Guild Wars 2

[iR] Need Quick Buttons? No space for it?

Hamfast.8719:

Hey, guys! Hop on over to THIS thread:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Share-your-Mix-n-Match-TOWN-CLOTHES

…and post your Mix ‘n’ Match Town Clothes pictures to show ANet in a positive way how much you will miss it if they carry through with this ugly scenario!

There was already a thread like yours and it was merged with the present feedback one. But I will be happy to participate again. Actually I will take more screenshots. And add the video I made.

Let’s try with all our resources.

Xyonon.3987:

No new statement from ANet? Either they are working or they just don’t care :/

1) They’ve made their statement. It is final. You will not get what you want.

2) Even if through some miracle someone was able to force through all the levels of red tape and convince the decision makers to change their mind, it is 7 am Monday morning on the west coast. They won’t be making any statements at this time of day.

All my town cloth outfits are mixed and matched.
I love the way they look now since it’s especially hard to find good outfits for Charr.

I think giving people the freedom to mix and match really adds to the game!

1) Mad Kings + Horns (I can’t remember what event they were from anymore, sorry)
+ Drill Toy

2) Ringmaster’kitten + Witches outfit – Bouquet of Roses Toy

3) The cook’s outfit muzzle + Blood Prince everything else

I wholeheartedly agree with this thread

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

Care to elaborate?

Mixable pieces as in pieces that will be added to our light/medium/heavy armour wardrobe, or as in pieces we can mix and match in the “outfits”?

Also, is there a list of each individual item that will become tonics?

It would be nice to know specifically, piece for piece, what is going to be made into Armour compatible, Outfits, and Tonics.
I know that some information has been provided, but not a complete Piece for Piece / Category listing.
Wishful thinking, but still.

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

Will there be any guarantee that any new pieces won’t completely change in the future so that they are completely unusable for the purposes for which they were purchased?

Curtis, what about the possibility of making ALL town clothes into outfits instead of tonics? As you said, they will have “complimentary pieces” so they will become complete outfits anyway. Why not making them into dyeable outfits and making all outfits refundable? That way we will lose, but not as much as having part of them into useless undyeable tonics, and maybe in the future they will be implemented again as separated pieces. And the outfits for these pieces have already been designed, according to what you said.

I so fear in the future tonics will be completely forgotten and left the way they’re going to be changed now….

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

“continue” is kind of vague… up until now I don’t think you’ve released anything but Shoulder and Glove skins… any chance we will see the rest of the armor pieces at some point?

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

So if we spend MORE money in the gem store, we will get back the functionality of the stuff we already purchased?

I think not. You’re really shooting yourself in the foot with regards to the people who spend the most in the gemstore for pure fluff if you go ahead with this.

If you’re going to change townclothes, make ALL of them armor sets and ALL of them dyeable. Or leave them as is. OR offer back full refund on ALL of them, including outfits, the way you did with the flamekissed armor. Because this is some very poor customer service and will likely be reflected as such.

I’m a huge fan of this game, been playing since beta. This change annoyed me so much that myself and my group of friends all signed up for the EQnext beta. At least EQ has always supported RP.

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

That’s great and all for armor. But what about in the case of items that would be considered “town clothing”?

Because you keep going on about how much more customization this is going to bring, but you haven’t actually provided much proof seeing as outfits are becoming “one and done”, and discontinued items are becoming tonics.

What is the future of town-like clothing? Is it outfits, or separate item skins? How is this going down, ultimately?

I think this sums it up
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collateral_damage
“Collateral damage is damage to things that are incidental to the intended target. It is frequently used as a military term where it can refer to the incidental destruction of civilian property and non-combatant casualties”

yeah i feel like a casualty in this town clothes issue.

Personally, I would like to mention, I am willing to wait. Getting stuff like this fixed takes time for it to work through the bureaucracy, and changing features takes time – often quite a lot of time – to code. It is a bit frustrating to not get more definitive answers, but it’s only been a few days. So I would just like to add my voice as one of the people who’s very much willing to wait, if it means the end result will be the ability to still do all the things I do now with the items I paid real money for.

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

Then what’s the point of Outfits? I thought you said you didn’t want to have to do armor for three different weight classes, and that’s why there are combat Outfits now. But you’re still going to release pieces of armor that work with all three weights? Why can’t you do that to the pieces of town clothing we already paid for instead of making more new meshes and asking for more money for them?

And I’m with everyone else: what guarantee do we have that if we buy armor now, it will stay useable as it is and won’t be changed with only a couple weeks’ notice? I understand you can’t give us technical information or whatever, but at least give us something to explain why you would completely change the function of a gem store item and continue to sell it after you knew you were changing it. (Sure, you yanked some of the individual Town Clothes pieces but lied about the reason.)

It’ll do you no good to release more stuff in the future if everyone’s afraid you’re gonna turn it into something different and not refund it.

Voice of ANet Speaking Through Curtis… We need you to at least tell us if you’re working on a plan or something. How about “we will have an intern translate one piece of town clothing to armor a week until they are all available as mix and match pieces” or something. That intern would become a folk hero. We would sing songs in his or her honor. (No seriously, I really probably would.) Or “we will bring back the town clothes tab in addition to the clothing tab until a better solution can be made.” Or even “we are working on a solution and trying to address your complaints.” Can you give us that? Can you say you hear our complaints? Do you have the clearance to do that? Can you tell us whether you have clearance to tell us whether you hear our complaints?

…Blink once for “We are not recording complaints at this time and are only here to answer questions,” blink twice for “we hear your complaints but can’t do anything about them at this time so all we can do is answer questions,” blink three times for “we hear your complaints and are working on a solution but can’t tell you what that solution is,” blink four times for “We hear your complaints but I can’t say what we are or are not doing about them”….

Bensozia.8071:

I think this sums it up
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collateral_damage
“Collateral damage is damage to things that are incidental to the intended target. It is frequently used as a military term where it can refer to the incidental destruction of civilian property and non-combatant casualties”

yeah i feel like a casualty in this town clothes issue.

I don’t think it is a good term. Removing the town clothes slots is a design decision, so it’s actually an intended damage. You can’t call it collateral damage when you choose to throw a nuke on a bad guy and destroys everything around him instead of using sniper rifle. This is the same.

Still can’t believe Anet is not re-thinking about this. There is absolutley no reason to don’t have both systems working. And is an incredible oportunity to earn money that they are wasting with this decision.

Malvien.3264:

I still loathe the town clothes change with passion, but virtually everything I have to say about the issue has already been said.

BUT. I’m here to share something about the new costumes that came to my mind a while ago: dyeing them. Curtis said earlier that the costumes will still be dyeable, with up to 4 dye channels depending on outfit. However, I’m concerned that something like THIS will happen.

On the left there’s the fancy winter outfit dyed like I want it to be, each piece dyed individually. If I’ve understood correctly, after the patch that colour combination won’t be possible anymore, because it uses 5 colours in total. Worst case scenario, Anet will ruin the dye channels like in the picture on the right – my pants and vest don’t match anymore, the boots and gloves are the same colour as the coat, etc…

And of course some more creative dye jobs, like having the top and bottom halves of the coat be different colours entirely, will definitely be impossible when the pieces can no longer be dyed individually.

(Fashion is SERIOUS BUSINESS.)

I have concerns about this as well. On my chef’s outfit I dyed the top crimson and left the pants white. The contrast looks great! If the outfit gets dyed as a whole, I won’t be able to do this anymore.

Each minute Anet doesn’t confirm the return of town clothes, Grenth kills a little quaggan.

Help quaggans!!

shogei.8015:

Malvien.3264:

I still loathe the town clothes change with passion, but virtually everything I have to say about the issue has already been said.

BUT. I’m here to share something about the new costumes that came to my mind a while ago: dyeing them. Curtis said earlier that the costumes will still be dyeable, with up to 4 dye channels depending on outfit. However, I’m concerned that something like THIS will happen.

On the left there’s the fancy winter outfit dyed like I want it to be, each piece dyed individually. If I’ve understood correctly, after the patch that colour combination won’t be possible anymore, because it uses 5 colours in total. Worst case scenario, Anet will ruin the dye channels like in the picture on the right – my pants and vest don’t match anymore, the boots and gloves are the same colour as the coat, etc…

And of course some more creative dye jobs, like having the top and bottom halves of the coat be different colours entirely, will definitely be impossible when the pieces can no longer be dyed individually.

(Fashion is SERIOUS BUSINESS.)

I have concerns about this as well. On my chef’s outfit I dyed the top crimson and left the pants white. The contrast looks great! If the outfit gets dyed as a whole, I won’t be able to do this anymore.

I have a feeling its going to work like the dye preview.

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

TY Curtis! Hey, for whatever it’s worth, please don’t take anything we say personally. If anything, take it with a bit of pride that we care THAT MUCH about the appearance side of the game.

For mix and match, the question we’re all waiting for is to find out WHAT is going to be made into armor or not. Because Anet would be Blunderbussing themselves in the foot if they made everything into sets. I have no doubt Curtis you are way ahead of the rest of us on knowing that.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

“continue” is kind of vague… up until now I don’t think you’ve released anything but Shoulder and Glove skins… any chance we will see the rest of the armor pieces at some point?

I think you meant to say “HUGE FLOATING Shoulder” and “OVERSIZED glove” skins.

But then again, a friend showed me his World of Warcraft game again. Compared to that, GW2’s stuff is tiny!

But weird styling aside, we would like some individual CLOTHING-LOOK pieces, not armors. (Well, both actually.)

And I can’t stress this enough… NO TONICS FOR CLOTHING! It gives us ZERO customizability, and they come off by themselves when you don’t want them to.

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

That’s nice, but this thread is about townclothing.

you know anet do not owe you an answer ……… they dont even need to make you understand why they did what they did again they do not owe you anything

they did answer they did give you one and most of you still complain and demand answers

they have answered end of

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

You may not have intended it but this answer sounds a bit deceptive. Narthexia was in all likelihood referencing mix and match town clothes, yet your response only references armor pieces, completely sidestepping the question. If you meant town clothes will continue to be mix and match then… I don’t know how to reconcile that with anything that has been said so far.

Edit: because I do not want to incite a flame war I will not create a new post. But to chemiclord I must say, what is the use of such an nonconstructive post? We have valid complaints, and in telling us to shut up you are derailing the thread for no reason. If no company ever changed a stance based on customer complaints we would live in a pretty terrible society.

The point is there aren’t GOING to be “town clothes” any longer. They will either be one-piece “outfits” or armor skins.

There will not be mix-and-match town clothes. Full stop. Arena.net has not moved from their original position. They will not change their mind.

If that breaks the game for you, it is time to walk away.

Johasthan.1327:

Each minute Anet doesn’t confirm the return of town clothes, Grenth kills a little quaggan.

Help quaggans!!

Town clothes are there, but they’re in an outfit, so they aren’t mix ’n match. But, they are something much better, they can be shown in combat (worn over your armor), also (you can hide them to show your armor or not I assume like GW1)!

From the impression I get, (and I have a question thread for this to confirm), I think that town-clothes headpieces will turn into armor helm skins. But the town clothes pants/shirts (now taken out of the store) will be turned into endless tonics.

“Purchasing an outfit will unlock it for all characters on your account to use. Outfits will replace the look of equipped armors, are equipped in a separate appearance slot, and do not require Transmutation Charges to use. Single items, such as the Fuzzy Hats and Scarlet’s Spaulders, will be unlocked for your entire account and usable with any armor weight. Some basic clothing items that are no longer available for purchase will be converted into endless tonics.”

nibblesalil.3561:

you know anet do not owe you an answer ……… they dont even need to make you understand why they did what they did again they do not owe you anything

We paid for the game, we paid for the town clothing items. We are customers. They kitten well owe us better and less vague answers than what have been thrown out.

I am really getting sick of the video game industry getting a free pass for crap like this that would never fly in any other business in any other industry.

The worst part is when people like you defend it, claiming answers aren’t owed despite the fact people have paid for these products.

chemiclord.3978:

The point is there aren’t GOING to be “town clothes” any longer. They will either be one-piece “outfits” or armor skins.

There will not be mix-and-match town clothes. Full stop. Arena.net has not moved from their original position. They will not change their mind.

If that breaks the game for you, it is time to walk away.

Oh goody, you’re back to your non-understanding, cold shoulder, completely useless self.

And here I thought maybe you had changed for the better.

Gene Archer.8560:

Oh goody, you’re back to your non-understanding, cold shoulder, completely useless self.

And here I thought maybe you had changed for the better.

Buddy, I am all for making your voice heard. I am all for demanding a company explain themselves.

But there comes a point where protesting and complaining stop being productive. How many times does Arena.net have to repeat the same answers before you say, “Fine. We’re done. Goodbye?”

They’re not going to outright say, “Listen… we’ve decided you aren’t worth catering to, and we’re willing to accept this small loss of revenue for what we feel is to the overall improvement of the game and better revenue going forward.”

If that is what you’re waiting for… you’re going to be waiting a VERY long time. Otherwise, I really don’t understand what has been so unclear or confusing about what has been said. It’s perfectly clear to me; “town clothes” as you know it are going away April 15th, and no amount of protest is going to change that.

And my advice is not a cold shoulder… it’s honest advice. At this point, the ONLY thing that is going to change their stance is for the players to SHOW them they are making a mistake by leaving. If you REALLY represent the support you think you do, it’ll show in their pocketbook, and they will have no choice but to cater to you or the game will flounder.

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

Will you re-release the gathering shorts, witch boots and sleeveless hoodie(s) as mix and match skins? Perhaps put an in game vendor in that will allow us to exchange the endless tonics for them?

Or are those no longer appropriate or healthy?

chemiclord.3978:

Buddy, I am all for making your voice heard. I am all for demanding a company explain themselves.

No, you clearly are not. Except for a short while there, from the beginning, your stance has been: “Everyone has said their piece so shut up and stop posting, this thread is pointless, it will only bring rage.”

But you know what? Aside from myself, arguably at this point, it really hasn’t. It’s still been productive, and more than that, it’s kept this matter in the limelight by remaining active, completely with a red stamp showing dev activity within, even if that activity isn’t what people are hoping for.

It’s got all the bells and whistles that say “Hey, keep looking at me!”

At least until a mod cans it. But you aren’t a mod, so stop trying to act like one. Stop trying to get people to stop posting. You think the thread has run its course, and that’s fine. You’re entitled to that opinion.

So stop posting here.

But there comes a point where protesting and complaining stop being productive.

I disagree, and I think you do, too, since you continue to protest and complain that people need to stop posting and just leave the game, despite nobody heeding your advice.

So, in a similar question to yourself. How many times does everyone here have to keep up with their posts before you say “Fine. Goodbye.” ?

Gene Archer.8560:

So, in a similar question to yourself. How many times does everyone here have to keep up with their posts before you say “Fine. Goodbye.” ?

You’re ARE correct that the thread hasn’t completely spiraled out of control with rage. I’m honestly surprised by that considering how intense the emotions have been. So, yay for you.

Right now, all we’ve got is an echo chamber of the same people and one dev effectively saying, “Nope. Still not gonna change our mind.”

So, yeah… I’m sticking my oar in and noting how pointless it is. I’m sorry you don’t like it. I’m sorry you want a fight, and aren’t getting one.

If people want to ignore my advice, hell, no skin off my teeth.

chemiclord.3978:

Gene Archer.8560:

Oh goody, you’re back to your non-understanding, cold shoulder, completely useless self.

And here I thought maybe you had changed for the better.

Buddy, I am all for making your voice heard. I am all for demanding a company explain themselves.

But there comes a point where protesting and complaining stop being productive. How many times does Arena.net have to repeat the same answers before you say, “Fine. We’re done. Goodbye?”

They’re not going to outright say, “Listen… we’ve decided you aren’t worth catering to, and we’re willing to accept this small loss of revenue for what we feel is to the overall improvement of the game and better revenue going forward.”

If that is what you’re waiting for… you’re going to be waiting a VERY long time. Otherwise, I really don’t understand what has been so unclear or confusing about what has been said. It’s perfectly clear to me; “town clothes” as you know it are going away April 15th, and no amount of protest is going to change that.

And my advice is not a cold shoulder… it’s honest advice. At this point, the ONLY thing that is going to change their stance is for the players to SHOW them they are making a mistake by leaving. If you REALLY represent the support you think you do, it’ll show in their pocketbook, and they will have no choice but to cater to you or the game will flounder.

We don’t have to leave, given that the game is free-to-play… we simply have to stop paying. And many people in this thread have declared their intention to do exactly that, so, well, they’re following your advice. We’re just giving ANet some advance warning so that they become very aware of the cause of the problem and don’t think “well, obviously skins just don’t sell, time to stop making them.”

The thing is, ANet needs to know exactly what the problem is in order to fix it, and the players who were unaware need to know that they can no longer make purchases from the gem store without having to worry that their purchases will be altered. (And pray that ANet does not alter them further…) In order to hasten the restoration of Town Clothes AFTER they’re taken away on the 15th, and to mitigate the damage, it is best to apply pressure to the wound and keep the pressure constant so ANet doesn’t continue to bleed stupidity. They’re a company made of many different people, after all, and chances are some of those people are going to want some ammunition from the players for their “we told you getting rid of Town Clothes was a bad idea” arguments. Even a single sympathetic ANet dev can point out to the others, “Here are over two dozen pages’ worth of angry reactions from players, some suggestions for how we can fix this, and some good points about how this affects the player base’s faith in the digital products we sell, minus the space taken up by a few posts from Chemiclord telling everyone to shut up because he doesn’t think there’s a point to these over two dozen pages I am now citing to you.”

Simply ceasing to talk about the whole thing won’t make things any better. I understand your argument for voting with your wallet, but not your argument against voting with words. Your only argument has really been “there’s no point in trying because nobody is listening and nothing can change,” and unless you are The Voice of ANet Speaking Through Chemiclord (which you are not, as that’s Curtis’s job, poor guy), you have absolutely no way of knowing that.

chemiclord.3978:

Gene Archer.8560:

So, in a similar question to yourself. How many times does everyone here have to keep up with their posts before you say “Fine. Goodbye.” ?

You’re ARE correct that the thread hasn’t completely spiraled out of control with rage. I’m honestly surprised by that considering how intense the emotions have been. So, yay for you.

Right now, all we’ve got is an echo chamber of the same people and one dev effectively saying, “Nope. Still not gonna change our mind.”

So, yeah… I’m sticking my oar in and noting how pointless it is. I’m sorry you don’t like it. I’m sorry you want a fight, and aren’t getting one.

If people want to ignore my advice, hell, no skin off my teeth.

He doesn’t want a fight. He wants you to stop posting. As do we all. To encourage you, I give you my solemn guarantee that I will not respond to any further post of yours. I encourage everybody else to do the same.

To any mods reading: please don’t take this as a flame war. We are only attempting to preserve the tone of this thread.

chemiclord.3978:

So, yeah… I’m sticking my oar in and noting how pointless it is. I’m sorry you don’t like it.

It’s amazing how well you missed the point of what I was saying.

I mean, you’re not…lost to the irony (?) of what you’re doing…are you?

Twyll Blackleaf.9641:

Simply ceasing to talk about the whole thing won’t make things any better. I understand your argument for voting with your wallet, but not your argument against voting with words. Your only argument has really been “there’s no point in trying because nobody is listening and nothing can change,” and unless you are The Voice of ANet Speaking Through Chemiclord (which you are not, as that’s Curtis’s job, poor guy), you have absolutely no way of knowing that.

Here’s the thing.

MMOs without a subscription rely on two things:

A) People buying from a cash shop.

B) A large number of players, even if they DON’T buy from the cash shop.

Population is the lifeblood of an MMO. A populated world draws in more people, who a developer hopes will buy from the cash shop (and metrics shows they will).

If you keep playing the game, what that tells a marketer is they just need to offer you the right thing to get you sucking at their teat again. And even if you don’t, they can use the numbers to entice more people in, and those people quite likely WILL give ‘em a tug. Remember the press release about 450,000+ concurrent users or something like that? I can guarantee you they didn’t all buy gems.

In short; continuing to play only encourages them to stay the course. No, it doesn’t seem like it makes much logical sense at first glance; but as long as you are playing, you are an asset to them.

If you really want to send a message, you need to walk away, and take those that feel the way you do with you. That’s not a dismissal, that’s not a cold shoulder. I’m not trying to force you out or say what you think isn’t important. But that’s how you get a company to change course. If this is a big, game-breaking mistake, you need to show them, not tell them.

It’s the reason why we’re swimming in an Ascended grind. It’s the reason why a lot of the original manifesto had to be compromised for the content locusts. Because people weren’t playing, and Arena.net’s numbers were suffering.

I dunno; maybe I’ve just been made too cynical over the years. Maybe this sort of passive resistance will work in this case. But I don’t see it. Arena.net seems pretty kitten committed to this, and I don’t see how they can backtrack on it in two weeks time.

chemiclord.3978:

Right now, all we’ve got is an echo chamber of the same people and one dev effectively saying, “Nope. Still not gonna change our mind.”

And yet there has been only one official “answer” post and a few clarifications; it’s pretty clear that Curtis has not been given another answer from The Voice of ANet yet because they’re still debating— unless you think they’re content to sit there and let players get angry at them without a single attempt to rectify the situation.

chemiclord.3978:

So, yeah… I’m sticking my oar in and noting how pointless it is. I’m sorry you don’t like it. I’m sorry you want a fight, and aren’t getting one.

If people want to ignore my advice, hell, no skin off my teeth.

I simply fail to see the point of your advice. Why tell people NOT to voice their opinions? Is it not better to say something rather than just assuming we will not be heard? I’m pretty sure everyone posting here is already operating under the assumption that there is a chance we will not be heard, a chance we will be heard and ignored… but also a chance that we will be heard and our concerns looked into. And what more can you ask for than that?

If it is truly no skin off your teeth, then your continued involvement in the conversation baffles me; do you feel like it is your sworn duty to save people the time they would spend typing up forum responses? Do you want people not to have a feeling of agency in the matter at all? If you really wanted to tell people to vote with their money, then you’d be doing that instead of making it a short addendum to every post about how they shouldn’t talk about the reasons for doing so.

I only respond to you to try to keep you from preventing others from voicing their opinions with your fatalism. You call this an echo chamber… well maybe it wouldn’t be if you would stop discouraging other people from posting too!

I can’t swear that I will stop replying to your posts because honestly I think they are unhelpful and anyone coming into this thread and only seeing the last page needs not to be discouraged from adding an opinion; but instead I give you rock ’n roll in the hopes that you will listen to it and meditate upon how your posts have no actual benefit (beyond prompting me to introduce people to the combined amazingness of Slash and Miles Kennedy in Apocalyptic Love, because my ears, that’s a good album).

Voices added to the chorus of discontent are useful. Suggestions on how to fix things (not “suggestions” to stop trying at all) are useful. Questions are useful and answers to them are useful. Critiques are useful. Even speculation regarding ANet’s reasoning is useful. Posts encouraging others to make useful posts by responding to your inherently discouraging posts are useful but may not offset your own posts’ non-usefulness. Please find something to post that is useful.

The thing about this is that I don’t actually understand why they are doing it. Other changes that are unpopular with the community had a logical reason behind it even if we didn’t like it.

New armours being added to the gem store instead of earned in game = people spend money on gems
New weapons hidden behind black lion chests = people spend money on gems to buy keys
Ascended gear and infusions = desperate attempt to keep the audience that did no research on the game and just jump from mmo launch to mmo launch complaining about everything

But this seems designed to actively discourage people from buying stuff from the gem store by making us lose trust that we will actually get to keep the items we bought and by making the items less desirable for more people to buy them, while simultaneously removing the reason a part of the player base plays for (role playing and dress up).

chemiclord.3978:

Gene Archer.8560:

Oh goody, you’re back to your non-understanding, cold shoulder, completely useless self.

And here I thought maybe you had changed for the better.

But there comes a point where protesting and complaining stop being productive. How many times does Arena.net have to repeat the same answers before you say, “Fine. We’re done. Goodbye?”

First of all, I don’t want to be rude. English is not my main language, and all this may sound harder or tougher that it is, and don’t want to start a pointless discusion.

That being said, your statement is not true, plain and simple. It don’t stop being productive. We are speaking simply of an MMO game which development is endless (until closing), so every opinion and statement the developers ever said can be changing in any moment (won’t be the first time). This happens every day in this industry. See what happend with Sim City and the always online.

We are telling Anet we want Town Clothes, and there are plenty of good post with really good arguments that won’t change when the patch is released. So we will continue until each one consider enough. It is our right. Because as customers we have very legit reasons to be angry when feel cheated with our buys. Because as players we have opinions on what can be better, or funnier or what we have. And because since there is a forum to express our opinions, our opinions and questions will be expressed.

If you are tired about this topic, you don’t care or have nothing to say about it, then follow your own advice and say goodbye to this thread. If you agree with us, if you disagree with us, If you have questions, then post it all here. But saying us to keep quiet is a bit offensive.

We really believe the town clothes as it was were a really cool feature, good for the game, for the players good for the business. And we also believe that this design decision harms the game, the business and over all, the players and consumers we are.

chemiclord.3978:

(snipsnip)
If you really want to send a message, you need to walk away, and take those that feel the way you do with you. That’s not a dismissal, that’s not a cold shoulder. I’m not trying to force you out or say what you think isn’t important. But that’s how you get a company to change course. If this is a big, game-breaking mistake, you need to show them, not tell them.

It’s the reason why we’re swimming in an Ascended grind. It’s the reason why a lot of the original manifesto had to be compromised for the content locusts. Because people weren’t playing, and Arena.net’s numbers were suffering.

I dunno; maybe I’ve just been made too cynical over the years. Maybe this sort of passive resistance will work in this case. But I don’t see it. Arena.net seems pretty kitten committed to this, and I don’t see how they can backtrack on it in two weeks time.

Okay, that was a far more useful post than “just stop talking about it,” and I thank you for elaborating and respect your viewpoint. However, I must disagree. There is such thing, in my eyes, as a mistake that is big but not game-breaking; and the fact remains that GW2 is, to me and many others, a very good game, regardless of mistakes ANet might make along the way. I want them to be able to trust in my loyalty to the excellent product they created, with the provision that they don’t destroy what was originally there; and if we all just walk away, they’ll keep changing things and trying to grab new customers rather than trying to get the old customers to return with a change that might be harder to accomplish but better at building long-term loyalty. Because that’s the thing; fixing Town Clothes will be more difficult than just pumping out a bunch of shiny new one-piece Outfits, but it will also be more rewarding in terms of customer loyalty versus in terms of new customers.

Also, I don’t think most of us expect them to be able to fix everything in two weeks. I do think it’s a good idea to give them a head start on fixing it and to remind them that we want to know that they are dedicated to fixing it and are at least working on a plan to bring the Town Clothes system into a more effective combination with the new Wardrobe.

Twyll Blackleaf.9641:

Also, I don’t think most of us expect them to be able to fix everything in two weeks. I do think it’s a good idea to give them a head start on fixing it and to remind them that we want to know that they are dedicated to fixing it and are at least working on a plan to bring the Town Clothes system into a more effective combination with the new Wardrobe.

And I appreciate that very reasoned answer.

Because THAT is something that I think is doable… in time… as long as there is an understanding that what you had before likely isn’t going to be perfectly replicated. They aren’t going to be able to turn back the clock, if you will, but they might be willing to work with you going forward.

Levetty.1279:

The thing about this is that I don’t actually understand why they are doing it. Other changes that are unpopular with the community had a logical reason behind it even if we didn’t like it.

(snipping examples for brevity’s sake)

But this seems designed to actively discourage people from buying stuff from the gem store by making us lose trust that we will actually get to keep the items we bought and by making the items less desirable for more people to buy them, while simultaneously removing the reason a part of the player base plays for (role playing and dress up).

I believe the reason is that they believed it would be pleasing a larger population of the player base to make Town Clothes wearable in combat, and that there were issues making the existing Town Clothes system work with the Wardrobe and with combat. (See my Socratic Dialogue-esque posts of a paraphrase of a conversation between me and my boyfriend discussing potential reasons that there would be technical issues, though neither of us is much of an authority; speculation is speculation.) However, either they didn’t really foresee that people would be upset with the new system because they didn’t realize that we mix and match things instead of using entire sets (since we buy them as sets, they didn’t really have a way of knowing that, perhaps), or they thought it would be an acceptable tradeoff for the new functionality, not really thinking through the whole “changing things people bought with real money” = “eroding player trust” part of the issue.

On the surface, there don’t really seem to be reasons for this baffling change; that’s why ANet’s insufficient communication has been so frustrating and so damaging, I think. Of course, if it’s all based in technical issues, they really can’t tell us the problem due to the secretive nature of game development; but they could still be answering concerns regarding the money-related side of this mess a bit better, I think, and letting us know that they are going to fix it.

I still need to get a confirmation on single-item available town clothes, but this is my understanding of how things work:

1. All Gem Store items go account wide
2. Single-item currently available town clothes turn into helm skins of any armor weight (what I need a confirmation on).
3. You will be able to wear your town clothes as an outfit in combat like in GW1 (over your armor), which you can show or hide as you please (except perhaps in PvP).
4. Town clothes are a singular outfit, but from what I understand you can hide the head piece.

Town clothes are an outfit due to them needing to fit “over” any armor weight. They had to do this in GW1 (they were able to be used in combat “over” armor). I assume there is a fair reason for it and it was something due to them needing to be used in combat.

I’m honestly not expecting it in GW2, but then again, I did not expect to even be able to wear town clothes in battle or have account wide skins, so I think there’s hope. But keep in mind, this took a long time to implement.

What might happen to those pieces in the future is their incorporation into an armor set, which note, you can use in town or in battle currently anyway and are completely mix and matchable.

With regards to buying/not buying town clothes based on this change… Do whatever you want. But I will finally start buying town clothes and armors. I love this change. I think I might buy my first town clothes and my first armor set from them once the update comes as a thank you (along with maybe reading glasses too!).

In the end, though, keep hope up! This update, to me, is beyond my wildest dreams (I don’t know what could make it better and it seems too good to be true to me)!

What’s the verdict on our basic town clothes that we had at the start? Will they be skins or a costume? Or will they remain at all? Anyone heard anything or have an educated guess?

Hamfast.8719:

What’s the verdict on our basic town clothes that we had at the start? Will they be skins or a costume? Or will they remain at all? Anyone heard anything or have an educated guess?

My educated guess is that they will be an outfit, as they are still currently “available” (though not in a for purchase sense).

Lorelei.7809:

(snip)

In the end, though, keep hope up! This update, to me, is beyond my wildest dreams (I don’t know what could make it better and it seems too good to be true to me)!

I understand the need to keep up hope— but I also understand, and hope you understand, that anything you buy from ANet now stands the chance of being changed will little to no warning and not refunded, because it has been demonstrated that this can in fact happen (whether ANet wanted this, or was forced by NCSoft is hard to say, but the result is the same).

I would love to buy more things from them, but I feel like that would be sending entirely the wrong message; and while I’m quite excited about the vast majority of this patch, the underlying problems are too large to ignore until we get some assurance that they (“they” perhaps meaning “money-minded bureaucrats who put pressure on actual devs and have no connection with the players” here) aren’t going to assume that once they’ve got our money, they’ve got it, and it doesn’t matter what they do to what we bought with it in order to make people buy more things with the least effort.

They are trying to get you to buy things without bothering to spend the resources to ensure that the things you already bought stay functional. (However time-consuming it might have been, I’m sure it was still possible, but either some higher-up decided that “allowing people to continue to use items they have bought” was not a priority during the development of the Feature Set, or they ran out of time… There was mismanagement of resources in the name of future profits going on here, or just plain cluelessness or incompetence on SOME level of the totem pole, no matter how you look at it.) This may make them a lot of money, but think for a minute about whether you really want to set that example.

So I have a question I just thought of.

If I have a skin like the mad king’s slippers, but only the light version, will it unlock all three or just the light version?

The Mad King armor set uses the exact same skin set as the “named armor” Exotics.

Naus the Gobbo.5172:

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

Care to elaborate?

Mixable pieces as in pieces that will be added to our light/medium/heavy armour wardrobe, or as in pieces we can mix and match in the “outfits”?

Also, is there a list of each individual item that will become tonics?

You’ll note that he says “armor skin pieces”. He makes no mention of Outfits. And with only one slot to equip them in, how would you mix and match Outfits, anyway?

Palador.2170:

Naus the Gobbo.5172:

Curtis Johnson.8456:

Narthexia.1836:

will there be individual mix and match pieces in future releases? Or will they all be complete sets?

We will continue to release mix and match armor skin pieces

Care to elaborate?

Mixable pieces as in pieces that will be added to our light/medium/heavy armour wardrobe, or as in pieces we can mix and match in the “outfits”?

Also, is there a list of each individual item that will become tonics?

You’ll note that he says “armor skin pieces”. He makes no mention of Outfits. And with only one slot to equip them in, how would you mix and match Outfits, anyway?

What’s even more disturbing is that he mentioned “armor skin pieces,” which I assume means things like Scarlet’s Spaulders and the Toxic shoulders and gloves. However, in his earlier post he described the Outfit system as being motivated by wanting to release new armor sets without having to make a separate version for light, medium, and heavy… which means that future armor sets are likely to be Outfits. I haven’t seen anything to dispute this.

It seems like the Zodiac armor sets are the last gem store armor sets to be released that will include mix-and-matchable pieces, if that is so. Of course, this is all speculation; but since the Zodiac armors don’t really work with anything but themselves, and given what has been said about Outfits, it seems that this is the aesthetic direction ANet might want to take.

Twyll Blackleaf.9641:

What’s even more disturbing is that he mentioned “armor skin pieces,” which I assume means things like Scarlet’s Spaulders and the Toxic shoulders and gloves. However, in his earlier post he described the Outfit system as being motivated by wanting to release new armor sets without having to make a separate version for light, medium, and heavy… which means that future armor sets are likely to be Outfits. I haven’t seen anything to dispute this.

It seems like the Zodiac armor sets are the last gem store armor sets to be released that will include mix-and-matchable pieces, if that is so. Of course, this is all speculation; but since the Zodiac armors don’t really work with anything but themselves, and given what has been said about Outfits, it seems that this is the aesthetic direction ANet might want to take.

I think it’s going to be about 50/50 between new armor sets and new outfits. But remember that to make a new outfit, they only need to make one. If they make a new set of armor, they have to provide ones in all three types (look the same or look different, they’re trying to keep them even). So, for every trio of actual armor that comes out, I also expect about three outfits. They’ll get more money out of less work with Outfits, but they’ve yet to forsake armor mixing.