I do not want the sound of quip changed, this would be the 2nd time anet has screwed me over as i originally had gotten 2 quips trying to be unique before the wardrobe changed and was told i couldnt be refunded. Part of the whole reason i got quip was for the sound and confetti effects do not change the quip sound.
I feel your pain op, running p/p as a condi set now is worthless in wvw as any half decent player will cleanse or laugh at you now. whoever thought that confusion on heal was good wasn’t thinking. Its a “heal” skill not a attack skill. What should have happened is they reduced the 5 stacks on interrupt to 3 every 15 secs or leave it at 5 stacks of confusion per 25-30secs. Another gripe i have is how mesmer can still put out an absurd amount of confusion as well as other condi but now we cap out at 11stacks of confusion if we are lucky. “Headshot” should apply one stack of confusion for 3-5secs on hit not interrupt to make p/p condi builds viable. Wvw will now be filled with evade spam/ trapper thief because a build that relied on interrupts that took skill to land on decent players is gutted.
can we please get an official anet response to this? even if is “we know it needs a fix, and we will definitely be working on it, yet don’t have an official time-frame as of now”
You need to remove stealth gained via blackpowder and heartseeker.
1) Basilisk Venom Steal/cloak and dagger for stealth = dmge up to 7k
2) Backstab = damage up to 9k
3) Dodge/evade till reveal is over.
4) Attempt to Stealth with either cloak and dagger or
5) blackpowder/heartseeker for stealth/healing/condi clear.
I don’t mind the steps 1,2,3,4. I do not do much damage per hit, but I can still win even if I get hit for that initial 16k damage. Other classes can win even after the insane burst.
It is the blackpowder/heartseeker that is an issue. We see it all the time. Problem is, in the forums, no-one has specifically pointed out where the issue of thief stealth lies.
Fact
All the thieves who use this are running remove conditions on stealth and regen in stealth.
Fact
They use this skill to remove all condition damage and heal up to 100% while their opponent is sitting visible the entire time with no ability to heal more then a modest amount.
Fact
The balance is way off. I refuse to play this way just to win a fight.
It makes sense to not allow people the ability to nearly God Mode an aspect of the game.
1) I can’t kill diamond skin ele’s. I’m ok with that.
2) Some of the mesmers stealth so much I can’t kill them either. I’m ok with that.
3) A thief with good morals hits me for 16k (steps 1-3) total and I’m ok with that too.
I’m not ok with a god mode thief build. It ruins the game play and enjoyment of far more people then the number of idiots who use it.
If you remove the blackpowder/heartseeker stealth you will see far far less people complaining about thief stealth in the forums. The only people who will complain will be those who abuse the god mode just because they are bottom dwellers who feed off of ruining other people’s game play.
They will never kill me, but I am writing this post for those who can never escape a fight with a build that should never exist. As it stands, with issues like this, I have no inclination to buy your expansion.
I would honestly like to hear a suggestion for correcting this issue. I theif main, and have since inception. I can tell you that without stealth condi-removal, thieves are extremely limited in options for removal. Signet of agility is the only other viable condi-removal. Shadowstep has a crazy long cooldown so cannot be used reliably in an extended engagement. There are a few heals, yes that will remove select condis, but nothing else that removes them quickly as is needed in WvW. The nerf bat has been swung at thieves quite a bit since launch, not undeservingly in some cases, however currently I see more issues with thieves than OPness.
Our burst damage is not really the threat anymore, condition builds, P/D, S/D, with SB backup are among the most viable builds out there right now. Thief damage is mitigated by our awesome lack of armor and defense. It has been said time and time again, stealth, mobility, and regen are our defenses. Just my two cents.
TLDR: Thieves don’t need another smack with the nerf bat, our limited condi-removal nearly pigeon holes us into using Shadow’s Embrace for removal. If you want to talk about condi-removal that needs a nerf, look at the guardian.
On the topc of condi removal, how about we talk about a nerf to diamond skin ele. No build should be a 100% counter to any build.
As soon as Anet nerfs mesmer stealth duration along with the ability to stay in stealth and create phantasms then maybe you can ask for a thief nerf, till then only thing that needs a serious nerf is mesmer.
…can we get some?
- Mesmers out-stealthing us with little to no reveal.
Reveal works the same for Mesmers, and anyway if both Thief and Mesmer trait for maximum stealth, the Thief can still get a lot more (and do it more often). I don’t see the problem with this, if they want to trait for lots of stealth why should they have less stealth than a non-traited Thief?
Yeah trait for 20% deception skill recovery and then you will not be able to take shadows embrace for condi removal…
@NinjaEd of course no one wants to just spam a skill for no reason its all situational. If someone is chaining unloads its because he wants to kill someone. If hes using body shot its to prevent escape from people running away from fights or trying to get into tower. No one should just be spamming bodyshot in a 1v1 for no reason. As for lack of deffense on p/p we do have blinding powder, and if you take the right utilty skills you will have good deffence. Your also not limited to just 1 weapon set. You could easily take p/p d/p and make up for the lack of stealth, or take shortbow and use it for the evades. The only thing p/p has bit of a tougher time with now is mesmer because of clones, and even then like i said your not limited to just p/p. Use another weapon set in junction with p/p and you can adjust to the situation. A good example is thiefs making videos claiming to be s/d users but in footage of them they are usually using shortbow alot. Now about ricochet. I was a die hard fan. One thing i would like to see if its not coming back is the range of pistol from 900 to 1050 made baseline that would be nice.
Im just gonna go ahead and say P/P is perfectly fine, to all the people complaining do you guys even WvW? Sure they removed ricochet, and yes i would like to see its return but I have run both dire and zerk for wvw and the damage output on both is amazing. Stop crying. Also to anyone saying they dont use bodyshot i guess you never had a roaming partner or a friend to roam with. You can use that skill a few times mean while have a zerker burst them down. Its great utility.
@ mike, im also going through the same thing, played game since launch fine and now since downloading the june 23 patch the game has been pretty much unplayable. Im also in PA.
This will most likely be my last post, i pulled this from reddit. “Keep in mind I didn’t include my losses (for obvious reasons), and even good players mess up eventually.” Sure i can agree with that but what i made out is your trying to say dire perplex is op so the fact you lost some duels means you choose not to put (skilled, or good) people in your video. Instead you gave these guys a heads up and they still lost, so i have to make the assumption they arent the best or you asked them for the sake of the video for you to just flat out loose to you. The mesmer shoulda have moaed, eles should have brought Diamond Skin.
So your using bleeds and confusion with no weapons, just utility for your bleeds.
anyone one of your oppenents should have spammed laugh because if they stay out of your trap/ caltrops confusion wouldnt do any damage at all.
win an outnumbered fight against people with real skill and post a video, also upload a video of you fighting an ele thats immune to condi above the certain threshold and tell me condi is “OP” that i would like to see…
Ive never been one of the people who complain about last ref or hard to catch. sorta stinks they are changing hard to catch but seriously who are these noodles you are beating on with out weapons?? I just feel bad for those guys they really need to learn how to play. Anyone who knows what condi cleanse is shouldnt be loosing to a guy without a weapon.
well im pretty sure there is also a trait for dodging ranged attacks now, keep running? i gave an example of the shadow arts trait but since you had to mention condi, what condi skill tracks in stealth other then thief pistol sneak attack? And for me being hit with a sneak attack is no where near as deadly as rapidfire, plus if your smart you will have condi cleanse in stealth.
i understand your pain for the rapidfire in stealth but looking at what traits we get in shadowarts now you get the -50% damage reduction in stealth so while i agree the heatseeking is bs at least we get the trait.
Yes that was just said. i wanna har everyones comment on this regardless if they agree of not. Bring on the hate. Also if you ran 6-6-x-x-x you could use panic strike or residule venom and CnD backstab me becasue im not using a stunbreaker. That is why i said zerker counters it. Spam shortbow clusterbomb it wrecks people regardless if they have armor or not.
All in all its just a game and if i offended you im sorry but next time you try and gank me while i have 25 stacks and both guard stacks you might wanna at least have yours too. As for me runnign initially i didnt have my smokescreen on or i would have fought ya so i broke away to change my 25% run speed signet. I did let ya live after the fight because you did bow and after that i went north to find my ranger friend fighting a 1v4 so all is fair in wvw.
I gotta say its funny that you whine about being beat by perplex thief that caps at 13 stacks of confusion while engi maintain 17-20 stacks easy. I though thief was supposed to be high burst regardless of zerk or condi. With that said my proposed thief change is to apply 1 stack of confusion on hit from headshot. With 3 into trickery allowing 4 headshots in a row if spammed will push the cap for thief up to 17. it will also correct the lack of condi from p/p with out perpelx runes. short bow has poison field and bleeds from cluseter blomb. p/d has torment and bleeds as well as cloak and dagger sneak attack. Both weapons have 2 forumns of condi damage while p/p sits with just bleeds unless using perplex runes. With engis having the ability to reveal us and use stealth they either dont need 17 stacks of confusion or thief needs to be brought up in line with engi. now if you did spam headshot 4 times it would interput the play and prevent him from using a skill long enough to counter it if hes not a newb. Now lets talk smoke screen and stunbreakers. with shadowstep being over relied on by thiefs i feel we need to make smokescreen a stunbreaker. base cooldown for SS is 50secs if traited is 40. smokescreen base cooldown is 30 if traited is 24. 24 is more then half of 40. i suggest to make ss a stunbreaker to allow more counter play to thief and not jsut relying on the same old skills that everyone uses.
lmao its funny because the ranger that was with me left you alone and if you didnt want to duel you should have kept runnning. thing is ive faced a good thiefs from bg and if you know yoru class and know how to play zerker you will beat me. get better kid
Ive gotta say you need to stop spammingn this post. last refuge works wonders for me and as far as the blinding powder change its not even noticable. people need to stop whinning
No what im saying is no matter how many times i change to a different finisher it jsut reverts to the mad king consumable. whats the point in purchasing a finisher if you cant even use it.
Its pretty funny you say you roam with a warrior. when i fight warriors then tend to run away alot “nike air” warrior. the fact that your running skills are redic and your hp regen invuls etc sounds like you need to learn to play warrior.
why cant you guys be on tc. i made an all thief guild on yaks but most of that stopped when i got to tc. if anyone on tc sees this and is a thief add me in game
