Players Against Stacking/Skipping/Stuff
This whole stacking thing is starting to make me wonder a few things : do we all have the same definition about it ?
When you stack at a specific point so the enemies behave differently, that’s an exploit. When you stack wherever because everyone is meeleing/boon sharing, that’s being smart.
And when you stack at every single encounter, that’s guardians not knowing how to pull things.
Stacking at range so Lupicus doesn’t kick just confirmed as an exploit.
Rezardi – [DnT]
Game over, yo.
Game over, yo.
Remember, the devs designed all the dungeons to be played in disorganized groups of completely random builds with no coordination who run around like chickens with their heads cut off range-kiting bosses to death. that’s a direct quote from the manifesto, in case anyone asks.
The problem is when ever I do try to make a no stacking group, people join it and stack anyway because they don’t care how other people want to play the game they only want to stack and skip. When the group was intended to not do those things, it’s hard to get away from all stacking and skipping when I’m being forced to make new groups time after time because people are so enthralled by the easy methods of stacking they see no other way and will make make sure others do the same.
Remember, the devs designed all the dungeons to be played in disorganized groups of completely random builds with no coordination who run around like chickens with their heads cut off range-kiting bosses to death. that’s a direct quote from the manifesto, in case anyone asks.
I’ve been doing things wrong this whole time.
Brb, uninstalling TS and Mumble.
Genevieve Talbot [NP] – Noble Phantasm on Stormbluff Isle
The problem is when ever I do try to make a no stacking group, people join it and stack anyway because they don’t care how other people want to play the game they only want to stack and skip. When the group was intended to not do those things, it’s hard to get away from all stacking and skipping when I’m being forced to make new groups time after time because people are so enthralled by the easy methods of stacking they see no other way and will make make sure others do the same.
Kick the stackers!
I mean, we kick the non stackers! Nothing wrong with kicking folks from a party that was designed toward a specific method and goal. Don’t worry about kicking people who arent playing how you want when it is your party seriously. You have every right to work as hard as we do to keep our parties clean and nice and positive additions to our immersion.
[ARES]
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
The problem is when ever I do try to make a no stacking group, people join it and stack anyway because they don’t care how other people want to play the game they only want to stack and skip. When the group was intended to not do those things, it’s hard to get away from all stacking and skipping when I’m being forced to make new groups time after time because people are so enthralled by the easy methods of stacking they see no other way and will make make sure others do the same.
Kick them for not reading your lfg description?
And while I see you’ve got a guild you’re advertising for, again, find friends who share your common intent.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Players-Against-Stacking-Skipping-Stuff/first
Genevieve Talbot [NP] – Noble Phantasm on Stormbluff Isle
Kind of hard to do when the whole group but me is stacking.
Kind of hard to do when the whole group but me is stacking.
Get at least 1 other person to make the group. If there isn’t one other person then I really don’t know where all these threads are coming from.
[ARES]
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
Even if I do have a second I have to wade through all the stackers, skippers, leavers, and level 80’s that join and instantly leave.
Even if I do have a second I have to wade through all the stackers, skippers, leavers, and level 80’s that join and instantly leave.
we all do weeding out of our own the difference is we aren’t complaining about it or making excuses. there are waaay to many players that don’t want to stack, they post here all the time. form a guild and make it work.
Check out this thread if you haven’t there’s some people in that thread not including OP that do not want to stack or skip.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Players-Against-Stacking-Skipping-Stuff/first
Even if I do have a second I have to wade through all the stackers, skippers, leavers, and level 80’s that join and instantly leave.
And people here often have to wade through the non-zerkers and non-meta builds when we post LFGs for “Experienced zerker meta dps melee only.”
When you want a specific thing from your party-mates (meta play, non-stacking, PINK), it takes a bit of work. That’s why your guild and the other PASS thread are the best solutions: you’ll be able to easily find people to run with, according to your standards, without all this extra work.
Imagine the time I have to weed all the guards who come to my “Please, NO Guards” LFG. Maybe the problems aren’t lying at stacking/skipping but at those people who don’t make an effort to read the LFG?
#WePlayHowWeWant2014
#YouPlayHowYouWant
“Raids are like fortune cookies. You eat the cookie and then read the paper scraps.”
- doranduck, 2016 on Lore in Raids
- doranduck, 2016 on Lore in Raids
Even if I do have a second I have to wade through all the stackers, skippers, leavers, and level 80’s that join and instantly leave.
we all do weeding out of our own the difference is we aren’t complaining about it or making excuses. there are waaay to many players that don’t want to stack, they post here all the time. form a guild and make it work.
Check out this thread if you haven’t there’s some people in that thread not including OP that do not want to stack or skip.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Players-Against-Stacking-Skipping-Stuff/first
You don’t have to complain because you’re with the meta, the masses, the way it is currently. The people who want change are “complaining” because they want change. they want to play how they want to play i.e not stacking, skipping, zerking, and so on, but can’t because all people care about is the “meta” and will follow it without question. If things were the other way around I’m sure there would be plenty of complaining for the other end.
You don’t have to complain because you’re with the meta, the masses, the way it is currently. The people who want change are “complaining” because they want change. they want to play how they want to play i.e not stacking, skipping, zerking, and so on, but can’t because all people care about is the “meta” and will follow it without question. If things were the other way around I’m sure there would be plenty of complaining for the other end.
Everyone always thinks the grass is greener on the other side of the fence.
We do complain about people who don’t play the meta. Have you SEEN the funniest player fails thread? We just like to collect them in one spot for easy access instead of always making new threads.
Genevieve Talbot [NP] – Noble Phantasm on Stormbluff Isle
I somewhat agree with this sentiment except the BYOB part.
Class balance doesn’t seem to be a huge problem in GW2 PvE, as was the intent of supposedly removing the “trinity”. Occasionally it can’t be overlooked, i.e. you will probably want a Guardian for high level fractals for overall party survivability.
Balancing builds on the other hand is something I think everyone should do. Many PUGs don’t like being told what to do, so instead of creating conflict by insisting someone switch things up… try to balance your build to complement the party. If you ignore build choices entirely then you might not like the result. Certain things need to be accounted for like dps and aggro. While I see the point about playing the game to “not play the game”.. you probably want to avoid getting stuck in a dungeon for hours on end because your party isn’t viable.
The underlying issue of skipping through PvE content is that the rewards are considered more important than the actual gameplay. I think a lot players fail to realize the point of a game is to enjoy the gameplay experience and instead get caught up trying to stockpile fake in-game profits. I’m sure I could spiel on some elaborate psychological profile to explain this behavior but that’s the long and the short of it. Some players will tell you they’re simply skipping through these parts of the game to earn money to enjoy other parts of the game, but in practice, I’ve never known this to hold true.
On the surface there are a couple of issues that allow this.
First, outside of TA Aetherpath, there are no gating mechanisms that force players to deal with foes before they can proceed. Some players can’t wrap their heads around the techniques used to skip through instances but for those who can, the option is a tempting time saver. Now, to be fair, much of the GW2 PvE instance content is positively boring and some of it is only interesting the first couple of times through or every so often. I can’t fault people for losing interest in it, only that they’re still playing through it despite succumbing to boredom.
Second, GW2’s basic gameplay promotes using vertical movement to get past obstructions. Players are using the tools the provided by the game to “exploit” it. This is more or less something Arenanet has to constantly tweak because they aren’t going to foresee every possibility.
GW2 shares these issues with GW1 albeit without the gimmicky builds prevalent in GW1. That said, I think it’s safe to assume we have a lot of the same designers making the same design choices and nothing much will change.
So feel free to choose your own way and do not necessarily criticize who does not do it your way.
Let’s be realistic here;
If people were capable of out-thinking a rewards system all the time, we wouldn’t have words like ‘Grind’. A game can totally make you feel compelled to do something you hate doing, or compel you in the wrong direction.
Players shouldn’t have to choose between progressing their character aesthetically and statistically through financial gains, or progressing their knowledge-base of mechanics and their skillset as a player through genuine non-cheeseball gameplay. All of these forms of progression should be pointing down the exact same path. Like how more established franchises have been managing for years without issue.
We shouldn’t be trying to hand-wave this rock and a hardplace situation with some empty saccharine sentiment.
(edited by Vox Hollow.2736)
Even if I do have a second I have to wade through all the stackers, skippers, leavers, and level 80’s that join and instantly leave.
we all do weeding out of our own the difference is we aren’t complaining about it or making excuses. there are waaay to many players that don’t want to stack, they post here all the time. form a guild and make it work.
Check out this thread if you haven’t there’s some people in that thread not including OP that do not want to stack or skip.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Players-Against-Stacking-Skipping-Stuff/first
You don’t have to complain because you’re with the meta, the masses, the way it is currently. The people who want change are “complaining” because they want change. they want to play how they want to play i.e not stacking, skipping, zerking, and so on, but can’t because all people care about is the “meta” and will follow it without question. If things were the other way around I’m sure there would be plenty of complaining for the other end.
Actually it did used to be the other way around. But as everyone got more experienced, the meta game evolved as it does in all games. When I first starting running dungeons I hardly ever saw stacking. Not near as many people ran zerker either.
Everyone was running wacky builds, flailing around all willy nilly and dungeons were hard because there was no organization, dps was bad and people didn’t know what support skills actually worked well. Naturally we adapted our builds and tactics over time to become more efficient.
What you’re looking for is those early days when everyone was just winging it. You should try running with new players. Also, check out the PASS thread, get a guild going and advertise it. You deserve to play how you want to play, and it seems there are enough people to support such a thing. Heck, you could even invite me for a run as I’d like to experience it just out of curiosity
(edited by laharl.8435)
Even if I do have a second I have to wade through all the stackers, skippers, leavers, and level 80’s that join and instantly leave.
we all do weeding out of our own the difference is we aren’t complaining about it or making excuses. there are waaay to many players that don’t want to stack, they post here all the time. form a guild and make it work.
Check out this thread if you haven’t there’s some people in that thread not including OP that do not want to stack or skip.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Players-Against-Stacking-Skipping-Stuff/first
You don’t have to complain because you’re with the meta, the masses, the way it is currently. The people who want change are “complaining” because they want change. they want to play how they want to play i.e not stacking, skipping, zerking, and so on, but can’t because all people care about is the “meta” and will follow it without question. If things were the other way around I’m sure there would be plenty of complaining for the other end.
The average player stacks, but the average player does not run zerker meta builds. I consider myself lucky if I get one or two in a PUG who do. So yes, it is still challenging for us to find exactly the teams we want— that’s why PUGing is tough.
yayyyy thread merge
For great justice!
This whole stacking thing is starting to make me wonder a few things : do we all have the same definition about it ?
When you stack at a specific point so the enemies behave differently, that’s an exploit.
Did you know that when you range a boss, he will sometimes not melee you? Is ranging exploiting too?
Excuse for not making it clearer for people like you (and a few others) : When you stack at certain places, the boss stops using certain attacks. Just like when you stack on the pillar the Spider Queen won’t spit poison. Or when you end up pushing Alpha through the wall it stops attacking. You can do the same thing with Dwayna, and most bosses : when you end up pushing them through a wall/texture, they bug out at stop using some/most/all attacks.
This whole stacking thing is starting to make me wonder a few things : do we all have the same definition about it ?
When you stack at a specific point so the enemies behave differently, that’s an exploit.
Did you know that when you range a boss, he will sometimes not melee you? Is ranging exploiting too?
Excuse for not making it clearer for people like you (and a few others) : When you stack at certain places, the boss stops using certain attacks. Just like when you stack on the pillar the Spider Queen won’t spit poison. Or when you end up pushing Alpha through the wall it stops attacking. You can do the same thing with Dwayna, and most bosses : when you end up pushing them through a wall/texture, they bug out at stop using some/most/all attacks.
The spider queen’s poison attack is a ranged attack. At range, she doesn’t use her melee attacks. Does that mean ranging her is an exploit? I mean, if you range, she won’t use her melee attack, so obviously this must be an exploit.
This whole stacking thing is starting to make me wonder a few things : do we all have the same definition about it ?
When you stack at a specific point so the enemies behave differently, that’s an exploit.
Did you know that when you range a boss, he will sometimes not melee you? Is ranging exploiting too?
Excuse for not making it clearer for people like you (and a few others) : When you stack at certain places, the boss stops using certain attacks. Just like when you stack on the pillar the Spider Queen won’t spit poison. Or when you end up pushing Alpha through the wall it stops attacking. You can do the same thing with Dwayna, and most bosses : when you end up pushing them through a wall/texture, they bug out at stop using some/most/all attacks.
Ok, so let’s be clear back.
You can get the spider queen to stop using her poison AoE by standing in her. Try it— have everyone stand in her. Done! She only ever tries to use it at range. The corner for the queen just gets her into a position where she’s too close to use her range attack.
This is why people bring up Lupi: if you range Lupi, he won’t use the one-shot attacks like kick and swipe on you. If forcing the Queen to stay in melee is exploiting, so is ranging Lupi: they’re both just avoiding a particular type of attack.
This whole stacking thing is starting to make me wonder a few things : do we all have the same definition about it ?
When you stack at a specific point so the enemies behave differently, that’s an exploit.
Did you know that when you range a boss, he will sometimes not melee you? Is ranging exploiting too?
Excuse for not making it clearer for people like you (and a few others) : When you stack at certain places, the boss stops using certain attacks. Just like when you stack on the pillar the Spider Queen won’t spit poison. Or when you end up pushing Alpha through the wall it stops attacking. You can do the same thing with Dwayna, and most bosses : when you end up pushing them through a wall/texture, they bug out at stop using some/most/all attacks.
Excuse him for not making it clear to you: when you range bosses, they stop using certain attacks. Just like when you range lupicus he doesn’t kick or swipe you. Or when Ginva the butch can’t hit you with his axe whirl. Or when the Archdiviner can’t hit you with his hammer bash. You can do the same thing with most bosses: when you stay at range and kite them, they bug out and stop using some/most/all attacks.
Pros of stacking:
No skill is neededCons of stacking:
less fun and enjoyment of game.
No reason to even play the game if the main goal is to rush through it
A lack of skillYou could also try a game called WoW I hear that all you do is push buttons in that game too.
I’d like to know what do you do in Guild Wars 2 besides pushing buttons? Is there some kind of physical effort while you’re playing the game? Maybe some ab-normal intelligence that has to be used in order to play it?
Besides, WoW is considered one of best if not the best MMO ever to be made, along with Guild Wars 1 that is, and ANet sure knows that. Yet ANet tends to rush things in and lacks on effort they put in – from what I can see -> pure and very fresh example:
Edge of the mists:
GW2 has 25 explorable zones and 90% of them are overflow-capable, which probably means the overflow code is the same in all of them. On the day of the release of EotM, servers crashed because there was no player-limit in the overflow. To move on, Overgrown part of EotM seems like someone was running short on time because most of the kitten buildings seem to be half-done and placed under an angle that makes no sence (walls going downhill, gates fitting in there and guards standing straight on these steep walls).
That’s for the rushing things in part, now for lack of effort:
Last pack of gem armors is only a remake of already used armors (they only added flames) and is sold for 10€. Last 5 updates of the living story all included probes around the world, the only difference was the look of the probe and mobs around it – and yes, even in this “last epic ending of first living story season” on which they worked from December to January.
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t hate Guild Wars 2 nor ANet.
I’m getting a feeling though that the more we, their customers, are trying to give them hints on what we want and on how we think this game could improve, the less they’re listening to us because you know, they probably can’t stand criticizm (which is by the way the best way to learn things even if you might get offended by it in most cases).
They have their vision of the game which they won’t change for nothing, at least not yet. But they forgot the most important thing in the marketing and that is that the customer is ALWAYS right. Well, either ANet forgot it or NCSoft keeps screwing them over like they do to every other game developers they own.
Old Piken Square WvW Vet
Her*, dear Nike.
Anyway, I don’t think my point was at all off base. If I’m meleeing a boss, I don’t shoot my aoe 1200 units away from it. I don’t use static field (if I’m using staff) around an unmoving boss. I generally use my daggers, a lightning hammer, anything. I don’t use range attacks in a melee fight, why should an AI?
[ARES]
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
Excuse him for not making it clear to you: when you range bosses, they stop using certain attacks. Just like when you range lupicus he doesn’t kick or swipe you. Or when Ginva the butch can’t hit you with his axe whirl. Or when the Archdiviner can’t hit you with his hammer bash. You can do the same thing with most bosses: when you stay at range and kite them, they bug out and stop using some/most/all attacks.
Aww it’s cute <3 Ignoring how bosses bug out when stuck in a wall and throwing a few jokes “if you range you exploit” <3.
I might have wrongly assumed that the Spider Queen bugs when near a wall/pillar, just like Alpha used to bug (don’t know, it’s been a year since we didn’t bother to try to do that) when pushed into a wall. Or Dwayna stops attacking.
It’s also cute how you’re ignoring our very clear logic. Alpha doesn’t bug. He attacks. We dodge, we stack, we dodge, so on and so forth.
[ARES]
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
And all who stood by and did nothing, who are they to criticize the sacrifices of others?
Our blood has bought their lives.
lilith it’s time to get the flags out if you know what I mean.
Alpha’s bugged state happened regardless of wall or not. I haven’t seen it happen in a while as well. Maybe a stealth fix a few months ago?
I am uncertain of what bugged state you’re talking about with Dwayna. Have a youtube vid or anything of this bug?
Genevieve Talbot [NP] – Noble Phantasm on Stormbluff Isle
Alpha’s bugged state happened regardless of wall or not. I haven’t seen it happen in a while as well. Maybe a stealth fix a few months ago?
I am uncertain of what bugged state you’re talking about with Dwayna. Have a youtube vid or anything of this bug?
LoS Dwayna when she spawns, she’ll proceed to afk.
I know who I am, do you know who you are?
Alpha’s teeth attack doesn’t bug anymore, it hits you for like 4k even if you stand on him.
Rezardi – [DnT]
Game over, yo.
Game over, yo.
Even if I do have a second I have to wade through all the stackers, skippers, leavers, and level 80’s that join and instantly leave.
we all do weeding out of our own the difference is we aren’t complaining about it or making excuses. there are waaay to many players that don’t want to stack, they post here all the time. form a guild and make it work.
Check out this thread if you haven’t there’s some people in that thread not including OP that do not want to stack or skip.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Players-Against-Stacking-Skipping-Stuff/first
You don’t have to complain because you’re with the meta, the masses, the way it is currently. The people who want change are “complaining” because they want change. they want to play how they want to play i.e not stacking, skipping, zerking, and so on, but can’t because all people care about is the “meta” and will follow it without question. If things were the other way around I’m sure there would be plenty of complaining for the other end.
I take issue with this. You’re “The Masses.” “The Masses” being those that wish to be carried, force others to play their way, or don’t care about LFG Tags. You’re like 99% of players that would join a group that says “Melee Only” and range. You are the cancer that reads my LFG Post: “FoTM XX, Daily, Sexy Zerk Bros ONLY, Ping upon joining” who would join my group not ping meta, or say nothing at all, and range on mossman/bloomhunger, if things go bad and the group wipes you would be the last one to die and the worst is, you’ll die confident that you contributed the most to the group because you survived the longest doing “dps” the longest.
The 1% of my runs are beautiful, worth putting up with the uniformed like you. Yes, you are uninformed you don’t like stacking because you don’t understand stacking. It’s like saying I chose not to use exotic/ascended weapons because they do too much damage… it FEELS like an exploit.
Back to my 1%. Sometimes, once in a great while, the planets will align. PuGs will ping zerk gear WITH scholar and melee all day everyday. Might gets stacks, blinds get used, etc. It’s beautiful, I love playing with a group of players of like mind. I LOVE and find FUN, playing in perfect harmony with 4 other strangers. I am exhilarated that a team comes together and slays monsters and loots booty. That’s my fun, perfect execution and loot.
What’s not fun to me, ranging, Final Fantasy length end boss fights on trash, 3-4 hours in one dungeon because IRL I work 70-90 hours a week and don’t care about what you find fun.
(edited by Perdition.5981)
Excuse him for not making it clear to you: when you range bosses, they stop using certain attacks. Just like when you range lupicus he doesn’t kick or swipe you. Or when Ginva the butch can’t hit you with his axe whirl. Or when the Archdiviner can’t hit you with his hammer bash. You can do the same thing with most bosses: when you stay at range and kite them, they bug out and stop using some/most/all attacks.
Aww it’s cute <3 Ignoring how bosses bug out when stuck in a wall and throwing a few jokes “if you range you exploit” <3.
I might have wrongly assumed that the Spider Queen bugs when near a wall/pillar, just like Alpha used to bug (don’t know, it’s been a year since we didn’t bother to try to do that) when pushed into a wall. Or Dwayna stops attacking.
So using your 3 examples we have one (spider) that youre wrong about, a second (Alpha) that has since been fixed for months, and a third (Dwayna) that is a world boss. This isn’t exactly proving your point that stacking is an exploit.
Or though I am completely against you, you’re certainly brave for speaking up. Now this point may have already been mentioned, I only bothered to read the first two pages, however this game is not all about PvE, it isn’t all about dungeons, etc. If mechanics were put in place to prevent stacking/skipping it would RUIN the game, in all modes. Not only would dungeons be POINTLESS to run, it would screw every other mode that requires you to kill mobs. I mean, have you ever tried killing a single krait? That is an example of the mechanics they could put into the game… at the end of the day I do not see it as exploiting, what you going to call all the WvW’ers exploiters for stacking on the commander and fighting another zerg now? I’m relating this to other modes because you need to see the FULL story of this. It’s all well and good if a new player wants an enjoyable instance but do NOT screw it up for the players that actually like it this way, normally in GuildWars1 you wouldn’t even do the dungeon as a group, you’d hire x Assassin to do it for you and that would be that: they’d also use various aggro-break, stacking and skipping tactics to finish the dungeon, this was never “exploiting” back then… why the hell is it now? With a tone of rage in there I’ll, tone it down and say goodluck to however your runs go, maybe you’ll eventually see how annoying trash mobs can be when in dugeons in the future and learn that stacking isn’t actually a bad thing.
P.S. I agree with those wanting you to attempt Arah P4 and the Dredge Fractal at 49, not everything can be perfect and in all fairness I see stacking/skipping as using your brain, you use dodges, survival etc to get through so why is it mindless? I’ll leave it at that. /Rant over.
The reactions to this thread are quite frankly ridiculous. This is a post for those seeking to join and play fun, traditional runs of the dungeon – and nothing else.
It’s not an attack on your precious lifestyle. You’re reading too far into it. I’m not trying to destroy your precious little stacking game – the developers are the only ones who can decide on when, how, or even if this is going to happen. I’m not even trying to insult you. I’m not calling you bad players. The playstyle is unskillful, mindless, and boring – that’s not a personal insult and it’s not subjective. That doesn’t reflect on you. It certainly doesn’t make you unskilled – all it means is that you’ve done everything in your power to chase carrots as efficiently and quickly as possible, and there’s nothing innately wrong with that. It’s just that you aren’t utilizing the mechanics of the game to their full extent, because you don’t have to. The game doesn’t require it, after all, so why make things harder on yourself other than for the enjoyment of doing so; that enjoyment is the entire reason for the thread.
I am an intensely bored player looking to enjoy himself and play the game the way it was played before stacking became the norm. No, it doesn’t bother me that you have your all zerk speed runs or other explicitly special runs. What disgusts me is that stacking is the assumed meta – that, in order to play otherwise, one has to make threads like these and find likeminded people and explicitly post LFG messages JUST to get a group that wants to play. So yes, I’m a little bit angry that my favorite game has devolved to that point. And I’m more than a little bit angry that, in seeing my attempt to salvage the game for myself and a few others, the first reaction of the community is to derail my thread and get into hostile arguments for no good reason.
Basically, I ask you to express your opinion in a reasonable fashion, enjoy the game your way, and allow me to enjoy it in mine. If you’re not interested in participating or in reasonable discussion, the thread is not for you and has never been for you. God knows you have a billion others. I have to work a LOT harder for it than you do – all you have to do is spend 30 seconds in the LFG system, whereas I have to come in here and deal with this.
I’m not going to bother arguing any longer. And I haven’t bothered in several days. It’s pointless. There’s no need to. It’s not my intention nor my point to participate in pointless hostility.
But, because I was disillusioned and bitter at the time of making the thread, I will clean up the original post. God knows it wasn’t helping things, and it probably came off worse than it needed to, but the direction this thread has gone really sheds light on how far the Guild Wars community has fallen. And that’s the saddest thing. In a purely cooperative game with remarkably friendly design, the community is this prone to hostility. Think on that.
(edited by Duke Blackrose.4981)
@ Cri
Every other MMORPG in the world worth playing can manage to deliver a game experience without stacking/skipping just fine?
There’s nothing hopeless or futile about it.
It’s the way these sorts of games are normally played.
(edited by Vox Hollow.2736)
people who want to stack play with people who want to stack, people who don’t want to stack play with people who don’t want to stack. I thought it was common sense… is it really too difficult to add “no stacking” to your lfg?
King of the Nightstand dynasty
I like dungeons and Ikea.
aka Cotscene.
I like dungeons and Ikea.
aka Cotscene.
The reactions to this thread are quite frankly ridiculous. This is a post for those seeking to join and play fun, traditional runs of the dungeon – and nothing else.
It’s not an attack on your precious lifestyle. You’re reading too far into it. I’m not trying to destroy your precious little stacking game – the developers are the only ones who can decide on when, how, or even if this is going to happen. I’m not calling you bad players. The playstyle is unskillful, mindless, and boring. That doesn’t reflect on you. It certainly doesn’t make you unskilled – all it means is that you’ve done everything in your power to chase carrots as efficiently and quickly as possible, and there’s nothing innately wrong with that. It’s just that you aren’t utilizing the mechanics of the game to their full extent, because you don’t have to. The game doesn’t require it, after all, so why make things harder on yourself other than for the enjoyment of doing so; that enjoyment is the entire reason for the thread.
I am an intensely bored player looking to enjoy himself and play the game the way it was played before stacking became the norm. No, it doesn’t bother me that you have your all zerk speed runs or other explicitly special runs. What disgusts me is that stacking is the assumed meta – that, in order to play otherwise, one has to make threads like these and find likeminded people and explicitly post LFG messages JUST to get a group that wants to play. So yes, I’m a little bit angry that my favorite game has devolved to that point. And I’m more than a little bit angry that, in seeing my attempt to salvage the game for myself and a few others, you have the nerve to come in here, derail the thread, read too deeply into my bitter, but otherwise meaningless words, and attack me.
Basically, I ask you to express your opinion in a reasonable fashion, enjoy the game your way, and allow me to enjoy it in mine. This thread is not for you and has never been for you. God knows you have a billion others. I have to work a LOT harder for it than you do – all you have to do is spend 30 seconds in the LFG system, whereas I have to come in here and deal with this.
I’m not going to bother arguing any longer. And I haven’t bothered in several days. It’s pointless. There’s no need to. It’s not my intention nor my point to bash heads with pointlessly hostile players for no discernible reason.
But, because I was disillusioned and bitter at the time of making the thread, I will clean up the original post. God knows it wasn’t helping things, and it probably came off worse than it needed to, but the extent to which you have behaved really sheds light on how far the Guild Wars community has fallen.
You know the way in which you present yourself isn’t really helping your cause. Just fyi.
Tired of not actually playing the game when you run dungeons with pugs? Tired of skipping half of the dungeon? Tired of exploits? Tired of gameplay that has been dumbed down to dodge rolling into walls and spamming 1? Honestly, it seems that, as a result of all of the efficiency-oriented dungeon metagames and champ zerging, most of the community has forgotten how to actually play.
Leave your elitism at the door; everyone is welcome.
You come in hostile, you can expect hostility.
Still waiting for that “stacking is easy, I can even do it in fotm 50” video. Preferably while stacking on mossman and archdiviner. So far it just looks like complains from people stuck in AC, which, as anyone who has pugged a lot of dungeons knows, has the worst pugs, players who literally almost never left this dungeon, and when they do, it’s a disaster.
Always the same old “spider queen hrp drp drp hrp spider queen hrp drp drp drp”
- “No tears, please. It’s a waste of good suffering.”
Sorry, but, yes.
They are absolutely beholden to AC just as much as Fractals
That’s kind of the downside of not having vertical progression come along and wipe the slate clean every few months. Their release content is technically always their current content, and the more they advance in encounter design without going back to revise the farther and farther behind it gets.
I don’t envy the position they’re in, but I’m not about to let them off the hook either.
(edited by Vox Hollow.2736)
The reason I always PUSH Dwayna statue to the wall is to bug out all those range-rs’s precious champ chest. Guess what, they are too scared to come closer when their attacks become Obstructed.
Yawn… This is getting old…
“Raids are like fortune cookies. You eat the cookie and then read the paper scraps.”
- doranduck, 2016 on Lore in Raids
- doranduck, 2016 on Lore in Raids
Excuse him for not making it clear to you: when you range bosses, they stop using certain attacks. Just like when you range lupicus he doesn’t kick or swipe you. Or when Ginva the butch can’t hit you with his axe whirl. Or when the Archdiviner can’t hit you with his hammer bash. You can do the same thing with most bosses: when you stay at range and kite them, they bug out and stop using some/most/all attacks.
Aww it’s cute <3 Ignoring how bosses bug out when stuck in a wall and throwing a few jokes “if you range you exploit” <3.
I might have wrongly assumed that the Spider Queen bugs when near a wall/pillar, just like Alpha used to bug (don’t know, it’s been a year since we didn’t bother to try to do that) when pushed into a wall. Or Dwayna stops attacking.
So using your 3 examples we have one (spider) that youre wrong about, a second (Alpha) that has since been fixed for months, and a third (Dwayna) that is a world boss. This isn’t exactly proving your point that stacking is an exploit.
Dwayna=Simin.
Tired of not actually playing the game when you run dungeons with pugs? Tired of skipping half of the dungeon? Tired of exploits? Tired of gameplay that has been dumbed down to dodge rolling into walls and spamming 1? Honestly, it seems that, as a result of all of the efficiency-oriented dungeon metagames and champ zerging, most of the community has forgotten how to actually play.
Leave your elitism at the door; everyone is welcome.
You come in hostile, you can expect hostility.
And I say that you, and others, read too far into it. Not one comment in the original OP was explicitly intended to insult or enrage anyone. They were bitter insults at the state of the game but not at those who played it that way.
There were (and are) exploits. That can’t be denied. There were (and are) frequently-used dungeon exploits that Arenanet has acknowledged, fixed, and even banned people for. I was not calling stacking one of them, though it often tends to be used in the same overall playstyle. Arah exploit skips ringing any bells? What about the (historic) final boss stack in the Cliffside fractal or the one in the first boss of the Grawl/Volcano fractal? The CoF2 barrier skips? These exploits can and do become tiresome – even if experienced infrequently – by the players who don’t enjoy performing them and don’t see them as healthy gameplay.
Yes, stacking is dumbed-down gameplay. That is not an insult to the stackers nor was it intended to be one. It’s a fact – gameplay has been diminished in some way, mainly in the diminished importance of positioning players and combo fields, as these are already conveniently placed in a stack, the removal of kiting, the removal of melee to ranged (or vice versa) decision making, and other crucial components of Guild Wars 2 combat. There are some who enjoy this. There are people who would enjoy anything. But that doesn’t serve as a counterargument to the diminished quality of gameplay associated with stacking. Hell, even the game itself hates stacking, as evidenced by the berserk personality the camera takes on in many popular stack spots.
Okay, the “forgot how to play” comment may have been a bit much. I’ll admit that. But it wasn’t intended to be received as “Oh, you’re so bad. Learn to play, scrub.” It wasn’t an intended form of elitism. It was simply an observation of fact – a large percentage of the community has forgotten (or has never known) how to play encounters normally – as in with no stacking involved. And yes, that does detract from the overall game experience. It reduces content variety and makes content feel stale. Oh sure, it’s fast and rewarding, but that doesn’t make it good or fun.
And the elitism comment stands. Not as a general insult to those who disagree with me, mind you, but as a conditional (and matter of fact) label for much of the common behavior exhibited by the Guild Wars 2 dungeon community. Restricting others based on their profession or gear nomenclature is elitism. Kicking someone because they have less than (insert amount here) achievement points is elitism (and pointless elitism at that, as achievement points are a kitten-poor measurement of player skill or dungeon knowledge). It’s all arbitrary, pointless, and toxic. How do you think the Rangers, Necromancers, and other commonly excluded professions feel towards the community in general because of the common rejection they face for no reason other than that their preferred character class is less than optimal in the eyes of the masses? Even as a Guardian player, I could tell you that they aren’t happy. And in a game like this, which was intended to be friendly and designed to be “played your way,” that’s particularly disappointing.
I’m not even going to bother reading that huge wall of text.
You’re acting surprised by the hostility you invited onto yourself. Enjoy it.
Excuse him for not making it clear to you: when you range bosses, they stop using certain attacks. Just like when you range lupicus he doesn’t kick or swipe you. Or when Ginva the butch can’t hit you with his axe whirl. Or when the Archdiviner can’t hit you with his hammer bash. You can do the same thing with most bosses: when you stay at range and kite them, they bug out and stop using some/most/all attacks.
Aww it’s cute <3 Ignoring how bosses bug out when stuck in a wall and throwing a few jokes “if you range you exploit” <3.
I might have wrongly assumed that the Spider Queen bugs when near a wall/pillar, just like Alpha used to bug (don’t know, it’s been a year since we didn’t bother to try to do that) when pushed into a wall. Or Dwayna stops attacking.
So using your 3 examples we have one (spider) that youre wrong about, a second (Alpha) that has since been fixed for months, and a third (Dwayna) that is a world boss. This isn’t exactly proving your point that stacking is an exploit.
Dwayna=Simin.
Simin doesnt bug by “pushing into a wall.” You have to go out of your way to bug out Simin. So yeah, its still a bad example. The world boss was actually a better example.
The world boss bugs out simply because there are too many people. Same as melandru and a lot of other bosses. They just take sweet time to process who to attack.
There is nothing wrong with stacking. It employs group coordination, fun mechanics, actual skill (rather than pew pew I hit yew!) and requires a kind of cooperation folks don’t want to have in pugs.
Except, making CC skills worthless which is suppose to be big part of combat, causes players to be delusional about their skill, makes mobility worthless, protects themselves from ranged enemies, employs less group coordination, reduce fun mechanics, requires less skill, and requires only one cooperation order: “Stack here.”
You are lying to yourself that stacking takes skill. An average pug can stack and dps everything.
In conclusion, People want stacking because it is easy.
5x Warrior, 5x Ranger, 4x Elementalist, 4x Engineer,
4x Necromancer, 3x Mesmer, 4x Guardian, 4x Thief, 4 Revenant
4x Necromancer, 3x Mesmer, 4x Guardian, 4x Thief, 4 Revenant
Another one who’s never graduated out of AC school. Seriously, if all you run is AC you shouldn’t have any say here.
Go ahead just say “stack here” while even doing something as faceroll as ginva in your pug and let’s livestream it while we’re at it. It will be fun to watch. If FOTM 50 is asking too much of you, I’ll reduce the level to HotW P1. Simple enough, I hope? show me all these groups who just “stack here” at ginva and press 1 to win.
- “No tears, please. It’s a waste of good suffering.”