The dungeons in this game aren’t hard they’re tedious. Very tedious. I used to somewhat enjoy doing story mode with a PuG, but know it’s just a constant zergfest from the grave ever sinse the last patch. In my opinion this is just bad game design and it will cost ArenaNet greatly down the road.
“Mitigation and heals are absolutely so far away from the power of evasion that they are permanently relegated to an almost vanity feature of characters. Damage is similarly treated since basically everything in dungeons has 54656735962569365346 health and you can’t beat even the smallest add by trying to just burn it down.”
Just go’s to show that you can hand some people a plate of steaming dog **** and they’re still happy. Go figgure. Doesn’t mean that they’re right though, just very easy to please among other things.
I think the difficulty of pre-nerf CM was perfect; every story mode dungeons should’ve been brought down to that level instead of the opposite. The monetary reward was excessive since even lv 80s were spamming it, but the difficulty ramp-up is silly. Now hardly anyone does it.
Keep the explorable modes hard for those e-sport fans completely geared up with exotics & voice-comms shouting out CC-order, but I think story modes should be toned down so an average PuG group can “hack n’ slash” through them without waypoint zerging.
That’s kinda lame, I ran a pug cm explorable just the other day, in fact I ran two to full completion, path 1 and path 2 individually.
they are completely puggable, I am not busting your chops, I am not lying.
if you can get used to the mechanics and stop thinking like it’s a different mmo, then they CAN be enjoyable. but if you keep thinking “there’s no holy trinity” automatically means “we should all be pure DPS and leave our brains at the door” then you’re wrong.
THE LAST role ANY dungeon I’ve ran needed was dps, technically EVERYTHING is dps I know. but PURE dps, had little to no place :S
there was nothing to be burst down, everything had high hp but could be near enough permalocked in blinds etc, attrition is better than burst and I’m more and more becoming glad of that, because there’s nothing particularly exciting about bursting down a mob in one rotation several times before you hit a miniboss that requires an instruction manual and which forces me to shout for idiots to get out of the way of mechanics that they don’t fear or respect enough to get out of, because they only deal moderate damage to them, til the healer oom’s keeping their sorry rear ends alive, and then that lack of respect for the mechanic starts to add up and they die, which in groups then leads to a huge lack of dps because dead dps = 0dps
Does that sound familiar? because that’s what was happening before they IDIOT PROOFED dungeons in wow with the hour of twilight releases.
the irony? players STILL died on such woeful mechanics as ashara’s big “interrupt me now or wipe” skill. and we still had huntards refusing to spec for an interrupt which would have trivialised the content.
If I’m jumping the gun here, which I’m known to do somewhat, by all means correct me, but ask yourself if the problems you’re experiencing are truly problems with the core mechanics of dungeon groups, problems with your perceptions and expectations or just minor issues with conveyance
Ok I’ll humor you. Let’s say you did beat explorer mode with a PuG, my point is that the majority of people will not be able to do this therefore making it an overall unenjoyable experience for them. Why does this seem like a challenge for you to understand?
Beat you’re chest much? Don’t patronize me. Explorable content is not “completely puggable” as you put it and many other people in this forum would dispute that ridiculous statement.You must be really starving for some attention or to say something so silly like that.
I bought this MMO because it was different in some ways compared to others. You think that you have me figured out but have no clue about what my expectations were coming into this game or what kind of gamer that I am. Way off! Just foolish nonsense.
fyi – Providing some proof to back up certain claims go’s a long way toward ones integrity.
I’m not saying rewards are not a problem, I agree 100% that dungeon rewards are beyond silly, but it’s only a part of a generally failed design of dungeon system (lack of real challenge, artificial difficulty and unnecessary discouragement of less experienced players from trying it out or from acquiring the skills required to beat this part of content).
Where in the hell did this term “Artificial difficulty” come from? Are you talking about isntagibs? Because those are avoidable and very obviously so. Large HP pools? Because those are overcome with dps numbers. Are you talking about seemingly “overly difficult” trash mobs, every pull in a real dungeon should be strategic, not an aoe smashface zergfest as most of the new mmo generation is used to. Please Mr. expert, explain to me with your professional knowledge of game design what is considered non -artificial difficulty? Because I fail to see your logic. To me it looks as though you are calling it that simply because you don’t know how to beat it, but, you are failing to see that once you know how to beat it and play as a team, it isn’t difficult at all, and in fact was meant to teach you through trial and error. I know that this concept trial and error may be a new way of learning things for some, as most nowadays are used to the Dora the Explorer form of teaching where your hand is held at all tiems and you are not forced to do any of the footwork yoruself. Unnecessary discouragement? You mean people who are not too bright thinking that if they keep trying the exact same thing over and over and over again without changing anything (considered diagnosably insane btw) are going to become discouraged? That cannot be helped.
I’ts not a crime to have a different opinion you know. Also It’s pretty much general consensus that the story mode dungeons are pretty bad all things considered. At least for PuG groups.
@TwistedWarrior: that’s absolutely not true, about trolling anyway. I just now got out of CM explore and had a great time. I’m not trying to troll anyone and I don’t want to be condescending. I strongly disagree with people saying they are too hard. They ARE difficult, that’s for sure. Easy isn’t a word I’d use.
However, in that CM explore run, we had no total wipes, but there was a lot of downed time, but that’s part of the action. The more that I play the explore modes, the more I have come to admire the subtleties of the new group design that Arenanet has done. We were throwing up bubbles, Wall of Reflection, healing seeds, using our crowd control, focus firing on single targets, making use of combos, etc. all the tools at our disposal and it was a GREAT time. So intense and so challenging, but so fun. We cleared it in about 40 minutes, but we weren’t rushing.
About rewards, I don’t know. I think after vendoring all the blues and with picked up coins and the end reward, it wasn’t a huge money making operation, but I don’t really think of them that way anyway, so I was fine with it. I picked up one random rare that time, so that was good. All in all, a good time. (this was a PUG, by the way)
I’m sure there are people that find the dungeons in this game fun no matter how few they are.
PuG? Thought you said it was a CM explore run? Well you must be a gifted gamer and every person in that PuG must have been equally as gifted. So not everyone is ignorant or just trolls, some are liars too! After all – this is the Internet.
Looking at some of the posts in this thread I see ignorant people and I see trolls. The people that claim that the dungeons in this game are fun and easy are obvious trolls. Then there are ones who are just ignorant thinking that the people who complain are all running in organized groups using Mumble and just lack skill. This is what I see. I think that the people who are complaining are actually running in PuG’s, and this is reason for their frustrations along with some recent poor decisions made by ArenaNet.
Rewards are not the entire issue here in my opinion. I personally enjoy pugging through CM story and ever sinse the increased difficulty from the new patch it’s been impossible. It’s been like: get to first trash mob then die and rinse/repeat until trash is dead etc.. etc.. This is very demoralizing and tedious so I’ve completely lost interest and I think that many have followed suit for the same reason.
Anyway, I have a new machine ordered and on it’s way. BF3 looks really fun and I’m curious to see how it looks and runs with an Ivy Bridge I7 and GeForce GTX 660. Perhaps I’ll come back and check in periodically to see if ArenaNet eventually come to their senses.
In my opinion ArenaNet ruined the potential of this game with the introduction of diminishing returns, caps and then upping the difficulty of dungeon NPC’s substantialy. Dying then respawning rinse/repeat until you’re PuG manages to whittle the trash down so you can move on and do it again is a garbage system – period! I am really disappointed but relieved that I bought a digital copy instead. So all might not be lost for me just yet! I wasn’t that fortunate with Diablo III.
You’re a good example of a delusional fanboy. “but.. I just know that they truly care about me!” In the gaming industry money is king nothing else matters.
I’m done. The buff to dungeon npc’s was too much for me. I just tried to go through CM with 4 completely different PuG’s and failed every time. It’s always the same, we get to second boss kill him then get zerged by trash and repeatedly pummeled about 3-4 times in a row. Then i quit because at that point I pretty much know how it’s going to be the rest of the way. Repairs are also a pain.
In my opinion the dungeons where already a bit of a mess but they were still doable with a PuG.
EXPLORABLE DUNGEONS ARE END-GAME CONTENT. it’s supposed to be challenging. very challenging. what are you complaining about?
anyway, i see myself playing gw2 for years to come….my main is in mid-30’s, ive got 2 alts, and im rank 13 in spvp. ive done a bit of WvW as well. i feel like ive barely scratched the game. i can see dynamic content in future content updates and xpacs being amazing, and as long as they keep coming up with new content, i’ll be playing it! enjoying my guardian, mesmer, and engie currently. having tried all profs, i gotta say i like them all.
I wasn’t talking about explorable dungeons you twit. I’m doing story dungeons – understand? fyi, I wouldn’t do explorable dungeons with a PuG thats just silly.
Also, I personally try not to get too excited about a game because from experience, I’ve found that it can lead to disappointment further down the road.
I’m done. The buff to dungeon npc’s was too much for me. I just tried to go through CM with 4 completely different PuG’s and failed every time. It’s always the same, we get to second boss kill him then get zerged by trash and repeatedly pummeled about 3-4 times in a row. Then i quit because at that point I pretty much know how it’s going to be the rest of the way. Repairs are also a pain.
In my opinion the dungeons where already a bit of a mess but they were still doable with a PuG.
You haven’t seen negative yet. I bought both SWtOR and Diablo III during their launch and whitnessed first hand what negativity really is. These forums haven’t even started to get warm.
I have just about 2 gold on my level 58 warrior. This is the most currency that I’ve made so far in the game. I made it running CM but since the recent idiotic introduction of deminishing returns introduced by ArenaNet, this will no longer be possible. This game is starting to epically suck.
I have realized some things from this though. I’m done with the “free to play” MMO model and I will stick with subscription based games from now on.
I predict that these forums will get very negative in the weeks to come.
Vandal and Rdescope, those are excellent proposals. Pretty much exactly what I was thinking when I made this thread.
Twisted, I do infact play a warrior, Knightfall on Isle of Janthir, currently my only level 80. And this is NOT a nerf HB thread. As it stands with all the stun break/cc removal/cc and bigger problems like pistol whip, which applies the stun itself and grants evasion, if someone gets caught in HB, they deserve it. But this still does not change the fact that as it roots you, it is currently useless in competent PvP matches.Yes maybe 30% is too ludicrous and I apologize for the exaggeration, however.
If the HB root bothers you that much use something else. I did. There are better options out there for the warrior you just have to dig through youtube and google for them.
A nerf to HB damage would directly mess over Greatsword warriors that enjoy the PvE content in this game. Not cool.
You make very valid points, TwistedWarrior. I did fail to think of the pve ramifications, since I primarily pvp. It was selfish, and I apologize for my other post.
Hey no problem. Sometimes I get so caught up in trying to proove a point and forget that there are “two sides to the coin” so to speak. It happens.
Something to keep in mind as you call for reducing Hundred Blades damage:
The axe autoattack does 17.5% less damage than Hundred Blades in the same amount of time. So reducing Hundred Blades damage by more than 17.5% would be kind of silly.
Please don’t patronize me, this is a nerf thread. The 25-30% nerf to damage as proposed by Knightfall is certainly not toning HB’s damage down a little – as you put it.
I’m not opposed to ideas, Just to ideas that require nerfs. Don’t forget, PvP isn’t the only form of entertainment in this game. Sometimes people can’t see the whole picture for whatever selfish reasons. Thats what I’m in partly trying to point out here.
I personally enjoy PvE and currently use a condition spec greatsword/Longbow build. Any hard nerf to damage would make the Greatsword useless. Yes I could replace with dual axe’s – but I like the look of the greatsword! As I’m sure a lot of people do.
Although I could have used many more examples, I used Moldran and Taugrim only to proove a point that there is more to the warrior than just the Greatsword. Which I feel that I did. As far as Moldran saying that the warrior doesn’t bring much to the table, I have to respectfully disagree with him. Whatever changes that Moldran feels that warriors need, I seriously doubt that nerfing the damage of HB into the ground is one of them. Just the thought of that idea seems silly.
@ Knightfall.8471
Umm.. You suggested a 25-30% nerf to HB for starters. If you view the warrior as in a tight spot, then why would you make such a silly suggestion in the first place? This makes no sense to me.
I personally don’t view the warrior as being in a tight spot. From what I’ve seen and read there are a few different warrior build types people are using to great success in PvP, other than just a Greatsword build. Go to youtube and check out some of Moldran’s or Taugrims warrior vids for an example. I personally use Moldran’s high burst “’Triple Axe” build for PvP which centers around Eviscerate – just saying. My point is, that the Greatsword build isn’t the only viable PvP spec out there as some would believe. Aside from it’s obvious lack of mobility in PvP I really don’t see the point in whining about it anymore. It will just generate negativity in this forum. Besides, most people that play warriors and know what their doing in PvP have moved on to better things. Any nerf to this ability would really only hurt the PvE community in the long run.
You’re “nerf HB” whine is really no different then everyone elses in this forum. Cleverly disguising you’re whine behind “but.. I play a warrior” bs doesn’t change anything. I see right through it. I’ve been a part of many gaming communities over the years and whitnessed simular tactics and forms of manupulation before. Ahh.. The silly games people play just for attention!
Like I said yesterday, nerfing is a never ending circle and can also do more damage to a game then good in the long run – in my opinion.
I’d also like to add that I’ve never whined for a nerf to anything in any forum in all my years of gaming because, I feel that it’s potentially harmful and should only be considered as a last resort solution after other options have been explored.
HB is fine the way it is.Your ridiculous proposal of a 25-30% nerf to it’s damage would make the HB hit like a wet noodle. Removing the root and making HB more mobile wouldn’t make things any better under that circumstance.
I hope for the sake of this game that ArenaNet ignores the majority of you nerf whiners. Because if it’s not one thing it’s always another. Most of it comes down to just ignorance and the lack of enough time spent with the game.
Nerfing almost always turns into a never ending circle. The more that developers listen and cater to nerf whiners the worse things get. In my opinion nerf whiners are a cancer in all game forums along with the trolls, doom and gloomers as well as the fanboys. Any game forum would be well off without these four types of nuisances in their communities. They’re only good for starting flamewars.
“I don’t think Guild Wars 2 has the sort of polish that a game on release should have.”
Did you play SWtOR or Diablo III during they’re releases? The forums of these two games upon release were just overwhelmed with hate for obvious reasons.
What you do with you’re character in PvE has no bering on what you do in PvP in GW2. When you PvP in GW2 you are instant level 80 in a set of free PvP gear. To PvP in GW2 just open you’re hero tab and go to the bottom tab (PvP) click on the long gray button marked: “heart of the mists” you will then be transported to a lobby area with a bunch of other people. There you will find all sorts of PvP gear/trinket vendors where you can customize you’re gear set all for free.
Just curious, since you think GW2 has no real end game…
Could you please tell us about an MMORPG that in your opinion had a good end game? And tell us what was so good about it?
Eve Online. I’ve been playing for over 5 years. There are no levels, instead you train skills that can take anywhere from 5 minutes – 3 months, roughly. End game for some people in Eve is being able to fly all the best ships and just pew pew till you’re hearts content. For some it’s all about power and running big corporations or huge alliances. Some just prefer to be left alone and mine or get rich from running all the PvE content in the game to no end. Some like to play the market and get rich that way. Some prefer to just sit back and scam everybody else.
I think that the Greatsword is great for PvE, not so much for PvP. It’s single target/AoE damage synergises well with the Longbow for PvE. Being stuck in-place to use HB really doesn’t matter in PvE – unlike in PvP.
Greatsword/Longbow is much better for world events, dungeons and some storyline quests where there are a lot of zerging npc’s. I recently switched from a Greatsword/dual axe high burst build and haven’t looked back. The bow has almost insane AoE and the added ability to kite for certain situations is very helpful.
I’m really curious as to why you don’t like the engineer.
I just feel bored, disappointed, unenthused, and just plain out crappy. I should be having fun leveling! I love engineer PvP and thats what kinda made me decide for engi in the pve aspect but geez, I didn’t think it would be like this. The damage is, lackluster to say the least, most of our utility skills are broken (ie; don’t do good damage, aren’t consistent, etc.) I really wanted Engi to work but I just can’t do it. It’s too stale.
Fair enough. Perhaps try a Greatsword/dual axe warrior for high burst. Or maybe Greatsword/Longbow which I find better for dungeons/events and also situations that require some kiting. Thief is also pretty good as a bursty melee if you go with a pistol whipping sword/pistol, pistol/pistol build. The dual pistols are great for adding some range.
Ah, that’s simple. When you go down, you get 4 skills to choose from, right? The first one causes slight damage, the second one knocks down your foe, the fourth one channels health… What you’re experiencing is the effect of the third skill. When you use it, you are revived for 15 seconds. When those 15 seconds are over, you die. However, after every enemy you kill in that state, there’s a chance that you’ll rally, i.e. won’t die after the time limit expires. It’s good for life-or-death gambles, finishing off near-dead foes, or positioning yourself in a more convenient spot for potential resurrection. Check out the description of the third skill when you go down next time. Most likely you kept using that skill without checking what it does and thus got “fake” resurrections.
Ahh! Thank you! I’ve been wondering about this as well. I knew what the effect was called I just didn’t know why or how. I will never touch that third downed skill ever again.
I had same issues at one time. I went greatsword/dual axes and swap between both on the fly for maximum effect. Try opening with hundred blades followed by whirlwind attack then switch over to dual axes for whirling axe. By this time you should be able to hit with an eviscerate to finish off. You can also throw in bladestrail and throw axe wherever needed to help with kiting. Also, don’t forget to use you’re utility skills for better results and try to keep all you’re gear up to date.
Yeah i’ve been having a lot more fun joining the pugs with 4-6 people in them. Teams get unbalanced pretty often though.. when there are only 5 people whoever has the 3rd player is at a serious advantage.
I just can’t wait til they give us a “join as party” option and let us play with our friends for an entire sPvP match. :’(
Problem with joining as a party is, to do it right, they have to limit the queue so that people who join as a party only play against other people who joined as parties.
Otherwise, it would just be a cake walk, which is why PvP sucked so hard in Rift, for example.
Another example would be SWtOR. Pre-mades stomp over everyone in that game. There never seems to ba a shortage of whining in the forums about it.
