I know there’s a ton of newer players out there who would love to do dungeons but for various reasons have not been able to try. For those of you in this category, my guild is starting dungeon mentoring days where the intent is to let people get their teeth cut in a friendly environment where as long as they meet the minimum level for the dungeon they are welcome to come if we have open groups. No one is going to be told they have to play a certain class, run a certain build, or have to do exactly what we say. You won’t be forced to conform to the current meta that has been forming around dungeons. You can do just about any dungeon path in this game with any mix of classes with a coordinated and experienced group in 30-45 minutes. Our intent for our guild members that have never done any dungeon but Citadel of Flames is to get them to learn coordination and flexibility in their weapon and utility choices, and teaching them the individual dungeon mechanics in a friendly way. No one is going to yell at you, kick you, or make you feel unwelcome. If you’re dying a lot with your current setup we will make suggestions but ultimately your build is your own choice. If any of this interests you feel free to message me in game. We’re not teaching speed farming, just basic dungeon mechanics that will allow you to actually complete paths and enjoy your dungeon runs, cause lets face it if you spend over and hour and aren’t even halfway through no one is having any fun.
Dramen Maidria
Knights of ARES, Dragonbrand
Good times, good memories
Thanks Devon. Variety and uncertainty are good things! Personally, I’d love to get crushed for a few weeks, but a few hours’ delicious anticipation is ample compensation for a week of terror or a week of cruise control. On Maguuma, we’ll enjoy either with our usual, cynical poise. hugs
the t7 is gonna rage quit and WvW lose more ppls VERY GOOD IDEA!
(leave the game not just WvW)
Ah but this would be a mistake. A server at a vast rating disadvantage (to use your example, a 10 Seed versus a 20 Seed, it makes little sense to use tiers now that there is match-to-match mobility) can come out ahead in rating even if it scores less than 0.5 of the points against the higher rated server. That is, there is also pressure on the 10 Seeded server to dominate the match; if the 20 Seeded server is able to put up enough of a struggle (gaining valuable experience against a better team, as well) it might be able to move up a spot—19th Seed. This is the motor behind rank mobility with the newer system.
This guy gets it.
Lower seeded servers could still gain rating even while getting blown out. The math would then re-adjust the following week with higher probability of finding accurate matches in the newly-adjusted rating spread.
Essentially, this should fix glicko’s tendency to only absorb rating points from within your own tier and lead to much more volatility in the positions.
In practice, most players quit playing a particular match for the week when it becomes evident they have no hope of winning. Despite the good points of this system, rankings will remain inaccurate as losing servers fail to field players. Fighting your way up is all well and good in concept, but most players have no comprehension of how rankings work right now, and morale will be low when every fight is a roflstomp.
In the long term, this may be a good change. Right now, it’s going to suck for everyone who likes a fair fight.
Unfortunately, math can’t fix morale. That’s up to each server to figure out.
But what the system WILL do is reward the servers that keep fighting in a blow out rather than quit. If the lower server fights their butts off all week, they might jump up a few places. If the higher server tries to coast through the week, they might drop in ranking even while winning by 200k.
I think the end result will be more accurate rankings for all of the servers. And once that stabilizes a bit, the deviation variable should keep things fresh since you have increasingly less chance of facing an opponent that’s either way too strong or weak for you. WvW has never been about fair fights, but at least the lines between tiers have been blurred a good bit.
In practice, the servers full of people who give up in the face of adversity kind of deserve to get lower ratings.
The higher-rated servers are the ones that continue to fight, no matter what. Under the old system, tier stagnation allowed some servers an easy ride once they fought their way into a tier, but under the new system each server will have to continually prove that they deserve their rating, or risk falling in the rankings.
@DevonCarver thank you for your hard work and communication. You can’t please everyone, but a majority of the community is excited to fight some new opponents.
the t7 is gonna rage quit and WvW lose more ppls VERY GOOD IDEA!
(leave the game not just WvW)
Ah but this would be a mistake. A server at a vast rating disadvantage (to use your example, a 10 Seed versus a 20 Seed, it makes little sense to use tiers now that there is match-to-match mobility) can come out ahead in rating even if it scores less than 0.5 of the points against the higher rated server. That is, there is also pressure on the 10 Seeded server to dominate the match; if the 20 Seeded server is able to put up enough of a struggle (gaining valuable experience against a better team, as well) it might be able to move up a spot—19th Seed. This is the motor behind rank mobility with the newer system.
This guy gets it.
Lower seeded servers could still gain rating even while getting blown out. The math would then re-adjust the following week with higher probability of finding accurate matches in the newly-adjusted rating spread.
Essentially, this should fix glicko’s tendency to only absorb rating points from within your own tier and lead to much more volatility in the positions.
the t7 is gonna rage quit and WvW lose more ppls VERY GOOD IDEA!
(leave the game not just WvW)
Ah but this would be a mistake. A server at a vast rating disadvantage (to use your example, a 10 Seed versus a 20 Seed, it makes little sense to use tiers now that there is match-to-match mobility) can come out ahead in rating even if it scores less than 0.5 of the points against the higher rated server. That is, there is also pressure on the 10 Seeded server to dominate the match; if the 20 Seeded server is able to put up enough of a struggle (gaining valuable experience against a better team, as well) it might be able to move up a spot—19th Seed. This is the motor behind rank mobility with the newer system.
Here’s a random thought to liven things up a little. Not sure if it’s possible but it could be fun.
Once a server ends up x points behind in a battle (say 200,000 or something), then people guesting to those servers are allowed to represent it in WvWvW.
That way, you could have players from more popular servers who are fed up with queues getting into WvW and having a fight, you could breathe life back into the servers who are getting pounded and provide the winning opponent a challenge for the week without really risking affecting the end result.
Perhaps even go as far as to lock the score prior to guesting opening up for the purposes of the ranking system.
And yes, I know it’s unlikely the idea would ever be feasible, but I couldn’t help smiling at the idea of players from the three tier 1 servers suddenly working together and giving the winning tier 9 server a challenge for a couple of days.
Arborstone got a higher tier than us, doesn’t make any sense.
That’s the main reason why RoF is mad about it, not because we ended in tier 9, but because we don’t know how we got there
If the devs could only give us a detailed explanation on how we ended in tier 9…
You see there is something called Randomness, or in other words kitten happens.
The short answer: every week, somebody has to play against Fissure of Woe and Vabbi. Whoever it is, they are probably going to win by a lot.
This week it’s you. Next week it will probably be somebody else.
The advantage of the new system is, one server is no longer stuck playing those two every single week.
I understand that from your perspective, Blacktide having to play them every week is better than you having to play them just once, but that’s not a good outcome for Blacktide — they deserve to play somebody else from time to time. And when they do, somebody else has to play FoW and Vabbi instead.
I’m a commander from Ring of Fire server. Only 2 hours after the reset we had already almost fulled the WvW maps. How are we supposed to spend a week against those servers? This is not WvW and there’s no point on playing a whole week. That’s not a good start for new matchup system.
Well do Fissure of Woe and Vabbi a favour and quit playing for a week. We would appreciate the experience. Otherwise I hope green is your colour because you will see a lot of it over the next few days.
Transferring to Fissure of Woe / Vabbi with your entire guild would be an option as well of course.
Ruins of Surmia (EU)
[Jd] Jam Death
“Work, Hustle, Kill”
Can we all just take a second to appretiaite the work Devon did today to get the system working quick and the changes that were promised made, ignore whether or not this change will be good or bad but that Devon put in a lot of hard work to fix the errors and to make a change for the ever increasing stale matchups…here’s to hoping the change worked as planned and thank you Devon!
Can someone smarter then I explain why a simple system of 1st goes up 3rd goes down wouldn’t work? I’m really getting a sense of over complication here…
Every week will have a T1 server playing a T2 and T3 server, no matter what.. this pattern continues all the way down the ladder. IE T2 server will be playing a T3 and T4 server..
No one in T3 will want to win because they’ll get smashed by whatever monster from T1 loses and no one in T2 will want to win because they’ll get thrown in with 2 T1 monsters.
NSP>ET>SoS>BG>ET>SoS>JQ>SoS>Mag>JQ
My fun laughs at your server pride.
WvW DOES = Zerg fights. The problem is that you seem to think “zergs” are a bad thing. You can demonize the term all you want, but in the end of the day, zergs are nothing more than a large group of people working together towards a common goal. Sorry you hate teamwork in a large scale team-oriented game. There are other PvP options available to you, and I’d suggest you use them.
Zergs <> teamwork…its pretty obvious you didn’t play much other MMOs
Please explain how zergs =/= teamwork.
Zergs:
-Require a large number of players
-Roaming together
-Attacking together
-Healing/Assisting one another
-Taking the same objective
This is basically be the definition of teamwork. You sure have a skewed perception of the word.
Because if the other zerglings were just bots, you’d play the exact same way: rock the keyboard.
Here, I drew you a picture:
Angry mob != team work.
Army platoon = team work.
Only a Wv3 player hears the sound of a gate being hammered on when they fall asleep at night…
are you kidding me? i hear the gate hammer sound in every crack of thunder from the weather SFX up near hills north gate. >.<
anyways…
only a WvWer who’s not online (for whatever reason) would ask their friend/sibling/significant other… while they are mid PvE event/dungeon mind you… “hey, press B and let me look at the score real quick please?!?” guilty
only a WvWer would watch their PvE-preferring spouse log off and go to sleep, and continue to play because there’s “still a tower and 2 camps to recap…” again.. guilty. CAN’T LOG OFF… COMMANDING… MUST RETAKE… LAST… TOWER…
Druids of Dhuum [DoD]|Rally Bait [RALY] ~o hai there :D~ LONG LIVE ET
Only a WvW player goes to BLTC npc for every single transaction.
Only a WvW player wonders why the risens in Orr doesnt drop badges.
Only a WvW player think that Black Citadel is a dungeon.
