Guild Wars 2

You can have your opinion about how not awesome Guild Wars 1 is in comparison to Guild Wars 2, but there is a reason that you are the minority. Obviously, Guild Wars 2 has better graphics. That doesn’t change a thing (see World of Warcraft). The game was also by no means a perfect game series.. but it seemed like there was much more time put into the game.

Guild Wars 1 Story:
May not have been perfect.. but it was light years better than the story revolving around Guild Wars 2. If it was not a game but rather a book.. which would you rather read? I believe in book form the story about Scarlet could be pretty fascinating. But there are countless stories revolving Guild Wars 1 lore that, in my opinion, would be either just as or more fascinating. Of course this is not a completely fair assessment since Guild Wars 1 had a ton of more content. But if you only included prophecies vs Guild Wars 2 stories. Prophecies is much more intriguing.

Guild Wars 1 classes:
Were actually all very unique in respect to the next. This is something that Guild Wars 2 lacks very heavily. Not only were the classes unique amongst other classes, but there seemed to be an infinite ways to play every class. A few listed below without going into the multi-classes too much.

Ranger
(Trap Master Ranger, Ranger Spike/Interuptor, Condition, Spirit)

Warrior
(Weapon master warrior, wammo, shock/gust warrior, IWAY, or you could go super tanky Defy/Endure Pain style)

Necro
(Condition master, Minion Master, Curse, Spike Necro)

You get the point… But because of the million different ways you could play. You could literally play your character for years and still find new ways to play him.

As far as PvP you had Deathmatch Arena, Capture the flag, Guild vs Guild, and specialized scenario type matches in Hall of Heroes.

Question:
There is really a lot more that I could say about the game… but I ask you. How much could you really say about Guild Wars 2?

EDIT: I apologize this is not the best formatting but I am on my way out the door.

@ Dawdler you are quoting the wrong person.

Take a look at the formatting for the post. All of the quotes are bolded, everything under is a response to those quotes.

+1 @ Knichtus…someone who actually gets it.

IMO there is obviously not an obvious answer to this question. Advantages and disadvantages although they can determine probability still lacks statistics needed to prove anything.

I have stated a major flaw early in this thread that according to this “lore” there are very little scenario’s in this “lore.” One fight cannot be used to determine the facts as their are exceptions to most rule of thumbs.

Aside from my arguement. I would also like to acknowledge that it never occured to me which Spirit the Norn was more aligned with. That is a fine example of both a variable and perspective that should be used when talking about these things. Very well written response. I commend you for it.

To the OP

This has become even more of a problem lately, with some servers ahve 10+ AC’s inside of one tower, absolutely destroying the ability to siege a tower with anything short of 60 players.

I disagree with this. I believe that if your opponents have 10 well places arrow carts, then its supposed to be hard to take that tower. That is kind of the point, in my opinion this is what is lacking in WvW. There is absolutely not enough effort put into defense. There is way to much capturing and abandoning taking place.

Everyone who has played WvW for more than 30 minutes has experienced situations like this:
http://i.imgur.com/UB23pYV.jpg

Just wanted to point out that it does not matter if you have a million arrow carts if you have nobody available to man the siege. Looking at that screenshot it appears you are the only defender.

Currently, it takes half a second to stand below a wall and throw an arrow cart up above at it where it can only be hit by 1 or 2 skills, while still raining death on everyone down below. This “fixed” placement would make it actually able to be destroyed by players on the outside. Yes, this would prevent 5 people from being able to defend a structure from 30 people, but how realistic is it for them to be able to do that anyways?

It would require actual players to be there to defend AS WELL as the siege being placed. The siege is supposed to ->Supplement<- the army, not be the army.

In my opinion, I feel that seige is a bit lackluster in comparison to getting out their and fighting off your attackers. Currently, seige is really only affective to support ground defenses. Seige alone will not repel any zerg without ground forces.

Guild Wars 1 was just a much better game. More in depth story, better replay value, more versatile builds, the ONLY downside to the game was there was a lack of player interaction in comparison to its competitors.

QQ still miss GW1 Ranger…

In a proper group, melee stacking, with limited dodging greatsword blows hammer out of the water. But it amazes me how people seem to think that Greatsword is so godlike in dungeons.

Greatsword is only significantly higher if you are melee stacking properly on mobs. Otherwise, its really not that great..

Try doing what the man says instead of posting your troll responses. In a normal group without melee stacking it does not do more damage but it is on par in terms of damage.

I have tried many builds for warrior my opinion is unbiased. I have preference but I could care less if a build is optimal or sub-optimal but I can say that his points are completely valid.

Conclusion:
Fine, I guess that you like getting owned by Hammer/Bow Warriors. Just want you to understand that if you do not promote build diversity you promote the cheese meta that currently plagues the class.

It is true Hammer/bow requires very little skill. But the problem will persist. Yes you are going to continue to be cheese, and yes I am going to laugh at you when you are facerolled.

Lack of build diversity promotes cheese but if you prefer to keep things as they are then so be it.

Their are going to be many more hammer bow face roll warriors because of a lack of other viable alternatives. So if you are one of the crybabies on this forum upset because a Warrior owned you then laughed, it’s probably your own fault.

Sartharina.3542:

Norn have a more ‘stable’ gait, and by extension somewhat less range of motion, but can get to any point in that range of motion nearly immediately. Charr lack the equillibrium and stability due to their digitigrade stance, tails, and arched/hunched spine that don’t allow their hips, shoulders, knees,base of the skull, and ankles to remain aligned vertically with the center of gravity, and remain aligned as they move in any direction. Charr would be better at maneuvering around a battlefield because of their dynamic posture and long arms, but they lack the agility to move within their own space as well.

It’s less “Puma Vs. Ape” and more “An Oversized and Clawed King Kong vs. A Very Fast Gipsy Danger”, in terms of how a battle likely goes down.

I would love to see how meaningless this post would be with just one slash by a charr to the Norn’s kidney.

eg. Power doesn’t mean anything if your ribs are broken.

Rampage Jackson vs Wanderleigh Silva

I think this suggestion is totally legit. Might Stacks = Bleed stacks.

That is the entire point of corrupting boons. This type of hard counter play is exactly what is needed in order to balance this game. There needs to be more build diversity in this game. This is one way to achieve that.

I am not suggesting that stacking boons is OP but I do believe in this philosophy and tend to agree that there should be choice in regards to boon stacking.

Great idea OP

Quantity over Quality is the theme here obviously.

Not necessarilly, the nerf was also to trinkets in general. Before trinkets provided a much higher crit damage in comparison to other pieces of armor. Trinkets are normalized and celestial crit damageor now known as ferocity was also nerfed.

I have provided plenty of counter examples in regards to how important strength is in a one on one fight. I see no rebutes, only contradiction.

Kimbo vs Matt Mitrione UFC 113
ken shamrock vs royce gracie UFC 1
Muhammad Ali vs George Foreman
sugar ray leonard vs roberto duran

In all these fights, the evidence of stregnth was clear. But had absolutely zero factor in the fights. I find it hard to believe as a Martial Arts instructor you think that strength is more of a factor than skill, speed, knowledge, timing.

Very hard to believe…

Dustfinger.9510:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Let me also take this debate a couple posts back where someone was talking about how strength doesn’t win martial arts/street fighting fights, and a couple posters, including you Dustfinger, were saying it does and that it makes the only difference in a fight (at least that’s what I got from the post). I am a martial artist and I can tell you that strength is definately not the winning factor in a fight.

The 2 most important attributes you can have in a fight are agility and knowledge. Agility far outweights strength in the fact that not only will you land more blows but also avoid them than an opponent who is less agile. Knowledge comes in several flavors, but off the top of my head, knowing combat and countercombat strategies, and knowing your opponent.

Those 2 factors alone win the fight. You could have half the strength of your opponent and and still easily win the fight armed with these 2 alone. I’ve seen hulking, muscle bound guys get taken down by chubby or even skinny guys simply because the muscle bound guy couldn’t land a hit on them.

Off the track, yet still on topic, game mechanic wise, I think Norn combat movements feel clumsy compared to Charr. Now, I’ve only played a Norn ranger, so I can only comment from that perspective. I ended up deleting him because of it. I always felt like an oaf that might accidently stab myself. Maybe it was the disportionate body features or the droopy man-boobs. /shrug.

Allow me to clear something up for you. As a hand to hand combat instructor in the Marine corps, I would never say that strength alone is the deciding factor in a fight. I’m not sure how you could have gotten that from anything I posted.

What I did say is that the strength advantage is undeniable. The problem with relying on agility to outweigh a strength advantage is that the agility disparity needs to be so great that the stronger opponent should barely be able to touch the one that tholds the agility advantage. But we have no evidence in lore that charr have this kind of large generalized agility advantage. So even if they have some kind of agility advantage, lore history has shown that it simply wasn’t enough to compete with a less organized, stronger opponent. That means that any agility advanatage the charr may have isn’t big enough to make a great difference. Is strength the only factor in a fight? Not at all. But all factors included, we have been shown who would generally win and the huge strength disparity that norn hold was no doubt a factor. Especially considering the large disadvantages that norn inherently share. Namely their disorganization.

Dustfinger.9510:

1 on 1, it would tend to be Norn. Despite a cultural shift to more sedentary proffessions, they are still a species of giant warriors with supernatural strength. And melee weapons are still viable in todays Tyria.

Dustfinger.9510:

Drakkon.4782:

Charr are larger than Norn. They’re stronger than Norn. They’re born and bred for battle. Norn are born to hunt. There’s a difference. I’ll take a Charr every time. When my back’s to the wall, I’ll take a Charr at my side over a Norn. The only creature I’d take over a Charr would be a Kodan. But of the playable races, Charr. Every time. I don’t know where people are getting that Norn are bigger and stronger than Charr. The lore clearly contradicts that. Charr are the fiercest creatures playable.

So much is wrong here. Norn are bigger than charr. Norn are many times stronger than charr. Norn aren’t just big humans. They are fairy tale giants. Norn have been scaled down a couple times for game mechanics but Norn are larger and stronger by far. Charr are bred for organized battle. Norn are bred for individual battle. Lorewise, a charr got picked up by the scruff of her neck and tossed across the room one handed by a norn. There’s no comparing the strength of a norn and a charr. And lorewise, one norn can take out a warband of charr.

It’s a puma fighting a gorilla. Puma has teeth and claws but they can’t compete with the raw strength of the gorilla.

I could reference more of your post regarding strength as deciding factor if you like.. but I would not want to be banned by moderators for something so trivial…

But that is beside the point, my posts have all been pretty consistent. As a martial arts instructor you should already know what has been pointed out. There are other factors in skilled combat much more than strength alone, that play more of a role in a deciding factor.

I’m pretty sure my post have been pretty consistent but you seem to be going back and fourth a bit.

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Kalavier.1097:

Dustfinger.9510:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

It says that your point isn’t always true.

Any general rule already allows for the possibility. pointing out an incident where a 10 year old severly hurts an adult doesn’t disqualify the general rule that an adult will tend to be able to beat a10 year old.

Exactly my point, thank you Dustfinger.

“In general” never means “Always true”.

Well at least your willing to admit that.

Let me also take this debate a couple posts back where someone was talking about how strength doesn’t win martial arts/street fighting fights, and a couple posters, including you Dustfinger, were saying it does and that it makes the only difference in a fight (at least that’s what I got from the post). I am a martial artist and I can tell you that strength is definately not the winning factor in a fight.

The 2 most important attributes you can have in a fight are agility and knowledge. Agility far outweights strength in the fact that not only will you land more blows but also avoid them than an opponent who is less agile. Knowledge comes in several flavors, but off the top of my head, knowing combat and countercombat strategies, and knowing your opponent.

Those 2 factors alone win the fight. You could have half the strength of your opponent and and still easily win the fight armed with these 2 alone. I’ve seen hulking, muscle bound guys get taken down by chubby or even skinny guys simply because the muscle bound guy couldn’t land a hit on them.

Off the track, yet still on topic, game mechanic wise, I think Norn combat movements feel clumsy compared to Charr. Now, I’ve only played a Norn ranger, so I can only comment from that perspective. I ended up deleting him because of it. I always felt like an oaf that might accidently stab myself. Maybe it was the disportionate body features or the droopy man-boobs. /shrug.

Great minds think alike..

Rouven.7409:

The benefit of strength is undeniable, as is the benefit of speed. Strength does very little to you if the fight is over in ten seconds.

If my memory serves me correct there is no description on how the changing of shapes works for norn. They could be very vulnerable for attack at that point.

I don’t agree that martial arts “rely” on strength, but it is certainly a byproduct of training and core strength in particular is very important. The modern military certainly has very different demands of “strength” than in our example. Even a race car driver has to be fit, but not for the same purpose.

Well, I’m sticking to my verdict of potential outcomes as above, speed and agility wins over size and strength in certain scenarios and loses in others in addition to willpower becoming an ever more deciding factor in longer fights.

On the other hand … of course if the norn just stomps the outgoing shockwave kills everyone … maybe the charr can avoid that by jumping really high and landing directly on his head … I need more data.

Good points..

Also to back that statement with an actual fight. Not exactly comparable, considering Charr are a little more dangerous but the point is that…

bigger is bigger…
faster is faster…

but skill is SKILL…

Skill and technique cannot be overlooked when it comes to the art of fighting.

(Edit tried to eliminate all that white space to no avail)

Dustfinger.9510:

Apparition.1576:

Unless he was Norn.. then I’m pretty sure the entire Charr would grovel at his feet, due to his superhuman strength. There would be no Charr able to stand up to the Norn.. and he would eventually become the next Khan-Ur.

Aint that right dusfinger?

Fanboi-ism only sees fanboi-ism.

First of all I like how you always like your own posts. That’s cute…

But seriously, all I did was agree and maybe slightly over-exaggerate everything you preach while proving a point.

Unless he was Norn.. then I’m pretty sure the entire Charr would grovel at his feet, due to his superhuman strength. There would be no Charr able to stand up to the Norn.. and he would eventually become the next Khan-Ur.

Aint that right dusfinger?

I can respect any opinion that takes all variables into account to make a informed decision. But any fighter can tell you exactly that.

There are a multitude of variables that come to play when you are talking about a full on fight. This aint no kitten arm wrestling contest.

This is a battle of strength, wit, agility, tenacity, and lastly the invidual. Shaq vs Jordan in their primes who wins? On paper you would think it would be Shaq.. but we all know better. Jordan’s heart, determination, and history of banging on bigger opponents…

Not the best analogy, but I have used several through these posts. Yet, here we are. Still talking the same facts with the fanboy’s refusing to consider the alternative. That the same probability that they are right, is also the same probability of being wrong.

So your arguement for greatswords burst is, that if combined with axe its not useless?

So my rebuttle would be, that would be more of a statement regarded Axe effectiveness and Greatsword lack of.

Three things I want to bring up,

Firstly, the individual might not be using axe as his alternative build. So should any greatsword build be deemed useless if not combined with another weapon?

Secondly, good players don’t get caught with hundred blades period. Hundred blades is a skill that takes at least one utility skill in order to land. Bulls Rush or bola now that Warrior stuns were nerfed but that’s another story. Even with that said, even those skills no good players should ever be hit with.

Lastly, my main point is that you are not thinking about this the right way. Buffing greatsword WILL NOT be a buff to warriors. It will allow them to choose between whether to use greatsword, hammer, and axe for #1 skill damage.

Keep in mind, that Axe, especially not. Axe 1 out damages GS1 by a LARGE Margin (already before feature update pack). Hammer 1 does higher burst AND weakens enemies.

You can’t be damaged by multiple weapons at the same time, there is a reason GS 1 is a joke in pvp environments. Because the only thing players have to do is just stay moving,

I reiterate buffing GS 1 Greatsword is not going to make warriors any stronger. It may just allow warriors to not be so reliant on axe burst or hammer stuns…

Apparition.1576:

Some of you guys are missing the point completely. If greatsword is able to compete with other weapons in terms of damage per sec. It is not a buff to ALL warriors. This just means.. that their may be a little less hammer and axe warriors.

So what are you crying about? If you think GS damage is good you clearly do not play the class. Even in PVE all greatsword’s damage come from the Hundred Blades burst, which is also complete irrelevant in mobile fights.

To be honest, I would not care if they removed hundred blades completely. Greatsword is a mobility weapon.. hundred blades requires u to stay still. Think about this for a second, how much sense does this even make???

F1 Burst = useless
Rush hits maybe 50% of the time.

I would even be cool if they changed rush to be kind of like Bulls Charge without the stun. There could be damage at making contact with the enemy (like what actually happens when you charge somebody) and damage during the actual slice.

I am tired of people looking at Hundred blades and basically uses that one skill to justify everything that’s wrong or broken with the greatsword.

Could someone share their thoughts with this post directly? Still haven’t heard a response to this.

Rahar.9872:

Apparition.1576:

…

But why should a Greatsword warrior be forced to use axe or hammer for damage. Greatsword has no sustain, horrible damage, at the cost of mobility thats part of the class design?

Greatsword received way to many nerfs, and no compensation before the condition meta.

Should thief or mesmer have their damaged nerfed to kitten as well?.. Mesmers have clones, stealth and mobility. How is a greatsword warrior supposed to compete?

Oh my God yes, why should Warriors have to make the same choices other professions have to make? No one gets everything quite like the Warrior. Mesmers have damage and good in combat mobility, but they sacrifice sustain and out of combat mobility. Thieves have good damage and mobility, but they have very, very poor sustain. Warriors, on the other hand, have damage, sustain, and mobility through weapons and traits. You see where I’m going with this?

Greatsword has its place, and that’s as a utility weapon. Just like the Thief’s shortbow or the Mesmer’s focus.

The last thing we need is Warriors getting more of everything.

Sarcasm does not prove your point very well. Sell your idea’s with facts or an arguement that supports or rebute your, or my points.

Some of you guys are missing the point completely. If greatsword is able to compete with other weapons in terms of damage per sec. It is not a buff to ALL warriors. This just means.. that their may be a little less hammer and axe warriors.

So what are you crying about? If you think GS damage is good you clearly do not play the class. Even in PVE all greatsword’s damage come from the Hundred Blades burst, which is also complete irrelevant in mobile fights.

To be honest, I would not care if they removed hundred blades completely. Greatsword is a mobility weapon.. hundred blades requires u to stay still. Think about this for a second, how much sense does this even make???

F1 Burst = useless
Rush hits maybe 50% of the time.

I would even be cool if they changed rush to be kind of like Bulls Charge without the stun. There could be damage at making contact with the enemy (like what actually happens when you charge somebody) and damage during the actual slice.

I am tired of people looking at Hundred blades and basically uses that one skill to justify everything that’s wrong or broken with the greatsword.

Dustfinger.9510:

“The Age of Giants ended when magic was stolen from us. You norn turned to your Spirits of the Wild to redeem your strength and self-respect. We jotun have had no one and nothing to pull us from the quicksand.” Thruln The Lost
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Thruln_the_Lost

He is clearly talking about social strength as a race. Besides which, that was long before the events of GW1 and he says they were redeemed before GW1. The only evidence that supports the norn getting individually weaker since GW1 can also be used to show that a naked asura is just as strong as a naked norn. Because in all likelyhood it is just a game mechanic.

Didn’t even notice but that explains and refute everything you have talked about regarding your “evidence.” Theis evidence goes much deeper than “social strength” this also explains the reduction in both size and stregnth of your race. The Jotun could not have been any clearer in this explanation.

Appears ANET did something right in the lore after all. This is the first time I have heard of it but everything the Jotun says makes perfect sense.

The evidence is clear, their feats are much smaller and a lot more normal. As a matter of fact, all these individual feats that you praise only happened once and they were all a very long time ago. In real life we like to refer to them as exaggerations.

FYI..The hint I was referring to was The Fang of the Serpeant. Look at the Size of it… stories does not tell of this as an individual feat or combined effort. But if this was an individual feat none of the Norns in the GW2 Generation would be able to accomplish anything even remotely possible.

Norns are not the Norns of old. Charr are still the trained killers they have always been, and they bred that way.

Talyn.3295:

Apparition.1576:

Talyn.3295:

Apparition.1576:

This is a Warrior we are talking about… warriors need mobility. Otherwise they could just be kited into oblivion. That was part of the class design. Greatsword warriors have nothing but mobility, but mobility counts for exactly what in pvp? Sword + warhorn is the most mobile spec warriors have, except that they can kitten near immune to conditions. So at the cost of damage they have much better sustain.

But why should a Greatsword warrior be forced to use axe or hammer for damage. Greatsword has no sustain, horrible damage, at the cost of mobility thats part of the class design?

Greatsword received way to many nerfs, and no compensation before the condition meta.

Should thief or mesmer have their damaged nerfed to kitten as well?.. Mesmers have clones, stealth and mobility. How is a greatsword warrior supposed to compete?

I have to laugh at this. When guardians complain we can’t stay on a target we are told to suck it up. But warriors who have no trouble due to large amounts of charges and cripples, on most of their weapons, and stuns as well are still complaining about be kited?

All is vain

That doesnt really bring much to discuss with this topic. Try to post responses in regards to the issues being discussed. We are not here to discuss guardians issues in this thread.

I think my post said as much as it needed too. You complain that you will be kited. However regardless of if you feel this way or not you do not realize how silly you sound when you say it. You put it out that as a melee class you would be kited if you didn’t have great mobility. The only thing I see greatsword warriors use it for is to turn and run away.

Apparition.1576:

But why should a Greatsword warrior be forced to use axe or hammer for damage. Greatsword has no sustain, horrible damage, at the cost of mobility thats part of the class design?

I also mentioned that Warriors have a tremendous amount of CC abilities, both Hard and soft. It doesn’t mean they will have access to everyone of these on every weapon. That would be bad class design.

You mention warriors and melee and forget there is another melee job in this game. And that it has far less in the way of mobility or crowd control. My points are valid.

What kind of sense would that make.. Necromancers.. masters of cleave and conditions? Stay on topic and stop trolling my thread.

That doesn’t even make any sense.. how do u lose in WvW because someone decides to RP… essentially play a given role?….

Talyn.3295:

Apparition.1576:

This is a Warrior we are talking about… warriors need mobility. Otherwise they could just be kited into oblivion. That was part of the class design. Greatsword warriors have nothing but mobility, but mobility counts for exactly what in pvp? Sword + warhorn is the most mobile spec warriors have, except that they can kitten near immune to conditions. So at the cost of damage they have much better sustain.

But why should a Greatsword warrior be forced to use axe or hammer for damage. Greatsword has no sustain, horrible damage, at the cost of mobility thats part of the class design?

Greatsword received way to many nerfs, and no compensation before the condition meta.

Should thief or mesmer have their damaged nerfed to kitten as well?.. Mesmers have clones, stealth and mobility. How is a greatsword warrior supposed to compete?

I have to laugh at this. When guardians complain we can’t stay on a target we are told to suck it up. But warriors who have no trouble due to large amounts of charges and cripples, on most of their weapons, and stuns as well are still complaining about be kited?

All is vain

That doesnt really bring much to discuss with this topic. Try to post responses in regards to the issues being discussed. We are not here to discuss guardians issues in this thread.

Nate.8146:

When I first entered WvW, I had huge expectations. That quickly died when I realized how simplified the mechanics were. One commander, stack on him, then roam around the country side capping territory you owned not less than 10 minutes ago. It gets dull very fast and you’re not alone in this. What keeps me most excited is when I’m on the defence in forts (not keeps, those are not as exciting). The guild I use to chill with referred to it as the Alamo. Often outnumbered, but we were highly skilled players that kept their zerg out. When they charged, they took heavy losses and had to regroup. It’s the best fun I had in WvW. You never knew when the next wave might be your last and that thrill was just really good.

For everything else though, you just have to roll with the zerg. This game is less about RTS or RP and more about capture the point. I’d like to suggest the game devs consider new experiences with WvW. To take ideas from games like Savage, Tribes, DOTA, etc. But, WvW has always been a 3rd class citizen in this game and it’s likely to stay that way.

If you have ever been in some decent 5 man’s you would know that is not the only way to play WvW. That’s the problem with people in this game, people always feel like there is one way to do things. People should spend more time being creative and learning other fun ways to make an effective team.

Sure you can have a blob or whatever just follow the commander, stack, etc.. But small skirmishes can also be very effective. I will give you an example.

There is a large battle taking place, mostly based on momentum resulting in the most part a stalemate.

A small group of elementalists devise of a place to turn the tides of battle the next time their commander is pushed back. They patiently wait on a hillside for their chance to strike. Suddenly, 5 Staff elementalists syncronize their meteor showers and rain down on the enemy as they pursue. To further strengthen their sudden strike, they transform into a Tornado. The intensity of the meteors magnify.. at that moment the stalemate was broken. The enemy was either dead or retreated back to their tower.

Battles are as simple as you want them to be.

What about those old school Warcraft 3 days.. where you have a big army fighting.. then suddenly those peons in the backside of the orc army start building massive amounts of towers to reinforce the army.

You can have a party of supply masters apply some similar techniques. They could synchronize to rush build 2 or 3 arrowcarts as their commander charges in for the attack and change the tides of battle by raining in arrows forcing the enemy to die or retreat.

This is a Warrior we are talking about… warriors need mobility. Otherwise they could just be kited into oblivion. That was part of the class design. Greatsword warriors have nothing but mobility, but mobility counts for exactly what in pvp? Sword + warhorn is the most mobile spec warriors have, except that they can kitten near immune to conditions. So at the cost of damage they have much better sustain.

But why should a Greatsword warrior be forced to use axe or hammer for damage. Greatsword has no sustain, horrible damage, at the cost of mobility thats part of the class design?

Greatsword received way to many nerfs, and no compensation before the condition meta.

Should thief or mesmer have their damaged nerfed to kitten as well?.. Mesmers have clones, stealth and mobility. How is a greatsword warrior supposed to compete?

Kalavier.1097:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Oh boy, here we go again.

Here’s one: Norn aren’t what they used to be just like Charr are different from the past.

Where’s the lore that states Norn haven’t gotten weaker since the days of GW1? Where’s the lore that states Charr are weaker than Norn in current GW2 times?

Going off of a combo of what arthurobenzi and Gieniusz Krab are stating: is it possible that the GW1 Charr were just as powerful as GW1 Norn but were considered weaker because of their savagery?

Where is the lore that says Norn these days are weaker then they were before?

Gameplay doesn’t count. There is nothing in the Movement of the World that’d suggest a total racial decline of strength and other areas in individuals. Infact, you could say there is stuff to imply they’d work at becoming STRONGER, Faster, etc in response to the forced exile.

Go the the Norn Town Hall.. there you will find your answer.

Why is it that people feel warriors are so kitten OP. Warrior greatsword was fine before the condition meta..

First, quickness got nerfed. This nerfed all heavy crit/burst builds not just warrior.

Then Warrior Greatsword was nerfed on top of that due to the changes in the first tree, and the move from Empowered trait.

I don’t want any trolls in this thread but I would welcome any honest discussion regarding Warriors. This is in terms of PVP (WvW or Arena). I actually think that despite popular opionion, the warrior skills are actually pretty good. The damage on the other hand is another story.

Warrior 1 needs buff.
Warrior F1 Burst needs to be a freakin burst ability.. how in the hell does the burst ability hit for about the same as Warrior 1 skill.. which is terrible.

I want your opinions and your aguements, if warrior greatsword should be buffed or why not.

Dee Jay.2460:

Ok I know this is going to get a lot of snarky responses but imo Engineers are the single most overpowered class in this game.

They are somewhat flying under the radar though because their imbalances aren’t as obvious as with other classes. The exception being sPvP which they have already turned into a mockery.

Unlike with other imbalances like Warrior Healing Signet + Adrenal Healing it’s hard to pin-point exactly what makes Engineers so OP.

In my book it’s the ability to passively deal damage while kiting combined with lots of knock-backs, CC and Blinds. It’s not an individual trait or skill that makes them OP, but rather their entire kitten nal and the lack of trade-offs they have to make.

Yes, Engineers don’t have amazing crit-videos where they show off their PvE DPS and no they aren’t very popular but mark my words, in a few months time this problem will become much more apparent.

Pro roamers and PvP heroes have already caught on to this for a while and most have rerolled Engineer at this point.

This is my problem with the whole community. Stating that you cannot exactly pinpoint what makes them OP… is the same thing as saying. That the class feels to be synergetic with one another. People are so backwards in this game.

If a skill or group of skills work properly it is considered OP… stupid logic if you ask me. You want to talk OP, you can beat a thief 5 times and never kill him. That’s my definition of OP (stealth).

I would be glad when ANET stops listening to this kitten forum when it comes to balance.

Dustfinger.9510:

Apparition.1576:

Kimbo Slice lost a fight to a little shrimp.

Give it up with this superhuman stregnth crap, that has nothing to do with getting whipped in a fight. Skill, agility, experience are all equal factors. Go to the gym and watch all those big guys lifting all those weights, put him in a ring with a trained fighter and watch what happens. Skilled, vicious, and none of that stregnth means anything.

Chars are bred to fight, they have trained since birth, you guys are hilarious. This is a fight we are talking about people.. not a rock lifting contest…

It was given before you even tried. 4th page 11th post down

“And we have already been shown what would tend to happen. So personal anecdotes about getting beat by smaller guys and issues about other advantages being a factor have been addressed. At least by me.”

So by your logic a valid rebuttle only needs me to reference to a big guy beating a small guy.

Apparition.1576:

Awaiting your rebuttle….

almost 20 minutes later….

The ball is …. how you say…. “in your court”.

So just to clarify.. your rebuttle to my entire arguement… this one time.. there was this norn.. i dont know his name or anything but he beat an entire warband with one punch! This proves Norn can beat Charr?

This sounds like the arguement of a child.. why don’t you take at least a few minutes to refine your arguements instead of just posting garbage 99 out of 100 of the posts that you make.

Dustfinger.9510:

Apparition.1576:

Kimbo Slice lost a fight to a little shrimp.

Give it up with this superhuman stregnth crap, that has nothing to do with getting whipped in a fight. Skill, agility, experience are all equal factors. Go to the gym and watch all those big guys lifting all those weights, put him in a ring with a trained fighter and watch what happens. Skilled, vicious, and none of that stregnth means anything.

Chars are bred to fight, they have trained since birth, you guys are hilarious. This is a fight we are talking about people.. not a rock lifting contest…

It was given before you even tried. 4th page 11th post down

“And we have already been shown what would tend to happen. So personal anecdotes about getting beat by smaller guys and issues about other advantages being a factor have been addressed. At least by me.”

So by your logic a valid rebuttle only needs me to reference to a big guy beating a small guy.

Apparition.1576:

Awaiting your rebuttle….

almost 20 minutes later….

The ball is …. how you say…. “in your court”.

Nice rebuttle…

Awaiting your rebuttle….

Kimbo Slice lost a fight to a little shrimp.

Give it up with this superhuman stregnth crap, that has nothing to do with getting whipped in a fight. Skill, agility, experience are all equal factors. Go to the gym and watch all those big guys lifting all those weights, put him in a ring with a trained fighter and watch what happens. Skilled, vicious, and none of that stregnth means anything.

Chars are bred to fight, they have trained since birth, you guys are hilarious. This is a fight we are talking about people.. not a rock lifting contest…

I guess I am somewhat of a roleplayer. My new favorite class is engineer, but I have some concerns about playing a specific role in World vs World as an actual Engineer. This is not about solo roaming or zerg fights or anything like that. But for the most part, World vs World seems mostly about zergs engaging other zergs and taking over towers.

This usually leads to groups just capping and recapping towers camp etc.. I am not sure what to suggest but it is not very engaging to actually defend structures. I feel an obligation whenever I touch my Engineer (and sometimes my Charr Warrior) to focus on running supplies, building siege, refreshing siege etc…

But it is amazing how boring this can be… I would like to know if there are any others like myself out there who likes the thought of bringing a little RP to the class in World vs World in terms on fulfilling your role. Also, any ideas on improving the activities/fun with defending a base and building its defenses.

These are just some ideas I just came up with on the fly (since Engineer is a fairly broad term), that would list a few fun ways to play Engineer in a RP setting.

Demolition Expert
Siege/Defense Engineer
Inventory/Supply Manager

Don’t you dare disrespect the Flame Legion..

The Missing: The ability to take our PvE skins to wear in sPvP

Robert Hrouda.1327:

Kojiden.8405:

Robert Hrouda.1327:

my main is a female charr
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/51926/Kodin_1.PNG

I didn’t know you employ hyenas at Arenanet!

Sir Chompers is an invaluable asset to the Dev team – he keeps the office kitchen floors clean by scavenging things that get dropped, and chases off those pesky zebra who try to snack on our cereal bins.

Not gonna lie, only visited this post to read the Dev post.. when i saw it i almost choked on my own spit from laughter. hahahahahaha

I feel dumb, I always thought the plural for mongoose was mongeese LOL

Unfortunately, to do that we will have to all be on the same server. However, I think it would be worth it if we really get a lot of turn out.

But Henge is absolutely right, we should all be able to recruit.

Bah… If this skill would summon some flame legion characters.. I would use it regardless of its viability… lol

One day I will rule the Flame Legion…

Yeah, I just love the idea of an all Charr guild. Best idea yet… its a shame really that we don’t have more active members than we do.

Seriously folks… this thread should be on page 10 now.. ALL CHARR GUILD.

There is nothing more awesome than this..

Exactly, there is a lot more to winning a fight than sheer strength. In high school I played football. Nobody was stronger than me period at my school as a senoir. Bench Press 365 Hang Clean 350, at 200 lbs.

However, I have gotten rocked a few times by much smaller opponents. I am certain that if you compared our stats. You wouldn’t be able to explain how this little corny little dude could ever rock me 1v1… hell… not even I could really explain it to you but it happened a few times. I would never mention his name.. lol

Point is that strength or any advantage is simply that… an advantage but when it comes to a fight: skill, technique, verocity, are all factors that are equally if not more important in my opinion.

Apparition.1576:

Firstly, I would like to start off and say that I am really enjoying this debate. However, I believe too much emphasis is placed on strength and strength alone. The art of fighting is much more by strength.

eg. Remember when Battista tried to fight in the UFC? LOL

I am not saying that strength isn’t important because I personally believe that it is. But there is much more of a science to fighting than any individual statistics. Especially, when it comes to something like Charr vs Norn where their strengths are not exactly directly comparable.

1. Charr were bred to fight and endure. Let us take both a Norn and charr.. and beat them both down to where they are so tired and beat up that they could barely walk. Who would be able to endure and have enough stamina to get up and continue fighting?

My vote would definitely be for the Charr, they were basically bred for this.

2. Aggression in my opinion is much more important than strength in a fight. Who can deny that the Norn warrior is an absolute kitten… but these norns are not fighting bears or gorilla’s. These are Charr.. possibly the most savage race in the World of Tyria..

My vote would be that the Charr would possess the most aggression solely based on the fact that not only is this a natural characterstic of the species.. but once again.. they were also bred this way.

I don’t personally believe that a Norn would be that much (if at all) stronger than a Charr warrior. However, assuming a slight advantage in strength given to the Norn. I don’t think that would impact the battle at all.

These are not little kittens, cubs, or even tigers. These are Charr, more comparable to the old werewolves from the 90’s movies (back before vampires walked in the sun and sparkled), the ones with walked with 2 legs, full of rage, huge fangs. claws, and just straight savage beasts.

I made clear and distinct points with this post. You addressed absolutely nothing that I have said. Hell, I did half the work for you.. its numbered. Instead you deflect and do what you have quite a history of doing throughout this post, either ignore any validity and basically say that you are right because of something you already said or proven by some unknown source.

The merry-go-round goes in a small circle at a very low speed. The first ride is the same exact ride as the thousandth time. That is why most adults tend to find this kind of ride to be a very boring one. Point for the second time..
Address the rebuttal, deflecting just makes any post you type to be like that of a merry-go-round. This would actually be a great debate if you stop just killing this post by not addressing any of the points people make. You can agree or disagree but explain why.

FYI – rebut (r??b?t)
— vb , -buts , -butting , -butted
( tr ) to refute or disprove, esp by offering a contrary contention or argument

In a debate you address the rebuttal of your opponents. In an arguement, you just kind of say whatever comes out of your mouth.

You should learn to address the valid points if you would really want to be relevant instead of just replying to every post with whatever.

You posted an entire paragraph without making one valid point.. lol

Weak

“but the Charr are more threatening to me”

kitten right we are!

You sure love to dodge around the questions. Prove that this is no exception and tell me of other Norn who have achieves this feat.

Furthermore, the capability of the norn is equal to the capability of anything else or anyone else. You cannot argue about the potential of a Norn to do anything vs anyone else. There are billions of athletes with the potential to play professional sports yet not even 1 percent of the population have accomplished this feat.

What is the portential of one Sylvari (Scarlet Rose) to build a crap ton of robots and invade Tyria?

Point is that if you want to stregnthen your argument then you need to incorporate a plethora of scenario’s reguarding the races stregnths and weaknesses. Of course it all comes down to how good each opponent fights on that particular day. But in my arguement I have included just a few reasons and explanations of my examples and why I feel the way that I do. One fight one time won’t prove much of anything. Give facts, scenario’s and you also need to look at both the strengths and weaknesses of the race.