Guild Wars 2

Never spotted a viz guild, but for some reason they seem to find it very amusing every time they overrun something 60 vs 10 since theres always this /laugh emotion. Else they melt if theyre only double the size, as expected from reading other matchup threads. Fun at prime time, when they cant hold the t3 stuff they get at night. Heard SFR is a good server? Hoping to meet them next. Seen some ok german guilds at least Would be nice to meet more of those in fights. But seriously, I cant recall one viz guild? -.- Come out please

There is one solution, but Anet doesnt have the hardware to do it; Player collision. That would make it possible to funnel at entrances, quick direction change and more mobility is rewarded.

Nuka Cola.8520:

killimandros.5087:

I am pretty certain THAT was the guy who fixed CULLING In that case; BIG mistake ANet. I am ALSO pretty certain he gor fired because of constantly insisting on class balances to fit wvw instead of the kitten smallscale PvP. Last one, you can take as inside information. Point is, he wanted classes to work. And was fired for it.

What kind of dumb company would fire a person (that was with them for quite some time too) for wanting balanced classes?

When the majority of the developers, including lead developers, say classes are fine, and one or two people keep nagging about it on meetings, then eventually action was taken, as you see.

I am pretty certain THAT was the guy who fixed CULLING In that case; BIG mistake ANet. I am ALSO pretty certain he gor fired because of constantly insisting on class balances to fit wvw instead of the kitten smallscale PvP. Last one, you can take as inside information. Point is, he wanted classes to work. And was fired for it.

Rhaps.8540:

mistsim.2748:

then you are just killing pugs. same difference. you will only kitten your guild by running ranger in an organized setting. GvG for instance, or lets say 20vs40 GvZ where every man has to count.

Again, assumptions that we never GvG or GvZ. What is with you people? Did you all wake up today thinking you’re psychic?

Sfr is constantly in GvZ situations. We’re well organised (very active serverwide TS) but don’t have the same numbers as our matchups so we do have to make our teams count, down to the last member. And as I said originally, I agree with Killimandros’s assesment of Ranger’s place in that overall. I just had issue with his evalutaion of a couple skills and rambling about something I didn’t say. That’s all.

I had no idea you all had your heads so firmly wedged up his kitten that I’d have to defend my credentials to make the slightest comment about something he said.

Point taken. If I misunderstood you, I am sorry. It all cooks down to the fact (IMO) Rangers abilities doesnt support tight knot mobile team. It does, however have several abilities making it a great zerg player, or roamer. Which is why the guilds focusing on that type of fighting (tight mobile teams) will never find space for a ranger. A team like Red Guard, as an example, would never recruit a ranger, no matter how skilled he was (Pardon Saccy if I am wrong). This is quite common in games like GW2. The best example was WAR, where the best warbands would run with ONLY fom classes. Seeing videos of the better teams, show me they utilize max 4 classes, and ranger is not one of them, leading me to believe it is the ranger as a class, not the team-leader who fails in that combo.

Well, being out of the tight knotted guardian/warrior meat ball is unfortunately why its so hard to fit a ranger intop a guild group combo, because you cant give benefits to the greoup if you are far away, and neither can you profit from the benefits surrounding such a group. Lets just take retaliation and stability as an example. When the ball hits, it will have both up, but just if you are within range. Anything else will, litterally kill you in seconds. If you barrage such a group, you will be on 10% health afterwards, because of confusion and retaliation. At the same time, you wont receive the waterfields dropped on the group, so basically you are bleeding yourself to death, doing what the ranger can do best. Ideally, barrage should be cast on the run, like so many other aoe skills. Imagine iof the necro had to stand still for the entire wells duration. Not likely. And longbows damaghe should be as good on point blank as on 1200 range. But it isnt. To pull out your own waterfield, which is the best in game, you have to negate your own dps, because its useless where you will be standing, which is away from the team. Rangers excell in zergs, much more than support guardians and many other classes. Because there you can shine, picking the targets you want. WHile in a groupball, you dont have that privilege, unfortunately. Much could be done to the melee weapons available to optimize it. As I said earlier, some of the off-hand weapons are decent. Axe, torch, dagger all have its utilities, some even in organized groups. Blasting on your own waterfield with warhorn 5 is great, and brings utility, but we need more, much more. A non-locked main hand weapon aoe swing. A group cleanse, or a main hand cleave stun would be a starter. Then it could be efficient to bring a bunker guardian to a team. Still, it doesnt exist, if it comes, Ill gladly shelf my guard

So in your own guild group, where you are guildleader, you have a ranger. Great. Now, please among the top 20 guilds, apart from yours ofc. mention one who run with a ranger.
Its not because I lack respect of the good rangers out there, its more the fact it saddens me to realize no good guild group commander has ever found good use of a ranger above other classes. I honestly wish it was different, but it isnt. You have to move tight to move efficiently in a guild group. That doesnt suit the ranger playstyle at all, unfortunately. Especially since all main hand weapons are so weak and useless. I still, sadly, state the mere fact ranger has no utility in such a group above other classes.

Rhaps, 2 points. Ill take your last point first; Its crap because it makes it very hard for me to follow my guild group. Thats why its crap. If I try to pull it off in anything besides a zerg, I get burnt down before duration time ends. So, in other words, its useless. Second point, you said there are other classes which are as useless as hunter. Well, the two best classes are Guardian and warrior for a good organized guild zerg bust team. But, ALL other classes has its uses, EXCEPT Ranger. As yourself pointed out, there will occationally be even engineers. But no rangers. I have myself Guardian, thief, ranger and warrior. No sane team leader will ever ask me to log on my ranger. Has never happened, will never happen. ANd rightfully so.
It doesnt mean I dont enjoy my ranger. Its a totally different game. Ranger is not built to be an asset to a team. Maybe if you are running two or three friends, relaxing trying to pick out one or two, running the risk etc. its good fun. Its good fun to try one vs one as well, testing different builds. I like my ranger, but its still useless for anything else than my personal fun. Might be decent in sPvP, I dont know, because I dont like sPvP.

Kasama; The point is, the ranger dosnt do ANY of these abilities any better than classes who at the same time bring other and BETTER group abilities, PLUS more dps….You mentioned some decent single abilities, useful in a zerg, where you only rely on yourself. In a good organized grouip, no sane leader would pick a bunker ranger instead of ANY class. Thats the truth. The ranger doesnt bring ANY ability to a top guild group other than healing spring other classes cant do better, WITH dealing more deepeess at the same time. Take a look at the best guilds combos. They run warrior, guardian, mesmer and necro. In that order. In the very beginning some of the better guild groups had some, a few dedicated healers. Not anymore. Guardians do dps OR control. Another point is, if you wanna do ranged dps with your longbow, you arent running in a group efficiently anymore. You cant heal your allies (who will be melee) and at the same time hit enemies from 1200 distance. It wont work.

From what I read, most of you either follow the zerg, using the ranger as a bag collector from a safe zone, or play in guilds following the zerg collecting bags from a safe zone. If you have tried the ranger in a fairly organized guild group, you would know it is the weakest class there is, and most abilities, apart from the good waterfield, can be done better or just as good by other classes. Ill add my 2 cents to the ranger classes weaknesses and pros in the only build up which is more than casual;
Problem is afaik the survivability, it seems. I suggest runes that give regen. Preferably id say go beastmaster with beast taking damage (aka draw conds, guard area etc.) but thenm again, you wont have the traps, and muddy terrain. IF you want a trapper toon, you will have to specc ALL into survivability, as your utility skills will be used on cc. Dead ranger is no good. Then, doing so, would reduce the dps a lot. As it is now, the damage axe does is mediocre. It does have a good pull (4) and a good reflect/retaliation (5), but the main hand skills are bad, compared to other classes. Actually, fact is, ranger does NOT have a good main hand weapon. So if I were to suggest a specc, Id say any 2h weapon + axe/warhorn or axe/axe. Sword is crap, dont even think about it. Warhorn has one benefit. It gives the ranger a blast. And skill 5, is actually rampage as one (so if you choose warhorn, you can have both 5(RaO) AND roots). The 4 skill, owls, are cool, but not very efficient. Axe as offhand, gives a pull (4) which is hard to get off, and, it seems hard to place. If you target the one closest to you, it pulls one, if you place it in the middle of a zerg, you can, potentially, puill up to 5. Ive experienced max 3 so far. Not to mention it pulls pets. 5 minions in a pull, was not pleasant…Skill 6, is a retaliation/ranged dps skill, which is cool, but, as any good raidleader would have put it, can other classes do it better? Probably. First which comes to mind, is guardians reflecting wall. Especially since rangers 5 makes the ranger rooted for 5 seconds….which potentially is a problem, I guess.

Let us see what other options there are for the ranger then; Greatsword, has one ok attack (2, Maul, which applies 3 stacks of vulnerability. It used to be bleeds, which made it a useful cond. specc weapon). 3, is a good escape mechanic (unless it bugs out, and you fly directly into the zerg. Happens even though you dont have a target, then it will make you go for the one who hit you last). 4, is a block one attack. Crappety crap for anything else than solo roaming.. 5 is a weird skill. Its supposed to stun one target, and apply vulnerability. I almost never find myself using it, unless im in a one vs one. So for a guild team, not optimal. My idea then ,is that greatsword is a weak weapon, but, mashing button one, can make it useful in a guild group. Then again, it does less damage than any other classes with GS…

Longbow. I kinda always fall back to using this, with piercing arrows. Its the weapon most effective in a group combo, because you can start damaging from far away, and you can control your damage quite well. You can easier pick targets in the back. 1 does decent damage from distance, crap point blank. Skill 2 applies vulnerability to target, gives the ranger stealth, which again gives the ranger something called point blank shot (i believe), which is an initiative roll, giving crit. I Use it before I fire off skill 5, which is Barrage, so I get crits on the barrage, and the stealth makes it more prossibble to survive the root you have while fuiring off barrage (you can do it wile being stealthed, it doesnt break on damage to or against). Small thing, but useful. Skill 4 is the knockback, which is useless in anything else than a 1v1. Skill 3, is rpaid fire. Does low damage, and is easily dodgeable.

So to sum it up, after a very brief look at what a ranger can add to a guild organized zerg-hunt team; Nothing no other classes cant. What to do then? Nothing, developers wont change a thing this year. YUou can whine and growl and swear, call me ajerk or whatever, but NO raidleader from any top guild would ever put a ranger in a squad combo. Take a look at the best fights guildgroups? How many rangers do you find? None.

“schnabelangst”, is when your willie shrinks…if that makes the sky break up Anyway its freely translated to what I wouyld like it to look like

I think the rightful expression to why the blobbing is something like this translated to german (pardon my french); “schnabelangst in die laderhosen”, or being afraid to walk alone

Best of luck in Camelot Unchained, pray the mmo gods it is good and competitive. I guess it wasnt such a big surprise you would get THIS world first, but a congratulation is nevertheless fitting :-) I guess now you can enjoy that Carlsberg off-line now for a period, but its hard to imagine a competitive mmo world without RG. Are you gonna try out something else before CU?

[/quote] The only major difference now, is that other ranged classes can fight back from the same range (ie. Engi, Warrior, Thief). Oh the horror.[/quote]

I am a bit puzzled now. But, I like the idea. Now Anet this guy clearly tells you next step is giving rangers same melee abilities/utilities as Warrior, thief, engi. Or wait, maybe even par to mesmer!?

Upperground.6849:

Troma.3250:

…

So yeah, if sometimes ppl call you frogs and rats, it does come from somewhere, and it is not always “the others” to blame. Everyone has to deal with annoyances, but it looks like VS have the hardest time handling them, and start to go berserk trolling, or just being ignorant about it blaming others, and post idiotic stuff.

.

Are you seriously saying anyone should accept being called a rat? Because of a video game?

Lags a result of 3 servers using portal bombs and stealth mechanics. Creates more and more lag. Initially a tactic used to abuse the current culling, it is now adapted by everyone and all, this is the result.

Stiv.1820:

killimandros.5087:

The thieves who doesnt think so, blame it on lack of skill for all who cant cope with thieves, which is, it seems the majority of the playerbase, which leads me to conclude the essence of the discussion is indeed, if you dont roll a thief, you need to L2P…basically

The reason it’s a L2P issue is new players in both WvW and sPvP hotjoin get rickrolled by GC thieves left and right. They come here to vent with suggestions like “dots shouldn’t allow stelath” and “Damage should break stealth”. Things that show a complete lack of understanding of this game’s stealth mechanics.

In all honestly, if you don’t at least try every class in sPvP or level it to 40 in PvE or so for more gated learning of the profession (so you can read every utility and trait and fully understand them) you are nerfing yourself in any form of PvP in this game. Most people who have thieves and play them regularly also play other professions. This game is very alt friendly (at least until every ascended item is out). The reason players who have 80 Thieves don’t have trouble beating thieves is because they know the mechanics. It’s the same with every other prof it’s just that the Thief is the most different (resource based instead of CD, stealth and steal) relative to other profs and very noob vs noob friendly. It’s not until higher skill levels that the Thief is more balanced.

I have a level 80 thief, guardian, ranger and warrior. I have problems against thieves, and so do other thieves have with their alts. Kinda funny I turn into a total noob every time i shelf my thief isnt it, as I am godmode on my thief. I cant remember last time I died in WvW with my thief, and taking out other classes isnt even fun anymore. Its like the big fat kid with hjis hands in the cookie jar saying to all the small kids “if your hand cant get into the jar, theyre all mine” logic thing right now

To Jportel

Then we agree about stealth and culling, which is what the topic was all about. About myu observation of the other thieves, yes. There are a fair few thieves on this specific topic who insists on naming players losing to thieves in all situations and conditions to be bad players. They also love to comment on how the othet classes SHOULD have played (eg make a bunker build, makes it a draw, the thief has to run, you win..(lol), or, you need a power build to take a thief, or, you need a warrior with 100k blades jumping from a tower with death from above skill active…..hell, I stood upside down with Swiss folk music (the youudledoodle thingy) on max volum, made my dog wear a pink raincoat and my wife cook smoked half sheephead for dinner, tantraing the teletubby intro, still, I lost to a thief on my ranger….Good thing is, I have a max level thief myself. So obviously im pro

No, theres 2 discussions going on here, the first one, is the one im interested in, where the issue with culling makes it possible to permastealth (for the classes who can do that…) and the other discussion is wether or not the thief with the stealth mechanics as of today, is overpowered or balanced. So far most classes apart from the thief think so, whats more interesting is a fair few thieves (myself included) believe stealth in its current form IS an OP tool against classes in WvV (NOT sPvP or PvE). The thieves who doesnt think so, blame it on lack of skill for all who cant cope with thieves, which is, it seems the majority of the playerbase, which leads me to conclude the essence of the discussion is indeed, if you dont roll a thief, you need to L2P…basically

jportell.2197:

killimandros.5087:

Xsorus.2507:

Stiv.1820:

The only change that is actually needed is a 1 point DD added to Poison Arrow and maybe Trops utility (fix culling too but that’s just a noob crutch excuse, it won’t matter much). A thief should not be able to initiate damage and remain stealthed. Even if the people who die to this are god awful. Trops are so easy to avoid though it’s hard to justify, even PvE players should know to stay out of red circles…

Other than that, showing videos of a thief trolling bads in WvW proves nothing but how terrible a large portion of the WvW player-base is. You can troll a zerg all day but then you run into 2-5 guided decent PvPers and treat them like the masses and they will roll you hard. I wonder if that’s happened to you yet on your Thief OP?

rofl, the population is just bad, so nerf to stealth isn’t needed grin

And no it’s not happened yet… know why?

Because if i get trouble I can teleport away..

I stopped this discussion long time ago. Its obvious all who doesnt play thieves, are terrible players…it all cooks down to that.

Hold on cowboy… Are you saying in order to be a good player one must play a thief? And everyone that doesn’t play a thief is a baddy?

Thats the essence of thjis discussion. I wish we could return to the original topic, which was why stealth and culling is a terrible combination, and why all classes using/abusing stealth need some sorting on their stealth skill to make wvw playable. I played a bit yesterday, and culling has never, ever been this bad before. I doubt I can play with my guildteam until culling is sorted. Ill quote my wvw guild commander; "How on earth am I supposed to make tactical desicions when 9 out of 10 times we engage those 10 people turn out to be 30+++ (we run a 10 man group, and all know the smaller the group the worse do you fare against culling)

Xsorus.2507:

Stiv.1820:

The only change that is actually needed is a 1 point DD added to Poison Arrow and maybe Trops utility (fix culling too but that’s just a noob crutch excuse, it won’t matter much). A thief should not be able to initiate damage and remain stealthed. Even if the people who die to this are god awful. Trops are so easy to avoid though it’s hard to justify, even PvE players should know to stay out of red circles…

Other than that, showing videos of a thief trolling bads in WvW proves nothing but how terrible a large portion of the WvW player-base is. You can troll a zerg all day but then you run into 2-5 guided decent PvPers and treat them like the masses and they will roll you hard. I wonder if that’s happened to you yet on your Thief OP?

rofl, the population is just bad, so nerf to stealth isn’t needed grin

And no it’s not happened yet… know why?

Because if i get trouble I can teleport away..

I stopped this discussion long time ago. Its obvious all who doesnt play thieves, are terrible players…it all cooks down to that.

RyuDragnier.9476:

That makes me wonder…does anybody on the dev team actually PLAY the Ranger class? If not, there’s the problem right there. One does not simply ‘fix’ a class they’ve never played.

Just wanted to make a comment on that; No. Most of the devs play Thieves.

hm, are we talking reroll engine or new core engine? As culling wasnt so bad before xmas patch if im correct?

problem Cries is, stealth affects the vision of smaller groups more than the zerg. So if a small zergbuster squad uses thieves stealth, due to them being less num,bers, they render faster than a zerg using any stealth, so its not a zerg buster, its a zerg booster. The more people the more rendering issues.

Lets pick up the threads, as there are no big good guilds on EB theres no use discussing that.

I still do not see any, not one good reason to nbot make drastical changes to stealth to counter culling and imbalanced fights/abuse.

interesting, as most of the bigger and considered best guilds run wvw mostly for the fights, not the scenarios. They even transfer servers to find those fights…

can you believe it, I got infracted for mentioning a particular game just now and how that game became worse with every expansion….I think im done with this pile of junk game.

I explained it to him yesterday, on skype. He did say, though, you are a"hard".

I dont believe you were being sarcastic. I believe youve just read it or been explained it. Sorry. Shame the reading or explanation didnt fully explain how an ele works, and why venoms. Leaving you with a big 0 (nothing) look in your eyes from this post. Now, stealth and culling abuse. Thats what I was discussing. Btw, you dont need more than 1 stealth to take on an ele. Not even a bs from stealth one. Some videos show thiefs doing this with relative ease, and its not a d/d specc.
I highlight stuff when I know I have the tl;dr gang reading. Hence caps. You cant use more than caps 5 max 6 times anyway, as 7 words become meaningless to them. And if you watched the video, he uses his p/d about half of the fight. WHat does he use the rest of the fight?

They cant do anything, developers are trying to work on it, but it needs loads of coding of the engine. They dont have the time, possibly the money to find a good enough programmer to do it, and also possibly the intention lacks, as wvw is only a small part according to Anet. Bandaid is what we will be given, not a real solution. And before Intigo says “what, or [insert random accusation] stop speculating”, the developers themself confirmed this both officially (on these forums) and unofficially (the same developer who told me thieves would get buffed this patch told me this. Its not gonna happen a solution to culling)

lol you didnt know you can switch to venoms on the run? I suddenly understand why you dont want culling/stealth bug abuse to be fixed….you know, you switch BACK after unless..Are you serious you cant kill eles in 1v1 or 1v2?…and ye, all other players are bad ofc. ofc…its just eles are op, right right? .Btw with the increased survivability (BUFF to HEALING, WHAT are you THINKING about devs? Did any of your dev team consisting of ONLY thieves get killed? Maybe try PLAYING other classes DEVELOPERS!!)) you dont really need to specc into anything anymore. Forget venoms. If, by a miracle you take a bit of beating, your increased healing skills will MORE than enough cover for that. Lets see what we have here; Someone mentioned lowes health pool…..are you nuts? Ill give an example, that GUARDIAN you deem OP (because you cant kill it in 3 secs…FOrgot to add a guard specced like that cant kill anyone in return) have lower hp. Do they whine? I just cant stop myself from thinking, theres a fair few thieves totally agreeing stealth is op etc. then theres the thieves complaining about RANGER PETS, asking for a NERF…….How likely is it those will EVER reach the point they can play any class without chosing the one with the most abuse possibilities? Hold on to the culling abuse, just cling to that one little thing which makes it possible for yourself to pat your backs and call any other players baddies and noobs. You will never get it anway. Shelving MY thief until its fixed.
Down under, another pro-hero, who doesnt know how to swich abilities on the run. Well done sir, well done.

55% certain some pet damage abilities have been nerfed. Maybe to compensate for thieves not being able to abuse rendering vs pets anymore? I dont know, but one things certain, my thief has more survivability AND dps now……

Its true. Target thief /dance before he enters combat, certain of an easy kill, go full evasive and profit from thief thinking why the culling god has left him. Now you really see what culling is, because yor pet now attacks an invisible target 4-5 secs before you see it. But, target pet and attack pets target now

ArcTheFallen.7682:

Xsorus.2507:

ArcTheFallen.7682:

@oZii, he makes a great point in what I was trying to tell these very oblvious people.

The game type we are talking about is capture the point—I am pretty sure Anet knew what they were doing when they made stealth and available feature in this game type. Stealth means you can get away it doesn’t make you impossible to kill—especially if you are in a zerg or decent group. Do you really expect to go to war in the open battlefield and not get sniped? Or let alone (fantasy-wise) get assassinated? Run in a group, capture points.

Stealth has very little to no affect in gaining major points for WvW. And that’s why it’s not imbalanced in WvW. Balance should only be necessary if it actually affects winning or losing the game guys. -_- But a stealthed thief annoying a group and killing one or two guys doesn’t give you more points than a small group holding off a thief while killing a camp veteran.

And also I’m surprised no one is manning up to ask what they can do to which they cannot see. Because there are ways to live against these unseeable things and prevent them from recloaking.

His point is silly, Class Balance is needed in PvP, even if its just for “points”

I could of easily called for reinforcements for an already out gunned side to get screwed over..

We have over 80k points over that team already…

I think you are simplfying WvW though. A lot of factors go into the thieves advantages, it’s not a balance issue. Let’s say WvW was a map of at most 3000 units. Would finding a thief and killing him be bad? Prob not. WvW is so huge, the thief could use a number of areas as a window to escape. That’s one advantage.

The issue with culling, that’s another advantage. All this is present because WvW is a huge warring world, with many people there. The game type is making the thief better than he normally is (if not decent already). So balancing a class due to it’s effectiveness by external factors, not really the class itself is not a good move on a dev part.

The only really good suggestion for this fix is to load the name tags before the model, hopefully eliminating total blindness when they thief is supposed to be out of cloak.

And asking to change WvW’s game type is really out of the question. So it’s best to just play the game of coordination, defending keeps, and capturing points, not the mini-game of deatmatches.

If this is how wvw gonna end up, then I am out. Me and my guild enjoy more roamiing fighting in the field than the slow stale treb bombing walls, repairing, trying a golem rush every now and then. Thats the german servers tactic isnt it? Bunker up etc. tiring the opponent out. Thats not what I want from this game, and its not the only way to play it either.

ArcTheFallen.7682:

jkctmc.8754:

ArcTheFallen.7682:

Also, if you want to talk about balance, please really considering spvping and THEN complain about stealth. As far as I know, CULLING is the issue, which can be procced by huge zergs, mesmers, etc, not just thieves. It’s really childish to blame your problems on one class when it’s caused by more than one thing. If you can show me a pvp match where you are getting murdered in pvp, I’ll believe stealth is a problem then. But last I checked, they aren’t making the top 3 list in pvp.

It must really suck that you suck at playing the Thief. They do not need stealth. I run more stealth on my Mesmer, than I do my Thief now. With our Shortbow teleport, and the Sword “2” teleport you should hardly ever die in a PvP fight.

I wish people would really get good with Thieves. There are so many bad ones out there, it isn’t funny.

Lol, way to call me out when I wasn’t even being negative towards you—I just disagree with the stuff claimed in this thread due to my expereiences. But yes, let’s call my thief bad. Too bad there’s not 1v1s because I’d like to prove a point as opposed to thinking I know what’s up. -_-

Also I dare you to make a pvp post about the thief being one of the best in pvp in the spvp forums. And if the response is in your favor, I’ll give you that.

Heck, why are you even arguing with me, I’m trying to say stealth doesn’t make the thief OP. And you are telling me the thief doesn’t need stealth to be good. Are we not on the same page?

So, your point here is that with an already overpowered class, you can one vs one anyone? I must say that “to prove a point”thingy rather shows how unbalanced it is than not, you know unless hes a thief himself, you will either win or draw…Ye man-pro, go show them

Laika.8795:

killimandros.5087:

Its a shame a nerf intended for wvw hits the pve players :-/

How in the holy hell does a “nerf” that doesn’t reset aggro tables on mobs when you stealth translate, in your mind, to something aimed at WvW?

I don’t mean to be rude, but this does not compute…

I dunno if you got the answer you were looking for, but; steal on trashmobs in wvw is quite frequantly used (well, any ability that you can use on targets to get away and or disappear). It is to stop this, basically they added it. Correct me if I am wrong.

Daendur.2357:

killimandros.5087:

[cut] Not pointing towards anyone, but seriously, why would any player half decent deny culling is an issue that needs to be solved asap unless using/abusing it is the only way to gain?[cut]

Culling IS an issue, stealth mechanic isn’t.

Ppl are crying “nerf stealth” not “remove culling”. I’m up with the “remove culling” shout but not with the “nerf stealth”.
If we are talking about culling you have to point at mesmers firstly.
If we are talking about stealth mechanic. deal with it.

well, from most of the videos I deduct this. Those players being killed so easily, when the thief is seemingly out of stealth, arent bad. Theyre victims to culling. You can almost see when culling is ovewr, 3-4 seconds after the thief is out of stealth they react. If it was one, two, ten, heck id even say 50 players standing still letting the thief do their thing (which I experience myself every time I attack from stealth), I could maybe blame it on bad playu. But when 100%, all, every one of the membners in a huge zerg , in 10 man teams or alone do NOT react, not once, immediately to an unstealthed thief, that says more than anything. I dont deny mesmers culling abuse. Not at all. But, thieves have more stealth abilitiues, and longer ones, creating more rendering issues. Mesmers have 1,5 afaik that are hard. One (the major one) on a loooong cd, and only usabløe for mesmers who wanna stealth large groupsm hence nothing good in a solo roaming build (never saw a roaming mesmer placing stealth line alone, did you?). My personal opinion, and I am ready to take the challenge on my thief, is removal of all stealth in wvw until culling is fixed. Now let the abuse rain.

Kasama, i believe you got it wrong. Maybe, just maybe ranger pets will be faster on thieves again. In any other pvp situation there will be no, zero difference. You will still die. It only nerfed the pve thieves, who were a pretty weak class anyways if im not wrong (never do pve on my thief).

Its a shame a nerf intended for wvw hits the pve players :-/

Xsorus.2507:

oZii.2864:

Wait what?

A) So there was no point at all you effectively did nothing. I am not deflecting anything at all. You just had to type a simple hey anyone close by danelons come to help defend. You probably only need like 4 people to help you hold that off with hylek support and the npcs. Come on you gotta do better than that.

Your counter is I don’t like zerging so I don’t ask for anyone close by to come help me defend danelons? You can you know press 4.

Its not a deflection if the point of WvW is winning if you are going to win the matchup and it doesn’t matter to you about defending anything and you just like to roam around and kill people then your contribution is minimal and you just like to play wvw to fight people I guess.

Nothing wrong with that hey play your way but don’t think its some significant event if you kill 4 upleveled players for objectives you claim your server doesn’t care about because your already winning.

Thats not deflection thats just what it is WvW goal is winning by objectives thats the mode your in. You aren’t forced to do any of those things at all but if your in the back of the windmill dueling your just as effective as your video and thats just what it is. It doesn’t matter at all.

Also all you did was post a video saying hey look this is me on my thief abusing stealth. Yea thats alot to go on. If I said no your not abusing stealth but bleeds I guess that is deflecting in your eyes. Its not like you gave much substance to your point and video to begin with. lol

Again, there is no point in me calling for help, we are up 50k in the score, and We’re already controlling most of the map…I’m not surfing around the map on my thief to “win” by zerging the under populated side..Maybe you get your kicks for that.. but i don’t.

I’m out there to kill the enemy, That is what i’m currently doing when I play the thief.

if I wanted to zerg surf i’d rolled a Rifle Warrior.

The fact that you think i should call for help to zerg an already out gunned side because you don’t like the fact that i’m calling thieves overpowered with stealth speaks volumes on you as a player.

" I am sure xsorus doesn’t walk by and see a underleveled enemy and not attack him cause he is underleveled. Do you? When your out roaming do you not kill that underleveled thats all by himself. You don’t chose your opponents in WvW you just fight whats there or avoid it if you can but that doesn’t mean they wont engage you anyway."

By the way, if I come across an underleveled player, I don’t attack them if they’re solo.

it presents no challenge.

If there is more then one, or they attack me first, I’ll kill the group, or if they’re solo, I’ll down him and then leave

Lol to that distraction. Its like when I wanna have some fun with my 2 year old kid, and points in a random direction yelling"LOOK A PINK WOOLEN DRAGON", making him look away so I can put a gift in front of him and pretend I did magic….its not gonna work. This topic is not about objectives in 3w, its about culling and stealth, and that video showed very well how culling works with stealth.

Neves.2905:

They already fixed the stealth problem by getting rid of C&D stealth off of WvW walls. Thief is a stealth class (or have you guys never played an RPG with a thief class…) There are ways to counter a thief. Learn them.

And OP, you would get owned by any moderately good player…

Lol to the first line. They fixed an abuse which never was part of THIS discussion. I guess you play a thief moderately well since you are so ancious about stealth and culling being fixed, this has nothing to do will wall c’n’d. The problem remains invisible thief due to culling and lag when triggering certain skills unique to thief and mesmer. And the “you bad you mad” is sooo 2007. People complain about this ability in 3 fourths of all complain posts on the wvw section. Makes you wanna think maybe, just maybe the warriors, guardians, hunters, elementalists, mesmers, necros, engineers, never complaining about ANY other class abilities just MIGHT be into something. Yes it would ruin the fun for the baddies (bad thieves), but then again, if all other classes are played by baddies, remove the stealth all together and profit.

To Danedur; theres also a fair number of thieves now themself complaining about this specific issue. Not pointing towards anyone, but seriously, why would any player half decent deny culling is an issue that needs to be solved asap unless using/abusing it is the only way to gain? I have a thief on Gandara, youre free to check if you doubt it.

well, normally the forum base gives a pretty good indication to what the players in general are concerned about. In any of the videos posted of thieves killing tons of people, the response from 95% of the thievces is those players are baddies. Am I right? All players in said movies are bad, bad, bad and unskilled. Dont you see the shallowness in that? Why arent people complaining to the same degree to other classes? If there are so many complaint posts about the same topic, are you gonna dismiss ALL of them as bad players who doesnt know kitten about the game? lol… seriously, Xsorus is one of the better players I know about, I love how he moves his ranger, still hes complaining, and Id put him into the 5% player base. That 5% consists of, according to you, 99% thieves. The rest of the players are just bad, right? They shouldnt be allowed to play hehe. I find myself playing my thief more and more when I roam alone, because I can basically get away from anything, anytime anywhere if I dont get the kill.

asccording to this discussion, around 95% of all players NOT playing thieves, are so bad they really shouldnt be allowed to plat this game. On the other hand 100% of all thieves are so GOOD and PRO mensa will send you an auto invite if you roll thief in gw2

Hey guys, listen to this; we just got a huge buff versus thieves, no kidding :-) Why? Because of the fact their stealth now doesnt reset NPC’s (INCLUDING ranger PETS). Test it? Its like Benny Hill show intro last night. Thief stealth, pet runs around chasingf invisible thief, pouncing and stunning said thief, thief out of stealth, stunned, lol. Even whe the pet cant find the thief immediately, it jumps on him very fast again, because culling doesnt affect NPC’s :-) Maybe not a great patch specifically for the ranger class, but a huge buff versus thieves.

Maybe you should choose Sylvari then :-) Their racial ability isnt awesome (take root isnt it?), but they fit more into your description. I think you can make a blue one if im not wrong. Theyre quite independent (altough not as independent as the Azurta), very careful about nature stuff. They do have a funny walk though, they kinda step on their toes, while the rest of the classes would first thread on their heels..which makes it look like they wanna pee or something. If you just want cat, then its charr all the way. Theyre not very elegant though, and I dont think blue is an option there. About pets and pet ideas, you should just shelf it immediately. None of the classes with pets use them much, apart from ranger who HAS to use it (if I could chose lets say 10% extra damage, id shelf my pet immediately, as it normally dies before reaching its target). But, what about that vanity pet you can buy from the gem store? A cat I think?

see you in-game :-) good luck and have fun

take a peak at the rangers forums here and change your opinion :-) Its totally different from Wow (I have a ranger here and had a hunter in wow), kinda close to ranger in WAR, actually. Those who master it are quite decent, those who doesnt quit fast or reroll :-) You should visit every class-forum before deciding on a class :-)

azuras are nice. Just forget that thing about rangers. Pick any other class hehe :-)

Asuras are small, and have pain-inverter. Most rangers I see these days are small buggers inspired by the pain-inverter ranger guy (whos awesome btw)

There is afaik some sort of lfd system yes. IO do not believe its automatic, like wow, where you get thrown into a dungeon with random kids on a sugar rush, its more like a “hi I saw you were looking for dungeon-x run, and are class y, care to join?” type of dungeon finder. Then again I only do pvp so I might be wrong.