Guild Wars 2

Hello, Guild Wars 2 people!

I am a LotRO veteran who just purchased GW2. I am now downloading the game and thinking about what race and profession to pick and how to set it up. I am charmed by the Asura race (funny little fellows)

Now I like to be a main tank (if that exists in this game) Thus I like to reduce incoming damage and have good self-heals. I don’t like crowd control. I also enjoy doing sustained AoE damage. (bleeds are nice)

If any of those requests can’t be combined, then so be it. As long as the outcome is that I would be wanted as a main tank, then my priorities are met.

Welcome to Guild Wars 2!
Nobody will expect you to tank since there is no such thing in this game as dedicated tanks and healers. Damage mitigation, aoe damage, regen – it screams Guardian, but then the same thing can be said about Engineers Try Guardian tho, it has heavy armor, blocking buff and holy knight’s powers, it is the most tanky-looky class there is in game.

I agree that Guardian is closest to what you are looking for, but do not expect this game to be like your other games. If you don’t accept it on its own terms and you try to play it according to another game’s rules, you will be disappointed.

Guardian has the best survivability. Shout guardian in particular may be of interest to you as it is good for supporting the team and providing buffs.
Alternatively a banner warrior may also be of interest

There is no Aggro System in place in GW2, because they have steered away from the classical Holy Trinity, thus it is impossible to make a “Pure Tank”. Furthermore, AoE Heals are relatively insubstantial and are used for Sustainance rather than Comeback, much like Damage Reduction Buffs in other games.

That being said, there is a profession for you, namely the Guardian. It doesn’t matter wether the Guardian is Geared out for max DPS (As is mostly the case in Dungeons and PvE) or for Survivability/Support (Which is often the case in WvW or sPvP), the Guardian will always be the king of Defense and Support no matter what group he enters. Having access to all defensive boons (Protection, Aegis, Regeneration, Stability and Retaliation) as well as plentiful Condition Removal, Projectile Defense and Healing.

It helps if you know that All Professions Have a Self-Heal that heals them for a substantial Amount, meaning you shouldn’t worry too much about watching their Health, and that all Professions have the ability to Dodge, completely avoiding attacks. Each profession has their own levels and tricks to sustain themselves, meaning they can often survive on their own. However, that only goes for so long and the Guardian’s purpose is to make sure his team makes it through the encounter even if their own resources are diminished.

Gear Choice (PvE/Dungeons):
Mostly, a typical “Tank” would gear up for maximum HP and Defense in PvE modes. As you cannot control Aggro (And thus direct it towards yourself) in GW2, stacking such Stats only affects your own Survivability and doesn’t help the team at all.
On the other hand, Max DPS gear means enemies go down faster. Dead enemies Don’t Deal Damage. A Coordinated team will make sure to have all their 5 members Gear out for Maximum DPS, trusting the innate Support of professions like Guardian, Mesmer or Elementalist to make up for any cracks in their defenses along with skillful play and learning the encounters. Guardians overall tend to sacrifice some DPS Traits for Supportive Traits, because they’re just that good at it.

So for PvE/Dungeons, go for Berserker Gear (POWER/Precision/Ferocity).

World Bosses (PvE):
Now, some “World Bosses” that spawn around the world of Tyria Cannot be critically hit, making stats like Precision and Ferocity useless against them. Not to mention, their AoE’s tend to hit hard if you’re caught off-guard.

Against these Bosses, use Soldier Gear instead. (POWER/Toughness/Vitality)

Dante.8456:

Guardian has the best survivability.

its a matter of perspective, but really any class can be tanky if you build for it. imo the classes that can be built really bunker to have good survivability are warrior, guardian, ele, and engineer. If you are doing spvp you should try a warrior shout heal build, thats probably closest to what you ask. the whole build is about bleeds, self heal, condis, and rotations. for pve I suggest warrior, they have such high base health and regen even when built for zerker, in groups I sometimes solo Lupi off the wall without taking any damage. The idea of banner warrior is you are naturally tankier than other classes due to high health and armor, and you still bring more dps than a guardian with bunker build, for example.

Thanks a lot for the insights, guys!

I got me a guardian. I guess I’ll find out what ‘shout’ guardian means, but so far I tried 2h sword, 2h hammer, 2h staff and mace+shield. I like 2h sword the best, but I only just started off course.

Shouts are one type of utility skill (utilities come in categories). As you get traits, some of them affect particular categories of utility. For instance, my support guardian is traited to remove her group’s conditions when she shouts, so having 3 defensive shouts gives her that much more support value.

TheSwede.9512:

There is no Aggro System in place in GW2,

False.

There is an aggro system in place, just not something similar to WoW or Wildstar where there are threat modifiers to aid tanks.

Not trying to be negative, but if your goal is make a TANK in this game, you are in for a LOT of disappointment. TANK in this game means you may be able to mitigate most damage for a few tens of seconds and then take take 3 heavy hits from a CHAMP before going down rather than 1 or 2 hits.

You will NEVER be able to stand next to a Champ or World Boss and just take infinite damage and maintain his agro (even with others assisting you)….just can’t happen in this game. As long as you go into this with that knowledge, you will be fine.

Fluffydonkeys.8037:

Thanks a lot for the insights, guys!

I got me a guardian. I guess I’ll find out what ‘shout’ guardian means, but so far I tried 2h sword, 2h hammer, 2h staff and mace+shield. I like 2h sword the best, but I only just started off course.

Shout Guardian was a relatively ok build 2 years ago when ppl were still figuring out the game. You can use that build if you want, but is far far from being the best build. Its a selfish build that boost only your survivability, while having limited damage and group support. Build exist right now that will give you more survivability with damage mitigation over the self healing that shout build provide you. These same build will also give you way more damage and group support. I think that all guardian used shout build at least one, but you should stick to it for too long.

I’m pretty sure what you consider a “shout build” is not what I am currently using. My shouts give me and others swiftness (for mobility in zones) and lots of boons in addition to condition removal (with both my shouts and a one of the virtues). Nobody has ever complained and called me “selfish” for running it.

Sure, there are other builds that can provide better overall group DPS, but most players in PvE have DPS covered pretty well.

The real issue with what the OP is asking is that a TANK (as it exists in other MMOs or similar co-op games) simply does NOT exist in GW2. This was a direct design decision and if he attempts to play as a TANK (per other games) he will fail miserably and frustrate himself and other he is playing with.

Thaddeus.4891:

Its a selfish build that boost only your survivability, while having limited damage and group support.

I think you shouldn’t lump all Guardian Shout builds together with Altruistic Healing builds. There are variations that are not “selfish”, assuming group-wide Aegis, Stability, Retaliation, Protection and condition cleanse is considered selfish.

Well ok that. It won’t be that good of a build anyway, but it won’t be selfish. I guess you can do a good build of the kind if you play hammer. Something like 2/5/0/6/0 with 1 pts left to put where you want. But that sacrificing a lot to gain not that good of a condition removal. With that you will sacrifice UC or MoC. You will also need to sacrifice some of your utilities to use shout. You can’t use retreat as a condi removal since you need to time if with direct attack dmg so it will be able to remove condi only by chance not on purpose. Either you use WoR and you lose one more shout leaving you only with 1 shout using Pure of Voice at maximum or you don’t use WoR which can be a bad idea in some situation. You are better off without Pure of Voice, but with Purging Flames for group condi removal. That leave you more room to adapt to the situation. You could also get the condi removal on shout from a rune, but that would sacrifice more than 20% dmg.

Coming from LotRO myself, the first thing you’ll need to learn here is to move more while in combat. And as said many times, the “tanking” system here is quite different, if not completely absent. Also, you need to understand that playing PvE is much different than PvP, just life most other games out there. So when considering build ideas, make sure you check which section of the game they’re designed for.

Others can give much better advice on the Guardian profession ( I haven’t played it a lot, ) but I can talk a little about making damage sponge and support Warriors. Someone already mentioned a “banner warrior” and that’s how I play my main. Banners ( http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Banner ) here work much like Captain banners in LotRO: plant them and they give off a beneficial aura ( though doing so doesn’t penalize your own stats like LotRO. ) Properly traited, your banners cooldown faster, have bigger AoE, and provide health regen too. That same trait line also helps with group condition removal and buffing, so you become a kittenet to your party. Using Knight’s, Sentinel’s, or Soldier’s gear will increase your armor and life while still boosting your damage output a little. Taking this route will reduce your own potential DPS, but you help everyone else do their job better so I call that a good trade. The downside is that your buffs only get fully realized in a group, so your solo survivability isn’t what it could be.

Some people will complain that the warrior is the easy mode to play, and that’s just fine. Some times you want to play basic, some times you want to play tricky. Both have their parts. And don’t feel like you have to conform to some prescribed stat matrix. Most builds can do very well so long as you put some thought into it and play it accordingly.

I was wrong….my build doesn’t just remove conditions from myself and allies it converts them to boons. I really appreciate being told how bad the build a favor “wont’ be that good”, by someone that has no idea what I’m using.

No, my guardian is not set up to deal max DPS and since I’m not running dungeons with you, why do you care? The OP didn’t ask how to play a Guardian but how to play a Tank…..do him a favor and tell him he will not be successful in that attempt.

Hello Fluffydonkeys. Yes – it most certainly is true that this game has no traditional trinity model involving Tank, Healer and various DPSes. However the part regarding the Tank is simply untrue. Which class should it be? I will surprise You – no guarding and no warrior can easily beat what i have in store when it comes to plain survavibility.

1. The Class

The choice, while surpriseing, is simple. Pick up the Engineer. It is the jack of all trades so this means that You will be able to handle many different situations, but You will not master any of it. But we do not have to master them, we simply have to survive them, right?

2. The Character Build
I currently use this one:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdIQFAUlUUpdr9Zx+KseNiaBF6O2mAAqLK6r8xsA-TxBBABA8AAzfRp8TI1fC5CAA4+DWoEcGdAAA-e

So let’s talk about skills and how to use them, shall we?

2.1 The Healer

Tha game have been designed around dpsing only. Thus the mobs have to deal damage which is small enough to make a team of unexperienced players survive to kill them. The general rule of thumb here is that the less HP the mobs have the higher the dps they deliver. That being said You still have to remember that these kittens have to NOT kill warriors with around 25k hp within couple of seconds. Let’s do the math.

The basic and the earliest source of hp for You will be Healing Turret. In the build i have posted in the basic passive system it heals you for 292 hps (311 hps when overcharged) + another 3k worth of hp each 15 seconds with active usage (it also cleans 2 conditions) thus making total of: 508 hps when in range of healing turret. It is already more than any other class in the game, but wait – there is more.

You can also notice the Elixir Gun kit in Your first utility skill bracket. This babe has some decent abilities up to number 5 (the whole kit replaces Your usual weapon) which provides you with aditional total of 465 hps (and heals ONE condition) the kitten thing stays in place for 10 seconds and has 20 seconds cooldown so we can round the average hps it provides to 232.

Thats 232 + 508 = 740 hit points per second. Of course there is more.

In Your traits You will notice two different Trait Lines which were finished. One of them contains Backpack Regenerator trait – providing You with aditional 189 hps IF you have weapon kit equipped (which you will have equipped at all times) the other notable mention is Elixir Infused Bombs which is a cherry on top of our murder cake. Each bomb kit explosion You cause will hill everyone in range for 363 hp. Bombs have 0.5s cast time and no cooldown (the basic ones) thus effectively doubling the hps the bombs provide making it 726 hps.

To sum it up You will have 726 hps (from bombs) + 189 hps (from BP regenerator) + 740 hps (from other aforementioned sources) = 1655 hit points per second. So You will be a decent healer giving away 1466 hps to allies. (since only one of those sources affects ONLY You.) Oh, did I mention that You can also eat up food for some passive HPS regen? You can – I do not remember exact numbers but it is around 80 so let’s just say You will heal Yourself for around 1730 hit points per second.

You will also have two other skills derived from both Your Healing skill (#6) and whichever utility slot the Elixir Gun occupies – both of them provide You with some regen (which is nice to elongate the effects of Healing Turret) but the real deal is that the first one creates water field (great for planting Big Ol’ Bomb inside to make a healing combo with) and the other is Your stunbreak.

2.2 The Kiter

You see i decieved You a little bit – You won’t be able to tank and spank everything. You will kite them. How can You kite enemies? Why with constant Swiftness of course. Since the build is using Magi gear (only half of it can be ascended) which is cheap as dirt You will quickly have 49% critical chance which combined with two bombs a second and Infused Precision from Firearms tree will provide You with Swiftness every second.

“But it will make me leave the bomb explosion radius thus cuting my heals in half” you say.

Indeed. Thats why this build can be also called Crab build – strafing doesn’t allow you to move at full speed, just like moving backwards. But whats the point of having constant swiftness then? Simple: Invigorating Speed from Alchemy skilltree which will provide You with 6 seconds of Vigor (+100% endurance regeneration) thus allowing You to enjoy constat evading.

It seems complicated right? Don’t worry – the build is very forgiving. Why? Did You notice the yellow elixir in Your utility skills? Elixir S? That’s the “F***-everything-and-run” button. It makes You virtually indestructible for 3 seconds. Great when things do not go Your way. Oh, and it is automated too – thanks to Self Regulating Defenses trait from Alchemy skilltree. So when You accidentally get Yourself in trouble and drop to 25% of Your hp You shrink, break from stun and run like hell. After that You still get to use Elixir S from Your utility skill. Making it “F.E.A.R” button active each 30 s.

2.3 The weak spots

Well. You are prone to three things. Enemies that can somewhat competently heal themselves, condition damage and stun. Stun cuts Your hps in half thus making this build very prone to hambow warriors in pvp. You also have only one stun breaker – which does not help. Your demise will be certain after You meet certain types of pvp classes focused on condition damage – perticularly Necros and Mesmers are nasty. The guardians will be fun since they can’t kill You just as You can’t kill them, other warrior builds too seems to be uneffective. So basicly this is not good sPVP build (or at least i can’t utilize it correctly), but it is marvellous for PVE.

You can also notice that I am using slightly different build and that I adjust it on the fly. I also used the invisibility from Elixir S (the toolbest lkill) to bypass couple of enemies. I also used couple of turrets to avoid direct confrontation with certain enemy mobs. So – go on – do experiment, enjoy Your new tank!

It should also be mentioned that, although there are some builds that are more “efficient” than others, pretty much every build is viable in this game. I’m running a very tanky build for my guardian and although some people wouldn’t take me with them on their dungeon tour, I’m pretty happy with it and it works perfectly fine. Different types of gear (or builds) usually don’t decide if you succeed or fail, they only decide how fast you can complete the content.

My 2 cents:
Warrior: If your self-survivability and the ability to get your teammates out of downed state takes priority from the basic mmo-tank aspect. Easy class to play relatively efficiently in groupplay.
Guardian: If your main goal is preventing/mitigating damage your team (and thus you) take, which is compareable to the basic mmo-tank aswell. Difficult class to play if encounters are unknown to you and no teammates give you a heads-up about them. (Which as a Tank-player shouldn’t be something that scares you off :p)
Mesmer: Also helpful at mitigating damage for the team and have an easier time surviving (in melee) than most other classes due to a low-cooldown evade on sword, along with a block, their support options do require a bit more practice and are more limited (less Stability, no Aegis.) Rather annoying to level though, so I’d keep that as an alt-option personally.
Necromancer: Also rather high self-sustain, but lacks any form of teamsupport.

I’d stay away from Thief and Elementalist in PvE, they’re generally rather squishy, damage orientated classes, though they do each have ways of surviving (Thief from blinds, Elementalist from reasonable invul/evade options.) Not sure where to place Engineer/Ranger.

PS: If you enjoy PvP you could try out all classes with almost all their traits/gear/skills available to them. The rewards aren’t too shabby, few weeks of PvP and I got enough items to get 4 more alts to level 80. Shame I already got 17 level 80s. ^^" There’s a Practice Mode and Hotjoin option where people are overal more chilled towards unexperienced players (or should be atleast.)

Where to place ranger? As master of survival ofc!

Work well with your pet and you can be near invincible. Also tons of evades on melee weapons, solid melee and great ranged damage, strong condition game, and good ability to control mobs (traps!). On top of that add ability to pull out 50k hp bear (that’s 5x the hp of your typical zerk guardian) that needs to stay alive for 20 secs (or 16 if trated) before you can swamp to 2nd pet with full hp and you know you got bear grylls with a bow there.

But it’s true rangers are less supportive to party then guardians. We can’t give our party stability like the guard nor create safe zones. But who needs that if our pet manages to get boss’s aggro while staying way away from rest of ppl. Ofc that’s a big if, given the game’s rather mysterious aggro mechanic..

Overall…oooooh the things you are allowed to learn are massive
Wish you luck and fun

Well the topic sure taught me a lot I am sort of simultaneously levelling a guardian, engineer and elementalist. Especially the former 2 are meant to explore the possibilities of survivability. Engineer pleasantly surprised me indeed.