Guild Wars 2

I keep getting in losing streaks and barely crawled my way into emerald. Things haven’t changed yet. It has been a horrible pvp season for me so far, and I’m not sure I have the strength to keep on doing this.

Noscoc goin 50 games winstreak stright to diamond, soon maybe legend. thats what i call slow mmr settle

Salamander.2504:

StickerHappy.8052:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

Shadelang.3012:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

I’ll explain the lopsided games.

“Beginning with Season 2, matchmaking for Ranked matches will use your placement in your current league division as your primary matchmaking consideration and pair you against players who are placed in the same point range as you, regardless of the skill level (MMR) of the other people in that point range."

This is what they said how the season 2 MM system will work.

So actually to clarify something and please correct me if I’m misreading. The way the system currently works is it only considers MMR on your own team and not the full 10 players. So let’s say there’s 10 people queuing within an acceptable division range, 5 players are around 800 MMR and the other 5 are around 1000 MMR. Due to the fact that the system only considers making a team of 5 of similar MMR players at a time, the 5 800 MMR players will be put on one team and the 5 1000 MMR players will be on the other team. So what you get is high skilled players on 1 team and less skilled players on the other. Of course the result is the 800 MMR team getting stomped.

The result is you will never get a balanced team vs. balanced team like a team of 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players vs. 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players.

But with all said, I prefer the balanced team vs balanced team setup more.

The thing is eventually the teams will end up balanced. Or atleast so close it won’t matter. As different teams will progress at different rates. The 800mmr people SHOULD start fighting other 800mmr (or close) becuase they will be the only ones in range.

Atleast thats how I have understood it.

Eventually it will work out yes you are correct. As the 800 MMR people will be the only ones in the suitable division range so 800 MMR vs 800 MMR games will happen. The question is how long will that take though and if it takes too long is this system worth it as you’ll be playing lopsided games for a while. Another thing I’m wondering about is the decreasing player population amplifying this as well.

These are all good explanations (and questions) :]

That’s your answer? It’s better if you just straightened your stuff out. Can’t you see your customers are complaining?

It’s day 5. Way too early to tell if this needs to be straightened out at all. People are still getting into their appropriate league positions. Evan Lesh’s answer was fine.

LOL. If you were in danger control, you are the type of person to wait until there is max casualties eh?

Since the beta, we have no idea how exactly MMR works, show us our MMR and I assure you all this whining is gonna stop.

Show the MMR when being matched up. Easy. So we could see if Matchmaking is working.

StickerHappy.8052:

Salamander.2504:

StickerHappy.8052:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

Shadelang.3012:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

I’ll explain the lopsided games.

“Beginning with Season 2, matchmaking for Ranked matches will use your placement in your current league division as your primary matchmaking consideration and pair you against players who are placed in the same point range as you, regardless of the skill level (MMR) of the other people in that point range."

This is what they said how the season 2 MM system will work.

So actually to clarify something and please correct me if I’m misreading. The way the system currently works is it only considers MMR on your own team and not the full 10 players. So let’s say there’s 10 people queuing within an acceptable division range, 5 players are around 800 MMR and the other 5 are around 1000 MMR. Due to the fact that the system only considers making a team of 5 of similar MMR players at a time, the 5 800 MMR players will be put on one team and the 5 1000 MMR players will be on the other team. So what you get is high skilled players on 1 team and less skilled players on the other. Of course the result is the 800 MMR team getting stomped.

The result is you will never get a balanced team vs. balanced team like a team of 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players vs. 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players.

But with all said, I prefer the balanced team vs balanced team setup more.

The thing is eventually the teams will end up balanced. Or atleast so close it won’t matter. As different teams will progress at different rates. The 800mmr people SHOULD start fighting other 800mmr (or close) becuase they will be the only ones in range.

Atleast thats how I have understood it.

Eventually it will work out yes you are correct. As the 800 MMR people will be the only ones in the suitable division range so 800 MMR vs 800 MMR games will happen. The question is how long will that take though and if it takes too long is this system worth it as you’ll be playing lopsided games for a while. Another thing I’m wondering about is the decreasing player population amplifying this as well.

These are all good explanations (and questions) :]

That’s your answer? It’s better if you just straightened your stuff out. Can’t you see your customers are complaining?

It’s day 5. Way too early to tell if this needs to be straightened out at all. People are still getting into their appropriate league positions. Evan Lesh’s answer was fine.

LOL. If you were in danger control, you are the type of person to wait until there is max casualties eh?

Since the beta, we have no idea how exactly MMR works, show us our MMR and I assure you all this whining is gonna stop.

Show the MMR when being matched up. Easy. So we could see if Matchmaking is working.

Ouch, I guess?

I don’t see why the pitchforks are being brought out on day 5. ANet Devs explicitly told us that the beginning of the season would be chaotic in these very PvP forums, and all of the forum-goers signed on enthusiastically! Give it a week, things are going to be different. My matches through sapphire to ruby were already much more balanced.

Also, seeing our MMR is a terrible idea—I would get so discouraged seeing my MMR drop after losses, etc. It’s demoralizing and I’m glad we can’t see it.

PvP is massively unfair, so I guess we are all going to a game where PvP should be good, like Black Desert Online that is out today… GJ Anet you ruined your own game by not listening to your players and not responding when they told you it was unfair and showed you all the proof you should need… Your players are telling you that you have messed up, but you have done NOTHING to help us, only to tell us that it SHOULD get better after a ‘while’. I will look out for the Anet redundancies in the papers as the players leave for other games. I know 6 people now who have uninstalled GW2 over this last week

“YOUR MMR IS MEANINGLESS IF THE FOUNDATION FOR THE CALCULATION IS BASED ON GAMES THAT ARE SUPPOSED TO BE ENTIRELY ONE SIDED.”
This is correct, and is the heart of the problem.

If you solo queue, your MMR will increase if your MMR is already high because you are paired with good players. and it decreases if it’s low because you are paired with bad ones. And it’s a viscous cycle. In the other words, If you are on a losing streak, your team will be worse and worse if you keep playing.

It’s a simple math error by assuming MMR can effect placement but not the other way around.

My recommendation is removing teams entirely, have ranked pvp be 1 v 1s, if you want to tell exactly how good everyone is, there are no better test than duels.

This is seriously God awful. Last season in ruby I at least had competent players that knew what they were doing and would switch professions if enemy team was unfavorable to their current. This season I am getting nothing but scrubs, and when I lose with said scrubs, I get more scrubs or the same kitten scrubs! I am pretty big into pvp, but this type of downward spiral gaming will even make me quit.

Salamander.2504:

StickerHappy.8052:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

Shadelang.3012:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

I’ll explain the lopsided games.

“Beginning with Season 2, matchmaking for Ranked matches will use your placement in your current league division as your primary matchmaking consideration and pair you against players who are placed in the same point range as you, regardless of the skill level (MMR) of the other people in that point range."

This is what they said how the season 2 MM system will work.

So actually to clarify something and please correct me if I’m misreading. The way the system currently works is it only considers MMR on your own team and not the full 10 players. So let’s say there’s 10 people queuing within an acceptable division range, 5 players are around 800 MMR and the other 5 are around 1000 MMR. Due to the fact that the system only considers making a team of 5 of similar MMR players at a time, the 5 800 MMR players will be put on one team and the 5 1000 MMR players will be on the other team. So what you get is high skilled players on 1 team and less skilled players on the other. Of course the result is the 800 MMR team getting stomped.

The result is you will never get a balanced team vs. balanced team like a team of 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players vs. 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players.

But with all said, I prefer the balanced team vs balanced team setup more.

The thing is eventually the teams will end up balanced. Or atleast so close it won’t matter. As different teams will progress at different rates. The 800mmr people SHOULD start fighting other 800mmr (or close) becuase they will be the only ones in range.

Atleast thats how I have understood it.

Eventually it will work out yes you are correct. As the 800 MMR people will be the only ones in the suitable division range so 800 MMR vs 800 MMR games will happen. The question is how long will that take though and if it takes too long is this system worth it as you’ll be playing lopsided games for a while. Another thing I’m wondering about is the decreasing player population amplifying this as well.

These are all good explanations (and questions) :]

That’s your answer? It’s better if you just straightened your stuff out. Can’t you see your customers are complaining?

It’s day 5. Way too early to tell if this needs to be straightened out at all. People are still getting into their appropriate league positions. Evan Lesh’s answer was fine.

That’s why I decided to save some nerves and quit PvP for a week or two. Or maybe 18-lose streak made that lol. Anyway, will try in a few weeks to see if it rolled out.

I am in sapphire now, and I lost just ONE match…
I am not unhappy with winning streaks but it is getting boring and not challenging enough for me

MadVisions.4529:

Mr Godlike.6098:

Right now I maybe have 1 win per 3-5 matches.

It’s not fun to non-stop lose…
It’s not fun to play unfair matches if you had 55% win ratio in previous season.
It’s not fun to hear that you have to keep losing until your mmr or matchmaking will be balanced.

Game has no point of playing or buying if it don’t give any type of fun or satisfaction for your effort.

For now as casual i can say that playing ranked is waste of time and a lot players will say the same. I love pvp but many ppl will just quit.

I am really Astonished. really…. i’ve read dozens of post like this at this point. and i feel really sorry and bad for seeing players actually quit becouse of a system i’ve beed waiting since long long time.
I am just screaching my head atm…. what to say to stay constructive, help and meanwhyle dont hurt anyones feelings.

so. Back in time when i started pvp i havnt even touched ranked for a long time. i was thinking like: hmm ranked.. ranked means competition in every game and obviously i can feel i’m a beginner so lets get better and mby then i can show off some ranks later. Imo i’ve hit the 1k unrankeds way before i even started to think about ranked.

The thing is that the newly implemented MM algorythm NO LONGER supports grinding based progression like the previous ones. This means that progression is enchanced by the skill level of an individual and not the bare will to progress. League system was implemented to indicate one’s mad haxor PvP skills with a tiny icon next to his/her name so everyone can see how big his E-PENlS is. Now, becouse the smurfing and abusing has been (mostly)fixed and the league is skill based, a mediocre random player can no longer have the same E-PENlS icon as an ESL player at least not as fast.
To get to the point. If someone is enduring a humilating 15lose streak or barely reaches 20% winning in this season should ask himself: “Am I prepared to play the most competitive part of the game? maybe not. Maybe wanting to be faster ranked up than way better players than me is a bit eager behaviour… Mby i should go practice a bit more so i can later suprise everyone with how good i am!”

Your speaking out of both sides of your mouth defending a system that’s supposed to have skill as the sole determinate yet makes it faster for pvp players with the highest mmr from a terribly flawed last season to climb faster. Each match is like a race to the top of a pit with one team getting a rope and the other given nothing but there hands to climb the wall.

cosmicegg.8502:

Your speaking out of both sides of your mouth defending a system that’s supposed to have skill as the sole determinate yet makes it faster for pvp players with the highest mmr from a terribly flawed last season to climb faster. Each match is like a race to the top of a pit with one team getting a rope and the other given nothing but there hands to climb the wall.

you clearly have no clue about how ruby matches at this moment look like. i mean at the top 20% the matches are already entertaining so your “Each match is like a race to the top of a pit with one team getting a rope and the other given nothing” argument is invalid.

There’s so few people in ruby right now your only getting good players give it a couple days you’ll see ruby the new scrub sapphire, I remember ruby last season was the same way. If your such a pro start a new account and work your way up the solo q.

StickerHappy.8052:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

Shadelang.3012:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

I’ll explain the lopsided games.

“Beginning with Season 2, matchmaking for Ranked matches will use your placement in your current league division as your primary matchmaking consideration and pair you against players who are placed in the same point range as you, regardless of the skill level (MMR) of the other people in that point range."

This is what they said how the season 2 MM system will work.

So actually to clarify something and please correct me if I’m misreading. The way the system currently works is it only considers MMR on your own team and not the full 10 players. So let’s say there’s 10 people queuing within an acceptable division range, 5 players are around 800 MMR and the other 5 are around 1000 MMR. Due to the fact that the system only considers making a team of 5 of similar MMR players at a time, the 5 800 MMR players will be put on one team and the 5 1000 MMR players will be on the other team. So what you get is high skilled players on 1 team and less skilled players on the other. Of course the result is the 800 MMR team getting stomped.

The result is you will never get a balanced team vs. balanced team like a team of 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players vs. 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players.

But with all said, I prefer the balanced team vs balanced team setup more.

The thing is eventually the teams will end up balanced. Or atleast so close it won’t matter. As different teams will progress at different rates. The 800mmr people SHOULD start fighting other 800mmr (or close) becuase they will be the only ones in range.

Atleast thats how I have understood it.

Eventually it will work out yes you are correct. As the 800 MMR people will be the only ones in the suitable division range so 800 MMR vs 800 MMR games will happen. The question is how long will that take though and if it takes too long is this system worth it as you’ll be playing lopsided games for a while. Another thing I’m wondering about is the decreasing player population amplifying this as well.

These are all good explanations (and questions) :]

That’s your answer? It’s better if you just straightened your stuff out. Can’t you see your customers are complaining?

They are using as as guinea pigs to test stupid pvp systems instead of using something from other game that is working

They should show MMR on the score screen,I feel I almost never get a balanced game one team will win by a LOT 99.9% of the time….

Actually you do not get matched with you’re tier, that’s a complete lie.

I’m in Emerald t1, i have been in the same team as amber for over 100 matches, so my teamates are amber. I have also asked my opponents what their divison was? I have gotten the highest of ruby.

So yea i love having a team full of amber facing ruby… makes sense.

On top of that why do i solo queue and taking on parties and guilds? makes zero sense.

Anet ruined this, they screwed solo queuers, and only made it fun for teams, like the abjured, orange logo, team 55, and vermillion.

But why not screw the other players, they are not the faces of the worthless pvp system.

New matchmaking is horrible.

I’ve been over 60% win rate last season, now down to 40% in a matter of days. More losses than wins. Teams full of necros. Teammates completely clueless, and I get the same people every single time, even when trying to avoid them by not queuing again right away.

Zzzz…

Pvp is ruined…. they need 2v2, or 1v1…

Shadelang.3012:

The reason for this has been explained in a dozen threads now. The general consensus is let the kitten league sort out. We KNEW this is what would happen. Nearly every PvPer that asked for exactly for this system knew this would happen. The issue is alot of those people didn’t realize where there skill level actually was. Now that were being partnered by tier instead of by Win/Loss ratio people are getting harsh wakeup calls.

Let the max tier people get where they need to go. It won’t take the much longer to spread out. But making rage posts cussing out Anet for giving us EXACTLY what the vocal portion of our community asked for is not exactly bright…nor is it fair to Arenanet.

You actually know the biggest problem with the system balancing out at a reasonable time right? People play for different amount of time. That means some high skilled players move on slower which really screws up the whole idea of the system being auto balancing at a reasonable amount of time. This system will work perfectly if you assume everyone that plays this game plays for exactly like 5 hours a day or something.

Why the hell did a-net need to invent some stupid matchmaking system in the first place? there are dozens of other games, like Heartstone that work just fine

Start from facts:

I don’t hear any good player complaining. They have short queue, they win, they have win streak and they go up. They’ll reach quicker the higher division. And this is good because best players deserve to be in the higher divisions.

I hear a lot of complaining from other players category. Basically the reason is always the same, I get matched with bad player qq I can’t carry them, I’ll quit GW2, GW2 matchmaking is terrible, etc. etc. I’m pretty sure this category of players do always the same mistakes like other players they like to blame.

If I’m wrong just record some “cantcarrythem” games and upload them on youtube and we really see if it’s only your team mates fault or there is “something else”.

The truth is that this matchamking is showing what is your real level and it’s saying “dude, you’re not good enough to carry enough games to go out from amber or emerald. You need to improve”

That’s all, some bad game can happen to everyone but if you are in a super long loss streak well I’m sorry but it’s not only a matchmaking fault.

I know many players like the fact they could reach legendary division in the last season, fighting only subpar players but honestly the old matchmaking was really terrible, punishing high skilled players because they moved a lower rate than bad players.

Good players have thousand of hours spent in spvp trying to improve their gameplay, a PVE player can’t pretend to have the same progression than a good pvp player.

You need to work on it like other players did.

This is supposed to be a competitive environment. If you want to go up, you need to be better.

Happy now ? I’m winning non-stop and complaining about it.

Basically the new matchup system is more fair but probably not fun for lower division players.

This is my proof that match making is solid and I am being rewarded/punished for my skills

http://i.imgur.com/vOthumo.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/MbI8mVT.jpg

You win some, you lose some, you try harder

This matchmaking is really better than the old one, at least, from my experience.

Let me guess Phil, you’re stuck in Amber? No?

I’m shocked.

Wow mister can I have your autograph?

Constantin.5608:

Happy now ? I’m winning non-stop and complaining about it.

You just started man, wait when it settles a bit then you will get much better matches.

I basically got to ruby with minimum of losses(like 4-5 maybe). Atm I am on the border of ruby/diamond and the matches are already way way more balanced for me. So just wait it out

Here is what’s wrong with your logic OP (and subsequently the matchmaking system)

So top players win and move up and it’s all happy dandy because that’s where they belong

So the system puts you exactly where you belong… Which seems great on paper… But if I am to play and lose 70+ games like i saw a dude post earlier on the forums… I think I’m going to go play league of legends or CS:GO or anything else really…

Just like sports there are few Olympians at the top but thousands upon thousands amateurs learning the sport.
Why hasn’t the sports died? Because sport associations make the athletes have fun going to the way up. Will all of them make it? No. Will most of them have fun trying to get there? Definitely!

Right now a-net is not making the amateurs enjoy their e-sports. Thus most will quit and never make it to the top. Then those at the top will retire and you will have no one left to take over. Why? Because they didn’t have fun to begin with.

That’s all fine and good phil, I’m glad your an advocate for broken gaming…God knows Anet needs some praise right now.

Let me say this though, you speak of a competitive environment. ..ok…..where is it? There are 2 godmode classes, 2 semi competitive and the rest are trash, yes Phil trash. That is a problem for people “wanting to work to get better” because the truth of the matter is, even if they are the best at that class they will still be a crutch to a good team. Sprinkle all kinds of fancy words on your “get gud” mentality but the bottom line is simple. The classes are not balanced to have a healthy competitive environment……not even close.

The matchmaking doesn’t help, the streaks do not help, season 2 is still a fail to the overwhelming majority of the pvp playerbase. I’m glad you are good enough to have fun and be ok with this bs, but I am not. I will not fight and claw against a system that is flawed and one sided, catering to a small populis of the community. My experience this season hasn’t even been that bad, but I know others have struggled and it isn’t because they simply aren’t good enough. If they can’t even play the class they love, and know the mechanics of, because 4 other classes strait up steamroll everything they throw at it that is a problem.

Enjoy your season 2, I’m ending mine prematurely.

Having decided to play some games on my 0 games played (thus base MMR) account using S/F Fresh Air ele and going on a 10 game win streak, I partially agree with you. The players in the lower divisions right now are clearly very inexperienced (my own teammates included) and seemingly running very poor builds. One player using a viable (if far from optimal) build who knows how to play and can play around their teammates’ constant mistakes can make a big difference to the outcome of such matches in my observation.

That said, the game simply cannot sustain such heavy losses by the ‘grassroots’ players to the point where they do not feel like PvPing anymore, even if they are contributing to their losses due to their own play or poor build choice which many certainly are from my own observations. It’s obvious that a lot of people are being put into matches way beyond their own personal ability and the outcome of those matches isn’t fun for all concerned.

It is important novice players are put into situations which allow them to feel as though they’re progressing whilst gradually improving themselves. Some could argue ranked arena isn’t the place for this and it is natural the below average/beginner players could realistically expect to spend quite some time in the lower divisions, which is fine if looking from a purely meritocratic perspective but not so fine if taking the health of PvP in the long term into consideration. It’s important all levels of player, particularly beginners, have the feeling of: “Yeah, that was pretty epic and definitely something I want to come back and do more of” rather than “screw PvP, I’m not going back there again to get farmed over and over by pros.” You only elicit the former reaction through balanced matchmaking where people feel the result could have gone either way.

Yes, matchmaking is showing the truth who are the OP classes.
I have two words for HOT “No balance”.

Game play on this game never was really that good or fair or fun. I’ve always said I just play this game for the fashion aspect, about the only thing it has going for it. And each “update” they do just makes things a million times worse

SqualZell.7813:

Here is what’s wrong with your logic OP (and subsequently the matchmaking system)

So top players win and move up and it’s all happy dandy because that’s where they belong

So the system puts you exactly where you belong… Which seems great on paper… But if I am to play and lose 70+ games like i saw a dude post earlier on the forums… I think I’m going to go play league of legends or CS:GO or anything else really…

Just like sports there are few Olympians at the top but thousands upon thousands amateurs learning the sport.
Why hasn’t the sports died? Because sport associations make the athletes have fun going to the way up. Will all of them make it? No. Will most of them have fun trying to get there? Definitely!

Right now a-net is not making the amateurs enjoy their e-sports. Thus most will quit and never make it to the top. Then those at the top will retire and you will have no one left to take over. Why? Because they didn’t have fun to begin with.

If you’re talking about lordrosicky (the 70+ loss streak) ofc he was trolling every topics where people started to complain about matchamaking, about super loss streak, quit gw2 because they sux etc.etc.

You’re talking about learning….well you learn nothing from bad players , and the fact many people reached diamond or legendary in the past season and now They have many issues to go over amber/emerald is because the old system was wrong and gave the chance to bad players to move in higher divisions.

You learn from good players, so bad players should be happy to face them, at least They realize what is this game at higher level.

Bad players will reach ruby for sure but they’ll need more time and they’ll need to wait better players stabilized in the higher divisions.

A bad player can’t have a faster progression than a good player. If this happens there is something wrong in the system (like in the old season).

Now this is fixed.

You don’t like that?

3 alternatives

1) Improve and move faster
2) wait 1/2 weeks and retry
3) quit or cry

First off, on mobile, so bear with me if there are any spelling or format errors.

Now to the heart of the issue: matchmaking in pvp

As it stands, there are some major issues apparent in the way teams are formed in ranked pvp. As these issues are most apparent from the standpoint of a solo queue player, it stands to reason that this is the best case to study. Currently, teams are formed prioritizing the mmr similarity of teammates, as opposed to opponents. Opponents are matched on the basis of league rank. By itself, this seems like a logical choice (see season 1), however this greatly penalizes players that suffer early losses, and inflates the standing of players who win a few matches early in the season (for detailed reasoning, skip to very end). This issue is that once a streak has been started, it is very difficult to break out of. Speaking from personal experience, this has been exceedingly frustrating. Having lost a couple of early matches due to afkers and (admittedly) opponents of very high skill, I find myself repeatedly matched with teammates that are not of equitable skill levels. As of time of writing, I am on a 14 game loss streak (and that is just the current streak. Win percentage over the current season is most likely in the single digits), and am constantly matched with a team of players that are very new to the game. While I am not trying to push all blame off myself (as I am not a pvp primary player), there is a point where the team makes or breaks a match. To cite two examples of this phenomena, I recently finished a match on forest where not one, but two players ended with a score of 0. Additionally, in a recent Khylo match, I had a teammate immediately jump on our trebuchet and spend roughly two thirds of the match trying to hit the opposing team’s trebuchet (in case any readers are curious, no, it is not possible no matter how many times one tries).
I get that Arenanet is trying to modify the matchmaking system to address issues that were present in season 1, and that issues are going to arise regardless. However, I just cannot see the reasoning behind averaging team mmr to your own mmr (as opposed to bringing team mmr up to a value closer to global average) and removing the matching of team mmr to opposing team mmr. As it stands, the matchmaking system has a number of notable flaws that are taking the point out of pvp. I would hope these issues would be addressed in a timely manner, as currently progression in the leagues are dependent on chance (as a solo queue player) more than player skill.

The reason the first few matches played are such large factors in deciding the outcome of the majority of following matches is as follows. For the purpose of example (and due to a lack of the numerical values used in mmr calculations), let us quantify player skill (both actual skill and skill as perceived by the system — mmr) by the highly accurate and precise terms of high, average, and low. If a player loses their first match, they will lose skill standing in the system (mmr). Under the current matchmaking system, the next team this player will be placed with will consist of players that have a similar (read: low) mmr. Stastically speaking, this low mmr team will (greatest probability of occurrence) be matched up with a team of average mmr. It is overwhelmingly likely that this low mmr team will consist of players of a lower skill level (the odds of all five players being the victim of an afk player in a previous match are exceedingly low). Due to this lower skill level of the majority of players in the low mmr team, the most likely outcome of the match is a loss for the low mmr team. This pushes the mmr of each player even lower, leading to an even worse team in the next match. Because the opposing teams are not matched by mmr but by rank, basic statistics dictates that this very-low mmr player will be matched with a very-low mmr team, and will face a group of average mmr players. This simply compounds the issues outlined above, and quickly turns into a loss streak for a player that should (by any reasonable measure) have an average mmr.

Don’t Feed Phil

Excellent post. I hope the developers read this and respond to it promptly.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

Shadelang.3012:

Oh Snapalope.1378:

I’ll explain the lopsided games.

“Beginning with Season 2, matchmaking for Ranked matches will use your placement in your current league division as your primary matchmaking consideration and pair you against players who are placed in the same point range as you, regardless of the skill level (MMR) of the other people in that point range."

This is what they said how the season 2 MM system will work.

So actually to clarify something and please correct me if I’m misreading. The way the system currently works is it only considers MMR on your own team and not the full 10 players. So let’s say there’s 10 people queuing within an acceptable division range, 5 players are around 800 MMR and the other 5 are around 1000 MMR. Due to the fact that the system only considers making a team of 5 of similar MMR players at a time, the 5 800 MMR players will be put on one team and the 5 1000 MMR players will be on the other team. So what you get is high skilled players on 1 team and less skilled players on the other. Of course the result is the 800 MMR team getting stomped.

The result is you will never get a balanced team vs. balanced team like a team of 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players vs. 2 1500 MMR players + 3 800 MMR players.

But with all said, I prefer the balanced team vs balanced team setup more.

The thing is eventually the teams will end up balanced. Or atleast so close it won’t matter. As different teams will progress at different rates. The 800mmr people SHOULD start fighting other 800mmr (or close) becuase they will be the only ones in range.

Atleast thats how I have understood it.

Eventually it will work out yes you are correct. As the 800 MMR people will be the only ones in the suitable division range so 800 MMR vs 800 MMR games will happen. The question is how long will that take though and if it takes too long is this system worth it as you’ll be playing lopsided games for a while. Another thing I’m wondering about is the decreasing player population amplifying this as well.

These are all good explanations (and questions) :]

So you are gonna just leave this here? Could you explain how you could find this a good competetive game if you have 5stacks competing 2+2+1 this game was lost when it started! This is for pips this is competition how can this be right how can this not be a bug! If you fesign a competetive game design it’s sutrou digs accordingly and not just like is joke! And if you have issues with waiting times before games I’ll tell you one things i transferred from pvp based games to gw2 and real competetive people don’t give 2 kittens about kittening long waiting time not if the way to decrease em is this solution you huys gave to it! Plz explain how this could be a comptetive scene if this is possible plz i date you give m one good explanation!

greatest mach system……….

The trend i`m noticing is you either stomp the enemy team with 250-300 score difference or more or u get stomped the same way, from all the games i played so far only 2 were interesting and close.

I’ve found that the matches do get more balanced/better the higher you go. I went from Amber to Sapphire without losing, and had about a 60% win rate from there. I’m currently in Ruby.

It does, however, sound (and feel) like a very gimmicky system.

Good post killer. I was going to write a mathematical proof that change in MMR is currently a function of MMR. What you say here is a lot easier to read and explain the problem just as well.

Yes, you are a wargod, it takes a math error to reveal that to all of us.
Happy now ?
Of course people who win are not complaining about the broken system handing them free wins, genius.

So matchmaking shows whether I am a good or bad player.

How come that to start I had about a 70% win ratio on one account and less than 20% on the other? And the losses were in my main account with many many games.

What do those facts show?

Phil.8901:

You’re talking about learning….well you learn nothing from bad players ,

Which is why being paired with them doesn’t somehow lead to an epiphany, just more loses.

You learn from good players

Which is why I would imagine that many of the ‘bad’ players had a better experience in the previous matchmaking system.

They were paired with good players and they learned from the experience via Teamchat and observation.

You are really claiming the only way bad players can learn is if they keep getting beaten by good players while on a bad team and that’s not true.

Case and point, if someone is on a +75 losing streak from being on numerous bad teams while fighting good players how has that helped them 75 loses in?

It hasn’t.

They’ll just keep getting paired with bad teams wide-eyed and fresh from PVE.
There’s no magic point where 200 loses in all the baddies ‘get it’ at the same time and suddenly everyone on equal footing.

The people who benefit the most are the good teams paired together and moving ahead because of it so I can see how some would like things to remain as they are.

I think people overestimate the influence of a few games on the MMR. I won my first 2 games, lost the next 2. The first games didn’t put me on a winning streak, the lost games didn’t put me on a losing streak. On my alt acc (very few ranked games played – so unstable and at best an average MMR) I won all my games in amber, despite not having the best teammates. But I didn’t get teamed up with much better people after those wins and lost my first games in emerald. After those losses, my teammates didn’t become suddenly worse and so I started winning again.
If you already had lots of ranked games played before the season and your matches are very one-sided, it will barely influence your MMR. Of course very long winning or losing streaks will sooner or later affect your MMR, but those MMR changes are most likely not the (major) cause of those streaks.

I kinda agree with the OP, most matchmaking complaints that i see on this forum are from new people that aim for the legendary reward and stuff like that but dont even care about pvp or just blame others while they dont even know what CC is.

I also agree that new/bad players should have fun even when they will stay in amber/emerald, but they dont have to except to get very high if they stay bad just because they want that stuff also and then complain the matchmaking system sucks.

Harmadda.5971:

They were paired with good players and they learned from the experience via Teamchat and observation.

And thank god this is over. Last season I’ve had my full of rookies in saphire and ruby

I am an average player at best, but I play safe and don’t do any rookie mistakes. I’m pretty sure I have a low MMR and I started the season with a loss streak. I barely played this season and I’m almost out of amber. I really don’t see any doom spiral of infinite losses incoming.

People tend to blow out of proportion the whole deal and while I do agree that some people genuinely had bad luck, most of them are probably bad players.

Watch the first minute of this video

Should sum it up with a comical twist.

in my opinion system is not broken because you win all the matches or you lose them, is broken because you can go afk and you still have the same result…on 50 matches i have played 5 close match over 500-400, all the others was a bloody bath, in 20 seconds you know that you have win, and if bad player are with you, you can even know before match start.
i’m ok saying this point is far beyond my ability, i sit there in ruby, but not that i win 500-xx till there and then lose xx-500 after.
basically this sytem use the player mmr to force player in that range, your mmr have far more weight then your skill.
this season is: start the season, look at mmr, give prize, season end.

From my point of view this seasion and matchmaking is much better than the last one.
I was out of Amber/Emerald/Sapphire within 2 days. The real tough games start at diamond division. I’m playing with/against ESL-players all the time and therefore getting legendary is much harder than last seasion, which is a really good thing.

I don’t want to see Vingador or some other pve-achievement-point-hero being legendary after 2 weeks. They can go on blaming the matchmaking,not accepting that they are also the reason why they’re losing 10 games in a row.