Showing Posts For Lurinna.4306:
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By the way, anyone who says there is no archway period in Lions Arch in GW1, and that it’s just a name, should probably go back to that city and look up.
Is that the arch ?
I think there’s actually two of them. The other is in the opposite direction, over the main gate.
I’m aware that the archway was not present in GW1, but it’s still an important landmark that was obviously inspired by the cities name. And it was completely undamaged by the attack. It’s bizzare they’d tear it down to build some little fountains.
By the way, anyone who says there is no archway period in Lions Arch in GW1, and that it’s just a name, should probably go back to that city and look up.
Has there ever been an explanation for why the large majority of Krytans are pale-skinned?
I’ll invite everyone to see the wiki page on Deborah, and rethink this whitening theory.
And I’d invite you to walk around DR and count the amount of non-white NPCs you see versus the number of white ones, despite Krytans supposedly being in the vast majority.
I’m not a big fan of the new LA. The design is pretty, but it doesn’t really fit the city and feels kinda weird and themeparky. Also, the layout of stuff is a lot less convenient then it was a few days ago.
I think it’s kind of tacky when players try to create a in-universe explanation for Kryta’s whitewashing.
It was done because it sells. Which is gross, but the best thing to do is to leave it at that. Saying, “All the black people turned white because magic!” makes it a zillion times worse.
1. Consortium values nothing but their profit. The Priory saved all they could before the evil, evil, EVIL consortium dropped the pavement over the ruins.
2. The consortium provably asked him to leave.
3. Kidnapped by the consortium to gather information about Evon and make him work for them… even more, that is.
4. Also kicked by the Consortium.
5. Consortium research showed it was good for business.
6. The consortium used bad materials for that one.
7. The consortium took so much resources and money fro mthe city that they can’t aford paying more lionguard structures.
8. Same as 1.
I know you’re joking, but the Consortium don’t own the entire city. They couldn’t just ask Deverol to leave. The old dialogue made a point of saying the island was in her family for generations.
Did you find the explanation for the royal banners while Lion’s Arch was not under Krytan domination?
I like Konig’s interpretation, that they are meant to honor the history of King Doric’s presence in the city.
With absolutely no disrespect intended, this explanation isn’t very consistant. Sea of Sorrows is very firm on the inhabitants of Lions Arch having strong opinions about divesting themselves of the cities royal heritage.
I know you’re trying your best, but this sort of business is making me kind of cynical about Anets interest in maintaining a cohesive world and character pool, rather then just doing… Well, whatever seems cool, and cleaning up later. I know it might not be within your power or something you’re even interested in, but I’d really appreciate it if you guys would go back and put a few explanations for the radical changes in game rather than having us just stab in the dark and hope.
Bringing back some of the old NPC dialogue that important characters would have would help, too. Right now, someone playing for the first time and trying to pick up the lore has no way of knowing who any of the important characters in the city are unless they use the wiki, because almost none of them talk any longer.
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Not a bad effort! Want to try any of the others?
You clever lore hounds seem to be doing just fine fielding the others.
Alright. I don’t mean any disrespect to you guys, just so you know! I know it’s probably a nightmare to account for a ton of characters and story elements while also coordinating amongst yourselves and with seperate art and design teams that probably don’t consider the story their first concern. I just wanted to point it out.
Here’s another one- 9: Why isn’t Magnus missing an eye anymore?
He’s, uh, trying out a new glass eye for feel, though something tells me he’ll decide it doesn’t suit him and return to the old eyepatch look in the near future…
(tugs collar nervously)
Not a bad effort! Want to try any of the others?
Here’s another one- 9: Why isn’t Magnus missing an eye anymore?
No offense – Really, I commend you for trying to adapt – But a lot of those seem like pretty big optimistic streches, considering Anets track record on this sort of stuff.
When was it established that the Zaishen were enemies of the Consortium? I can’t remember a time they were involved with the plot at all.
Also, the fact that they literally changed the name to “Deverol Garden” on the map and added a merchant there that sells flowers as well as some NPCs with dialogue kind of suggests the chapel isn’t coming. I’m getting the increasing sense that Anet redesigned half of the map at the last minute for some reason and disregarded a lot of the old lore around it.
Especially since it doesn’t match the old new-LA concept art at all.
While the new LA is very pretty, some it doesn’t seem… Super well thought out, from a lore standpoint.
1. Why did they literally pave over the priceless ruins of the old royal palace with some random street? It was still intact. Wouldn’t the priory care? What happened to their excavation?
2. What happened to Kerryn Deverol? In the previous patch she was sitting around on her island saying a chapel was going to be airlifted in there (which was sort of confusing in of itself) but now it’s a garden instead and, despite it being named after her, she’s nowhere to be found.
3. What happened to Evon Gnashblades partner? I forget her name – The Sylvari. She’s not in the new building. Did she die? She was in Edge of Destiny, so that seems kinda notable.
4. Where did the Zaishen go? The little half-fort they hung out in is gone, as well. Have they been retconned?
5. Why are multiple Krytan royal banners flying over the entrance to the Eastern Ward? Isn’t LA pretty big on not acknowledging royal authority?
6. A dam has been built over the river near the lighthouse, but water is still somehow flowing through it as normal. What? I guess that’s not quite a lore concern, but still.
7. Where is the Lionguards headquarters, now? It’s not in Fort Marriner anymore.
8. Why did they destroy the, like… Actual “Lions Arch”? The big archway with the Lion statues? Now the name doesn’t really make any sense.
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whoops, double post
The fun of this skill is one of the main reasons I’ve stuck with this class, in spite of all the hard times. I hope Anet will reconsider it’s decision.
Four of my friends quit the game when the megaserver happened and never came back.
I am also upset about this change. By making it extremely time consuming to grind out a viable endgame gear set for hardcore content, it will remove the ability to move between and try out different builds whenever, which was something I really liked about the game. I don’t understand why this is being done.
“Maybe now that you are finished with this nonsense, you can come back to Ascalon and help deal with the filthy Charr infestation.”
That segment was created along with the rest of the Prophecies epilogue much later, around the time of EOTN.
I’m not saying either is right. I’m explicitly saying neither has to be right.
The world where GW1 happened and ended and that was the end and the world where things continued/were retconned onto GW2 can both exist and be equally valid.
But you are wrong. You are not participating in some writing contest, you playing game owned by Anet, on Anet servers. “My game – my rules”.
That’s crazy. An author loses the authority to dictate how their writing is percieved from the moment it goes into the readers brain.
This has nothing to do with canon though. Canon is the continuation of a story. It has always required the official stamp to the texts. For instance I can’t write another book of the Bible and have people believe me without appealing to the author. It’s why people find the Book of Mormon non-canon because they feel it lacks authenticity.
Canon is about the public, it is not about you. It is based solely on majority rules.
You want to separate the universes of all the games. Then go through each game and show me how the lore does not mesh and the source of the games is not authentic.
You’re not quite getting my meaning.
What I’m saying is that it’s silly to say that the newest aspects of Guild Wars, despite being created under fundamentally different conditions, by different people, and at different times, should be considered more valid simply by the fact that they’re newer.
Let me put it this way: I’m not debating that, for example, the Charr being multi-faceted is not true, or “canon”, in GW2. I’m rejecting the idea that them being that way in GW2 retroactively makes them that way in GW: Prophecies when it’s considered as a stand-alone entity, when it obviously wasn’t written with that in mind.
But that doesn’t mean I’m saying it isn’t the new creators right to change things for their story, either. Both the original narrative and updated one can exist both independently and seperately without either ceasing to be legitimate or cancelling the other out. All that means is that one can judge them seperately.
I find the idea of “canon” – That one has to be absolutely true, and the other lies, as if the Guild Wars universe is something that needs to objectively exist as one continuous thing and not just a made up story – To be sort of trite.
You not playing inside your brain, you playing on Anet servers. You free to have any headcanon, but game world is not your head.
Except GW1 still exists…? You can still go and play it and have the universe not be updated.
But you are wrong. You are not participating in some writing contest, you playing game owned by Anet, on Anet servers. “My game – my rules”.
That’s crazy. An author loses the authority to dictate how their writing is percieved from the moment it goes into the readers brain.
Canon is a dumb concept made up by corporations.
Stories are stories.
…………I really hope you are trolling.
I’m not.
The concept of “Canon” didn’t really exist until the 1600s at the earliest, with the advent of the earliest forms of copyright, and even then didn’t become widespread until the 1800s in regard to fiction specifically.
Before then, it was basically completely normal for people to take stories created by other people and retcon them or make up a continuation as they pleased. This is basically how most “public domain” properties in the modern sense came to exist; Fairy tales, Arthurian legend, etc, were all made up by individuals and then iterated upon a million times in different directions by others.
However, unlike today, none of those extensions were considered any more valid then the others. For example, there were probably close to hundreds of different interpretations of the Lancelot+Arthur+Guinevere love triangle penned by different authors, but were any of them considered “Canon”, even the original? Well, no, they weren’t. They were all equally valid, because people recognized they were just stories. Made up stuff.
The modern trend of establishing a one-true-narrative for a fictional universe is an aberration of storytelling that came about as a result of modern capitalism, and the desire for individuals and corporations to keep the exclusive right to monetize their intellectual properties. It is unnatural and awkward and forced and leads to bizzare conversations like this where people are debating how one piece of made-up fluff is somehow more valid then some other piece of made-up fluff.
I don’t believe any iterations of Guild Wars are any more valid then any other. The original stand-alone story of prophecies is still valid, as is the extension brought about by Factions, and Nightfall after that, and, yes, Guild Wars 2. All of them are seperate works created by varyingly different people, and are equal.
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Canon is a dumb concept made up by corporations.
Stories are stories.
If anything (and I wouldn’t say GW1 was for an older audience ever), the shift to a less serious tone started with Nightfall
You might’ve forgotten that there was a Sorrow’s Furnace path that was just one extremely drawn out Leeroy Jenkins joke.
Or the fact that “For Great Justice!” Was a base game skill.
It weirds me out when people talk like the way humanity is presented in GW2 is something that we, the players outside of the game, are silly to occasionally complain about, as if it’s all inevitable truth.
You can’t critique history, but you can certainly do so with writing, which is what this is. It was all done with the stroke of the pen. It can be undone with the stroke of a pen.
Also, the Centuar invasion isn’t really a good example of how humanity would totally collapse if another threat piled on it. In the 2013 interview, the writers stated that it’s mostly spurred on by funding from the ministry – Paying for their weapons, maintaining supply lines, etc, in an effort to undermine the queens authority. Presumbly if the kingdom itself was actually in danger, they would quit doing that.
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Now I am wondering about the whole retcon thing. While it probably was a retcon, i never saw it as an obvious one. For me, no side in a war can be 100% evil, so seeing some (for a lack of better term) “good” Charr in EOTN seemed logical.
Of course, there’s no way to know for sure what Anets plans for the Charr were in those days before plans changed, but I can atleast tell you that there wasn’t even a hint of them being anything other than monsters in the original release. And that stands out because, with most of the sentient monster races, they made at least a token effort to humanize them – Ventari and his followers for the Centaurs, tons of stuff in Factions for the Tengu, etc. But the Charr never spoke a word. The first time you even learn they’re capable of speech is right at the end of nightfall, and even that’s not a paticularly positive impression.
But yeah, I’m glad you get it and I didn’t just sound crazy.
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The Zephyites flew to Cantha last year, I think. I remember they talked about it during the event at the start of living story S2.
For me, it’s because the whole thing evokes negative feelings I associate with the whole GW1>GW2 transition in general. Where Anet kinda dumped their existing fanbase, along with their game and it’s unique premise, just 2 years out of the gate, to make something new with better mass appeal. Without much care for all that the aforementioned had invested.
It’s probably difficult to understand now how the two are connected, but consider it from the perspective of a veteran GW1 player at the time that GW2 is announced. You’re playing a thing you love, in a universe you enjoy, and everything seems great as you await the next addition, of which you’ve been promised many over the course of years.
Then suddenly you’re told their won’t be a next addition, (despite it still going strong,) and instead support is about to totally stop in favour of this new thing.
Naturally, you’re a little upset. But at the same time, all the ideas you associated with the old thing you loved are being thrown out as well. It might seem ridiculous considering it’s a video game, but for many people, Ascalon and pre-searing, and the tragedy of them being destroyed, were the earliest memories they had of the game, and the firmest sense of a “home” within it’s context. The beta events were all there. All the earliest missions, as well as some of the hardest endgame quests, were there. Sure, MMO patriotism is extremely silly and dumb when you’re an adult, but I – And probably a lot of other people – was a kid when GW1 launched, and feelings you get as a kid are hard to get rid of.
So there had been an attachment to Ascalon for a lot of people, and to it’s cause and it’s conflict with the Charr. But now these new people – New writers, in your mind the same people taking your game for something you might not even see for years and years and might not even like – Came along and told you that you were dumb to feel that way. That the generic monsters were actually the good guys, and you were jerks for fighting them, and they would be the stars now.
It was such a blatant retcon, made for such obvious, shallow reasons (the desire to be able to incorporate a cool sounding race into their new project which, as was popular, required multiple races) that came about at the worst time, and got bundled in with a big ball of anti-anet resenment; At their laziness, fickleness, in regard to lore and game design both. The feeling that everything you had come to enjoy was being replaced for arbitrary reasons. That it could easily happen again, at any time.
That probably all sounds very melodramatic, and I certainly don’t feel that strongly now. But again. Try to think of it from the perspective of a tween.
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But Gw1 and 2 and not novels. They are lore written by staff for Arena Net. This isn’t a book. And despite the eekiness of the metaphor, if God appeared before us all and said the new testament was the way to go, then that would be the way to go. No single author has control over any of the works. Nor did any single author write any single work without ANETs approval and probably editing.
These are video games. It would be like saying that Portal 2 is a dream because we don’t see Chell being readmitted to the facility until they added new footage later. Nooooooo. Valve owns Chell . You cannot use lore from a later game, and then argue it is incorrect because of lore in a previous game. Jigglypuff is now a Fairy Type, any Pokemon discussion we have now will not use data that refers to Jigglypuff as a Normal type.
I don’t really agree with the notion that simply because someone holds the rights to a property that they have absolute retroactive control over it, especially if they’re not the ones who actually produced the original work to begin with.
And writing is writing, however it’s dressed up. Obviously I can’t pick and choose bits of GW2 and say they’re incorrect (I mean, I could, since all of this is a bunch of made up fluff to begin with, but it wouldn’t be very useful) since it’s all one cohesive work. But if someone wants to reject the entire of GW2 as a legitimate continuation of GW1, that’s entirely their right as a reader.
Its the entire thing behind Christianity. ANET is God, and though s/he inspired people to write stuff earlier, the people s/he inspired later to write stuff trump the earlier material. Its the same Universe, anything in the New Testament is suppose to trump the Old Testament. Anything in Gw2 trumps on the truth scale anything in Gw1.
This… Seems like kind of a weird example to use, since there is an entire world-spanning religion based on explicitly rejecting the canonicity of the New Testament.
To treat works like Christianity or ANET lore like simple imaginations of authors rips the fantasy from everything.
I can’t agree with this. Despite being part of a larger piece of entertainment, the story of Guild Wars is just that – A story. No story transcends authorship. They are born and die in the minds of the writer and the reader.
Two authors can certainly create works based on the same ideas (Though the only real difference as to if this is “legitimate” or fanfiction are based on fairly arbitrary ideas of copyright and abstract ownership that have only really come into existance in the last 200 years with the advent of corporatism) but that doesn’t make them the same. For instance, there are many people who do not accept the Wheel of Time novels that were written after Robert Jordans death as a legitimate continuation of the story, and it’s perfectly fair for them to do so, since many of the ideas that would comprise the original conclusion are lost forever.
Guild Wars 1 and 2 are largely different works, created by different people. Choosing if you enjoy/accept both, just one, or even neither is entirely up to the reader.
As I understand it, the old proph writer departed and was replaced by some of the people we have today after factions, not nightfall. Just to offer a small correction!
If you think that Ascalon and the Blood Legion Homelands are the only lands that they own, you don’t know jack about charr lore. The Blood Citadel (home to the Blood Legion and Blood Imperator Bangar Ruinbringer) is east of the Blazeridge Mountains – not north of Ascalon.
It would be closer to say that a quarter of the population (if that) got shoved into another quarter of their conquered lands.
And given the state of the so-called Blood Legion Homelands in GW1, that did not really affect them nearly as much as you claim.
Is this still canon? The only time I recall lands to the east being mentioned is in the Legions of the Charr article, and that was way early in development – Before they made the change to explicitly define the GW1 Charr lands as being the blood legions home.
These are the players statistics, not the real one.
Charrs outnumber Humans and are more advanced technologicaly than them. Many Asura think that Humans are living museum pieces to study before their extinction. Only one out of five kingdom remain for what they know. Human population decreased brutally. Also, while others races can sustain themselves, Humans have to buy food and things to the others.
And even if they manage to reclaim Ascalon… For what? Having to fight Ascalon’s Ghosts, Flame Legion, Branded, Ogres, Renegades, and the local fauna additionnaly to Centaurs and bandits?
Just so you know, humans don’t have to buy food from anyone. Anet mentioned during development that they have the best agricultural technology of any of the races. Kryta is Tyrias breadbasket.
This is the last bit of dialogue from Adelbern you get from him in GW1, after you complete the quest to return to Ascalon and save it from a Titan/Charr attack.
“A long time have I fought for Ascalon. First as a soldier blessed by Balthazar, now as its king. Though I have survived one more battle, and I will see another day, it will not make me any more wise… only one day older. I have lost all that a man can lose. All that I have left is this antiquated set of armor and the remains of this tattered kingdom. I thank you for your help today. Rurik would have been very proud of all you have accomplished.”
Doesn’t really sound like later lore paints him.
I could really use an invite! On the US servers.
Greens had the same stats as maxed golds.
No. I really don’t like the ascended stuff.
I never expected to hear the term “Best in slot” in a guild wars game. Especially not after the manifesto.
If this goes through, I’m asking for a refund, I think.
I really hope they don’t do this.
Do you remember when the game is started and the areas had a lot of player? I want it back!
Posted by: Lurinna.4306
I say this in every thread with the idea, but I really wouldn’t want this unless you could opt out. I hate when dynamic events become just massive zergs. It makes it really dull.
I was wondering. Next year, will the same Halloween items be popping up in the black lion chests, or will there be a brand new set, with the old ones just exclusives. It’d be really nice to see an Anet anwser to this!
So the event is over, but… I still see all the halloween items in the gem store, including the one for the limited chest items. What’s the deal?
Sorry if I’m jumping to conclusions.
Only if there’s an opt-out option. I like areas nice and quiet.
Well, there is always a market that will buy gold. The problem is: As long as it’s cheaper to buy gold from a third party as opposed to gems, people will opt to do that. At present, a cursory google search reveals that you get almost six times as much bang for your buck if you go through a RMT site.
Further, it is very dangerous to ban someone utterly for buying gold. For instance, somebody could easily get rid of someone they didn’t like in game by “generously” making a small purchase of gold for them.
Welp. Sounds like the writers dropped the ball somewhere.
It’s said by a few generic “Seraph Guards” who wander around Fort Salma. They explain the war in full.
Also, I think those sources refer to the conflict between the two races in general, rather then this specific invasion, which by all accounts started only a few years ago.
And I don’t see why you think that change took place. I mean, it’s just referring to him in the context of association to his tribe. It’s a bit odd, but no different then saying “Logan the Krytan” or something.
The treaty is kind of universally portrayed as a bad idea, with the Centaurs breaking it and attacking caravans on multiple occasions, and even plotting an invasion of Lions Arch. You even get a few dialogue options to call them out on it, I think.
In regard to the motives, if you go to Fort Salma, a Seraph there tells you that the reason the Centaurs are invading is because the Centaur “king” (Ulgoth the Mighty) wants to take revenge on humankind for destroying the Modniir tribe in the Far Shiverpeaks 250 years ago.
Which was the work of the GW1 player characters. So, in short, the entire war is due to people farming Norn reputation points.
(As a side note, Ulgoth gets killed at the end of the Harathi Hinterlands. So things aren’t looking good for the invasion.)
For the customized soundtrack: please let us have a playlist for each zone, city and dungeon!
in Suggestions
Posted by: Lurinna.4306
I remember asking this in beta myself and being told it was possible. I’d absolutely love to see this!
Oh, the players are also mentioned in one of the novels, for that matter. Glint tells the story of how she instructed them to save the world and then they beat her within an inch of her life for no discernable reason to Destiny’s Edge.
You can hear some NPCs in Divinity’s Reach talking about the player characters and the defeat of the Lich. (They refer to them as a “group of adventurers”.) So they certainly weren’t forgotten – Anet probably just didn’t want people to be talking about “The Legendary Hero” awkwardly and without being able to mention any specifics too often, and so they only come up rarely.
So, in essence: retcon? Then why bother showing us that relic of the previous ecosystem? (Can’t remember the name of the area with the skill point in Gendarren Fields.)
Also, is the climate progression any more realistic in GW2? You still have a jungle on the same latitude as mountain/alpine snow.
I think somthing can be a retcon, while still having a vague attempt to justify it from the creators. For instance, how Tiber Septim in Elder Scrolls used crazy time magic to transform Cyrodill from a dense jungle to a generic forest just in time for the release of Oblivion. It’s explained in universe… But there’s a much more fourth-wall breaking explanation for why it actually happened. That is, because a game set in a jungle would be offputting to some.
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