Guild Wars 2

I still need more details about the introduction of Ascended items and how will they evolve and affect the progression of the game on different fronts but…

If this is indeed the start of gear progression and a sign of what other future content updates will bring, requiring upgrading gear with each release to obtain optimal stats (like the majority of other mmorpg’s), then..

No, I hate the new ascended items.

All hamsters, please board the gear treadmill for your daily workout.

Quick and short : when I started playing I had a feeling that people are so nice and you know … “well brained”. Now when ANet tries to do something for A LOT OF PEOPLE that were just getting bored everyone else is crying about it. What I thought is the best, turned out to be the worst, people have a mindset that if there is any gear progression they have to participate in it else they feel inferior to others that have 5% stats more. If you don’t like gear progression, even as little as ANet wants to introduce, either stay away from the new dungeon and help gear up people that want to try it out (because you will need exotics before stepping there) or go craft, farm events or do whatever you want. The game is ment to be fun, and your “fun” doesn’t have to collide with others.

if you are just worried then read carefully what is written
“we’re only adding the first level of Infusions and Ascended Rings and Back slots, so that leaves us a lot of room to build upon these levels of Item progression in future content”

its even worse than people realize…..

Tobkilla.4612:

I don’t mind the idea about ascended gear just to be able (with the use of infusion slots) to play certain or future high-end dungeons.

But I don’t see the need to give ascended gear higher stats than exotic – because if it’s coming like this you need that gear to stay up-to-date in WvWvW…

Pretty much my opinion too. The ascended gear should have the same stats than existing exotics, and then the infusions should give an advantage, but only against a very specific foe or in a specific situation. This way, there would be intensive to get that new gear while not making everything crafted, looted or from older dungeons totally obsolete, and without forcing people down an unique path, that new dungeon, if they want to gear up.
I made a suggestion about this on the suggestion forum.

Hycinthus.6483:

Will this be a trend of limiting players from being able to run content? I remember I was in TERA, and this was exactly what happened. People right away got kicked if they weren’t wearing the latest gear and we haven’t even started the dungeon yet. I thought it will be different in GW2, but I guess now we’re reverting back to the same formula…

I agree,

The fear is this just cements that whole gear progression mentality into the game. How long do you think it’s going to take before you start to here …” no sorry we are only taking players into our “Guild / Group / Party/ Dungeon Run” with full Ascended sets …sorry try a noob Guild.

I think this just goes against the whole design template for this game. GW2 was about taking down the barriers that prevented players from interacting, and tiered gear systems that lock out contents is a 360 to that core philosophy.

Nalora.7964:

Personally, I do not know why people are upset about ascended gear, it is just another grind/farm for you to accomplish after you finish your grind/farm for your exotic.

MMO players are a horrible self-entitled crowd, they’ll moan about anything, even free content. They see something new, some guy blows it out of proportion and the rest follow like sheep.

The core game didn’t change but the very same “dedicated” Guild Wars fans threaten to quit because of this. It’s fear mongering and sheep herding at its best. Try to count how many times you see “gear treadmill” and “power creep” being mentioned. You’ll get the idea.

Riaky.8965:

Riduy.1682:

Finish the cycle of Eternal Return~

I actually convinced a friend to buy and play the game because he is busy, but could play from time to time. I’m afraid now every time he logs on I’ll just have to point him at some new benchmark gear. R.I.P.

I don’t wanna sound mean but your friend can buy cheap exotics that only has few less stats than Ascended gears. And for those that have extra time they can spend on other things to get better gears. I don’t see any problem with that and everyone know this from beginning when the game started:
=> Exotics > Green > Blue > White
now Legendaries + Ascended > Exotic > Green > Blue > White; suddenly people start QQ!

Um, Exotics are not cheap…

I don’t quite understand why people are getting upset over the mention of Ascended gear. It’s a fraction better than exotics, and it gives you a decent upgrade in end-game dungeons. You work for them to progress your character so that he/she can do the content even more easily.

This isn’t a grind. It’s called progression. Cosmetic rewards are wonderful and all, but it’s not bad to have something to work towards that affects you otherwise.

Also, remember that this content update in November is only introducing accessories/back equipment for Ascended. No armor, no weapons.

bamono.7098:

Ok cool. I was afraid there was some glaring problem I couldn’t see.

The rage is because many of us loved GW1 and hated other MMOs because they introduced systems like this. In GW1 you had one top level of gear. It never went higher. The only reason to grind was because you wanted a specific look for your character.

It meant that once you hit top level you could participate in anything in the game without having to go out and grind for specific gear just so you wouldn’t get pummeled. There was a always a cheap, effective option that ensure you had the same stats as the other guys, in PvP or PvE. It’s what they promised us over the years of developing GW2. That’s what they promised with the manifesto in April. that’s what they promised over and over in interviews and blogs and videos.

The fear that I have, that I feel is shared by others like me, is that this is just the start. This weekend they’re releasing ascended rings and backpieces and say they want to do more. They say it’s to appease people that want a meaningful progression at max level. So a year from now after there are 6 or 8 or 10 of these content updates and people have ascended items in every slot, what’s the next carrot? Another tier above that? Another gimmick mechanic that requires you to first hit rares or exotics, then hit ascended, then hit the next tier?

The problem is this kind of thing doesn’t really have an end point. It just keeps building and leaving those who are new to the game or who don’t enjoy specific parts of it in the dust behind those that demand some stat based progression in order to continue playing.

The other problem is I love WvW, even with all it’s problems. I don’t know how ascended gear will be treated in WvW, I freely admit that. So far, gear in WvW is a free for all. So now, if I don’t want to go through fractal of the mists, I’m missing a ring and backpiece that add about +5 points on three stats. The problem is a year from now, if I still don’t do the new content that gives ascended items, how far am I down against somebody in full ascended gear? +60 stat points, +100? If they add a tier above ascended how far am I down then? So if ascended gear isn’t somehow downgraded in WvW, a year from now if I’m up against somebody in full ascended gear, they have a distinct advantage over me. No, it’s not a lot, but it is there, and it’s significant. Now instead of playing the content I want, I have to go grind for ascended gear, and whatever comes after it.

Or look at PvE. If you’re out farming for materials or loot, your contribution to the death of a mob is determined by damage. If you’re running with a group of full ascended gear players and you’re in mixed rares and exotics, how much harder is it for you to do enough damage to “tag” the mob so you get loot before the other guys with better stats and higher damage kill it?

It’d be one thing if the higher stats of ascended gear only applied to this new fractal dungeon. And it very well may, and if it does I will be ecstatic. But going off the way gear works right now, I have to assume it does apply elsewhere. That means I have to grind for it. And a year from now I have to grind for something new. And if I have a friend join the game a year from now they have to grind through ascended to the new level above that to be equal with everyone else.

Honestly, I really, really, really, was hugely excited for GW2. I love this game right now, with all the flaws and issues. I hope as the full details of ascended gear are revealed that I will be proven wrong. That there will be a quick, relativley easy way to get ascended gear as needed, or that it will only matter in this new dungeon and not in the rest of the game. Even if It’s exactly as bad as I fear, I’ll probably still play for a while. But I doubt I’ll be spending the time and energy to level several other characters up, and I doubt I’ll continue as the gear grind goes further. That not only disappoints me, it kind of pisses me off.

[Yes, this is built on a lot of assumptions. I’m assuming that ascended gear will work like other gear and the higher stats will count everywhere but spvp. That’s based on the way things work so far.

I’m assuming that a year from now people that choose to grind will be in full ascended gear and it will make a significant difference compared to those that are not. That may not be the case, but it certainly looks that way.

I’m assuming the same people that wanted this kind of gear progression will demand more of the same once they have full ascended gear. I don’t think that’s unreasonable.]

Just another MMO, absolutely fail…

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Remember that one that started collapsing because of that easily farmed event in the Mad Kings Zone? The even that resulted in an emergency fix where they nerfed the chest to the point it was no longer worth doing the event?

Wonder how everybody is going to feel when they can’t sell their exotics because of all the new ascended armour coming in over the next few content updates. To forget peoples reaction to it that easily you would think it hadn’t happened only last month.

There are 2 pieces coming out a ring and a back , and they are only useful in the new dungeon that will probably give exos for the higher rewards so its really no big deal.

Please read the blog post.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en-gb/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

They will have higher stats then Exotics, eventually you will be able to wear full Ascended.

This will kill the exotic market and probably take the high tier crafting material with it.

No, I hate the new ascended items.

It doesn’t sound like the GW promised in the manifesto and sets a bad precedent. What will they do in 3 month, when all the hardcore players get the ascended items, get bored and start complaining? Make a new tier again? Will it ever stop?

I know I am! And so are my friends who have gotten very board with Guild Wars 2 over the past few weeks!

For us our endgame has turned into nothing but Farming Orr for our legendary’s but now we have something new to work forward to AND a new area/dungeon to explore!

I have seen a lot of the knee jerk reactions posts of how much people can’t stand change so this thread is for people who are truly happy with the upcoming content and changes!

Thank You ArenaNet!!

Hycinthus.6483:

I think ANet is pressured to do this because they are losing players, so now they’re going against their own , as what ppl call it, ‘manifesto’….

Sounds like a sound tactic; dealing with player/revenue loss by pissing off the players loyal to AN and its design ideals.

Wait, no it doesn’t…

Did you stop to consider why people might be feeling the way they do before getting disappointing in them? Clearly their thinking is different to your own, maybe try to understand it a little from their point of view.

Ditton.3149:

Oldgrimm.8521:

can we also customize ascended accessories?

as far as my exotic goes, its emerald +exquisite ruby.

can we do this combo to ascended or we are forced to play a specific set of accessories?

I think that is the point of having stats already on them..there is no customization past the infusion..so you have to farm more for the stats you want.

oh so sad, i cant have def + damage at my future accessories then,

i hope future armors can be upgraded with runes.

if not (superior runes of divinity is just a waste of space)

Oh and i most certainly didnt enjoy doing COF. Path 2’s npc is kitten the point is your dungeons arent well-design and it is a real hassle to grind along with the pointless mechanics called diminishing returns

As long as it does not effect wvw , I don’t care. I do understand people’s apprehensions though. Does it stop here? who knows. That is what is causing all the apprehension.

For now the only thing we know is that ANet doesn’t have the best communication ever. No wonder the way things were worded would cause this reaction. Now let’s wait for the facts, to see if it’s actually that bad. But it definitely doesn’t bode well. A little hope here, though.

NO NO NO. No to item progression. And gated content.

Voted that I will leave gw2 if a gear grind is introduced.

What does this mean for WvWvW, and all other PvE? If my stats slowly grow, wouldn’t that mean that running around in the world will become less challenging to a point where it is so easy that it isn’t fun? Eventually it will get to a point where all but the latest dungeon is challenging, and everything else is a joke.

In WvWvW, won’t I want Ascended gear to continue to be effective?

I would rather have seen a blog post to address these issues rather than “Hey, I hope you like bigger numbers!!”

Flynch.6034:

Kimbald.2697:

Of course we don’t know all the details yet.

Of course a lot of these posts are irrational.

But still it’s good that the uproar is as loud as it is.
Simply because that gives a very strong signal.

The dev’s will filter what they can use, no need to do their job for them.

It definitely gives a strong signal that the game is very much alive, i’ll give you that And it also gets across the point that we don’t want a forced gear treadmill for the most part.

But if people are screaming at the top of their lungs at a passing plane, when it turns out to be a seagull, then people start looking a bit cuckoo.

Not more than when it would turn out to be a plane after all…
People screaming at a plane are pretty cuckoo to me

The question would remain: what makes these people scream at a plane?
Telling them to stop shouting will not give you the answer.
Listening to what they shout might shed some light on their motivation.

7,5 Years and 6000 hours played to GW1.

Since 1 BWE and 700 hour played to GW2.

2 lvl 80 with each one 2 exotic set, in path to my first legendary.

No im not happy, im really pissed

Hycinthus.6483:

Riaky.8965:

Riduy.1682:

Finish the cycle of Eternal Return~

I actually convinced a friend to buy and play the game because he is busy, but could play from time to time. I’m afraid now every time he logs on I’ll just have to point him at some new benchmark gear. R.I.P.

I don’t wanna sound mean but your friend can buy cheap exotics that only has few less stats than Ascended gears. And for those that have extra time they can spend on other things to get better gears. I don’t see any problem with that and everyone know this from beginning when the game started:
=> Exotics > Green > Blue > White
now Legendaries + Ascended > Exotic > Green > Blue > White; suddenly people start QQ!

Um, Exotics are not cheap…

I bought my armor for like 5 gold, you can farm that in a few hours at most. Exotics are extremely cheap like everything else in the game except legendaries.

what it comes down to for me, and i know many others is:

for 5 years arena net/ncsoft sold this game as one thing. this was a core selling point, a fundamental feature. we were inundated by the fact that this was the case by devs and fans alike.

it took 3 months to go back on this.

there is a large variety of games, that are either sub based or f2p, that have this kind of feature. in fact it’s been so done to death, it’s been blamed as a primary reason for the increasing progressive fail cascade of blockbuster mmo’s. and the f2p games that offer this, do a better job of it already, and tend to have less abusive cash shops to boot.

i don’t really necessarily have an issue with gear progression, beyond it being done to death and a tired stale model that has proven to be unsuccessful time and time again.

the problem i have is that in this game, thiscompany, that sold this product as one thing, took the earliest opportunity to change it into the exact opposite, and hide that fact from it’s customers.

then their head CM whined on his personal public twitter account we were all freaking out over non factual information. only to have his own company confirm that our sources were indeed correct.

MrLee.6892:

I know I am! And so are my friends who have gotten very board with Guild Wars 2 over the past few weeks!

For us our endgame has turned into nothing but Farming Orr for our legendary’s but now we have something new to work forward to AND a new area/dungeon to explore!

I have seen a lot of the knee jerk reactions posts of how much people can’t stand change so this thread is for people who are truly happy with the upcoming content and changes!

Thank You ArenaNet!!

You should learn to read better. People’s issue is not with change, it’s with the disturbance of the tiers. I’m sure no one is complaining about new content, it’s the fact that the new content has a built-in geargrind treadmill.

Amiron.1067:

I don’t quite understand why people are getting upset over the mention of Ascended gear. It’s a fraction better than exotics, and it gives you a decent upgrade in end-game dungeons. You work for them to progress your character so that he/she can do the content even more easily.

This isn’t a grind. It’s called progression. Cosmetic rewards are wonderful and all, but it’s not bad to have something to work towards that affects you otherwise.

Also, remember that this content update in November is only introducing accessories/back equipment for Ascended. No armor, no weapons.

Dude, in their own video on their own website they say no gear treadmill. But giving us upgrades to what is already max stat gear, creates the gear treadmill. They specifically say “No gear treadmill”, hell they even aluded to it in the blogpost about no gear treadmill, but that is exactly what this is. Yes, its for rings and back, but there will be more gear. Id say in 6 months time we will have at least a half set of ascended. You spent your kharma and gold on exotics for nothing other than a skin.

People bought this game partially because once they retrieve a max stat set, it would not be replaced.

If only they would represent their point of view in some other way than making hundred threads about how this game sucks, and how they are leaving the game right freaking now.

At the end of the day this gear seems to be drop only and not something you can buy making it no longer able to PTW for your “best” set. This is the cold hard truth that you MUST deal with as things stand you can buy gems in game and trad them for gold to buy your gear but by adding in gear that is above the gold system and even gem system you make the game less bot aimed to more playing aimed.

Voted “I will leave if they continue releasing ascended items”

Large problems await with this. Only time will reveal them to those who say things like “people are whining to whine” or “people complain on these forums that’s all they do” but they will happen. How do we know? Oh I dunno how about how every mmorpg out there that has this very model of progression, how’s that for evidence of the problems this system ensures WILL occur every time.

Unless they do something soon, there’s going to be more people leaving then there the tiny niche dungeon runners that stay. The majority isn’t the hard cores the majority has always been pve open world content seekers crafters gatherers explorers since 2004 when the type of players switched.

It’s slightly strange that the people who are vehemently against the geargrind are the ones who are so focussed on the stat differences between gear in the first place. Normally people who are all about spreadsheeting item stats are found in games that actively promote geargrind, as opposed to a game where a percentile difference won’t make or break the experience.

vysaek.8290:

So.

You want a game with no new gear, stats or [name it here] to fight the whole 4 dragons we have to whipe yet.

You want the same, items, whithout any change or new mechanic… I find that kind of boring myself.

You did never played Guild Wars, did you?

Well, you got what you want… GW2 just turned into just another MMO with the exact same stat grinding than the other 10 MMOs.

This is not the way to go. At all.

It is not that we can not stand change. We do. Change is always there. Change is good when the direction is good.

But changing into just another grind MMO is not the type of change people want.

I can imagine people at Blizzard and Bioware thinking Anet for this change, because Anet gave up one of their unique selling points.

No to pve farm, or same items from wvw badges or karma.
NO!!!

Hycinthus.6483:

Riaky.8965:

Riduy.1682:

Finish the cycle of Eternal Return~

I actually convinced a friend to buy and play the game because he is busy, but could play from time to time. I’m afraid now every time he logs on I’ll just have to point him at some new benchmark gear. R.I.P.

I don’t wanna sound mean but your friend can buy cheap exotics that only has few less stats than Ascended gears. And for those that have extra time they can spend on other things to get better gears. I don’t see any problem with that and everyone know this from beginning when the game started:
=> Exotics > Green > Blue > White
now Legendaries + Ascended > Exotic > Green > Blue > White; suddenly people start QQ!

Um, Exotics are not cheap…

Exotics are cheap bro, unless you want some other cool skins that cost 100 gold +!

@DisplacedTitan6897

Please leave your politics off this forum, as this is the one place where we can go and not be bombarded with political opinion.

my issue is that, currently most of us in my guild have multiple 80’s we just bring whatever makes a good balance, now i have to gear all my alts again

Zplus.4217:

I hope Linsey Murdock is reading this and if not someone should print this out and put this on her desk.

Good idea!

Crackbone.5710:

Let’s cut to the chase. This isn’t the original Guild Wars. People need character progression. As it stands, progression is pretty thin at the end.

No they “need” World of Warcraft but they are to confused to understand it.

What’s wrong with playing a game because the GAME is fun? Why do you need to have something beyond that to enjoy yourself? Why does better gear = more fun then something else?

Despite what Blizzard says, character progression does not equal better gear and better gear only. You can have character progression in a multitude of different ways.

Oh well, i knew this was coming the first time i logged in to the beta and saw stats on the first piece if gear i looted.

Your last statement says it all: “The game is meant to be fun.”

But, sadly it is not. It is work. It is grinding, excruciating work. Crafting is a joke. It has no merit, nothing you craft is worth anything. “Farm Events”? Repetitive grinding is not “fun” in my book. Perhaps I am just not the right kind of gamer for Guild Wars.

Most of my friends who began the game with me in BWE1 have already left. Most “well brained” people do not enjoy tedium. I am only still around because my last spark of hope for Guild Wars has not yet been completely snuffed out by their idiotic decisions.

displacedTitan.6897:

I just hate knee jerk reactions to things like this. Why are all gamers so conservative? Its like watching Fox News whenever someone does something that they can spin to be horrible/world ending/hitleresque. Its just a bunch of people overreacting and when the event happens and people like it, those same people will embrace it and pretend that they were never calling wolf in the first place. Grow up guys.

Conservative? Wanting to not go back to the way all MMOs work is being conservative? Its the exact opposite. A lot of people bought into this game, not wanting their geargrind and such. IMO it was already a chore to get exotic, but once you got it you got it.

Now they are adding more gear tiers, and show plans to add more in the future. Thats not what i expected, not what i was told i’d get and not what i want. I liked the idea of being able to walk about and come back a few months later and still be up to par.

I approve.

Thank you ArenaNet!

Swoo.5079:

The problem is that Ascendant gear isn’t nerfed – it is auto upgraded and then has a buff on top of that.

Wrong, but quite frankly I´m done arguing about one frikken pink ring.
Providing proper info on such a possibly vital new game mechanic is ANet´s responsibility and they should step up.
Pity is they are by now all asleep and think everything is still right with the world.

Heh, good kitten morning that will be when they wake up.

Oh hooray, another gear treadmill. I think I’ll just go back to WoW, now. This game just isn’t anything close to the spirit of Guild Wars.

You know that you now have to run dungeons to complete the monthly achievement now right?

It wasn’t a big deal before but now it is?

I am confused!

Since mod is reading this, I would like to kindly letting you know that I am disgusted by the new gear grind direction.

Amiron.1067:

I don’t quite understand why people are getting upset over the mention of Ascended gear. It’s a fraction better than exotics, and it gives you a decent upgrade in end-game dungeons. You work for them to progress your character so that he/she can do the content even more easily.

This isn’t a grind. It’s called progression. Cosmetic rewards are wonderful and all, but it’s not bad to have something to work towards that affects you otherwise.

Also, remember that this content update in November is only introducing accessories/back equipment for Ascended. No armor, no weapons.

Oh please, how long have you been playing MMO’s for?
If it’s an upgrade, no matter how small, you need to have it to remain competitive.

It’s only a matter of time until we start seeing “LFM <Insert Dungeon here>, Ascended Only”. Not only that, it forces players that concentrate on one aspect of the game (eg. WvW or casual PvE) to start grinding dungeons for the Ascended Gear so that they can ensure their character is optimal. That’s the very definition of a gear treadmill.

GW2 had a different model, and as such it did not compete directly with WoW. It was somewhat different and a novel experience. Now they’ve went gear treadmill mode. Ask all the other WoW clones how well that worked out for them. Start with Bioware.

Kimbald.2697:

Flynch.6034:

Kimbald.2697:

Of course we don’t know all the details yet.

Of course a lot of these posts are irrational.

But still it’s good that the uproar is as loud as it is.
Simply because that gives a very strong signal.

The dev’s will filter what they can use, no need to do their job for them.

It definitely gives a strong signal that the game is very much alive, i’ll give you that And it also gets across the point that we don’t want a forced gear treadmill for the most part.

But if people are screaming at the top of their lungs at a passing plane, when it turns out to be a seagull, then people start looking a bit cuckoo.

Not more than when it would turn out to be a plane after all…
People screaming at a plane are pretty cuckoo to me

The question would remain: what makes these people scream at a plane?
Telling them to stop shouting will not give you the answer.
Listening to what they shout might shed some light on their motivation.

Heh yeah, or they could just turn to you and talk normally about what’s bothering them, without everyone nearby having to wear ear-mufflers ^^