Guild Wars 2

PyrateSilly.4710:

There is the Wintersday tree from the one achievement that gives out a present a day that has been updated with the rewards from this year —- drinks and all.

And I solute anyone for whom that tree is their only drink-acquisition method… in 30 years, they’ll have their shoulders!

After complaining in every Wintersday thread in the forums (4 of which were combined) about the sheer anti-Christmas feeling having to grind 10k drinks was giving me, I just sucked it up after grinding for a couple thousand drinks and bought the rest of mine whenever they were below a particular threshold on the AH. And I’ll tell you with 100% certainty… reloading AH prices was more fun than the jumping puzzle and the bells (after 10 hours, anyway – I actually liked the bells for the first 10 hours).

Both my husband and I are broke now, but hey! I have time to like… make dinner and sleep, so… worth it. And I don’t have to rely on my home instance tree for presents. Speaking of that tree… It’s too pretty to be hidden in a tiny little building!

I hope they don’t change it at this point! Unless they want to refund all the gold my husband sold all his ectos to get so I could get these shoulders!

I’m definitely kittened they made a HOLIDAY item this ridiculous to get, but now that I have spent all my and my husband’s gold on it, they better freaking not change it!
BTW – it would take 79 hours of bells to get enough drinks… I have to travel for the holiday and don’t have time for that, as pleasant a holiday treat as that sounds. The Jumping puzzle has about a 200 bags an hour yield if you’re good at it, but I’m horribad, so that wasn’t an option. So… I rang bells for 2000 drinks with the help of my husband and paid nearly 700 gold for the remaining 8k. I hate myself for spending gold (read giving in), but I really wanted the item and don’t have time to do it my usual way.

Nike.2631:

One day ANet might get the idea to have collections that require 10 things for the shiny but have 12 things in the set so we can skip 1-2 of them…

This would be so much more in line with the GW2 I knew and loved.

Sheobix.8796:

There are a lot of things wrong with HoT and the current state of core GW2 post-HoT that are.. just plain bad.

I spent 5 minutes on GW2 today, and it didn’t make me mad, it made me sad.

I really used to enjoy the game.

GW2 has become a chore MMO.

Hayseus Christo… what the hell happened to GW2?

:*(

I echo your sentiments.
And add that they’ve ruined Christmas with a 10k drink requirement for the shoulder skin. They should have not tied such a gold-sink to their holiday event – it’s just depressing.

I doubt GW2 will ever be great again – they’re just too far down the hole. This will quickly become just another game I log into to do dailies like Warframe, TERA, Firefall, etc… except this game was once great! I shall remember the good times and move on.

Yea… I hate being forced into ONE activity. I’m thankful they didn’t make me PVP for the META (Sadly, I realized this after I was halfway done with that huge annual torture session), but 10k drinks is ridiculous! My husband and I did all the various Christmas activities for 10 hours yesterday and I only got 500ish drinks. If All I did was high-intesity bag-yielding activities, I would have nearly 800, if I had to guess, at which rate, I do not have enough waking hours between now and when I’m forced to leave town (Next Tuesday) to accumulate the requisite drinks without paying 9s each for them.

So… I’m sad. And mad that they’re letting their new F-off people who came to GW because it was different crowd philosophy extend to holidays.

Old Tyria when it wasn’t just an internal compatition for which development group could make people spend the most cash or suck the most resources out of players, especially during the holidays. 10,000 drinks? LOLOLOLOL over 800gold for one of 10 acheivement items? hahahaha jerkfaces.

Amen!
They gave a big middle finger to their mission statement, to what this game was that drew so many here, and to many well-paying customers like me.

Hakuryuu.8634:

You’re complain about grinding for COMESTICS. They’re entirely optional, and no one force you to do so. No one is going to crap on you for not having one. You won’t die without it. You choose to commit to the grind yourself, and even though ANet has been a kitten lately, don’t stab yourself and blame it on them.

This game is about cosmetics. it always has been, as it is not your traditional (thank goodness) Linear MMO model.

The big problem here is that they were not content to make fluff grinds ridiculous in their regular HOT content (read the forums – this is an issue for many many people who have been playing GW2 since BETA, many of whom came from GW1. These are not people are aren’t used to working for stuff… These are people who are used to a reasonable grind), but they’ve expended the grind forever or pay us scheme to holidays – to Items only available during a 2-week event, which is ridiculous. Especially for people like me who have no freaking choice but to travel for the holidays. It’s not like I can tell my kid’s grandparents – “Sorry, you can’t see your grand kids this year because I have some very demanding virtual drinking to do.” I mean – I COULD, but they’d cut me off…

To fix it, they could:
Lower the amount of drinking required
or
Extend the variety of drinks that count
or
Make drinks available at a vendor for a decent price so we don’t have to deal with auction house flippers again (did Nightfury teach them nothing?).
or
axe that requirement alltogether – encouraging alcoholism isn’t socially responsible.

I’m annoyed. Again. They just keep making decisions that alienate me.

This is just the new direction they’ve chosen. I’m extremely frustrated with the 10k drinks as well. My husband and I did Christmas stuff for 10 hours today… got all the other requirements done – figured I’d see how many drinks I got by playing normally today before complaining… I got 533 ish… and that’s including buying all the available gifts with Karma. I only have 1 week due to family obligations and there is no way I can feasibly grind all 10k in that time. I am a mother with 2 children and a life. They’re making even their holiday wares available only to those with no life or obligations other than playing GW2 — Nightfury was a sign of things to come, I guess. I’m really getting tired of their new direction – it’s very punitive.

I spend a lot of time playing GW 2and have given them a lot of money and I just keep feeling like they’re flipping me off. I’m getting really tired of it. Holiday stuff is supposed to be a fun way to get basically free loots… This is just not that. They put the cool stuff behind a gold wall (for those of us who literally do not have time to grind all the drinks) on a holiday – it’s like asking for presents instead of giving them. It’s depressing at best.

I remember when holidays were a fun time to get presents. Apparently, Anet prefers to get presents (our gold or cash) instead of gifting them to us

Since when is holiday stuff gated by such strict requirements?! So they wanted to make the game more hardcore… gold gating presents isn’t hardcore – it’s just mean. It’s supposed to be FUN! In my normal gaming time, I’m not having fun grinding for mats for Bifrost this week… Yay! I get to take some time off from my normal grind to… grind even dumber stuff! Merry Christmas!

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Are you required to get and consume all the drinks in 30 days?

More like 15.
I don’t see an actual end date, but most of these things last about 2 weeks.
I’m extremely upset that every single little thing they added in HoT is gold-gated.

This is serious BS. They could include all the past drinks or… all drinks. 10k would still be a lot – no matter what drinks you’re chugging, but these specifically – the cheapest right now is 7g 60 silver. 5 minutes ago it was 6g 80 silver. Anyone who thinks the prices will come down before this event is over is smoking something. Maybe a little but, but not enough to make this attainable by most people.

I don’t have enough karma to buy 9.5k bags and don’t have enough time to grind them out from events, so… they successfully excluded me from getting the shoulders… I should have just guessed based on other decisions they’ve made.

I was just going to start a thread about this. what the actual F?
Where in the hell am I going to get 10,000 drinks before this is over? I have to travel for Christmas, so I have until next Tuesday. Believe me, if i could choose to stay home and grind for virtual booze, i totally would, but since i had kids, my holidays are not up to me.

My husband and I spent 10 hours on this today and we only got around 500ish drinks. If I spend 10 hours a day for the remaining 7 days I have before I have to go out of town, I will have around 3500 drinks. So… basically, I have done every other requirement for the shoulders, but I do not physically have time to earn that many drinks. Right now, If you were to buy them straight-up, it’d be 873 gold.

This BS is why I quit skyforge (not that it was a great game anyway, of course)… it’s holiday stuff was virtually unattainable.

PLEASE fix this – put the fun back in holidays! Seriously. This is just. too. much.

I’m not worried about the jumping puzzle… but where the hell am I going to get 10,000 drinks before this is over? I have to travel for Christmas, so I have until next Tuesday. My husband and I spent 10 hours on this today and we only got around 500ish drinks. If I spend 10 hours a day for the remaining 7 days I have before I have to go out of town, I will have around 3500 drinks. So… basically, I have done every other requirement for the shoulders, but I do not physically have time to earn that many drinks. Right now, If you were to buy them straight-up, it’d be 873 gold. This BS is why I quit skyforge (not that it was a great game anyway, of course)… it’s holiday stuff was virtually unattainable.

Starting a thread about this in hopes that someone has some ideas for me.

Yea. I’m trying to see if I can find someone for whom they reversed it in the past. Judging by the first response I got, the particular support person didn’t even understand what I’m talking about. I’d take a referral to someone who’s had their coffee! When their game mechanic is so obviously punitive, they should be prepared to help people after simple mistakes like this and I’m sure they’ve done it in the past given this game’s been out for 3 1/2 years, so I just need to find out for whom

Edit: Point is moot. I found someone who was awake at Anet Thanks for playing!
====
Hey,
Has anyone been successful reversing a gold-for gems transaction?

I’m wondering if anyone has accidentally exchanged gold for gems and has been able to get them to reverse it. I’m extremely annoyed right now because I accidentally exchanged 349 gold for 2000 gems instead of exchanging 2000 gems for 238 gold last night.

Because they tweak their exchange, I can’t just go back the other way and call it even.
If I sell 2000 gems, I’d only get 244 gold after having paid 349 gold for the same amount of gems.

So a simple mistake has cost me 105 gold, which is a LOT to me right now. I had a plan and I was excited and freaking clicked the wrong button

They refuse to reverse the transaction (but said if it was the other way around, they would — I see no difference, as both involve gold). If I can find someone for whom they’ve fixed this in the past, It would strongly bolster my case. Feel free to PM me if you don’t want to post openly. Thanks.

Kerin.9125:

His argument is a strawman, that isn’t what those disenfranchised small guild members are upset about, they’re upset because pre-HOT they worked and unlocked many perks for their small guild that HOT simply took away from them and gated them behind the GH many small guilds will never get.

If GW2 had started out with this mechanism then fine, clearly anyone not wanting to put up with large guild drama and having their access to such content at the whim of the leader would not have got used to having it, but GW2 gave them that ability which Anet then moved behind a paywall and gates.

Yep.

Totally ridiculous to remove access to things we earned and put them behind huge mat/pay walls. “Oh you want your banners? Level a scribe, you scrub. And the requisite guild hall buildings and upgrades, too. What you did in the past and the precedent we set are no longer important. F off small guilds – especially small WvW guilds” -Anet

But then I looked at the mats for each upgrade through the end and went ballistic. With good reason. Eventually, I decided just to F it all. I no longer care about this game – It’s simply what I’m doing until something else comes out – the bar for that something else has been lowered significantly with the HoT changes. I’m actually considering Black Desert now (Starting the 16th if you Beta-Qualify/Buy), which I wasn’t before. I’m required to play Star Citizen due to Spouse Threat. So… I have new things incoming. When I’m done with those, I’ll check back in with GW2 and the state of Guild Halls. If it hasn’t changed by then, I’ll look to something else. I’m just being honest here… Anet lost my respect and their top rank in my gaming repertoire. They’re now somewhere in the middle. Lucky for them (cause I’m still giving them money), I’m kind of bored of the other games installed on my box, so I’m alternating between GW2 and Warframe… for another week or so.

BTW, I think people looking for scaling should make their own thread.

I just think if you’re going to come into a thread about how long it would take a small guild to clear a guild hall saying you’ve just unlocked the last building upgrade within a couple of months, it’d be nice to know exactly what you mean and how you did it. Because that type of information would be relevant and maybe mind-changing.

In conversing with you guys, I’ve basically talked myself out of building a guild hall for my guild. As of right now, I have no plans to even bother…. because I’m right: It’s too punitive and will take too long to complete. I’m still kitten and love this game less — a lot less, but right now, I don’t have a better game to play. I’m hoping a better standby emerges, so when I get done with the next time-sink game, I have something other than a game that gives me the middle finger to go back to.

Still bugged! We knew it was bugged before, but figured you guys would have fixed it by now… nope.
/confused

Guess it’s either really complicated or really unimportant.

Kulvar.1239:

20 member guild with 10 active members
We just unlocked the last building upgrade
One man guilds are not guilds.

This means nothing to me without more information.
Exactly what upgrades do you have open? I’m genuinely curious – not trying to be snarky. The last upgrade (Weaponsmith 2, for the Market, for instance) for what buildings?

Or do you mean you’ve just opened up all your buildings (which is easy-peasy by my standards)?

And did anyone put in any real cash?

GreyWolf.8670:

Great. Now not only do I want my guild hall but I want a pool in it. :/

… and a dinner table and a house… and many other totally irrelevant subjects of flawed metaphor.

It comes down to this: the Guild Hall facet of HoT is completely punitive for small guilds. There really is no point in discussion because it’s simply true – no matter how you swing it.

This thread has basically been hijacked by people who want there to be scaling. I am the OP and I say F scaling. This needed to be fair from the start – obtainable in a reasonable amount of time without requiring real money. I don’t care at all how fast big guilds get their Hall’s filled out – they could have them done on day 1( I expected it). For me it’s about the sheer amount of time it would take a small guild (not really even compared to big guilds… Big guilds were only mentioned to emphasize exactly what the focus of this expansion was on, to draw attention to how anet has changed over the years, how they broke promises and how they gave small guilds the middle finger. Individual effort means nothing in guild hall development and access. Someone in a big guild can contribute 3 shovels and some iron and have the same access as I will after donating:

Ancient Wood Plank 1760 / Bolt of Gossamer 1220 / Bolt of Silk 420 / Cured Hardened Leather Square 1860 / Cured Thick Leather Square 8930 / Elder Wood Plank 18400 / Gold Ingot 150 / Green Wood Plank 750 / Hard Wood Plank 750 / Mithril Ingot 21600 / Orichalcum Ingot 2735 / Seasoned Wood Plank 250 / Soft Wood Plank 250 / 18 Slot Invisible Bag 7 / 18 Slot Leather Pack 10 / 18 Slot Mithril Box 9 / 18 Slot Silk Bag 9 / 18 Slot Thick Leather Pack 30 / Bowl of Lotus Stirfry 50 / Bowl of Saffron-Mango Ice Cream 40 / Chocolate Omnomberry Cream 100 / Bloodstone Brick 220 / Bottle of Airship Oil 445 / Bowl of Black Pepper Cactus Salad 80 / Celestial Intricate Gossamer Insignia 6 / Celestial Orichalcum Imbued Inscription 6 / Custom Arena Time Token 15 / Dragonite Ingot 15 / Eggplant 1000 / Elonian Leather Square 55 / Empyreal Star 60 / Essence of Luck (exotic) 1085 / Milling Stone 300 / Mystic Coin 830 / Superior Rune of Speed 6 / Superior Rune of Travel 6 / Unidentified Dye 70 / Ley Line Spark kitten / Ley-Line Infused Tool 625 / Mysitc Crystal 1110 / Obsidian Shard 250 / Pile of Auric Dust 375 / Potion of PvP Reward 720 / Sheet of Coarse Paper 300 / Sheet of Extra Coarse Sandpaper 600 / Sheet of Fine Paper 100 / Sheet of Premium Paper 20 / Sheet of Quality Paper 40 / Sheet of Rough Paper 540 / Sheet of Smooth Paper 80 / Silverwaste Shovel 600 / Tome of Knowledge 610 / Watchwork Portal Device 15 / Empty Keg 270 / Glass Mug 445 / Loaf of Saffron Bread 600 / Meat Pie 200 / Vial of Linseed Oil 1500 / Arrow Cart Blueprints 75 / Badge of Tribute 640 / Ballista Blueprints 75 / Bottle of Elonian Wine 380 / Catapult Blueprints 75 / Choir Bell 100 / Flame Ram Blueprints 75 / Greater Rune of Holding 35 / Jug of Water 100 / Major Rune of Holding 213 / Minor Rune of Holding 20 / Rune of Holding 300 / Superior Rune of Holding 37 / Thermocatalytic Reagent 3450 / Trebuchet Blueprints 75 / Amber Pebble 50 / Amethyst Lumpv 600 / Amethyst Nugget 100 / Ancient Bone 20 / Armored Scale 10 / Beryl Crystal 200 / Beryl Orb 100 / Beryl Shard 200 / Carnelian Lump 100 / Carnelian Nugget 100 / Carrot 2000 / Chrysocola Crystal 200 / Chrysocola Orb 100 / Chrysocola Shard 200 / Copper Ore 200 / Coral Chunk 200 / Coral Orb 100 / Coral Tentacle 200 / Corrupted Lodestone 15 / Destroyer Lodestone 50 / Elaborate Totem 10 / Emeral Crystal 200 / Emerald Orb 600 / Emerald Shard 200 / Foxfire Cluster 15 / Garnet Pebble 50 / Glacial Lodestone 10 / Glob of Ectoplasm 2265 / Intricate Totem 1050 / Iron Ore 400 / Lapis Lump 100 / Lapis Nugget 100 / Large Bone 500 / Large Claw 850 / Large Fang 600 / Large Scale 2000 / Malachite Pebble 50 / Mithril Ore 200 / Molten Lodestone 110 / Omnomberry 300 / Opal Crystal 200 / Opal Orb 950 / Opal Shard 200 / Orichalcum Ore 100 / Pearl 100 / Peridot Lump 100 / Peridot Nugget 100 / Pile of Crystalline Dust 690 / Pile of Incandescent Dust 3580 / Potato 1000 / Potent Venom Sac 750 / Powerful Venom Sac 10 / Quartz Crystal 650 / Ruby Shard 200 / Seaweed 1610 / Silver Ore 200 / Spinel Lump 100 / Spinel Nugget 100 / Sunstone Lump 100 / Thyme Leaf 1000 / Tiger’s Eye Pebble 50 / Turquoise Pebble 50 / Vial of Potent Blood 2000 / Vial of Powerful Blood 40 / Vicious Claw 10 / Vicious Fang 10 / Watchwork Sprocket 1200 / Zucchini 1000

Yep. Totally Fair. Nevermind. This post was totally overreaching….

I understand they needed to add something that would soak up veteran player’s mat and gold pools to kind-of even the playing field for new players, but I think that should have been an individual sink (like the new legendaries (talk about a gold sink)- more skins like that – more weapons with cool particle effects, etc…)

Shuai.7435:

Except for that you get to keep all of the banners you made before HoT and is able to craft new ones of the types you had unlocked pre-HoT at the Initiative HQ…

No you don’t get to just make more of what you could already make… Not without leveling a scribe! Unless my guild initiative HQ people are slackers.

I’m not sure why people keep saying this… My Guild Initiative HQ offers nothing of interest. In fact, the guild initiative notary tells me exactly what I can do in the Initiative Headquarters: “You can access general services you’ve unlocked (bank, which I can access without going in there at all). You can also speak with the explorers about funding an expedition to claim a guild hall.” Whoopteedoo! Unless there’s a secret passageway to banner-making without having a scribe, people who keep saying “you DO have access to everything you had access to before!” are full of it.

They straight up stole our effort in favor of forcing us to give them more effort, time, and/or cold-hard cash.

Majic.4801:

Alas, that would open the content to far too many players rather than fragmenting and alienating what remains of the Guild Wars 2 community.

/thumbsup
Priorities!

maddoctor.2738:

Do you honestly believe that in a guild of 500 complete strangers there will be more than let’s say 20-50 people who will actually actively contribute to the Guild Hall? If yes then you are wrong, the bigger the guild, the lower the percentage of active contributors. On the other hand a family guild of 10 that all know each other in real life will probably all contribute towards the Guild Hall in some way. And there you have the main problem with any solution based on guild size.

I’m not saying the current situation is good. But I’d rather have a solution that solves the problems without creating an even worse situation, where the admin team of a big guild will have to pay an even greater amount of resources to level a guild hall, or create not-fun policing rules for the guild that can cause all other manners of problems.

It’s like everyone thinks that in a big guild every member is completely loyal to said guild and they spread the burden of guild hall leveling evenly. So in an example, let’s say a guild hall requires 5000gold. In the minds of some players, that means that a guild of 500 will split the 5000gold among them so each pay 10 gold to have a full guild hall. On the other hand, in a guild of 10 they will have to pay 500 gold each for the same result. Well sadly that’s not how reality works.

Clearly you haven’t been reading my comments…
That sounds about right. But 20-50 people actively contributing anything is multitudes more than 2-3… for 2 people to put together the reasonable mat donations of 20 people is pretty crazy.

I’ve stated numerous times in this thread that there are a lot of freeloaders in big guilds… The fact that those freeloaders have the same access as I will after however many years it will take me to gather all the requisite mats is one of the things that kittenes me off. NOBODY (not a single person in this thread anyway) thinks each person in a 500 person or 5 person guild is going to donate the same amount. What I said was that I stand to donate a veritable crapton more than anyone in a big guild – even the biggest contributor. Maybe using a different word would be more clear?

…more than any individual in a Big guild. Not sure why clarification was needed, but there ya go.

Linken.6345:

Dejavu.2349:

SkyShroud.2865:

Also, why should one pay more for something others pay less to obtain?

Exactly… I stand to pay a LOT more over a much longer period of time than anyone in a big guild and get the same exact freaking house. /middlefinger in my face

No you pay exactly as much as the 500 people over there for the exact same house, just becouse you decide to do it alone instead of with 499 other people dont make you pay more then them.

I said than any of them… not than all of them. HUGE difference. I’m not in a big guild and refuse to feign interest just to use them for buffs I should be able to get reasonably in my own small guild. It’s the principle of the thing. Thanks for the bump!

SkyShroud.2865:

Also, why should one pay more for something others pay less to obtain?

Exactly… I stand to pay a LOT more over a much longer period of time than anyone in a big guild and get the same exact freaking house. /middlefinger in my face

SkyShroud.2865:

As far as I read, TS simply wants a guild of her own, something that belongs to her with her and her husband as the owners. But, unwilling to fork out that huge amount of mats to obtain the fully upgraded guild hall and that is why she is complaining. And, like all others, talks about small guilds and large guilds comparisons which often pointless because we all know large guild will upgrade the hall easier and faster than small guild.
…
In the end, many such discussions are often bias and nonconstructive.

Not unwilling, but

1) don’t think I should HAVE to given what GW2 was for the 3 1/2 year prior to HoT. It’s the ONLY game I’ve played (and I’ve played pretty much all of them) to change the primary focus of their game after 3 1/2 years of setting customer expectations.

2) The mat requirement is WAY too high to unlock everything – It is clearly punitive to small guilds.. There really is no argument here. I expected to have to work much harder than a normal small guild (like that of my friend) because that’s the way it was before, but this is an insane amount harder than they have to work, which is exponentially more work than any random person in a Big Guild has to do to gain the same benefits, which is unfair. That this game is still about fluff (skins, mini’s, bragging rights) and that the guild hall adds a HUGE discrepancy of access to said fluff between individuals of different number of people in their guild, is a big problem for them now and in the future. They need to know they can not continue on this path of disenfranchising small guilds.

3) If they didn’t take anything away and all the guild stuff was NEW and not a reworking of what was – a reworking that strips guilds of what they already earned and effectively makes them re-earn what they already earned (no game I’ve played has every done this either after launch – this is like closed Beta level stuff). I wouldn’t be nearly as upset. I’d still be annoyed, But it’d be easier to swallow.

In the end ALL discussions about anything are biased. There are always people of differing opinion – that doesn’t make the conversation pointless. There is a goal here and it has not been reached. My opinion that the new changes made the game I loved – my favorite MMO of all time – much less lovable is a valid opinion.

Bloodstealer.5978:

Whilst on the face of it having much larger numbers within the guild might appear to be difficult to manage, reality of it is it requires much less in the way of organisation in order to achieve the same goals as a small guild.

I agree with you, Bloodstealer.

[deleted huge diatribe about my past guild leadership because it’s totally not relevant here at all since I’m not leading a big guild in GW2 and have no intention of doing so ever because this game is for ME. Sky is trying to distract me from what matters with his blah blah blah]

This thread is about a huge material wall in front of buffs and skins access, some of which people already had before Hot, but that were callously stripped of in Hot.

A large guild is going to, by default, have more primary contributors, more secondary contributors, and more tertiary contributors than a small guild. In my case, REALLY small guild – just a family guild… I am THE contributor. My husband works 60 hour weeks and isn’t a farmer type like me and my kids think gw2 is mostly boring. They’re not even 80 yet, but are leveling slowly.

Anyone in any large guild is going to have to put in less mats (in some cases, 2000 times less) than I will need to in order to get the same access while still maintaining personal integrity and ownership of the guild into which I sink my mats.

Sure, I could join some random big guild to get the buffs or, later, skins, assuming they don’t set their permissions such that I couldn’t (which they can do and some have), but my argument is that I shouldn’t HAVE to. I don’t expect everyone to agree with me, but I wish people would stop making the same irrelevant or pointless arguments over and over again.

As an aside… Ecto gambling is fail. Last night I gave an evil skritt all but 11 of my gold and all my ecto because… I was bored of grinding, thus causing myself to have to re-grind all that Ecto… I do like the Silverwastes, so… see ya there! https://youtu.be/l3Y5mPESQkw

Jaxom.7310:

maybe not in mmos, but gw2 wasn’t suppose to be same as all other mmos…

The premise of my entire argument.

While some people have made very good points about why Anet made these changes and what I can do to gain access to the Big-Guild exclusive content, I maintain that none of the anecdotes mentioned are in line with the game I was originally sold. I know Things change over time and understand all good things must come to an end, but that doesn’t mean I can’t be disappointed enough in the current trajectory to speak up. If enough people speak up, maybe their future decisions won’t be so punitive to smaller guilds or individuals.

nezroy.8492:

You don’t need to be in a “big” guild. 3 or 4 people can do it with some gold investment, 10 people just by playing. Itsy and I have pretty much duo’d our guild to 23 so far; yes some of the later upgrades will take months or even a year to reach at our current rate, but I see no issue with that. It gives us something to work toward and all the important stuff was easy to unlock.

80% of our progress has just been us two. We’ve had two other active contributors help with shovel farming and making some bloodstone bricks, but that’s about it.

But mostly you are just salty as a solo completionist. You can get a guild hall with repair + merchant to port to at any time trivially. It’s a one-time LFG run with a few strangers and like 150 gold. The only other thing you arguably need is convenient bank access which 2 people can easily get in short order with the first-tier workshop.

Beyond that every other thing is just fluff and you are just annoyed you can’t 100% it solo. Some skins and minis are inaccessible, but there are dozens of those that are equally out of reach. You don’t need an arena for 2 people. I guarantee a 2-person guild already wasn’t using WvW upgrades from the war room anyway. So what exactly do you feel you are missing out on?

The only thing you might be missing out on are the buffs, which with five guild slots you can easily mooch off from other people; which in fact I know you were already essentially doing pre-HoT anyway from a large faceless guild and which you can keep doing now.

I asked you the other day, but you didn’t reply… How much real money have you put in to get as far as you have? I was trying to make a point in this thread… Because that’s really what it would take for any small guild to be competitive… dollar bills…. lots of them.

You’re right about me being a solo completionist. But it’s why I played this game to begin with. That’s my whole point. I can’t be that any more, so my primary reason for choosing this game over others is gone. GW2 is no longer my refuge. It’s just another MMO. It’s the fluff that matters. No fluff is why I quit Wildstar (other than rosterboss). Fluff is why I play games.

I don’t see the point at all in having a guild hall when I can’t have weapon/armor smiths 2. It’s not the hall itself I care about… It’s the benefits therein. The fact that I stand to put in 2000 times the mats (that’s a reasonable number, too, looking at everything) of any average big-guild person and have the same access (but way way down the line) is just stupid.

Effectively, I get to choose between playing the game as they’ve allowed and even encouraged me to for the last 3 1/2 years and not have a guild hall OR join a big guild. You know me… what do you think I’m gong to choose?! Can you see me joining a big guild when I won’t even join your guild (a person who I know and like (except when you come into my threads being mean))? I said this earlier in this thread somewhere… I will be the last one standing in any guild I’m in and it’s going to be my own or my husband’s guild so one of us has control over it when everyone else leaves.

Assuming you’re talking about guild heroes banners with the mooching part ‘cause I’ve never been in any big guilds in GW2… Whoopteedoo…

Thanks for the bump, I guess.

SkyShroud.2865:

Dude, that some really arrogant words you have there. If you think that it is THAT easy to build a large guild and then maintain it to be large, then do it and show it to me, only then you have the rights to say those words but other than that, that is really arrogant of you.

Oh get over yourself. I’ve led big guilds in MMO’s through their raiding content. I know exactly what it’s like to organize people and am more qualified than 99% of the people here to talk about the huge pile of do-nothings that just come in to get the good stuff (it’s why DKP exists), but make no real contribution. I have perspective, tyvm. I prefer a meritocracy.

I came to GW2 because it was a game wherein I wouldn’t HAVE to lead or even be in a big guild. The entire point of this thread, since you clearly didn’t read through it, not that I blame you… it’s a lot of words) is that they’ve changed the very focus of their game and are now forcing people to join Big guilds to get access to skins and buffs, etc…

I personally know several people who joined big guilds and have donated nothing. nada. cero. zip. Whereas I stand to donate pretty much everything… and we’ll both have the same access, only I’ll have it after my kids go off to college… maybe. It would be so much easier for me to organize any level of guild – 10-50-500 – than to do it all myself or with a little help from a few people who have demanding jobs. I’m actually very good at guild leading. But that’s not why I play guild wars – I play this game to get away from all that work. Oh man it is WORK… a ton of WORK… there is very little fun in it. The new changes have taken away the primary reason this game is my mainstay (the one I don’t quit, though… it’s more likely now).

And we now get to grind for a veritable kittenton of mats for upgrades we already had, but that were taken away and put behind a huge mat wall. Yay. Their execution of the guild hall leaves much to be desired. Again… anyone who’s not a primary earner would not understand this at all. This thread is for primary earners… not for people who have it easy.

Absconditus.6804:

Maybe I already replied in this topic, the Search of these Forums are horrible, so I’ve given up on even trying that, and I can’t be bothered looking through all my old posts; Anyways—

I claimed Gilded Hollow for my personal “bank” Guild, with the help of my friend. That’s with two people. I play a Herald, he plays a Warrior. We had little to no issue with taking out the tendrils, besides a few RNG fails where the tendrils would spawn on the complete opposite side of the map where we had just taken out the previous one. It took perhaps 5-6 tries and/or resets, and then it were claimed.

After that, I have been casually enough upgrading my Guild Hall, on my own, and have reached Lv.13, missing just the basic Arena unlock as I am doing my sPvP dailies to get Potions needed, and having gotten a few upgrades at each unlocked location, that I want. Nothing about that feels too annoying or overly difficult. I just need patience. Even the semi-ridiculous need for Crystalline Ore on basic furnishings, feels less frustrating now that the Noxious Pods are by far increased in numbers within Dragon’s Stand. There’s a Flax farm in Verdant Brink, and I have 9 characters that all gather there each day, so that’s over 100 Flax a day from that little spot, and 5 minutes of my time.

Is the system perfect? No. But it’s not as bad as I feel some people make it out to be. It’s going to take you some time, and what’s wrong with that? It’d be boring if it were all unlocked within a week or two.

Let me know when you clear restoration 2/weaponsmith 2!
He’s my goal and I’d like to know how long it takes a real true solo earner like me (the others in my guild are kitten -near worthless). Until then… Yes… in the beginning, it looks doable, but it’s really just the tip of the Iceberg.

Do you (or when will you) have 21000 flax seeds yet? 600 shovels? 2265 Globs of Ecto? 18000 Elder Wood Planks? 21000 Mithril? 3450 thermocatalytic reagents (483 GOld, straight-up)? 950 Opal Orbs? 610 Tomes of Knowledge? 1085 200-luck essences? Want the rest of the list? It’s been linked… Not to mention max-level scribe.

You may not see it yet, but my point is valid.

Good question! Bye!

Kidding… I’m not being forced to be here. I made a decision to come here to get my voice heard… I’ve played enough MMO’s to know the only way to get heard is to QQ the loudest! And I’m only here when I’m bored… which has been more often sine HoT came out than usual

Thanks for the Bump!

Grim West.3194:

I like jumping puzzles, but they shouldn’t be forced upon anyone. ANET made some very poor design decisions in HoT.

I agree. I like them, but like anything else in life and games, I don’t like being forced into anything, even the best content. Choices are good.

Here here!
Agree on all points.

I wish I had your resolve, sir!

My problem is there are still things I want to spend real world dollars on even though I feel me and my tiny guild got the big ol’ middle finger by HoT I want the dollars I’ve already spent to go towards the next xpac, which hopefully won’t disenfranchise small guilds.

Regardless of how it is, it’s not the way it should be. Games aren’t supposed to mimic real life… unless they’re a Sims game and even then (in real life, you don’t take a poop on the floor if the bathroom door is shut…). But, if you’re going for real life-corporate analogies… the losers who just work for the man don’t get all the benefits the man does, so… there goes that.

I didn’t mean to be a knob… I guess I just get testy when people clearly don’t even try to see my point of view. And the run along now thing is something I picked up from a movie like a decade ago and I admittedly overuse it because it really suits my attitude… Apologies!

Devata.6589:

No, they do not have to pay way more per player. Imho you are looking at it wrongly.

A big company needs a bigger building with more facilities. A smaller company needs a smaller building with less facilities.

As a smaller guild you might not want to try to get to level 40 and get the guild-expansion. You also might not want to get the Warroom, the Workshop, the Tavern and the Arena all fully upgraded but you might only want to go for the Warroom, or only for the Workshop of only those two (Depending on the size and the preferences). Or maybe you want to go for them all but not get them all completely upgraded.

That should be your goal as a smaller guild, just as a smaller company go’s for a smaller building with less facilities. The cost per member would then be the same.

The problem is, you basically are the small company but want the biggest building, with all possible facilities and then complain that it’s too expensive.

About losing what you had, I agree that that is sort of bad. I can understand it, but I agree it’s not ideal.

Oh, we absolutely DO have to pay more per player – this isn’t even arguable.

Guilds are NOT companies (or people). The output is not different. We’re not making cars here. This analogy is among the worst I’ve heard.

There are X available benefits, including a weaponsmith, for instance, that’s only available after guild level 40 and the largest mat wall of all. To say only Big guilds should have this and other skin vendors is just asinine. Especially considering many big guild members put in like… NOTHING. Seriously. I stand to deposit a minimum of 300 shovels, all the ascended mats, most of the mystic coins, most of everything else… and according to you, I should have less access than some knob who simply joined a big guild and contributed nothing or next-to nothing. LOL. Hilarious. Run along now…

LOL, Tora. For sure.
I’ve always felt sick of seeing the same armor in the preview screen…. Like, from Beta. My husband has more of a tolerance for limited selection than I do – as long as there’s ONE piece for each slot that he likes.

I’d like to add to your request by requesting all armor of the same type accept dye equally. Some items just suck at taking dye. They look kittenty no matter what color you use because their shading is just crap. This is especially noticeable in cloth and leather. Much of the plate looks beautiful.

PS – we don’t need any more hole-ridden skirts for any armor class. Thanks.

Yea… maybe for some people, my method doesn’t work. But it works for me because I tend not to spend time doing things I don’t like. If I’m not having fun, I log out and do something else… I have a ton of games on my box and a pretty mice steam library, so I’m always doing something I like. The value of my time is mostly equal but for time with my kids, which trumps all.

I’m one of the authors of a haters-gonna-hate threads and I say to buy it.
The way I think about games is this:
How much entertainment do I get per dollar?
$8 – 2 Hours ($4 an hour) Going to the movies.
$15 – 2 hours ($7.50 an hour) with mandatory popcorn and a drink
$20 – 1 hour for going out to the bars (more if I buy drinks for other people)
$60 – 600+ hours (10cents/hr)- Skyrim ( a solid second option)
$200 – 2448 hours (8 cents/hr) – GW2 including HOT so far.

Basically, even If I hated hot (in many ways, I totally do actually), They still earned that money from me and maybe this time, my money will go toward content that doesn’t completely disenfranchise small guilds! You can play hot however you played before if you ignore guilds all together. It’s really only kittenty if you’re a primary earner in a small guild or in a small PVP guild. Those 2 groups got the finger.

The gliding is super cool, but the maps are a bit too confusing until you get the hang of it… Kind of like downtown San Fran driving…

Gaining mastery (the new XP after 80) is easier than gaining the points to fill it out, for sure, but it’s doable – even solo if you’re not on an empty map. Generally the GW2 community is pretty helpful.

Honestly, after going through the story quests, though, I haven’t been spending much time at all in the new zones but for events I see pop up in LFG, so… meh.

But… buying this XPAC makes stuff you do in the old zones worthwhile. There is a gain for leveling over 80 again! You’d earn mastery and points. Your mats are desperately needed by small guilds! Join one! I think it’s worth it even without doing raids or guild hall stuff…. barely, maybe, but worth it.

Go to your achievements tab. There will be a red icon next to the categories that have Tyria points to offer (the blue icons are for HoT ones).

They’re all tied to achievements, some of which are easy like killing the 4 legendaries in Silverwastes nets you 5 points, and some of which will take a while or force you to re-do content like completing all the achievements in each story quest segment nets you 1 point, etc…

Personally, I’m hoping to avoid having to go through all the story quests again to get those achievements… we shall see! The Silverwastes ones are arguably the easiest. I was out there anyway. I’m 15 short with 3 easy ones on my list… then I have to decide what I want to do out of the things I don’t want to do.

Draygo.9473:

And its totally ok that smaller guilds currently have to pay way more per player?

I am not against smaller guilds having to spend a bit more effort per person, but the current effort required to earn what we previously earned is way too kitten high.

I don’t think they understand the sheer number of hours it would take for 5 people to grind out all the mats required… To people in big guilds, this seems so trivial because their personal contribution is so low… even the highest contributors in big guilds have it incredibly easy. Being able to see what it’s like to be the primary contributor out of 5 or so is completely out of their realm of understanding.

Some of the mats are easy, but others are simply insane for small guilds to gather. It would be better if we could pick the end product we want without having to go through however many middle steps to get there and the actual guild levels required were halved. But as it is, there’s not enough picking and choosing and too many difficult mats in between important guild hall benefits.

I know it’s hard for a person to understand the plight of a group they’re not part of. But I’d appreciate it if they (especially people who have any power to make changes) would try.

I guess it just never affected ME before. I tend to not notice when something affects other people as much as I do when it affects me… That’s pretty much because I’m human and that’s just how humans are.

Bloodstealer.5978:

Try to engage some grey matter before jumping in with meaningless responses..

Win.

pandemos.3497:

I still just vote that contributions to guilds be based on the individual… if you want guild services you contribute X amount, regardless of guild size. Complete eliminates the complexity and makes everyone accountable. The freeloaders won’t like it… but that shouldn’t be a surprise.

I second this. I’m totally fine with individual responsibility/ownership. It would indeed eliminate my whole problem with their shoddy guild hall execution. The people who really benefit from their new system are indeed the freeloaders. WTG, Anet!

Wahaha.7938:

But it was always the norm in dungeons and then in fractals.

I must have gotten lucky – never once had anyone question my spec or ability. Though I do tend to run in a tight circle…

@ Mahou: I know it’s the norm and I feel extremely lucky to have played GW2 for the 3 1/2 years it was not the norm. To me, these and other changes make it just another MMO and that makes me sad

@Mel: Optimal is usually not the most fun. At least not in my experience in any game. It’s sometimes only optimal because it’s the easiest, too.

@ Palador: It will happen even in fake-difficulty content, too… people just overreact instead of think about things.

Something about the Raid that came up in conversation is that, while it’s great to have more challenging content (I totally agree /facerolling isn’t a whole lot of fun), It will inevitably lead to people being forced into cookie cutter builds because joe shmo on some forum or Youtube says it’s the best. It has already happenned, actually… Some raids specifically ask for professions of a particular spec with toughness under x. The reason is because the people running the raids or inviting for them have no vision… they just want to easiest path between points A and B, which leaves little room for fun.

Something else I liked about this game is that I could play however I wanted. Sure, my bow may be a marginal decrease in DPS from a sword, but it has more utility and suits my play style a lot better, which makes me a happier and better player than I would be if forced to play a way I’m not comfortable with.

What do you guys think?

What I see in the future of this game now that they’re adding raids and dedicated tanks and healers is an endless balancing nightmare. How many times has the druid been “fixed” since HoT? We all already know the audience for whom HoT was created….. But the backlash of the changes they made will cause them years and years of balancing ability sets between professions and PVE and PVP, which will inevitably lead to class homogenization. They’ll want to make sure people of all professions are equally useful and needed n raid groups, which kitten -near guarantees I’m right.

I see a few fun, smart players in a sea mindless drones depositing mats and gold into the repositories of big guilds.

It’s just another reason they’re no longer different in the important ways from any other run-of-the-mill, bottom-line-oriented MMO.

Time will tell!

mcwurth.2081:

…

So there we come to the bigger issue: new player comes, wants to start a guild, makes a guild, but cant get their members because of the high bar that is laid upon us by arenanet, so in the end ONLY bigger guilds profit from this, because they have build out everything already due to their sheer numbers, and will be easy to build out these guilds more.
…
I just got kicked out of one guild because I do not want to rep 100%, it is a new rule, because they want everyone 100% giving everything off a sudden. See it is starting already, I can’t be in several guilds anymore. the game took a step backwards now, and if you really can not see this then I really do not know where your head is at.

McWurth makes an excellent point here and is spot on.
More undeniable proof this xpac is all about big guilds (not… guild… BIG guilds).

The Majority of players are going to want to join the biggest, most progressed guild they can find so they don’t have to feel responsible for donating the HUGE mat wall between them and the buffs and vendors. Why would they? All things being equal, if you were guildless, would you rather join a guild knowing full well you’d have to provide 5,000 flax, ascended mats, 150 shovels, etc…? um… not unless you had another reason to be there… like friends or some other investment.

And some of those guilds are already kicking people because they don’t need people who don’t rep 100% or donate mats. Or they’re just not taking people without an upfront mat or gold deposit (and a couple even kick you out after that, per these forums).

It’s just a lose-lose for a lot of people at this point.

(my apologies, Mcwurth if i misunderstood your post).

Linken.6345:

Yes and you can still do that in game you just cant have said guild hall or raiding since it demands more people then you are willing to have around you.

I dont go around moaning that I cant go in the carpool lane or use family parking spaces at supermarkets, when Im the only one in my family.
I adapt to how it is and maybe so should you?

Except, It’s only how it is because they just changed it 3 1/2 years into a game I loved. Do you think I’d be here if this has always been the focus or “how it is?” Nope. And I likely wouldn’t be playing this game at all.

Again, since you clearly don’t understand, I am here in these forums because the changes they made to the game just annihilated the primary reasons I chose to give them my time and give them my money. I may adapt to some of those changes in time, but right now, I’m peeved and I’ll be here peeving on about it until I’m heard by people who actually can make a difference.

But… they have family spaces at the supermarket?! What paradise do you live in?!