Guild Wars 2

Xillllix.3485:

Arcane will impact overload recharge, so most probably we will be forced to go Water/Arcane/Tempest.

Why do people keep saying this?
They said a trait called Harmonious Conduit affected overload recharge.

Overload =/= Attunement

Raif.9507:

FrownyClown.8402:

Tempest may offer different ways to cleanse conditions so you may not need water attunement at all.

FTFY. So far all we know is that the Water overload cleanses conditions (we don’t know how many) and that the heal cleanses some (don’t know how many). For all we knnow it will cleanse 4 between these 2 on long cooldowns.

Shouts with Trooper runes might do the job depending on their CDs.

You do know that switching your specialization isn’t necessary and may be good for certain instances and bad in others. None of the specializations are mandatory and there will be different ones perhaps in expansions. It all depends on the play style you personally like, and it may force you to change the way you play for a new refreshing experience.

from what i understood from today’s blog is that you will be able to overcharge and still stay in the attunement.

so what you can do is: overcharge and then use your normal rotation.

most likely the overcharge cooldown will be triggered after you use it so while you stay in the attunement to use your skills you will already have 3-5 seconds off the actual cooldown.

so let’s say you overcharge and it goes on a 17s cooldown (-15% from arcana minor) and you stay 3 seconds in the same attunement your actual cooldown will be 14 seconds.

assuming it takes 2s to charge the singularity and you stay at least 3s in it you will have 5s off the first overcharge cooldown.

These forums are so ridiculously negative. This spec will be very good, just different

Guizao.4167:

1. I didn’t specify the duration (less than 20s of looking to total strangers and then decide this is the best time to use the elite is pretty dumb)
2. Playing with them? LOL, and benefit someone is already something, you don’t have to benefit all the 4, i.e. you and other teammate are fighting to secure a point

1) OFC you didnt, I was being totally generous, 20 secs means 5 sec per player, to know how all about how he plays…. is ridiculous. But talking about 2 -4 min´s of combat time to know your team means you wasted a ton of battle opportunity´s already. Probably even game-changing ones.
2) “Something” is the keyword, as it is depending on the CD & interactions using the elite on 2 players may be really common or totally stupid. We just don’t know yet.

Azure.8670:

These forums are so ridiculously negative. This spec will be very good, just different

I personally can’t see myself using it over traditional staff in wvw. It might have uses in more frontline-oriented comps.

maddoctor.2738:

Example:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Well_of_Recall

If I understand it correctly, 66% faster recharge means for every 1 sec of alacrity, 3 seconds of recharge pass. Well of Recall applies 3 seconds of Alacrity, which means once those 3 seconds pass, 9 seconds of recharge will be removed, so a net benefit 6 seconds of recharge per skill.

However Alacrity applies to all your skills, so if all your weapon, heal, utility and elite skills are on cd, you will get a massive 6*9=45 second cd reduction, multiply by the amount of players affected (5), and you get 225s cd reduction total. Of course there are also other things affected by Alacrity, second weapon set, profession mechanic recharge, kit, conjure etc recharge, so the benefits of Alacrity will go way up.

Well of Recall also does damage, applies chill on foes and has a 45 sec CD (39s overall if you count the 3s of Alacrity)

If the Elementalist elite has about 20s recharge (or less) it might be worth it otherwise it won’t even be worth the elite slot

… and all the math teacher over the world facepalmed in sync :p

66% recharge means x1.66 (well, more exactly x5/3) on recharge speed, not x3. Meaning 3s of alacrity gives you 5s of recharge, not 9. Not bad, but net benefit is 2s, only 1/3 of what you thought. With all your skills on CD, it makes for a total reduction of 18s instead of 54s (because 6×9 makes 54, not 45 ). For 5 players, 90s. Far from the 270s you should have computed, and still far from the 225s you got. And if you take weapon swap, profession mechanics and co. into account, you also have to realize that not every skill will be on CD for 5 players during a 3s window in a definite space on the field, so the real benefit is way less.

Not to say Rebound is better (I do think alacrity wins), but you have to keep things in perspective.
Rebound gives a better reduction on all skills that have 10s or more of CD. Not to forget that this reduction is instant, not spread on multiple seconds, standing in place (which suck), and wouldn’t be strippable/corruptable/stealable.
On Time Warp (highest skill CD in the game iirc), it gives a whopping 45 second of reduction. You need almost 70s of continuous alacrity to go even. Ideal case for rebound would be 4 mesmers, plus an untraited glyph of renewal: it gives a total 221.25s of CD. Way better than the punny 90s of alacrity!
Such a case would obviously never happen, but it shows how much the math don’t lead us anywhere without more info. Rebound has potential, numerically . What will make or sink it will be things like CD (on a 20s CD it would be OP as all hells for example), duration of the effect (next attack in what window? 2s? 10s ?), if it affects autoattack or not (probably not, but who knows?)…

In short, it might be bad, it might be good, we need more info

FrownyClown.8402:

For those of you who don’t know, the current implentation of tempest’s new f1 skill is the ability to overload an attunement to gain access to pulsing skills that correlate with that attunement. Here is the catch 22, if you leave that attunement after it is overloaded, you will be locked out of that attunement.

Here is a couple problems with this idea. Sometimes an ele may unintentionally stay in the attunement too long and lose access to key skills they may need at clutch moments.

Another problem is that the overload skills can probably be interrupted, making your reason for staying in that attunement a waste and locking you out anyways.

Keep in mind, this is only my assumption of how overload will work.

If anet wants to promote single attunement play they can’t cause singularity to crutch the elementalist.

My proposed changes will make single attunement feel worthwhile and won’t prevent them from accessing water skills if they need to throw a heal down or air skills if they need to throw some cc down.

Singularity-This skill will function different from before. Now, if the elementalist stays in an attunement for more than 10 seconds, the skills in that attunement will have a reduced recharge of 25%. This skill will be affected by other reduced cooldown traits. For example, if you have -20% fire recharge from a trait, it will calulate that, then reduce that by 25%.

Yes, that means you potentionally have 15s meteors or 24s healing rains.

Overload-this now becomes a grandmaster trait that procs automatically after you reach the overload threshold. Overload fire, overload water, overload air, overload earth.

Additionally, players will not be locked out of that attunement if they need to switch out of it.

I feel this would more effectively promote single attunement play, while not crippling the concept itself.

I don’t think you understood the way overloading works, or if you even read the blog post or the tth article..

“Sometimes, an ele might unintentionally stay In an attunment too long and lost access to key skills”. What are you trying to say here ? Overloading an attunment is by the choice of the player. After the player has stayed in water long enough. They will have access to the water overload ability. If they use it. That attunment goes on CD. It’s the players choice to use it or not. The amount of time you spend in it doesn’t matter. If you dint use it and swap to another sttunment, your CD will be as it would on the base. Class. The only way the ele will lose access to abilities is if the player activated the skill themselves then swapped to another attunment, that’s the players choice.

And about channeling skills being interrupted, I agree that will get annoying. But it’s on the player to know when to use the skill at a time where it won’t be wasted. Every mechanic needs counter play. And this doesn’t break the mechanic in anyway, it just required more situational awareness .

hopefully you guys are right.

FrownyClown.8402:

hopefully you guys are right.

Hopefully lol. I agree. But if you look at what they said, and what I explained, the choices are up to the players and it will reward , just as they said in there post, good positioning.

I think it looks pretty great and I’m pretty excited (;

Years waiting a decent elite…

Surreal thats all.

I’m just hoping the Air Overcharge does good damage and there’s trait somewhere that grants Stability on Overcharge. A Fresh Air build might be viable and you might be able to skip Water with Trooper runes and taking Shouts(assuming they have reasonable CDs).

Frowny wait till we see the numbers tomorrow.

That way when we dissect all the bad mechanics and compare them to existing mechanics we have numbers to back up what why the new mechanics are terrible.

The Great Al.2546:

rhodoc.2381:

Please somebody tell me this also works for ele itself?

Shouts always work on yourself.

The reaper disagrees.

nearlight.3064:

Argol Vazin.3061:

Leo G.4501:

My perspective on what this spec brings to the players is effect for sacrifice, that sacrifice being holding off on swapping attunements to get a greater effect. Many players complained that the only viable way to play ele was attunement dancing, to the point that people will blindly say you are WRONG if you don’t dance your attunement rotation. Some people don’t like that spammy style and want a more calculated high-effect type of play. Currently you can’t really do that on ele, you need to swap and throw down your high cooldowns, not hold off and overcharge skills for greater effect. Basically, there is no advantage to holding off on certain skills and it’s all about what skills are off cooldown and which attunement they are in.

Staff, you are basically the master of AoE and you camp fire on Staff since you just have massive AoE DPS, add in ice bow/glyph of storms. arcane blast for fury and your good to go. not to mention with constant lava font there is no end to the might stacking.

Camp water for healing support…if healing actually meant anything.

Tempest offers nothing that staff alone already does, in fact the entire elite spec could be converted to a single elite skill that would be better for us as a whole.

Elemental fury (Formaly tornado form): Unleash the fury of the elements in spectacular ways based on your current attunment. Becomes stronger the longer you are in an attunment before using it.
As you can imagine. each of the overcharges whatever they’re called would be represented in this single elite skill

The way I see it the warhorn will bring staff like AoE damage and CC skills that will be useful to use with the sustained damage and PbAoE of an MH dagger, which we couldn’t do before. In pve anything works so whatever, but in pvp this could be a cool new combo since the staff builds had powerful support for pvp, but the dagger builds always outclassed it in damage and flexibility, especially in smaller fights.

So I agree with Leo G.

All this spec needs to be viable is anything that makes it better, or as good as blinding ashes and the fire can trip trait. So far we know that getting more mileage out of protection and the ability to use game changing abilities every once in a while seems like a fair tradeoff so far compared to the fire line in cele pvp builds.

I’m personally excited to see what traits it offers that don’t apply to the channels.

There is your mistake, you are looking at it purely PvP.
Purely PvP, the warhorn is not going to outclass D/F or D/D in fact using Tempest and the overcharges in PvP is the stupidest idea ever “hey guys. please don’t interrupt me while I do a thing”

and of course in PvP Staff is still a contender anyway so Warhorn would still be outclassed

Ele and their crappy elites. Well, I think I will stick with my never used “0” button.

No, For real, I NEVER use elite on my ele, just because it is not worth for anything. Seens like this is not changing atm.

I like the rest of stuff ele is getting tough.

You’re locked out of the attunement when you switch after an overload (longer recharge time).
Overload seems like a risk/reward mechanic. It also has a great synergy with conjured weapons since you can just overload each attunement while using hammer for exemple (use your elite to reduce recharge on hammer too) and Fresh Air makes it even better.

Shouldn’t all Attunement Overloads have a break bar to provide some sort of protection from getting interrupted, maybe even have a shorter break bar(is that even possible) if the channel is only a few seconds.

Anjoys.5367:

Shouldn’t all Attunement Overloads have a break bar to provide some sort of protection from getting interrupted, maybe even have a shorter break bar(is that even possible) if the channel is only a few seconds.

We will just have to wait until tomorrow, there’s always a chance they didn’t talk about those mechanics for the other overload, there could be a trait that provides stability when channeling, who knows. Hopefully they have something like a grandmaster or master that allows you to get the break bar for all attunments

Anjoys.5367:

Shouldn’t all Attunement Overloads have a break bar to provide some sort of protection from getting interrupted, maybe even have a shorter break bar(is that even possible) if the channel is only a few seconds.

You mean Defiance Bar? I think only Earth Attunement has a defiance bar (or break bar) but I do also think it would be great for all the attunements to get a break bar, or at least one major trait provides it.

i’ll wait and see.

the traited 15sec cooldown doesn’t bother me (6 extra seconds isn’t game changing) if the skills are worth it and there are traits that will provide enough stability to pull them off.

as of now, you’d be forced to take Armor of Earth or offhand focus to even be able to do them. its cool if it takes a mantra traited mesmer to blow 3 MoDs to interrupt you….but you have to be able to self-generate enough stability to not be interrupted by a single cc….and preferrably it wouldn’t lock you into having to use AoE cantrip……..that said, you’ll be using that skill anyway outside of pve…..but in pve, a trait would be preferable.

arkealia.2713:

You’re locked out of the attunement when you switch after an overload (longer recharge time).
Overload seems like a risk/reward mechanic. It also has a great synergy with conjured weapons since you can just overload each attunement while using hammer for exemple (use your elite to reduce recharge on hammer too) and Fresh Air makes it even better.

The only game mode you can currently afford to sit in the same attunement as an Elementalist is PvE. The only attunement this is currently rewarded sufficiently in is in Fire because all other attunements offer lackluster DPS. So far, they haven’t announced any changes to any other DPS in other attunements. The few Horn mentioned Air abilities, Air being the primary DPS for Dagger/ are not large DPS adds but instead a CC move (pull) and a (piercing?) line DPS move. From a PvE stand point Tempest will only be relevant if it replaces the large % damage adds the class currently gets from Fire, Air and Water.

In PvP/WvW, being locked out of an attunement is a liability. As a front or backliner we or the groups we already support often rely on us to be able to do the abilities we have. Our entire class is designed around the concept that we can swap attunements and skills are balanced on that fact reinforcing this play style. The skills (so far) aren’t being rebalanced around that fact. For example there’s no stacking buff that increases skill damage or reduces cool downs the longer we are in an attunement (something that would actually make camping an attunement more viable). This means we’re still forced to put out the effects as needed. For example a Staff player might start in Air (Static Field) then use it’s water abilities such as Frozen Ground or Healing Rain, then swap to Fire to get some Meteors on but then need to swap back to Water for the Geyser refresh at the end. Locking a player out of these attunements is crippling as while the damage on Ice Spike is interesting (6-7k+) it’s certainly no stacked Fire damage.

The entire Tempest concept is based around being a front line support character. However from a WvW perspective if you look at existing frontline characters (Warriors, Guardians) they are largely built around the “Leap” concept. The Leap concept is where they use lowish cool down leaps to get in and out of combat scenarios. For example when the enemy team drops a Well Bomb on your location, you use a combination of Stability, Condition management and Mobility skills to get in and out of those scenarios. Examples of this are Savage Leap, Earthshaker, and Leap of Faith all of which have 8-15 second cool downs (base). Tempest, and Elementalist in general, lacks these kinds of short duration leap style abilities to keep base and instead is forced to rely on long cool down abilities like our Cantrips (40s – 75s) or long mobility moves like Ride the Lightning (40s). This will always leave the frontline Elementalist dragging behind the main force, and if you are separated out you take the full brunt of an offensive (melee frontline are required to stay together to spread damage out to live) which is why D/D “bruiser” Elementalists fell out of favor in group combat. This is not even considering that most front liners also run roughly 3000 armor (buffed of course) or so meaning the stats the Elementalist will need for frontline will basically neuter it’s damage output entirely.

The buzz about the shouts, such as the AOE stun Break, is rediculous. There are plenty of existing options that already are AOE stun breaks. Anything that gives AOE stability breaks stun. The most common examples are “Stand your Ground” on a Guardian or Mantra of Concentration (Power Break).

Simply put: it’s an interesting concept, but it’s wholly unrealistic of current game play and has no place that isn’t already currently being done by the Elementalist in a better fashion. There’s any number of other routes they could have taken, but they didn’t go those routes. If they had given Warhorn more mobility, it would have made it more viable for an Elementalist frontliner for WvW. Overcharging adding a channeling mechanic and locking you out of needed mechanics is just wholly ignorant of existing game play scenarios and how it would fit in there.

What if they change it to: Automatically overload the attunement you are currently in (doesn’t put overload to cd and doesn’t incerase your current att cd)
I think that this will fit more and can be a lot more useful.

Avador.8934:

What if they change it to: Automatically overload the attunement you are currently in (doesn’t put overload to cd and doesn’t incerase your current att cd)
I think that this will fit more and can be a lot more useful.

Or something like eles have long been calling for (seen a lot of signet suggestions like this):

On use, refresh the cooldown of all your attunements.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

Avador.8934:

What if they change it to: Automatically overload the attunement you are currently in (doesn’t put overload to cd and doesn’t incerase your current att cd)
I think that this will fit more and can be a lot more useful.

Or something like eles have long been calling for (seen a lot of signet suggestions like this):

On use, refresh the cooldown of all your attunements.

That’s a nice idea for an elite signet.

On use, refresh the cooldown of all your attunements.

That’s even better

NO WAY!!!! This Elite is so awesome…. You can reduce the CD by 25%….. that’s 1/4th! for every 10 secs that’s 2.5 secs!

IT’S AWESOME CAUSE THAT 2.5 secs will make or break YOU!

(I will defend the tempest with my life…. Even though it sucks!)

OVERLOAD IS SO AWESOME! Let me explain why!

That’s why!

Hm…. Poor mesmers only get an off-hand wep. Well, always wanted to use sword on eles.

I main ele. I don’t see this elite as useless. Just situational, but that can be said for most elites.

Do I find it sort of mild? Yes

Will it require a modicum of communication within your team? Yes, but this is not a bad thing. Actually, we’ve been asking specifically for things that will incentivize us to work more as a team, instead of just spamming the auto attack.

Does this require voice coms? No. Even in my casual play, we ctrl+click timewarp and such before we use it (since we don’t use voice), so people in the group know it’s coming. Depending on the range of this elite, we should likely have enough time to pop it before the timewarp or a warbanner drops, and if we let the person using those skills know that we’re going to pop it, they can watch for the effect to pop up on their bar before they drop their skill.

She’s holding a dagger, not a sword. I believe that is the mistforged dagger that you can get from wvw.

Kodiak.3281:

The only game mode you can currently afford to sit in the same attunement as an Elementalist is PvE. The only attunement this is currently rewarded sufficiently in is in Fire because all other attunements offer lackluster DPS. So far, they haven’t announced any changes to any other DPS in other attunements. The few Horn mentioned Air abilities, Air being the primary DPS for Dagger/ are not large DPS adds but instead a CC move (pull) and a (piercing?) line DPS move. From a PvE stand point Tempest will only be relevant if it replaces the large % damage adds the class currently gets from Fire, Air and Water.

In PvP/WvW, being locked out of an attunement is a liability. As a front or backliner we or the groups we already support often rely on us to be able to do the abilities we have. Our entire class is designed around the concept that we can swap attunements and skills are balanced on that fact reinforcing this play style. The skills (so far) aren’t being rebalanced around that fact. For example there’s no stacking buff that increases skill damage or reduces cool downs the longer we are in an attunement (something that would actually make camping an attunement more viable). This means we’re still forced to put out the effects as needed. For example a Staff player might start in Air (Static Field) then use it’s water abilities such as Frozen Ground or Healing Rain, then swap to Fire to get some Meteors on but then need to swap back to Water for the Geyser refresh at the end. Locking a player out of these attunements is crippling as while the damage on Ice Spike is interesting (6-7k+) it’s certainly no stacked Fire damage.

The entire Tempest concept is based around being a front line support character. However from a WvW perspective if you look at existing frontline characters (Warriors, Guardians) they are largely built around the “Leap” concept. The Leap concept is where they use lowish cool down leaps to get in and out of combat scenarios. For example when the enemy team drops a Well Bomb on your location, you use a combination of Stability, Condition management and Mobility skills to get in and out of those scenarios. Examples of this are Savage Leap, Earthshaker, and Leap of Faith all of which have 8-15 second cool downs (base). Tempest, and Elementalist in general, lacks these kinds of short duration leap style abilities to keep base and instead is forced to rely on long cool down abilities like our Cantrips (40s – 75s) or long mobility moves like Ride the Lightning (40s). This will always leave the frontline Elementalist dragging behind the main force, and if you are separated out you take the full brunt of an offensive (melee frontline are required to stay together to spread damage out to live) which is why D/D “bruiser” Elementalists fell out of favor in group combat. This is not even considering that most front liners also run roughly 3000 armor (buffed of course) or so meaning the stats the Elementalist will need for frontline will basically neuter it’s damage output entirely.

The buzz about the shouts, such as the AOE stun Break, is rediculous. There are plenty of existing options that already are AOE stun breaks. Anything that gives AOE stability breaks stun. The most common examples are “Stand your Ground” on a Guardian or Mantra of Concentration (Power Break).

Simply put: it’s an interesting concept, but it’s wholly unrealistic of current game play and has no place that isn’t already currently being done by the Elementalist in a better fashion. There’s any number of other routes they could have taken, but they didn’t go those routes. If they had given Warhorn more mobility, it would have made it more viable for an Elementalist frontliner for WvW. Overcharging adding a channeling mechanic and locking you out of needed mechanics is just wholly ignorant of existing game play scenarios and how it would fit in there.

I want to bottle you and unleash you on the feckless idiots who roam these forums whenever they kitten me off. +1
ANet needs to stop designing this game around thematic conceptualization and recognize that the foundation of a successful skill, trait, or class is always going to be mechanics.

Having an elementalist channel so much elemental energy that it shrouds them in power is, quite frankly, amazing. Having it apply to their their already inapplicable frontline capabilities, however, is a waste. Having it lock the elementalist out of the crucial ability to attunement swap is just the nail in the coffin.

Even d/d elementalists (who LIVE in the fray) won’t touch this. Attunement swapping is just too integral to the class mechanics, it can’t be traded out. Overloading has zero synergy with how the elementalist class has to be played to be effective.

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

Avador.8934:

What if they change it to: Automatically overload the attunement you are currently in (doesn’t put overload to cd and doesn’t incerase your current att cd)
I think that this will fit more and can be a lot more useful.

Or something like eles have long been calling for (seen a lot of signet suggestions like this):

On use, refresh the cooldown of all your attunements.

I like the way you think : )

Argol Vazin.3061:

nearlight.3064:

Argol Vazin.3061:

Leo G.4501:

My perspective on what this spec brings to the players is effect for sacrifice, that sacrifice being holding off on swapping attunements to get a greater effect. Many players complained that the only viable way to play ele was attunement dancing, to the point that people will blindly say you are WRONG if you don’t dance your attunement rotation. Some people don’t like that spammy style and want a more calculated high-effect type of play. Currently you can’t really do that on ele, you need to swap and throw down your high cooldowns, not hold off and overcharge skills for greater effect. Basically, there is no advantage to holding off on certain skills and it’s all about what skills are off cooldown and which attunement they are in.

Staff, you are basically the master of AoE and you camp fire on Staff since you just have massive AoE DPS, add in ice bow/glyph of storms. arcane blast for fury and your good to go. not to mention with constant lava font there is no end to the might stacking.

Camp water for healing support…if healing actually meant anything.

Tempest offers nothing that staff alone already does, in fact the entire elite spec could be converted to a single elite skill that would be better for us as a whole.

Elemental fury (Formaly tornado form): Unleash the fury of the elements in spectacular ways based on your current attunment. Becomes stronger the longer you are in an attunment before using it.
As you can imagine. each of the overcharges whatever they’re called would be represented in this single elite skill

The way I see it the warhorn will bring staff like AoE damage and CC skills that will be useful to use with the sustained damage and PbAoE of an MH dagger, which we couldn’t do before. In pve anything works so whatever, but in pvp this could be a cool new combo since the staff builds had powerful support for pvp, but the dagger builds always outclassed it in damage and flexibility, especially in smaller fights.

So I agree with Leo G.

All this spec needs to be viable is anything that makes it better, or as good as blinding ashes and the fire can trip trait. So far we know that getting more mileage out of protection and the ability to use game changing abilities every once in a while seems like a fair tradeoff so far compared to the fire line in cele pvp builds.

I’m personally excited to see what traits it offers that don’t apply to the channels.

There is your mistake, you are looking at it purely PvP.
Purely PvP, the warhorn is not going to outclass D/F or D/D in fact using Tempest and the overcharges in PvP is the stupidest idea ever “hey guys. please don’t interrupt me while I do a thing”

and of course in PvP Staff is still a contender anyway so Warhorn would still be outclassed

Well D/D is better than staff right now in PvP, but once we know the warhorn skills it could be possible that D/WH outclasses staff and D/F at the very minimum, which is likely, and maybe outclass D/D.

With staff you get great CC but low damage unless your enemies stand in your AoEs (they won’t). MH dagger takes care of that problem while things like the warhorn air cyclone will still provide AoE CC, and it sounds like you get an fire andwater field that moves from you in water, where OH dagger and OH focus do not have a water field that can be blasted. It sounds like the earth skills will provide AoE blind with sand squall, which we can do with blinding ashes or glyph of storms, but not staff and D/D (sans trait or glyph) specifically.

At least eles have ways to cover their casts, such as with armor of earth and arcane shield, unlike something like a necromancer, and you ptobably won’t be overcharging more than once per minute anyway.

Guardians can also give you stability on a low cooldown.

I think it will be viable, but that will depend on how good the traits and skills are when we get specific information about them.

Uh.. I don’t know if this was mentioned but, you’re not rooted when overloading. In fact, you gain swiftness/protection. If staff ele can pull off meteor shower and dagger churning earth.. I’m not too worried about the occasional interrupt.

Hopefully they’ll reduce the cool down on overloading so it only locks you out for 10s or so.

Chaos Archangel.5071:

Uh.. I don’t know if this was mentioned but, you’re not rooted when overloading. In fact, you gain swiftness/protection. If staff ele can pull off meteor shower and dagger churning earth.. I’m not too worried about the occasional interrupt.

Hopefully they’ll reduce the cool down on overloading so it only locks you out for 10s or so.

that would defeat the purpose since attune cooldowns are that long anyways.

Chaos Archangel.5071:

Uh.. I don’t know if this was mentioned but, you’re not rooted when overloading. In fact, you gain swiftness/protection. If staff ele can pull off meteor shower and dagger churning earth.. I’m not too worried about the occasional interrupt.

Hopefully they’ll reduce the cool down on overloading so it only locks you out for 10s or so.

Thank you for bringing the multiclass voice of reason to these forums. And yeah traits should reduce the lock out time. We know 15 down from 20 from a tempest trait, and maybe arcane traits can reduced that further to 12 or so, but even then eles have actual skills that can cover their casts unlike say a necromancer or a mesmer that doesn’t take stab mantrs, stab trait, or signet trait (most don’t).

I like the idea that was mentioned about potentially using fresh air with overloading. I really hope they let us do that

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I main ele. I don’t see this elite as useless. Just situational, but that can be said for most elites.

Do I find it sort of mild? Yes

Will it require a modicum of communication within your team? Yes, but this is not a bad thing. Actually, we’ve been asking specifically for things that will incentivize us to work more as a team, instead of just spamming the auto attack.

Does this require voice coms? No. Even in my casual play, we ctrl+click timewarp and such before we use it (since we don’t use voice), so people in the group know it’s coming. Depending on the range of this elite, we should likely have enough time to pop it before the timewarp or a warbanner drops, and if we let the person using those skills know that we’re going to pop it, they can watch for the effect to pop up on their bar before they drop their skill.

So, eles will get an elite skill to be used to augment Warbanner and Time Warp… yay for the possibilities!

Azel.4786:

Valento.9852:

“Elite specializations keep the base profession core skills and traits in addition to the new ones provided by that elite specialization, while offering new profession mechanics or changing existing ones.”

Source: wiki

First, your quote is wrong (I remember when I first wrote that quoting from an early interview, and I stand correct to this moment). Second, you can’t change the attunements! They are the core of this profession and will always exist! Elite specs will work on top of attunements, and this is expected.

So, please, avoid quoting false information and understand the underlying approach for elite specs.

:)

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Guild_Wars_2:_Heart_of_Thorns#Elite_specializations

Next time read the material on the wiki too before accusing of false quotes.

And to the guy above, no your idea certainly involved a lot of consumption of heavy stuff… but I guess that is what you need if you think that Elementalist can not group buff and group heal today, always needing to watch their positioning so the effects they get from swapping attunement, making and blasting fields, etc produce the most tide turning effect in battle.

I mean, it is not like elementalists today:

have a trait that let’s you give AoE boons on a very short cooldown; or
are able to heal 2 times for a sizeable amount and cure up to 3 conditions of himself and allies by simply dodge rolling while swapping to water (or 3 times and 4 conditions if they also use Dagger OH 5); or
share their auras (which they have good access to); or
provide up to 9 AoE might stacks by using a standard might generation rotation just once, which depends on a positioning to get the best effect.

They definitely did not have any of that in melee / close range so the new elite spec comes to fill in this HUGE void in group support that the elementalist had.

The wiki can be edited by anyone, and I don’t police everything (nor do I have to), but that text doesn’t have sources so it’s not as accurate as the specialization article itself. Your quote, therefore, stands inaccurate.

Plus, overloading attunements DO change the way eles play.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

She’s holding a dagger, not a sword. I believe that is the mistforged dagger that you can get from wvw.

On closer look yea seems so. The outfit she’s wearing looks almost apart of the wep.

Its times like these that being a semi-Necro main that also mains mesmer and ele pay off. And who knew that having a norn ele with wolfy cultural armor would pay off in the long run either?

So that this is an actual discussion, what warhorn skin are you going to rock on your tempest, if you choose to use one?

Edit: Merged into this megathread… oh well

stop moving all the posts to this forum. We all know the devs won’t read all this kittena.

Ark Bladesteele.2943:

Conncept.7638:

And here folks is a prime example of inverse ignorance, a malady commonly found on the internet, wherein a person can know more about something because they know nothing about it, because, obviously, if you don’t even know the breadth or depth of the subject, let alone the actual content, it must be small, simple, and easy, right? Like arguing a subject they know so little about they don’t even know what the word mechanic means in context of the argument.

Did you not read the interview? The introduction of overcharging is an entirely new mechanic. It does not exist in the game as of right now. You are acting like a child.

Have you ever read a single word on game design? Clearly not.

This is not a new mechanic, it is a group of abilities, with a big cooldown, on top of a new button, with a new name. We have a group of abilities on a single button, in two different ways, by stacking attuning procs, and in glyphs; so that’s not a new mechanic. We also have abilities with very large cooldowns, for very big affects, they’re called elites, and everyone else has them. Not a mechanic period, so certainly not a new one. And we also have have attunements already, and their cooldowns can be modified. So again, not a new mechanic.

Recharges, cast times, pre and after cast, interrupts, control, stability and stunbreakers, the break bar, quickness and slow and recharge resets, cast time modification, damage over time, damage on proc, direct damage, healing reduction, damage reduction, defense reduction, movement reduction, damage over time removal, proc removal, effect removal, damage amp, defense amp, amp removal, evasion, endurance, invulnerability, block, line of sight, targeting, targeting interception, obstruction, reflect, critical, melee and ranged, projectile or not, AoE, multitarget, single target, pets, pet management, pet command, pet sacrifice, transformation, passive or active, passive then active, toggling, charging, health, death shroud, resource gain, resource management.

The list goes on and on and THESE are examples of mechanics. They don’t ‘just do something’ that the class hasn’t done before, they provide the game with something it wouldn’t otherwise have.

You don’t know the bloody difference between a mechanic and an ability, and I don’t have a second more to waste on a childish know-it-all.

To every one else, the fact remains that this isn’t a new mechanic, we already have abilities tied to our attunements in any choice of traits. Even every single ability which modifies ability recharge and cast times treats our attunement like abilities, for good and ill. The presence of a new button and a new name does not a new mechanic make.

However, to those lambasting ANety for this, ANet did not ever state that new mechanics would be given with every single specialization, that would be insane. They stated they would bring a new or expanded upon playstyle with each specializations. The question just remains, until we get more info, of whether the tempest successfully accomplishes either.

Chaos Archangel.5071:

Uh.. I don’t know if this was mentioned but, you’re not rooted when overloading. In fact, you gain swiftness/protection. If staff ele can pull off meteor shower and dagger churning earth.. I’m not too worried about the occasional interrupt.

Hopefully they’ll reduce the cool down on overloading so it only locks you out for 10s or so.

Yes, you are not rooted but you don’t need to be in range to interrupt skills.

MiniEquine.6014:

Astralporing.1957:

soakman.7539:

Horns have a history of magical properties in a lot of mythology, for instance Gabriel’s Horn, the horns that brought down the walls of Jericho, and last (but not least) STORMCALLER! The horn Rurik used to turn back the Charr assault of Acalon!

Seriously, again, bringing up Stormcaller in a discussion about warhorns is about on the same level of relevance as mentioning Skyhammer when talking about pistols.

From the wiki:

_Stormcaller is the great horn that can conjure up rain and water upon the lands. _

It’s not much of a stretch, to be honest. The only thing I could grant you, and very reasonably so, is that Stormcaller is tied pretty strictly to the Human kingdom of Ascalon from GW1. Perhaps it would have been more lore-worthy to have Guardians get the Warhorn rather than Elementalists, but, eh.

I guess my point is, it’s not completely irrelevant; horns in the lore have been able to bring storms and Elementalists are well known for their elemental magic.

As i said, the Stormcaller is to the normal warhorn the same as a skyhammer is to a pistol. It is not a warhorn. It is a massive, defensive, stationary siege weapon in the shape of a horn. You are, in a way, claiming that it is okay for pistols to cause massive orbital strikes because Skyhammer does, or your teacup to burn cities because cauldron of cataclysm did. After all, both a pistol and a Skyhammer are guns and both the cup and the cauldron are liquid containers, so they are the same.
Except they aren’t.

(Edit: nice merge, the post i was answering to is lost somewhere in the middle now)

I don’t get all the warhorn hate. It’s the best thing about this disappointing elite spec.

Giving you access to water and lightning fields outside of staff is already enough to warrant using – or at least thoroughly trying – it. All the skills they’ve previewed seem useful at least, if not particularly new or exciting.

The shouts and class mechanic on the other hand seem really lacking – especially in pvp/wvw but also in pve.

Chaos Archangel.5071:

Was I the only one hype for this when I read the article?

First thing that came to mind when I read the article was “staff ele meteor shower fire tornado tornado elite bahahahaha!” (Uh we’re still doing the dramatics thing.. Right?)

I don’t know if I’m in the minority, but I saw an interesting, cool spec. You have a choice to look at the ways it could be bad or list what the other specs can do better, or start figuring out new ideas and ways to make an effective build that you’ll love.

My fav weapon is the focus so I’m planning on trying to make it a decent monster and be all “I’m overloading my kitten and you can’t do squat about it! BOOM!”

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

I don’t get all the warhorn hate. It’s the best thing about this disappointing elite spec.

Giving you access to water and lightning fields outside of staff is already enough to warrant using – or at least thoroughly trying – it. All the skills they’ve previewed seem useful at least, if not particularly new or exciting.

The shouts and class mechanic on the other hand seem really lacking – especially in pvp/wvw but also in pve.

In exchange for blasts you’ll get fields. Which means you will be much more reliant on your team.