Guild Wars 2

warbignime.4610:

You guys should compare WoW expansion reveal to HoT, or even ff14 heavensward. Most of MMORPG are vague about their expansion too, there are no weekly live stream about the content neither weekly detailed blog post. Just check wow MoP reveal page, all they did are listed features and a very short portion of the reveal video and that’s pretty much it. How much more do you guys want? Anet won’t tell you every detail neither but that’s the same with every game expansion ever. People are having ridiculous expectations and it bothers me.

Your logic:
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/bandwagon
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum

Jermoe Morrow.9501:

• Saw the in-game thing, and was all excited.
• Saw the ultimate option had a gem discount, and was “:-O want!”
• Saw that standard didn’t come with a character slot when every previous guild wars series expansion that added classes did, and I would also be paying for a base game account I don’t get, and literally logged out of game in disgust.

I am no stranger to the gem store, and was literally moments from dropping a hundred dollars on a game with no release date like it was nothing, but how can I morally support this nonsense? Anet has clearly changed from their gw1 days, and this is a change I can’t support. And for that, Anet just lost out on a $90 sale, and ensured that I probably won’t making any gem purchases for awhile(I had been eyeing up more than $50 worth of stuff). Makes you wonder how many more sales like that they lost.

Now if Anet were to come to their senses, and added a character slot to the standard version(even if just for veteran players like in GW1), then they could easily count on my purchase of the ultimate edition.

You made a moral choice sir

2 would be honorable, as that would at least be what GW1 players were used to.

Soyaman.7096:

I mean.. Really this is just an overpriced game, nothing more nothing less.

Totalbiscuit covered games like Dungeons 2 (Or was it Jim Sterling?) Saying “It was alright, but rather expensive” (Not actual quote)
The game itself is 45 euro (60 dollar?)

I know this is an expansion and not the same thing – While I agree the pricing is a bit over the top it’s not like it’s anything worth covering.
Not to mention we’re on top of E3.

Their FAQ ninja-delete is false advertising, deal with it.

Anets recent activities need to be brought into the general discourse by these prominent YouTubers. Issues like the FAQ scandal are exactly what is wrong with the industry these days, and should always be pointed out as soon as they occur.

This whole fiasco needs to be brought to PC reviewers such as TotalBiscuit. This is truly a problem that journalists will cover as it ranges from unfair, to greasy, to possibly illegal. If lets all tweet major YouTubers and get this story covered.

I will tweet/msg and I hope others do as well. Remember, this isn’t the first time Anet tested the waters of legal action. That whole glitch back when where they had a merchant selling some item for cheap karma? They banned users then changed their mind once lawyers started to salivate.

Btw, since it usually works.

Jim Sterling Jim Sterling Jim Sterling

I’m not surprised these rascals arent commenting in this thread.

Raven.3957:

Blackworm.2167:

Raven.3957:

Bitoku Kishi.8346:

This “extra slot or base game” a good idea. They should definitely give a character slot no matter what for players that already have the GW2 base game. Because let’s face it, how many are going to be sitting on an unused character slot if you’ve already been playing the game? (my guess is almost none)
Players that are coming in fresh can get both games together, and won’t necessarily need an extra slot. But if we already have the base game, it should just automatically give us a free extra slot instead when we purchase any version of HoT.

Some people really are sitting on an extra character slot. The 800 gems is perfect because if they are, the free slot means nothing to them. But 800 gems is.. 800 gems.. lol

You cant go wrong with the 800 gems. If your a new player you choose the core game, if your a veteran player with an open character slot, you get a free 800 gems, and if your a vet player without a character slot, you buy a characterslot with the 800 gems. Everyone wins, no one gets angry with getting ripped off. And best of all, it costs Anet NOTHING to do this fix. They dont have to change any pre-existing orders, refund anyone anything, or go back on their word. They just have to hand out the option to get one thing or the other.

Even though this idea is better than the current state of things, I have to wonder how the value of the base game ($50) equates to the value of 800 gems ($10).
Newcomers still get a vastly better deal, no matter which way you spin it.
To make it equal, the 4000 gems ($50) included in the $100 bundle is what we should really be getting. We already paid the other (mandatory) $50.

That way it’s $50 for HoT (Like everyone), $50 for something (gems) rather than nothing (taking the place of our now-invalidated GW2 purchase), and $0 for GW2 since it’s now free.

Gw2 core game is not going to be free forever. Devs have already posted that its only being included free currently as part of the pre-purchase deal. Eventually the core game will cost XX$ and the HoT expansion will cost 50$

The issue here and now isnt that 50$ for just the expansion is too much, its that new comers are getting amazing deals on buying the expansion, and the veteran players are paying 50$, then having to pay an additional 10$, paying 60$ total for the same content that newbies are paying 50$ for. It should be the other way around, and it would have been that way if they didnt include the core game for free. Because then people would have bought (like many did) the Gw2 Core while it was on sale for 10$, then 50 for the expansion. Meaning everyone paid 60$ to play HoT in the end. Not favoring anyone one way or the other. This blaintent favoring of new players and punishing the old ones is whats gotten everyone’s panties in a bunch.

A lot of text. But none of it fixes the false advertising claim users legitimately have.

Daxxter.8920:

I am also afraid that “challenging content” means zerging tequatle like gameplay, we do not have information on that portion also. The only thing we know as of now is what we are not getting which is kind of lame for a reputable company like Anet.

Do you think Blizzard became what it is based on probabilities? The players knew each and every time what their money would get them before even being able to drop a single penny on the game and expansions and that even a year before the launch date which also was not a secret.

If beta taught me anything, its basically SW part 2 in terms of “challenging content”.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

The problem is not that the expansion isn’t worth $50, most mmo expansions are like that and I’m more than willing to pay, the problem is that new players are getting the same amount of content for half the price, that they only need to pay $50 whereas senior/veteran players had to pay $100(50 for original gw2 50 for expansion). How is that fair? How can anyone defend that? It’s like a slap in the face to those of us that have been loyal to the game since launch, that we have to pay more, twice as much even, then the new players to play the same amount of content, that is the problem, that is where anet is screwing us over.

This is true, Anets scummy move alienates 2 kinds of users.

1. The legacy user that may paid the full price a long time ago, who has many hours on all alts and will now have to caugh up 800 gems, delete a likely lvl80 toon on all slots, or give into an upsale ultimatum. Also, as you stated, your loyalty and likely history of gem store purchases is worth nothing. They cant even give 2 slots like they did in GW1, or gems, or anything.

2. The new user (myself) who thought the upcoming expansion was an expansion, so I got the game ahead of time. I am new, don’t have much in the way of account bound stuff but I like my toons and dont want to be made to delete them to access content made on an old engine at nearly the cost of a new AAA game. Its weird that there is no stated compensation for either of us. What this tells me, gut instinct, is “run.. go to another MMO… give another dev a try”.

shadyrussian.7986:

And this is when I stop playing guild wars 2. Im so sick of companies taking advantage of the individuals that make their company possible in the first place. We buy the game and support the developers by giving them our hard earned money just to only be taken advantage of later on what a joke. I hope they lose at least half the community by doing this.

Its going to be bad. With so many buying alts that will mean waves of bots from the reseller keys no longer useful because of HoT. Cant say they dont deserve it.

On the bright side, BDO starts in August. If they can keep the P2W factor at bay I may forget GW2 ever existed, unless somehow they make good on their FAQ deceit and general greasy business ethics.

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

mrstealth.6701:

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

sigh why do i bother you wont understand or choose not too which ever it is do as you will i care not ill be buying the expansion with or without input that’s all i care about i can give the code the core game to my brother maybe he’ll like the game too and we can play it together

You don’t get a core game code, you get a single code for HoT+ core game. You add that to your existing account, and get nothing but HoT.

well then i could just buy him the game with the leftover money i have after buying the expansion it really makes no difference to me

Why are you telling us this? Useless information..

Anyways. I think its pretty much a fact that for those who purchased in the last ~3 months the only viable solution is to make an alt. We havent earned much in the way of account-bound stuff (mostly dungeon token stuff for me). For those of us with full alts, its a waste to lose a slot when I could have 5 and transfer the gold to my superior HoT account. Sure I lose ez access to my primary but again I dont have much invested. Better to gain 5 slots than lose one toon. 1 slot for everyone, and 800 gems for recent purchasers post-FAQ lies would be prudent.

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

sigh why do i bother you wont understand or choose not too which ever it is do as you will i care not ill be buying the expansion with or without input that’s all i care about i can give the code the core game to my brother maybe he’ll like the game too and we can play it together

Good for you. Preorder 10 copies, we truly don’t care what you do.

TheToxicFox.8710:

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

they have told us its for new players many times now but were too much in a rage to care they need to get money somehow obviously you don’t know how much a video game costs to make and the matter of transparency hah you don’t know business then they don’t have to tell us anything they could say oh yes this will happen and not give jack crap about what we say the fact Anet does care is that they are the rare exception to big business

Fanbase > Income > Anet

Must I say more. Your statement is ignorant and preposterous! Businesses, whether big or small, MUST listen to it’s fanbase if they are to make an income. That’s where all their money comes from.

Sure Anet could treat it’s customers like you stated but they would only become a mocked version of EA or Ubisoft and would lose the fanbase they have today.

At least EA has more than two games, and actually I dont have to lose access to my achievements if I buy an expansion or DLC like I do with Anet.

Otokomae.9356:

Bassjunkey.9746:

If they add a slot the purchase would be a nobrainer to me. Without it´s just a rip-off EA-STYLE….
I don´t wanna pay for the failure of Wildstar and those other kittenty NC games…

Alexxander.8306:

Ive never seen something of this low character before, not even from EA. Ive never seen a map pack for example where you’d have to delete access to another map from a prior game. You have to pay extra to not lose content you paid $40 for already. Gross.

EAnet……………………..

EAnet…. indeed.
You broke the code.

I guess Anet was too good to be true. Why isnt GW2 on Origin?

briggah.7910:

Tachyon.5897:

I know. I don’t what whomever thought that idea up was thinking when they put that idea to paper, but it’s beyond ridiculous. What I’d do is this. If the expansion key is linked to an already existing account then the free copy of the core GW is be replaced with a couple of character slots.

Well I already pre-ordered a bundle pack and have already purchased several extra character slots over time. I won’t need a couple more free character slots. If this does happen I will demand anet step in and compensate me on only what I feel the free copy of the core game is worth. /sarcasm

Cool story.

I want an extra slot for the content I would hypothetically buy since I don’t want to pay a $10 fee for kitten expansion.

Strix Nebulosa.3579:

I love this game just as much as the rest of you guys. As much as I think the price is a tad high, I have to look back at the history of this company and recognize they have worked hard to foster a culture of listening to the voice of their players and caring about the quality of what they give us. Now, no-subscription-fees is a must for the future of MMOs. However they have to pay all those amazing employees who use their creativity, imagination and ingenuity to create a game I play all the time. I trust they struggled to find the best price for this expansion and either they have their reasons (such as they need to pay their employees) or they made a mistake. Either way they are listening to us and I know they will try and find a balance that in the end supports the future of this game! (cause I can’t wait to explore the jungle by glider!! EEEK!)

No, they arent listening to us. Not yet. I was in the beta, what I saw of Maguuma was somewhat “EEK” but at the cost of a character slot and forfeit of dignity, nah. Black Desert has a clean slate, and Heavensword is on sale. I hope Anet fixes this by the time the Steamsale ends.

Fastfood.6570:

I’ve never posted on a game’s official forum before, and with a thread this populated I’m not sure I’ll even be read, but I feel pretty strongly here so I’m taking the time to post.

I have no problem with paying $50 for an expansion; in fact I bought the deluxe edition of GW2 and was planning on doing that for HoT. I’m fortunate in that the cost of video games isn’t really material to me. My issue right now is that If I buy a deluxe version it needs to be because I want to support the game, not because I feel forced to.

Like many players, I have no open slots. I bought three and I’m now 8/8 (one of each class.) That effectively sets the price of the expansion to $60 for me, because one of the features I’m most excited about is the new class.

It feels like an exploitation of my goodwill the way things are priced. I look at the three tiers, and it feels like I’m being forced towards a higher tier just because I’ve played and supported the game up to this point. That is something I am not ok with.

I see other concerning behaviours, like the fact that the base game was essentially put on a fire sale for quick cash before being bundled with HoT. This doesn’t directly effect me, and I won’t be so selfish as to be upset that others are getting the base game for free. I do feel bad for the people who bought the game 1-3 months ago thinking they needed it for the expansion and are now caught in a rough place. They were mislead by a FAQ that was ninja-edited by ArenaNet. This is not the sort of behaviour I’ve come to expect from company that historically has valued it’s player base.

The result for me has been I’ve decided not to pre-purchase HoT, and will likely wait for a price drop before picking up the standard edition. I’m pretty shocked because before the announcement I was confident I would instantly order the deluxe edition.

I hope TotalBiscuit does a video on this.

Anyways, I think the most level-headed proposal is the obvious character slot and some gems for previous owners, at least 800 gems to make up for us being lied to. Or else I am basically forced to make an alt as the opportunity cost of 5 slots is too much.

Vegeta.2563:

Regina Buenaobra.6193:

To clarify: $50 is the price of the expansion. We included the core game as a free bonus to make it easier for new players to get into it.

It WAS stated in the FAQ that players would be required to buy the base game in order to use Heart of Thorns. Now that FAQ was changed at the last day right as HoT pre-orders go live. So all those players that bought the game back when the game was 75% Off, didn’t need to buy the game back then. This is why a lot of people are kittened off. We want our $10 back!!!

I think previous owners should simply get the USD79 deal OR they make an inbetween with the character slot and some sweet for their lies, perhaps 800 gems.

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

sigh all this rage for what a slight lie whoop dido have you ever considered that they didnt think of the fact they would do a bundle deal when they posted the FAQ months ago i mean they are only human humans make mistakes no one is perfect

I know you must be young, since you have demonstrated no knowledge of how advertisement laws work. Go ask your mom or dad what fraud is, and perhaps sit on their lap and read some sites that documented the recent Red Bull case since it had a lot of publicity. Maybe some day in an econ class you will write a paper about it.

Altapir.2571:

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

yet when this is all over and your rage is done you’ll buy it anyway so what is the point of this again?

You certainly don’t know what consumers accomplished through the years thanks to “raging”

Well, it’s easy to stay calm when you pay your games with daddy’s money…

Don’t worry bout him, he’s one of those “paid mod whiners will never succeed” types. Their qq threads when Valve pulled it due to the PR damage were delicious. They are just noise. Perhaps this problem needs to be addressed similarly with a petition, its already had a remarkable effect once this year perhaps its time to do it again.

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

yet when this is all over and your rage is done you’ll buy it anyway so what is the point of this again?

Actually, I won’t. I will wait till HoT is cheap on a reseller site and open an alt account since I dont want to delete a toon OR I may end up liking BDO which goes into open beta soon, orr I may take Heavensword for a spin. I, and many others, are not addicted to GW2. Its just an MMO that I like, one of several. One that is disrespecting its consumers.

Felix.9170:

What bothers me is the above mentioned “Batteries not included” aspect. They have hyped the new class but if I want to play it i have to spend an additional $10 for a character slot.
There are the other issues about the value of content and what-not but for me that is not as big an issue as selling an expansion that then requires an additional expansion to utilize the content advertized!
I will state for the record that the addition of 800 gems, the cost of a character slot, for existing accounts would be a fine resolution and if this happens I will buy the pre-order despite the other reservations I have.
It then becomes a matter of Anet convincing the majority that the new content is worth the $50 price tag, which for some of us, apparently, will take some doing.

Batteries not included is a good example, but its actually worse since you lose time invested in your toon that gets deleted to access content you paid for. Whereas a couple AAs could cost like $5, you lose more than $5 worth of time.

mrstealth.6701:

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

abuse hahahah that was funny last i checked you were the one whining about a game abuse is not that they can trample over us if they wanted but they dont and the fact they’ve broken no laws business wise or otherwise means they can do as they please

The 6 months of telling us that we needed to buy the core game separately before buying HoT looks a lot like false advertisement, which I do believe there are laws against.

They were using false pretenses to sell copies of the core game. Even going so far as to have special sale discounts marketed as getting ready for HoT.

It is false advertisement, remember Red Bull? Even an asinine case such as “it doesnt actually give wings” is valid depending on the state it is filed in. If the suit is filed by a Californian then it could be valid.

Raven.3957:

Its an easy fix. The starter pack just has to offer the base game OR 800 gems along with the HoT expansion(Keeping in mind that the other two packages are the starter PLUS stuff so its for all of them really).

Everyone wins, no one has to refund anything, anet dosent have to pay money. Its that simple.. 800 gems.

The sad part is it would make far better sense for a newer user to simply have an alt version of the game with HoT and one without it. I have no idea if that is against the rules or not as I havent considering doing it but realistically what benefit is there to upgrading.

You LOSE character slots lol (opportunity cost), and if you are new you also lose (opportunity cost) the daily and chest farming capacity of 10 accounts. If you simply start a new account you get all that HoT has to offer, lose nothing since you have so little (being new) and you gain 5 slots. What possible benefit for a pre-HoT new user to GW2 is upgrading? Unless having 2 game copies is against the rules even the account-bound stuff cant add up to the daily farming capacity of 10 toons.

burntcrispy.4527:

I am on the an extra char slot or 800 Gems for those who already had the base game option. Or give the char slot or Gems to everybody and give something like a title and a skin/outfit/mini for those that already had the base game; Just something to say yeah we remember you.

Oh and a sale on char slots would be nice. Reduced price during the pre-purchase period, add a limit of 1 or 2 at the reduced price if you like.

Now onto the head in the cloud portion of this post:
Personally I think the price should have been lower, but lowering the price now would cause too many problems. I also don’t think it would have hurt to give the dollar amount of gems with the expansion and game considering how quickly gems can be spent, and aNet looses very little. But I don’t actually expect it to happen or many to agree with that point; I am not willing to go through all the car dealer and other analogies defending it (rolls eyes).

I want a char slot minimum. Remember, we paid twice what new users do. The just option would be more slots than 2, but I expect next to nothing from this developer now.

$40 average for someone that didnt grab it on kitten sale.
$50 for the expansion.
$90 vs $50.
The only advantage a user who purchased the game recently has is a little extra time. As it stands I lose a toon if I upgrade if I want access to the primary content of the new game, the new class and its pathways.

AlexanderFalkor.4765:

like i said they are a business they need to make money somehow even if its by less than perfect methods they are a small business not a multi million dollar corporation they cant afford to be giving stuff away for free the fact that they gave the core game away its risky and unprofessional but it was necessary and simple solution to this problem if your unwilling to pay the price don’t buy the game

So abuse customers, sorry your logic isn’t good. They can find ways to sell product through, i dunno, making gem store items worth something? I know it sounds crazy but they actually added a MT store which could potentially add revenue. The more you know.

Anet just spat in my face, showed me a revenanat (I was in beta), I foolishly gave them the benefit of the doubt I would get to use it upon purchasing their GAME PRICE expansion, but no I must delete a toon in order to use the primary content of the expansion (the new class).

I guess I’ll have to get into Black Desert Online, at least they won’t pull greasy stunts like this. Its not entitlement to expect a character slot at the $50 price point, when again the class of the expansion is the most interesting part for so many. Its literally an ultimatum to upsell to a character slot upgrade or delete a toon. Ive never seen something of this low character before, not even from EA. Ive never seen a map pack for example where you’d have to delete access to another map from a prior game. You have to pay extra to not lose content you paid $40 for already. Gross.

EDIT: I wanted to add, since users who are new get 5 slots while existing owners who paid the same price 2 times LOSE content or pony up an extra twenty.

Its added salt to the wound. Anet makes me sick.

When I bought GW2, my friend who suggested it to me had a glowing review of Anet. I was new to Guild Wars, and had been away from MMOs in general for a long time. I never believed him, but nonetheless Anet has actually surprised me with how greasy they are willing to be as a company.

Imagine having 5 characters that you like, and although without evidence expecting that with the sizable purchase of a (they censor the price of the base expansion) expansion for a game using old tech you will get an added slot for the character you pay to access.. only to find out that they are upselling their character slot upgrade.

I actually had a sick feeling, I felt like I was on Origin or Uplay when I saw that. Total disbelief. I hope Anet changes this, I hate seeing it when companies exploit their users in these sorts of ways, “delete ur alt or no revenant in the expansion u paid for lolololol”. Rant over, I guess I’ll wait till G2A or Kinguine has HoT on a sale since I wont pay asking price for content I cant have without sacrificing content I already paid for.

Ah ok. Will just sit on it till hot.

Im making a Spinal Blade Pack for my rev. If i equip it to him in beta will I lose it on launch?

Anets policy appears to be “no fun allowed”.

As a new player I wasn’t expecting to have entered into a game where time-gating and downgrades to mediocrity were basic MO. Dungeon tokens were nerfed before I got here, drops for cool looking MF stuff, builds gone to satisfy crying PvPers as if PvE doesn’t exist. For competitive games I play actual competitive games. Having PvP-side nerfs seems like the best way to go about this imo.

GW2’s legacy from what I can see is:

1. Fun/ez to get – timegate!! nerf farming!! make it artificially difficult!!

2. Build works quite well in PvE but no meta counter in PvP yet – ruin build!! E-Sport MLG Gosu Gamers play GW2, they do!!!!

3. Dare I say it.. (insert thing) translates to decent gold? – Nerf for the love of gems!

I wasn’t here for the good old days and I’m not certain if any are ahead of this game. The nerf/fun ratio (for PvE) seems in favor of migrating to a different mmo. I’m in beta for HoT I hope it has signs of improvement. I don need instant gratification, but I dont like how time gating makes the version of the game better for everyone before me and I dont like how PvP can’t be separate from the kick back experience I want from PvE ( and I do play both PvP and PvE for the record and engies have never bothered me).

Wait you were trying to dungeon without being a lvl 80 zerk? what is a “necro”? O.o

I accidentally bought a stack of an item only needed one of, no idea how, no confirmation, all of a sudden im out 11 gold. Compare this to any other trading sim or real trading software I use and its objectively horrible even compared to F2P mmo systems. To compound the insult I get taxed to redeem the cost of a mistake due to sloppy design. Fortunately I have decent amount of gold, doesnt change or excuse the sloppy UI. It needs confirmations if its going to have very strange input methods.

EDIT: one other issue, the search engine for TP is worthless. I typed in the name of a rune yesterday and got totally unrelated results.