 16k(presuming all crits) direct damage off, within the same time in which the swordsmen do a total of 36-48k damage(presuming all crits). increasing phantasm damage by 2% would increase total phantasm damage to 36.72k-48.96k damage, and direct damage from 16k to 16.32k. while, presuming you keep your health above 90%, your direct damage should be increased from16k to 17.6k.

The scholar runes here increase your damage around 1.5x as much, compared to what the ruby orbs do, in a purely hypothetical situation in which:
1. you have 3 SWORDSMEN phantasms up,
2. your health stays above 90%,
3. you are attacking constantly
4. crit chance is increased to 100% to make things easier for my lame brain to comprehend at this hour.

If your damage is indeed lower than 16k per aa, consider that it has to be atleast below 12.8k per chain to reach the amount of ruby orb damage increase with the 3 swordsmen presuming the 8k hits(which generates a total damage increase of 1280).

Also, this does not take damage from attacks such as illusionary riposte in account, neither does it reflection.

I am not claiming scholar runes are always better for the mesmer, Im just bored and thought I’d do some simple maths late at night. there are plenty situations in which the 90% health upkeep is hard to match(looking at you ascalon/grawl fractal).

Thanks Sanderinoa. Appreciate the explanations.

The only time I run a mantra build is in Lupi fights and I bring healing, mantra of pain, and stability, along with feedback.

Is that what you generally run most dungeons, changing the mantras depending on what you need (such as interrupts/condition cleanse)?

Ethics.4519:

Thanks Sanderinoa. Appreciate the explanations.

The only time I run a mantra build is in Lupi fights and I bring healing, mantra of pain, and stability, along with feedback.

Is that what you generally run most dungeons, changing the mantras depending on what you need (such as interrupts/condition cleanse)?

Yup, in general I run the 15/30/0/25/0 build as explained before, I try to keep up the healing mantra at all times, feedback in secondary slot, and change the other mantras whenever I need a specific one, when in doubt, I use distraction, for the 5-8 vulnerability stacks due to the 15 domination minor. In most situation this makes me end up with recovery mantra-daze mantra-condi mantra-feedback, or a slight variation.

but because of the glasscannon nature of the build you need to know your own limits too :P
I do not run this constantly, the nature of my playstyle and the build is the (easy) switch between full offense and defense, in specific situations in which I know I can not handle the mantras, I switch to blurred inscriptions, and go for blink-signet of midnight, with ether fest.

(examples of these situations are the grawl final boss, certain encounters with mossman and captain asylum prepatch, to make meleeing more smooth, and being able to survive his greatsword phase if it triggers)

This gives you an immense increase in survivability(extra dodge+stunbreaker, usable anywhere, anytime every 30 sec, combined with quick movement to counter melee opponents) , while keeping the plain stat bonusses from your traits.