Showing Posts For Kanthor.2094:
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Yikes, I wonder if the posters demanding permanent bans for everything would apply their logic outside of games. What, he stole some bread? Off with his head!
Anyone who breaks the rules to the degree that results in a permaban knows exactly what they’re doing.
Citation needed.
Except for the RMT bot squads and serious hacking (like the warp hack used by RMT bot squads), I think a permanent ban is way too harsh, especially if it’s the first offence.
Since some people still don’t get that this wasn’t an infinite loop here is the full breakdown of the level 80 rare Snowflake Mithril Earring:
Assumption 1: The average return of ectoplasm from a rare item is 0.9 ectos.
Assumption 2: Salvaging this jewelery returns an average of 1.5 mithril ore.
(Feel free to correct either of these if they’re off, which they probably are)
Assumption 3: A master salvage kit was used (BLSKs weren’t worth using until the end).
8 mithril ore + 1 brilliant snowflake = 0.8 brilliant snowflake + 0.9 ectoplasm + 1.5 mithril ore
Multiplying by 10 for the sake of whole numbers gives:
80 mithril ore + 10 brilliant snowflake = 8 brillant snowflake + 9 ectoplasm + 15 mithril ore
Simplifying the equation gives:
65 mithril ore + 2 brilliant snowflake = 9 ectoplasm
Since 1 brilliant snowflake = 1 pristine snowflake + 1 ectoplasm + 4 mithril ore:
73 mithril ore + 2 pristine snowflake + 2 ectoplasm = 9 ectoplasm
The final simplified equation is this:
73 mithril ore + 2 pristine snowflake = 7 ectoplasm
Was this a very efficient recipie when first released? Yes. Did the market adjust in a few days? Yes. Was this an infinite loop as some people are saying? Absolutely not.
If you have a reciped that by breaking it after you craft it you get more mats than you had at the start, you should know something is wrong.
I agree 100% but that wasn’t the case here.
That would be 100% truth if the gain wasn’t made by a faulty recipe!
A+B -> 3A + B isn’t right!!! This is the problem!
It was more like A + B + C = 1.5C Of course the pro-ban people like to ignore A and B and only focus on C.
Well deserved ban. Any jewelcraft would immediately know that the recipe should have required 3+ jewels not 1, because all others do.
The rare 65 jeweler snowflake items still require 1 snowflake each.
An exploit is whatever ANet labels an exploit, apparently.
“can’t talk about it”? but they can sure ban for it! Wow.
Do you know when that screenshot was taken?
The message is that if something is obviously a bug…
It wasn’t obvious.
An item, that when crafted and salvaged duplicates one of the most valuable crafting materials in the game and can propagate itself along with a profit, there is obviously a problem. That goes well beyond making a profit from crafting.
Infinite loops never result in an increased price of the inputs. Both snowflakes and mithril ore went up in price because this was NOT an infinite loop. Just because a couple ANet employees who are bad at logic and/or math say it’s an infinite loop doesn’t make it so.
To all the posters saying the exploiters knew what they were doing was an exploit, I disagree. ANet said nothing about the recipies before they were blocked, so under what criteria do YOU determine it was an exploit? And don’t mention “infinite loop” because that was already debunked when John Smith brought it up in another thread. It can’t just be about how much money was made because that would be absurd.
The decision to permanently ban “exploiters” were made in good faith but the harm associated with the precedent set by ANet with this decision by far exceed any gain. In essence, ANet has sent the message that ANY profitable salvaged material is an exploit, (eg: salvaging a yellow for ecto). I do not think ANet fully comprehend the magnitude of the harm set by this precedent…
Exactly, now EVERY method of gaining significant gold outside of item flipping on the TP can be considered an exploit in the future. But don’t worry, I have your solution.
Step 1: On release of new recipies, find out if any offer significant profits.
Step 2: Buy lots of whatever materials are used to make those recipies.
Step 3: Sell those materials when they peak.
Step 4: Watch the crafters profit and then get banned.
Step 5: Watch yourself profit and not get banned.
Problem solved…kinda.
Since this is such an unintended exploit, I think they should just fire the person responsible.
I like this.
Crafters know the mechanics (and costs) of crafting, if a recipe does not follow the mechanics such as the snow flake one, then a crafter knows immediately that something isn’t right with it.
Most if not all of the snowflake recipies require less stuff when compared to existing recipies. For example, Giver’s insignias require 8 snowflakes, when the others require 15 of that tier’s materials. It was no accident making these recipies cheaper, but ANet later regretted that for the most profitable ones.
That’s ridiculous. So if there is a new crafting recipie that crafters can actually make money from, they shouldn’t use it for risk of being banned? I bet the people who bought and sold pristine snowflakes weren’t banned.
In a transaction between two people where one has a advantage by controlling a resource with out reasonable competition, the person who is forced to make an uneven trade comes away feeling negatively while the person who Controlled the resource gets additional income giving them a positive feeling about the trade.
That must explain all those threads titled “I just bought my precursor and it kittened me off”. No, if the buyer would end up unsatisfied, then he woudn’t make the purchase in the first place. Duh?
I think like most people we don’t like our enjoyment of the game to be negatively effected by other peoples enjoyment of the game.
I guess you’re referring to those who buy and sell items for profit. When you farm items, do you give them away? It seems by your logic not giving them away will negatively effect other people’s enjoyment of the game. If you sell the items, they lose gold, but if you give them away, they save gold, which according to you improves their enjoyment of the game.
…inflation in the market that is purely speculative and/or manipulative.
Citation needed. There is speculation, and people do buy out items to sell later, but inflation is mostly caused by an increased gold supply that allows people to spend more on items. As I have said in other threads, the people with precursors can’t simply list them at thousands of gold. To make money requires a buyer.
This isn’t a free market.
Correct, but it is apparently still too free for some players including yourself.
Did you know that in the real world there are government agencies that look to protect consumers against monopolies, insider trading, and Index manipulation? It’s not a free market.
No I didn’t know that since the government actually does the opposite. A free market would be a significant improvement.
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So many players hate free trade…a sad reflection of society today.
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Is is normal to post a stack of items for 2.5s and for it to then be bought out a second later for 11s each? I mean when the highest offer is 2.1s? You’d have to manually go in and make that offer, right? Because a simple click of “buy now” would have scooped them up at 2.5s each, yes?
No that doesn’t sound normal. Maybe you’re right about this being a bug which would also explain the absurd price increase to 70s.
Well that was a quick 4g after hitting the three potato farms. Do people just buy whatever is listed without even looking at the price?
@Nike Nice, too bad I have no alts :p
EDIT: Sorry, I shouldn’t have compared buy offers due to “fake” ones being placed. Still my point stands. There are far more people who want the staff than there are available to sell. Scarcity results in high prices, and even without the traders you still wouldn’t get one without a lot of gold (or luck, of course).
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I think all DR that is not clearly defined should be removed. The daily achivement is a form of DR that few complain about because it has a clear starting point and a clear reset time. While removing DR will give bots more items, it will also give legitimate players more items as well, meaning the bots will get less gold per item as a result.
Well the rarity of precursors is ANet’s problem, but so many players want to blame traders instead. As if keeping the sale price lower means they’ll get one…wrong. They would be bought out by the players who need them and can afford them, and then there would be zero on the TP. So a few of the richer players would have their precursor, and the casual players who are complaining now would still continue to complain.
If only sellers dictate prices, explain why precursors are not thousands of gold or more.
After 20 uses of the “extremely efficient” black lion sickles, I didn’t get any passion flowers.
People aren’t rational; that’s why. Some will gladly pay 40s for a minor rune even though cheaper ones can give the same stat benefits.
Zelda’s Lullaby (full) — http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qPtuOfQbyI
(Parenthesis = high octave); {Bracket = low octave}
{6} {8} {5} {4} {5} {6} {8} {5} {6} {8} 5 4 {8} {7} {6} {5} {6} {8} {5} {4} {5} {6} {8} {5} {6} {8} 5 4 8 8 7 6 7 6 4 7 6 5 6 5 3 8 7 6 7 6 4 8 (4)
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I don’t understand the point of magic find replacing other stats. So if you wear a set of MF gear, you’ll get slightly more loot. You’ll also kill slightly slower than berserker gear, resulting in slightly less loot, making the whole thing pointless.
That IS the rare insignia, which I assume has been mislabeled.
I’m assuming the only thing that makes sense to assume, restricting the access of cheaper keys. Lyns was available at the very beginning of Wintersday, so she wasn’t disabled for technical reasons. If you deny this has anything to do with keys, I’m curious why you think she was disabled.
I’ve gotten 6 so far, but the worst 4 are probably less than 50G combined. With some precursors being so valuable and so rare, you would have to record a rediculously large sample size to even come close to knowing your average return.
Even with better drop rates, lower recipie requirements, and reliable farming areas (all which I support), there will always be a need for the TP unless you intend to be horribly inefficient by vendoring items you don’t want to hold any more of. And quit this “evil rich people” attutude. Unlike real life, there is no use of force (government) giving them an unfair advantage. Maybe if the “large majority who makes a pittance” would stop directly buying/selling everything and use more buy/sell orders, they wouldn’t be so broke.
To the super hardcore crowd that expects high standards from completely random people: stop pugging. As I said before, this change will make it much easier for you and your friends/guildmates to progress together.
I don’t want to have to deal with someone who doesn’t have the necessary gear, experience and player skill required for higher level fractals.
Then don’t? The upcoming patch will make it so much easier for premade groups to progress together.
We sure do have a lot of anti-capitalism in this forum. How about blaming ANet for making recipies requiring stacks of items you might get at a rate of 1 per hour, rather than players who are good at making money?
Does restarting the game solve the problem?
I don’t think there is any “undisclosed behavior”; making and salvaging the items WAS the “exploit”. I think Aura mentioned the solution to avoiding this problem in the future though. Simply buy whatever items will be used by some new efficient recipe, and sell them when they peak. The potential for profit is huge, and the risk of being punished is absolutely zero, since Anet does not consider “playing the TP” an exploit.
Stop saying it’s a loop…if it was a loop, ectos would have crashed to vendor value. Instead, they were leveling off at around 25s some time before the recipies were disabled. The title is misleading.
Adding in one charge of a black lion salvage kit, that isn’t “almost nothing”, and mithril ore did rise significantly as a result. John Smith has implied that ANY use of a future recipe that is more efficient than currently existing recipies is an exploit subject to a potential ban. The infinite loop argument does NOT apply because this was NOT an infinite loop. If it were, ectos would have crashed to under a few silver.
Well I’m glad my jewelcrafting is 0 and I didn’t know about it earlier, because I did not think it was an exploit (salvaging has a cost so it’s not an infinite loop), and I certainly would have made lots of those trinkets. Does your statement mean anyone who made those will be banned?
This is a common deceptive trick used by buyers to get sellers who are used to undercutting by 1c to sell directly to the buyer.
It’s not an exploit any more than black lion keys from Lyns was an exploit (although that also has been disabled). Anet makes new items that make some other items easier to get, and then they later say “whoops we didn’t mean that (even though they originally did), and you’re a bunch of exploiters”. I’ve made decent money recently from the mystic forge, but I’d never ever make a forum post about the specifics of it because Anet will likely change things and call it an exploit. Maybe I should become a TP flipper or maybe a pump and dumper who spams the forums with “buy this now”. Anet doesn’t seem to interfere there (which besides the forum spam is a good thing).
So crafting and salvaging are exploits now? LOL.
It’s the fine material promotion, same as other fine materials.
The listing fee is 5%.
Those buy orders don’t go up because crafters are actually selling to them often enough to keep them that low. So no, they aren’t going to raise their offer for the sellers, just to stay above the other buyers. If you can’t make profit on something then make something else.
I find it eaiser to watch his buffs than watch his animations. As soon as he gains protection, dodge.
In my last two fights with this boss we kited him into the right side room and ran out only when he dropped the hammer. The other mobs didn’t follow us into the room either time. A party member became stuck inside an unbreakable cage, but as a memser I was able to port him out.
. . . inserted a rune in it . . .
That’s why.
I don’t like it.
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