Guild Wars 2

11% stats is alot, me think.

It is what it is: another tier of must-have gear.

They changed this game from a ‘grind for cosmetics only’ MMO into just another ‘grind for stats’ MMO.

Like the other 10 MMOs out there.

/cry

Check my history NEVER EVER POSTED to forums.

But i have to say as an ex WoW, WarHammer, SWTOR, EvE, AoC etc etc etc player. GW2 was a refreshing change to the grind of other games. (BTW never played GW1)

I have a single level 80 in exotics that is functional in WvWvW and on equal par with everyone else. My exotics look crap, but are functional, I can live with that!

I have a full time job and a family and often disappear for days on end without logging in due to that thing called RL.

I like the fact i can log in after time away (even a few days) and start doing stuff with friends where my gear is not an issue.

As an adult with a decent job i have a disposable income and i have already spent over £150 on gems (more than any subscription to a tradition MMO in the same time frame)

People like me are people to pay to keep games like this alive. As my gear gets less and less competitive i will log in less and less and spend less and less until i stop logging in. Because i don’t have time to grind for gear and more importantly i don’t want to grind for gear.

Am i happy about the new patch for 99% of it yes! all sounds cool and good. But ascended items, errrr nope.

ATM a quick bit of maths puts the increased stats at around 8%, for two items this is minimal and won’t affect the game too much, but when every item is now ascended with a total stat increase of 8% across the board that’s a significant stat increase.

In WvWvW two zergs meet… 20 vs 20, 20 without full ascended, and 20 with full ascended. so in real terms that’s 20 players vs. 21.6 players with each player outputting 8% stat increase, so in real terms of extra damage output will be substantial!

Therefore ascended items now become the requirement for WvWvW.

“Fun impacts loot collection. The rarest items in the game are not more powerful than other items, so you don’t need them to be the best. The rarest items have unique looks to help your character feel that sense of accomplishment, but it’s not required to play the game. We don’t need to make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional, so those who find it fun to chase this prestigious gear can do so, but those who don’t are just as powerful and get to have fun too”.
Is it Fun? :-)

kiranslee.4829:

LF1M ONLY full Ascended geared allowed , link gear on /w.
Anyone see this happen ?

That already happens with exotics.

I feel like they’re justifying gear-grinding because they’re only letting rings/backpiece drops for now and allowing other bits later on before getting a full set so even casual people with only 1 level 80 like me can probably get 1-2 things over a long period of time.

But what about players that start a year or two in? That what was so nice about GW1. I started late but I could still participate in all of the end-game stuff with enough practice in my gear because there wasn’t a gigantic difference in stats.

Tallis.5607:

Flynch.6034

Ok now i’m really confused – which part of the current angst is about grinding, and what is there that’s suddenly new that we need to grind for?

The extra stats on the new gear. Read the blog, it’s all there: new gear that a) gives you more stats in all situations and b) a new infusion slot that you must have and fill to do the new content.

They are even upgrading the legendaries to the new stats, so obviously, the new stats & slot are not insignificant.

That is the very definition of gear grinding.

Untill now it was pretty easy: you get to 80, you get the top gear wherever you want and you can do any content you want.

From now on, it will be like each and every MMO there: you get to 80, you get the first set of top gear wherever you want, then you grind AGAIN for the second tier of top gear before you can do the end-game.

You used to go 80 > buy or earn exotic > end-game content.
Now you will go 80 > buy or earn exotic > grind for ascendent & infusion > end-game content.

You can look at this any way you want, you can call it any way you want, you can make as many posts you want, this new tier of gear is simply an added grind.

Making this MMO exactly the same as all the other MMOs out there.

<sad face>

I’ve read the blog, also double checked it.

Nothing there says that I need or require the armour to do the new content. I just need it to repeat the content sequentially as the Agony mechanic bumps the difficulty. Seems fine to me.

If it turns out that to even set foot inside the new content i’ll need to grind for the gear, then yeah i’ll be annoyed. But from the looks of it, you can go in with your current gear, presumably find Agony-resist drops in the dungeon anyway, and continue on your merry way.

edit: clarity

“The game is ment to be fun”

R.I.P. in piece, Guild Wars 2.

I never even got a full set of exotics. Never will I casually wear a dungeon cosmetic set and play Fashion Dress-up Online 2.

All games must return to Diablo, World of Warcraft, or Call of Duty. Goodbye.

nugzta.8973:

MrLee.6892:

I know I am! And so are my friends who have gotten very board with Guild Wars 2 over the past few weeks!

For us our endgame has turned into nothing but Farming Orr for our legendary’s but now we have something new to work forward to AND a new area/dungeon to explore!

I have seen a lot of the knee jerk reactions posts of how much people can’t stand change so this thread is for people who are truly happy with the upcoming content and changes!

Thank You ArenaNet!!

So what do you do after you get the Ascended gear? Most hardcore players would have done it in a few weeks time (or even days) like they did to legendaries. Perhaps it takes 1-2 months for regular players. What’s next? Get bored again, quit the game, and wait for the next gear? Rinse and repeat.

The added dungeon is nice but Anet is so desperate to maintain the longevity of the game, they have to incorporate gear treadmill into it. This is a lazy attempt by the developers where they are incapable to add contents with high re-playability value …. you know the actual contents that are engaging, interesting and challenging where people would do it without being swayed with rewards at the end. Think of why people play FPS, RTS, etc over and over again with the same maps yet they play these games for years.

If they plan on release content they way they have been, that will keep me busy just fine. After lost islands is another December event. Then after that I am sure another content patch, ect ect.

Also I don’t have to pay a sub fee so I can play something else for a few weeks then come back!

Hey guys, I’m Grommi.

I just wanted to point out a note that I’m really looking forward to the Ascended gear, and the new high-end difficulty of the dungeons. Although I can’t imagine they’ll be that difficult, since they’re relying on a gear-update mechanic in the form of Agony (if I read correctly); it’s still nice to see new content and allow me to apply myself against it.

I’m looking forward to the Ascended gear because I really don’t feel like I have much to do if I deck myself out in exotics. I’ve helped my guild multiple times in running dungeons, I’ve hunted down the dragons for ectoplasms and exotics, I’ve PvP’d (and dislike the grind in PvP rankings)… I’m not really sure what to do. Having new gear to achieve always gives me a reason to play the game, and although I know the term play for fun not for gear, the game is more -fun- to me to have something to play towards. And, I don’t do this with legendaries, because to me they are far too out of grasp, and far too much of an effort. This is why I’ll respect those with Legendaries haha.

I mean, I see a lot of hate on the forums, but guys – Come on. They’re trying to provide content and a unique alternative to how gear progression works. Staying at the same gear level all year long isn’t going to be fun for the majority of players, in my opinion. It’s not a grind, it’s update.

Still.. I wish these dungeons were more than five player dungeons so I could actually play with my full guildmates in them..

Still.. I wish these dungeons were more than five player dungeons so I could actually play with my full guildmates in them..- Grommi

I think they should cap the stats somehow (only when in WvW). I don’t want to grind for gear in WvW personally.

No. I hate pink.

Ganzo.5079:

BUt legendary have THE SAME STAS as EXOTICS… why create a new type of items with different stats???

Why dont simply let people infuse their exotics items, instead of create this big mess! People claim for new skins and better looks, not for higher stats!

Legendaries do not have the same stats as exotics.

Cyferwolf.1089:

I like WvW. Will ascended gear’s better stats count in that? A year from now am I going to find myself at a distinct stat based disadvantage against somebody with all ascended gear in WvW because I don’t want to spend my time grinding for it?

And that is another huge problem with the game. Currently you can buy or craft the end tier stuff or even get it from Karma vendors. If you have to do dungeons to get the new ascended stuff then your forcing PvPers to do PvE and welp we all know how that goes. To the next game!…..or back to others.

I wonder if their really trying to cater to PvEers after they alienated the eSports community with the cease and decist orders on monetized streams. I know several professional eSports teams swore off the game after AN did that. I wonder if loosing it’s PvP community is spurring this change.

ArenaNet. “Take ads off streams of our gameplay”
Streamer, “But eSports and we make money off streaming your game”
ArenaNet. “You will not make money off our game!”
Streamer, “Okay we’ll go professionally play games that we can stream”
ArenaNet. “Where did all of our eSports players go? Hmm maybe we need to add PvE grind to the game.”

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Remember that one that started collapsing because of that easily farmed event in the Mad Kings Zone? The even that resulted in an emergency fix where they nerfed the chest to the point it was no longer worth doing the event?

Wonder how everybody is going to feel when they can’t sell their exotics because of all the new ascended armour coming in over the next few content updates. To forget peoples reaction to it that easily you would think it hadn’t happened only last month.

There are 2 pieces coming out a ring and a back , and they are only useful in the new dungeon that will probably give exos for the higher rewards so its really no big deal.

Please read the blog post.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en-gb/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

They will have higher stats then Exotics, eventually you will be able to wear full Ascended.

This will kill the exotic market and probably take the high tier crafting material with it.

They have higher stats because you can not add runes or gems to them , without this they would be worse than exotics.

No, please read the blog post like I asked you too. It specifically states that Ascended has higher stats.

If you look at the picture and add the numbers of the exotic together with the gem slotted into it it still has lower stats then the Ascended one shown.

Infusion might make that stat difference even more but even if it doesn’t then Ascended is still better and nobody will want exotics anymore.

The bonus I get for the runes I use is not worth losing to get a small increase in stats.

All those runes you can slot into your accessories and backpack? I’m sorry have you used some kind of exploit there?

Also the exotic market isn’t tied to you, its tied to supply and demand. The demand for exotics is going to drop right off once people can get these higher stats. Most people already use ruby orbs and similar if they are going full glass cannon, these ascended items have them built in from the get go.

Cyferwolf.1089:

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Remember that one that started collapsing because of that easily farmed event in the Mad Kings Zone? The even that resulted in an emergency fix where they nerfed the chest to the point it was no longer worth doing the event?

Wonder how everybody is going to feel when they can’t sell their exotics because of all the new ascended armour coming in over the next few content updates. To forget peoples reaction to it that easily you would think it hadn’t happened only last month.

There are 2 pieces coming out a ring and a back , and they are only useful in the new dungeon that will probably give exos for the higher rewards so its really no big deal.

Please read the blog post.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en-gb/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

They will have higher stats then Exotics, eventually you will be able to wear full Ascended.

This will kill the exotic market and probably take the high tier crafting material with it.

They have higher stats because you can not add runes or gems to them , without this they would be worse than exotics.

See now I was going to get a bit ragey and mention that the ascended ring you see in the blog post clearly has 15 more stat points than the exotic jewled ring next to it, but you raise a tremendously interesting point. If the infusion slot replaces the upgrade slot, that may mean the eventual Ascended armor (and maybe weapons) that come out may not have rune (or sigil) slots. If that’s the case, its very possible the stat increase evens out or even loses out in a 1:1 comparison with an exotic armor (or weapon) set with full superior runes (or sigils), except for having the infusion slot.

Ok… going back to revise my posts. thank you for pointing this out, it may be that this is not the problem I felt it was, though that’s obviously based on assumptions.

If you are putting Orbs into these items then you wouldn’t be putting runes into them anyway.

100% on target.

This extra tier makes this MMO like just another grind MMO, like there are already 10 MMOs.

Okay here’s a bit of misinformation OP.

Currently there is no gap in power between exotics and legendaries. They currently have the exact same stats. Their only benefit is cosmetic. This is no “in between” of anything currently in game.

This is adding a new tier, that is a direct upgrade to older exotic gear, and all legendary weapons will be increased in power to be direct upgrades to exotic weapons. Unfortunately they’ll all have power/vit/toughness instead of someone’s personal choice of power/prec/crit damage, or power/condition damage/vitality, or power/healing power/toughness, etc.

Currently you can transmute your favorite stats into a legendary weapon. When the patch hits you’re stuck with P/V/T or you downgrade your weapon to an exotic.

Bad idea.

karma.8763:

You had to work for gear in the beginning……what is the difference after 80? you think there just gonna beable to throw more skins at us? LOL, no that wont keep the players happy, i want my character to feel like he is getting stronger…..that is what an mmo is about right? or just grinding all day to play dress up is for you?

GW1 was like this and it kept lots of people happy. You want stats and more levels? THere are tons of games like that. Each one trying to tell you their game is better, but it’s all the same.

You are typical of treadmill players. Not everybody likes that. A lot of people came here because they didn’t like it. Whether you understand it or not makes no difference there. The problem is that getting stronger is bull, because they just make stronger mobs indefinitely. It makes no difference if you go from level 12 to 13 or from 120 to 121. It’s so mind-numbingly stupid that I can’t even begin to explain why a gear treadmill is not for everyone.

So a game comes out that for years said: we are not about the gear treadmill. 4 months after release….the treadmill begins. Aside from whether you like this or not, can you not see that there’s something wrong with a turn around like that?

You think dressing up is stupid. I think become more powerful for the sake of beating more mobs with higher stats is stupid. But that’s ok. There are plenty of games that cater to your needs. GW2 said they were different. They lied….and not just a little bit.

Przemek.6835:

Why can’t gw2 be good for everyone?

It can be, to a point. You just have to balance their interests and make sure features designed for different players don’t step on each other.

“We added better gear that makes exotics looks like rares!” is a poor approach to this, because it might please some hardcore dungeon-grinder subset, but it’s actively bad for people who were happy to get their exotics and be done with hunting for bigger numbers — which is something they’d come to expect from GW1, and was always part of the core proposition of GW2. I think there are much better ways to please both kinds of players.

Amulrei.4973:

The community was nothing short of lied to by no less then the company president of AN.

Frankly I am surprised there isn’t MORE of an uproar but I suspect that will come about once the news circulates during the day.

A sad day. Once again the need for gear to do content has appeared in a game that didn’t need it. Sigh

I will make a judgment once I’ve seen it first hand how it exactly works, and how important the gear will be, but tbh, I’ve got a really bad feeling about this choice by ANet..

Levetty.1279:

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Kromica.2831:

Levetty.1279:

Remember that one that started collapsing because of that easily farmed event in the Mad Kings Zone? The even that resulted in an emergency fix where they nerfed the chest to the point it was no longer worth doing the event?

Wonder how everybody is going to feel when they can’t sell their exotics because of all the new ascended armour coming in over the next few content updates. To forget peoples reaction to it that easily you would think it hadn’t happened only last month.

There are 2 pieces coming out a ring and a back , and they are only useful in the new dungeon that will probably give exos for the higher rewards so its really no big deal.

Please read the blog post.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en-gb/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

They will have higher stats then Exotics, eventually you will be able to wear full Ascended.

This will kill the exotic market and probably take the high tier crafting material with it.

They have higher stats because you can not add runes or gems to them , without this they would be worse than exotics.

No, please read the blog post like I asked you too. It specifically states that Ascended has higher stats.

If you look at the picture and add the numbers of the exotic together with the gem slotted into it it still has lower stats then the Ascended one shown.

Infusion might make that stat difference even more but even if it doesn’t then Ascended is still better and nobody will want exotics anymore.

The bonus I get for the runes I use is not worth losing to get a small increase in stats.

All those runes you can slot into your accessories and backpack? I’m sorry have you used some kind of exploit there?

Also the exotic market isn’t tied to you, its tied to supply and demand. The demand for exotics is going to drop right off once people can get these higher stats. Most people already use ruby orbs and similar if they are going full glass cannon, these ascended items have them built in from the get go.

You do know that there will be full sets of armor eventually

Flynch.6034:

Swoo.5079:

Flynch.6034:

It’s slightly strange that the people who are vehemently against the geargrind are the ones who are so focussed on the stat differences between gear in the first place. Normally people who are all about spreadsheeting item stats are found in games that actively promote geargrind, as opposed to a game where a percentile difference won’t make or break the experience.

If it makes no difference why bother?

The people wanting more power won’t get them and still be bored, the people not wanting a gear grind for stats will be annoyed and disappointed.

Presumably because if it doesn’t affect a majority in any way, but means a minority enjoy the progression, then that’s ok.

Apparently it does affect.

When you shift power plateau, the skill differences get washed by the gear.

Considering Ascended items are supposed to be harder to get than exotic (read grindier) it means you have to spend more time grinding items rather then acquiring secondary sets to try out different builds, rather than playing different professions to learn them.

Instead of one developing themselves as player they need to spend more time developing their characters.

Developing yourself as a player is an endless task. Developing your character is a question of spending time.

When I get the max stats I don’t find it rewarding. I’m just happy that phase of the game is done and I can focus on trying different builds, strategies and professions.

For me stats isn’t a reward – it is a requirement to have a shot at being the best player possible.

So no, Dear Linsey Murdock, I’m excited about the new content, I’m excited about the new items artwork. I’m not excited about a new item tier.

Valtameri.2075:

If only they would represent their point of view in some other way than making hundred threads about how this game sucks, and how they are leaving the game right freaking now.

Actually many people do and you would know this if you took the time to read them instead of taking all of them as just, “This game sucks.” But the problem is, once someone says anything negative about this game, be it constructive or not, you and the others who cherish this game can’t seem to accept it and need to challenge them and say they are wrong and that they shouldn’t play the game etc.

Not to just single you out but that is how, well you know, the fb word, act. That is one of the reasons why this community is so bad along with Tera. No one can say anything negative about their precious game.

So if you really weren’t a fb, you would have seen many good posts on why this game does suck. There is even one a couple posts under yours on the first page too.

Instead of fixing Plinx grind fest, and terrible ruined market for pre legendary, now we get even worse , new dungeon with new gear and to make it worse new frikken debuff that WILL force you to get new gear in order to pplay new content. Thats sad.

Webba.3071:

Kindeller.3072:

I feel like screaming at you people…

Why, exactly? Others opinions aren’t going to hurt you. I don’t really feel like screaming at you even though you completely fail to understand my point of view too, because it wouldn’t help us understand each other at all.

We have all had some excellent tantrums and counter tantrums about everything and everyone has got nice and uptight so it might be a good time to chill out a bit around here.

Because you haven’t even seen the content or how its attained. Think of it mathematically. You know you’ve went from point A (fine) to B (rare) to C (exotic), its taken you factors of X and Y to achieve each step lets say time and skill. At this point all we actually know is there is a fourth step D now… which given new content was always going to happen. (Could be worse it could have been a level cap increase :p)

What most people miss is that we don’t know the (X) time and (Y) skill that’s going to be required to achieve each piece which will ultimately decide the gear treadmill’s impact.

I’m not annoyed you have an opinion, just that your opinion is based on factitious conclusions. Take a step back and realise we don’t have the big picture.

LordByron.8369:

TOS have no legal value in most parts of the world

Its a contractual user agreement and is quoted mostly for those that have been demanding refunds etc. Its also irrelevant which country your from as you connect and use the service to the origin country which the legislation holds true in. (as far as i was made to believe, feel free to enlighten me, I may be wrong)

So true OP. Thank you for writting this.
I wonder if anyone on anet is reading this and if they will reconsider what they are doing?

@Zen
So tell me, do you have to get full exotics now? Or full ascend? Do you have to do anything to keep the game as fun as it was before the news? Because your post AND signature clearly states that you stopped having fun after you read the news.

MrLee.6892:

If they plan on release content they way they have been, that will keep me busy just fine. After lost islands is another December event. Then after that I am sure another content patch, ect ect.

Also I don’t have to pay a sub fee so I can play something else for a few weeks then come back!

Then why not just add the contents without the gear treadmill? That doesn’t address what I just said.

MrLee.6892:

nugzta.8973:

MrLee.6892:

I know I am! And so are my friends who have gotten very board with Guild Wars 2 over the past few weeks!

For us our endgame has turned into nothing but Farming Orr for our legendary’s but now we have something new to work forward to AND a new area/dungeon to explore!

I have seen a lot of the knee jerk reactions posts of how much people can’t stand change so this thread is for people who are truly happy with the upcoming content and changes!

Thank You ArenaNet!!

So what do you do after you get the Ascended gear? Most hardcore players would have done it in a few weeks time (or even days) like they did to legendaries. Perhaps it takes 1-2 months for regular players. What’s next? Get bored again, quit the game, and wait for the next gear? Rinse and repeat.

The added dungeon is nice but Anet is so desperate to maintain the longevity of the game, they have to incorporate gear treadmill into it. This is a lazy attempt by the developers where they are incapable to add contents with high re-playability value …. you know the actual contents that are engaging, interesting and challenging where people would do it without being swayed with rewards at the end. Think of why people play FPS, RTS, etc over and over again with the same maps yet they play these games for years.

If they plan on release content they way they have been, that will keep me busy just fine. After lost islands is another December event. Then after that I am sure another content patch, ect ect.

Also I don’t have to pay a sub fee so I can play something else for a few weeks then come back!

Well if that is the case then why do you need higher stats dangled in front of you in the first place?

Do we really need another condition and then another Boon (infusions) to counter this condition to make the game more intresting for us? I say no. I am all for new content and new skins but what is wrong with balancing the game as it stands without adding new conditions and then MUST HAVE boons (infusions) to counter this condition?

I’m just reading ahead to the map chat
“LFM Must have infusion gear fully slotted on all equipment or you will booted.”
Not very casual friendly….

@Cyferwolf:

But the eventual Ascended armor and weapons cannot be worse or on par with exotic armor and weapons. If they were worse/equal, then nobody would want to get them. Why implement items that nobody wants to get?

Eventual Ascended armor and weapons will have to be superior to exotics in some way (I don’t know how) if they want to keep players working for it. Otherwise it’s a totally pointless addition.

bcbully.7289:

NCsoft knows the people that are still here are hooked. No matter what they do these people will stay. The Halloween event was a test run. The people who said “stop cry” those people are here to stay.

I disagree.

I am hooked on the idea of having an MMO that is a GAME, and not a second job.
There are plenty of other things I can and will do with my time.

I am still holding out hope that someone will come along in the AN office and see this, flip out, fire somebody, and fix it with a public apology about how vision is the most important thing with any business and stuff.

Don’t like the sound of “ascended gear” it just sounds like a gear treadmill to me even if it turns out it isn’t. When I start hearing people shouting “LFM Full Ascended only” then I know it’s gone too far.

Can’t say I am all for these changes, it goes against a lot of what Anet said they wouldn’t do.

I really hope I am wrong.

Great post, pointing out exactly what many loyal GW1+2 customers in the casual niche are worrying about.

Devildoc.6721:

Okay here’s a bit of misinformation OP.

Currently there is no gap in power between exotics and legendaries. They currently have the exact same stats. Their only benefit is cosmetic. This is no “in between” of anything currently in game.

This is adding a new tier, that is a direct upgrade to older exotic gear, and all legendary weapons will be increased in power to be direct upgrades to exotic weapons. Unfortunately they’ll all have power/vit/toughness instead of someone’s personal choice of power/prec/crit damage, or power/condition damage/vitality, or power/healing power/toughness, etc.

Currently you can transmute your favorite stats into a legendary weapon. When the patch hits you’re stuck with P/V/T or you downgrade your weapon to an exotic.

Bad idea.

This is a goood point, what happens to legendaries that have been transmuted to different stats when this patch hits?

Cyferwolf.1089:

Ok… going back to revise my posts. thank you for pointing this out, it may be that this is not the problem I felt it was, though that’s obviously based on assumptions.

Unfortunately, we don’t know yet if Ascended items come only in MF flavor or in ALL flavors.

If the latter is true, then the non-customization becomes irrelevant. If you want e.g. Berserker stats on the ring + slot, you just need to find the Berserker (main stats) + Berserker (slot stats) version of the Ascended item and off you go.

In fact, it could make for some truly horrid grind; just think about how many possible combinations there are, and how infinitesimally small is the chance of getting the combination you want on any one drop. TP might help, but God help you if the combination you’re after is the most popular one…

Grommi.5634:

They’re trying to provide content and a unique alternative to how gear progression works.

Unique?

What is so unique about a new tier of gear?

It is the exact same thing as every other MMO out there. 100% identical.

You get a new tier of gear with more stats on them and a new ‘infusion’ spot.

Even if this infusion spot is onlt some sort of anti-agony-stat and not an extra VIT or PREC spot, the added base stats on the gear makes this the exact same thing as every single other MMO out there, a new tier of gear.

You may like to grind new gear. That’s your right.

But don’t call it anything else than what it is: a step into changing this game into every other MMO out there.

Devildoc.6721:

Currently there is no gap in power between exotics and legendaries. They currently have the exact same stats. Their only benefit is cosmetic. This is no “in between” of anything currently in game.

I am aware the stats are the same. Nevertheless, the legendaries are better because of the appearance benefit. If they want to add a slot between exotic and legendary, they can’t go with awesome appearance, because that’s reserved for legendary. Instead, they also added an infusion slot. Fine. Their mistake was also adding some base stats.

Still, I think the problem is not so awful since it doesn’t sound to me like there will be another tier “ascended++” added in the future. Rather, they will just slowly roll out ascended armor for each slot. Still a tread-mill, but not as odious as in other games.

Swoo.5079:

Przemek.6835:

Quick and short : when I started playing I had a feeling that people are so nice and you know … “well brained”. Now when ANet tries to do something for A LOT OF PEOPLE that were just getting bored everyone else is crying about it. What I thought is the best, turned out to be the worst, people have a mindset that if there is any gear progression they have to participate in it else they feel inferior to others that have 5% stats more. If you don’t like gear progression, even as little as ANet wants to introduce, either stay away from the new dungeon and help gear up people that want to try it out (because you will need exotics before stepping there) or go craft, farm events or do whatever you want. The game is ment to be fun, and your “fun” doesn’t have to collide with others.

“Fun” being connected to “better stats in items” is a silly notion for many of us tha picked this game (and GW1) in the first place.

I’ll link a post from a dangerous revolutionary that doesn’t want to help the people getting bored:

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/is-it-fun-colin-johanson-on-how-arenanet-measures-success/

“Fun impacts loot collection. The rarest items in the game are not more powerful than other items, so you don’t need them to be the best. The rarest items have unique looks to help your character feel that sense of accomplishment, but it’s not required to play the game. We don’t need to make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional, so those who find it fun to chase this prestigious gear can do so, but those who don’t are just as powerful and get to have fun too.” ~Colin Johanson

This guy created a game I wanted to play and I bought it.

“As we watch Guild Wars 2 mature in its Live environment, we have found that our most dedicated players were achieving their set of Exotic gear and hitting “the Legendary wall.” We designed the process of getting Legendary gear to be a long term goal, but players were ready to start on that path much sooner than we expected and were becoming frustrated with a lack of personal progression. Our desire is to create a game that is more inclusive for hardcore and casual players alike, but we don’t want to overlook the basic need for players to feel like they are progressing and growing even after hitting max level.
(…)
We have always worked hard to create a sense of satisfying progression rather than gear grind and this new item progression initiative is no exception. By adding challenging new combat mechanics to end-game content and ways to mitigate those mechanics through gear progression for high-end players, we can add personal progression without making the game feel like an endless treadmill of gear that is just out of your reach” ~Linsey Murdock

This girl isn’t.
(not trying to make a girl vs guy thread, and I know this was approved by more than just these individuals)

What the first guy said is actually a ‘concept’.

Take fable for example. Peter Molyneux hypes his game up so much the actual product is NOTHING like the concept he proposed.

In this regard, Anet does it way better.

The new set of gear actually aren’t that much more powerful than normal exotic, at least not to the point where you can beat up someone in exotic gear without an ounce of skill like most other MMO.

Plus, spvp has no gear progression anyway. Only wvw has, and you can avoid it entirely if you hate progression so much. The point is, Guild war 2 is not like GW1 because Anet is trying to reach out to a boarder audience.

They’re not making the game for you die hard GW1 fan only – they’re making the game to cater to everyone’s need.

What the girl said is the actual ‘product’, and she is actually quite right. There are many who complain about the lack of endgame gear progression.
No one complain about getting better gears when you’re leveling from 1 to 79. Why not? Because it feels natural, and you are given better stuff so you can tackle harder content. You don’t need these better equipment, but its good to have them. This is also gear progression.

So why shouldn’t it be the same as endgame gear progression? Getting better stuff as harder content comes out, so you have something to work towards. The only bad thing this new tier of gear is the gating mechanic to the new dungeon, which requires certain resistance to be able to complete.

This part is absolutely ridiculous because it “FORCES” you to grind, whereas creating better gear merely “MOTIVATE” you to grind. You shouldn’t NEED the better gear that’s coming out. It should be like an extra thing where its good to have but you can do without if you really don’t want to grind for it.

I am very excited about the new content.

I vote yes.

showatt.9413:

Levetty.1279:

prenavo.3926:

I am very excited for this. I think it is a step in the right direction. No matter how pretty the game is or how cool some of the armor looks, there will always be some form of progression in an mmo. It is the nature of the beast. I think they are taking great strides in trying to make this game appeal to a wide range of tastes as to make the game have a better player retention rate. More people playing is a good thing.
I look at it like this.
1. If you like open world pve…you’ve got it.
2. If you like regular dungeon running…you’ve got it.
3. If you like spvp… you’ve got it.
4. If you like wvw…you’ve got it.
5. And now, if your into getting new things for more power, you’ve got that too.
None of it is required, yet all paths are available for every play style.
In the end in almost every mmo, the acquisition of new stuff is the driving force behind it all. If some people need a carrot on a stick to keep them going, so be it. Eventually, (I’m crossing my fingers here) They may introduce raids!!! GASP!!! Oh the horror! People just need to relax and see where this new stuff takes us. I seriously doubt it’ll be as bad as people think. Besides, even if it did become a wow clone in the future, I’d rather play this than have to pay a monthly sub to do the same thing. People just need to chill out.

Seriously why did you buy GW2 in the first place? Aren’t the millions of other MMOs enough for you? Why does GW2 have to be exactly the same?

The same question can be said for those who believes endgame gear progression is bad thing and believe Gw2 should not include it. Why should GW2 be exactly like GW1?
Now I’m not saying needing to get a certain stat to be able to do dungeon isn’t ridiculous – that’s completely dumb.

But if its just a better tier of gear with non of the infusion stuff I’m all for it. Guild Wars 2 is not meant to be guild war 1 as it is nothing like guild wars 1 from the get go. If I want a game where I’m only ever gonna grind for skin I’ll go play GW1.

Excatly! If people thought that Guild Wars 2 was going to stay the same as Guild Wars 1 then they are in for many more surprises!

Also compared to other MMO’s Guild Wars 2 has many things they don’t have.
Example:

Combat is different
Graphics are different
Questing is different
Dynamic Events is different
Personal Story line is different than most MMO’s (minus SWTOR).
WvWvW is different
Quickbars are different
Being in multiple guilds is different
Dungeons are slightly different
Crafting is slightly different

Its a BUY2PLAY game (which was a huge bonus for me)

Those are just some of the reasons why I bought Guild Wars 2.

You could say if you don’t like the gear progression can just go back and play Guild Wars 1! Be thankful it’s still up and running!
People who did not like SWTOR and wanted to go back to SWG didn’t have that choice!

Serbaayuu.3051:

NO. There was a promise, and it’s been broken.

Exactly.

I wanted to register discontent with this whole Ascended and Infused item thing.

I’m an intermittent player. I don’t particularly enjoy playing through content in order to play through other content. I want to go straight to the content I want to do at a particular moment and do it immediately. The current design of the game makes than eminently possible. If I want to go do something, I can wander over and do it. Infusion makes that not possible.

I also don’t enjoy grinding up items. Exotics were annoying, but I rationalized that as being essentially the same as the first set of max gear in GW1. In other words once you’ve got it you can focus on the builds and the content and the fancifying. Not grinding of course, because farming and similar make me unhappy and bored. If I wanted to play a Diablo style grind-em-up game where you plow for power, I’d go buy Diablo III. I don’t. I want to play a game where I can focus on fancy cosmetic upgrades for my Battlin’ Barbie while beating up other players and mobs on an even playing field.

Thus far I’ve paid ArenaNet $130 for this game (2x $60 for box, one of which was for brother, and $10 for a costume) and ~$200 for the original (box, 3x expansions on release, character slots). I’ve liked ArenaNet’s games since ‘05 and I’d like to continue liking them. I’m sure you’d like me to continue supporting your ability to make them and buy fancy things!

So please don’t add in things that make me materially weaker than other players in certain parts of the game. If you want to add in an infusion mechanism, make it explicitly a part of the dungeon. If you want to make higher levels of the dungeon difficult, make them difficult. Paraphrasing another theme park builder, ‘players, uh, players will find a way.’

You wont be able to do lowest lvls of dungeon without “ascended gear” , what do you think, will anyone let u party if you dont have it……..

Mala.3861:

Serbaayuu.3051:

NO. There was a promise, and it’s been broken.

Exactly.

Exactly

All the fear because it seems a new tier of gear after exotics and it is only obtainable by doing a dungeon.

What I see is a new gear type worse and better then exotics available and focusing on a gear progression for the infinite dungeon.

The dungeon its self needed a new type of gear and would have been quite boring with out it.

The dungeon gets harder the farther you get and the rewards scale to the difficulty, if every one only had exotics then you play the dungeon and quickly hit a brick wall were it becomes just boring and a waste of time.

If the dungeon includes its own gear then the farther you get in the dungeon the harder it gets which gives more rewards which makes the dungeon easier which allows you to go farther.

Thus extending the dungeon life by quit a bit until it gets expanded on and more ascended gear becomes available which would allow you to get further then before thus making the time spent in the dungeon and potential reward from the dungeon increase.

From my understanding the ascended gear doesn’t equip runes or sigils which most of my builds rely on thus making it not entirely viable for things outside the dungeon.

ps. Instead of complaining now, wait for the release and give reasoned input that can help expand on something that is going to be potentially awesome.

That was pretty much my general observation of the post. And I agree with what you would have like to of seen.

Though I understand why they may have wanted another tier in between the two it should of been made more clear long before instead of suddenly leaking out information. And it wasn’t like we heard it from them first, it ended up coming from preview news articles.

Also, I would of rather just liked to see pure Resistance gear sets to collect rather then upgrading base stats. I have nothing against collecting armor to do certain dungeons. If I didn’t want to collect a certain armor I wouldn’t do the dungeon, or vice versa. But the increase in base stats makes the idea more demeaning. If I decide not to get the gear am I hurting my character’s progress, etc.

Also, I’m curious what others think of "Ascended gear has Infusion slots, and rarer versions of the items also come with additional Agony Resistance built into them. " The chance of there being ‘better’ Ascended gear and not purely what they showed us as an example is confusing in itself. Will the stats get better or just the resistance? Let’s hope its just the resistance.

Swoo.5079:

Flynch.6034:

Swoo.5079:

Flynch.6034:

It’s slightly strange that the people who are vehemently against the geargrind are the ones who are so focussed on the stat differences between gear in the first place. Normally people who are all about spreadsheeting item stats are found in games that actively promote geargrind, as opposed to a game where a percentile difference won’t make or break the experience.

If it makes no difference why bother?

The people wanting more power won’t get them and still be bored, the people not wanting a gear grind for stats will be annoyed and disappointed.

Presumably because if it doesn’t affect a majority in any way, but means a minority enjoy the progression, then that’s ok.

Apparently it does affect.

When you shift power plateau, the skill differences get washed by the gear.

Considering Ascended items are supposed to be harder to get than exotic (read grindier) it means you have to spend more time grinding items rather then acquiring secondary sets to try out different builds, rather than playing different professions to learn them.

Instead of one developing themselves as player they need to spend more time developing their characters.

Developing yourself as a player is an endless task. Developing your character is a question of spending time.

Ah but this is the rub though. We’re all assuming that players are immediately going to forgo any kind of personal progression and focus entirely on getting the new gear, and that’s also on the proviso that they want to go much further in the new dungeon than the other players.

However, the new gear is coming out in bundles. We’re only getting 2 so far. How long does it take to get a full set of Exotics? And these players can also enjoy themselves in the new dungeon without the new gear anyway – it is only preventative at a certain point, namely repeating the same run.

All of this is then carried by the weight of assumptions that there will be no way to equalise the stats of the new gear and the current exotic gear, even though 200 or so recipes have been announced, which may also include a plethora of better runes etc which can not be applied to Agony armour.

Haroshia.9358:

tl;dr: If you want gear progression, there are plenty of other games that have it. Go play them. Let GW2 be unique.

I was thinking more in terms like:
“Gear treadmill → ArenaNet is changing its target audience/market only 2 months into the game → this will upset many players in this specific (strongly advertised before launch) segment → please don’t, there are already enough MMOs in the direction you’re heading into”
- but your version works, too

Sam.4728:

I am aware the stats are the same.

Actually, I guess it would be more accurate to say: the stats WERE the same. Now legendary=ascended>exotic stat-wise. Before it was legendary=exotic.

I agree it sucks, but so far it does not look like this will be an endless gear treadmill. If they go down the dark path with the infusions granting benefits outside of their respective dungeons, however …. then the amount of vitriol on the forums will be justified. ;-)