Guild Wars 2

Better a nerfed thief than an annoying one, was about time they did something about the backstabbing crybabies that got all the boosts, buffs and extras ingame whilst evry one else was nerfed.

Now atleast i can one-shot them with my ranger Yipiieeeee!!!! :-)

you know explore it first , test it out and then complain, its not been out for a day yet.

Btw the sensible idea would be to go and add a real map-rotation for all borderlands , that way not all the maps would be desert not all would be alpine and add the good stuff they’ve done now. it would remove the daily and weekly drag of having to do the same over and over.

I think this is a good start on a lasting solution for wvw!

The only thing i’m not agreeing on is allowing EOTM to access the reward tracks, in the end it will be quicker and easier just to go there, instead of playing the game like it should be played on the borderlands.

no thanks going EBG now:-)

I think the real problem started when EOTM. overshot its purpose and became instead of a waiting area the main rank-farm area.

Its quicker more easy, less fights, less enemies and like Stihl said there is less loyalty you are not affiliated with one server.

Yesterday there was a big row going on the GW2 forum on the post about the overhaul of WvW.

It seems some of the ppl, on the forum didn’t like the idea of an open discussion building up around the idea what WvW really needs to be stable in the future and what it will require to keep is as a part of the game alive.
Seeing it was easier to remove my entries instead of reacting to them i will re-edit my thoughts.

I’ve added this all into a single post referring to WvW and i would like reactions to the suggestions and the basic idea behind the post. Thank you for reacting in advance!

Hence this post:

If it hurts feeling so be it I would rather throw a brick trough the window to shatter an illusion then let players dream up a form of utopia that doesn’t work. Utopia’s never work!

My thanks go out to the players that got anxiety whilst reading my posts and the forum moderator they employed removing not only my ideas for an overhaul but those of my fellow Guildies, if you cannot take criticism and want things to go your way just remove it, thank you for allowing me to have this forum!

cc of this post will go to several key-members of Arena-net trough face-book!
(maybe the zealous forum-admin can explain removing valid posts to them)

My position is the following:

A) Comparing WvW to the other game formats does not work, whereas PvP and PvE allow for random players to join WvW needs dedicated and loyal players that play on a daily basis else WvW as a system comes to a standstill.

B) In order to make important changes to WvW, you need the broad support of your WvW gaming-community, not just the designers and the players here helping them out changing the game are required for this.

Although you guys do an important job, and keep the game running where for my thank and gratitude, the future of an entire portion of Guild Wars 2 is too important to let you guys just decide about it.

Reasons why:

1) Alot of the players the developers depend on are from the fighting guilds the vision of these players is clouded, generalizing and judgemental, their main interest is making fights more interesting.

2) WvW is supposed to be the combination of a) a strategy game and b) a battlefield game, which allows the maximum of different fighting styles to be applies to it.

-In order to achieve this you need to capture, defend and add upgrades to your camps, towers and keeps this requires support from scouts, escorters builders, players and guilds that provide upgrades.

things working against this:

1) The guilds many of the complainers and helpers represent only are interested in fighting, they do not care about PPT which allows the they represent server to win.

2) These guilds have a vested interest in acquiring more fighting players, whereas all other segments of the game: scouting, ambush-tactics, sieging, defending, capping, roaming, capture, holding and building up objectives have secondry to none importance, which would at best be minimized or totally removed,
destroying World Versus World that we know and love in the process.

3) The posts reflecting to:

a) bringing back the old maps;
b) bringing back stability and overpowered skillz;
c) getting rid of the mechanics of the HOT system and finally
d) the overhaul of the WvW

Many of these posts and reactions are colored, generalizing, one sided and just follow the perspective of players wanting to turn back the game to the point before they left guild Wars 2.

Some of them havn’t even played the game and went of to do other stuff when HOT and the Desert Borderlands were released, they didn’t even bother exploring and fighting on it and just follow hearsay.

Can you really depend on these players to leave a lasting legacy for WvW, they leave on a whim when the game does not suit them anymore, how long wil this last 2 months to half a year for them to remain?
Are these players more important then the rest of your players that play the game on a daily basis? Now it looks like you are following the ideas of a couple of hundred players
versus the rest of your entire WvW-gaming community.

Can you or anyone at Arena-net tell me where the BALANCE you wish for is in this?

Evry interested WvW player deserves to have his voice heared, not just the few players that help out on the forum that tell about other WvW-players that their voice doesn’t count often arguementing that these players are ignorants!
Because its the voice of a happy careless player? a happy concerned player? a new player to WvW without real knowledge? players that don’t react on the forum?

We all deserve an advocate someone or multiple players that defend our causes and want to be the voice of players that are not heared or players that do not bother using this forum to voice their concerns?

Hence my reaction trough this post no doubt some of you will totally disagree but that is your right as it is mine to react and to voice my concerns and those of the WvW players inside Angel Hearts Clan.

The ideas and toughts of Angel Hearts Clan about what is needed for WvW:

My guildies and myself sat together (12 + players) and we discussed what we are seeing in WvW and what we think it misses, these were our answers:

2) Working towards a permanent solution

I have a solution though why does arena-net not do a POLL THROUGH THE ON-JOIN SCREEN LINKING IT WITH THIS FORUM with multiple selection options
reflecting all the posts that were created surrounding WvW, it would cover all the bases and you would have correct information about what the majority
of your WvW players want for the future of the game, you only need to add an option for players to react if they want to add some more thoughts.

At least it would be honest and give you a real idea about what is living inside WvW or do the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many?

This is just plain basic realistic logic free from all forms of powerplay, generalisation and it is neutral whereas the discussion on the Gw2 forums are not?

On top it would set a path to a real stable future for WvW which would be supported by the majority of the players playing WvW

Just to show players that we do actually care about all the aspects of the game and are free from outside influences, someone actually challenged me to produce a workable poll yesterday, well i took up your glove and accepted your challenge.
We did it with one little difference to your way of trying to change things in WvW though, we did it with respect not only for your opinion and players that have the same concerns as you have,
but added all possible options making it fair towards the entire WvW-gaming community. Seeing i had nothing to do well i could spend the time productively there’s nothing wrong with doing brain-execises isn’t there?
Just took me a couple of hours to come up with this draft.

its actually nice to see the ppl on the forum speaking plain language and using real arguments instead of falling back on sentiment.

I firmly believe that all players in WvW can be happy players if all of us want to keep the same end-goal in mind, making the WvW better and more acceptable for all players!

Not just for a single limited group by itself, we have a bigger chance of getting real change and improvement if we set our differences aside and start looking where we can work together, the larger and more extensive the coherence and the better the common argument is the more likely Arena-net will listen.

If we give in to sentiment it will not work cause that is a division line amongst players, on top getting 100% either way (Desert vs Alpine and vice versa) will not solve anything cause you end up chasing other valuable players out of wvw, thats just short term thinking.

Not here to start a fuss:-)

Why don’t you think more down the lines of:

1) 3 different borderland maps each week

-a) they rotate so you don’t have the same evrywhere
-b) 4 weeks is 4 rotations a months, you would not have the same map on your homeborder each week?
-c) maps would be:

Point Per Tick mechanics:

- Alpine (basic mechanics best of old and new Hot)
- Desert (reworked as it is now)
- EBG (reworked to serve as borderland map with best of old and new Hot)
-EOTM map (get rid of EOTM we need real players on the maps that are loyal to servers and guild, reworked with best of old and new HOT)

Point Per kill mechanics:

- a Brand new center map with Point per kill system towards server, that also can be used for GvG league and a 3 way meta event, with lots of open places for fights under different conditions. If you are afraid of fighting under conditions well then you are bad at the game in real warfare you get to choose the battlefield as well but not the war-conditions or environment.

Now it might be much to think about, but in the long run this might be the best solution for all, its just an idea, but the more players support the middle road the more likely Arena-net will listen to you.

BTW nice going on the QQ i thought for a long time that the whining was one-directional on this forum lol.

EOTm was a waiting area to get into WvW.

The idea was always to get the players on the WvW maps so they can play WvW.

Some players didn’t like the fact they were having to follow commanders, they didn’t like using ts, they didn’t like fighting for one server, they didn’t like being in guilds, some thought WvW wasn’t rewarding enough for ranks.

They turned to EOTM and gave it another focus as Rankfarm area, thats when the population on the borderlands and in EBG on the different servers started going down.

Well WvW has been reworked, it allows you do the things you did in EOTM without any stress. So come back to WvW.

In my humble opinion there is no need for reward-tracks in EOTM they should never be applied and EOTM should disappear as an instance its just taking up space and keeping players away from where they should be on the WvW borderlands.

Maybe the EoTM map can be reworked and offered into a working Borderland map for a map-rotation for the borderlands.

The discussion about Actual WvW and not real WvW is bullkitten. its an excuse.

There has always been just 1 WvW and not multiple ersions and Edge of the mist was part of that as a waiting area, never meant to be permanently used. Seeing it has no use anymore remove it.

@ Puck

You know, its written all over all your msg’s, evrywhere!

3 things:

1 bring Alpine Borderlands back
2 remove all added game mechanics
3 Turn back the clock

Your msg is getting tiresome!

@Sviel

You are right for obvious reasons

The Desert borderlands have increased the efficiency and the operating possibilities for the small offensive and defensive innitiative.

1) some keep-mechanics allow hiding, not being spotted allows for ambushes
2) the map is bigger, there are more ways to travel around the map
3) there are more choke-points allowing to bring your enemies to a standstill
4)small offensive initiative can work around a map carefully without being detected from the keep to the camps in the south.
5) it takes a bit longer to get from one point to another but atleast it relieves the keeps towers and camps from annoying players that keep tagging them they get bored quicker.(Puck?)
6) if you are smart you dissapear from the enemies sight forcing him to place scouts at all key locations.

Btw your test were done from the right perspective, Puck is wrong.

This does it for me.

I have gathered and bought 1000 chests.

i just opened them result:

no ticket
no wings nothing

I’ve bought and gathered between 1000-2000 chests now.

so far stacks of fire works 16-20 knights but nothing serious.

Is the droprate on the tickets and mini’s turned of on my account?

Cause this is no way to treat ppl that try to get the rewards from the game it totally turns me of from playing gw 2.

sorry after 5 minites of Alpine i had to VOMIT its exactly the same as 2 years back, except for new keep camp and tower mobs.

So i’ll stick to EBG.

As for being the majority that was done by 186 votes against 10,000 of happy careless WvW players who are you kidding here, you will have to do better don’t forget gw< 2 forum thats the place ppl go to to complain….

I have to say i find both your reactions awesome, you are ofcourse right.

WvW as opposit to PVP and PVE needs continuity players who offer up their valuable time to come each day to do WvW, those are the most loyal players Arenanet has, because for the last 3 years they were always there to play the game.

Reward tracks should be correctly implimented for players that actively participate in WvW on the borderlands, like Zynt mentioned.

What lil devils also holds truth alot of the issues players have with WvW would be resolved if Arena-net would be nice to us and grant ius bether rewards and loot for actively being present and participating and contributing in fighting and building up the borderlands. Thank you guys for your reactions keep em comming! :-)

i agree with Luna,

Personally i love WVW, but the matchups atm. are simply said counterproductif to the entire idea of WVW.

We want to play against other worlds not just fight a slugginmatch in the trenches with the top 3.

Whats the use of having a competition if you cannot play a nyone else? Besides the 3 same worlds.

This is an arrangement that will make players quit WVW.

@MomentOfWeakness

A couple of remarks:-)

1) To be honest after all the whining 186 players did on this forum to get Alpine back on a total WvW-population of how many thousands of players?

(where is the poll?)

2) Alpine borderlands will be brought back for the time Arena-net is trying to sort out technology for actual map-rotation with multiple maps.

Map rotation will come!

3) The Alpine maps will be back with the new mechanics and reward-system, wow. the will not roll back two years, they will not remove the specs, the map will be adapted? What did you win nothing, you guys were just able to act like mules instead of looking for a real solution for the WvW problems.

- revamped Desert – all players happy
-reward tracks – all players happy
-specific wvw armor weapons – all players happy
-reworked reward system – all players happy
- participation as part of wvw experience chain a stroke of genious on the part of Arena-net thank you so much – all players happy

You guys were to busy making Arena-net roll back all, and didn’t wish to compromise on anything. the best way to go forward is to find a middle-road for all players that is acceptable, not enforcing one idea and pushing other players out of WvW cause they have a different opinion.

Do you really think that worked out? in my opinion the entire community wins in this patch but you guys loose big time sorry.

4) More and more players like the new mechanics on the reworked Desert borderlands, no new players on the forum wish to delete it or permanently remove it, they are actually asking when their opinion about the borderlands was asked.

- progress not regress, best of the old combined with best of the new and players like it.

5) none of you asked for the reward tracks, the players that were more open minded asked for it whilst the players demanding the alpine roll back verbally opposed it.

- none of you even thought about making the game appealing or rewarding to bring players back. your focus was just Alpine an old borderlands map that players had gotten so fed up with that they left before HOT cam out.

6) you still use the term ‘Actual WvW’ to make a distinction between WvW and edge of the mist.

- there is just one WvW and all should play it, remove EOTM get the players back on the borderlands.

7) Who are the players which opinion is valid and whose is not?

- some of you said other players opinions didn’t count because they were noobs, they didn’t know enough about WvW, they were below some players, that is discrimination.

And yes I’m very happy cause 75 % of the suggestions I and some other players made and we were not many maybe 10 players versus 186, were accepted and set into the game.

On top we know that Arena-net is working on the last 25% which is the map-rotation, so we are very happy.

I"m also very happy to see more and more players getting back to being involved into the game and its future when i look at the posts since the quarterly update it is amazing:-)

My message to those guys YOU ROCK!!! Keep it going :-)

Always look for the middle-road! it leads forward!

Hi guys,

Its not my place to vent my desillusion at things the way they are.

I really like the event and evrything surrounding it, the holograms are neat, dragon ball is fun, the pinatas with dragon motif are original and there’s alot of stuff dropping.

That being said.

The chests are a dissappointment.

I only wanted to get one ticket to have a nice longbow skin for my WvW ranger.

So i went out the first day the chests were released and gathered them like mad i think i got between 200-400 chests.
The result of opening them was meager: 7 holographic knights heaps of z., a couple of candy no ticket.
After that i sold most of the things i owned raising between 20-35 gold and bought chests.
The result of opening them was again meager: 7 holographic knights heaps of z., a couple of candy no ticket. The money i made from the knights was again pumped into the game. Result nothing.

I see some ppl in Lions arch spamming multiple dragon items and tickets, the funny part is its all personalised so i don’t understand the ppl discussing the rarity of the items the value is nill since you can’t trade the items?.

I’m not a big time farmer or spender like some of you obviously are. What am i doing wrong? I just would have liked to have one ticket.

Sad bunneh

That is actually not my main concern atm.
In my opinion we should be looking for a lasting solution which offers all of us a sense of belonging or being part of WvW.

In that sense i don’t have a problem with the old maps returning, but i don’t believe in devolution being the solution. Returning to the old will not solve the problem we need to look ahead and make the game better together.
I believe firmly that instead of making the new and the old mutually exclusive, we should add the maps together, add some more maps, make a working rotation so players do not get bored with what they are playing in WvW.

I also believe that WvW is more than just fights focussed around blobs and zergs, we have roamers, defenders, scouts, escorters, ambushers, taggers, small offensive initiative (havoc) and maybe even more forms of playing.
Maybe the solution is not only to make the maps what evryone would like them to be, maybe part of the solution is too make the maps more specific allowing a certain kind of fight to be more apparent.

Like introducing an open field map just with multiple locations under different conditions to fight in, or a meta-event spread over several fighting instances which reflect the diverse nature of WvW but which would reflect the fight and have as a real endgame a battlefield victory for a server. This map could also be used for GvG, leagues and competitions aswell.

Do we therefore need to remove things we have, i think that would make WvW even less viable, maybe we should ask ourselves wetter WvW still has a future or as many on the forum have stated is dead, a part of the past.
But all of this stand and falls with the patience and the will of the players to participate actively in WvW.

A good start would be to look at the positive points and to work away the negative points on all the maps and come with suggestions offering opportunities.
Concerning maps there will always be big and small maps, maps with choke-points, maps without, maps with conditions and maps without. Look at how you can improove them to make them playable for all.

You will always have maps that allow either for more PPK or PPT and rankfarm, the answer is to find the balance.

As for automatic upgrades rendering escorting and scouting useless, that is in my opinion a hoax, yes players focus more on escorting dollies they don’t need to stay with the camps as they upgrade, but most do because you need to keep an eye on your enemy if he’s close.

The automatic upgrades are handy to have for defenders if guilds provide them, my guild does, don’t hear any defenders complaining about that and they do allow you to do multiple things whilst your objective is upgrading making you available to do other things.

And yes WvW is way to expensive nowadays and yes it needs to be affordable cause its ruining my wallet , which is not fair, and the upgrades need to go way quicker!!

And Jade Sea is still building Superior arrowcart’s evry 5quare mm of a map wetter it be a tower keep or just a camp, same goes for putting 10 rams or cata’s down in 1 square meter,,, Bringing Alpine back or playing on Desert will never change that!!!!

So many good things in the old and new why do we really have to loose any of it?
sigh

@lil Devils

I agree with you on alot of points, but rolling the game back to pre HOT WvW will not save WvW.

The loyal WvW players are few and alot of the returning players will just stay until they have their belly full and leave again like happened when the Alpine borderlands were still up, when it still was the old system before HOT was released.

Another point is the loyalty to a single server many players have multiple accounts hovering one week on one the next on another server, alot of the players that should be playing WvW are PVE rank-farming in EOTM, not because they are loyal players but because it just is much quicker to do without having the stress of having to play with a guild or for a server. They are careless.

In a sense the arguement of bringing Alpine back is just a cover-up.

How many players really play WvW still atm. how many players still play GW2 atm.? Why the mega-server system?

Looking for positive answers and solutions that do not mutually exclude the other is my answer, contacting as many players as possible from the WvW-gaming community for their help and participation in this process should be the way.

Atm i play with groups from my guild between 3-15 members, some are core-players not all, but they do have the sense to play with the guild as they consider themselves to be part of it. We do all WvW, PvP, PVE together and all use TS.

Don’t i encounter enemies on the desert borderlands, i do, cannot deny the truth,
Do i like the old and the new mechanics, my guildies like em both and we all play WvW not for the PPT or PPK its really not about getting points its about spending quality game-time together and getting the feeling we are doing something usefull.

We help zergs, blobs, individual roamers, small guilds, big guilds, we’re building up stuff (if other players afterwards take care of it!) defending, capping, ambushing and small offensive initiative which we like the most, because it makes zergs and blobs have to split up to come deal with us and gives our zergs and blobs more time to organise themselves.

Take that away WvW will loose its purpose, atraction and sense, opening up another gap in the borderlands when we leave WvW.