Guild Wars 2

Derenek.8931:

Eventually a meta will form and you guys at Anet will know where you should have grouped those skills lines together to begin with, instead of the haphazard feeling way it is now.

Intentionally having imbalance within a line is a good way of balancing that line or class, though.

To explain this in detail:

• You think of 3 GM traits.
• All 3 are very strong.
• The team ponders how to balance them, but can’t think of anything which wouldn’t make them feel meh.
• Instead, the minors are intentionally made weaker than the other lines. Or the master and adept traits are. Or something.
• In total, the line is now balance, just that its power resides in the GM traits more than anything else.

Still waiting for a fix on this.

Or honestly, devs, just revert it. It’s ok, you tried, we get it, your artists and modelers didn’t understand what to do. Just revert it, let it clip, that’s better than this and if this is the alternative we have, I’d rather have my clipping outfit back. :S

<— severely disappointed

You should stop playing sPvP. It helps, makes GW2 worlds better to just never use sPvP except as a shortcut to LA. Seriously. WvW has enough problems, but at least they’re mitigated by being able to bring superior numbers. Not the mess that is sPvP.

Bonus: You avoid the sPvP community. That also uplifts GW2 significantly, the game becomes more enjoyable right away.

Honestly just name it Grenade Launcher Kit, and done. That’s how it looks, fits perfectly.

Annika.7084:

I agree with the OP. This is nothing else than a dumb-down of the trait-system into pre-fabricated templates – cookie-cutter builds for each proffession.

Yes, but!

You underestimate the complexity of the new system.

You got 3 picks from 5 trait lines. 10 combinations.
For each combination, 3 times 3 times 3 (times 3 traitlines selected) combinations. 81 total ways to set up the traits for the 3 picked lines.
Makes for 810 total possible ways to set up the character.

Now, I understand this is significantly less than the old system. Not arguing that. But really, 810 trait setups and you consider it “dumbed down”? Really? That’s so many that no player will have any real first-hand experience with their “entire” character (plus this ignores gear/weapons!).

Thaddeus.4891:

You can’t complete any final boss or a level 50 because agony can’t be mitigate without AR. You use to be able to mitigate it by dodging the attack, now you can just absorb it with AR.

Yes but this isn’t really a bad thing. AR is easy enough to acquire, and serves as a built-in system to facilitate actually going up the FotM ranks instead of skipping to the final right away.

Mitch.4781:

Thanks for the reply. Odd that it doesn;t explain this IN GAME though. Unless I missed something?

Without wanting to sound mean, the system is quite self-explanatory. :<

Zergs.9715:

I think that Anet hit the jackpot with introduction of Mawdrey. It removed rng and added complex but meaningful mix of interaction with environment and gathering. Its challenging but not in a “hurr durr get 250 charged lodestones” kind of way.

Yes, but it’s way easy to acquire, all things said.

The problem with relying less on RNG always comes down to how creative rarity and as a result of that bragging rights or a feeling of accomplishment.

apharma.3741:

Anyone had any thoughts on utilities that could do with a buff?

Mantras
Removed, replaced with something not clunky and actually Mesmery. See my post about Illusion-type-skills.

Portal
Range indicator added to minimap, skill doesn’t actually cancel when you leave range but duration is left on it.

Illusion of Life
Instant cast.

Fay.2357:

She’s an absolute and unmitigated disaster at the specialization reveals, but she’s obviously been told to do them by some higher-up at anet that doesn’t know the first thing about good public relations, so she doesn’t really have a lot of choice in the matter.

That’s a problem I have with ANet in general.

Someone higher up the foodchain is meddling with PR in a really bad way. It’s just needless player disappointment and aggression being generated.

I would love to see a stricter cap in visuals.

Show mine. If there are 5 or less attacking that enemy, show faded out versions of party visuals (party only, not randoms). Show 2 other players with slightly faded visuals, only if the above isn’t applied. That’s it.

Rainbowsand.2438:

I adore your strategy duo of trolls upvoting each other. On HotS forums your kin is more organised tho, they run in huge packs able to dump 30 downvotes in five minutes.

HotS? Honor or the Swaves? Heart of (the) Sorns? Heart of the Smists? Hwastes of the Silver?

MidoriMarch.8067:

Seems like u are the forum keyboard warrior becuase i see u on every single thread people post up problems with mesmer and u are busy being salty “mesmers arent not op u are just noob”

I’m sorry, but if you ever have a sliver of the ingame PvP experience Pyro does, you can come back and talk to him about being a forum warrior. He’s abrasive, but there’s very few players in this game who both know as much about the stuff they talk about and still talk about it (on the forums) as he does.

Zenith.7301:

OR BETTER YET GUYS, HOW ABOUT WE SPLIT PVP/PVE SKILL BALANCE ALREADY.

If this means bloody sPvP will no longer affect WvW/PvE with their whining and resulting nerfs, awesome.

Tongku.5326:

I have played mes since launch. i play it across all 3 game modes. ankitten ot wrong, i run condi shatter in spvp at least 5 days a week, and often several matches in a row. i know exactly and precisely what i can do, each and every time, consitantly. i can open with scepter 3, followed by torch 5, and usually 1 more attack, before my stealth wears off.

Then as Fay said, show us a video of you doing that, and then file a bug report.
You’d be the first person to do this, but maybe there is something bugged about your specific character or so. Could be.

Otherwise, I see this:

• You made a Mesmer 5 days ago and immediately went into sPvP.
• You are making things up.
• You are using the anonymity you have here to stick to your story even now that you are being called out on it.

Happens. If you want to keep some dignity just stop replying, that’s what people usually do.

Padra.1678:

there are more of them

No.

Padra.1678:

and they are on command

Wrong again. Not all are.

Padra.1678:

which means that if you make a mistake with your burst you arnt punished for it all because you can just pop your stealth, reset and try again.

Congratulations, you want to get Thieves nerfed. Wrong forum for that.

Padra.1678:

@Carighan: Id imagine thats because you arnt playing zerker on any of those.

Only on my Necro. And Sinister on my Warrior, which, as you maybe know, is Zerker for conditions. You were saying what exactly, again?
Mesmers aren’t difficult to defeat. At all. Yes we can be annoying in pure Blackwater builds, and we can be lethal in 1v1 in PU-Powershatter, but… we don’t contribute. It’s the same as zerker thieves, we gank lone people running back to the fight, but that’s it. Highwaymen. If specced for it.

Thieves can do this since the game launched. Surprisingly, the game has survived in spite of it and many do not consider it a problem that Thieves can do this. For a reason, effective as it is at making people rage on the forums (as you are so aptly demonstrating), it fails to impact the fight in a way helpful to your team/realm.

People are frustrated because it used to be that only Thieves do this. Now both stealth classes do, and people get killed. But instead of running around together, they take to the forums. The only thing which changed is the exposure, seriously.
Thieves did the exact same thing since forever, and they got away with it perfectly. Every thief ganking a lone runner is someone not taking keeps or points. Same goes for Mesmers now. Put them in an actual fight and they’re rubbish, which is why the devs generally didn’t see the problem.

And this is only considering stealth. We’re squishy as heck if not specced for PU and using full stealth, which in turn makes us not contribute to the fight. There’s a reason my Necro especially feels so much stronger in sPvP, downing people in 3-5 attacks depending on class, from range. Sure I can’t 1v1 a PU Mesmer. But make it a 2v2 and we got one target dead before they even realized a fight broke out.

Padra.1678:

My adivse to all you whining mesmers is try playing a class that is actually isent in a good spot and then see if you can still kitten.

Is playing Necro mainly in sPvP, and playing Engi, Warrior and Guardian on top of Mesmer enough for you?

And I consider the Mesmer my weakest char, sorry. Sure she can really get on someone’s nerves, but she’s sooooo fragile and soooo easily disabled. Yes, the opposite of what you said. You might want to play a Mesmer, feels really meh after other chars.

Odyssey.2613:

It’s nigh time we start holding the dev’s accountable, specifically by name.
By doing so it’s harder for them to hide behind generic terms like “team”, & “devs”.

By the same token, I think it smells that players can hide behind their account names and attack the devs or cry about each other with no accountability.

Post player real names. And possibly email. Hold players accountable for their comments, too.

(Hint: WoW tried to do this, it didn’t really end well. Now project that back onto your idea again…)

Mikkel.8427:

I’d be completely ok with them being removed entirely. I went 8 months b4 the trait rework without touching a mantra bc of how poorly they function/feel. The ‘bug’ after the patch finally made them worthwhile to use, so they were incorporated into a few of my builds. It genuinely felt like we got a brand new line of utility skills for me.

Put up a separate post about my ideas for a replacement skill type.

Well they could always start restricting such “grief-able” skills to party-only.

Ah, that’s a pretty cool idea, too. That way it works more reliable and also has a more interactive downside.

Since I brought it up as something I’d prefer over Mantras (if Mantras stay in their current state) in a few threads and every time someone said the idea might have merit, I figured I’ll write out my concept for Illusion-type spells.

The idea here is to have a type of skill which feels very mesmer-y by itself, without needing any traits or anything to evoke it.

Underlying idea
Illusion-type skills temporarily grant you something really strong. The concept ofc comes from Illusion of Life, which might not actually grant you something strong at all – usually it gets people killed hence it’s never used – but the idea has a lot of merit.
Illusion-type skills would briefly give you something very strong, followed by either taking it away again in a manner that it hurts, or actually giving you something negative, so that if you failed to exploit the moment of power, then you’re stuck with the debuff afterwards.

Specific abilities

Illusion of Life
The one we have already. I’d rework one aspect about this. It’s current weakness is that getting downed again during the revived time is actually pretty brutal since you die entirely. Coupled with the long cast time, this makes the skill worse than just letting your friend lie on the ground.
Effect: Up to 5 friendly players in the target area are temporarily revived and cannot be downed. At the end, they are downed again. Kills during the effect cannot rally the affected players.
Note: First, getting downed during the effect increases your downed debuff but you will immediately pop up again, half a second later or so. Second, this means that if they push you to red and then down you again, you still die. No change there. Third, I removed the “can rally”-part. This is on purpose. We’re looking at 15 seconds of always-back-up-instantly, that’s strong enough as it is, plus the inability to rally from kills is the downside inherent to this illusion.

Illusion of Health – healing
Effect: Regain all of your health. Over the next 10 seconds, lose all of the health gained this way.
Cooldown: 10 seconds
Cast time: instant
Note: Yes, this doesn’t actually heal you. Quite intentional, it’s a blam-full-heal on a 10s CD, in return you’re not healing anything at all.

Illusion of Might
Effect: Gain 5 stacks of Illusion of Might, increasing all of your damage by 10% per stack and decreasing all damage taken by 5% per stack. Lose 1 stack per second. After you have lost all stacks, gain 1 stack of Delusions of Might per second, decreasing your damage done by 10% per stack and increasing your damage taken by 5% per stack.
Cooldown: 40 seconds, starting from when you push the button, not when the effect ends.
Cast time: instant

Illusion of Freedom
Effect: Ignore all crowd control effects on you for the next 10 seconds, including those already applied to you. However, all crowd control effects on your do not lose duration during this time. When the effect ends, you will be stunned for 2 seconds if no stun or daze effect was applied to you during the duration.
Cooldown: 40 seconds, starting from when you push the button.
Cast time: instant, breaks stuns (well, kinda :P )

Illusion of Death – elite
Effect: Down target enemy. This does not count as a downed effect in regards to enemy debuffs or traits and will not increase their downed-counter. If the target enemy is not defeated after 6 seconds, they are revived, healed to full and have all conditions removed.
Cooldown: 120 seconds
Cast time: 2 seconds
Note: Yes, this isn’t balanced for 1v1 gameplay, the rest of the game isn’t, either. It should have a quite distinct effect of shattered glass shards flying off of the enemy when they’re downed, btw, so the target and their friends and your friends immediately know what is going on.

There used to be a time and age when Mantras were trying to be an interesting mechanical concept, they only had a single charge but a comparatively strong effect.

The idea was that you had a ~100% longer cast time, but in exchange your cast time came sort-of after the use, and when convenient. Sure, the cast time back then was too long and HM had such an overpowered interaction with them that they had to be changed, but conceptually the old Mantras actually felt like a specific ability type.

Whereas the current ones… I dunno… clunky is the best I can think of, but that fails to fully encompass just how bad they feel.

At this point I’d honestly just rip them out. Entirely. There’s plenty ideas for better skills, and Mantras as a skill type had their try, they failed, now get it over with.

apharma.3741:

My favourite bit is today I went on power necro to get the daily. I literally killed a thief in one attack. Life blast with air and fire proc and spinal shivers auto cast. All I had to do is wait for his dodge animation to end.

I then kept killing him by using DS fear and again, one or two life blasts.

I liked the game more a few weeks ago when things were strong and you HAD to dodge, kite and rotate around the power. Soon we’ll all be back in the same mud as pre patch with everything being different colours of brown except ele, guard and engy.

In sPvP that might be fun, but honestly if I want twitch action PvP I got better and more focused games for that.
In my MMO I want a leisure and relaxed combat which allows me to chat and hence socialize. Even between casts. That’s what I play a MMORPG for after all.

Velimere.7685:

I’ve been the victim of a few bait-and-switches in my life, but boy do they sure hit me right in the feels every time.

You play a MMO. Potentially multiple. How many balance changes before you stop playing classes for their numbers and instead play for their loadout?

It’s not worth it to change classes or pick based on who is effective. Even at GW2’s glacial development speed compared to other MMOs, you’re going to get kittened off if you do that, because Things Change™.

Rather, pick based on design and loadout, not on whether it’s valid or not right now. Enjoy both being the apex predator at some time, and another time you’re the underdog, impressing people by being 95% effective on something they considered 90% ineffective. :P

It sounds as if at the very least, you need to salvage ascended to create the new legendaries and the fractal skins.

That being said: Good riddance. If we could permanently salvage ascended gear off the servers, would be much better.

Never liked clone death builds.

I enjoy the concept, but only if it were our main way of doing combat. That is, have very realistic clones which confuse enemies, and attacking the wrong target hurts them.

Since that’s not how they worked out: meh.

zerocool.9842:

I get the feeling anet only makes changes based on how much people complain in PvP, not considering that some of use don’t do PvP (ahem)

This is probably correct. Most balancing changes except edge cases (see old Portal nerfs) are based on sPvP, because… well honestly, I doubt anyone knows, in a game where the majority of combat is based on scaling solo to zerg, basing character balance on 5v5 Domination maps is … not a word allowed by the word filter, apparently. :P

Anyhow, as far as nerfing Mantras go: Good.
I hate the concept of Mantras. They feel clunky, they don’t feel mesmer-y at all, they’re stupid as a gameplay element, and really the sooner they’re so useless they can remove them, the better.

My favorite take on what we could conceptually use is still “Illusions” (basically Illusion of Life as a concept). Say an illusion heal heals you to 100% instantly, even through poison, but then drains all of the damage healed that way over the next 10 seconds. It’s just an illusion.
Or Illusion of Power. Gain 5 stacks of “Imaginary Power”, giving you more power, malice, toughness and run speed. Drains 1 stack per second. Continues draining past 5 seconds, giving you “Imaginated Weakness”, reducing your toughness, vitality, healing power and run speed, until you are at 5 stacks of that, then it ends. Both effect should be quite strong.

That’d feel somewhat mesmer-y, at least. :S

Hrm, for me there’s 2 main points:

• The whole concept. After the Mesmer failed to be a class about debuffing enemies and disabling them, the Chronomancer messing with time conceptually sounds like the next-best thing. A “reset” being their most core ability drives this forward even independent of the rather disappointing well-effects.
• Speaking of wells, all in all I enjoy the idea of more AE support, though. I wish the wells were built more around the concept of the spec and their names, like the healing well healing you for health lost in the previous few seconds and so on. But still, gimme more support!

Personally, I feel the way it is right now it’s worth it. Faster speed is very helpful for the AA-chain and Confusing Images, plus it helps with some casted skills. Coupled with the cooldown reduction it puts out some real pressure.

Further:

• Mirror Blade and Shatter damage is all a target is taking.
• Active mitigation doesn’t exist and hence doesn’t have to be factored in.
• Greatsword burst is all a Mesmer ever does and also constitutes all damage going out. I just idle between shatter bursts, same as you.
• 1v1 fights are balanced, designed for and provide an interesting and useful source of balance information.

If you thought “yes, that’s true” to any of the above, you got bigger issues than whether Mirror Blade was nerfed rightfully or not. Irregardless of the nerf, none of what you write makes much sense because the situation you describe is a clean room no-context test which is as far from “what we need to dev for” in MMOs as it gets.

Toeofdoom.6152:

Indeed, that’s why I quoted the exact same lines you did – if it wasn’t clear, I think the test, and the difference in wording both point towards it being intentional.

That said, it’s not really conclusive.

Oh. heh. Sorry, misunderstood you in that case.

troubleFORever.6520:

so i bought few dreamthistle skins some weeks ago, to win some money, placed 2k gold on it (almost 3k)

now they are worth nothing

:/

thanks anet!

That’s how market gambling works. You win some, you lose some. Key is to win more than you lose.

Toeofdoom.6152:

Hey, so I compared this to the engineer trait Skilled Marksman and it is possibly good news.

The engineer trait is quite differently worded, though.

Engineer trait: “You attack faster with a rifle…”
Mesmer trait: “You attack faster while wielding a scepter…”

If you look at weapon traits across classes, some explicitly state what they affect, others don’t. In the case of those which don’t specifically limit their effects to the weapon, they are global. AFAIK without exception. One example I cited above was Guardian Staff trait, another is Warrior OH trait. I think, don’t have a Warrior.

Miroe.2054:

Does anyone know wether this still applies if you weapon swap to the alternate set?

No it doesn’t. As the text says, “While wielding a scepter”.

Conceptually, it should make Slow on you less bad and Quickness on you stronger.

Say:

1. +25 Toughness
2. Slow on you is 5% less powerful.
3. +50 Toughness
4. Quickness on you is 5% more powerful.
5. +100 Toughness
6. When you have Quickness and Slow applied to you, Slow duration is decreased by 50%.

Silverkey.2078:

I totally agree. Considering that our damage multipliers do not apply on phantasms, they are much less effective than on a warrior, so we should get a 40% modifier on mantras!

Wait, isn’t that what you meant

It is actually what I meant, indirectly. I was seriously just complaining about people always comparing things 1-to-1, as if that’s sensible.

I do agree with you that if anything our modifiers should be higher, not lower. Though this also depends on base weapon damage calculations, attack setups ,utility selections, bla bla bla. Tons of variables.

I just keep thinking that I want actually useful mantra charges (back when it was a single charge) back.

Compare other classes’ traits.

Unless they specifically state the attacks affected, they are global. Guardian staff comes to mind since I use it, it increases boon duration. Of all boons you apply, not only through staff. Likewise the Necro trait affects marks and again, affects all marks, though most are ofc on the staff.

That it affects non-ability-animations is a bit weird, granted. But the trait very much says it affects attack speed (not attacks of scepter, like other skills do when just affecting a single weapon, compare the wording).

If this is not the intended use – and I bet it’ll get nerfed, we can’t have nice things – then it’s a huge mislead, I was hyped for the trait getting fixed because it’d affect all attacks. It’d also make the trait completely rubbish, so I guess that’d be par for the course…

Fay.2357:

With a scepter equipped, malicious sorcery not only causes scepter attacks to increase in speed by 15%, but in fact causes EVERYTHING to increase in speed by 15%.

Eh, yes?

I mean not to criticize Pyro, but why would you touch that trait with an 11-foot pole if this weren’t the case? That’s what it advertises, “15% attack speed while having a scepter equipped” (not “With scepter attacks”), is consistent with how other traits work, and well, is the whole selling point.

Ofc, granted, some of the things you mention are a bit tricky to classify as attacks, but even stomping technically is.

Happy to see that trait is fixed. Actually feels like a GM trait now.

MailMail.6534:

I’d rather not even get used to playing with such an obviously bugged trait. I don’t think 15% attack speed increase is even worth it for scepter alone.

You realize that the trait pretty clearly states that it’s not exclusive to the scepter attacks? And as you say, 15% speed on just those 3 attacks would be pointless.

Compare for example Guardian or Necromancer staff skills, neither of which are exclusive to the staff’s attacks.

The only questionable thing I could see here is stomping. Yes it’s an attack, but I doubt it was intended. OTOH, affecting all 10 slots seems very much what the tooltip advertises, is consistent with other traits, and would actually make it a choice compared to the alternatives.

So yeah, it’ll get changed. :P

The whining is pretty ridiculous. Effects aren’t comparable cross-class. Just because one class has a 20% modifier doesn’t mean that other classes should have the same or better.

DHawk.2687:

give all the mesmer stealth skills a cast time (just like thief) to make it counterable

While in general I am always for more cast-time skills (on all classes) and less instant skills – something instant should be a really really rare thing and the core component of that ability in return for being much weaker – Thieves do have instant stealth skills. And lots of them once you include combos since they can trigger them easily.

I want my stealth mantra. :’(

Aetrion.8295:

The game really fails to create a good dynamic between damage dealers and support characters. I understand that they didn’t want to have the trinity, and I fully support that, but a game doesn’t need to enforce the trinity to make playing a healer viable. All the game has to do to make playing a healer useful is to make sure that a damage dealer who is being healed can deal more damage!

This would be diametrically opposed to the active defense mechanic at current gameplay levels.

There can be hybrid solutions, but… they’re iffy, I bet the community would as a whole dislike them.

Example:

Bulwark of Light – Guardian skill
Shield the friendly target for 200% of your maximum health.
Duration: 2 seconds
Cast time: instant
Cooldown: 10 seconds

Effectively you get to “block” one burst on someone. But you need to time it just right. Ofc, if they can also dodge it’s a waste, so mechanics like this would need evade removed to be useful.

Not… sure… people would like that.

denis.9487:

Mesmer did not go from zero to hero. It went from bottom of the classes to on par with the classes. That simple.

That’s not what I said though. What I meant is that individual traits are kinda meh if they constitute such a large portion of a character’s power, the power should be moved into the base char then, and then balance should be re-evaluated. Although if you read the whole post, my idea would sort of do the opposite because it’d fit GW2 better.

Erron.5327:

God I love this effect. Just needed to say it.

It makes more butterflies fly out! :O

Honestly, I have quite mixed feelings about this.

For one, I feel traits should be really strong. Otherwise the choice between 3 traits is a non-choice as there’s either a clear winner (all traits are weak but one aligns with your build) or it doesn’t matter as no trait really does anything.
If all traits are very strong, then even if you are a shatter-spec player and the choice is between two shatter traits and a phantasm trait, depending on traits this’ll still be a tough choice. After all, even that phantasm trait is going to add a lot of power to you (say, for 3 seconds after spawning Phantasms do +100% damage/effectduration, even if that damage is a shatter skill).

Second though, I don’t like characters growing from zero to hero via traits. I want the baseline to be balanced.
Yes I am aware that contradicts what I said above. Like I said, mixed feelings.

What I’d do is maybe the following:

• Reduce character base power. We are weaker without the traits.
• Give traits earlier, this is a necessity of my changes.
• Buff all GM traits to be on the power level of PU or so. They ought to both add serious amount of oomph and be quite game-changing.
• Buff Master traits to be just slightly weaker. Master traits should not be as game-changing. Yet they should add enough power that picking one is difficult, because you desire all three – after all, base character power was seriously nerfed beforehand.
• Adept traits would be the area where the “weak” traits reside, but they ought to be thematically aligned. For example Chaos could let you pick 3 ways to spawn an additional chaos storm, Domination could have 3 ways to cause Vulnerability, etc.
• Shuffle traits so that each set of 3, like the adept examples above, tries to give you something similar in different ways. This is necessary as a result of increasing relative contribution of traits as an enemy figuring out you are Dom / Duel / Illusions should have some reliability on what trait effects you have.

Dinks.2478:

Ignoring all the fanboys here to whiteknight Anet, yes I remember the manifesto and I am as disappointed as well. Anet can backtrack and pretend they meant something else all they want but it won’t change the reality that this isn’t the game we were promised.

Smart people buy games for what they are, instead of pre-buying them on hype.

But I think that ship sailed years ago, given modern sales tactics. GW2 is now what it was at release. Anyone saying they’re disappointed got only themselves to blame for shelling out money for it, IMO.

That’s independent of whether ANet delivered on what they promised or not, mind you. Independent of that you still should not be disappointed as a paying customer (only from afar, as someone who hasn’t bought the game but wishes it came out as something worth buying), as you shouldn’t have bought it then.

True, because then we’ll be behind in either scenario, given the elite specs announced so far. :P

Silv.9207:

There’s a lot of situations. In www it’s useless in zerg but in roaming can 1-shot you by hide, making him “OP”.

See, that sounds balanced to me. Good against single enemies, however it comes with a downside, cannot provide sensible DPS in a zerg.

That’d be a pretty cool concept.

Especially because it’d give a huge mechanically unique aspect to the Reaper if instead of using life force to avoid damage, they’d use it to avoid CC.