Guild Wars 2

I actually believe that the current stealth mech fits rangers most or will fit them better.

-It isnt a nerf, but a completely new stealth mechanic.

This is permanent stealth and will only get revealed if hit by aoe, but remember there will be visual cue/s like footprints for an example since we already have that feature on legendary weps, it should be easy to incorporate that to this skill.

-Swinging a weapon isn’t aoe.
-Ragnarok did have aoe spammers too, but it worked. You will see bigplays from stalkers calling the whole guild into emp room. Promotes sneakiness on thief and smart play, not just oh im dying > Bam! stealth skill easy getaway with players getting away unpunish from having complete disregard to positioning and absolutely removing the “risk” factor.

Ragnarok players should be familiar with this skill, it could be interesting for stealth mech to change into this, which could reduce the amount of QQ on stealth.

basically “stalk” is a stealth mechanic that leaves a subtle trail of footprints, so you’ll still be able to tell where the thief is, but the thief will only be revealed if hit by an aoe or etc.

I believe they can do 2 things to fix pistol. These are:

1) Bodyshot – Applies both vulnerability and cripple.

2) Pistol shots/skills pierce trait- gives it pseudo aoe. (instead of the god awful 20% bounce)

P/P desperately needs piercing shots. Ricochet is an okay gimmicky trait that is a lame excuse for an aoe skill.

2 things that will make P/P viable for me:

1) Make pistol skills/attacks: 100% piercing
2) Body shot change into: 1200range w/ crippple

-or: Like above.

and if Anet is feeling generous they can throw in a faster animation for unload.

Will these erase all QQ’s about bs thieves??

TheZeus.8617:

Another reason as to why Anet is not listening. The 2 DEVS working on PVP should be fired.. they totally killed pvp.. this adds injury to insult… seriously, 20 sec re spawn timers.. wtf devs.

i believe it goes “adds salt to injury”

Oks since they pretty much destroyed my beloved s/d set. I think im ready to jump in on the bs bandwagon.

Which is better? Full valkyrie set with Hidden Killer.

or Mix valkyrie and berserker with Executioner? (still try to go for atleast 50% crit chance here)

Im planning on putting rubies on my set if it matters.

Mrbig.8019:

evilapprentice.6379:

You can stun break out of a PW stun. there is no way to break daze. also, you can only stunlock when using haste, whereas you can daze someone whenever you stealth.

Stun breakers work on daze just like they work on stuns.

An S/D thief can be kited, and as soon as you avoid a C&D ( L2P issue), the S/D thief is already out of ini.

S/D thieves could be countered way easily, STILL it was our best duelist build.

Now it’s destroyed, and there’s no reason to choose a main hand sword over a main hand dagger.

exactly!

those people saying otherwise simply do not use this set, and doesnt realize how ruined this weapon set it.

Not a big fan of condition builds, this weapon set was perfect for me. It allowed to me to go toe to toe people. If i kill anyone it was because I perfectly time all my cnd and tactical strikes, this is no where as easy as backstab build which only relies on ONE cnd > backstab combo. If i were to miss ONE tactical daze strike i would lose a chunk of hp. If i were to miss 3rd hit of my auto attack, the fight would substantially take longer!

I dont think Anet, or anyone not playing this set realize this. It takes Skill to play this set, and to dazelock someone gives a whole lot of sense of accomplishment because it means that person got outplayed.

Lets list what this set have left shall we.
pros
-auto attacks which is the only reliable damage this set can do
-sword 2: immobilization shares the same resource as cnd(which is more important if i want to continue autoattacking).

cons
-flanking strike: very situational, but with the current ini cost, id rather use cnd > tactical strike combo.
-dancing dagger: nerf to hell.
-cnd: did not do considerable damage before, much less now. It cost a lot of ini too.

In conclusion:
Weapon set, S/d build totaly destroyed.

@Adeneshade
Yes it wasnt a burst build but it was a way to wittle down a bunker in a long period of time, granted all daze hits. Right now it can not counter a bunker 1v1.

s/d pwr/tough/vit is my semi bunker build as a thief, it works enough to be able to stall on a node 1v1, but even with all that we cant stand toe to toe against any class now more than ever.

And here i thought the purpose of the patch was to reduce burst and increase other aspects of thief like survivability for more of a sustained fight, rather than hit and run.

Let’s be honest, if you get permadaze you should just quit this game.(period)

it takes skill to dazelock people, who knows how to dodge the 3rd strike of autoattack or dodge cnd after a very predictable 3 autoattacks. Why would a thief just auto attack if it was too predictable? well let me tell you, what does a thief kill someone with s/d wep set? flanking strike? (LMAO).

Im sorry but how is dodging tactical strike hard?

Considering a thief landed that first daze strike…

dodge before u get crippled by the third attack and it will be hard to get hit by cnd. That should give enough window to punish thieves and prolong the next daze strike.

dodge before cnd: count the auto attacks and after the 3rd strike, thief is sure to use cnd. Again, that gives enough window to punish thieves.

The nerf was uncalled for, this is our only counter to bunkers!! u might say its not fair, a thief shouldnt be able to lockdown a bunker and kill him by himself, bur dazelocking someone completely is hard to do against someone with brain, and killing a bunker with only auto attacks take a long time. Seriously this is the only weapon set that allows thieves to compete against guardians, wth.

I really dont know what gear to make. I only have enough time to make one set, and im holding off on crafting because of all the nerf scare that thieves are facing.

Can we please have some feedback from Anet? Can we please rid thief forum of all QQ post? What happened to the rendering bug ?(which is really the only thing about thieves that are broken and its not our fault) .

Do we have to be scared of every update that this game is going to have in the future? Because getting toned down for balance purposes isn’t the problem, its the watered down feeling you get for unwarranted nerfs that really ruins the experience with any class. It’s not like we have fixes and buffs to look forward to, thief class is pretty much pidgeon hold to bs burst build or condition build. (daze thief got destroyed for no reason) Is it really hard to predict sword thief’s attack?.

After playing with p/p some more, i think bodyshot should be a knockback/down skill instead with 300range.

lmao no ressing while stealth??

I find that the only thing i do best in pve is control aggro, by invising those who shouldnt have it and if team’s about to die shadow refuge squishies with me while ressing the tanks. That will ruin the only thing i do well in instances.

^ exactly.

have u tried a 1v1 dueling a balanced build guardian? lol good luck.

back on topic: you have to kite, thief shines in initiation and leaving for a reset. If a thief fight somone head on, if they are decent they will outlast any thieves.

The only thing i can tell you is to just use it! lol
The thing about thieves is we can have the best initiation and if it fails we bail, and shadowstep does both. If you ended up burning your heal first, then shadowstep away and reset.

^
- no stealth (i guarantee you p/p doesnt need it)
-no mobility (try this build http://www.guildhead.com/skill-calc#mckMMc9cmlbxmmlbxmxx0a0oRqzkqc)
-like i said change body shot to cripple

the build above works really well, lots of mobility making stealth unnecessary.
shadowstep gives you options to be aggressive and defensive. with the build above i’ve manage to use all the skills in the p/p set except for bodyshot.

Unload could be faster though, but i feel like the damage is just enough. Piercing effect would make it awesome but not overpowered. What i like to do is use unload then wait for enemies reaction, and when i feel like its the right time i active venom mid unload.

I know how headshot cost a lot of initiative and it forces you to use either one skill or the other, but on my experience there were moments when once ive downed enemies to 50% headshot + autoattack can finish them off easily (ofcourse timing headshot when they’re healing).

No matter what build you’re using, thieves’ success mostly depends on the initiation and how well you execute it. It really dictates the battle that much.

i think they should replace bodyshot’s vulnerability to a cripple and make it 1200 range. Also instead of aoe, pistols should pierce through targets.

Ofcourse it needs a nerf when you post a screenie showing damage done to your glass cannon mesmer with the ss of your bunker guardian pretending it took oh my wow damage on your guardian.

lol these QQ posts arent even posting their stats and gear in the same screenie as the damage done to them.

Rfreak.6591:

@Wilhelmryan.9203

You are obviously lyin, simply because if you played those classes enough you wouldn’t be saying this, now I want proof, a screen with your amount of matches won as a mesmer/warrior and your pvp rank, else I won’t believe you.

@GlockworK.2954

When I play a thief I do a number of actions that, tactically speaking, other classes would never EVER do:

-being able to kill in 5-6 hits most non-tank built players with no risk, as I get free hits while engaging stealthed
-rushing into unaware groups of players fighting just to score an F-finish stealthed
-travelling half the map stealthed timing my utilities skills (yes I use the heal too, c’mon you telling me you don’t burn it for the stealth when you feel the need? seriously?)
-trick my opponents in following me while I stealth and get past their backs to capture the point

Now these actions, would be crazy to consider while playing any other class, as it has no real cost on a thief and you can keep running all the way as you wish, while playing on any other class would mean pretty sure death.

This pretty much sums what the first poster wanted to discuss.

Yep this pretty much sums up what thieves can do, and Nobody would consider these actions while playing other classes because they are not thieves, that’s just silly.

engaging in stealth is one way to get free hits, but you do realize that it’s only effective if the person is unaware? ex. when an enemy player is preoccupied with your teammate, then of course you can get free hits, you don’t even have to stealth.

I don’t understand what you consider as “cost on a thief” when you are fighting “unaware groups of players”. Any class can kill anyone according to that logic, so next time you baddies make sure you are “aware” when you are playing a game where it is possible to “die” and “get killed”.

There’s many ways available to travel across a map, depending on the class.

I don’t understand the tricking part. I thought the goal was to capture nodes? If you were to capture a point that the other team already own, wouldn’t you think that it’s possible for them to come and defend it? maybe they are preoccupied with capturing your own points? if that’s the case then aren’t they doing the same thing as you? and maybe you are the one getting tricked?

Im sorry but i can do the exact same in my mesmer and warrior in spvp. It’s all about timing really, doesnt matter what class.

What’s should be noted is that, when im on my thief, i barely pose any presence/threat in the battle other than when im bursting someone and then 36/45 secs again later after cd’s.

On my mesmer, im constantly engaged in the fray, while doing considerable amount of burst comparable to thieves and doing it as an aoe.

On my warrior, im constantly sniping people with my f1(10/8 secs cd) using rifle and when the time comes, BOOM! frenzied 100b.

its not about thief’s broken blah blah blah…

that Elem looks like he actually spend time playing the game and learning it. Good fight.

~~~~~~~~~~
1) Backstab : is only a problem in wvwvw(where balance doesn’t exist and should not be balance towards, only because there’s just too many things to consider that contribute to different stat disparity between players.

2) Rendering Issue (stealth bug): Player’s main complaint is that not having a chance to retaliate.

3) Class design: Initiative system promotes proper resource management, thus promoting the use of the most efficient skill in the weapon set which creates the illusion of spamming and reduces diversity between thief builds.

4) Utility skills: This is the main culprit in thives having gimmicky builds. The escape skills are great(stealth and shadowstep), and what build benefits the most from these great utilities? How about venoms (wasted charges on air) and traps?

these are just some of the things to start with.

these so called “friends” aren’t playing in the same server as you?…

doesn’t make any sense.

Imagine doing lower level instances without downscaling. lol

samanosuke.4508:

But does the move work? It was wholly ignore by most because it was unreliability, but I always hoped for it to one day work as intended.

It works!

I use it to evade. People are sooo eager to use skills on me after daze runs out so the skill works as intended, evasion while keeping damage pressure at the same time.

It’s sooo funny messing with people, after the daze their first instinct is to burn their skills which i evade using this skill and my 3 dodge(endrance return trait) then its back to free auto attacks for me

traited with fury at 50% and quickness on crit, you would be surprise at how deadly this weapon set is.

I dont think people realize how good this skill is. It is fine way it is now, and lessening the ini cost will only make ppl qq more. I dont want any qq attention on my s/d.

(mug/infil signet )>cnd > tactical strike
with the right gear u can daze them for atleast 3secs, which is enough to cast cnd after 3 uncontested auto attacks.

Now get traits and skills for endurance and Nobody can counter you, because after 3 auto attacks u have sooo many evades at disposal that you can safely recast cnd > tactical strike combo all the time.

lol they tried right?

To be honest im more than happy that they didnt nerf the backstab skill itself. This doesnt change anything though, probackstab thieves will always be probackstab thieves. Im just hoping the qq posts in thief forums die down a little bit (doubt it).

Just to let you guys know, you would want backstab thieves more than anything. They are very easy to counter, and die soo quick.

^_^ perma dazethiefbaby! lolz s/d ftw(we need a better dual skill though than that pos skill).

Loosifah.4739:

For any of your complaining about the nerfs to the thief; try rolling a class like Elementalist who’s supposed to have massive damage for the trade off of having the LOWEST armor and health in the game.

Enough said.

This is the main problem with all the nerf qqing for any class.

What people need to acknowledge is that Gw2 is a game of “roles”, not in a sense of healer,tank,dps,spike dps, but more of a….

Ganker
Initiator
support
carry

If you have played HON,Dota/2,LOL you would be familiar with these terms. To translate that into gw2 simply means that you can not compare a glass cannon elem to a glass cannon thief. (glass cannon ele =/= glass cannon thief).

why you ask?

because each class is designed differently to do different roles, and the biggest thing is to realize the potential of each weapon skill set for a certain class, whether it be dps/support/initiate/etc.

for example:
dagger/dagger elem: no matter how you look at it the skills this weapon set offers great initiation(fire3, air4, earth3) a lot of skills that travels some distance + some kinda of “cc” (stuns,immobil,slow)

dagger/dagger thief: This set is all about damage, no “cc”, but offers great mobility in terms of leap(dagger2/heartseeker), evade (dagger3/deathblossom), and cloak and dagger(stealth)

now if both go glass cannon build one(elem) would be inferior in terms of damage.
but think about it this way, the elem offers the best set up for the team trying to “gank” because of its “cc”. On the other hand, what does glass cannon thief offer to the team other than its damage.

Both offers different things, and both requires certain situations to shine.

lmao @ calling backstabs “minimal finese”, coming from a pistol whip thief.