Guild Wars 2

I completely agree. I saw this and just shook my head. Dangerously close to P2W. What is next? A harvesting tool that also gets pristine spores?

Welp, that’s over the line, imo. It’s doesn’t sound like a big deal but it is obvious that they are testing how far they can go with the gemstore stuff.

This is where it starts.

Um… yeah… this is, I mean totally terrible…

…. where can I pick one of these up?

Indeed, it does feel a bit bad.

I am wondering if it is intended though, seeing as there is no information at all about it in-game as far as I have seen (I haven’t bought it, so might be visible on the item itself, but the store says nothing about it), which makes me think that it might actually be a bug.

I’m hoping it’s a bug, because if it’s not it’s definitely verging on P2W and I can’t stand that.

The only exception would be if the stuff you get from it can easily be gotten in game by anyone.

lordkrall.7241:

Indeed, it does feel a bit bad.

I am wondering if it is intended though, seeing as there is no information at all about it in-game as far as I have seen (I haven’t bought it, so might be visible on the item itself, but the store says nothing about it), which makes me think that it might actually be a bug.

I can’t see how it is a bug, that seems like it is a programmed option. Now, if the sprockets that drop are in place of gems, then I’m ok with that swap.

I’m glad to see the concordance on this topic. I have not seen a single defender of this, and that’s a plus. As a person with several unlimited tools, I love these items. But now I certainly feel obligated to buy this in order to stay ahead. I don’t know. It kind of sucks.

Lilith Ajit.6173:

I’m glad to see the concordance on this topic. I have not seen a single defender of this, and that’s a plus. As a person with several unlimited tools, I love these items. But now I certainly feel obligated to buy this in order to stay ahead. I don’t know. It kind of sucks.

Well you supported the whole “Pay 2 Convinience” thing with the purchase of the unlimited tools and now this is what you get.

Lilith Ajit.6173:

I’m glad to see the concordance on this topic. I have not seen a single defender of this, and that’s a plus. As a person with several unlimited tools, I love these items. But now I certainly feel obligated to buy this in order to stay ahead. I don’t know. It kind of sucks.

This is why I made this thread. If there is enough vocal opinion on this (and I strongly believe there will be), then I sincerely hope Anet takes the route of Flamekissed armor and make changes.

kokiman.2364:

Well you supported the whole “Pay 2 Convinience” thing with the purchase of the unlimited tools and now this is what you get.

There is a rather major difference between paying for convinience and paying for advantages though.

I for one will NOT buy this new set if they don’t fix/remove this thing even though I have bought multiple sets of the earlier ones.

lordkrall.7241:

Indeed, it does feel a bit bad.

I am wondering if it is intended though, seeing as there is no information at all about it in-game as far as I have seen (I haven’t bought it, so might be visible on the item itself, but the store says nothing about it), which makes me think that it might actually be a bug.

Not a bug as they are advertising it on their own website. Here is how they describe it: “A recent breakthrough in mining technology has let us make a new infinite mining pick. This self-repairing pick has a chance to add a Watchwork Sprocket to the rewards when used to mine ore veins!”

kokiman.2364:

Lilith Ajit.6173:

I’m glad to see the concordance on this topic. I have not seen a single defender of this, and that’s a plus. As a person with several unlimited tools, I love these items. But now I certainly feel obligated to buy this in order to stay ahead. I don’t know. It kind of sucks.

Well you supported the whole “Pay 2 Convinience” thing with the purchase of the unlimited tools and now this is what you get.

Well that’s a little mean, now isn’kitten

Anyway I’ll always pay 2 convenience. I’d rather do that, as a casual player with less than 4 hours a week to play. I’ll also always support anet while playing this game, because it is my hobby and I enjoy it.

(Granted, I used to play 12 h a day but you know, life happens)

Chrispy.5641:

ENDLESS GEAR TREADMILLL!!!

Anet, I am disappoint.

lordkrall.7241:

kokiman.2364:

Well you supported the whole “Pay 2 Convinience” thing with the purchase of the unlimited tools and now this is what you get.

There is a rather major difference between paying for convinience and paying for advantages though.

I for one will NOT buy this new set if they don’t fix/remove this thing even though I have bought multiple sets of the earlier ones.

Well like I said earlier they are trying to test how far they can get. People complained about the first unlimited pick aswell but later people didn’t care anymore and we got more of them + they got more expensive. Now they are trying to give people another incentive to buy them.

I just emptied my bank account buying a bunch of these for every character.

They hired a former Nexon ‘expert’ for monetization, afaik. Doesn’t this say everything?

Invictus.1503:

Not a bug as they are advertising it on their own website. Here is how they describe it: “A recent breakthrough in mining technology has let us make a new infinite mining pick. This self-repairing pick has a chance to add a Watchwork Sprocket to the rewards when used to mine ore veins!”

Ah, I had not seen that.
Since that is the case, I would say this is definitely crossing the line.

kokiman.2364:

Well like I said earlier they are trying to test how far they can get. People complained about the first unlimited pick aswell but later people didn’t care anymore and we got more of them + they got more expensive. Now they are trying to give people another incentive to buy them.

The increase in cost is because they changed them from Soulbound to Account bound though.

shootist.3607:

They hired a former Nexon ‘expert’ for monetization, afaik. Doesn’t this say everything?

They did hire say expert several MONTHS BEFORE the release of the game though. So it is not something new. And if she did all this, one would wonder why she waited over a year with it.

I agree. Even though sprockets are kind of useless imho it does set a bad precedent. Back off this kind of thing Anet. Please.

You do realize you can already buy 5 trillion sprocket by simply converting gem to gold right?

I fail to see how everyone suddenly get shocked they are paying for advantage.

lordkrall.7241:

They did hire say expert several MONTHS BEFORE the release of the game though. So it is not something new. And if she did all this, one would wonder why she waited over a year with it.

So people get used to it cough accountbound dyes cough

Nausiation.1469:

This is where it starts.

kokiman.2364:

So people get used to it cough accountbound dyes cough

You mean the change made quite some time before release, and with the alternative being a rather grindy mess that most people probably would have hated even more than the current system?

lordkrall.7241:

kokiman.2364:

So people get used to it cough accountbound dyes cough

You mean the change made quite some time before release, and with the alternative being a rather grindy mess that most people probably would have hated even more than the current system?

I think it was like 1 or 2 months after they “hired” her. The system we saw in the beta, was horrible aswell, that’s true.

laokoko.7403:

You do realize you can already buy 5 trillion sprocket by simply converting gem to gold right?

I fail to see how everyone suddenly get shocked they are paying for advantage.

Right now watchwork sprockets are +35c each.

Wouldn’t you be annoyed if anet offered a pick that offered a 20% chance at 4 chances on a node rather than 3? Cause that’s what is happening if you were to use this on a copper or mithril node. There is no telling the value of sprockets 6 months from now, either.

Vol.7601:

laokoko.7403:

You do realize you can already buy 5 trillion sprocket by simply converting gem to gold right?

I fail to see how everyone suddenly get shocked they are paying for advantage.

Right now watchwork sprockets are +35c each.

Wouldn’t you be annoyed if anet offered a pick that offered a 20% chance at 4 chances on a node rather than 3? Cause that’s what is happening if you were to use this on a copper or mithril node. There is no telling the value of sprockets 6 months from now, either.

So you are annoyed by that and not people can buy gold already?

I’m already annoyed. They dont’ need to introduce a new advantage mining pick for me to be annoyed.

I wouldn’t necessarily call it pay to win since the sprockets do not provide you any advantage over other players.

I’m definitely tempted to figure out if this is worth it. If there are any items created via sprockets that have a solid price I’ll be converting gold to gems for this.

Ayrilana.1396:

I wouldn’t necessarily call it pay to win since the sprockets do not provide you any advantage over other players.

Exactly. Which is exactly like buying gold. That don’t provide any advantage over other players.

I don’t get why people are suddenly bothered by things already happening.

The only thing the sprocket mining pick do is making people more gold. Which is already what you can do now with gem conversion.

Much as I love the infinite tools this is not ok.

the point is that they are infinite- it is a mere convenience with the added bonus of looking cool- adding sprockets is not ok- much as I love you, you should not have done this.
Call it a bug and remove it- you really don’t want to go there (PtW)

One solution they could provide is to start selling temporary picks with the same ability in-game. That would make this whole situation better and would mean these picks won’t offer anything not available in the game.

laokoko.7403:

Vol.7601:

laokoko.7403:

You do realize you can already buy 5 trillion sprocket by simply converting gem to gold right?

I fail to see how everyone suddenly get shocked they are paying for advantage.

Right now watchwork sprockets are +35c each.

Wouldn’t you be annoyed if anet offered a pick that offered a 20% chance at 4 chances on a node rather than 3? Cause that’s what is happening if you were to use this on a copper or mithril node. There is no telling the value of sprockets 6 months from now, either.

So you are annoyed by that and not people can buy gold already?

I’m already annoyed. They dont’ need to introduce a new advantage mining pick for me to be annoyed.

Not sure why you want to go that route, but OK.

People can legitimately buy gold, yes, but what can they do with it that makes them better than people who don’t? Everything in this game can be accessed by normal players.

You can ‘buy’ gold and get a legendary, or you can make it.
You can ‘buy’ gold and get exotics, or you can get it through karma/game gold/other

The difference with this pick is that there is no other alternative in game to get it (strictly speaking across mining picks). No other mining pick in game so far can give a 20% chance at sprockets. This one does. That’s not good.

The reality is you can convert gold to gem too.

I get many people are unhappy though.

I would be very unhappy also. But I give up being the carrot chaser.

P2W means that you are using real $ to become better than other players. It’s completely unfair and ugly.

Is this a dangerous precedent? Yes. But is this new mining pick P2W? No way. It’s the opposite, actually. You are spending a massive amount of gems to get more conveniently a material that you could otherwise get for much cheaper from the TP.

It’s convenient fluff.

It depend how much those sprocket will went up. I have maybe 10 toons filled with sprocket, by the look of it, it won’t went up too much.

Definatly pay to win.

Don’t forget, the new pick is account bound as well. the older picks are not

Definitely not a fan of this, keep any infinite tools as pure convenience/cosmetic items, no bonus loot.

I think a perfectly good conversation about the gem shop was knee capped and dumped into the lake so that players can whine and complain… Seriously, do you all think ANet would take something like this seriously?

Passafist.2035:

Don’t forget, the new pick is account bound as well. the older picks are not

The older picks were later changed to account bound. You just need to manually do it yourself through a vendor.

Passafist.2035:

Don’t forget, the new pick is account bound as well. the older picks are not

“Soulbound infinite gathering tools can be exchanged for account-bound versions through the Black Lion Weapons Specialists. These NPCs can be found near the Black Lion Traders in every city that hosts a Trading Post. For example, in Lion’s Arch the Black Lion Weapons Specialists are located on the second floor and can be reached by taking either stairway adjacent to the Black Lion Traders. Note: Be sure to un-equip any infinite gathering tools before speaking to a Black Lion Weapons Specialist because these items cannot be exchanged if they are equipped.”

2 months ago.

I remember that when you payed around 25 Gold for the first picks people did the math and said that you have to harvest maybe 65.000 time so that you have started to save money against buying orichalcum picks.

Now .. if you have harvest over 65.000 that item will suddenly also be pay to win since every 100 picks you save the money you would else have to pay for a new pick.

Now however a new pick costs what ? 80 Gold maybe ? So you have to pick maybe 180.000 times to get back the money. If you save 6,7 copper per pick now because of the sprockets you will maybe still have to pick over 100.000 times that the investment pays of.

lordkrall.7241:

One solution they could provide is to start selling temporary picks with the same ability in-game. That would make this whole situation better and would mean these picks won’t offer anything not available in the game.

+1 … yeah this would be the ideal solution for this issue I agree.

DiogoSilva.7089:

P2W means that you are using real $ to become better than other players. It’s completely unfair and ugly.

Is this a dangerous precedent? Yes. But is this new mining pick P2W? No way. It’s the opposite, actually. You are spending a massive amount of gems to get more conveniently a material that you could otherwise get for much cheaper from the TP.

It’s convenient fluff.

The only reason the sprockets are currently cheap is because you can still get them. Once Scarlet is gone the major source of sprockets is gone too. The prices start to go up. Suddenly have an extra 20% chance to get sprockets is quite lucrative, giving anyone who has the pick an advantage.

I guess for 800 gems (or whatever the tool costs) you could get more sprockets right now then you will mine the next 5 years with the pick … but as a matter of principal I agree, not cool.

Getting mining nodes as part of a reward through play is one thing, getting extras like that with a bought item is not right.

Why not double the yield of a node then? 20% chance to convert every normal node into a rich node for yourself with the “MineMorePickMe” pick, now from your convenient convenience store.

Nope, that wouldn’t be right either, which is why those tools are only as good as the best regular in-game tool.

This makes them better.

I’m not seeing the pay to win element here. Where is the gameplay advantage from sprockets? How would this be any different from saying using real money to buy gems to make gold to buy sprockets? This is just an extra step in the process.

Also, we can get sprockets from the current meta and boss rewards. There is nothing to say watchwork drops aren’t permanent as we don’t know if the watchwork mobs are staying around post-season LS.

laokoko.7403:

It depend how much those sprocket will went up. I have maybe 10 toons filled with sprocket, by the look of it, it won’t went up too much.

You do realize that the price of sprockets will fall? This is one of the reasons that its not pay to win because now there will be an abundant surplus of an item that has no real use other than for a few things.

If be more worried about a pick that provided 20% for silk or linen scraps. However it would still not be pay to win. Anything that is sellable on the TP will eventually have its value lowered if its easier to get.

Beldin.5498:

I remember that when you payed around 25 Gold for the first picks people did the math and said that you have to harvest maybe 65.000 time so that you have started to save money against buying orichalcum picks.

Now .. if you have harvest over 65.000 that item will suddenly also be pay to win since every 100 picks you save the money you would else have to pay for a new pick.

Now however a new pick costs what ? 80 Gold maybe ? So you have to pick maybe 180.000 times to get back the money. If you save 6,7 copper per pick now because of the sprockets you will maybe still have to pick over 100.000 times that the investment pays of.

And because this is highly unrealistic, and demands a really heavy time investment and devout dedication, there is nothing remotely close to P2W behind this mining pick.

Even in the day where players will finally save money out of this, they will do so not because they “bought to win”, but because of their crazy dedication.

1. I don’t see the Pay 2 Win in it since I have already got a Sprocket lode in my home.
2. I am probably going to get one since I need a infinete mining pick.
3. I was pretty sure something like this where comming when seeing this rare Sprocket crafting thing that costs 500 sprockets to make.
4. For some reason I don’t think Scarlet minion attacks will stop even after scarlet LS, maby it will be remoduled to be interesting again.
5. Sprockets are not gone yet, don’t write doomsday on your calendar just yet but I see your point (Your = People who’s opinion it is pay2win).