Guild Wars 2

@Oolune: Actually we’re not backpedaling, we’re having to clarify to people who seemingly only read the bullet point and not the actual explanation beneath said point. People are also taking things entirely too literally, assuming we’re kittens on any of those points. Should he have put the minor things that annoy us into that list? Maybe not, but he qualified each of those in the explanation with “This is more of an annoyance than anything.”

So if people actually had some reading comprehension this thread would still be on the first page.

@SkyChef: Again goes to reading comprehension, nowhere are we requiring people to do anything other than be reasonable and listen to how we, the majority of the group, are going to be running the dungeon. If they have a problem with that they can leave. Yes, we do need PUGs, because the game’s instances are built around 5 people and we came from another game and there are only 3 of us.

We have resorted to doing dungeons with just the 3 of us because we haven’t wanted to deal with other people, but guess what? That’s not ideal. And our “guild not being good enough” has nothing to do with our lack of wanting certain types of people in our guild. Are you implying that we’re wrong because we want people to play a certain way, yet you’re sitting there telling us to suck it up and play with certain people all the time? Hi kettle, I’m pot, did you know you’re black?

Almost all of the negative responses in this thread have come down to taking things way too literally and poor reading comprehension.

LordByron you are clearly incapable of comprehending the point of this topic and are misinterpreting what we are saying, as well as being straight up incorrect at points.

ToS is useless? Oh ok. The very fact that you are sitting here defending using glitching on encounters that aren’t that hard to begin with completely boggles my mind and invalidates anything you have to say.

Mossman is incredibly easy to dodge. Whether he’s invisible or not, all you have to do is dodge a few seconds after he cloaks. It’s not rocket science and you don’t need to glitch to beat him.

There was never a point where Cliffside “forced you to wipe”. Unless you’re talking about the person with the hammer falling off the cliffs, in which case that is an acceptable consequence for somebody screwing up. I guess you’re saying you HAVE to dupe the hammer? No. You don’t.

Explain to me why WE should leave, when WE are the majority of the party and WE made the party. That doesn’t make any sense. You are arguing for the sake of arguing and are completely incoherent in parts of your posts.

@Lambros: Magic Find is a terrible stat and using Magic Find gear in a grou kitten elfish and there is no excuse for it. It doesn’t help anybody else in the group but yourself and lowers your efficiency by a significant amount, causing things to take more time and/or leading to more deaths.

The thing about Rangers is that 90% of the Rangers we’ve encountered all use only Longbow, don’t swap weapons and in general are terrible players, but like I said, we don’t kick people just because they’re on a specific class. We don’t even generally kick people for playing badly, we just don’t want anything to do with them after the run is over.

@Mark: I disagree. Every encounter in this game can be melee’d, as is being constantly proven with the videos that crop up with people accomplishing amazing things that other people have written off as “impossible”. I agree that is definitely advantageous to have a ranged weapon on hand at all times, as you should be flexible in your play style if the situation demands it. However our issue comes from people that only use ranged attacks when they have alternatives that are way more effective at the time.

That being said, there are a lot encounters that it is definitely easier to ranged attack than it is to melee. The easy way however isn’t always the best way.

As to the comment about dungeons, all 3 of us have the Dungeon Master title so we’ve done everything.

EDIT: @ Geofrroy: All of those points are things that you’re assuming we’re being unreasonable about. We get that crap happens and we don’t expect perfection and you’re taking some of those points way too literally.

As for Hounds of Balthazar: It ALWAYS takes the spot of an elite that is beneficial to the party.

—Glitching

respect your party will…..
Expecially since sometimes glitch are workaround to other glitch that makes things unnecessary difficult for players but are on “the list of things to do….” (as often happens when glitches are against players )

Um. Newsflash: Glitching is never a valid strategy, especially when in most cases nowadays it is used simply to save some time. I’m 99% sure that it’s against the ToS as well. What happens when they fix the glitch you’ve been using to breeze through a particular fight? You are left with a player who doesn’t understand the mechanics of a boss and is way less useful than he could be if he had just not been glitching it in the first place.

We’ve had personal experience with this on Mossman. People had gotten so used to getting underneath that bridge that when we said we weren’t going to do use that glitch, they repeatedly died because they didn’t know how to dodge his attacks, thus wasting everybody’s time and being a detriment to the group.

So no, we don’t have to “respect that our party will”, because that’s not a valid strategy and we refuse to participate in it, if you don’t like that, you can leave the party.

TLDR
I think its perfectly acceptable to report you for griefing in most cases you when boot people …..

Also i think you should read etiquettes on dungeon running rather than writing….

It would makes things better for Others, but for you also when you read misconceptions you are not aware of…..

If you can report us for “griefing” (I really think you should look up the definition of that word), then it is also perfectly acceptable for us to report each of the people we kick for “griefing” because they are being a detriment to our group and causing us trouble while playing the game.

You seem to have quite a lot of misconceptions yourself.

I would also like to point out that we never claimed not to be elitists, but we’re not unreasonable people in the slightest. We don’t demand anything other than you know how to play the game and you don’t waste our time. We don’t attempt to quantify skill levels because that varies person to person. If you’re making an honest attempt to learn how to play we appreciate that as well.

@Whoever was arguing the semantics of common sense:

You must be the only human being I know that was born with common sense then. Common sense can be common sense without everybody knowing it already. You see, people need to learn common sense, they don’t just magically have it. So yes you can in fact be informative while teaching about common sense. You are arguing semantics and nitpicking on word usage which means the entire point of the post went over your head.

@Whoever said this was a wasted thread:

I agree, it’s a shame that people immediately screamed elitist, as if that somehow makes our points any less valid. Just because you don’t like a certain group of people doesn’t mean you can’t learn from them or that they are wrong.

Post 2 of 2

LordByron.8369:

the actual reason is that you are an elitist in the worst meaning of the word…
There are things in your reasoning that are not only your personal distorted view of the game but also really shows lack of experience….

The worst thing is when you meet a newbie (in the good meaning) thinking he is a pro….this may be the case….

You fail to qualify any of this with examples so I’m just gonna write this comment off as trolling. You also seem incapable of voicing your opinion without being insulting to others, it’s something you should probably work on.

—Arguing about how the dungeon is being run

you kick people….and you decide how to do things …. ._. maybe there is a better way and you still don t want to hear it?

We’re perfectly open to suggestions, we don’t kick people for voicing an opinion, we kick people for continually arguing on a matter without providing anything to the discussion other than “Well I don’t like how you guys do it so I’m just gonna say so repeatedly and argue about it for no reason.” Way to take this point way out of context.

—Consistently not raising

This is quite noobish….

Some build/classes cannot afford to stand still to raise in the middle of a fight…
I play mesmer and ele….while ele is one of the best profession at ressing and i manage to recover desperate situation, my mesmer cannot even sustain 2 hits…..

1st rule do not risk to be downed to ress someone……was written months ago by first dungeon runners and actually there was no need for….

Understand that some classes are made to deal damage and other to survive….
Do you prefer having 2-3 downed players instaed of 1?

Again, taken out of context. We don’t expect you to drop everything to raise a downed person. We do expect that if the monster isn’t targeting you and/or you have the means to do so quickly, you should probably be helping raise instead of just standing there shooting at the mob. If you’re being targeted by the monster and somebody goes down it is now your job to keep it off of the downed people until they can get up.

Your comment about how certain classes are made to only deal damage and others to survive is completely wrong. There may be classes that do certain things better than others, but every class has the potential to fulfill any role to an extent.

—Consistently typing during fights

communication…nuff said….if you are not good enough to type and play its your problem.
(i play an ele too and one of the few running dungeon with a balanced build and D/D using combos and stuff…)

Again, taken out of context. If you need to communicate something during a battle, that’s fine. What’s not fine is taking the time to ping drops or talking about inane crap that isn’t relevant to what’s currently happening in a heated battle. If there is downtime during whatever you’re doing, then go ahead and make light conversation, but don’t do it in the middle of something that requires a certain degree of concentration.

—Misusing timewarp

use your own mesmer ……you possibly don t know what is the right way to use it…
It may be used to ress someone or may be a cooldown tactic.
OR may invoolve something you don t know….

How about people kicking you when you use the wrong skill?

Once again, mistakes will be made, nobody is perfect. But repeatedly putting timewarp on yourself when you’re not standing with the group has no place in a game that is centric on group play. We’re not talking about using it to raise somebody, or accidentally hitting the wrong button. We’re talking about repeated misuse of an ability that benefits the entire team by only using it on yourself.

Saying “use your own mesmer” is an incredibly childish response. How about the people that are currently playing the class learn to work together with the team instead of being selfish?

Post 1 of 2

@ Ari Kagura:

You literally state the reason why we do this in your fifth sentence: We’ve had too many people screw us over, so we eliminate the chance of it happening to us. I don’t see how that’s unreasonable and if you have a problem with it, that’s really not OUR problem. We get on to play the game to accomplish things, not have our time wasted because somebody decided to be a kitten, so we don’t take the chance.

We don’t take issue with people using whatever build they want, and LB’s post came off as a tad more abrasive than it needed to be in that particular area, but between the 3 of us we’ve played almost every class to 80, we know what the traits and weapons do and because of that we have an understanding that certain things simply aren’t as good as the alternative. This game is not perfectly balanced so there are always going to be things that are the “best”. We’re not gonna kick you for being a Longbow ranger or a Scepter guardian. We are however going to be watching how you utilize those skillsets and note if you’re doing it properly. If you aren’t, then we’re not gonna want to have anything to do with you after the run.

This is not a checklist that we require you to read before you join our group. This is common sense that we expect you to know about the game you play and if you don’t, then this post was to educate you so you can better yourself and better your gameplay experience for yourself and the people you play with.

@SkyChef: We do, in effect, do the PUGs we get a favor by being efficient at whatever it is we’re doing without using glitches or bullkitten mechanics so you can actually learn how to play the game properly and efficiently and having a general smooth experience. If you don’t want to be efficient that is totally fine, but that’s not how we play and we’d rather have people in our group that also like to be efficient.

I see that you however feel the need to insult our group because of some perceived insult to yourself.

@Starhawk: We’ve discussed that in length. We don’t come across people who we like and play well enough very often and when we do, they already have a guild and don’t feel like joining ours. We’ve made a few contacts but people quit for various reasons as well. The thought process behind this post was merely to put the information out there. We knew that we were going to get negative responses and we’re prepared for that, those people are probably the very people we’re talking about in the post. This wasn’t posted for their benefit because they don’t agree with us in the first place.

@Demeron: I fail to see how any of what we did was QQing. We made an informative post (majority of the people in the thread have agreed this is all mostly common sense) about some bad habits people tend to have while playing this game, and MMOs in general. It’s up to them and you if you wish to better your experience with the game.

We’re well aware that Scepter guardian has some uses (have yet to see one use that weapon properly though), and like I said, we’ll never kick somebody just because they’re using a certain build or class. We kick people because they refuse to listen to how we are going to go about things and/or are the sole cause of multiple wipes.

This includes people not reading our gw2lfg.com ad properly. We always state in our ad that we are not skipping monsters and we are not using glitches. Every other group we get somebody who skips monsters or insists that we use a glitch/exploit. At that point they are given a warning and told that we stated in the ad that we were not doing so. If they refuse to listen then we kick them because they are wasting time sitting past the monsters we are fighting or trying to glitch something and not helping the group.

Again, don’t waste our time and we won’t waste yours.

Munkee.3542:

Kuishen.6140:

As part of LB’s group:

All of these come down to one simple fact: Don’t waste our time. It’s disrespectful.

You waste more people’s time jumping through your moronic obstacle course to join a group than other people waste yours.

I fail to see how common sense is a moronic obstacle course. Of course for some people I suppose that’s true.

Also to the people who say we’re anti-thief. I am a thief. It’s the only class I play. 99% of the Thieves we get as PUGs are complete morons. We don’t kick anybody because they’re on a specific class. We kick people if they refuse to listen to instruction, which leads to a wipe and lots of wasted time.

As part of LB’s group:

All of these come down to one simple fact: Don’t waste our time. It’s disrespectful.

Time isn’t the issue. It’s them telling me I can’t progress past a certain point each day and/or them telling me I have to be a part of a large guild to do certain things.

If I could grind away my ascended gear with my 2 friends in something that doesn’t have a block put in place to where we can only progress a certain amount each day/week, I wouldn’t have an issue.

Darth Llama.9217:

I don’t mean to sound harsh, but if you feel that the process for Ascended Gear is too much then just simply don’t do it. There is absolutely nothing in this game that requires you to have Ascended Gear, the stats are fairly nice but not so much better that you can’t play with far easier to obtain exotics instead.

I’m not really sure why people feel they have to have everything in order to succeed in this game. For example, I think the process for Legendary Weapons is completely ridiculous, so I simply don’t do it. I’m more then happy just using my Exotic Weapons and spending my time doing things that are more fun for me.

If the process isn’t something you enjoy, just skip it. It’s really that easy.

Except for, you know, Fractals. Which we enjoy doing when we have competent people. Also we don’t settle for second-best, that’s not who we are and not how we want to play. We joined this game because it had a gear plateau that was fairly casual and we could enjoy the game simply for what it was instead of worrying about grinding gear, which is exactly what we’d be doing when we’re getting to the point of only getting on to do Dailies.

Not having the best gear means we’re not playing the best way possible, which is how we play our games. All I want to know is if they are going to continue to add more ways to obtain this gear other than teaming up with people we don’t like or getting on to do Dailies everyday for 3+ months per character.

We’re in our own guild, we have the first tier of Guild Missions unlocked. We’re not looking to merge with other guilds. If we happen to find people that we like and play the game well then we make an effort to invite them to play with us regularly, except we rarely find people that meet those two requirements and when we do, they either leave for bigger guilds or stop playing.

Also only half of my post was in reference to PUGs.

We don’t want to take a break because the alternative to obtaining certain Ascended gear is a straight up time block. If we take a break we fall behind and we’re right back where we started. We don’t want to create new characters because with the current system it requires like 3 months of doing Dailies every day to outfit a new character with those Ascended items.

As for gear takeing time to get. Who cares! You dont need it to complete content. And just through standard play you will have it eventually

We care, we don’t want to have to wait 3+ months to outfit each new character with the best gear simply because we have no other alternatives that we can do without going through the painful process of doing things with PUGs.

Are you going to continue adding new ways to obtain Ascended Gear?

I would like an answer to the above question because with the advent of Laurels and Guild Missions my two friends and I are thinking of taking a break from the game until you add ways to obtain the best gear where we don’t have to rely so heavily on other people.

We’re getting sick and tired of dealing with PUGs for content, because most of the players we get are absolutely terrible and our Blocked lists are growing far larger then they should be.

Here’s why I ask though: We like your game. We want to keep playing your game, but with certain Ascended gear gated behind systems where we’d fall significantly behind if we took a break (Laurels), we’re beginning to wonder if we should just quit altogether. None of us want to even level new characters because of this and we don’t want to play the game just for Dailies because that would make us hate your game and we don’t want that.

So are you going to add alternative ways to attain ascended gear or is it going to remain gated behind content that relies on us having to form PUGs with people that are only causing us grief?

Inb4 Elitist: All we ask is that people don’t waste our time. If you are causing us to wipe on things we know we are capable of with competent people, you are wasting our time.

If this were any other MMO I wouldn’t be making a post like this because I expect certain content to be gated behind certain restrictions like requiring a certain number of people or what have you, but seeing as how those were things you promised NOT to do I have to ask the question, if you’ve decided to go in a different direction then you previously intended, fine, it’s disappointing, but fine.

Phoebe Poison.4875:

Kuishen.6140:

The fact is that WvW kills don’t belong in the PvE dailies

Wait, did I miss the part when they added WvW dailies? Because then maybe your point would be valid. These are not PvE dailies, these are dailies for everything that’s not sPvP, that includes PvE AND WvW. You’re still in the better position, you have ONE daily that you can’t do in PvE, while WvWers sometimes can’t even finish their required 5 without going into PvE.

It would actually be cool if the pool consisted of 10 objectives, 5 PvE and 5 WvW ones (10 invaders killed, 10 dolyaks stopped/escorted, 10 dances on enemies corpses, 10 CC enemy off the ledge in JP), so you could either do them completely in your preferred game mode or you could mix and match. Or just make WvW dailies separate, like sPvP ones.

Probably not gonna happen though, who cares about WvWers while PvErs need more pink rings and kitten.

Sounds like somebody is mad.

The simple solution to my complaint is to take off the achievement points for the rest of them after you complete the 5 to get your laurel. I don’t understand how that could possibly inconvenience anybody and it would make people like myself happy.

Your complaint with the PvE only dailies is that ANet isn’t catering to people who WvW only, a relatively small portion of the population of the game. My complaint is that they’re also not catering to the achievement hunters in the game, we technically want the same thing. lol

EDIT: Also I have yet to see a daily where you couldn’t get 5 of them in WvW so that argument is kind of fail.

Olvendred.3027:

Kuishen.6140:

I don’t think you get it.

Achievement points aren’t just “a little something extra” for some people. Just because you don’t understand the need to complete certain objectives, imaginary or not, doesn’t make my point any less valid.

The fact is that WvW kills don’t belong in the PvE dailies and the Personal Story Completion is down right asinine.

If you feel compelled to get all the achievement points, then you’d be in WvW anyway to, for instance, get your ‘1,000,000 supply used on siege’ achievement and title. And all the other WvW achievement points.

Difference being that what you’re talking about doesn’t have a time limit on it. I can get the WvW achievements on my own time, I may not want to do WvW some days.

ProxyDamage.9826:

Kuishen.6140:

Achievement points aren’t just “a little something extra” for some people.

That’s their problem. No content is gated behind it, so no, nobody has to do them.

I’m sorry, I know OCD sucks, but that’s not the developers (or any other player’s) problem.

Except it could be solved completely by removing any extra achievement points once you’re done with the 5 options you choose to get your laurel. Simple solution and everybody is happy.

Also isn’t it their intent to make some sort of system that rewards you for how many achievement points you have in the future? They talked about this when they first announced laurels, so depending on what that is, there could be “gated” content behind it.

PopeUrban.2578:

Kuishen.6140:

Blacklight.2871:

The reason you can select just some of the achievements to qualify for your daily is so that people wouldn’t feel forced to do activities they don’t like. If there were additional significant rewards for completing all of them, then people would feel the need to complete all of them, and we’d be back to square one.

Achievement points are significant to certain people and I’m not particularly happy with being forced to do WvW (a pvp gamemode) for PvE achievements, I also know people that aren’t happy they should have to create a new character or shout for help to do the Personal Story Achievement part of it.

They need to remove the Personal Story Completion achievement from Dailies completely and if they insist on having WvW be a part of the PvE Dailies then they need to change it to something other than player kills.

Options could include: 5 Guard NPC kills, or 2 Supply Camp Captures, or 3 Guard Flag Captures.

Those type of objectives can be done independent of how well your server does in WvW, aren’t dependent on being skilled in PvP and are relatively non-invasive.

They also encourage people to actually play WvW correctly instead of zoning in and asking where the zergs are and running with them hoping to get some kill credits.

I don’t think you get it.

The whole point of “Do five of eight for your daily award” was specifically so that the could add things like WvW kills, story, crafting, kill mobs in zone X, etc, without forcing you to do them. That’s exactly why all you get for going above and beyond is just a few achievement points and a little XP. You’re meant to pick five, but you get a little something extra for doing… a little something extra.

I don’t think you get it.

Achievement points aren’t just “a little something extra” for some people. Just because you don’t understand the need to complete certain objectives, imaginary or not, doesn’t make my point any less valid.

The fact is that WvW kills don’t belong in the PvE dailies and the Personal Story Completion is down right asinine.

Blacklight.2871:

The reason you can select just some of the achievements to qualify for your daily is so that people wouldn’t feel forced to do activities they don’t like. If there were additional significant rewards for completing all of them, then people would feel the need to complete all of them, and we’d be back to square one.

Achievement points are significant to certain people and I’m not particularly happy with being forced to do WvW (a pvp gamemode) for PvE achievements, I also know people that aren’t happy they should have to create a new character or shout for help to do the Personal Story Achievement part of it.

They need to remove the Personal Story Completion achievement from Dailies completely and if they insist on having WvW be a part of the PvE Dailies then they need to change it to something other than player kills.

Options could include: 5 Guard NPC kills, or 2 Supply Camp Captures, or 3 Guard Flag Captures.

Those type of objectives can be done independent of how well your server does in WvW, aren’t dependent on being skilled in PvP and are relatively non-invasive.

They also encourage people to actually play WvW correctly instead of zoning in and asking where the zergs are and running with them hoping to get some kill credits.

Robert Hrouda.1327:

@Kuishen

Thanks for the feedback. I noticed however you mention that your necro minions were causing ectoplasms. I built it specifically so that only players can draw ectoplasms off – that way rangers, mesmers, and necros wouldn’t enrage their party just by playing. I think someone in your party may have been attacking when they shouldn’t have been.

It’s a possibility, but since almost every other facet of that fight is broken I’d hope you would at least double check to make sure that function is working as intended.

You made one of the few things my group genuinely enjoyed doing together an absolute chore and this is very upsetting because I’m sure that wasn’t even your intent, but it happened because of the poor implementation of some good ideas. I sincerely hope you intend to adjust this further. I don’t expect you to return it to the way it was but as it stands the dungeon is unacceptable. It’s not that it’s too hard, it’s not that the ideas were bad, it’s just that you did it poorly and it needs some serious adjustments and a lot of these adjustments waste everybody’s time for no good reason.

AC was the most balanced dungeon in the game as far as effort:reward ratio and difficulty (could be easy with competent people, but could give you trouble without competent people), and I hope that you return it to that former glory as the most polished dungeon in the game, but for now it is most definitely not anymore.

TO REITERATE: I AM NOT SAYING THE DUNGEON IS TOO HARD AND I LIKE THE CORE IDEAS BEHIND THE CHANGES TO THE BOSS FIGHTS. THE PROBLEM IS THE NUMEROUS CHANGES THAT WERE ADDED SIMPLY TO WASTE PLAYER’S TIME AND THE BUGGY NATURE OF CERTAIN MECHANICS CAUSES THINGS TO BE NOT FUN.

(Post 3 of 3)

Colossus Rumblus:

It was amusing seeing all those red circles for the first time, I’ll give you that. However you need to choose between making a monster have an instant-kill move or have extremely powerful regular attacks, you cannot have both on the same monster, that is bad design.

-Colossus’s regular attacks do way more damage then is necessary. This wouldn’t be so bad if we had room to move around inside of Grast’s shield bubble, but there is little margin for error if you’re going to allow a monster to move around and attack while channeling an instant-kill attack.

-I understand that you allow Colossus to move around after starting the boulder drop attack but allowing him to knock you out of the shield into certain death completely? You have to allow him to move so that he can come to Grast so that people with melee builds can attack him instead of being useless inside the shield, but then you punish melee players by giving him knockback and making his regular attacks do a ridiculous amount of damage. The design choices for this fight are in conflict with one another and in the end it’s more efficient to just sit back and ranged attack him to death then risk death by pure damage or being knocked back into the rocks.

-We didn’t have any problems with Grast dying or the shield not working, but since I’m hearing reports of that too then there is definite need of some adjusting here.

How this could be fixed:

-Lower Colossus’s attack rate OR damage and remove his knockback.
-Lower the spawn rate/radius of the rocks so that if you are skilled enough you won’t die if caught outside the shield bubble.

The minor things:

-Why did you feel the need to give every single Graveling some form of knockback? Nobody likes not having control of their character that often as was evidenced by the complaints about Risen Putrifiers in Orr. This does nothing but waste everybody’s time and is an annoyance that has no place in this dungeon.

-Raising the HP of the Spider and Graveling Hatchlings. Again this does nothing but waste everybody’s time for seemingly no reason, it also makes it nearly impossible to rally yourself if you get downed.

-Raising the spawn rate of the Graveling Hatchlings and their attack power. Why was this needed? Hatchlings were already a threat if you left them alone for too long, why did you feel the need to make them a threat even in small numbers? You also broke the framerate of your game in the process, so this serves zero purpose.

-Increasing the damage and number of the poison fields that Spider Queen puts out. This wouldn’t be so bad if by simply attacking the Spider Queen we didn’t push her into a corner/wall and make it so the fields are almost constantly on top of her, thus once again making Ranged Attacks the most efficient way of dealing with a boss. I do appreciate the sound effect for the web attack though, it’s nice.

-Graveling Stalkers. You turned several mobs in the dungeon into the final boss of CoF Path 3, the path that nobody runs specifically because the boss takes too long to kill because it goes invulnerable every few seconds. This serves no purpose other than to waste people’s time, so why did you change it? I realize that it doesn’t go invulnerable if nobody gets hit by that attack, but that is asking too much of people unless they are in a static together which brings me to my last point.

-You made this dungeon completely un-friendly for any form of Pick Up Group. All of the changes require coordination that any number of random people simply do not have and that goes directly against your overall design philosophy. I have 2 friends I run with regularly, which means we need 2 random people to get a full group. Those 2 random people were the cause of most of our deaths when we did this revamped dungeon, and it wasn’t even that they were bad players, it was just that they couldn’t communicate as well with us. I suspect that even having one member in a group that isn’t established and knows how the group works together would cause unnecessary frustration. You took one of the few things in the game that was completely PUG friendly and made it a chore for them.

How to fix these:

-Return the Spider and Graveling Hatchling HP back to the original values.
-Spawn rate of Graveling Hatchlings can stay the same if the above is met and you fix the framerate issue.
-Remove the knockback from regular Gravelings.
-Remove the invulnerability from Graveling Stalkers
-Make Spider Queen easier to position and give her some form of stability so that when people hit her she doesn’t continually move backwards.
-I haven’t fought Troll yet so I don’t know if that needs to be adjusted, but if it’s anything like the above points please take a look at that too.

(Post 2 of 3)

“I feel as though the people saying these changes to AC are good are those who are only planning on running the paths once in a while and want a unique boss battle to remember.”

That is the sentiment of a friend I agree with on the matter. I’m going to explain in very clear detail why the changes made to AC today are misguided, especially for people like my little 3-man static that run AC almost every night.

I’m going to start out by saying that I do not think the ideas behind the changes to the 3 main boss battles were bad to begin with, but as almost everything that is wrong with this game, it’s the implementation that is the problem.

The mechanics behind the 3 Graveling boss battles are unique and could even be fun, but they were implemented poorly and because of this, what could have been an engaging and fun experience was made to be exasperating and a chore.

Let’s start from the top though with the boss battles and then work our way down into the minor changes that were made that were/are completely unnecessary.

Howling King:

The lasers were a nice touch and had everybody on vent laughing maniacally. However that laughter was soon replace with expletives and utter bewilderment at what was taking place on screen. We had read beforehand that you need to kite the adds into the fiery circles to kill them. As we looked around frantically for the fiery circles we finally spotted one and quickly ran to it, only for it to disappear immediately. All the while our team was being knocked around like rag dolls and all of us were experiencing painful FPS drops due to the sheer amount of mobs on screen.

To put it simply:

-The fiery circles didn’t appear frequently enough, they weren’t in useful locations, and they disappeared far too quickly to be of any use.

-The amount of knockback/knockdown is absolutely ridiculous, there is no amount of stability or stun breakers that can prepare you for this and makes actually getting rid of the adds, much less damaging the boss a chore.

-The increased HP on the hatchlings makes it impossible to self-ressurect yourself by killing one of them for a rally, you simply can’t do it anymore, which means when you do go down you are useless to your team and they now have to risk their lives trying to save you.

The two latter points make it so that certain classes are far more beneficial than others and that goes against Anet’s philosophy of content that anybody can do reasonably.

How this could be fixed:

-Lower adds hp and spawn rate so that the fiery circles aren’t necessary if you have skilled players.
-Have the adds target one person and that person can be in charge of kiting them into the circles.
-Have the rings of fire last significantly longer and have some actual pattern to them instead of being randomly placed and only lasting a short amount of time.

Ghost Eater:

The concept behind this battle is genius… the implementation leaves something to be desired. After we figured out how to go about beating this boss we had trouble because it is wrought with glitches and un-intuitive design.

-Ghost Eater himself glitched out several times during the battle, sitting there doing nothing. This was a problem because…

-The traps would randomly stop working. If this was intended there is no visual or audio cue as to why the trap wasn’t going off and if we were supposed to move to the next one. We also couldn’t do anything for a while because of the above point and couldn’t get Ghost Eater to move to another trap.

-Pet classes actually harm you in this fight. We had a minion master necro who wouldn’t listen and his minions would continually attack Ghost Eater and spawn way more Ectoplasms then was necessary and ended up getting a few of us killed because of the stacks of vulnerability they put on you.

This fight deliberately discriminates against certain classes because classes with Pets can’t properly control them. If you are going to make a fight where you can’t progress if you do not meet certain conditions then you need to make sure that those conditions aren’t going to glitch out. I don’t expect perfection Anet, but I do expect you to to be as sure as possible that those glitches aren’t going to happen to something that can potentially ruin a run.

How this could be fixed:

-Change the turrets back to manual and have it so it takes a few hits to take down Ghost Eater’s shield.
-Failing above, change it so that one person can lift AND pull the ectoplasms.
-Make the traps charge after one ectoplasm is absorbed.

(Post 1 of 3)

As an aside I did end up getting tournament rewards like 2 hours later when I logged on again, but yeah, this is still bullkitten.

Let me paint a picture for you:

Me and 2 other friends go to do a free tournament for the monthly pvp achievement, this is our first time delving into the pvp tournaments. We win a fairly close first match. We all comment on how awesome this is. We then proceed to win our second match after making a pretty large comeback. We’re ecstatic and glad that we decided to do this because it is great fun.

The option to join Round 3 pops up.

After hitting “Go Now” we all get teleported back to Heart of the Mists. Wait, that’s not right, what’s going on? Network Error pop up. Oh kitten The pop up to join Round 3 appears again, we all hit “Go Now”, all get network error. This happens several times until the counter eventually hits zero and my two friends get sent to Round 3. Meanwhile I’m stuck in Heart of the Mists and get one final Network Error and then no more pop ups.

At this point I’m pretty distressed and angry. I log in and out a couple of times, only to get a pop up to join Round 1. What? No. That’s wrong game. This happens for the next 8 minutes as I listen to my friends on Ventrilo losing a match that we probably could have won. They proceed to get 2nd Place Tournament Chests and I get nothing.

Anybody else encounter this problem? I’m quite pissed about this and I’m now turned off from doing tournaments again until I at least see a dev comment on whether or not this is a common issue.

Synitare.3176:

Kuishen.6140:

DeadlyRush.1620:

Kuishen.6140:

You are all incredibly infuriating.

Calm down. You are all making wild assumptions and accusations with literally zero basis.

Needing ascended gear to do anything in Fractals? No evidence that this is the case.

Taking a break and coming back to find you can’t do anything because gear is outdated? No evidence this will be the case.

Ascended Armor being more powerful than Exotics? No evidence that this is the case. Because if it’s going to work like the accessories, then you can’t put runes on them and there are stats on runes that are simply miles ahead of a few extra raw stat points.

Gated content? No evidence this will be the case.

I like wild conjecture as much as the next guy but you guys are being some of the most whiny, self-entitled and generally unpleasant people I have ever seen on any MMO forum. By all means continue battering the developers that are giving you all of this content for free.

ANet please don’t listen to these idiots and do whatever you want because contrary to popular belief, this is your game and it doesn’t belong to these ridiculous whiners.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

Please see the picture and do the math. Thank You.

Please learn reading comprehension. Thank You:

Because if it’s going to work like the accessories, then you can’t put runes on them and there are stats on runes that are simply miles ahead of a few extra raw stat points.

Yeah sure accessories have a negligible higher amount of stats, not game breaking. If the Armor works like the accessories in that picture, there will be no runes on said armor and Runes are way better than those few extra stat points.

…wat.

If armor works as the accessories do, then they will still be better since the stat bonuses will be baked into the items, just like they are for the rings. At worst, you’ll lose the “% chance to do X” bonuses, if even that.

Yes because +X% Boon Duration, +X% Condition Duration, health regen, shouts removing conditions… All of those are so worthless right?

Synitare.3176:

Untouch.2541:

Please do the english.
You are not gated from this content.
If that was the case, it’d be impossible because there’s no way to get anything but rings and back.

Please do the reading.

“Players who wish to delve deep into the Fractals will find that Agony makes progress increasingly difficult, until they reach the point where some defense against this condition is a must”

That is the definition of content gating. So too is releasing thing piecemeal like they are, given that they have also already confirmed that there will be the full range of Ascended items.

Whose to say that you won’t get the gear you need to progress further AS you are delving deeper? kitten Like I said a whole lotta baseless accusations.

You are all incredibly infuriating.

Calm down. You are all making wild assumptions and accusations with literally zero basis.

Needing ascended gear to do anything in Fractals? No evidence that this is the case.

Taking a break and coming back to find you can’t do anything because gear is outdated? No evidence this will be the case.

Ascended Armor being more powerful than Exotics? No evidence that this is the case. Because if it’s going to work like the accessories, then you can’t put runes on them and there are stats on runes that are simply miles ahead of a few extra raw stat points.

Gated content? No evidence this will be the case.

I like wild conjecture as much as the next guy but you guys are being some of the most whiny, self-entitled and generally unpleasant people I have ever seen on any MMO forum. By all means continue battering the developers that are giving you all of this content for free.

ANet please don’t listen to these idiots and do whatever you want because contrary to popular belief, this is your game and it doesn’t belong to these ridiculous whiners.

Bohun Martell.8963:

piitb.7635:

Bohun Martell.8963:

People who left becouse of lack of gear progression will come back.
For a 2 days. They will grind another tier and leave again.
People who are not interested in gear progression would play this game for months. And now they might leave.
I can’t see the reason in this..

Or they will get their ascended rings in a couple runs of fractals before even fully clearing the place and think to themselves…“well that was easy…I complained over that?”

I have made 8’th alt yesterday. Do I have to go through several AC runs again? No. I can Go to COF, if I like it more. I can craft my stuff, I can earn it in WvW.
But I will have to go to fractals. Maybe I will like it. Or maybe not. But when I was buying this game, I was promised I will have a choice. And that’s the point. Broken promise. Maybe Anet will introduce another tier of gear in next 3 months. I don’t know that now.

What? You’d have to do AC again to get AC gear, and CoF to get CoF gear. The main reason of doing dungeons is to get the tokens to get the gear skins specific to that dungeon.

Literally the only difference here is a few stat points.

Whole lotta ASSuming in this thread.

The only even remotely solid argument people have against ANet currently is that they are saying that you might NEED ascended armor with infusions to “complete” Fractals of the Mists.

To them I say this: (Based on the information we have)

It’s a randomized infinite dungeon. First of all you don’t “complete” it because it is infinite. You will get to experience all of the content within that dungeon because of the random factor. The only thing that ascended/infusions MIGHT give you is a chance to go deeper in one run. However based on the fact that you can do all PvE content easily in masterwork gear, I’m just gonna go ahead and assume that like Exotics, it’s simply a way to maximize your performance and give you a bit more padding.

If that is the case then what is the issue? Everybody will get to do everything. A few more stats in WvW is negligible but gives hardcore players something to work towards IF THEY CHOOSE. Sounds like something this game desperately needs.

I have never seen anybody do the “can’t join if you don’t have exotics” thing when shouting for members. If you do, then tell them to kitten off and find another group. Believe it or not, everybody is not an kitten.

@ Coglin: Did you even read my posts? Apparently not. I love how everybody is so quick to condescend to me, thinking themselves smart for pointing out I gambled and lost.

Hurr Durr. I didn’t expect anything. I hoped for a tonic, I haven’t gotten one yet. Oh well. I know how gambling works.

I’m making a suggestion, with an example that what I’m suggesting has been done before. I never complained once.

How about you stop trying to assert your intelligence over the internet by kitten up my thread with assumptions that have no basis.

I don’t believe anybody gave the impression that it worked otherwise. But thank you for the information.

@ Sneski: I’m sure there is a point you’re trying to make, but since nobody has tried to say this isn’t gambling or “change the definition of gambling” I’m not sure why you posted.

I never said this wasn’t gambling. I’m asking the question: Should it be a gamble when you only have a limited time every year to get the reward? I’m also putting forth a reasonable suggestion to make it not so much of a gamble.

@Mulch: Sure, but that’s 4 inventory spaces that could be 1. Also not taking into account the leftovers I have. Also I said I like shiny things.

@Bunnehboo: I’d like to know where in my post I was complaining. I was making a suggestion to make the current system better. You are also assuming that I haven’t been farming all this event has to offer throughout the week. I have but time is growing short so I figured I’d try to get it en masse before the event ends. When something has a clear time limit on it, don’t you think they should put at least some kind of limit on the random factor? Because this only happens once per year, and NEXT year there is going to be even MORE things to do, I’d like to get everything out of this event as possible, but can’t because of a silly decision. Like I said, I understand the importance of RNG systems in an MMO, it keeps people playing (and paying in the instance of chest skins), however I also think that it wouldn’t be hard to reward those who are getting extremely unlucky but are persisting regardless, especially when you can’t continue trying after a certain amount of time. The requirements for the recipe I suggested would not be “handing it” to anybody, seeing as how it took a significant investment to get to that point in the first place. I’ve said it twice, I’ll say it again. They’ve already set the precedent with Mad King Chests..

@BrunoBRS: Investments are gambling of a sort, just with different parameters. I’m making the suggestion that this activity be more like a long-term investment with the gamble to get it quickly instead of straight up gambling. Also your talk about addiction and having a quota are irrelevant. My life is not ruined because I spent a bunch of imaginary currency trying to get an imaginary item. I also didn’t ruin your life by spending the gold, so you have no grounds to suggest that I stop and just give the money to you instead.

Nothing has gone out of hand because I will continue to do this until I get a tonic and once I have it, I won’t have any regrets about spending that much money on it. The point I was making is: It’s not your call to tell other people how to spend their imaginary money in a game and I’m not some random raving lunatic complaining and demanding Anet repay me, so kindly stop kitten up my thread.

@Mars: Not particularly, most reports of people getting it don’t take nearly as long as I and a few others have. Those people would be looking at it the wrong way. You’re gambling to get it quicker, and investing to get it in the long run.

EDIT: @ Rakuza: Yeah it doesn’t bother me that people get lucky. I understand the way gambling works. It would just be nice to have some of it being put towards something rewarding in the long run.

BrunoBRS.5178:

next time you think about spending 25+ gold on something like trick or treat bags, don’t. mail them to me instead. you’ll waste your money all the same, and you’ll make someone happy.

I’m pretty sure I addressed this in my post. It’s my money to with as I like. You don’t go up to rich people in real life and say “Hey instead of investing in that company, why don’t you just give me the money instead, that way if the investment would have turned out poorly, at least you made somebody else happy.” I realize that the anonymity of the internet allows people to say and do things that are generally socially unacceptable but don’t be that guy.

Arysta.9530:

This event is all about being disappointed and frustrated.

I’m not particularly angry or frustrated (though the string of foul language my guildmates had to endure might imply otherwise). I’m just simply giving a suggestion about how this could be handled better and give a minor semblance of “fairness” to a RNG system.

And like I mentioned, the precedent is already there with Mad King Chests.

Still no Endless Tonic.

Look I get the whole random thing, it’s fine to a point. Here’s what I suggest though. If somebody like me gets continually shafted by the RNG, how about you implement something that rewards persistence as well.

I have 250 of each of the 4 regular tonics that come from ToT bags. Put in a recipe at the Mystic Forge where I can put all that junk and get myself an Endless Halloween Tonic.

Recipe would be:

250 Halloween Tonic + 250 Concentrating Halloween Tonic + 250 Candy Corn Tonic + 250 Plastic Spider Tonic.

I don’t think that is too much to ask since the precedent is already there from the Mad King Chests. I have absolutely zero problem with RNG systems in games like this, I’d even venture to say they are necessary, but you could alleviate some headache by implementing a failsafe of sorts.

It’s not even like the above is easy to get either, it literally took me 10k Bags (about 50/50 split between the two types) to get 250 of each type.

Whaddaya say Anet? Pretty please?

(For the people that are going to call me stupid for wasting that much money on such a silly thing, whatever, it’s my money to do with as I please. I could even have been more economic with what I spent on this too but alas I didn’t do enough research first (once I realized it could drop from regular bags I started buying those and selling the junk instead of buying candy corn for the personalized bags). I also like shiny things. An Endless Tonic is a shiny thing, and I’m trying my absolute best to get the most out of this event.)

Sure why not. ^^

More data from tonights runs. Some dungeons were done before I joined and started taking data but this set was started well after 30 mins from their last one. Data reflects 4 of us in our group, one was a random that I did not take data for. This was all our first time doing HoW explorable.

Run 1 HoW Path 1
Start: 9:27 pm End: 10:34 pm
2 got Full rewards (60 Tokens), 2 got 45 Tokens.

Run 2 HoW Path 2
Start: 10:40 pm End: 11:30 pm
3 got Full rewards (60 Tokens), 1 got 30 Tokens.

Run 3 HoW Path 3
Start: 11:34 pm End: 12:31 am
3 got Full rewards (60 Tokens), 1 got 45 Tokens.

Some more data from today’s runs, just after 5 PM PST, all of us had done runs approx. 24 hours earlier throughout the night (aside from the randoms we had to invite, and data does not reflect them, just the 3 of us that do this regularly).

Run 1 CM Story Mode
Start: 5:30 pm End: 5:56 pm
(This data is a “just in case”)

Run 2 CM Path 2
Start: 5:58 pm End: 7:06 pm
All got full rewards (60 Tokens/177k/26s)

Run 3 CM Path 3
Start: 7:22 pm End: 8:08 pm
All got full rewards (60 Tokens/177k/26s)

Run 4 CM Path 1
Start: 8:14 End: 8:59
All got full rewards (60 Tokens/177k/26s)

Run 5 AC Path 1
Start: 9:15 pm End: 9:58 pm
All got full rewards (60 Tokens/177k/26s)

Run 6 AC Path 2
Start: 10:06 pm End: 10:36 pm
One person got full rewards (60 Tokens/177k/26s), two of us got 45 Tokens
We all entered at the same time so even if we completed the dungeon in under 30 mins all of us should have gotten 45, but seeing as how they said you would have to do that twice in a row to trigger the DR system, and we clearly didn’t, it has to be the bug

Run 7 AC Path 3
Start: 10:43 pm End: 11:28 pm
One person got full rewards (60 Tokens/177k/26s), two of us got 45 Tokens
Same conditions as Run 6, we clearly had not completed two dungeons in a row in under 30 mins, but still got hit with DR.

Getting the “Content Disabled” message every single time I kill a Risen Grub in the Orr areas.

I have no problem with this system as long as it works like it is supposed to, and it currently doesn’t.

As Druk said, you shouldn’t punish the players for doing all 3 paths in a row quickly. How fast you complete a path should have absolutely zero to do with the DR system. If I finish a path in under 20 minutes because my entire party is on the ball, nobody died and everybody is doing their part, you should not have the DR punish us UNLESS we attempt to do the same path twice.

Maybe that is what it is intended to do, but since you guys are so unwilling to share how exactly this broken system works we don’t know and it just seems like you guys are in fact punishing people for playing your game well even if they aren’t attempting grind by doing the same path over and over.

(Copy-pasta from the other thread, didn’t see this one.)

Took some data from AC and CM today regarding the DR system, we did them right after it resets (same time as dailies, as was confirmed by a dev in another topic).

3 of us hadn’t done a dungeon in the past 24 hours, other two had done some AC paths around 9 PM PST yesterday (24th). All times are in PST.

Run 1 AC Path 1
Start: 5:15 PM End: 5:56 PM
All 5 of us got full rewards 177k/26s/60 Tokens

Run 2 AC Path 2
Start: 6:00 PM End: 6:29 PM
All 5 of us got full rewards 177k/26s/60 Tokens

Run 3 AC Path 3
Start: 6:33 PM End: 7:05 PM
All 5 of us got full rewards 177k/26s/60 Tokens

Run 4 CM Story Mode (for a friend)
Forgot to write times for this since it seemed unimportant until… (But you can see we did it between 7:05 and 7:45 PM)

Run 5 CM Path 1
Start: 7:45 PM End: 8:45 PM
1 person got full rewards, 2 of us got Half Rewards (30 Tokens), 1 of us got Quarter rewards (15 Tokens), and the 5th was a random person.

The person who got 15 tokens hadn’t done any dungeons in the past 24 hours, as was one of the people that got 30 tokens (this being aside from the AC runs we just got done doing). The person who got full rewards had done some AC runs the night previously. So on the last run the DR system was affecting random people in random ways.

So yeah, everything was working as intended until we did CM.

As was pointed out by one of the devs, the majority of people crying had done dungeons last night and before the reset today, but it still looks like there is a bug here.

Took some data from AC and CM today regarding the DR system, we did them right after it resets (same time as dailies, as was confirmed by a dev in this topic).

3 of us hadn’t done a dungeon in the past 24 hours, other two had done some AC paths around 9 PM PST yesterday (24th). All times are in PST.

Run 1 AC Path 1
Start: 5:15 PM End: 5:56 PM
All 5 of us got full rewards 177k/26s/60 Tokens

Run 2 AC Path 2
Start: 6:00 PM End: 6:29 PM
All 5 of us got full rewards 177k/26s/60 Tokens

Run 3 AC Path 3
Start: 6:33 PM End: 7:05 PM
All 5 of us got full rewards 177k/26s/60 Tokens

Run 4 CM Story Mode (for a friend)
Forgot to write times for this since it seemed unimportant until… (But you can see we did it between 7:05 and 7:45 PM)

Run 5 CM Path 1
Start: 7:45 PM End: 8:45 PM
1 person got full rewards, 2 of us got Half Rewards (30 Tokens), 1 of us got Quarter rewards (15 Tokens), and the 5th was a random person.

The person who got 15 tokens hadn’t done any dungeons in the past 24 hours, as was one of the people that got 30 tokens (this being aside from the AC runs we just got done doing). The person who got full rewards had done some AC runs the night previously. So on the last run the DR system was affecting random people in random ways.

So yeah, everything was working as intended until we did CM.

As was pointed out by one of the devs, the majority of people crying had done dungeons last night and before the reset today, but it still looks like there is a bug here.

@Robert Hrouda:

Well that is very clearly not how it’s working so it would go a long way to either acknowledge that there is a bug that is causing people to get hit with the DR system even though they only do one of each path per day, or outline exactly how it’s supposed to work so we can submit accurate bug reports to you guys. We can’t do the latter if we don’t actually know if it’s a bug.

According to the information you gave us here in this thread, it is, but in other threads I see other Devs giving conflicting information.

Can we get a community rep to comment on this? Siege Weapons should not despawn. You cannot get up a defense of Siege Weapons quick enough when the enemy is at your front door. It needs to be there and be ready. At the very least make the despawn timer a LOT longer.

EDIT: Also JoolaPrime is an idiot.

I have a suggestion, put a slight decay on siege weapon life and allow us to repair them, that way if they are left alone for too long they go away but if an attack happens they can be made functional again in a short amount of time.

On Heartseeker missing: It’s not actually missing, it’s hitting off to the side, you can even see the change in the animation. If it misses the mob you’re targeting and you have a mob on either side of you it hits them instead. But if you don’t have another mob around you it appears like a miss since there was nothing to hit on the side. Still a bug and still needs to be fixed.

Dagger Storm: Being interrupted by Pull moves, which should fall under the things Stability blocks. If that is working as intended then that is bullkitten and Dagger Storm is now useless in Orr and PvP.

Bumping this.

Once again clarifying that I am not referring to being hit while under stealth as a bug. I realize that if I run into the path of projectiles or into a ground targeted spell then I will take damage while under stealth.

I am referring to having myself be targeted through the use of clicking on where I am or the Tab key (thus putting an arrow above my head and a circle around my feet) while under the effects of stealth. Which means the enemy can know where I am at all times and even auto-attack me with things like ranged attacks as if I am not invisible.

If that is how the Stealth function is supposed to work, then what exactly is the point of it being in the game?

The exact testing I did to prove this: Went onto an empty sPvP server with a friend, went on opposing teams and met up in the center of the map. After I used a skill that put me under the effects of stealth my friend was able to hit tab and target me (as in I was his current target at the top middle of the screen), and then continue auto-attacking me with his longbow as if I wasn’t invisible.

So after conversing with friends they mentioned that they can target me (Thief) on the opposing team and just keep auto-attacking while I am under the effects of Stealth in Structured PvP.

Did some light testing on an empty server and people on the opposing team can indeed target me via clicking on me or using the Tab key to cycle targets while I am under the effect of Stealth.

This HAS to be a bug because if I can be targeted while under the effects of Stealth, somebody explain to me what exactly the point of being under stealth is? It makes me transparent? It might break a target lock if I’m being targeted and then go into stealth but if they can hit tab once and just keep attacking me as if nothing happened then what is the point? This is a serious issue that I would like addressed or if it is functioning as intended can I get an explanation?

This makes my entire build absolutely useless and stealth in general worthless except in PvE, although as another bug report suggests if something is already using a channeling move on you then it doesn’t break that either so it doesn’t have much utility in PvE either except for resetting aggro.

It is incredibly frustrating using the Stealth skill while downed and have somebody continue to auto-attack me like nothing happened when (I assume) it is supposed to give a short reprieve to be able to teleport away unseen to maybe get yourself back up.